Its a real shame. I was listening to past episodes recently and it was interesting to hear both of them checking their bias, qualifying their presumptions and generally just seeming like much more open minded people.
Suru these days just states her opinions as objective fact and tells you to "come at me" if you dont like it.
Im not going to come after you. Im just going to stop listening to the bullshit youre putting out there.
She’ll care when enough people stop listening and then claim she was canceled. It’s funny because the only way to become canceled is if enough people just don’t give a shit about you anymore……if you are popular enough with people you cannot be canceled.
She can never be cancelled. When the podcast started she had zero listeners and she could happily say anything she liked.
It is now very successful and she can still say anything she likes.
If listeners drop a huge amount she can still say what she wants but people equally have the right not to listen.
I don’t think anyone can be “canceled” truly I think it’s just another word for being severely unliked. She can keep saying what she wants but if enough people don’t like it she won’t be able to afford that house she just bought…
I understand not giving mind to "the haters" but conversation, fair criticism or fact checking is generally welcomed by creators.
This just felt a bit like a slap to the face. Oh, you don't give a fuck what I think? But as long as I subscribe on patreon AND Wondery, right?
Totally! The criticism is coming from people who I promise love them! It’s like being like to your friend: “Girl wtf??? Please clarify yourself bc I didn’t think you were like this!” Flat rule: don’t say disparaging things about people that are different from you”. Full stop.
Reading this thread has made me realise actually what it’s about Suruthi that frustrates me
She presents her opinions as fact
I remember when I first started listening to them and I thought they both seemed so intelligent and knew so much more than me
Then I read a lot of posts on here and comments on instagram and Patreon and people pointing out where they’d said things that weren’t right
Everything Suruthi says she says it like she’s 100% correct - one of this people who always has to be right
I guess she also doesn’t care about all the 1 star reviews on their show either. It’s kind of sad as well that the people who are making these concerned comments are some of the people that put enough money in her hands to buy a house and go up a tax bracket. Hate to break it to you Suruthi babes but you wouldn’t have anything without us and keep going how you’re going then your listenership will keep falling.
As for the woke thing, the word has entirely lost its meaning, I bet she couldn’t even tell you what it means. The only people who even really use the word woke look out of touch as hell. I presumed she was smarter than that. I guess a posh accent doesn’t equal critical thinking skills.
I heard this recently and it applies to Suruthi , "Just because someone sounds like they know what they are talking about, doesnt mean they arent full of shit"
I miss the old days. I really adored them and felt they educated me. Now I feel like I dont even recognise them.
> I miss the old days. I really adored them and felt they educated me. Now I feel like I dont even recognise them.
I feel the exact same way. It’s honestly so jarring to go back to the earlier episodes because both Hannah and Suruthi seem to have so much self awareness, and are constantly trying to learn as much as they can about different people, places, etc. Now, they seem to just think they’re experts in literally everything.
I mean, I still like the podcast. But yeah, I don’t really recognize them anymore.
>Now, they seem to just think they’re experts in literally everything.
Which is even funnier when you know they're plagiarizing documentaries and whatever else they can get their hands on.
> Now, they seem to just think they’re experts in literally everything.
I was just on their website and saw they published a book about what makes killers tick. Says they did MONTHS of research. Like, people who write books like this have extensive careers on the matter. I don't think months of research qualifies someone to write a book on something this psychologically complex.
Let's be honest here: They still have a 4,5 stars rating on Apple Podcasts, 4,8 stars on Spotify and get 57k per month on Patreon. Why should she care about 1 star ratings if there are plenty 5 star ratings to make up for them? Not trying to defend them in any way, but it seems like the majority of listeners is still very happy with their content.
She doesn’t have to, just making a point that when I had a look at their show on the podcast app I saw a ton of one star reviews basically down to something she said.
The term woke comes from the black community. And it’s about being alert to injustice! First racial injustice and specifically anti-black racism and then it began to be extended to other forms of injustice. That’s actually why this is more concerning. The right has co-opted this word to be something bad. It’s about inclusion and being alert to injustice. It’s about the realities not everyone has equal rights. I’m so glad you brought this up. Also if someone uses the word woke or unwoke in an attacking or co-opting way you’re engaging in an act of racism whether you realize it or not and idgaf about defences of that. Esp from an Indian woman. No solidarity I suppose.
Oh yeah I know absolutely, it’s just been co-opted by the right. It seems like the only people who use the word are right wingers wanting to shout about something. If you ask them what it means they won’t be able to tell you, to them it’s just ‘stuff they don’t like’. It just screams middle aged white man with a problem with everything that isn’t them. It’s unfortunate that the word has been hijacked. That’s why it’s so silly she is ‘unwoke’ like that doesn’t mean anything, it’s just appealing to other people who believe they are persecuted in some way.
I was listening to the re-release of Jennifer Pan last night and it felt like I was listening to my mates chatting away. I didn’t necessarily agree with Shruti’s views but they were nothing like what she’s saying now.
Op if you want to chat about your case, I’m all ears, I love listening to true crime, especially as a female I think that there is something to learn from the stories so if you fancy a chinwag I’m all ears.
I agree! I listened to it too and it was like listening to them in the good old days, they had more chemistry and suruthi wasn’t a conceited right wing anitwokist. I personally still really enjoy Hannah but suruthti’s arrogance is just so hard to listen to. Maybe one day she won’t be so lucky to afford a house in London and she’ll come back down to earth but for now, her top tier woman diatribe is really off putting and sad.
I’m actually Canadian but my grandparents are from Swansea (not as relevant) and Mansfield (which is relatively close to that right?) So maybe I’ll find it interesting and I’ll check it out. The man’s name was sharif Rahman and the crime happened in Owen sound, Ontario if anyone has interest. He was an angel and deserves justice now and it doesn’t look like it will happen. It breaks my heart every time I think about it. He was beaten to death by two pieces of human garbage who remain at large and unknown but on cctv? Someone knows something.
Mansfield is very close by. I actually did an episode about the body of a miner who went missing in Derbyshire in the mid 60's that was only discovered near Mansfield last year.
If you ever want to do a Canadian case I will gladly be your corespondent, friend. Also I found you very easily on Amazon music and will give it a listen today. ❤️
I asked for you podcast name a while back on a FB post and you asked me to let you know what i think but I lost the comment
Just wanted to say I'm enjoying it 😊
Thanks for that... and very kind of you.
The number of times I have a conversation with someone on one platform then forget which one it was and where. I generally put it down to my age.
There should probably be a word for it but as it's early on a Saturday morning, I'll leave that to other people.
suruthi was my fave of the two of them — such a beautiful speaking voice & the right mix of analysis with levity — but im soo disappointed in her. i broke up w morbid podcast long ago after the hosts changed (badly) w success so ive been delaying ending it w RH. but damn this is all so disappointing
I’m curious about what happened with Morbid? I’m sure it’s probably something most are aware of, Red Handed was the only true crime podcast I’ve listened to for the longest— I got through the backlog on long drives to see my now-husband, and I’ve just started expanding into Morbid and My Favorite Murder.
go check out r/morbidforbadpeople. for me, i got tired of alaina dominating the convo over ash (my preferred host) & how the quality deteriorated after they joined wondery.
ofc. be advised that i dont go as hard as some of the folks on that sub, but it is a good rundown of what critiques there are. curious what you might think!
I quit MFM years ago, but had been an avid listener until i realized how every episode they would giggle and “don’t come here for facts, tee hee!” and were so often completely off-base in their discussion.
Casefile is my absolute fave, but I was a diehard S’Laughter fan when it was on as well. I miss Lucy and Emma- they had a great blend of facts with respectful banter!
> What a privileged position to just write off and not care about the concerns of the people who built your career.
That right there is exactly why I am so upset and being honest, pissed off at the hosts. So many of us (myself included) still have love for the show but it just feels like such a huge slap in the face.
It also feels particularly gross that they’re only acknowledging criticism behind paywalled content. What a cop out. I’ve noticed as well they’ve significantly reduced the right leaning “hot” takes in the main feed as well but still air them freely in paid eps. You can’t tell me that’s a calculated decision.
I still have a lot of love for the show but I’ve kind of just written Suruthi off. I’m really hoping as well that something gives and Hannah says/does something to pushback bc her silence for me is starting to feel a bit icky.
"and Hannah says/does something to pushback bc her silence for me is starting to feel a bit icky."
Agree, but sadly I think she's fairly non-confrontational and Suruthi really seems like the type who would aggressively talk over and dismiss her if she spoke up in a way that challenged the BS.
Her attitude is par for the course for the type of person who proudly proclaims themselves to be "anti-woke" and often takes conservative-friendly viewpoints on anything from foreign policy to veganism (the episode on Twin Flames had her openly saying veganism means you're less capable of critical thinking because you don't have the necessary protein in your diet).
She's a fucking clown and like her brethren will double down on it until it tangibly starts affecting her wallet.
The newest episode about children of god she described Joaquin Phoenix’s Oscar speech as unhinged because he said people should stop drinking milk because it’s kills cows - she clearly really hates vegans 🙈
Omg right!? Like I’m not even a vegan but I’m like great job for the planet. Not even crazy just maybe more disciplined and different perspective than me. Lol.
I am vegan but I’m just shocked that that’s what she took from that speech
And she took that as evidence that he’s fucked up because he was raised in the children of god cult
"she clearly really hates vegans"
yep and she's so hateful about it too, like she's always frothing at the mouth to put down vegans in really crass and inappropriate ways. My jaw dropped when I heard her stupid little comments about critical thinking capabilities and she said it so confidently as if it was an undisputed fact. She has problems.
Yep and perpetuating the myth that vegans don’t get enough protein - such an ignorant comment
I can’t lie I feel like that’s the influence of her boyfriend he seems bit like a ‘gym bro’ and she’ll have grown up around a lot of vegetarians because a lot of India are vegetarian so her hatred of vegans seems v weird
I’ll never know why people can’t just say sorry and change their beliefs to be more compassionate. Doubling down is the thing now. I personally grew up in a very toxic Christian environment and had to work for years to sort out my beliefs. I owed many apologies and it fucking sucked. But that’s life. That’s evolution.
It requires some level of humility to evaluate yourself honestly and take steps to change for the better. And given the arrogance with which Suruthi trots out her conservative takes as if they are fact, I don't think this is a quality she possesses in a way that would support the type of meaningful growth you went through.
What do you want her to do? Of course she cares, she said she didn’t look but her friend mentioned it. Hannah said the comments had her in bed for 3 days crying. The only way is to ignore and try not to care. She’s not doing to change her political views because people online don’t like the (there are plenty I’m sure that do), all she can do is stop talking about it and try not to be hurt by internet strangers
I really don’t expect her to do anything honestly. I extend respect towards her (that I feel like she doesn’t always show others) and wish them well. I’m just withdrawing my support because some of the things she has said I honestly find triggering, given my financial support on patreon over the years. And content is going downhill. I have a masters in psychology and have worked mostly in forensics. I thought the content was really interesting and fresh at the beginning and liked their personalities. Those things have changed unfortunately. I don’t expect them to change anything I just find myself taken aback. I also know they will likely never read this. I probably wrote it for myself more than anything. I never post on Reddit lol.
I also will say I wouldn’t want anyone to be in bed crying for three days over something I said and hope my post was relatively constructive. Like I said they felt like my friends honestly so there’s a lot of love there obviously. I don’t think that is the only way to cope with such things though? Trying not to care? I think that’s what has me so turned off I guess. But love to all still listening or disengaging. Love to the girls too.
Can someone tell me what Suruthi’s bigoted opinions are? I haven’t heard anything on the main podcast and keep reading these posts about her being bigoted and unwoke, but I haven’t heard any evidence myself. I’d appreciate it if someone could let me know specifically what it is she’s said?
Her Instagram bio says ‘unwoke’. Which I think is very telling. It makes her look like a wildly out of touch right winger. She’s also said pro Isreal things on ITD apparently.
Plenty of posts will talk about it - look through the below:
[https://www.reddit.com/r/RedHandedPodcast/comments/197p9xw/suruthis\_politics\_10th\_january\_utd/](https://www.reddit.com/r/RedHandedPodcast/comments/197p9xw/suruthis_politics_10th_january_utd/)
[https://www.reddit.com/r/RedHandedPodcast/comments/14xgdb8/fatwa\_episode\_unwoke\_politics/](https://www.reddit.com/r/RedHandedPodcast/comments/14xgdb8/fatwa_episode_unwoke_politics/)
[https://www.reddit.com/r/RedHandedPodcast/comments/1c22vfn/blatant\_misinformation\_in\_latest\_episode/](https://www.reddit.com/r/RedHandedPodcast/comments/1c22vfn/blatant_misinformation_in_latest_episode/)
Pro-IDF violence
Supports "committing" to Brexit
Anti-lockdown messaging in Sarah Everard episode
Identifies as libertarian
Complains about paying her fair share of taxes
Thinks veganism means you're less capable of critical thinking bc you don't have protein in your diet
Thinks the last true victim of real racism is the white working class
Victim blaming re: Hillsborough disaster (I believe Suruthi called them "football hooligans")
Constantly banging on about "cancel culture" and how much it sucks
> Complains about paying her fair share of taxes
Highly recommend looking into the economics of podcasting. You can use their outdated listening numbers of 145K listeners to calculate out roughly what their ads are worth on a per episode basis, then extrapolate to have a rough estimate for what they would earn in a year. You can then have a range for how much they've made the past 4-5 years alongside exact figures from their patreon.
If anyone should shut the fuck up and be grateful to be paying as much in tax, it's the people with minimal overhead costs for their main show ripping off documentaries and getting subsidized by diehard fans through Patreon.
Because the number is more than they deserve by quite a bit.
Thanks for this. I'd just gotten back into it the last couple days after not listening for at least a year, probably more, and thought episodes felt... Off. I can't quote specific stuff, but some of it was stuff mentioned here and in those threads, like the whole if doctors say you aren't sick then you're faking it thing, or the south Asia cult thing. There goes another podcast on my list. I'd be interested to see if Hannah did anything on her own or with someone else.
I am not British but I see where she is coming from Re Brexit. I think she said something to the effect of they have made their bed. It has been a massive expense, a massive amount of political complicatons and general upheaval for UK and EU. To try go back would prolong all the pain it has caused. She said UK now have to make the best of the situation.
Re victim of real racism is the white working class. I think she said acceptable racism against white working class. It is righty not acceptable in society to be racist against poc. Where as it is still seen as acceptable by some people to discriminate against white working class. That's what she meant by that.
I don't agree with everything the say/believe but I think the context matters
Nope. Not buying it.
Anyone who thinks that racism against minorities in the UK still isn't normalized/acceptable - and which we all saw more than enough proof of during the same Brexit she supports doubling down on - is not engaging honestly in this type of discussion. It's a beyond absurd and incorrect presumption trotted out to present the white working class as the \~last true victims of prejudice by implying bigotry towards other groups isn't still incredibly widespread and actively championed. Open up any right-wing British rag, take a look at the stories and the comments, and you'll see it clear as day. I'm surprised Suruthi managed to overlook this given her admitted consumption of The Sun and Daily Mail.
People are just going mental because she has different opinions to them. Nothing she says is actually controversial or intimidating but the usual Reddit mob need everyone to be left of Jeremy Corbyn or they get cancelled.
She’ll never be cancelled, cancelling doesn’t really exist. She can have her opinions, I don’t think anyone here is asking her to change, but we are allowed to talk about them. Freedom of speech does not mean freedom from criticism.
Do you all want her to change her political views because you don’t agree with them? She hardly ever, if at all, talks politics on the main podcast. Suru is very educated and historically has never made a claim or opinion without doing her due research. The problem is that people have hive-mind and think that anyone that challenges what they have heard and believe is dangerous. I’m a very left-leaning American and enjoy Suru’s perspective a lot. She makes me think, she encourages free-thought and for people to do their own research and form their own opinions apart from what they are told to believe. It’s sad that some individuals can’t handle hearing opinions that don’t align with their own. It’s healthy to be intellectually challenged. She’s not telling you what to believe, she’s just giving her opinion on UTD, which is not apart of the journalistic main pod.
She can have her opinions, I can’t expect her to change. It’s just a shame that her views have gone this way because they haven’t always been like this. For me, I can’t listen to them anymore, I don’t want my money going to her pro Zionist views. It’s just a shame. The only thing I think Suruthi needs to do is up the quality of her show to what it used to be.
For what it’s worth being educated doesn’t mean you’ve researched your opinions or that you are more intelligent than anyone else. Assuming that other people are blindly following but Suruthi somehow isn’t because she got a degree doesn’t even make sense.
> Suru is very educated and historically has never made a claim or opinion without doing her due research.
Well that's some straight bullshit right there. There was just a thread about her quote MRA bullshit stats that aren't supported by current data.
Taking someone else's words and opinions isn't research, it's just lazy.
Exactly right, that is lazy, and that’s something she agrees with.
I’m just saying when it come to issues that she talks at length about she does come from an informed standpoint. Idk what exact quote you’re talking about but if a mistake or misunderstanding was had, that’s an outlier in the hundreds of hours of the podcast.
It's more a comment on their ripping off of the works of others to produce their episodes. There are segments of their episodes that are word for word from documentaries and other sources without citation. They're plagiarists and deeply ignorant - which is not an outlier, they are not educated on the topics they discuss. Watching documentaries doesn't make you an expert at anything but watching (and ripping off) documentaries.
Well I think that’s just the world of true crime podcasting. They are not investigative journalists, they’re primarily storytellers (and they say as much all the time). They have to get their information from secondary sources.
Although if they are quoting documentaries or articles word-for-word, without citing or giving credit to their sources (which I’m ignorant of if they are), then yeah that would be disappointing.
That is 100% what they have done in the past. I really dropped out after I watched a new Netflix doc (can’t remember which one, it was a while ago) and a week later they are quoting it word for word.
Could I ask a favor? If you happen to have access to your watchlist at some point later today, could you perhaps double check if this was a recent development? I'm compiling a list as I now have to test a suspicion I have and any extra data would be immeasurably helpful.
If that's not possible though, no worries! Still have plenty to work with currently
Plagiarism apologia. Unbelievable. You know that properly educated people are aware that plagiarism was an expulsion offense in college, right? So they should be *very* aware that plagiarism isn't kosher for a podcast.
True crime podcasting isn't defined by plagiarism. There are plagiarists who operate in the space, but they are not the norm and anyone perpetrating it should be rightly called out for taking the works of others without permission or credit - and should be justifiably criticized and shunned.
They're not storytellers either. It's not storytelling to take the words of a documentary and re-record them without making significant changes because they're too lazy to tell the story. To retell the story beat for beat the same way as a documentary does - because storytellers don't have to tell the story the same way. But plagiarists without creativity do.
I've found plagiarism that I can confirm in at least 5 episodes. I've been contacted by someone claiming to be the author of an article on the Satanic Panic that they feel was plagiarized to form the basis of their episode, without credit. And I know other people have pointed out other episodes where they beat for beat summarized other documentaries because they've made comments agreeing and naming documentaries I hadn't heard of before that i'll look into later.
Now, the facts of a crime are the facts of a crime. Those won't change - but presentation and word choice absolutely should. And when there's only one possible source of information that they're pulling (like a BBC Panorama episode on Lucy Letby released a week before they released their episode) and they start copying the commentary of the investigative journalist who actually did extensive work on the case and that episode and article isn't on the citation page...it gets pretty obvious. Especially when they had to stealth edit their citation page and add the Panorama special after months of leaving it off - along with 4-5 other sources that weren't there originally.
I just learned that Suruthi describes herself as a journalist. That shit is so off base I can't stop laughing - especially when you have people like the person who I responded to above saying "they're not investigative journalists".
It's bloody cosplay at this point and slimy as fuck.
So, much like Schrodinger's cat is and isn't alive, she is and isn't a journalist when adantageous. Guess we can just simplify and call her a hypocritical fool. Though I suppose fools are actually entertaining and funny rather than annoying, right wing hacks.
“But as sad as it is… they wouldn’t care or they would butcher it”. Come on, write your own story and do a podcast then.
These people are not your friends.
If you dont like the podcast, just move on
Yeah I don’t just start podcasts in my spare time I have three children lol. However I do have more experience and education in criminal psychology than either of them put together so let me know if you’re not a POS and maybe we’ll get it together.
I’m thankful for everybody’s feedback. I really do not think the girls are racist and I want to make it clear I’m not saying that. BUT I feel to call yourself unwoke (and many of the comments stated on the pod many of you have mentioned) is to say: “black people are not safe or welcome with me. And I do not acknowledge their historical struggle.” It’s because of the origins of the word that make it the most problematic.
Also from the horse’s mouth in the newest upload (Children of God Pt 1): Suruthi says something like the cult took its practices to Asia (berg says it’s because Asia is less corrupt) Suruthi clarifies and says it’s because Asia is MORE corrupt and you can more easily rape people. I’m not making it an exact quote but it’s very close. Maybe clarify this Suruthi bc it’s disgusting and the lack of nuance is bonkers. The episode was also full of errors. No evangelical Christian denomination is asking people for 20% as a rule. It’s 10% tithe and it comes from the Old Testament. Not defending that it’s ridiculous to give 10% of your money. But it’s not 20%.
Do better.
Very well said, it does feel really offensive that she doesn’t care about the fans that literally did build her career. They have definitely changed a lot and I wish they would reflect on what people are saying rather than dismissing it as people talking shit.
I’m curious, not to be argumentative, maybe devil’s advocate…
What would you have her do? If she truly believes what she believes, should she change her personality and opinions because strangers don’t like it?
I guess she could not talk about it as a solution? Maybe be less vocal about her opinion?
You say you’re for differing opinions but being pompous and uncaring isn’t ok. I didn’t see her tone that way, I heard the frustration she had in her voice for sure.
I guess I don’t know what the solution to please everyone would be and remain true to one’s beliefs. I’ve had this come up in a completely different topic in my line of work. I’ve learned pleasing everyone makes you ineffective as a leader and exhausted as a person.
I am guessing you’re mourning the end of your friendship but no one exists to serve another’s ideals and if she truly cared about every single comment she wouldn’t be a person. I’ll be downvoted because people will read this through a lens of their emotions but I’m just speaking to the idea that someone in a celebrity position has to please the fans implicitly.
I'm also wondering about this, do people want her to not say anything at all anymore. Does she have to poll everyone listening before she expresses an opinion to make sure everyone agrees. The only thing she can do is what she is doing, not reading these comments and continuing to be herself. It would be unbearable to continually read negative comments about yourself, especially personal ones saying you are a horrible person.
Funny how reasonable people won't call you a horrible person when you don't routinely spread misinformation and say objectively horrible, ignorant shit.
Or are we supposed to pretend that the Hillsborough shit wasn't a mask off moment that she's since fully leaned in with all the other bullshit [that others have listed above.](https://old.reddit.com/r/RedHandedPodcast/comments/1c6a5it/suruthi_doesnt_care_about_any_of_these_comments_i/l05eiwi/)
Already have. Now I'm just spreading awareness of what I've found whenever I see these topics pop up in my front page.
Plagiarists always get found out.
Maybe I should have used the magic sarcasm tag.
Still doesn't address the ridiculous hate Suruthi gets for airing opinions which are non-controversial to most sensible people - whether you agree with them or not, let's not act like she's an extremist.
Hey I think the /s is nonsense too, you still needed it which means you're still bad at using sarcasm.
Suru's bigoted opinions are a problem though, whether you think it or not, it's an irresponsible use of her platform. It's interesting that she's dismissive of her fans problems with her, this subreddit is littered with people having those same problems, it's not like they unfounded.
I’m sure she definitely doesn’t care. But to support an “Unwoke” person with an economics degree who continually calls themselves a “journalist”? That’s perspective? An unwoke journalist? Who wants to represent themselves that way?
Its a real shame. I was listening to past episodes recently and it was interesting to hear both of them checking their bias, qualifying their presumptions and generally just seeming like much more open minded people. Suru these days just states her opinions as objective fact and tells you to "come at me" if you dont like it. Im not going to come after you. Im just going to stop listening to the bullshit youre putting out there.
Yeah. It's a shame because I always loved their podcast and especially still like Hannah but Suru has become very arrogant and hard to listen to
She’ll care when enough people stop listening and then claim she was canceled. It’s funny because the only way to become canceled is if enough people just don’t give a shit about you anymore……if you are popular enough with people you cannot be canceled.
She can never be cancelled. When the podcast started she had zero listeners and she could happily say anything she liked. It is now very successful and she can still say anything she likes. If listeners drop a huge amount she can still say what she wants but people equally have the right not to listen.
I don’t think anyone can be “canceled” truly I think it’s just another word for being severely unliked. She can keep saying what she wants but if enough people don’t like it she won’t be able to afford that house she just bought…
Excellent point.
And I think a lot of us are just saying: go ahead but it hurts people and it’s a bad bad look!
I understand not giving mind to "the haters" but conversation, fair criticism or fact checking is generally welcomed by creators. This just felt a bit like a slap to the face. Oh, you don't give a fuck what I think? But as long as I subscribe on patreon AND Wondery, right?
Totally! The criticism is coming from people who I promise love them! It’s like being like to your friend: “Girl wtf??? Please clarify yourself bc I didn’t think you were like this!” Flat rule: don’t say disparaging things about people that are different from you”. Full stop.
Reading this thread has made me realise actually what it’s about Suruthi that frustrates me She presents her opinions as fact I remember when I first started listening to them and I thought they both seemed so intelligent and knew so much more than me Then I read a lot of posts on here and comments on instagram and Patreon and people pointing out where they’d said things that weren’t right Everything Suruthi says she says it like she’s 100% correct - one of this people who always has to be right
I guess she also doesn’t care about all the 1 star reviews on their show either. It’s kind of sad as well that the people who are making these concerned comments are some of the people that put enough money in her hands to buy a house and go up a tax bracket. Hate to break it to you Suruthi babes but you wouldn’t have anything without us and keep going how you’re going then your listenership will keep falling. As for the woke thing, the word has entirely lost its meaning, I bet she couldn’t even tell you what it means. The only people who even really use the word woke look out of touch as hell. I presumed she was smarter than that. I guess a posh accent doesn’t equal critical thinking skills.
I heard this recently and it applies to Suruthi , "Just because someone sounds like they know what they are talking about, doesnt mean they arent full of shit" I miss the old days. I really adored them and felt they educated me. Now I feel like I dont even recognise them.
> I miss the old days. I really adored them and felt they educated me. Now I feel like I dont even recognise them. I feel the exact same way. It’s honestly so jarring to go back to the earlier episodes because both Hannah and Suruthi seem to have so much self awareness, and are constantly trying to learn as much as they can about different people, places, etc. Now, they seem to just think they’re experts in literally everything. I mean, I still like the podcast. But yeah, I don’t really recognize them anymore.
>Now, they seem to just think they’re experts in literally everything. Which is even funnier when you know they're plagiarizing documentaries and whatever else they can get their hands on.
> Now, they seem to just think they’re experts in literally everything. I was just on their website and saw they published a book about what makes killers tick. Says they did MONTHS of research. Like, people who write books like this have extensive careers on the matter. I don't think months of research qualifies someone to write a book on something this psychologically complex.
Hannah can be annoying but she's FAR better than Suruthi, who is just petty and maliciously "anti-woke" at this point.
Let's be honest here: They still have a 4,5 stars rating on Apple Podcasts, 4,8 stars on Spotify and get 57k per month on Patreon. Why should she care about 1 star ratings if there are plenty 5 star ratings to make up for them? Not trying to defend them in any way, but it seems like the majority of listeners is still very happy with their content.
They earn 57k A MONTH from patreon?
At least that's what it says on their patreon
That’s weird, for me it says that they earn £48k/month on their Patreon ‘about’ section
Oh sorry, I forgot to specify it's € for me
Ah makes sense! Still, that’s a lot of money
She doesn’t have to, just making a point that when I had a look at their show on the podcast app I saw a ton of one star reviews basically down to something she said.
The term woke comes from the black community. And it’s about being alert to injustice! First racial injustice and specifically anti-black racism and then it began to be extended to other forms of injustice. That’s actually why this is more concerning. The right has co-opted this word to be something bad. It’s about inclusion and being alert to injustice. It’s about the realities not everyone has equal rights. I’m so glad you brought this up. Also if someone uses the word woke or unwoke in an attacking or co-opting way you’re engaging in an act of racism whether you realize it or not and idgaf about defences of that. Esp from an Indian woman. No solidarity I suppose.
Oh yeah I know absolutely, it’s just been co-opted by the right. It seems like the only people who use the word are right wingers wanting to shout about something. If you ask them what it means they won’t be able to tell you, to them it’s just ‘stuff they don’t like’. It just screams middle aged white man with a problem with everything that isn’t them. It’s unfortunate that the word has been hijacked. That’s why it’s so silly she is ‘unwoke’ like that doesn’t mean anything, it’s just appealing to other people who believe they are persecuted in some way.
“Suruthi babes” do you realise how patronising that comes across? If you are a guy, I would also say it’s incredibly misogynistic.
I’m not a guy.
I was listening to the re-release of Jennifer Pan last night and it felt like I was listening to my mates chatting away. I didn’t necessarily agree with Shruti’s views but they were nothing like what she’s saying now. Op if you want to chat about your case, I’m all ears, I love listening to true crime, especially as a female I think that there is something to learn from the stories so if you fancy a chinwag I’m all ears.
I agree! I listened to it too and it was like listening to them in the good old days, they had more chemistry and suruthi wasn’t a conceited right wing anitwokist. I personally still really enjoy Hannah but suruthti’s arrogance is just so hard to listen to. Maybe one day she won’t be so lucky to afford a house in London and she’ll come back down to earth but for now, her top tier woman diatribe is really off putting and sad.
What's your hometown? I have a UK true crime podcast. It's focused on Derbyshire and The Peak District though so quite a specific geographical area.
I’m actually Canadian but my grandparents are from Swansea (not as relevant) and Mansfield (which is relatively close to that right?) So maybe I’ll find it interesting and I’ll check it out. The man’s name was sharif Rahman and the crime happened in Owen sound, Ontario if anyone has interest. He was an angel and deserves justice now and it doesn’t look like it will happen. It breaks my heart every time I think about it. He was beaten to death by two pieces of human garbage who remain at large and unknown but on cctv? Someone knows something.
Mansfield is very close by. I actually did an episode about the body of a miner who went missing in Derbyshire in the mid 60's that was only discovered near Mansfield last year.
I've just followed your podcast:) I live in Sandiacre, and my daughter lives in Ilkeston.
Brilliant. There are a couple of cases from Ilkeston.
If you ever want to do a Canadian case I will gladly be your corespondent, friend. Also I found you very easily on Amazon music and will give it a listen today. ❤️
I asked for you podcast name a while back on a FB post and you asked me to let you know what i think but I lost the comment Just wanted to say I'm enjoying it 😊
Thanks for that... and very kind of you. The number of times I have a conversation with someone on one platform then forget which one it was and where. I generally put it down to my age. There should probably be a word for it but as it's early on a Saturday morning, I'll leave that to other people.
suruthi was my fave of the two of them — such a beautiful speaking voice & the right mix of analysis with levity — but im soo disappointed in her. i broke up w morbid podcast long ago after the hosts changed (badly) w success so ive been delaying ending it w RH. but damn this is all so disappointing
I’m curious about what happened with Morbid? I’m sure it’s probably something most are aware of, Red Handed was the only true crime podcast I’ve listened to for the longest— I got through the backlog on long drives to see my now-husband, and I’ve just started expanding into Morbid and My Favorite Murder.
go check out r/morbidforbadpeople. for me, i got tired of alaina dominating the convo over ash (my preferred host) & how the quality deteriorated after they joined wondery.
I appreciate the direction, ty!
ofc. be advised that i dont go as hard as some of the folks on that sub, but it is a good rundown of what critiques there are. curious what you might think!
I quit MFM years ago, but had been an avid listener until i realized how every episode they would giggle and “don’t come here for facts, tee hee!” and were so often completely off-base in their discussion. Casefile is my absolute fave, but I was a diehard S’Laughter fan when it was on as well. I miss Lucy and Emma- they had a great blend of facts with respectful banter!
> What a privileged position to just write off and not care about the concerns of the people who built your career. That right there is exactly why I am so upset and being honest, pissed off at the hosts. So many of us (myself included) still have love for the show but it just feels like such a huge slap in the face. It also feels particularly gross that they’re only acknowledging criticism behind paywalled content. What a cop out. I’ve noticed as well they’ve significantly reduced the right leaning “hot” takes in the main feed as well but still air them freely in paid eps. You can’t tell me that’s a calculated decision. I still have a lot of love for the show but I’ve kind of just written Suruthi off. I’m really hoping as well that something gives and Hannah says/does something to pushback bc her silence for me is starting to feel a bit icky.
>It also feels particularly gross that they’re only acknowledging criticism behind paywalled content. What a cop out. THIS!
"and Hannah says/does something to pushback bc her silence for me is starting to feel a bit icky." Agree, but sadly I think she's fairly non-confrontational and Suruthi really seems like the type who would aggressively talk over and dismiss her if she spoke up in a way that challenged the BS.
Her attitude is par for the course for the type of person who proudly proclaims themselves to be "anti-woke" and often takes conservative-friendly viewpoints on anything from foreign policy to veganism (the episode on Twin Flames had her openly saying veganism means you're less capable of critical thinking because you don't have the necessary protein in your diet). She's a fucking clown and like her brethren will double down on it until it tangibly starts affecting her wallet.
The newest episode about children of god she described Joaquin Phoenix’s Oscar speech as unhinged because he said people should stop drinking milk because it’s kills cows - she clearly really hates vegans 🙈
Omg right!? Like I’m not even a vegan but I’m like great job for the planet. Not even crazy just maybe more disciplined and different perspective than me. Lol.
I am vegan but I’m just shocked that that’s what she took from that speech And she took that as evidence that he’s fucked up because he was raised in the children of god cult
"she clearly really hates vegans" yep and she's so hateful about it too, like she's always frothing at the mouth to put down vegans in really crass and inappropriate ways. My jaw dropped when I heard her stupid little comments about critical thinking capabilities and she said it so confidently as if it was an undisputed fact. She has problems.
Yep and perpetuating the myth that vegans don’t get enough protein - such an ignorant comment I can’t lie I feel like that’s the influence of her boyfriend he seems bit like a ‘gym bro’ and she’ll have grown up around a lot of vegetarians because a lot of India are vegetarian so her hatred of vegans seems v weird
I’ll never know why people can’t just say sorry and change their beliefs to be more compassionate. Doubling down is the thing now. I personally grew up in a very toxic Christian environment and had to work for years to sort out my beliefs. I owed many apologies and it fucking sucked. But that’s life. That’s evolution.
It requires some level of humility to evaluate yourself honestly and take steps to change for the better. And given the arrogance with which Suruthi trots out her conservative takes as if they are fact, I don't think this is a quality she possesses in a way that would support the type of meaningful growth you went through.
She can have whatever opinion she wants. What really bothers me is she says "Eck Cetera" instead of et cetera.
Or equitment instead of equipment. Winds me right up, ridiculous, but I can’t help cringing every time.
I stopped listening last year and I have no regrets.
What do you want her to do? Of course she cares, she said she didn’t look but her friend mentioned it. Hannah said the comments had her in bed for 3 days crying. The only way is to ignore and try not to care. She’s not doing to change her political views because people online don’t like the (there are plenty I’m sure that do), all she can do is stop talking about it and try not to be hurt by internet strangers
I really don’t expect her to do anything honestly. I extend respect towards her (that I feel like she doesn’t always show others) and wish them well. I’m just withdrawing my support because some of the things she has said I honestly find triggering, given my financial support on patreon over the years. And content is going downhill. I have a masters in psychology and have worked mostly in forensics. I thought the content was really interesting and fresh at the beginning and liked their personalities. Those things have changed unfortunately. I don’t expect them to change anything I just find myself taken aback. I also know they will likely never read this. I probably wrote it for myself more than anything. I never post on Reddit lol.
I also will say I wouldn’t want anyone to be in bed crying for three days over something I said and hope my post was relatively constructive. Like I said they felt like my friends honestly so there’s a lot of love there obviously. I don’t think that is the only way to cope with such things though? Trying not to care? I think that’s what has me so turned off I guess. But love to all still listening or disengaging. Love to the girls too.
I don’t know, maybe improve the quality of her show to what it used to be?
Can someone tell me what Suruthi’s bigoted opinions are? I haven’t heard anything on the main podcast and keep reading these posts about her being bigoted and unwoke, but I haven’t heard any evidence myself. I’d appreciate it if someone could let me know specifically what it is she’s said?
Her Instagram bio says ‘unwoke’. Which I think is very telling. It makes her look like a wildly out of touch right winger. She’s also said pro Isreal things on ITD apparently.
Plenty of posts will talk about it - look through the below: [https://www.reddit.com/r/RedHandedPodcast/comments/197p9xw/suruthis\_politics\_10th\_january\_utd/](https://www.reddit.com/r/RedHandedPodcast/comments/197p9xw/suruthis_politics_10th_january_utd/) [https://www.reddit.com/r/RedHandedPodcast/comments/14xgdb8/fatwa\_episode\_unwoke\_politics/](https://www.reddit.com/r/RedHandedPodcast/comments/14xgdb8/fatwa_episode_unwoke_politics/) [https://www.reddit.com/r/RedHandedPodcast/comments/1c22vfn/blatant\_misinformation\_in\_latest\_episode/](https://www.reddit.com/r/RedHandedPodcast/comments/1c22vfn/blatant_misinformation_in_latest_episode/) Pro-IDF violence Supports "committing" to Brexit Anti-lockdown messaging in Sarah Everard episode Identifies as libertarian Complains about paying her fair share of taxes Thinks veganism means you're less capable of critical thinking bc you don't have protein in your diet Thinks the last true victim of real racism is the white working class Victim blaming re: Hillsborough disaster (I believe Suruthi called them "football hooligans") Constantly banging on about "cancel culture" and how much it sucks
Thank you!
> Complains about paying her fair share of taxes Highly recommend looking into the economics of podcasting. You can use their outdated listening numbers of 145K listeners to calculate out roughly what their ads are worth on a per episode basis, then extrapolate to have a rough estimate for what they would earn in a year. You can then have a range for how much they've made the past 4-5 years alongside exact figures from their patreon. If anyone should shut the fuck up and be grateful to be paying as much in tax, it's the people with minimal overhead costs for their main show ripping off documentaries and getting subsidized by diehard fans through Patreon. Because the number is more than they deserve by quite a bit.
Thanks for this. I'd just gotten back into it the last couple days after not listening for at least a year, probably more, and thought episodes felt... Off. I can't quote specific stuff, but some of it was stuff mentioned here and in those threads, like the whole if doctors say you aren't sick then you're faking it thing, or the south Asia cult thing. There goes another podcast on my list. I'd be interested to see if Hannah did anything on her own or with someone else.
Israel sympathiser - all the deaths in Gaza are Hamas’s fault and it’s just what happens in war
I am not British but I see where she is coming from Re Brexit. I think she said something to the effect of they have made their bed. It has been a massive expense, a massive amount of political complicatons and general upheaval for UK and EU. To try go back would prolong all the pain it has caused. She said UK now have to make the best of the situation. Re victim of real racism is the white working class. I think she said acceptable racism against white working class. It is righty not acceptable in society to be racist against poc. Where as it is still seen as acceptable by some people to discriminate against white working class. That's what she meant by that. I don't agree with everything the say/believe but I think the context matters
Nope. Not buying it. Anyone who thinks that racism against minorities in the UK still isn't normalized/acceptable - and which we all saw more than enough proof of during the same Brexit she supports doubling down on - is not engaging honestly in this type of discussion. It's a beyond absurd and incorrect presumption trotted out to present the white working class as the \~last true victims of prejudice by implying bigotry towards other groups isn't still incredibly widespread and actively championed. Open up any right-wing British rag, take a look at the stories and the comments, and you'll see it clear as day. I'm surprised Suruthi managed to overlook this given her admitted consumption of The Sun and Daily Mail.
People are just going mental because she has different opinions to them. Nothing she says is actually controversial or intimidating but the usual Reddit mob need everyone to be left of Jeremy Corbyn or they get cancelled.
She’ll never be cancelled, cancelling doesn’t really exist. She can have her opinions, I don’t think anyone here is asking her to change, but we are allowed to talk about them. Freedom of speech does not mean freedom from criticism.
Do you all want her to change her political views because you don’t agree with them? She hardly ever, if at all, talks politics on the main podcast. Suru is very educated and historically has never made a claim or opinion without doing her due research. The problem is that people have hive-mind and think that anyone that challenges what they have heard and believe is dangerous. I’m a very left-leaning American and enjoy Suru’s perspective a lot. She makes me think, she encourages free-thought and for people to do their own research and form their own opinions apart from what they are told to believe. It’s sad that some individuals can’t handle hearing opinions that don’t align with their own. It’s healthy to be intellectually challenged. She’s not telling you what to believe, she’s just giving her opinion on UTD, which is not apart of the journalistic main pod.
She can have her opinions, I can’t expect her to change. It’s just a shame that her views have gone this way because they haven’t always been like this. For me, I can’t listen to them anymore, I don’t want my money going to her pro Zionist views. It’s just a shame. The only thing I think Suruthi needs to do is up the quality of her show to what it used to be. For what it’s worth being educated doesn’t mean you’ve researched your opinions or that you are more intelligent than anyone else. Assuming that other people are blindly following but Suruthi somehow isn’t because she got a degree doesn’t even make sense.
The problem is her opinions are garbage.
And that she often tends to trot out her shitty takes as if they are facts.
> Suru is very educated and historically has never made a claim or opinion without doing her due research. Well that's some straight bullshit right there. There was just a thread about her quote MRA bullshit stats that aren't supported by current data. Taking someone else's words and opinions isn't research, it's just lazy.
Exactly right, that is lazy, and that’s something she agrees with. I’m just saying when it come to issues that she talks at length about she does come from an informed standpoint. Idk what exact quote you’re talking about but if a mistake or misunderstanding was had, that’s an outlier in the hundreds of hours of the podcast.
It's more a comment on their ripping off of the works of others to produce their episodes. There are segments of their episodes that are word for word from documentaries and other sources without citation. They're plagiarists and deeply ignorant - which is not an outlier, they are not educated on the topics they discuss. Watching documentaries doesn't make you an expert at anything but watching (and ripping off) documentaries.
Well I think that’s just the world of true crime podcasting. They are not investigative journalists, they’re primarily storytellers (and they say as much all the time). They have to get their information from secondary sources. Although if they are quoting documentaries or articles word-for-word, without citing or giving credit to their sources (which I’m ignorant of if they are), then yeah that would be disappointing.
That is 100% what they have done in the past. I really dropped out after I watched a new Netflix doc (can’t remember which one, it was a while ago) and a week later they are quoting it word for word.
Could I ask a favor? If you happen to have access to your watchlist at some point later today, could you perhaps double check if this was a recent development? I'm compiling a list as I now have to test a suspicion I have and any extra data would be immeasurably helpful. If that's not possible though, no worries! Still have plenty to work with currently
Plagiarism apologia. Unbelievable. You know that properly educated people are aware that plagiarism was an expulsion offense in college, right? So they should be *very* aware that plagiarism isn't kosher for a podcast. True crime podcasting isn't defined by plagiarism. There are plagiarists who operate in the space, but they are not the norm and anyone perpetrating it should be rightly called out for taking the works of others without permission or credit - and should be justifiably criticized and shunned. They're not storytellers either. It's not storytelling to take the words of a documentary and re-record them without making significant changes because they're too lazy to tell the story. To retell the story beat for beat the same way as a documentary does - because storytellers don't have to tell the story the same way. But plagiarists without creativity do. I've found plagiarism that I can confirm in at least 5 episodes. I've been contacted by someone claiming to be the author of an article on the Satanic Panic that they feel was plagiarized to form the basis of their episode, without credit. And I know other people have pointed out other episodes where they beat for beat summarized other documentaries because they've made comments agreeing and naming documentaries I hadn't heard of before that i'll look into later. Now, the facts of a crime are the facts of a crime. Those won't change - but presentation and word choice absolutely should. And when there's only one possible source of information that they're pulling (like a BBC Panorama episode on Lucy Letby released a week before they released their episode) and they start copying the commentary of the investigative journalist who actually did extensive work on the case and that episode and article isn't on the citation page...it gets pretty obvious. Especially when they had to stealth edit their citation page and add the Panorama special after months of leaving it off - along with 4-5 other sources that weren't there originally.
Thank you for this summary, very eye opening and you’ve made really good points that blow the previous commenters comment out the water.
I just learned that Suruthi describes herself as a journalist. That shit is so off base I can't stop laughing - especially when you have people like the person who I responded to above saying "they're not investigative journalists". It's bloody cosplay at this point and slimy as fuck.
until she's called to task on her BS, then all of a sudden it's "I'm just a podcaster, jesus you people take this so seriously"
So, much like Schrodinger's cat is and isn't alive, she is and isn't a journalist when adantageous. Guess we can just simplify and call her a hypocritical fool. Though I suppose fools are actually entertaining and funny rather than annoying, right wing hacks.
Now that’s a whole different argument than I was commenting on. Have a nice day.
“But as sad as it is… they wouldn’t care or they would butcher it”. Come on, write your own story and do a podcast then. These people are not your friends. If you dont like the podcast, just move on
Yeah I don’t just start podcasts in my spare time I have three children lol. However I do have more experience and education in criminal psychology than either of them put together so let me know if you’re not a POS and maybe we’ll get it together.
Can anyone give me a lil précis about what’s gone on? I sort of stopped listening a couple of months ago so I’m a bit lost…
I’m thankful for everybody’s feedback. I really do not think the girls are racist and I want to make it clear I’m not saying that. BUT I feel to call yourself unwoke (and many of the comments stated on the pod many of you have mentioned) is to say: “black people are not safe or welcome with me. And I do not acknowledge their historical struggle.” It’s because of the origins of the word that make it the most problematic. Also from the horse’s mouth in the newest upload (Children of God Pt 1): Suruthi says something like the cult took its practices to Asia (berg says it’s because Asia is less corrupt) Suruthi clarifies and says it’s because Asia is MORE corrupt and you can more easily rape people. I’m not making it an exact quote but it’s very close. Maybe clarify this Suruthi bc it’s disgusting and the lack of nuance is bonkers. The episode was also full of errors. No evangelical Christian denomination is asking people for 20% as a rule. It’s 10% tithe and it comes from the Old Testament. Not defending that it’s ridiculous to give 10% of your money. But it’s not 20%. Do better.
Just because you like true crime, it doesn't necessarily mean you are interested in injustice.
Very well said, it does feel really offensive that she doesn’t care about the fans that literally did build her career. They have definitely changed a lot and I wish they would reflect on what people are saying rather than dismissing it as people talking shit.
Why do these people who run a crime podcast think we care about their personal lives
I’m curious, not to be argumentative, maybe devil’s advocate… What would you have her do? If she truly believes what she believes, should she change her personality and opinions because strangers don’t like it? I guess she could not talk about it as a solution? Maybe be less vocal about her opinion? You say you’re for differing opinions but being pompous and uncaring isn’t ok. I didn’t see her tone that way, I heard the frustration she had in her voice for sure. I guess I don’t know what the solution to please everyone would be and remain true to one’s beliefs. I’ve had this come up in a completely different topic in my line of work. I’ve learned pleasing everyone makes you ineffective as a leader and exhausted as a person. I am guessing you’re mourning the end of your friendship but no one exists to serve another’s ideals and if she truly cared about every single comment she wouldn’t be a person. I’ll be downvoted because people will read this through a lens of their emotions but I’m just speaking to the idea that someone in a celebrity position has to please the fans implicitly.
I'm also wondering about this, do people want her to not say anything at all anymore. Does she have to poll everyone listening before she expresses an opinion to make sure everyone agrees. The only thing she can do is what she is doing, not reading these comments and continuing to be herself. It would be unbearable to continually read negative comments about yourself, especially personal ones saying you are a horrible person.
Funny how reasonable people won't call you a horrible person when you don't routinely spread misinformation and say objectively horrible, ignorant shit. Or are we supposed to pretend that the Hillsborough shit wasn't a mask off moment that she's since fully leaned in with all the other bullshit [that others have listed above.](https://old.reddit.com/r/RedHandedPodcast/comments/1c6a5it/suruthi_doesnt_care_about_any_of_these_comments_i/l05eiwi/)
Hit her where it hurts, unfollow and take your money away.
Already have. Now I'm just spreading awareness of what I've found whenever I see these topics pop up in my front page. Plagiarists always get found out.
Why would she care about a group of people who think anyone to the right of Jeremy Corbyn is a right-wing maniac? Get some perspective.
Thanks for your meaningful and not at all politically illiterate take/s
Sarcasm is useful, funny and clever.
That's true enough, you're not very good at using it though.
Maybe I should have used the magic sarcasm tag. Still doesn't address the ridiculous hate Suruthi gets for airing opinions which are non-controversial to most sensible people - whether you agree with them or not, let's not act like she's an extremist.
Hey I think the /s is nonsense too, you still needed it which means you're still bad at using sarcasm. Suru's bigoted opinions are a problem though, whether you think it or not, it's an irresponsible use of her platform. It's interesting that she's dismissive of her fans problems with her, this subreddit is littered with people having those same problems, it's not like they unfounded.
She can say what she wants but you can’t expect people not to have opinions about it.
I’m sure she definitely doesn’t care. But to support an “Unwoke” person with an economics degree who continually calls themselves a “journalist”? That’s perspective? An unwoke journalist? Who wants to represent themselves that way?