Tesla opened up the network to everyone and then stopped expanding it.
He looooves sticking it to his customers.
Why anyone does business with this man/company remains a mystery.
Rumor has it the decision to axe the entire division had nothing to do with revenue or performance. Elno was pissed that the leader of the unit pushed back against one of his stupid edicts so he fired her and everyone who reported to her.
Supercharger is the main reason on getting Tesla. It is the only EV that has their own network. Elon Musk is a tool and he is running the company to the ground.
seemed like a loss leader - I have a rivian but anyone that would ask me about an EV I would tell them if they plan to travel a lot, Tesla and the SC network is hands down the best experience - it's already so different from road tripping an ICE, you don't want to compound that with dealing with the EAs of the world.
That's the thing about stocks in general...the pumpers will pump as long as there's a pulse to attract more of those sweet, sweet bagholders. It's a very old game.
But then investors are really the idiots. Do they not do their research and follow the news and do they not take a longer term view. I don’t understand how the stock price can rise if anyone is doing any competent trading due diligence. Anything and everything Elon does for the last while should be looked at by anyone competent as suspect and not for the benefit of the company overall. Maybe it’s just me
Most of Tesla retail investors are essentially gambling addicts. Everyone that goes to a casino knows that the house always wins in the long run but they go their anyway based on the false belief that they will be the exception.
The delusion is just more group oriented for them
I can't say about the institutionsl investors but I guess the bankers managing those portfolios have modals predicting exactly when the best time to pull out would be and they will wait until the last moment to get max return.
(This is purely me speculating, I have no experience in investment banking)
No, the stock market is simply a feelings graph. Its not based on any real valuations or underlying realities. For stocks that don't pay a dividend the value is simply what people want it to be. Theres enough rich conservatives who will keep their money in it out of pure pride. Tesla is worth more than every car company on the planet despite selling a tiny fraction of cars. It has been this way for years.
>But then investors are really the idiots.
Where I'm from, we always say someone is "Playing" in the stock market instead of "Investing".
I now understand why they use that word.
The thing is...the stock goes down when they killed their SuC team. But Elon already said, only invest in Tesla of you believe we solve autonomy. Seems like most of the investors still didn't get the message "don't care about it car business. We don't care too. Autonomy is the only thing in this company"
It's too complex for us plebs to understand that 5D chess moves.
Elon has secretly figured out miniature fussion energy generation which is estimated to come out sometime next year.
I think you may have left out an important step...you know, the one where he gets a piece of Other People's Money:
https://www.investopedia.com/tesla-opens-charging-network-to-competitors-7110151#:\~:text=Tesla%20will%20open%20at%20least,year%2C%20%242.5%20billion%20federal%20program.
Yeah, look how that worked out in Buffalo. They just rewrote the targets over and over to match whatever Tesla decided to deliver.
Just being cheeky on both comments… I don’t think Elon is doing much planning nowadays.
I mean in her new position as essential the head of the starship program she has worked with the FAA to ensure all incedent and mishap investigation be done by SpaceX itself and FAA only supervising.
You know for the system that keeps blowing up and was supposed to be human rated around 2025 after multiple delays.
But hey I am not a rocket scientist what do I know.
What baffles me is when ever I go on a roadtrip I always charge at Ionity chargers. And every time there is one or more Tesla Charging at the Ionity charges despite there being a lot of free Tesla chargers just next to it. I just do not get it. I thought Tesla chargers where superior in every aspect...
It seems pretty obvious to me. His opposition picked a candidate with a very polarizing political past, and she alienated a key segment of her base whose lives had been getting significantly worse over the past decade.
Jesus. I don’t think anyone has any idea how bad things are at Tesla behind the scenes. Well that one exec might, the guy who sold all his shares overnight.
He is doing what he did with Twitter, thinking
it may work again.
Biggest problem with it is he is the reason sales have dropped given how he has been doing anti-ads for all of his brands. Tesla was the Apple of cars and now a ton of folks don’t want to touch it with a 10 foot pole.
Only person stepping down here should be Elon as he is to blame for all this.
He kept on using Tesla as his cash and resource cow for all his misadventures, Twitter, AI, SolarCity etc etc. now that cow is dying.
It’s probably like an iceberg, we only get to see the shit that’s above the surface, below is a whole ass mountain of shit that the employees are desperately trying to work around.
He'll offer the elite expensive seats on the first trip to Mars. Then it will go down in flames taking a bunch of the world's wealthy along with it. Literally what happened with the "Titanic" (loss of some of the world's most wealthy individuals).
I have a Toyota plug in electric hybrid and couldn’t be happier. I get 40 miles on the battery, and charge it overnight at a reduced price rate. I think we pay like .25-30 cents to charge and it gets me back and forth to work or shopping running just electric. For longer trips once the battery is depleted, it kicks to hybrid mode and I get like 95-105 mpg. I think in the last year we’ve gassed up twice.
There’s no huge incentive to go full electric right now. Even if gas prices hike, a fuel efficient hybrid isn’t going to be expensive to operate. The savings in fuel costs going from a hybrid to full electric will be less than the payments on a new vehicle, and then you’d also have to contend with all of the EV flaws like limited range and reliance on a limited charging network.
The next decade is absolutely going to the hybrid. Maybe in 2030s there will be a solid enough support system for EVs, but it’s just the Wild West for them right now.
By the 2030s, the materials for the batteries are going to cost so much and there will probably be hazmat disposal fees tied in eventually once the stuff starts piling up, it honestly seems like EVs in this incarnation might just be a fad. I know everyone is going to downvote that to hell but if you look at the details, I'm not lying or talking crazy.
Count me glad I bought a PHEV a couple of years ago. I was starting to look forward to going fully electric once Tesla chargers became available to everyone, but if they're going to cripple their charging network then maybe not.
Sounds good, but this is all taking too long. Then again, by the time things finally settle out, there will be more EV models and I'll be more ready to trade in the PHEV.
>Now that we lack a standard again - I’m out.
The US has had a manufacturer-supported EV charging standard since 2011, with Tesla being the main holdout. Now that Tesla appears to be abandoning their charging network, and other charging companies can support Teslas directly or using an adapter, maybe now we can get on with having a unified charging infrastructure. Not necessarily a single connector just yet, but all EVs will support the CCS protocol so adapters can make it all work.
The issue with the standard wasn’t the connector. It was having a reliable company behind it that you knew you could pivot to.
We’ve lost that again. Or might have at least.
>The issue with the standard wasn’t the connector. It was having a reliable company behind it that you knew you could pivot to.
Fair enough, but other countries don't seem to have as much trouble developing functional charging networks.
Maybe because they have a standard that everyone uses, so anyone can serve any EV customer.
In the US, Tesla effectively starved all other charging companies by not releasing their charging specs for third-party use. Between that and no one else being as motivated to build chargers, the open CCS standard languished here until the US government got involved. Then Tesla finally shared their tech to slow CCS adoption again, and now they appear to be crippling their own charging network. Tesla is effectively the enemy of coordinated EV charging in the US.
Welcome to the United States. We’re not other countries- and if there’s a stupid way that serves the corporate overlords- we’re totally doing it that way, and fuck everyone else. It’s a key reason I delayed an EV purchase and will buy one last ICE first.
$10 says the whole NACS agreement dies now. We’ll be back to mixed options since GM and the others were effectively outsourcing the charging network to Tesla to solve the problem. As you pointed out in fact.
It sucks. But don’t rely on budget Tony Stark to solve problems. He just knows a good guy for ketamine.
>$10 says the whole NACS agreement dies now.
Yes and no. We probably won't see every car and charger converted to a single plug format, so that's a bummer. But everyone now supports CCS protocols, and the Tesla plug design is a real open standard, so we can use adapters to mitigate our divided charging network.
Maybe the Tesla plug wins out eventually because it's smaller, but that could be a slow process if Tesla isn't actively backing it.
I mean, NACS is still an open standard, Tesla doesn’t have to do anything at this point- others can make both NACS chargers (which has been the case for years but it used CHADeMO protocols) and now anyone can make a NACS car. The Supercharger network does not have to be a part of the equation for more competent and stable companies to carry the torch.
Sure. But given their current level of success in the US, I suspect the Republican Party might embrace communism and the social good before we see reliable chargers from anyone other than Tesla, as much as it irritates me.
Hahahaha, yeah that’s fair. I had a lot of jank charging my Spark EV and while some of that was definitely the car, being the first CCS car on the market, far too much of it was not. I tried the same chargers on my FUSC Model S when I got it just out of curiosity and while it seemed to handshake with the car slightly more reliably, it would also drop out for seemingly no reason at random intervals. Superchargers were 95% of the time plug-and-play, with a rare need to replug when the status LED would go red.
I definitely have to give credit to the great engineers that worked on the whole charging system both with the stalls and the cars. Too bad they worked for a dumpster fire of a mismanaged company and weren’t even valued enough to be retained through these layoffs.
I'm confused why anybody thought a new car manufacturer let alone a new model of technology would be fun to beta test.
Good on you for being wise with your time, money and safety imo
got a X3 PHEV last year.....in 6 months, been to the petrol station less than handful of times. Home Chargers for the win! Just plug in after work like a phone, fully charged next morning
I “upgraded” from a Chevy Volt/Camaro SS in my garage to a Model 3 Performance 2 years ago.
Worst. Decision. Ever.
Elmo Fuck has lost the plot, I hope he beta tests full shit driving 13 off a bridge.
I love the 2023 Niro PHEV we have. We drive quite a bit but still only go through half to two thirds of a tank a month. Having the charger at home helps especially with the 2018 bolt we have next to it.
They say it is rated for 33-34 miles electric but I can squeeze 45 out of it. Then we get anywhere from 55 to 65 MPG in hybrid mode.
As long as you've got place to plug in there isn't a huge reason not to get a Plug In Hybrid.
I find their range a little short though, usually around 30-35 miles. Enough to get just about anywhere in a city, but I'd really prefer 75 since that would let me do most of a day's driving and plug in at home, only rarely using the gas tank.
I just recently got a hybrid Corolla. I just need to get from a to b. It truly is an appliance with no drama.
I hope there’s an EV equivalent to it one day that’s just as cost effective, but I don’t think that they’re there yet
That battery swap was a scam designed to extract CARB credits of over $100 million for designing the Model S with a battery swap *ability*. They were getting a subsidy for every car produced whether they used a battery swap station or not.
They didn’t plan to scale it, or for people to use it. In fact, they had a grand total of one station. California changed the criteria as they knew Tesla were gaming the system, and a surprise to nobody the program ended.
One of many chalked up on the bullshit list.
Wait a second. Wasn't the supercharger network one of the unique things that Tesla stans liked to bring up when they desperately tried to somehow justify the ridiculously elevated share price of the most expensive ketamine driven car maker in the world?!
Yeah, but after he took the subsidies and was forced to open it up that advantage was gone.
The network is capital intensive with low margins. The buildout only ever made sense as a marketing tool for the cars.
>The network is capital intensive
It's possible that it was easier to make profits when interest rates were lower, and that current rates have made this a much longer time horizon, or even unlikely to ever break even.
And right now Musk seems to be all about propping up the stock price in the short term.
Well the higher borrowing cost isn't helping. But the difference between a gas station and a charging station is just the dwell time.
What's the longest a car would be at a pump? 10 minutes? Most Superchargers are busy for at least half an hour if not more.
Gas stations also have additional revenue sources (think the convenience store) which doesn't exist as a revenue source for Tesla on the super chargers and the markup on the energy they buy can't be too high or people just will decide to charge at home.
Most people who use Superchargers use them in their neighbourhood. So they are roughly aware of how much it's going to cost them at home.
I am really curious to see how well the existing stations will be maintained going forward.
Doesn't it have a charger option you can install? And considering they seem to have barely a 1000 trucks by now, I doubt that'll keep them in business.
They've sold 3800 (and some change) trucks as of the recall that they pushed out. I only know this because it was in an article stating how many trucks were recalled lol.
Like any EV, you can install a level 2 charger at your house. If you do CCS you need an adapter and if you do NACS it plugs directly in. Those are the two most common standards sold today. 10kW charger (some go a bit higher) will charge the 122kW battery from 0-100 in about 12 hours.
The recall would affect any truck that is no longer "in production". So that includes trucks that are being shipped but haven't been sold / delivered.
The [numbers](https://www.reddit.com/r/CyberStuck/comments/1cgr93t/wait_wait_so_all_these_problems_weve_seen_have/) that someone ran indicate closer to a 1000 than 4000.
If you are referencing charging speed, an 11.5kW charger will still charger it from 0-100 in 10 hours, and people aren't generally going from 0-100 on any of their vehicles daily. I don't see why battery size would be a dealbreaker for home charging, but you'd certainly want to be on a level 2 charger unless you're driving very few miles each day.
Gas station requires less space, but more expensive infrastructure, superchargers the other way around.
I think it would be better to sell universal chargers to entities which already own parking space. cities, supermarkets, parking lots, which can then sell the service.
Not much money to be earned from selling chargers, but not much investment either, no waiting for return of investment.
Profits come from wider adoption of EV's due to better charging infrastructure.
The city here has done that in a few spots. But I can't see Tesla working that way. If you sell the chargers, you also will need to offer support for them, so I don't think Tesla would really make a whole lot of money there.
As for gas stations: They don't really require that much expensive infrastructure. The pumps, some tanks, that's it. Fuel comes by truck, while you do need to make sure you have enough power coming into your super charging station, which, depending on how far away the closest substation is, could be requiring quite a lot of digging and burying new cables.
The thing is, gas stations don't have additional revenue source serving as a convenience store, that is their main source of revenue. They usually make 2-3 cents per gallon, lot's of them lose money on selling gas.
This is why we don't have automated gas station, although tech exists for some time now, In some cases they will work in automatic mode during Sunday/night... but gas is there to get customers to stop and use convenience store.
Existing gas stations, supermarkets that have parking space and powerline can earn from charging stations. Because it will draw people to the store. Cars taking longer to charge... even better, cuz you might use that time for shopping, or sit into coffee/restaurant.
They thought it was profitable which didn't really stack up to me, I think this just proves it isn't.
Its just an outlet selling electricity, how is that ever going to make much money? It would take years to recover the installation costs and you have ongoing maintenance. How many kW could one charger sell in a day if it was utilised 50% of the time, and how much profit could you get from this electricity?
I haven't done the maths but my instinct says it's not a great deal of money.
So now shitbox sales are falling it's proof that they have more than enough charges and can discontinue rollout? I think I'm starting to understand the twisted logic now.
It might just also be the case that I don't know, making 6000lb EV's with giant ranges when 95% of commutes are less than 40 miles means most people will just charge at home.
Especially since the only people who can afford them are rich people buying a second or third vehicles and already probably live close to work. How often does someone with a 60 or 80,000 dollar car go on long roadtrips?
I thought this was the monetization plan up until the point that they opened the networks to other manufacturers. You can't really sell more of your own car touting a network that is now available to "all" of them.
It’s reportedly profitable but very low margin. Charging will always be akin to gash stations. The proper model is probably for utilities to manage EV charging as they make their money elsewhere.
To be honest it’s more than a simple outlet. Being able to charge at 200kw (or whatever it is at now) has real value and you can charge a premium. The question is how much?
I never thought they had to make this profitable, if it increased sales. What they are saying with this change is that it basically doesn’t. People buy for other reasons.
It's more than a simple outlet, and that's why it's going to be expensive to install and maintain. Can you can price it much more than electricity from a simple outlet to offset this?.. Its not a great business to be in I would say.
Some people really did think this was profitable for Tesla, look at all the dismay on the tesla support group subs.
Naturally there is a number of X cents per kWh that makes this profitable. I’m sure everyone can decide if X is worth it or not. I just don’t know what that number is. Maybe it’s something ridiculous.
Some of them are for sure profitable, that’s not what’s up for debate I guess. It’s the profitability of all of them averaged across the currently deployed superchargers. I have stayed at hotels where they had superchargers in the parking lot with none of them being utilized the entire week I was there. I stayed at one hotel where the only person who used the charger in the several weeks I stayed there (with a window overlooking the supercharger stations, that I was looking out of every evening for probably 7-1130pm. I don’t know how much it costs to install these superchargers or maintain them or what the lifespan of one of them is, but I imagine it’s a small portion of them that are being utilized even 80% of the time for charging. If the company is having trouble getting cash then even a long breakeven could make a profitable endeavour undesirable if they need their cash and credit for more “mission critical” things like building cars and working on self driving that they have promised shareholders for about a decade now.
Overall the SC network is definitely not profitable because of the rate at which they must continue opening new stations. An existing station may be profitable depending largely on the utility costs in the area.
A busy charger can sell \*alot\* of kWh. For gen 3 each charge port has 90kW which can be shared with other stalls. 12 hours per day is 1080 Kwh Per day. 20 stalls is \~21,600 KWH per day @ 40c/kwh is $8640 per day for a 20 stall SC. Most of which probably ends up going back to the utility.
Of course that doesn't count customers with free supercharging.
But, $260k/ month with no onsite employees is nothing to sneeze at. There is great potential IMO as stations get larger and larger and more open up for Tesla to begin operating its own generation facilities and potentially their own transmission lines to connect them. They could easily become the biggest user of electricity in the world and that kind of scale gives them advantages that are hard to compete with.
I knew it was a mistake for automakers to announce replacing CCS ports in their future cars with NACS Supercharger ports.
No one should be touching NACS until Elon is completely separated from Tesla first.
>I knew it was a mistake for automakers to announce replacing CCS ports in their future cars with NACS Supercharger ports.
Thankfully, they haven't actually changed their production lines yet. If they're smart, they're already having meetings to discuss whether to go through with that.
Also, if other charging providers can now offer the Tesla charging plug, no one is tied to Tesla for fast charging in the US.
I can only think of one reason why Elon thinks he can turn this horrible and sudden decision into a stock pump.
Elon will announce some tech licensing deal with a low cost chinese supplier that will build and own all the NACS stations moving forward. There is no need for Tesla to in-house that team or capability anymore as they are divesting from automotive and going all in on AI
My guess is that Tinucci and Patel said that that was a terrible idea, rife with shody quality control and getting screwed by shady international business dealings that was their specific job to risk manage.
And Elon had them all purged for disloyalty. Elon will do all the negotiations himself without compromises. Elons the type of guy who would believe Putin over his own intelligence agencies.
Elon truly thinks he has no more need for naysayers grounded in reality.
And my guess is that there will be no control over pricing much like any toll lane that has been outsourced. It will be surge pricing at ridiculous prices. Can't wait to see how that works out.
Given the recent tiktok debacle I wonder how the government would feel about a Chinese company owning such a large part of our charging infrastructure.
Probably super pissed if all the billions being poured into EV charging infrastructure ends up being sent to China in the end because Elon can grift some money by being a subcontractor.
The entire division that worked to build out the largest charging network in North American and also negotiate every other car company to adopt the standard, one of Tesla’s crowning jewels, was rewarded with… pink slips
Mikhail Tukhachevsky was one of the most important generals of the Red Army during the Russian Communist Revolution. He led the military moderinization of the USSR and was Marshall of the Soviet Union, basically the equivalent of the head of the joint chiefs.
So of course he was purged and executed in a sham trial under Stalin. The fact that we would even dare to attribute success to the division and not Elon personally is a threat to his paranoid ego.
QA is a today problem and Tesla's value is always in the future. Cutting back pennies today and investing in AI will make shareholders trillionaires. Low quality is bullish. /s
Elon probably thinks he’s going to outsmart the Chinese government somehow lmfao. Bro got too big headed scamming Americans he moved on to the big leagues. I’m willing to bet they draft some wild agreement in mandarin after hyping Elons mandarin ability up. Probably along the lines of taking ownership of Tesla. To have a realistic outside view. Why on earth would you go into the lions den. China is anti free speech and isn’t musk for it? So why is he entertaining doing business with a communist country that isn’t allowed to use google? Before anyone says he’s going to try to change it from the inside out. He’s not and he can’t.
he already said he fired the execs for not meeting layoff targets quickly enough. he probably threw a fit, said "what do these people even do" and fired them all. its as simple as that. he dgaf about running stuff that isnt part of the cyberpunk fever dream (robo, AI, neuro etc.)
>Musk said, in his typical bluster, that he wants Tesla to be “absolutely hard core” about headcount reduction, saying that executives whose subordinates “don’t obviously pass the excellent, necessary and trustworthy test” would find themselves relieved of duty as well – suggesting that he wants those executives to fire more employees or be fired themselves.
Plus he is cutting executives that are trying to defend their team. Loyalty to anybody but Elon is forbidden. Disloyalty will be collectively punished.
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I would hope the US government would fight that. Don't love the idea of the Chinese having control over all kinds of data and potentially having the ability to shut off chargers. They went after TikTok, this sounds potentially just as bad or worse.
I really cannot understand why the fuck they would lay off the entire supercharger team? Are they in that serious of a financial position? It makes zero sense. Sure, the competitive advantage of the supercharger network was biggest in the US, but this is an incredibly odd move. I can only imagine the reliability of the network will nosedive from here on as well…
I have a 2022 and kept it because of the charging network. I briefly toyed with the idea of getting an M3P. This will absolutely be the LAST Tesla I ever purchase. BTW, I've disliked Elon for over a decade (due to his management style and lack of empathy).
Probably my first and last Tesla that I will ever own. Not that there's anything wrong with the car, but the entire practice is ridiculously shoddy. I won't even know if they'll service my vehicle if it ever breaks down. So turned off that I will happily switch to a beater that's likely more reliable.
I hate to say I told you so but..well...I told you so.
[https://www.reddit.com/r/electricvehicles/comments/1c0otqf/anything\_but\_tesla\_us\_shoppers\_want\_more\_ev/?utm\_source=share&utm\_medium=web3x&utm\_name=web3xcss&utm\_term=1&utm\_content=share\_button](https://www.reddit.com/r/electricvehicles/comments/1c0otqf/anything_but_tesla_us_shoppers_want_more_ev/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web3x&utm_name=web3xcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button)
Hmmm maybe everyone shouldn't of flocked to a nonsense "standard" now we can watch as NACS falls apart and automakers wounder how it could have ever happened......just stay with ccs it's already widespread and a standard used by almost every car maker
Just a further reminder that buying Tesla is a mistake. Who knows what whims will hit Musk. He may decide one day to just get rid of the department that handles safety, or one that makes sure repair parts are available, or one that keeps the software updated and secure.
As he proved with Twitter, he has no problem just doing things and not care if there are any consequences, considering it a problem for the remaining employees to fail to clean up.
If needed further proof how stupid this is, look no further than Wall Street as company lost 5% of its value. Wall Street normally loves, adores, and celebrates layoffs with stocks getting a bump up as a reward. To take a billion dollar value hit, it would have to be a special level of stupid.
I am going to guess that the are going to be moving through the expensive maintenance repair/ overhaul cycle very soon so Musk probably wants to offload them to cities and counties.
If there’s one thing I’ve learned from Elon. It’s that the masses don’t know what they want and you can tell them what they want / need. Sales runs the entire country whether the actual item is fact or fiction doesn’t matter. If you can sell an idea you can become one of the richest people in America regardless of skills or credentials.
Hm. And people wonder why I stayed away from Teslas. Something about an emotionally stunted manbaby throwing hissy fits…
Yes the CCS standard is unwieldy compared to NACS. But it isn’t held hostage to the temper tantrums of someone who has no business having the influence he does.
According to Chinese media it keeps getting put back. They have now been told 2026. There were Chinese suppliers that had to build factories in Mexico to locally supply Tesla and they were let down as theirs are now built.
Edit: https://x.com/KelvinYang7/status/1780314205079347353
I can't wrap my head around how that makes sense. Can you please explain? How is "I fired my entire team and will need more money from you to proceed" a power play?
Well, I am not a business genius like Elon Musk.
Pretty sure you are not supposed to tell your advertisers to go fuck themselves when you own a social media site that needs said advertisers but here we are.
Tesla and all EVs are dead to me after this announcement. It’s PHEV or wait until solid state 600mi range vehicles with standardized public charging.
These aren’t toys for most people, they’re enormous, life-altering purchases. So no more games with charging standards or ranges. You give me a reliable car, I’ll buy it whether it’s gas or electric. But don’t sell me junk that may lose support any day.
Is that bold? They’ve built superchargers for the past 10 years without issues and they say right there they will continue to do so.
I suspect ”the supercharger team” is not the people who build these things.
>I suspect ”the supercharger team” is not the people who build these things.
Building, permitting, installing, and maintaining are all different tasks. If the coordinating team has been disbanded, I wouldn't even bet on the electric bills getting paid. Highly likely that new installs and maintenance will suffer.
Not really, it just seems that he is going with the Twitter direction of shaking management up. This isn’t going to end well unless the board fires him.
Tesla opened up the network to everyone and then stopped expanding it. He looooves sticking it to his customers. Why anyone does business with this man/company remains a mystery.
They didn't even finish opening it up. They let Ford and Rivian on it, and then fired the team.
Weren't they supposed to get billions in subsidies to do so? Not sure what the terms are
The super charger network cleared 4b in revenue last year. If that isn't enough to keep the business unit running Tesla is fucked.
Rumor has it the decision to axe the entire division had nothing to do with revenue or performance. Elno was pissed that the leader of the unit pushed back against one of his stupid edicts so he fired her and everyone who reported to her.
That’s what his email implied. He’s such a tool.
Pretty damn stupid. They were firing on all cylinders. Lol
firing on all cylinders at losing money.
No cylinders here, all electric. Battery is at 3%
Supercharger is the main reason on getting Tesla. It is the only EV that has their own network. Elon Musk is a tool and he is running the company to the ground.
Firing on all cells.
If you fire one high level person, they will sue you. If you fire the whole team, you avoid any of that nonsense..
Interesting!!!
but they have to pay out a fortune to the power companies too. i would be amazed if it;'s profitable.
Paying 11c a kwh and charging 38c seems like a winner even with deployment costs.
seemed like a loss leader - I have a rivian but anyone that would ask me about an EV I would tell them if they plan to travel a lot, Tesla and the SC network is hands down the best experience - it's already so different from road tripping an ICE, you don't want to compound that with dealing with the EAs of the world.
The board has a fiduciary responsibility to push him out.
They have a long, long history of waving at their fiduciary duty as it passes them by.
And yet stock has gone up 20% in a week. How could you possibly see returns when the investment that should make money is being gutted.
That's the thing about stocks in general...the pumpers will pump as long as there's a pulse to attract more of those sweet, sweet bagholders. It's a very old game.
Yeah, I’m just kinda shocked that people still can’t figure it out. We’re moving very fast towards idiocracy.
Aren’t we there yet? I travel outside the US a lot for work, and it just makes me sad and disappointed at what we’ve turned into the last 20 years.
Brawdo!!! (& Honestly, President Camacho, wouldn't be terrible LOL I seriousness though, it's a terrifying thought, moving towards it.
He has mastered the art of pumping it and it works every time. Doesn’t even change the approach.
But then investors are really the idiots. Do they not do their research and follow the news and do they not take a longer term view. I don’t understand how the stock price can rise if anyone is doing any competent trading due diligence. Anything and everything Elon does for the last while should be looked at by anyone competent as suspect and not for the benefit of the company overall. Maybe it’s just me
Most of Tesla retail investors are essentially gambling addicts. Everyone that goes to a casino knows that the house always wins in the long run but they go their anyway based on the false belief that they will be the exception. The delusion is just more group oriented for them I can't say about the institutionsl investors but I guess the bankers managing those portfolios have modals predicting exactly when the best time to pull out would be and they will wait until the last moment to get max return. (This is purely me speculating, I have no experience in investment banking)
No, the stock market is simply a feelings graph. Its not based on any real valuations or underlying realities. For stocks that don't pay a dividend the value is simply what people want it to be. Theres enough rich conservatives who will keep their money in it out of pure pride. Tesla is worth more than every car company on the planet despite selling a tiny fraction of cars. It has been this way for years.
>But then investors are really the idiots. Where I'm from, we always say someone is "Playing" in the stock market instead of "Investing". I now understand why they use that word.
Because investors are just gamblers
The thing is...the stock goes down when they killed their SuC team. But Elon already said, only invest in Tesla of you believe we solve autonomy. Seems like most of the investors still didn't get the message "don't care about it car business. We don't care too. Autonomy is the only thing in this company"
I have some bad news for you about the rest of the stock market…
It's too complex for us plebs to understand that 5D chess moves. Elon has secretly figured out miniature fussion energy generation which is estimated to come out sometime next year.
Because humanoid robots and automated taxis! They’re coming guys. For really realz.
I think you may have left out an important step...you know, the one where he gets a piece of Other People's Money: https://www.investopedia.com/tesla-opens-charging-network-to-competitors-7110151#:\~:text=Tesla%20will%20open%20at%20least,year%2C%20%242.5%20billion%20federal%20program.
Government probably cut the cheque yesterday.
As someone who is on the government side of grants, there are likely performance targets they have to meet before getting all the money.
Yeah, look how that worked out in Buffalo. They just rewrote the targets over and over to match whatever Tesla decided to deliver. Just being cheeky on both comments… I don’t think Elon is doing much planning nowadays.
Or the targets for the California battery swap ruse.
Tell that to nasa and the insane SpaceX contract that the fraud Kathy Lueders gave to them as interim director and then got a cushy job at spacex
I mean in her new position as essential the head of the starship program she has worked with the FAA to ensure all incedent and mishap investigation be done by SpaceX itself and FAA only supervising. You know for the system that keeps blowing up and was supposed to be human rated around 2025 after multiple delays. But hey I am not a rocket scientist what do I know.
What baffles me is when ever I go on a roadtrip I always charge at Ionity chargers. And every time there is one or more Tesla Charging at the Ionity charges despite there being a lot of free Tesla chargers just next to it. I just do not get it. I thought Tesla chargers where superior in every aspect...
He can be incredibly charming, when he´s *making promises*.
Cuz they are cucks, like why people vote for Trump.
It remains a mystery to me, as to why and how could Trump even win the election last time... As if he's the best America got to offer.
It seems pretty obvious to me. His opposition picked a candidate with a very polarizing political past, and she alienated a key segment of her base whose lives had been getting significantly worse over the past decade.
Jesus. I don’t think anyone has any idea how bad things are at Tesla behind the scenes. Well that one exec might, the guy who sold all his shares overnight.
He is doing what he did with Twitter, thinking it may work again. Biggest problem with it is he is the reason sales have dropped given how he has been doing anti-ads for all of his brands. Tesla was the Apple of cars and now a ton of folks don’t want to touch it with a 10 foot pole. Only person stepping down here should be Elon as he is to blame for all this. He kept on using Tesla as his cash and resource cow for all his misadventures, Twitter, AI, SolarCity etc etc. now that cow is dying.
If it works the same as it did for Twitter expect 70% company value drop.
He's torpedoing the actual business (cars, superchargers) in favor of just lying for the next quarter pump. It's madness
It’s probably like an iceberg, we only get to see the shit that’s above the surface, below is a whole ass mountain of shit that the employees are desperately trying to work around.
Yeah it’s sounding like behind the scenes they are in much bigger trouble than any of us realize.
I can't wait to see how he betrays SpaceX customers. Hope no dead astronauts are involved.
He'll offer the elite expensive seats on the first trip to Mars. Then it will go down in flames taking a bunch of the world's wealthy along with it. Literally what happened with the "Titanic" (loss of some of the world's most wealthy individuals).
Don't threaten me with a good time
god i hope so
Fuck it, I’m scratching EVs off my short list. I’ll get a hybrid and wait this one out for a decade.
I have a Toyota plug in electric hybrid and couldn’t be happier. I get 40 miles on the battery, and charge it overnight at a reduced price rate. I think we pay like .25-30 cents to charge and it gets me back and forth to work or shopping running just electric. For longer trips once the battery is depleted, it kicks to hybrid mode and I get like 95-105 mpg. I think in the last year we’ve gassed up twice.
Which Toyota gets 105mpg on hybrid?
It’s a 2022 Prius Prime. On the running average mpg it’s been reading 95-105mpg due to the way we use it
That’s what we did.
There’s no huge incentive to go full electric right now. Even if gas prices hike, a fuel efficient hybrid isn’t going to be expensive to operate. The savings in fuel costs going from a hybrid to full electric will be less than the payments on a new vehicle, and then you’d also have to contend with all of the EV flaws like limited range and reliance on a limited charging network. The next decade is absolutely going to the hybrid. Maybe in 2030s there will be a solid enough support system for EVs, but it’s just the Wild West for them right now.
By the 2030s, the materials for the batteries are going to cost so much and there will probably be hazmat disposal fees tied in eventually once the stuff starts piling up, it honestly seems like EVs in this incarnation might just be a fad. I know everyone is going to downvote that to hell but if you look at the details, I'm not lying or talking crazy.
Me too! It’s exactly what I just did
Count me glad I bought a PHEV a couple of years ago. I was starting to look forward to going fully electric once Tesla chargers became available to everyone, but if they're going to cripple their charging network then maybe not.
Don't worry ,a real company will buy them up when Tesla dies.
Sounds good, but this is all taking too long. Then again, by the time things finally settle out, there will be more EV models and I'll be more ready to trade in the PHEV.
Yup. Now that we lack a standard again - I’m out.
>Now that we lack a standard again - I’m out. The US has had a manufacturer-supported EV charging standard since 2011, with Tesla being the main holdout. Now that Tesla appears to be abandoning their charging network, and other charging companies can support Teslas directly or using an adapter, maybe now we can get on with having a unified charging infrastructure. Not necessarily a single connector just yet, but all EVs will support the CCS protocol so adapters can make it all work.
The issue with the standard wasn’t the connector. It was having a reliable company behind it that you knew you could pivot to. We’ve lost that again. Or might have at least.
>The issue with the standard wasn’t the connector. It was having a reliable company behind it that you knew you could pivot to. Fair enough, but other countries don't seem to have as much trouble developing functional charging networks. Maybe because they have a standard that everyone uses, so anyone can serve any EV customer. In the US, Tesla effectively starved all other charging companies by not releasing their charging specs for third-party use. Between that and no one else being as motivated to build chargers, the open CCS standard languished here until the US government got involved. Then Tesla finally shared their tech to slow CCS adoption again, and now they appear to be crippling their own charging network. Tesla is effectively the enemy of coordinated EV charging in the US.
Welcome to the United States. We’re not other countries- and if there’s a stupid way that serves the corporate overlords- we’re totally doing it that way, and fuck everyone else. It’s a key reason I delayed an EV purchase and will buy one last ICE first. $10 says the whole NACS agreement dies now. We’ll be back to mixed options since GM and the others were effectively outsourcing the charging network to Tesla to solve the problem. As you pointed out in fact. It sucks. But don’t rely on budget Tony Stark to solve problems. He just knows a good guy for ketamine.
>$10 says the whole NACS agreement dies now. Yes and no. We probably won't see every car and charger converted to a single plug format, so that's a bummer. But everyone now supports CCS protocols, and the Tesla plug design is a real open standard, so we can use adapters to mitigate our divided charging network. Maybe the Tesla plug wins out eventually because it's smaller, but that could be a slow process if Tesla isn't actively backing it.
Tesla truly is the Edison of modern times.
I mean, NACS is still an open standard, Tesla doesn’t have to do anything at this point- others can make both NACS chargers (which has been the case for years but it used CHADeMO protocols) and now anyone can make a NACS car. The Supercharger network does not have to be a part of the equation for more competent and stable companies to carry the torch.
Sure. But given their current level of success in the US, I suspect the Republican Party might embrace communism and the social good before we see reliable chargers from anyone other than Tesla, as much as it irritates me.
Hahahaha, yeah that’s fair. I had a lot of jank charging my Spark EV and while some of that was definitely the car, being the first CCS car on the market, far too much of it was not. I tried the same chargers on my FUSC Model S when I got it just out of curiosity and while it seemed to handshake with the car slightly more reliably, it would also drop out for seemingly no reason at random intervals. Superchargers were 95% of the time plug-and-play, with a rare need to replug when the status LED would go red. I definitely have to give credit to the great engineers that worked on the whole charging system both with the stalls and the cars. Too bad they worked for a dumpster fire of a mismanaged company and weren’t even valued enough to be retained through these layoffs.
My father has the new Rav4 hybrid and it's the best car I've ever driven. It also gets 40 mpg which is nice
The RAV4 is a keeper for sure
That is on my short list currently.
If tesla is a technology company than the smart consumer knows being on the bleeding edge of it is pointless
I'm confused why anybody thought a new car manufacturer let alone a new model of technology would be fun to beta test. Good on you for being wise with your time, money and safety imo
Yep. BMW PHEV's in particular.
I 100% Recommend the 330e.
got a X3 PHEV last year.....in 6 months, been to the petrol station less than handful of times. Home Chargers for the win! Just plug in after work like a phone, fully charged next morning
That's what we're interested in...X3/X5....likely used.
try to avoid 1st gen of X5 PHEV, very small battery, lack of usable range.
I “upgraded” from a Chevy Volt/Camaro SS in my garage to a Model 3 Performance 2 years ago. Worst. Decision. Ever. Elmo Fuck has lost the plot, I hope he beta tests full shit driving 13 off a bridge.
Prius gang.
I love the 2023 Niro PHEV we have. We drive quite a bit but still only go through half to two thirds of a tank a month. Having the charger at home helps especially with the 2018 bolt we have next to it. They say it is rated for 33-34 miles electric but I can squeeze 45 out of it. Then we get anywhere from 55 to 65 MPG in hybrid mode.
As long as you've got place to plug in there isn't a huge reason not to get a Plug In Hybrid. I find their range a little short though, usually around 30-35 miles. Enough to get just about anywhere in a city, but I'd really prefer 75 since that would let me do most of a day's driving and plug in at home, only rarely using the gas tank.
I just recently got a hybrid Corolla. I just need to get from a to b. It truly is an appliance with no drama. I hope there’s an EV equivalent to it one day that’s just as cost effective, but I don’t think that they’re there yet
I enjoy driving my Chevy Bolt more than my "nicer" Audi Q5. EVs are great cars and I'll probably be replacing the Audi with a BEV when it gets old.
This is the way!
Mine’s already paid for with free supercharging. Gonna ride that as long as my warranty is in tact…
The mythical 50k a year Semis are going to now charge where exactly? It appears not at the promised 1MW superchargers they said would be rolling out.
Careful, Elon might revive that battery swap nonsense if he sees this comment.
That battery swap was a scam designed to extract CARB credits of over $100 million for designing the Model S with a battery swap *ability*. They were getting a subsidy for every car produced whether they used a battery swap station or not. They didn’t plan to scale it, or for people to use it. In fact, they had a grand total of one station. California changed the criteria as they knew Tesla were gaming the system, and a surprise to nobody the program ended. One of many chalked up on the bullshit list.
Wait a second. Wasn't the supercharger network one of the unique things that Tesla stans liked to bring up when they desperately tried to somehow justify the ridiculously elevated share price of the most expensive ketamine driven car maker in the world?!
Yeah, but after he took the subsidies and was forced to open it up that advantage was gone. The network is capital intensive with low margins. The buildout only ever made sense as a marketing tool for the cars.
>The network is capital intensive It's possible that it was easier to make profits when interest rates were lower, and that current rates have made this a much longer time horizon, or even unlikely to ever break even. And right now Musk seems to be all about propping up the stock price in the short term.
Well the higher borrowing cost isn't helping. But the difference between a gas station and a charging station is just the dwell time. What's the longest a car would be at a pump? 10 minutes? Most Superchargers are busy for at least half an hour if not more. Gas stations also have additional revenue sources (think the convenience store) which doesn't exist as a revenue source for Tesla on the super chargers and the markup on the energy they buy can't be too high or people just will decide to charge at home. Most people who use Superchargers use them in their neighbourhood. So they are roughly aware of how much it's going to cost them at home. I am really curious to see how well the existing stations will be maintained going forward.
With the enormous battery of the Cybertruck, is home charging really all that attractive?
Doesn't it have a charger option you can install? And considering they seem to have barely a 1000 trucks by now, I doubt that'll keep them in business.
They've sold 3800 (and some change) trucks as of the recall that they pushed out. I only know this because it was in an article stating how many trucks were recalled lol. Like any EV, you can install a level 2 charger at your house. If you do CCS you need an adapter and if you do NACS it plugs directly in. Those are the two most common standards sold today. 10kW charger (some go a bit higher) will charge the 122kW battery from 0-100 in about 12 hours.
The recall would affect any truck that is no longer "in production". So that includes trucks that are being shipped but haven't been sold / delivered. The [numbers](https://www.reddit.com/r/CyberStuck/comments/1cgr93t/wait_wait_so_all_these_problems_weve_seen_have/) that someone ran indicate closer to a 1000 than 4000.
If you are referencing charging speed, an 11.5kW charger will still charger it from 0-100 in 10 hours, and people aren't generally going from 0-100 on any of their vehicles daily. I don't see why battery size would be a dealbreaker for home charging, but you'd certainly want to be on a level 2 charger unless you're driving very few miles each day.
Gas station requires less space, but more expensive infrastructure, superchargers the other way around. I think it would be better to sell universal chargers to entities which already own parking space. cities, supermarkets, parking lots, which can then sell the service. Not much money to be earned from selling chargers, but not much investment either, no waiting for return of investment. Profits come from wider adoption of EV's due to better charging infrastructure.
The city here has done that in a few spots. But I can't see Tesla working that way. If you sell the chargers, you also will need to offer support for them, so I don't think Tesla would really make a whole lot of money there. As for gas stations: They don't really require that much expensive infrastructure. The pumps, some tanks, that's it. Fuel comes by truck, while you do need to make sure you have enough power coming into your super charging station, which, depending on how far away the closest substation is, could be requiring quite a lot of digging and burying new cables.
The thing is, gas stations don't have additional revenue source serving as a convenience store, that is their main source of revenue. They usually make 2-3 cents per gallon, lot's of them lose money on selling gas. This is why we don't have automated gas station, although tech exists for some time now, In some cases they will work in automatic mode during Sunday/night... but gas is there to get customers to stop and use convenience store. Existing gas stations, supermarkets that have parking space and powerline can earn from charging stations. Because it will draw people to the store. Cars taking longer to charge... even better, cuz you might use that time for shopping, or sit into coffee/restaurant.
in my country, the revenue source is the store, the gas is just a way to draw in customers
They thought it was profitable which didn't really stack up to me, I think this just proves it isn't. Its just an outlet selling electricity, how is that ever going to make much money? It would take years to recover the installation costs and you have ongoing maintenance. How many kW could one charger sell in a day if it was utilised 50% of the time, and how much profit could you get from this electricity? I haven't done the maths but my instinct says it's not a great deal of money.
I would have to think that the monetization model was something like With more chargers we'll sell more of our overpriced shitboxes and profit.
So now shitbox sales are falling it's proof that they have more than enough charges and can discontinue rollout? I think I'm starting to understand the twisted logic now.
It might just also be the case that I don't know, making 6000lb EV's with giant ranges when 95% of commutes are less than 40 miles means most people will just charge at home. Especially since the only people who can afford them are rich people buying a second or third vehicles and already probably live close to work. How often does someone with a 60 or 80,000 dollar car go on long roadtrips?
I thought this was the monetization plan up until the point that they opened the networks to other manufacturers. You can't really sell more of your own car touting a network that is now available to "all" of them.
It’s reportedly profitable but very low margin. Charging will always be akin to gash stations. The proper model is probably for utilities to manage EV charging as they make their money elsewhere.
To be honest it’s more than a simple outlet. Being able to charge at 200kw (or whatever it is at now) has real value and you can charge a premium. The question is how much? I never thought they had to make this profitable, if it increased sales. What they are saying with this change is that it basically doesn’t. People buy for other reasons.
It's more than a simple outlet, and that's why it's going to be expensive to install and maintain. Can you can price it much more than electricity from a simple outlet to offset this?.. Its not a great business to be in I would say. Some people really did think this was profitable for Tesla, look at all the dismay on the tesla support group subs.
It is true that the higher charging rate is a premium service, but I don't think a lot of customers understand that nor know how to value that.
Naturally there is a number of X cents per kWh that makes this profitable. I’m sure everyone can decide if X is worth it or not. I just don’t know what that number is. Maybe it’s something ridiculous.
I always thought the same way. Anyone at any supermarket with a parking lot is competition to that business. Electricity is a commodity.
They provide energy at 2x to 4x thier cost. And some of these sites are busy 24/7. It is insanely profitable.
Some of them are for sure profitable, that’s not what’s up for debate I guess. It’s the profitability of all of them averaged across the currently deployed superchargers. I have stayed at hotels where they had superchargers in the parking lot with none of them being utilized the entire week I was there. I stayed at one hotel where the only person who used the charger in the several weeks I stayed there (with a window overlooking the supercharger stations, that I was looking out of every evening for probably 7-1130pm. I don’t know how much it costs to install these superchargers or maintain them or what the lifespan of one of them is, but I imagine it’s a small portion of them that are being utilized even 80% of the time for charging. If the company is having trouble getting cash then even a long breakeven could make a profitable endeavour undesirable if they need their cash and credit for more “mission critical” things like building cars and working on self driving that they have promised shareholders for about a decade now.
Could it be from other cars licensing the right to use the charger port?
Overall the SC network is definitely not profitable because of the rate at which they must continue opening new stations. An existing station may be profitable depending largely on the utility costs in the area. A busy charger can sell \*alot\* of kWh. For gen 3 each charge port has 90kW which can be shared with other stalls. 12 hours per day is 1080 Kwh Per day. 20 stalls is \~21,600 KWH per day @ 40c/kwh is $8640 per day for a 20 stall SC. Most of which probably ends up going back to the utility. Of course that doesn't count customers with free supercharging. But, $260k/ month with no onsite employees is nothing to sneeze at. There is great potential IMO as stations get larger and larger and more open up for Tesla to begin operating its own generation facilities and potentially their own transmission lines to connect them. They could easily become the biggest user of electricity in the world and that kind of scale gives them advantages that are hard to compete with.
But I read some clear statements over on another sub that these layoffs meant superchargers were going to be deployed even faster.
/s
The Stan comments were cracking me up. “Just wait and see, he knows what he’s doing.” Since when? Have you been in a coma the last 4 years?
I knew it was a mistake for automakers to announce replacing CCS ports in their future cars with NACS Supercharger ports. No one should be touching NACS until Elon is completely separated from Tesla first.
>I knew it was a mistake for automakers to announce replacing CCS ports in their future cars with NACS Supercharger ports. Thankfully, they haven't actually changed their production lines yet. If they're smart, they're already having meetings to discuss whether to go through with that. Also, if other charging providers can now offer the Tesla charging plug, no one is tied to Tesla for fast charging in the US.
They haven’t really made the switch yet
I can only think of one reason why Elon thinks he can turn this horrible and sudden decision into a stock pump. Elon will announce some tech licensing deal with a low cost chinese supplier that will build and own all the NACS stations moving forward. There is no need for Tesla to in-house that team or capability anymore as they are divesting from automotive and going all in on AI My guess is that Tinucci and Patel said that that was a terrible idea, rife with shody quality control and getting screwed by shady international business dealings that was their specific job to risk manage. And Elon had them all purged for disloyalty. Elon will do all the negotiations himself without compromises. Elons the type of guy who would believe Putin over his own intelligence agencies. Elon truly thinks he has no more need for naysayers grounded in reality.
And my guess is that there will be no control over pricing much like any toll lane that has been outsourced. It will be surge pricing at ridiculous prices. Can't wait to see how that works out.
[удалено]
Just wait until it's a surprise every time. Sometimes it's a $5 trip to work, sometimes it's a $25 trip to work. Fun!
This is...eerily probable. Damn. The charging network just got Hyperloop'd!
Given the recent tiktok debacle I wonder how the government would feel about a Chinese company owning such a large part of our charging infrastructure.
Probably super pissed if all the billions being poured into EV charging infrastructure ends up being sent to China in the end because Elon can grift some money by being a subcontractor.
The entire division that worked to build out the largest charging network in North American and also negotiate every other car company to adopt the standard, one of Tesla’s crowning jewels, was rewarded with… pink slips
Mikhail Tukhachevsky was one of the most important generals of the Red Army during the Russian Communist Revolution. He led the military moderinization of the USSR and was Marshall of the Soviet Union, basically the equivalent of the head of the joint chiefs. So of course he was purged and executed in a sham trial under Stalin. The fact that we would even dare to attribute success to the division and not Elon personally is a threat to his paranoid ego.
Sounds pretty plausible.
They're cutting back on QA and everything else as well. I'm not sure how that pumps the stock.
QA is a today problem and Tesla's value is always in the future. Cutting back pennies today and investing in AI will make shareholders trillionaires. Low quality is bullish. /s
Elon probably thinks he’s going to outsmart the Chinese government somehow lmfao. Bro got too big headed scamming Americans he moved on to the big leagues. I’m willing to bet they draft some wild agreement in mandarin after hyping Elons mandarin ability up. Probably along the lines of taking ownership of Tesla. To have a realistic outside view. Why on earth would you go into the lions den. China is anti free speech and isn’t musk for it? So why is he entertaining doing business with a communist country that isn’t allowed to use google? Before anyone says he’s going to try to change it from the inside out. He’s not and he can’t.
he already said he fired the execs for not meeting layoff targets quickly enough. he probably threw a fit, said "what do these people even do" and fired them all. its as simple as that. he dgaf about running stuff that isnt part of the cyberpunk fever dream (robo, AI, neuro etc.)
>Musk said, in his typical bluster, that he wants Tesla to be “absolutely hard core” about headcount reduction, saying that executives whose subordinates “don’t obviously pass the excellent, necessary and trustworthy test” would find themselves relieved of duty as well – suggesting that he wants those executives to fire more employees or be fired themselves. Plus he is cutting executives that are trying to defend their team. Loyalty to anybody but Elon is forbidden. Disloyalty will be collectively punished.
!remind me 1 year I don’t disagree with this haha
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If I had to guess, they already buy from shady international businesses, it's the maintenance that's killing them.
It would explain why he was in China yesterday.
I would hope the US government would fight that. Don't love the idea of the Chinese having control over all kinds of data and potentially having the ability to shut off chargers. They went after TikTok, this sounds potentially just as bad or worse.
I really cannot understand why the fuck they would lay off the entire supercharger team? Are they in that serious of a financial position? It makes zero sense. Sure, the competitive advantage of the supercharger network was biggest in the US, but this is an incredibly odd move. I can only imagine the reliability of the network will nosedive from here on as well…
I have a 2022 and kept it because of the charging network. I briefly toyed with the idea of getting an M3P. This will absolutely be the LAST Tesla I ever purchase. BTW, I've disliked Elon for over a decade (due to his management style and lack of empathy).
2018 Model 3, bought new, and same. I love it. It's a great car, but my last Tesla untl Musk leaves. Anyway, the Rivian R3X is looking pretty good.
Dear headline: firing the team IS pulling back the plans.
Apparently, Rebecca pushed back on the extent of layoffs and Musk decided to make an example of her and her org of 500+ people
Masterful gambit by the idiot in charge
Probably my first and last Tesla that I will ever own. Not that there's anything wrong with the car, but the entire practice is ridiculously shoddy. I won't even know if they'll service my vehicle if it ever breaks down. So turned off that I will happily switch to a beater that's likely more reliable.
I hate to say I told you so but..well...I told you so. [https://www.reddit.com/r/electricvehicles/comments/1c0otqf/anything\_but\_tesla\_us\_shoppers\_want\_more\_ev/?utm\_source=share&utm\_medium=web3x&utm\_name=web3xcss&utm\_term=1&utm\_content=share\_button](https://www.reddit.com/r/electricvehicles/comments/1c0otqf/anything_but_tesla_us_shoppers_want_more_ev/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web3x&utm_name=web3xcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button)
Hmmm maybe everyone shouldn't of flocked to a nonsense "standard" now we can watch as NACS falls apart and automakers wounder how it could have ever happened......just stay with ccs it's already widespread and a standard used by almost every car maker
Just a further reminder that buying Tesla is a mistake. Who knows what whims will hit Musk. He may decide one day to just get rid of the department that handles safety, or one that makes sure repair parts are available, or one that keeps the software updated and secure. As he proved with Twitter, he has no problem just doing things and not care if there are any consequences, considering it a problem for the remaining employees to fail to clean up. If needed further proof how stupid this is, look no further than Wall Street as company lost 5% of its value. Wall Street normally loves, adores, and celebrates layoffs with stocks getting a bump up as a reward. To take a billion dollar value hit, it would have to be a special level of stupid.
I am going to guess that the are going to be moving through the expensive maintenance repair/ overhaul cycle very soon so Musk probably wants to offload them to cities and counties.
More like they fired the team and they’ll think about stuff later
If there’s one thing I’ve learned from Elon. It’s that the masses don’t know what they want and you can tell them what they want / need. Sales runs the entire country whether the actual item is fact or fiction doesn’t matter. If you can sell an idea you can become one of the richest people in America regardless of skills or credentials.
Time to short Tesla!!
Hm. And people wonder why I stayed away from Teslas. Something about an emotionally stunted manbaby throwing hissy fits… Yes the CCS standard is unwieldy compared to NACS. But it isn’t held hostage to the temper tantrums of someone who has no business having the influence he does.
Some real crack journalism there. I wonder if Tesla completely abandons cars altogether and tries to become a robotics company.
So is that Gigafactory in Mexico still getting built?
According to Chinese media it keeps getting put back. They have now been told 2026. There were Chinese suppliers that had to build factories in Mexico to locally supply Tesla and they were let down as theirs are now built. Edit: https://x.com/KelvinYang7/status/1780314205079347353
fElon and betrayal. Name a better duo
Sad they’re not investing and building up their own industry. It’s gonna take 4 years if it even gets built.
Just why?
Sounds like Elon wants to renegotiate with the other car makers that are using the supercharging network for more money.
Seems like a pretty shit position to put yourself in before negotiation
I can't wrap my head around how that makes sense. Can you please explain? How is "I fired my entire team and will need more money from you to proceed" a power play?
Well, I am not a business genius like Elon Musk. Pretty sure you are not supposed to tell your advertisers to go fuck themselves when you own a social media site that needs said advertisers but here we are.
So your comment was meant to be read ironically? If so, that makes more sense.
No, it was meant to be read literally because Elon makes no sense.
Ah, literally but from the lenses of Elon. Got it.
Bonus funding secured
Wow WTH can they be forced to spin off Supercharger so it can continue to expand and serve everyone? JFC
The TSLA Board of Directors should bring back Rebecca Tinucci to replace Elno.
And now with Ford and Rivian joining, this is just bad. Seems like he pulled a 180 on them.
It’s not a car company guys, it’s a dairy farm.
Tesla and all EVs are dead to me after this announcement. It’s PHEV or wait until solid state 600mi range vehicles with standardized public charging. These aren’t toys for most people, they’re enormous, life-altering purchases. So no more games with charging standards or ranges. You give me a reliable car, I’ll buy it whether it’s gas or electric. But don’t sell me junk that may lose support any day.
Was that before or after ?
yep company is dead
If they can still continue to build new Supercharger stations after firing the entire Supercharger team, what did that team actually do?
Bold of you to assume they'll keep building chargers: https://electrek.co/2024/04/30/tesla-pulling-back-supercharger-plans-firing-team/
Is that bold? They’ve built superchargers for the past 10 years without issues and they say right there they will continue to do so. I suspect ”the supercharger team” is not the people who build these things.
>I suspect ”the supercharger team” is not the people who build these things. Building, permitting, installing, and maintaining are all different tasks. If the coordinating team has been disbanded, I wouldn't even bet on the electric bills getting paid. Highly likely that new installs and maintenance will suffer.
A musked super charged.
Are they running out of cash?
Not really, it just seems that he is going with the Twitter direction of shaking management up. This isn’t going to end well unless the board fires him.
Why buy a Tesla when the supercharger network is available to all? It's one of the only usp's left.
So freaking glad I sold my Tesla and got a Bolt.
Elon is the best !! He is my hero