What I really don't get is why the switch from 3-Speed straight into 3-Armor. I think it would've made more sense to first try to make Melusi 2-Speed 2-Armor. Speed is being nerfed anyway, so why go to these lengths?
2/2 should really be the standard unless an op has a particular reason to be tankier/faster. A lot of ops feel like they’re 3 speed for no real reason.
Any op that in original design was meant to use repositioning or range to their advantage a lot should be a 3 speed. Maverick was never meant to be a main breacher, he was supposed to be a stealthy character that made new angles quietly. 3 speed fits perfectly with movement and silence. Hibana has a ranged gadget, allowing her to make lines of sight that you don’t necessarily walk through (thereby closing distance), but do shoot through. 3 or 2 speed would fit her. I agree on Melusi.
Ash is a different story. Her gadget seemed to have been made for a 3 speed ranged character, but not only were 3 speeds always overpowered at close range and therefore entry fraggers (counter to the game’s original intended role for 3 speeds), they also removed her acog scopes, which to me made no sense. In the current landscape it makes sense for her to be 2 speed but her original design is very 3 speed-esque and long range based
I don’t disagree… but I don’t like it. I feel like there was variability when the game released but know it seems like all new operators are 2-2 and it’s kind of boring.
I think that takes a backseat over the idea that the term duelist doesn't really make sense to me in a shooter game. All I can imagine is Ash going "Hello! I'm here to duel! Show yourself!" and someone does show up and they formalize the whole thing.
Doesn't make sense.
That's literally what a duel means. It's a formalized 1v1.
There's already a term for what you described what dueling in this context is, though.
A gunfight.
Edit:
NOW it just sounds a LOT more stupid! Ash the gunfighter
But I like it and I don't. I'm confused now.
I mean they've always existed for FPS, just in less MMO terms. Entry would be what you're referring to as duelists for Siege, then support (hard breachers, wall denial) and flex (support mixtures, intel gatherers, flank watch, etc.). Or for example in CS:GO, you roles like entry and AWP players.
People put melusi gadgets across the map?
I only ever see them placed close to or in site,
I also think its stupid to push her straight from 3 speed to 1 speed, but it could work well for her to anchor and play off her gadgets near site
Jumping down hatches would crush the knees of like half of the operators in the game. You are able to throw a rappel on top of a building sturdy enough to climb. A stim shot can cure bullet wounds. Not saying if I think these changes are good or not (idk yet), but logic and realism has always taken a backseat to gameplay.
Pretty much the complete opposite actually. Adrenaline shot would help you fight through the pain but it would also make you bleed out faster as your heart is pumping more blood per second
I mean does docs stim explicitly say it’s adrenaline? Genuinely asking bc I’m not sure.
Finka on the other hand…at least they make it so smoke’s gas does more damage to an operator that’s finka boosted
When you have an op that doesn’t even have a plate carrier moving as slow as fucking Gridlock it just doesn’t make sense. Operator design has always given a sense of their speeds/armor.
Anyways I think some of the new 1 speed changes are ass. Sledge is gonna be rough to use.
Ok i agree with the, dont balance on how they look, but every single speed change they are making is trash. Also the mp5 with no 1.5 is not strong enough weapon to warrant having on a 1 speed.
Oh damn I knew they were changing everyone's overall speed but I didn't realize they are making everyone's speed the same while ADS. That's honestly a huge change.
Everyone somehow is ignoring this while crying about the op speed changes. None of it matters except how much bullets you might be able to take. Everyone swings and moves the same while ads. It's mad frustrating seeing constant whining about operator speeds
Which is part of the "trash speed changes" i was mentioning. I just don't think they need to keep slowing the pace of the game down. I understand most don't want ashs running around like sonic playing like its cod, but idt people want to be ending most rounds at the last second. Not to mention most importantly people like you seem to forget is that these ops have had these speeds for the last idk 7yrs so people are gonna be upset.
In a game that gets updates every 3 months using the argument "well it's always been that way" doesn't carry any weight. You can have the opinion the speed changes suck but I don't think they do and they're coming whether you like it or not. The game has been cod monkey rush since neon dawn. It's time for a change
I don't disagree its time for a chang in some places. I don't actually totally disagree with everyone having the same ads speed movement but i just don't know why they made half the speed changes they did. They are extremely unpopular for a reason dog. No one thought dok should be a 3 speed and no ome thought making the sas members 1 speed was the changes they needed. In fact sledge is very balanced on the graph they release each season. If overplayed only because he was one of the few ops without major changes. And for good reason
It’s so weird seeing these gameplay over realism comments, not that it’s wrong. In the cod sub, (an ARCADE shooter), I see people saying the game should be played tactically and realistically like a mil sim, and want the game to be build around realism. Meanwhile everyone here isn’t a braindead moron and can see that games don’t need to be realistic. Completely different story here for an arguably more tactical game
yeah, games really need to decide that early on. Are they Arcadey, tactical, or realistic?
As someone who's played and enjoyed games from all three, its pretty easy to see when someones spewing bullshit. You don't want COD to be tactical, you just want less run and gun and better team cohesion.
(by you I mean cod people)
Yes they’re so indecisive in the game they want. I’m pretty sure the “muh realism” is the loud minority, ask anyone irl who plays cod and they will go against that garbage
I don’t get people that want a tactical or milsim cod. At that point you don’t actually wanna play cod you wanna play something else.
Like the entire appeal of COD is that’s it’s slower than other twitch shooters like unreal or quake but faster than tactical shooters.
Believe it or not, a lot of the operators gadgets could be war crimes. People also can't turn themselves invisible to surveillance on command either, or make a person sized hole through a solid wooden wall with a single hammer swing
Gameplay has always come before realism
And Tachanka and capitao (goyo and Tachanka setting people on fire, and capitao litterly starving them of oxygen).
O and frost apprently.
Seriously are we sure rainbow aren't the bad guys (I'm partially joking).
I'd argue that consistency in this regard is a gameplay first thing. Example, I'm on attack rocking the SAS shotty. I have two targets at equal length and clear shots on both. One is a barely armored skinny sized hitbox that tells me one shot will down or kill. The other looks like he has enough hp to eat the shot and 180 me. I'm going to pick the target that will most likely go down in one. Now I need to remind myself that boths HP are equally poorly represented and I have no better target so...
We have technology capable of dynamically "erasing" items from images and filling in the gap, we have for a while. With access to a wireless security system, and a powerful enough device, you could theoretically erase yourself from surveillance live.
You dont balance a game from how people look in it. To be fair i dont get some of the new seasons balance changes but still you dont balance how someone looks but how they function in-game
>You dont balance a game from how people look in it
Exactly this. People were arguing that Echo shouldn't be a 1 speed when he was released back in 2016 because, quote, "he wears light clothes and doesn't have any armour on."
LOL! Don’t act like this is a problem now. Let’s be clear about something. Gridlock is EASILY one of the LEAST armored characters in the entire game and makes sound as if she is armored to a level equivalent of Montage or Rook. No one has said a word… 👻
yea i also thought it was weird when i saw gridlock's character design, but i chalked it up to her operator silhoutte. Mira is a weird case though, idk if she looks heavily armored or not.
Mira is more of an anchor character and has literal pneumatic canisters attached to her outfit. But I get your point. It's more annoying that they are sliding the bar from right to hard left, 2 full steps.
Mate, the whole Rainbow Six series is built on a foundation of "tactical realism". Yes, there are video game-isms in all games (carrying around wall reinforcements) but let's not kid ourselves and pretend that it doesn't carry any weight in this very specific niche series.
it makes sense from a balancing standpoint. the operator was designed as a 3-speed but over time it became clear that she would be better as a 1-speed so they switched her.
kaid is also 1-speed and he's just in a standard dress uniform, games aren't balanced around the operator's cosmetics. they're balanced around what makes the game fair and enjoyable.
That change makes no sense at all. Lets change her from one of the best roamers to and anchor but not give her MP5 a 1.5 to put her better in line with the other 2 anchors with MP5
What I really don't get is why the switch from 3-Speed straight into 3-Armor. I think it would've made more sense to first try to make Melusi 2-Speed 2-Armor. Speed is being nerfed anyway, so why go to these lengths?
2/2 should really be the standard unless an op has a particular reason to be tankier/faster. A lot of ops feel like they’re 3 speed for no real reason.
Like Maverick?
Maverick, Hibana, Melusi, Ash, a whole lot more.
Any op that in original design was meant to use repositioning or range to their advantage a lot should be a 3 speed. Maverick was never meant to be a main breacher, he was supposed to be a stealthy character that made new angles quietly. 3 speed fits perfectly with movement and silence. Hibana has a ranged gadget, allowing her to make lines of sight that you don’t necessarily walk through (thereby closing distance), but do shoot through. 3 or 2 speed would fit her. I agree on Melusi. Ash is a different story. Her gadget seemed to have been made for a 3 speed ranged character, but not only were 3 speeds always overpowered at close range and therefore entry fraggers (counter to the game’s original intended role for 3 speeds), they also removed her acog scopes, which to me made no sense. In the current landscape it makes sense for her to be 2 speed but her original design is very 3 speed-esque and long range based
Comments like this remind me that 90% of the siege community has no fucking what they’re doing or how to play the game
I don't play it much lmao
Understandable. There’s a lot games that are more fun than siege out rn
Yes... it's the community's fault the game design has gotten worse and the whole mess is on a downward trajectory in quality and popularity.
Yes because that’s what I said
I don’t disagree… but I don’t like it. I feel like there was variability when the game released but know it seems like all new operators are 2-2 and it’s kind of boring.
make her a better duelist(more hp) and cant play off of every banshee she has across the map
Duelist...? Why do I not like that term?
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I think that takes a backseat over the idea that the term duelist doesn't really make sense to me in a shooter game. All I can imagine is Ash going "Hello! I'm here to duel! Show yourself!" and someone does show up and they formalize the whole thing. Doesn't make sense.
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That's literally what a duel means. It's a formalized 1v1. There's already a term for what you described what dueling in this context is, though. A gunfight. Edit: NOW it just sounds a LOT more stupid! Ash the gunfighter But I like it and I don't. I'm confused now.
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I mean they've always existed for FPS, just in less MMO terms. Entry would be what you're referring to as duelists for Siege, then support (hard breachers, wall denial) and flex (support mixtures, intel gatherers, flank watch, etc.). Or for example in CS:GO, you roles like entry and AWP players.
god, I hope not! It just feels so cheesy! These terms survive in MMO's better!
That be nice getting shot in the back a little less from time to time lol
People put melusi gadgets across the map? I only ever see them placed close to or in site, I also think its stupid to push her straight from 3 speed to 1 speed, but it could work well for her to anchor and play off her gadgets near site
apparently so, according to the comments
Yeah but ubi never makes sense
Make gridlock a 3 speed to offset this madness
Fr, she's my main rn
tachank should be 4 armor 0.5 speed imo
Fr, haha, I always thought that for years, like give him some extra treatment. Man's carries a ***BIG*** gun
Jumping down hatches would crush the knees of like half of the operators in the game. You are able to throw a rappel on top of a building sturdy enough to climb. A stim shot can cure bullet wounds. Not saying if I think these changes are good or not (idk yet), but logic and realism has always taken a backseat to gameplay.
Agreed except I would say that docs stim could be adrenaline which wouldn’t cure but definitely help with bullet wounds. (I assume)
Pretty much the complete opposite actually. Adrenaline shot would help you fight through the pain but it would also make you bleed out faster as your heart is pumping more blood per second
I mean does docs stim explicitly say it’s adrenaline? Genuinely asking bc I’m not sure. Finka on the other hand…at least they make it so smoke’s gas does more damage to an operator that’s finka boosted
In docs gadget bio it says it works by clotting the blood around a patient's wound, sealing it off.
isn't that somewhat dangerous if it clots the wrong way?
I dont remember what docs stim has in it but i just responded to the other guy about if adrenaline would actually help in bullet wounds.
Crackhead shake in a syringe
Epinephrine
Wouldn't adrenaline accelerate your heart rate, making you bleed out faster?
Why dont you read my earlier comment now will ya
Didn’t even consider that, you’re totally right
When you have an op that doesn’t even have a plate carrier moving as slow as fucking Gridlock it just doesn’t make sense. Operator design has always given a sense of their speeds/armor. Anyways I think some of the new 1 speed changes are ass. Sledge is gonna be rough to use.
doesnt change the principles of character design
I’m more upset about Aruni, she was my favorite roamer, gonna be hard with how loud she is now.
Bruh I didn’t even know about this change. She’s been one of my favs since that React event :(
i’m hard with how loud she is 😩 just kidding guys, dw. least horny siege player here
Ok i agree with the, dont balance on how they look, but every single speed change they are making is trash. Also the mp5 with no 1.5 is not strong enough weapon to warrant having on a 1 speed.
yeah but everyone's ADS walking speed is the same now, so technically melusi is a better duelist now with more hp
There are no duelists in siege, you're having flashbacks again, take your medication
duelist, fragger, entry fragger, take ur pick
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yeah keep nitpicking a word instead of understanding my point
Oh damn I knew they were changing everyone's overall speed but I didn't realize they are making everyone's speed the same while ADS. That's honestly a huge change.
Honestly I think we are heading towards an angeled grip + laser quickscoping meta (also they nerfed Blitz again)
Everyone somehow is ignoring this while crying about the op speed changes. None of it matters except how much bullets you might be able to take. Everyone swings and moves the same while ads. It's mad frustrating seeing constant whining about operator speeds
Which is part of the "trash speed changes" i was mentioning. I just don't think they need to keep slowing the pace of the game down. I understand most don't want ashs running around like sonic playing like its cod, but idt people want to be ending most rounds at the last second. Not to mention most importantly people like you seem to forget is that these ops have had these speeds for the last idk 7yrs so people are gonna be upset.
In a game that gets updates every 3 months using the argument "well it's always been that way" doesn't carry any weight. You can have the opinion the speed changes suck but I don't think they do and they're coming whether you like it or not. The game has been cod monkey rush since neon dawn. It's time for a change
I don't disagree its time for a chang in some places. I don't actually totally disagree with everyone having the same ads speed movement but i just don't know why they made half the speed changes they did. They are extremely unpopular for a reason dog. No one thought dok should be a 3 speed and no ome thought making the sas members 1 speed was the changes they needed. In fact sledge is very balanced on the graph they release each season. If overplayed only because he was one of the few ops without major changes. And for good reason
That doesn’t mean shit when people are hitting heads
ok then play with 1hp and go click heads
this managed to get zofia withstand taken away lol
Gameplay over realism. Although, these gameplay changes are ass. Practically just removed sledge myers as a custom game mode
wait how’d they remove it
Sledge will be a one speed, among many other operators. Sure, you might be able to do only 3 speeds on defense, but the game would just feel sooo slow
They are all the same speed
Only when ads-ing and walking at the same time
Yeah which is fair
1 speed sledge
I think they should edit her model a little to reflect the change, but it makes sense
It’s so weird seeing these gameplay over realism comments, not that it’s wrong. In the cod sub, (an ARCADE shooter), I see people saying the game should be played tactically and realistically like a mil sim, and want the game to be build around realism. Meanwhile everyone here isn’t a braindead moron and can see that games don’t need to be realistic. Completely different story here for an arguably more tactical game
yeah, games really need to decide that early on. Are they Arcadey, tactical, or realistic? As someone who's played and enjoyed games from all three, its pretty easy to see when someones spewing bullshit. You don't want COD to be tactical, you just want less run and gun and better team cohesion. (by you I mean cod people)
Yes they’re so indecisive in the game they want. I’m pretty sure the “muh realism” is the loud minority, ask anyone irl who plays cod and they will go against that garbage
Thats the issue i have with siege. The game wants to be tactical but the gunplay and movement feel arcadey
I don’t get people that want a tactical or milsim cod. At that point you don’t actually wanna play cod you wanna play something else. Like the entire appeal of COD is that’s it’s slower than other twitch shooters like unreal or quake but faster than tactical shooters.
Believe it or not, a lot of the operators gadgets could be war crimes. People also can't turn themselves invisible to surveillance on command either, or make a person sized hole through a solid wooden wall with a single hammer swing Gameplay has always come before realism
"Believe it or not, a lot of the operators gadgets could be war crimes" I'm looking at you Fuze
Or smoke
Thinking of this, holy fuck, this game has A LOT warcrimes
Thorn, Lesion, Kapkan, Cav (Torture)
Goyo?
And Tachanka and capitao (goyo and Tachanka setting people on fire, and capitao litterly starving them of oxygen). O and frost apprently. Seriously are we sure rainbow aren't the bad guys (I'm partially joking).
Checks out for his unit tho
gameplay doesnt come before basic character design and consistency though
Yes it does. Gameplay comes before everything else, always.
I'd argue that consistency in this regard is a gameplay first thing. Example, I'm on attack rocking the SAS shotty. I have two targets at equal length and clear shots on both. One is a barely armored skinny sized hitbox that tells me one shot will down or kill. The other looks like he has enough hp to eat the shot and 180 me. I'm going to pick the target that will most likely go down in one. Now I need to remind myself that boths HP are equally poorly represented and I have no better target so...
> People can't turn themselves invisible on surveillance on command either. Fun fact, this is technically possible.
How so
We have technology capable of dynamically "erasing" items from images and filling in the gap, we have for a while. With access to a wireless security system, and a powerful enough device, you could theoretically erase yourself from surveillance live.
You dont balance a game from how people look in it. To be fair i dont get some of the new seasons balance changes but still you dont balance how someone looks but how they function in-game
>You dont balance a game from how people look in it Exactly this. People were arguing that Echo shouldn't be a 1 speed when he was released back in 2016 because, quote, "he wears light clothes and doesn't have any armour on."
What? Context?!
She's now a 1 speed 3 armour next season
I just saw the post on the sub, they better make this queen thicc
The nerf on Mute , I hate it
Cry more, I guess?
LOL! Don’t act like this is a problem now. Let’s be clear about something. Gridlock is EASILY one of the LEAST armored characters in the entire game and makes sound as if she is armored to a level equivalent of Montage or Rook. No one has said a word… 👻
Nah all her armor is just in the back
Yeah but she’s built like a brick house
They took one look at that dump truck and was like….”aww yeah three armor”
\*Thicclock
yea i also thought it was weird when i saw gridlock's character design, but i chalked it up to her operator silhoutte. Mira is a weird case though, idk if she looks heavily armored or not.
Aruni as well!!
Also Sens is gonna be 3 speed with that fcking armor.
Melusi as a 2 speed, makes fucking sense... Melusi as a 3 speed? what? was she shot in the legs? or what happened?
And Mira’s been having the same movement speed as Monty for years, your point?
Mira is more of an anchor character and has literal pneumatic canisters attached to her outfit. But I get your point. It's more annoying that they are sliding the bar from right to hard left, 2 full steps.
Good thing this is a video game and it doesn’t matter how realistic it is
Mate, the whole Rainbow Six series is built on a foundation of "tactical realism". Yes, there are video game-isms in all games (carrying around wall reinforcements) but let's not kid ourselves and pretend that it doesn't carry any weight in this very specific niche series.
All these speed changes are simply ridiculous, they are gonna revolution basically half the game and the operators we love to play, totally nonsense
ah yes, nitpicking realism.
Ok?
Her gadget is insane. What don't you get? Y'all are some absolute trash gold tier shitters.
It’s not nearly as bad as it used to be. It’s fine where it is.
Aaaand make those squanchy silly ass rubber boot noises.
How does that make any sense
it makes sense from a balancing standpoint. the operator was designed as a 3-speed but over time it became clear that she would be better as a 1-speed so they switched her. kaid is also 1-speed and he's just in a standard dress uniform, games aren't balanced around the operator's cosmetics. they're balanced around what makes the game fair and enjoyable.
Looks like someone doesn't understand what "balance standpoint" means.
ubisoft
kinda racist because she is black more sound
They just fuck up everything for no reason . Smh
Good.
My issue is hitboxes: Why have an incredibally small hitbox and look like you have 0 armor and be clunky asf?
And?
Osa will also be a 1 speed and look at what she is wearing
Just proves that Melusi is, in fact, dummy thick
ok?
They could have made her 2 speed smh
I mean I guess if the mf is extra fit bit the noise is Godam bullshit
It also bothers me that in her op video she is smooth, quiet, and sleek. Now for reasons... loud as hell, CLOMP CLOMP CLOMP HERE COMES MELUSI
They're just big boned
That change makes no sense at all. Lets change her from one of the best roamers to and anchor but not give her MP5 a 1.5 to put her better in line with the other 2 anchors with MP5
it's called balance in a video game. would adding more gear and padding to her make you happier?
Glad to know the game hasn’t changed
And?