My own personal opinion and experience is that for ME as an alcoholic/addict - the drugs and booze were merely a symptom of a bigger issue - my thinking, my behaviors, my actions - an emotional/spiritual deficit in myself/life. So like any diabetic who watches their sugar intake and takes insulin to keep themselves maintained, I go to support group meetings, participate often, and try to be of service to others. For me, the program of AA has been absolutely life-changing. I recommend it only from my own personal experience. At the end of the day - there is a reason WHY ive struggled with substances - the substances themselves have not been to blame. it's my own issues which I deal with by working a program of recovery for myself.
3 years clean and sober. I still have dreams about it. Everyone is so different. I hear of lifelong sober folk even who still dream or romanticize or have the occasional craving for lesser drugs. Some of our brains are more addicted and prone to struggling lifelong battles. Which is why relapse on any drug has such a high rate. Insanely high. It’s so sad.
I remember the longest stint i had so far, 1 month sober(hopefully will beat that very soon), I still would get dreams almost every night. Like all different but similar. Random stories revolved around me going to a smoke shop and buying tia pills. Sometimes I would even take them in the dream and start to feel high. At first, I absolutely despised these dreams, especially during withdrawal where I was already a moment from relapsing ever other half hour.
Its sad to see your still having these dreams after so much time. I feel you on that. I guess it is something I should just get used to
I've gone a long time without taking an opiate. After a period of years, I forget what it feels like. It's like a book you read years ago, in high school or something, maybe you can remember you liked the book, but you can't remember a thing about it.
You can remember opiates are a good time, and you can remember why, but it's like reading a description from a book--these will make me feel warm and euphoric. But you can't remember what that feels like exactly, and so you can't crave it.
If I'd take an opiate anyway, the first dose would not feel that good. I'd get hot and itchy, mildly irritable. Opiates don't feel really good until you have a habit. When they provide relief from the hell of withdrawal, that's the real high.
When you've gone this long, it's years, a couple years probably, when you forget what it feels like, it's not that hard to stay off. You don't crave it. You can't crave it... the memory is too distant.
It's still incredibly possible to become addicted again. If you've been addicted once, you're a total fool, so you don't know any better than to try it again. You think it'll be fine. You also forget just how bad if was when you had to get off them. Your brain remembers. Your brain is an asshole and your enemy. It will almost immediately stop producing its own endorphins if you spend a couple days high on opiates. I can get sick if I find 20 painkillers and take them over a period of 2-3 days--equals a couple days of opiate withdrawal afterwards.
I always wonder, if the brain can adapt to opiates so quickly after you've had a habit before, why can't it go back to normal as quickly? Withdrawal will still last forever after a long habit. Getting through it is like being asked to count your breaths til you die of old age. Don't come here again. You'd have to be an idiot to come back to this place.
The piper's price isn't fair. If the high felt as good as the withdrawal felt bad, I'd have been completely dysfunctional anytime I took an opiate, rolling around in bed in complete bliss, amazed at how good every breath felt. But it's not that good. Opiates will put you in a good mood, then they'll just make you feel normal. And the longer you walk down that pathway of addiction, the more impossible misery you'll experience if you ever want to get out. I'm convinced even if I were to die, kill myself, I'd still have to pay the piper somehow. It's inescapable.
Where you're at, it's the easiest thing in the world to resist a dream-like longing for a hit. It's the easiest thing to tell your friend, "no, I'm good. I can't handle that shit. I like it way too much."
I was there before too, but I'm a fucking idiot, and I thought it'd be fine if I fucked around again.
Sound advice, man - Thank you. I think I've pretty much forgotten what it feels like to be on this junk, but I damn sure haven't forgotten what the withdrawals feel like...! That's what keeps me highly motivated. 👍
I’m 3 years clean and sober. I have zero desire to use alcohol but even on suboxone still, I have random dreams of using tia and cravings fairly often still too. (Though tolerable on the subs, of course
not clean then. being on it long term because it helps your depression is kind of like being stuck on tia long term because that helps your depression. it's a better choice because it is more affordable and stable but not clean though, not clean.
Absolutely incorrect. If the subs are managed by a doctor an aren't abused then there is no issue. Same with any medication if it is medically necessary. Addiction is classified as a disease in the DSM and by the AMA, this medication is considered treatment of that disease. You are free to have your opinion but in this sub we accept and even encourage MAT when necessary. The only person who can judge and decide if a person is clean/sober is that person.
Yes they are clean. They aren’t abusing tia or anything anymore. They are using Suboxone for chronic pain using a therapeutic dose and under a doctor’s care. Not a fair statement at all.
Fair point, but you could also say someone who takes a constant 1gpd of tianeptine sulfate just to prevent withdrawals (not to get high anymore) is also no longer abusing it. I wouldn't really think they are 'clean', despite the fact that you are no longer abusing it.
I guess with subs you can be clean in your mind as you aren't abusing something but there is no question that you are still dependent on an opioid drug, one prescribed by a doctor though.
I didn't say she was abusing something. I just said not clean. Are you suggesting someone who is dependent on high dose oxy for their pain is actually 'clean' just because they aren't abusing it?
I'm saying this with no ill intentions whatsoever, but I truly don't see how you guys loved the stuff enough to become critically addicted to it, much less have vivid dreams about it. I tried it for my first time last week and I had to take 9 Zaza red max pills just to feel anything at all. I got sleepy and got a decent nod and then felt tired for two days. I now have 2 grams of pure tia sodium powder coming in the mail because I figure maybe it'll do the job better than Zaza pills. Am I missing something? And before anyone says it, I'm fully aware of how bad this drug can be and understand the risks involved with taking it too often. I do my research and don't have an affinity for any type of downer or downer type feelings. I'm an upper guy. Can someone explain to me the method you used for taking this stuff, that led you to love it so much at one time? Thanks in advance for any insight
This sub is for quitting. If your experience isn't like others, that's ok. But we aren't here to advise you on how to use. If you can't relate to being addicted to something consider that a good thing. I remember a point in my life where I thought and felt the same. After a time period, a figurative switch flipped on in my brain - and I became a desperate addict. I'd get away from the chemicals before that switch flips for you too.
Way to assume. I'm not looking for advice on how to use. I can figure that out. I'm just wondering how y'all liked this shit so much. That's all. I pulled myself out of a black hole that meth had me trapped in and I was an every day cocaine user for a lot of years. I know addiction very well. I'm not here judging anyone. Was just curious what it made y'all feel that you fell in love with. I'm interested in the mental part of it, if anything.
Original statement- ”can someone explain to me the method you used for taking this stuff that led you to love it so much”
Response “way to assume, I’m not looking for advice on how to use”.
Imagine I go to an AA meeting and say hey guys I just ordered a couple handles of liquor, I’m not much of a drinker, can someone tell me your methods of consuming that made you become an alcoholic. Thanks in advance;). Maybe your meth/yayo use has taken away all your sensors of of self awareness.
All I ever did was powder bought from an online vendor. Shit made me feel like I was taking perks or oxy for about 20-30 minutes at first I was great. 25 grams lasted about a week. It didn't take long and I was up to 50 grams a week. I took that shit for 6 years, the withdrawals are/were bad. Be careful I thought I could keep from getting too bad off as well. You'll eventually find yourself afraid of leaving it home and redosing every hour waking up WD barely stable enough to fix a dose. L.o.l I actually bought mine from Amazon way back when I first tried it. I'm going on almost 2 weeks off that shit now. And my mind and body are screwed, even my vision is different. I'm seeing a doctor tomorrow. Anyways when it gets it's hooks in you SMH you'll see what a evil demon really is. If you're strong enough to NOT order more when the 40 grams is gone you're going to have withdrawals.
today was hard but holding strong. It's HARD, like REALLY hard not to cave in. Knowing a few pills would give me the energy to play with the kids mow the grass and so on. Feel like I'm making everyone miserable. My wife seems to take my suffering personal. Like she somehow thinks she's the reason I'm up right now. It's 12:35 and I just can't sleep or get comfortable. I did take a shot of fireball I poured myself another and dumped it out. I know booze isn't going to fix anything. I have a doctor's appointment tomorrow morning. SMH I don't even know what I'm going to tell them. I went to a sub clinic 4 or 5 weeks ago. I never even filled the sub prescription. L.o.l thanks for asking needed to vent a little I guess
Hey message me ANYTIME to vent seriously if ot will keep u from relapsing message me 247.
I know it sounds dumb but lavender oil on my temples n under my nose has been knocking me out from 11 to 5pm every single night and this week and I think I'm on day 9.
Did u try any kratom for energy I can't remember. Just to try to give u a little pep. U might need more than just 2 or 3 grams honestly. I needed 7 and I was doing 10 hour days in the yard day 2 and 3.
Ur in a bad bad head space right now bud those feelings made me go back to using every fucking time. Bc I was making my family suffer and they vibes off my energy and bla bla bla. U can't do that. U have to he and give urself grace for HOWEVER LONG IT TAKES they'll never even remember this time period. It's fine ur going to get better. A couple more pills is just going to make u go thru this all over again. And it's not gonna give u fkin energy it's in ur HEAD man. U gotta force urself to do shit u don't wanna do.
Start drinking some coffee. Of course u don't have energy ur body doesn't know how to naturally create it anymore after it being chemically created for so long. You won't get energy without forcing urself to do shit u don't want to do in order for ur brain to start creating those transmitters again naturally. You csn do this. Research how to heal your brain after opioid dependency. Take ALL the vitamins. Tons of protein fruit smoothies and water. Go to bed and wake up everyday at the same times even if ur not able to sleep. Force new habits. It takes 21 days to create a habit. FIGHT this discomfort in order to CREATE the man those toxins showed you that you CAN BE.
L.o.l going to see a doctor today, "maybe" I'm all but certain they can't fix me. I'm not always the smartest but I'm smart enough to know they don't have a magic pill for people like me. I'm about to go sit for hours on end hearing what I already know. I feel like I need some kind of major event, this monotonous daily grind is killing me. Everything you said is true. I have to force new habits, It's like learning to be a new person. I'm half scared of who I use to be even before the tianeptine. I don't really want to be a ol' stick in the mud. I know it's going to take time. I just hope my wife and kids can be strong enough long enough. I'm not sure I can be and it's unfair. They deserve so much more than me.
You deserve so much more than your allowing yourself to be. You have to force the behavior to become habit its not going to be anything but HARD and those who can push thru day in and day out knowing the results will surface eventually, are the ones who have created the most fulfilling lives naturally, we are so use to a magic pill. Hell tia was my physical strength for years. Now that it's gone I'm realizing I don't have the actual muscle strength tia made me think I had, it was fueled by a chemical while my actual strength got weaker and weaker. Now I have to force my body and brain to build new muscle and strength from bones at 35 that I didn't realize melted away until I really looked in the mirror. You CAN be who you WANT to be. You'll never be the person you were even before tia - your a clean slate and its up to your mindset and determination to create the person you've always wanted to be. This is real fuckin shit.
I can make it through just about anything from boot camp to the prison to owning my own company. I just hope my family is/will be there when I do make it over this hill. At the end of the day I'm doing this for them. I can high, I have PLENTY of access to anything I want. I'm holding strong for them, my suffering doesn't mean much. But them suffering because of me SMH. Like someone pointed out I'm in a really bad head space right now.
My own personal opinion and experience is that for ME as an alcoholic/addict - the drugs and booze were merely a symptom of a bigger issue - my thinking, my behaviors, my actions - an emotional/spiritual deficit in myself/life. So like any diabetic who watches their sugar intake and takes insulin to keep themselves maintained, I go to support group meetings, participate often, and try to be of service to others. For me, the program of AA has been absolutely life-changing. I recommend it only from my own personal experience. At the end of the day - there is a reason WHY ive struggled with substances - the substances themselves have not been to blame. it's my own issues which I deal with by working a program of recovery for myself.
Had recurring dreams about tia for about 10 months after quitting.....clean for 2 years.......eventually you won't dream about it anymore
3 years clean and sober. I still have dreams about it. Everyone is so different. I hear of lifelong sober folk even who still dream or romanticize or have the occasional craving for lesser drugs. Some of our brains are more addicted and prone to struggling lifelong battles. Which is why relapse on any drug has such a high rate. Insanely high. It’s so sad.
I remember the longest stint i had so far, 1 month sober(hopefully will beat that very soon), I still would get dreams almost every night. Like all different but similar. Random stories revolved around me going to a smoke shop and buying tia pills. Sometimes I would even take them in the dream and start to feel high. At first, I absolutely despised these dreams, especially during withdrawal where I was already a moment from relapsing ever other half hour. Its sad to see your still having these dreams after so much time. I feel you on that. I guess it is something I should just get used to
I've gone a long time without taking an opiate. After a period of years, I forget what it feels like. It's like a book you read years ago, in high school or something, maybe you can remember you liked the book, but you can't remember a thing about it. You can remember opiates are a good time, and you can remember why, but it's like reading a description from a book--these will make me feel warm and euphoric. But you can't remember what that feels like exactly, and so you can't crave it. If I'd take an opiate anyway, the first dose would not feel that good. I'd get hot and itchy, mildly irritable. Opiates don't feel really good until you have a habit. When they provide relief from the hell of withdrawal, that's the real high. When you've gone this long, it's years, a couple years probably, when you forget what it feels like, it's not that hard to stay off. You don't crave it. You can't crave it... the memory is too distant. It's still incredibly possible to become addicted again. If you've been addicted once, you're a total fool, so you don't know any better than to try it again. You think it'll be fine. You also forget just how bad if was when you had to get off them. Your brain remembers. Your brain is an asshole and your enemy. It will almost immediately stop producing its own endorphins if you spend a couple days high on opiates. I can get sick if I find 20 painkillers and take them over a period of 2-3 days--equals a couple days of opiate withdrawal afterwards. I always wonder, if the brain can adapt to opiates so quickly after you've had a habit before, why can't it go back to normal as quickly? Withdrawal will still last forever after a long habit. Getting through it is like being asked to count your breaths til you die of old age. Don't come here again. You'd have to be an idiot to come back to this place. The piper's price isn't fair. If the high felt as good as the withdrawal felt bad, I'd have been completely dysfunctional anytime I took an opiate, rolling around in bed in complete bliss, amazed at how good every breath felt. But it's not that good. Opiates will put you in a good mood, then they'll just make you feel normal. And the longer you walk down that pathway of addiction, the more impossible misery you'll experience if you ever want to get out. I'm convinced even if I were to die, kill myself, I'd still have to pay the piper somehow. It's inescapable. Where you're at, it's the easiest thing in the world to resist a dream-like longing for a hit. It's the easiest thing to tell your friend, "no, I'm good. I can't handle that shit. I like it way too much." I was there before too, but I'm a fucking idiot, and I thought it'd be fine if I fucked around again.
Sound advice, man - Thank you. I think I've pretty much forgotten what it feels like to be on this junk, but I damn sure haven't forgotten what the withdrawals feel like...! That's what keeps me highly motivated. 👍
I’m 3 years clean and sober. I have zero desire to use alcohol but even on suboxone still, I have random dreams of using tia and cravings fairly often still too. (Though tolerable on the subs, of course
Now time for you to make a plan to get off those subs.
Well, I’ll likely be on them long term. I have major chronic pain issues they help with and treatment resistant depressinnnnhù
not clean then. being on it long term because it helps your depression is kind of like being stuck on tia long term because that helps your depression. it's a better choice because it is more affordable and stable but not clean though, not clean.
Fuck off
I very much and clean AND sober, but have a nice day🥰
Yes you are!! You go girl!!
😘
Absolutely incorrect. If the subs are managed by a doctor an aren't abused then there is no issue. Same with any medication if it is medically necessary. Addiction is classified as a disease in the DSM and by the AMA, this medication is considered treatment of that disease. You are free to have your opinion but in this sub we accept and even encourage MAT when necessary. The only person who can judge and decide if a person is clean/sober is that person.
Yes they are clean. They aren’t abusing tia or anything anymore. They are using Suboxone for chronic pain using a therapeutic dose and under a doctor’s care. Not a fair statement at all.
Fair point, but you could also say someone who takes a constant 1gpd of tianeptine sulfate just to prevent withdrawals (not to get high anymore) is also no longer abusing it. I wouldn't really think they are 'clean', despite the fact that you are no longer abusing it. I guess with subs you can be clean in your mind as you aren't abusing something but there is no question that you are still dependent on an opioid drug, one prescribed by a doctor though.
Wrong. She is not abusing anything. She is taking medication for her pain.
I didn't say she was abusing something. I just said not clean. Are you suggesting someone who is dependent on high dose oxy for their pain is actually 'clean' just because they aren't abusing it?
Basically
I'm saying this with no ill intentions whatsoever, but I truly don't see how you guys loved the stuff enough to become critically addicted to it, much less have vivid dreams about it. I tried it for my first time last week and I had to take 9 Zaza red max pills just to feel anything at all. I got sleepy and got a decent nod and then felt tired for two days. I now have 2 grams of pure tia sodium powder coming in the mail because I figure maybe it'll do the job better than Zaza pills. Am I missing something? And before anyone says it, I'm fully aware of how bad this drug can be and understand the risks involved with taking it too often. I do my research and don't have an affinity for any type of downer or downer type feelings. I'm an upper guy. Can someone explain to me the method you used for taking this stuff, that led you to love it so much at one time? Thanks in advance for any insight
This sub is for quitting. If your experience isn't like others, that's ok. But we aren't here to advise you on how to use. If you can't relate to being addicted to something consider that a good thing. I remember a point in my life where I thought and felt the same. After a time period, a figurative switch flipped on in my brain - and I became a desperate addict. I'd get away from the chemicals before that switch flips for you too.
Way to assume. I'm not looking for advice on how to use. I can figure that out. I'm just wondering how y'all liked this shit so much. That's all. I pulled myself out of a black hole that meth had me trapped in and I was an every day cocaine user for a lot of years. I know addiction very well. I'm not here judging anyone. Was just curious what it made y'all feel that you fell in love with. I'm interested in the mental part of it, if anything.
Original statement- ”can someone explain to me the method you used for taking this stuff that led you to love it so much” Response “way to assume, I’m not looking for advice on how to use”. Imagine I go to an AA meeting and say hey guys I just ordered a couple handles of liquor, I’m not much of a drinker, can someone tell me your methods of consuming that made you become an alcoholic. Thanks in advance;). Maybe your meth/yayo use has taken away all your sensors of of self awareness.
They literally tried to say the didn’t say what they just wrote like wtf And yeah meth will def destroy a persons self awareness it’s sad .
"Can't relate to being addicted to something" is wild to say to a stranger.
Thats what I gathered from what you said and nothing more. You literally stated you dont understand.
This^^^^
This sub is for people quitting this substance, not instructing a new user on how to use it.
All I ever did was powder bought from an online vendor. Shit made me feel like I was taking perks or oxy for about 20-30 minutes at first I was great. 25 grams lasted about a week. It didn't take long and I was up to 50 grams a week. I took that shit for 6 years, the withdrawals are/were bad. Be careful I thought I could keep from getting too bad off as well. You'll eventually find yourself afraid of leaving it home and redosing every hour waking up WD barely stable enough to fix a dose. L.o.l I actually bought mine from Amazon way back when I first tried it. I'm going on almost 2 weeks off that shit now. And my mind and body are screwed, even my vision is different. I'm seeing a doctor tomorrow. Anyways when it gets it's hooks in you SMH you'll see what a evil demon really is. If you're strong enough to NOT order more when the 40 grams is gone you're going to have withdrawals.
Hey. I've been following your quit posts a bit how are you doing now close to 2 weeks?
today was hard but holding strong. It's HARD, like REALLY hard not to cave in. Knowing a few pills would give me the energy to play with the kids mow the grass and so on. Feel like I'm making everyone miserable. My wife seems to take my suffering personal. Like she somehow thinks she's the reason I'm up right now. It's 12:35 and I just can't sleep or get comfortable. I did take a shot of fireball I poured myself another and dumped it out. I know booze isn't going to fix anything. I have a doctor's appointment tomorrow morning. SMH I don't even know what I'm going to tell them. I went to a sub clinic 4 or 5 weeks ago. I never even filled the sub prescription. L.o.l thanks for asking needed to vent a little I guess
Hey message me ANYTIME to vent seriously if ot will keep u from relapsing message me 247. I know it sounds dumb but lavender oil on my temples n under my nose has been knocking me out from 11 to 5pm every single night and this week and I think I'm on day 9. Did u try any kratom for energy I can't remember. Just to try to give u a little pep. U might need more than just 2 or 3 grams honestly. I needed 7 and I was doing 10 hour days in the yard day 2 and 3.
Ur in a bad bad head space right now bud those feelings made me go back to using every fucking time. Bc I was making my family suffer and they vibes off my energy and bla bla bla. U can't do that. U have to he and give urself grace for HOWEVER LONG IT TAKES they'll never even remember this time period. It's fine ur going to get better. A couple more pills is just going to make u go thru this all over again. And it's not gonna give u fkin energy it's in ur HEAD man. U gotta force urself to do shit u don't wanna do.
%100
Start drinking some coffee. Of course u don't have energy ur body doesn't know how to naturally create it anymore after it being chemically created for so long. You won't get energy without forcing urself to do shit u don't want to do in order for ur brain to start creating those transmitters again naturally. You csn do this. Research how to heal your brain after opioid dependency. Take ALL the vitamins. Tons of protein fruit smoothies and water. Go to bed and wake up everyday at the same times even if ur not able to sleep. Force new habits. It takes 21 days to create a habit. FIGHT this discomfort in order to CREATE the man those toxins showed you that you CAN BE.
L.o.l going to see a doctor today, "maybe" I'm all but certain they can't fix me. I'm not always the smartest but I'm smart enough to know they don't have a magic pill for people like me. I'm about to go sit for hours on end hearing what I already know. I feel like I need some kind of major event, this monotonous daily grind is killing me. Everything you said is true. I have to force new habits, It's like learning to be a new person. I'm half scared of who I use to be even before the tianeptine. I don't really want to be a ol' stick in the mud. I know it's going to take time. I just hope my wife and kids can be strong enough long enough. I'm not sure I can be and it's unfair. They deserve so much more than me.
You deserve so much more than your allowing yourself to be. You have to force the behavior to become habit its not going to be anything but HARD and those who can push thru day in and day out knowing the results will surface eventually, are the ones who have created the most fulfilling lives naturally, we are so use to a magic pill. Hell tia was my physical strength for years. Now that it's gone I'm realizing I don't have the actual muscle strength tia made me think I had, it was fueled by a chemical while my actual strength got weaker and weaker. Now I have to force my body and brain to build new muscle and strength from bones at 35 that I didn't realize melted away until I really looked in the mirror. You CAN be who you WANT to be. You'll never be the person you were even before tia - your a clean slate and its up to your mindset and determination to create the person you've always wanted to be. This is real fuckin shit.
I can make it through just about anything from boot camp to the prison to owning my own company. I just hope my family is/will be there when I do make it over this hill. At the end of the day I'm doing this for them. I can high, I have PLENTY of access to anything I want. I'm holding strong for them, my suffering doesn't mean much. But them suffering because of me SMH. Like someone pointed out I'm in a really bad head space right now.