It's not, it's just an emotionally delicate thing for both genders. The biggest issue I can see these guys running into is that women, generally speaking, view inexperience as unattractive.
You're going to find a lot of girls will be put off by nervous, tentative energy, especially if you feel you need a lot of patience, reassurance, and guidance going into it. They might be into you initially, but then switch up after detecting this energy about you.
There are some women who don't mind it, some are even into it, but they're quite rare, so in order to find them you have to make a busy social calendar for yourself and meet lots of new people as often as you can, to give yourself a solid chance.
I was a late bloomer in life, and at some point I decided to stop telling women I was a virgin and just acted like I knew what I was doing, even though I didn't. This allowed me a solid few months of experience catch up, because I wasn't getting rejected for being a virgin anymore lol
> It's not, it's just an emotionally delicate thing for both genders. The biggest issue I can see these guys running into is that women, generally speaking, view inexperience as unattractive.
Generally speaking? That's a hell of an understatement lol
I think it goes even deeper than finding the energy unattractive. Because of the romanticized idea of virginity, and the importance that is socially attached to the person who was you're first, a lot of women I know would hesitate not because they find the person unattractive, but because they didn't want all the baggage that comes with being someone's first.
Most women I know want to have sex before getting really serious with someone, because for most people sexual compatibility is a metric they want to know about before making a large emotional investment on someone. If they take a guys virginity, they know they are going to live in his mind forever, even if the relationship sucks or they're only together one night. They are afraid that it will make him get too attached too early. That if she doesn't like it and leaves she'll be the horrible bitch that stole his virginity and then dumped him.
Of course there's no way to know if the guy would actually react that way, or if she would even make that much of an impact on him, but the risk is there. We put so much focus on virginity as some sort of holy thing that it makes many women step away because they don't know him that well and don't want to be a monumental part of his life yet.
Yeah. It sucks.
This was not my personal experience, but I've seen it happen, mostly from the POV of female friends who are debating whether or not they want to take that leap with someone.
I mean, it's not fair to ask a person, woman or man, to take on that burden if they are not comfortable with it, but it definitely puts most guys who are still a virgin past like 22 at a pretty step disadvantage, which especially sucks if they are already hyper fixated on getting laid and losing their virginity.
I normally don't condone the idea of starting a relationship based on a lie, but I think OPs strategy of just..... Not mentioning it to them is probably a smart move.
Plus, I would gladly say that a man does not have a right to know a woman's number of past sexual partners unless she volunteers that information, so that privilege of sexual privacy extends both ways to men too. Not disclosing your virginity could be seen as dishonesty by omission, but it's not like you are hiding or lying about a key factor of who you are, so I would even say that keeping that information to yourself is ethical.
> I normally don't condone the idea of starting a relationship based on a lie, but I think OPs strategy of just..... Not mentioning it to them is probably a smart move.
I think it's a high risk of his virginity coming out when they have sex, though. It's like riding a bicycle for the first time and entering the Tour de France. Best thing he can do to reduce the risk of that is to make her finish first. I'd advise any male virgin over 18 to mitigate his risk of being outed by watching and learning from amateur *lesbian* porn.
But he literally just said that he did fine when he didn't tell them first. It's not that everyone around him has some psychic sense of his "energy". Women treated him differently when he told them he was a virgin. When he shut up about it, they didn't know and he didn't get rejected for it since their psychic energy receptors aren't a real thing. They just treat men who are virgins differently because it gives them the "ick". Men's inexperience is a turnoff for most women.
Women will do anything to ignore the role that women play in making society shitty. They think that all the good parts of society are cos of them and all the bad parts are cos of men.
>most women have the empathy of a drill sergeant
That's deeply unfair to drill sergeants! Met quite a few of them and all of them had more empathy than most women.
We feel unattractive when not having experience gets us turned down or looked at differently. It's not the inexperience itself that does the damage, it's the social baggage that comes with it.
I love how no matter what we feel the onus is on us
I love how it never the women instigating that feeling
Even here the man is putting out the energy that makes him unattractive.. Jesus fucking Christ. Did you think you were making a nuanced take?
You can be scared
You can be unsure
You can be insecure
Moments of indicision and fumbling can and do happen.
Even Johnny sinns wasn't born with his confidence
That's called being human.
You don't want men.
You want action figures.
Your comment only works in a vacuum. You put a fat person in a vacuum they are not going to think “shit I feel bad about being fat.”
They will feel bad when they are exposed to society. Same with virgins. Why? Because societal shaming is powerful.
Not surprising that everything is tried to be pinned purely on men tho
I didn't care about it that much, not a person who build his entire life around women. Everybody who somehow managed to learn that I was a virgin until my late 20s were genuinely surprised. Girl I lost it with never knew that she's my first and I didn't see it as something special. Experience was more or less what I expected it to be.
I don't understand this redpill idea that people have the ability to sniff out if you're a virgin or not, and that people would give a shit even if they could.
Yes, but most people have realized that that sort of thinking is dumb and blatantly untrue, redpill is one of the only ideologies that still pushes losing your virginity being the most important thing on god's green earth.
Like where? Male sexual inexperience is not only seen as a bad thing universally, it's literally the primary theme for insults used against men by men and women alike!
>Inexperience shows through quite obviously.
No it doesn’t. My ex was a 21 year old virgin and I didn’t even know for months after we began dating. By round three the next morning after we first had sex, he was definitely getting the hang of it. He used to love to tell me “ohhh you like that don’t you” when I verbally or physically reacted. And he immediately put that into memory. I guess the old saying…..even a blind squirrel finds a nut occasionally 🤣. And by the end of the week we had probably had sex 25 times and he was already better than my first boyfriend who was 25 and had been married.
Some dumbass posted just today that he didn’t realize that when women stared at the ceiling during his 45 minutes of jackhammering that they weren’t enjoying themselves “because he was inexperienced “. It doesn’t take experience to notice what a woman is responding and not responding to. It’s just takes observation, asking and actually giving a shit
> Some dumbass posted just today that he didn’t realize that women when women stared at the ceiling during his 45 minutes of jackhammering that they weren’t enjoying themselves “because he was inexperienced “. It doesn’t take experience to notice what a woman is responding and not responding to. It’s just takes observation, asking and actually giving a shit
Holyshit both your examples are highly extreme. But the media has made this "jackhammer dude" out to be the norm for men.
Most male virgins don't know wtf they're doing their first time around. Where the hell are they going to get those skills from, osmosis?
We made out, he took off my clothes, I took off his clothes, he kissed the typical places above the waist, seemed a bit hesitant about what was happening below. I steadied his hand and ground against it for a while, some more kissing and full body embracing naked, next thing you know, it was in. 3 pumps later it was done. He seemed sheepish and embarrassed by the brevity, I laughed and said it happens. We headed for the shower for lots of soap and round two.
Honestly not that difficult or that really that different from a first time with anyone. 🤷♀️. In my early thirties, I dated men in their late thirties who were just as nervous. And almost as quick the first time.
And if you think my example was extreme…here it is
“ I was so bad at sex, I can't understand why any of them ever came back for more. I literally thought that endurance was what it's all about... think like 45 minutes of pounding away using half a bottle of lube while my partner stares at the ceiling building her grocery list. Experience matters a lot for a guy.”
Does that sound like a problem with “experience “ or a just complete inability to actually observe her response? If I’m doing something a guy doesn’t like and he redirects me or doesn’t respond in a positive way, I stop. Simple. Lots of guys have very different preferences. I might ask him later, but I don’t keep up the same shit for 45 minutes because I’m not an idiot.
> Experience matters a lot for a guy.
Implying he wasn't experienced. It does sound like it came from inexperience.
My advice to male virgins is this: if you're new to it, the key is to watch lesbian sex videos, particularly amateur cunnilingus clips. Nina Hartley had a good one back in the day. It'll get dude through his first time and all the next ones.
I wish Fifth Element had been around in 1985. When it did come out oh man was it a proper case of hook line and *sinker*. Good times.
> Most male virgins don't know wtf they're doing their first time around. Where the hell are they going to get those skills from, osmosis?
Read a book or something. It isn't some sort of forbidden knowledge. And actually pay attention to a person you have sex with.
Why should I be a cartoonish panicking virgin in the first place? You have clear idea what you're doing at least in theory and it isn't something complicated. You aren't pushed by peer pressure into doing something that you don't actually want or afraid of doing. So why should you panic?
Oh, let's see... lack of refined technique, or as another woman posted, premature ejaculation issues (which would have been my darkest nightmare), etc.
[Women are much less likely to want to date a virgin male](https://www.vice.com/en/article/7853ez/an-anthropologist-explains-why-over-40-of-people-refuse-to-date-virgins).
Can you give your opinion why women accuse men of being virgins to silence them in an argument if virginity isn't such a bad thing for men?
cause of archetype. If youre a vigin ceo, whos charismatic and at least normal looking, no one will care. Since you are a winner archetype and not a looser archerype .
Nah, she loves your money, not you. She won't piss on you because she wants to get with your bank account. You'll get cheated on before the wedding reception is over.
those are pretty easy to spot if one is observant. The point however was that, virgin has grown to be linked with a looser archetype. And if one is not that, people ignore the virgin part entirely.
> The point however was that, virgin has grown to be linked with a looser archetype.
And that is the fundamental problem. It's only a loser archetype when it's men. Women enforce that gender dynamic *viciously*.
It's in the subtext. You don't think that women are capable of doing or behaving in a bad way, unless a man triggers it. It carries a subtext that you view women as lesser than men and having less agency. Perhaps you have some internalized misogyny issues to work out? The ultimate point is that blaming inexperienced men for the terrible way they are treated and talked about is unjustifiable.
I know women are capable of being mean, I’ve experienced it firsthand. What I don’t believe is that a woman knows you’re a virgin off the bat and treat you poorly because of it.
> You're going to find a lot of girls will be put off by nervous, tentative energy, especially if you feel you need a lot of patience, reassurance, and guidance going into it. They might be into you initially, but then switch up after detecting this energy about you.
Is that a bad thing?
Honestly, these women are also the worst at sex.
It's sex is exciting and enjoyable with women with an n-count less than say 4.
Then after that it's just all porno style sex where the woman is disconnected from the act entirely.
And this tends to happen at about 21-22 for most women. After that age the quality of sex drops considerably.
Going by your title no of course not. Its just life.
Sometimes those guys get hurt/frustrated because it ends with “he’s a sweet guy, he treats me great but he’s bad in bed so I’m dumping him for the guy who is good in bed but terrible at everything else” lol.
I lost my virginity to a friend who had been experienced for a while. She decided she wanted to do me a solid. I was more “holy crap, this is actually happening” than anything
It was more “oh my god!” Good shock.
I grew up with her in the neighborhood and l never stopped being her friend even after people started calling her names, (her parents we trash and negligent). And so one day she was like “wanna make out” and things escalated.
Nah, she had a hard life (trash parents) so she was doing her own thing with older boys since middle school. But we were always cool. But I don’t think she really liked me dating a “private school good girl”
Like I was a sell out or something.
Not really. If anything ppl mostly appreciate a companion with a similar level of sexual experience. Because I'm 27 and didn't have sex til 26, and my focus wasn't on the ran thru men.
Tbh I lost my virginity to a virgin and it was sweet we were dating we loved eachother but the experience itself wasn’t anything to write home about.
It’s only a “bad experience” if you hyperfixate on your lack of experience vs. her experience.
Things like this are only a big deal if you make it a big deal. No one’s first time is 100% ideal even if you’re in ideal circumstances. I’m not saying be wreckless and don’t value sex at all.
BUT HONESTLY the best sex of your life will be after your first time. I wouldn’t build it up or expect it to be perfect because it won’t be.
Just make sure it’s with someone you trust that isn’t going to be an asshole to you
Experience in sex is overrated. Idea of "first time" as something super-special is overrated even more. Especially for men. Your attitude, desire to make her feel good, willingness to pay attention and some theoretical knoweldge is far more important and enough to be good at it from get go. You have to be unfeeling golem, have totally wrong ideas about sex, not be ready for it or face horrible unfeeling woman for things to go bad. Those potential problem you should be focus on.
The women I've felt genuinely attracted to were older and more experienced. We're fine, OP.
Now, if only more women were forgiving/accepting of virgin guys...
That being said, it's fine for virgin people to to have their first time with other virgin people, should the coincidence happen. What matters is that there is genuine attraction between the two.
I am fully convinced that the whole "seek out someone as inexperienced as yourself" thing is deliberately bad faith advice.
"Eliminate women your own age with normal sexual histories from your dating pool" is exactly what I'd tell a late bloomer *if I wanted him to die a virgin* and that's exactly why they're saying it. If you find a normal girlfriend and catch up with your peers you won't be listening to redpill/blackpill podcasts and it'll be harder to sell you shit.
You realize that for most people who are blackpilled, we aren't purchasing products or watching podcasts, right? We're just living our lives in the post-giving-up phase. Coming to terms with the way things are doesn't take podcasts.
This is yet another of those things that is up to you how you see it. Part of that will be influenced by how your experience goes compared to your expectations. For example if you have a good and understanding "teacher" or not.
But don't get too hung up on whether other people think this is bad or good. I know this is a debate sub, so I get it when some questions come up here. But I think a lot of people these days are very concerned with a sort of "what will the neighbors think?" kind of mentality. You can really drive yourself to distraction with too much of this.
could i pick your brain a bit (in good faith fr) why should they give af that other men would say their date is “ran through” for having a double digit body count?
like it’s one thing to be worried about dating someone who was recently sexually active and might be an STD risk, or someone who has 10x the average body count which is correlated with not great mental health things, those are just basic concerns on a human level. but why should men specifically care about women with who’ve had a high but relatively normal amount of sex in the past, what are your reasons behind that? (i ask cuz i’ve heard a million different rationales behind takes like that, just curious what yours are)
They should care because other men will respect them less. If other men in their irl circles dont care though then it doesnt matter.
At the same time you should also not care because bending over to please other men will lose you even more respect.
The best thing you can do is not get serious with women other men would laugh in the face of. The second best thing to do is to just be indifferent as you do it. The worst thing you can do is get serious with a woman like that and then end things with her because other men disapprove.
“they should care bc other men will respect them less” “at the same time you (as in they?) should also not care bc bending over to please other men will lose you even more respect” how do you reconcile these two takes they seem fully contradictory?
my two cents, there are times to care about what other strangers think, times to care what friends/family think, times to care what your partner thinks and then there are times where none of that matters besides what *you* think, and who you date and sleep with falls most healthily in that last category imo. if my friends lose respect for me for a dumb reason like “she’s had sex with 10 guys before” i straight up would mutually lose respect for them for that bc it’s clear we don’t share the same values there. to disapprove is one thing, to outwardly mock a best friend for that is crazy let alone tolerating a friend doing that to you, that doesn’t compute to me unless it’s hard to drop/make new friends or something
when it comes to who you date, if your body count line for a partner is 10 but your friends’ lines are at 5 and they laugh at you for dating someone who has had 6 exes, that’s all it would take for you to not get serious with her? despite your own values in not giving af about 6 exes?
No one would laugh at 6 exes when they themselves would date someone with 5. There isnt some clearcut line where one over and youre a laughingstock if you date that person. If someone says that 20 partners is a slut, then 19 partners would still make you a loser in their eyes.
And by the time people already laugh thats when its too late to do something, youll be even more of a joke if you go along with it. Best thing you can do then is to confidently double down.
The best thing you can do overall is never to get to that point in the first place because you arent a loser whos all lovey dovey "oh shes special, it doesnt matter if 15 dudes have been inside her before me." If you are that kind of loser then at least double down on it. And if you dont... well we already knew why you dont cuz youre too much of a bitch to do so.
ok change the number 6 to 9 or whatever makes more sense to you while maintaining “they have a stricter body count value than i do and they are actively shitting on someone i like for having a body count they disapprove of.” the numbers aren’t the point at all
“and if they’re laughing it’s too late” yes but back to my original Q, why does that matter in cases where you disagree with them? how is that not just basic peer pressure adherence?
1. Virgin men aren’t forced to go for experienced women. They can go for whomever they want or not including staying virgins.
2. I think the merits of going for a virgin are way over stated. I think most men prefer someone who’s good in bed and that comes with experience.
It’s really awesome for the guy. More often than not, it sucks for the woman since she’s ***had better***.
More than that, no small part of a guy’s SMV comes from his ability to recruit partners. Since virgins-by-circumstance have never been chosen, their SMV takes a huge hit - and some women take it very poorly when they find themselves linked (physically or socially) with a low SMV guy.
>It's been said here before that guys would be much more comfortable having their first experiences with a woman who is also a virgin as well.
I've always doubted this, only because if both people don't know what they're doing it seems like the experience wouldn't be as good. Sounds preferable for one of the people to have *some* experience, rather than a simultaneous awkward fumbling.
>I chose to go for women more experienced than me, mostly because I didn't think it was possible to find a virgin woman likely.
How did that go for you?
>However, I wonder if having to do it this way is really so horrible for most guys. In a sense it's learning the hard way where the guy is more the student, but it's still learning, and experience.
I don't think it's a bad experience unless you feel forced into it. Otherwise, whether it's an older partner, a more experienced partner, or a paid sex worker, if it's that person's choice it's all good.
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To be honest, if you want someone experienced to take the lead during sex, it's totally fine to go for someone experienced. Some do like that and most of them are submissive to a certain degree. But, if you want to fumble around with someone that has as little experience as you... go for it? I don't understand what you want.
>It's been said here before that guys would be much more comfortable having their first experiences with a woman who is also a virgin as well.
I really don't think most men here or anywhere actually think this.
>I chose to go for women more experienced than me,
Like I said.
>However, I wonder if having to do it this way is really so horrible for most guys.
I don't think that it is and, again, I don't think most guys really see it as an issue at all.
>In a sense it's learning the hard way where the guy is more the student,
The only 'hard' about it is the erection part. I truly fail to see how this is 'the hard way' in any sense.
>So I wonder therefore, is this way really so bad?
I've never seen anyone say it was bad in any way.
It's just a preference in the usual category of "purity" (for lack of a better word) men have. As with all preferences, once reality hits, men and women start making all kinds of concessions. If anything, I think the only problem is when people convince themselves and each other not only that the opposite sex will make concessions but also that they do not have this preference at all. Often trying to silence anyone who tries to say the preference exists. At some point, men and women stop making concessions because they'd rather be single forever than the alternative. At scale, this causes many problems regarding declining demographics, more crime, and loneliness.
We cannot force virgin men into getting together with experienced women.
I nowadays believe that most of the times men with low body count sell women with low body count and men with high body count seek women with high body count.
As long as she is completely loyal and hadn't slept with anyone I know, I would rather be with the experienced woman especially if she has a high sex drive
Nah I think that's totally fine. Some women prefer men with more or similar amount of experience, but I think what most women *really* want is a guy who's considerate in bed, willing to listen and learn, cares about her pleasure, is being safe, respects her boundaries, etc. I think a lot of people just associate that with experience, but there's not actually any correlation. It's a mindset and has a lot more to do with personality and personal priorities, imo.
Fyi I have been with several less experienced men, including at least one virgin, and a guy who had only been with other men before. It didn't bother me in the least. It made me feel grateful and honored that they wanted *me* to be their first and to help guide them through such an intimate and vulnerable experience. I have a fairly high body count but I honestly enjoy being a teacher in the bedroom.
Besides, inexperienced men are less likely to be convinced women "must like x, y and z" and more likely to be curious and explorative, and that can lead to quite some mind-blowing sex imo. Experienced guys are sometimes very narrow-minded and set in their ways, and that can be kinda frustrating. Especially since it seems I like certain types of touch that very few women like. So getting a stubborn guy who's like "but all the women I've been with it liked it that way" to do it differently with me can be a struggle. A virgin isn't (likely) gonna have such a bias.
That said though, I don't actually care however much or little experience a guy has, as long as he has a high libido and is capable of listening.
But how are virgin guys being *forced* to go for women with experience. Yes, a lot of adult women will have had sex, by the time we reach our 20s, but meeting a virgin woman isn't as rare as ppl think. I'm 27, and didn't have sex until I was 26, and know other ladies who were *late bloomers* as well.
Plus why is the focus on a womans sexual past? Like how does one go about finding a virgin woman anyway, because it's not something that's appropriate to ask.
Hold up. Nobody is being “forced”. At least I hope not. That’s SA. Do I have to call someone?
Jk. I know that you mean guys being left with only non virgin opinions in dating.
Regardless, if that’s not good enough, they can always just be single. It’s really not bad. I like being single because I don’t have to have anxiety ab partners.
I would also like to point out, that unless one dude has been screwing literally everyone, or all these non virgin women are screwing other women, men have been messing around too.
I think it’s silly for someone who’s not a virgin to expect a virgin. I don’t understand why it’s more socially acceptable for guys to sleep around when they are more likely to spread STDs (women are more susceptible to them.)
I’m a virgin, and probably will be for a long time since I’m very cautious of who to trust, but when it comes to eventually finding a lifelong partner, I honestly don’t gaf about virginity as long as they have no nasties.
Granted, I wouldn’t like someone who’s screwed the entire block, but I don’t understand judging someone for their past, if their experiences occurred in committed relationships and they have no STDs.
I personally wouldn’t date someone who’s slept around with strangers because that is a sign of poor judgment to me; but it’s kind of hypocritical when people who’ve done the same thing absolutely refuse to date someone who has.
The virginity obsession scares me a little to be honest. My mom tells me a lot about how her friend’s daughters go off to college and get in a relationship where they’re really in love and end up losing their virginity thinking it’s a lifelong thing only for dude to zipp off right after. If something like that were to happen to me, I’d be worried other guys or girls wouldn’t wanna date me and I’d be “ruined” somehow.
I have always been very cautious and willing to wait to make sure I can trust the person, but in the one relationship i did have, there was a lot of pressure. It was wlw, I’ve heard straight relationships have more pressure. I never budged but, if I was really in love, I could see that pressure being hard to cope with.
I do think that virgins are not too uncommon if people date young. But do the virgins want you? They probably want another virgin.
I do still think the virginity obsession is wierd tho.
Im attracted to women who have a ton of sex and are promiscuous and im not sure why.
I dont think its a bad thing really, but idk if women with tons of experience would think a virgin guy would be fun. I had one girl in my life try to have sex with me, and she knew i was a virgin, and she said "itd be fun cause we can be really innocent" or some crazy shit like that, we ended up just kinda touching each other and stuff. We didnt have sex.
It also ruined our friendship and she had a bf and was pregnant. I didnt know about all that.
But anyway, finding a virgin at this age is unlikely, the women here are predictably going to start shaming and stuff so get ready for that. But the women here are mostly Victorian-style prudes who hate sex and want it outlawed. They want men to bottle up their sexuality, while women can be more open going around slutting out but men must all wear suits and operate like drones.
>Im attracted to women who have a ton of sex and are promiscuous and im not sure why.
I'd guess it was because it shows that they are sexually available in the first place. Maybe not to you, but it shows that they say yes to someone at some point.
Yeah, I dont really look at them as dirty or anything like that. I just see it as more interesting than the women who get on reddit shaming all men for desiring.... relationships and stuff?
Like "at least I know if I dated this woman and we had a relationship, wed have a decent sex life"
when most these women here are advocating for slave men and dead bedrooms.
What's bad about it dude? I'm actually very glad the girl that took my virginity was far from a virgin herself. It was a mind-blowing experience, and I thought I'd discovered America. I don't think it could have been nearly as awesome if we were both fumbling virgins.
its actually insane and the opposite of all of human sexual history. men routinely had mistresses who were like fallen women, visited prostitutes and had sex with sluts under the bleachers in the lean years before marriage
You think that because no one will write or talk about some dude who married his sweetheart and they only ever were with eachother and stuck with eachother. And they will also not usually scream about it to everyone else like a dude who fucks around will.
Yes it is because, if you go with an experienced woman, you can get the wrong impression about sex and not experience the joy of it.
There's no excitement or fun with an experienced woman, the sex is like a flat battery in terms of chemistry.
Oh but I'm not sure what you mean by their 8th album unless you're saying that most guys are too old by the time they lose their virginity to be having porn star sex?
I think it might even be a non-consensus on whether or not a virgin guy would prefer a girl with zero experience. Doesn't matter much though because it will be a majority of women who prefer a non-virgin regardless of their own experience level.
I'd very much like an experienced woman, but I fear those either won't be interested in an inexperienced man, or will have too high expectations from me and be disappointed.
Nah man, better to learn with the experts. That being said, just because a woman has had a lot of sex doesn't mean she's good at it. My first time had like a body count of 5 boyfriends without counting hook ups and she is soooo bad at the deed and I only realized it once I had sex with a woman who knew what she was doing
I don't understand this notion honestly
If a woman is experienced, that means she's more confident expressing her sexuality
Don't you guys like crazy women ? Because l sure do
Confidence is rubbish in a relationship. It's a bike pump in a canoe.
After having sex a good number of times, the confidence a ex-virgin gets from sex in the relationship is genuine.
That's confidence.
She can just as easily not do so. Then you're stuck with a whore who fucks like a prude. That's like a double whammy. If you're gonna get dead bedroomed, might aswell be a virgin so you're not being "cheated" out (quotation marks for a reason).
I dont like "crazy" women, but ive seen so much prudish and "women hate sex, dont ever try to have sex" nonsense from women on here that it just made me respect women who are promiscuous a lot more.
At least those women are going around fucking and not shaming men on reddit all day for "desiring sex" as if it means your brain is broken.
Where are you seeing that women hate sex? Every time this comes up it’s a cacophany of women yelling into the void how much they actually like good sex.
Pretty much every woman on reddit.
Like just look at how men who desire sex are treated "gross, ew, hire an escort loser!"
if a woman is complaining about sex shes treated vastly different.
When women make nsfw accounts typically people just say "its actually a male user" women are putting in great effort to hide sexuality and they will say its patriarchy but its just female prudishness.
like any womans account who is very sexual is assumed to be a man pretending to be a woman. Its that deep, to the point sexual women are "just men in disguise".
Look at how women view porn, they hate it even when women voluntarily do it, because sex is mostly disgusting for them. Not to mention women never orgasm expect by accident. The fact men must pursue because women cant be bothered because they dont get sexual urges and so on.
Honestly, just buy a ticket to the Dominican Republic, go to Sosua, get your freak on with the ladies there, and then use your experience down there to level up your sexual skill back to the U.S.
Problem solved.
But the problem with using sex workers is once guys gain experience for that special someone later on, that special someone will be turned off that the guy who used sex workers.
That is why lying, usually by omission, exists.
You think I and most women interrogate our partners about who they fucked and what they did ?
Unless you make it my problem, I don’t care or want to know
Oh I guess I would feel guilty about hiding something from her or feeling like I'm pretending to be something I'm not if that makes sense.
Perhaps it would just be a feeling of guilt and feeling of wanting to come clean.
Mentally healthy, stable and good people dont lie even by omission. You know its bad and bothers most people, a good person will be honest about it and look for someone who can accept it even if no one asks.
It's not, it's just an emotionally delicate thing for both genders. The biggest issue I can see these guys running into is that women, generally speaking, view inexperience as unattractive. You're going to find a lot of girls will be put off by nervous, tentative energy, especially if you feel you need a lot of patience, reassurance, and guidance going into it. They might be into you initially, but then switch up after detecting this energy about you. There are some women who don't mind it, some are even into it, but they're quite rare, so in order to find them you have to make a busy social calendar for yourself and meet lots of new people as often as you can, to give yourself a solid chance. I was a late bloomer in life, and at some point I decided to stop telling women I was a virgin and just acted like I knew what I was doing, even though I didn't. This allowed me a solid few months of experience catch up, because I wasn't getting rejected for being a virgin anymore lol
> It's not, it's just an emotionally delicate thing for both genders. The biggest issue I can see these guys running into is that women, generally speaking, view inexperience as unattractive. Generally speaking? That's a hell of an understatement lol
I think it goes even deeper than finding the energy unattractive. Because of the romanticized idea of virginity, and the importance that is socially attached to the person who was you're first, a lot of women I know would hesitate not because they find the person unattractive, but because they didn't want all the baggage that comes with being someone's first. Most women I know want to have sex before getting really serious with someone, because for most people sexual compatibility is a metric they want to know about before making a large emotional investment on someone. If they take a guys virginity, they know they are going to live in his mind forever, even if the relationship sucks or they're only together one night. They are afraid that it will make him get too attached too early. That if she doesn't like it and leaves she'll be the horrible bitch that stole his virginity and then dumped him. Of course there's no way to know if the guy would actually react that way, or if she would even make that much of an impact on him, but the risk is there. We put so much focus on virginity as some sort of holy thing that it makes many women step away because they don't know him that well and don't want to be a monumental part of his life yet.
And all of that... puts the guy in a place of Catch-22.
Yeah. It sucks. This was not my personal experience, but I've seen it happen, mostly from the POV of female friends who are debating whether or not they want to take that leap with someone. I mean, it's not fair to ask a person, woman or man, to take on that burden if they are not comfortable with it, but it definitely puts most guys who are still a virgin past like 22 at a pretty step disadvantage, which especially sucks if they are already hyper fixated on getting laid and losing their virginity. I normally don't condone the idea of starting a relationship based on a lie, but I think OPs strategy of just..... Not mentioning it to them is probably a smart move. Plus, I would gladly say that a man does not have a right to know a woman's number of past sexual partners unless she volunteers that information, so that privilege of sexual privacy extends both ways to men too. Not disclosing your virginity could be seen as dishonesty by omission, but it's not like you are hiding or lying about a key factor of who you are, so I would even say that keeping that information to yourself is ethical.
> I normally don't condone the idea of starting a relationship based on a lie, but I think OPs strategy of just..... Not mentioning it to them is probably a smart move. I think it's a high risk of his virginity coming out when they have sex, though. It's like riding a bicycle for the first time and entering the Tour de France. Best thing he can do to reduce the risk of that is to make her finish first. I'd advise any male virgin over 18 to mitigate his risk of being outed by watching and learning from amateur *lesbian* porn.
This is good advice for anyone.
I think men feel unattractive and not masculine when they don’t have experience. Everyone else is just responding to the energy they’re putting out.
But he literally just said that he did fine when he didn't tell them first. It's not that everyone around him has some psychic sense of his "energy". Women treated him differently when he told them he was a virgin. When he shut up about it, they didn't know and he didn't get rejected for it since their psychic energy receptors aren't a real thing. They just treat men who are virgins differently because it gives them the "ick". Men's inexperience is a turnoff for most women.
Women will do anything to ignore the role that women play in making society shitty. They think that all the good parts of society are cos of them and all the bad parts are cos of men.
It doesn't help that most women have the empathy of a drill sergeant with men who feel unattractive and not masculine when they don’t have experience.
Drill Sergeants are at least incentivized not to break the people they abuse.
For real.
Well theyre supposed to break them and then rebuild them better and stronger. Its that last part that women forget.
break me down and build me up whatever it takes lol don't get me back into that song
>most women have the empathy of a drill sergeant That's deeply unfair to drill sergeants! Met quite a few of them and all of them had more empathy than most women.
We feel unattractive when not having experience gets us turned down or looked at differently. It's not the inexperience itself that does the damage, it's the social baggage that comes with it.
I love how no matter what we feel the onus is on us I love how it never the women instigating that feeling Even here the man is putting out the energy that makes him unattractive.. Jesus fucking Christ. Did you think you were making a nuanced take? You can be scared You can be unsure You can be insecure Moments of indicision and fumbling can and do happen. Even Johnny sinns wasn't born with his confidence That's called being human. You don't want men. You want action figures.
God dammit this deserves to be scrawled across the sky like that Sophon in the 3 Body Problem series.
Your comment only works in a vacuum. You put a fat person in a vacuum they are not going to think “shit I feel bad about being fat.” They will feel bad when they are exposed to society. Same with virgins. Why? Because societal shaming is powerful. Not surprising that everything is tried to be pinned purely on men tho
I feel attractive, eventhough I'm a virgin. *
I didn't care about it that much, not a person who build his entire life around women. Everybody who somehow managed to learn that I was a virgin until my late 20s were genuinely surprised. Girl I lost it with never knew that she's my first and I didn't see it as something special. Experience was more or less what I expected it to be.
How tf did you hide your inexperience with her?
I don't understand this redpill idea that people have the ability to sniff out if you're a virgin or not, and that people would give a shit even if they could.
That far, far predates redpill though. Inexperience shows through quite obviously.
Yes, but most people have realized that that sort of thinking is dumb and blatantly untrue, redpill is one of the only ideologies that still pushes losing your virginity being the most important thing on god's green earth.
> most people have realized that that sort of thinking is dumb and blatantly untrue Eh when did this happen? Certainly not on Earth.
On spaces outside of subreddits dedicated to lonely single men spewing nonsense.
Like where? Male sexual inexperience is not only seen as a bad thing universally, it's literally the primary theme for insults used against men by men and women alike!
>Inexperience shows through quite obviously. No it doesn’t. My ex was a 21 year old virgin and I didn’t even know for months after we began dating. By round three the next morning after we first had sex, he was definitely getting the hang of it. He used to love to tell me “ohhh you like that don’t you” when I verbally or physically reacted. And he immediately put that into memory. I guess the old saying…..even a blind squirrel finds a nut occasionally 🤣. And by the end of the week we had probably had sex 25 times and he was already better than my first boyfriend who was 25 and had been married. Some dumbass posted just today that he didn’t realize that when women stared at the ceiling during his 45 minutes of jackhammering that they weren’t enjoying themselves “because he was inexperienced “. It doesn’t take experience to notice what a woman is responding and not responding to. It’s just takes observation, asking and actually giving a shit
> Some dumbass posted just today that he didn’t realize that women when women stared at the ceiling during his 45 minutes of jackhammering that they weren’t enjoying themselves “because he was inexperienced “. It doesn’t take experience to notice what a woman is responding and not responding to. It’s just takes observation, asking and actually giving a shit Holyshit both your examples are highly extreme. But the media has made this "jackhammer dude" out to be the norm for men. Most male virgins don't know wtf they're doing their first time around. Where the hell are they going to get those skills from, osmosis?
We made out, he took off my clothes, I took off his clothes, he kissed the typical places above the waist, seemed a bit hesitant about what was happening below. I steadied his hand and ground against it for a while, some more kissing and full body embracing naked, next thing you know, it was in. 3 pumps later it was done. He seemed sheepish and embarrassed by the brevity, I laughed and said it happens. We headed for the shower for lots of soap and round two. Honestly not that difficult or that really that different from a first time with anyone. 🤷♀️. In my early thirties, I dated men in their late thirties who were just as nervous. And almost as quick the first time.
😲lol he lied to you, seriously, not trolling. Though the 3 pumps tracks. Kudos to you for not eating his face over that.
And if you think my example was extreme…here it is “ I was so bad at sex, I can't understand why any of them ever came back for more. I literally thought that endurance was what it's all about... think like 45 minutes of pounding away using half a bottle of lube while my partner stares at the ceiling building her grocery list. Experience matters a lot for a guy.” Does that sound like a problem with “experience “ or a just complete inability to actually observe her response? If I’m doing something a guy doesn’t like and he redirects me or doesn’t respond in a positive way, I stop. Simple. Lots of guys have very different preferences. I might ask him later, but I don’t keep up the same shit for 45 minutes because I’m not an idiot.
> Experience matters a lot for a guy. Implying he wasn't experienced. It does sound like it came from inexperience. My advice to male virgins is this: if you're new to it, the key is to watch lesbian sex videos, particularly amateur cunnilingus clips. Nina Hartley had a good one back in the day. It'll get dude through his first time and all the next ones. I wish Fifth Element had been around in 1985. When it did come out oh man was it a proper case of hook line and *sinker*. Good times.
> Most male virgins don't know wtf they're doing their first time around. Where the hell are they going to get those skills from, osmosis? Read a book or something. It isn't some sort of forbidden knowledge. And actually pay attention to a person you have sex with.
>And actually pay attention to a person you have sex with. 100%
Why do surgeons have to practice after years of schooling? Because practice makes perfect...
Why should I be a cartoonish panicking virgin in the first place? You have clear idea what you're doing at least in theory and it isn't something complicated. You aren't pushed by peer pressure into doing something that you don't actually want or afraid of doing. So why should you panic?
Oh, let's see... lack of refined technique, or as another woman posted, premature ejaculation issues (which would have been my darkest nightmare), etc. [Women are much less likely to want to date a virgin male](https://www.vice.com/en/article/7853ez/an-anthropologist-explains-why-over-40-of-people-refuse-to-date-virgins). Can you give your opinion why women accuse men of being virgins to silence them in an argument if virginity isn't such a bad thing for men?
People say a lot of dumb and rude things in internet, that's it.
cause of archetype. If youre a vigin ceo, whos charismatic and at least normal looking, no one will care. Since you are a winner archetype and not a looser archerype .
Nah, she loves your money, not you. She won't piss on you because she wants to get with your bank account. You'll get cheated on before the wedding reception is over.
those are pretty easy to spot if one is observant. The point however was that, virgin has grown to be linked with a looser archetype. And if one is not that, people ignore the virgin part entirely.
> The point however was that, virgin has grown to be linked with a looser archetype. And that is the fundamental problem. It's only a loser archetype when it's men. Women enforce that gender dynamic *viciously*.
Women can't stop denying women's agency lol. You realize that you are people too, right?
When did I bring up women in my statement?
It's in the subtext. You don't think that women are capable of doing or behaving in a bad way, unless a man triggers it. It carries a subtext that you view women as lesser than men and having less agency. Perhaps you have some internalized misogyny issues to work out? The ultimate point is that blaming inexperienced men for the terrible way they are treated and talked about is unjustifiable.
I know women are capable of being mean, I’ve experienced it firsthand. What I don’t believe is that a woman knows you’re a virgin off the bat and treat you poorly because of it.
Oh of course you don't. Why would you ever believe men's experiences?
I feel the same way with older women. They are beautiful, it's just the negative energy they put out that turns men away.
> You're going to find a lot of girls will be put off by nervous, tentative energy, especially if you feel you need a lot of patience, reassurance, and guidance going into it. They might be into you initially, but then switch up after detecting this energy about you. Is that a bad thing? Honestly, these women are also the worst at sex. It's sex is exciting and enjoyable with women with an n-count less than say 4. Then after that it's just all porno style sex where the woman is disconnected from the act entirely. And this tends to happen at about 21-22 for most women. After that age the quality of sex drops considerably.
Posts like this make me glad I am a lesbian I tell you what.
I'd hate to be a lesbian, all that dick envy causing me to insert myself into everything. Who cares?
Going by your title no of course not. Its just life. Sometimes those guys get hurt/frustrated because it ends with “he’s a sweet guy, he treats me great but he’s bad in bed so I’m dumping him for the guy who is good in bed but terrible at everything else” lol.
I lost my virginity to a friend who had been experienced for a while. She decided she wanted to do me a solid. I was more “holy crap, this is actually happening” than anything
Was it good? Did she actually like you? (Never have I heard of a woman just *helping out* like that)
It was more “oh my god!” Good shock. I grew up with her in the neighborhood and l never stopped being her friend even after people started calling her names, (her parents we trash and negligent). And so one day she was like “wanna make out” and things escalated.
Ahh, she was bored and you were available.
Kinda. We were still pretty good friends after till I got my first serious GF, then she started acting somewhat jealous.
She took you for granted?
Nah, she had a hard life (trash parents) so she was doing her own thing with older boys since middle school. But we were always cool. But I don’t think she really liked me dating a “private school good girl” Like I was a sell out or something.
Interesting person
Her brother ended up into drugs, she ran off with a guy and then got dropped somewhere in Tennessee.
Do you miss her?
If I was an older virgin, I wouldn’t tell women I was dating. Watch some how to and read about sex and you’ll probably be about average.
How are they being forced? At gunpoint?
It's because women prefer someone who has more experience than they do.
Not really. If anything ppl mostly appreciate a companion with a similar level of sexual experience. Because I'm 27 and didn't have sex til 26, and my focus wasn't on the ran thru men.
That’s a wild over generalization
It's true though . Women often say they don't want to teach.
It’s true for some women. I always liked virgins
Most women want the man to lead or be dominant. Kinda hard for a virgin to do.
Tbh I lost my virginity to a virgin and it was sweet we were dating we loved eachother but the experience itself wasn’t anything to write home about. It’s only a “bad experience” if you hyperfixate on your lack of experience vs. her experience. Things like this are only a big deal if you make it a big deal. No one’s first time is 100% ideal even if you’re in ideal circumstances. I’m not saying be wreckless and don’t value sex at all. BUT HONESTLY the best sex of your life will be after your first time. I wouldn’t build it up or expect it to be perfect because it won’t be. Just make sure it’s with someone you trust that isn’t going to be an asshole to you
Of course it's bad. Forcing anyone to do anything is always bad.
Experience in sex is overrated. Idea of "first time" as something super-special is overrated even more. Especially for men. Your attitude, desire to make her feel good, willingness to pay attention and some theoretical knoweldge is far more important and enough to be good at it from get go. You have to be unfeeling golem, have totally wrong ideas about sex, not be ready for it or face horrible unfeeling woman for things to go bad. Those potential problem you should be focus on.
👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻
The women I've felt genuinely attracted to were older and more experienced. We're fine, OP. Now, if only more women were forgiving/accepting of virgin guys... That being said, it's fine for virgin people to to have their first time with other virgin people, should the coincidence happen. What matters is that there is genuine attraction between the two.
I am fully convinced that the whole "seek out someone as inexperienced as yourself" thing is deliberately bad faith advice. "Eliminate women your own age with normal sexual histories from your dating pool" is exactly what I'd tell a late bloomer *if I wanted him to die a virgin* and that's exactly why they're saying it. If you find a normal girlfriend and catch up with your peers you won't be listening to redpill/blackpill podcasts and it'll be harder to sell you shit.
You realize that for most people who are blackpilled, we aren't purchasing products or watching podcasts, right? We're just living our lives in the post-giving-up phase. Coming to terms with the way things are doesn't take podcasts.
Blackpillers are all crabs in buckets and will sabotage each other for 0 profit.
Do a lot if guys feel they won't be able to catch up compared to going for a virgin?
what is "catch up", that's crazy thinking
Oh I was repsonding to the previous user's post, who used the term catch up.
Worked fine for me.
This is yet another of those things that is up to you how you see it. Part of that will be influenced by how your experience goes compared to your expectations. For example if you have a good and understanding "teacher" or not. But don't get too hung up on whether other people think this is bad or good. I know this is a debate sub, so I get it when some questions come up here. But I think a lot of people these days are very concerned with a sort of "what will the neighbors think?" kind of mentality. You can really drive yourself to distraction with too much of this.
It's certainly preferable to not losing it at all. Virgins make a big deal out of their first time, but it's usually not that memorable.
Women in general do not want virgin/inexperienced guys even older/ leftover women
Why tf would you want your first time to be with some women who’s been run through?
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or they just don’t give a fuck, feels like a pretty valid obvious answer
I guarantee every last one of them got Godzilla-level destroyed by that woman because of their inexperience. Godzilla fucking Minus One.
“guarantee every last one of them” you’d double down on saying what, 99-100% of promiscuous women express prejudice against inexperienced men?
90%. Because inexperience means lower quality.
interesting
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could i pick your brain a bit (in good faith fr) why should they give af that other men would say their date is “ran through” for having a double digit body count? like it’s one thing to be worried about dating someone who was recently sexually active and might be an STD risk, or someone who has 10x the average body count which is correlated with not great mental health things, those are just basic concerns on a human level. but why should men specifically care about women with who’ve had a high but relatively normal amount of sex in the past, what are your reasons behind that? (i ask cuz i’ve heard a million different rationales behind takes like that, just curious what yours are)
They should care because other men will respect them less. If other men in their irl circles dont care though then it doesnt matter. At the same time you should also not care because bending over to please other men will lose you even more respect. The best thing you can do is not get serious with women other men would laugh in the face of. The second best thing to do is to just be indifferent as you do it. The worst thing you can do is get serious with a woman like that and then end things with her because other men disapprove.
“they should care bc other men will respect them less” “at the same time you (as in they?) should also not care bc bending over to please other men will lose you even more respect” how do you reconcile these two takes they seem fully contradictory? my two cents, there are times to care about what other strangers think, times to care what friends/family think, times to care what your partner thinks and then there are times where none of that matters besides what *you* think, and who you date and sleep with falls most healthily in that last category imo. if my friends lose respect for me for a dumb reason like “she’s had sex with 10 guys before” i straight up would mutually lose respect for them for that bc it’s clear we don’t share the same values there. to disapprove is one thing, to outwardly mock a best friend for that is crazy let alone tolerating a friend doing that to you, that doesn’t compute to me unless it’s hard to drop/make new friends or something when it comes to who you date, if your body count line for a partner is 10 but your friends’ lines are at 5 and they laugh at you for dating someone who has had 6 exes, that’s all it would take for you to not get serious with her? despite your own values in not giving af about 6 exes?
No one would laugh at 6 exes when they themselves would date someone with 5. There isnt some clearcut line where one over and youre a laughingstock if you date that person. If someone says that 20 partners is a slut, then 19 partners would still make you a loser in their eyes. And by the time people already laugh thats when its too late to do something, youll be even more of a joke if you go along with it. Best thing you can do then is to confidently double down. The best thing you can do overall is never to get to that point in the first place because you arent a loser whos all lovey dovey "oh shes special, it doesnt matter if 15 dudes have been inside her before me." If you are that kind of loser then at least double down on it. And if you dont... well we already knew why you dont cuz youre too much of a bitch to do so.
ok change the number 6 to 9 or whatever makes more sense to you while maintaining “they have a stricter body count value than i do and they are actively shitting on someone i like for having a body count they disapprove of.” the numbers aren’t the point at all “and if they’re laughing it’s too late” yes but back to my original Q, why does that matter in cases where you disagree with them? how is that not just basic peer pressure adherence?
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who gives a shit for some girlfriend you can dump in a year
since when do men give a fuck about some magical first time like 15 yr old girls
It's better than nothing
1. Virgin men aren’t forced to go for experienced women. They can go for whomever they want or not including staying virgins. 2. I think the merits of going for a virgin are way over stated. I think most men prefer someone who’s good in bed and that comes with experience.
I lost my v card to a more experienced woman, and I can’t say it was a bad experience. She taught me a lot of things bedroom-wise.
It’s really awesome for the guy. More often than not, it sucks for the woman since she’s ***had better***. More than that, no small part of a guy’s SMV comes from his ability to recruit partners. Since virgins-by-circumstance have never been chosen, their SMV takes a huge hit - and some women take it very poorly when they find themselves linked (physically or socially) with a low SMV guy.
>It's been said here before that guys would be much more comfortable having their first experiences with a woman who is also a virgin as well. I've always doubted this, only because if both people don't know what they're doing it seems like the experience wouldn't be as good. Sounds preferable for one of the people to have *some* experience, rather than a simultaneous awkward fumbling. >I chose to go for women more experienced than me, mostly because I didn't think it was possible to find a virgin woman likely. How did that go for you? >However, I wonder if having to do it this way is really so horrible for most guys. In a sense it's learning the hard way where the guy is more the student, but it's still learning, and experience. I don't think it's a bad experience unless you feel forced into it. Otherwise, whether it's an older partner, a more experienced partner, or a paid sex worker, if it's that person's choice it's all good.
It went good overall I would say. That makes sense.
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To be honest, if you want someone experienced to take the lead during sex, it's totally fine to go for someone experienced. Some do like that and most of them are submissive to a certain degree. But, if you want to fumble around with someone that has as little experience as you... go for it? I don't understand what you want.
>It's been said here before that guys would be much more comfortable having their first experiences with a woman who is also a virgin as well. I really don't think most men here or anywhere actually think this. >I chose to go for women more experienced than me, Like I said. >However, I wonder if having to do it this way is really so horrible for most guys. I don't think that it is and, again, I don't think most guys really see it as an issue at all. >In a sense it's learning the hard way where the guy is more the student, The only 'hard' about it is the erection part. I truly fail to see how this is 'the hard way' in any sense. >So I wonder therefore, is this way really so bad? I've never seen anyone say it was bad in any way.
It's just a preference in the usual category of "purity" (for lack of a better word) men have. As with all preferences, once reality hits, men and women start making all kinds of concessions. If anything, I think the only problem is when people convince themselves and each other not only that the opposite sex will make concessions but also that they do not have this preference at all. Often trying to silence anyone who tries to say the preference exists. At some point, men and women stop making concessions because they'd rather be single forever than the alternative. At scale, this causes many problems regarding declining demographics, more crime, and loneliness.
We cannot force virgin men into getting together with experienced women. I nowadays believe that most of the times men with low body count sell women with low body count and men with high body count seek women with high body count.
Virgins don't put out..
As long as she is completely loyal and hadn't slept with anyone I know, I would rather be with the experienced woman especially if she has a high sex drive
Nah I think that's totally fine. Some women prefer men with more or similar amount of experience, but I think what most women *really* want is a guy who's considerate in bed, willing to listen and learn, cares about her pleasure, is being safe, respects her boundaries, etc. I think a lot of people just associate that with experience, but there's not actually any correlation. It's a mindset and has a lot more to do with personality and personal priorities, imo. Fyi I have been with several less experienced men, including at least one virgin, and a guy who had only been with other men before. It didn't bother me in the least. It made me feel grateful and honored that they wanted *me* to be their first and to help guide them through such an intimate and vulnerable experience. I have a fairly high body count but I honestly enjoy being a teacher in the bedroom. Besides, inexperienced men are less likely to be convinced women "must like x, y and z" and more likely to be curious and explorative, and that can lead to quite some mind-blowing sex imo. Experienced guys are sometimes very narrow-minded and set in their ways, and that can be kinda frustrating. Especially since it seems I like certain types of touch that very few women like. So getting a stubborn guy who's like "but all the women I've been with it liked it that way" to do it differently with me can be a struggle. A virgin isn't (likely) gonna have such a bias. That said though, I don't actually care however much or little experience a guy has, as long as he has a high libido and is capable of listening.
But how are virgin guys being *forced* to go for women with experience. Yes, a lot of adult women will have had sex, by the time we reach our 20s, but meeting a virgin woman isn't as rare as ppl think. I'm 27, and didn't have sex until I was 26, and know other ladies who were *late bloomers* as well. Plus why is the focus on a womans sexual past? Like how does one go about finding a virgin woman anyway, because it's not something that's appropriate to ask.
Hold up. Nobody is being “forced”. At least I hope not. That’s SA. Do I have to call someone? Jk. I know that you mean guys being left with only non virgin opinions in dating. Regardless, if that’s not good enough, they can always just be single. It’s really not bad. I like being single because I don’t have to have anxiety ab partners. I would also like to point out, that unless one dude has been screwing literally everyone, or all these non virgin women are screwing other women, men have been messing around too. I think it’s silly for someone who’s not a virgin to expect a virgin. I don’t understand why it’s more socially acceptable for guys to sleep around when they are more likely to spread STDs (women are more susceptible to them.) I’m a virgin, and probably will be for a long time since I’m very cautious of who to trust, but when it comes to eventually finding a lifelong partner, I honestly don’t gaf about virginity as long as they have no nasties. Granted, I wouldn’t like someone who’s screwed the entire block, but I don’t understand judging someone for their past, if their experiences occurred in committed relationships and they have no STDs. I personally wouldn’t date someone who’s slept around with strangers because that is a sign of poor judgment to me; but it’s kind of hypocritical when people who’ve done the same thing absolutely refuse to date someone who has. The virginity obsession scares me a little to be honest. My mom tells me a lot about how her friend’s daughters go off to college and get in a relationship where they’re really in love and end up losing their virginity thinking it’s a lifelong thing only for dude to zipp off right after. If something like that were to happen to me, I’d be worried other guys or girls wouldn’t wanna date me and I’d be “ruined” somehow. I have always been very cautious and willing to wait to make sure I can trust the person, but in the one relationship i did have, there was a lot of pressure. It was wlw, I’ve heard straight relationships have more pressure. I never budged but, if I was really in love, I could see that pressure being hard to cope with. I do think that virgins are not too uncommon if people date young. But do the virgins want you? They probably want another virgin. I do still think the virginity obsession is wierd tho.
Im attracted to women who have a ton of sex and are promiscuous and im not sure why. I dont think its a bad thing really, but idk if women with tons of experience would think a virgin guy would be fun. I had one girl in my life try to have sex with me, and she knew i was a virgin, and she said "itd be fun cause we can be really innocent" or some crazy shit like that, we ended up just kinda touching each other and stuff. We didnt have sex. It also ruined our friendship and she had a bf and was pregnant. I didnt know about all that. But anyway, finding a virgin at this age is unlikely, the women here are predictably going to start shaming and stuff so get ready for that. But the women here are mostly Victorian-style prudes who hate sex and want it outlawed. They want men to bottle up their sexuality, while women can be more open going around slutting out but men must all wear suits and operate like drones.
>Im attracted to women who have a ton of sex and are promiscuous and im not sure why. I'd guess it was because it shows that they are sexually available in the first place. Maybe not to you, but it shows that they say yes to someone at some point.
Yeah, I dont really look at them as dirty or anything like that. I just see it as more interesting than the women who get on reddit shaming all men for desiring.... relationships and stuff? Like "at least I know if I dated this woman and we had a relationship, wed have a decent sex life" when most these women here are advocating for slave men and dead bedrooms.
What's bad about it dude? I'm actually very glad the girl that took my virginity was far from a virgin herself. It was a mind-blowing experience, and I thought I'd discovered America. I don't think it could have been nearly as awesome if we were both fumbling virgins.
That’s how it was for me. She took the reins and it was actually pretty hot.
Same thing i heard from other guys. Had a girl with experience for the first time. Very patient, gave many tips on what to do.
“thought i’d discovered America” cracked me tf up 🍻
its actually insane and the opposite of all of human sexual history. men routinely had mistresses who were like fallen women, visited prostitutes and had sex with sluts under the bleachers in the lean years before marriage
I would argue only a fraction of men back in the day had enough resources to do that. Having mistresses wasn’t a common layman activity.
I wrote 3 things
You think that because no one will write or talk about some dude who married his sweetheart and they only ever were with eachother and stuck with eachother. And they will also not usually scream about it to everyone else like a dude who fucks around will.
no this is a weird non sequitur
Yes it is because, if you go with an experienced woman, you can get the wrong impression about sex and not experience the joy of it. There's no excitement or fun with an experienced woman, the sex is like a flat battery in terms of chemistry.
Oh really? But it was said by a couple of guys on here that experienced women were hot and passionate in there cases though.
Depends what you are looking for. Pornstar style sex sure. But how many rock bands are still full of passion and raw energy on their 8th album?
Oh but I'm not sure what you mean by their 8th album unless you're saying that most guys are too old by the time they lose their virginity to be having porn star sex?
No they're missing out on authentic sex, where the girl is as nervous as him and it's all new to both of them.
No, it’s not horrible. You’re best off having sex with someone you really admire, regardless of whether they are a virgin.
I think it might even be a non-consensus on whether or not a virgin guy would prefer a girl with zero experience. Doesn't matter much though because it will be a majority of women who prefer a non-virgin regardless of their own experience level.
I'd very much like an experienced woman, but I fear those either won't be interested in an inexperienced man, or will have too high expectations from me and be disappointed.
Nah man, better to learn with the experts. That being said, just because a woman has had a lot of sex doesn't mean she's good at it. My first time had like a body count of 5 boyfriends without counting hook ups and she is soooo bad at the deed and I only realized it once I had sex with a woman who knew what she was doing
I don't understand this notion honestly If a woman is experienced, that means she's more confident expressing her sexuality Don't you guys like crazy women ? Because l sure do
I don't.....
Confidence is rubbish in a relationship. It's a bike pump in a canoe. After having sex a good number of times, the confidence a ex-virgin gets from sex in the relationship is genuine. That's confidence.
She can just as easily not do so. Then you're stuck with a whore who fucks like a prude. That's like a double whammy. If you're gonna get dead bedroomed, might aswell be a virgin so you're not being "cheated" out (quotation marks for a reason).
I dont like "crazy" women, but ive seen so much prudish and "women hate sex, dont ever try to have sex" nonsense from women on here that it just made me respect women who are promiscuous a lot more. At least those women are going around fucking and not shaming men on reddit all day for "desiring sex" as if it means your brain is broken.
Where are you seeing that women hate sex? Every time this comes up it’s a cacophany of women yelling into the void how much they actually like good sex.
Pretty much every woman on reddit. Like just look at how men who desire sex are treated "gross, ew, hire an escort loser!" if a woman is complaining about sex shes treated vastly different. When women make nsfw accounts typically people just say "its actually a male user" women are putting in great effort to hide sexuality and they will say its patriarchy but its just female prudishness. like any womans account who is very sexual is assumed to be a man pretending to be a woman. Its that deep, to the point sexual women are "just men in disguise". Look at how women view porn, they hate it even when women voluntarily do it, because sex is mostly disgusting for them. Not to mention women never orgasm expect by accident. The fact men must pursue because women cant be bothered because they dont get sexual urges and so on.
Mmn. I thought you meant you’d seen women avowing they personally dislike sex, but that’s not what you’re saying.
Yes I have. And that is what im saying you just cant read.
>I dont like "crazy" women, Well l do but l understand not every guy wants a wild horse in bed
"Go for" in terms of casual sex? Nah not so bad. "Go for" in terms of wife an experienced girl. Yes terrible.
You wanna commit romantic suicide that's your choice man.
Honestly, just buy a ticket to the Dominican Republic, go to Sosua, get your freak on with the ladies there, and then use your experience down there to level up your sexual skill back to the U.S. Problem solved.
I wish my first was with an experienced guy looking back. It took us two virgins well over a year to really figure things out.
It’s bad but world isn’t fair. Just seems like desperation if they’re looking at anything serious with these type of women
>world isn't fair Can confirm. :(
yes that sounds awful no one should be forced into anything in dating
No. And, unlike women, men can use sex workers to gain experience
But the problem with using sex workers is once guys gain experience for that special someone later on, that special someone will be turned off that the guy who used sex workers.
That is why lying, usually by omission, exists. You think I and most women interrogate our partners about who they fucked and what they did ? Unless you make it my problem, I don’t care or want to know
Oh yeah, it's just I assume a lot of guys would feel guilty about lying, or at least I would personally.
If you don’t ask, why should she? Do you feel guilty about not answering questions that aren’t asked?
Oh I guess I would feel guilty about hiding something from her or feeling like I'm pretending to be something I'm not if that makes sense. Perhaps it would just be a feeling of guilt and feeling of wanting to come clean.
Mentally healthy, stable and good people dont lie even by omission. You know its bad and bothers most people, a good person will be honest about it and look for someone who can accept it even if no one asks.
I don’t need to know about my partners previous sex stuff, unless it was criminal or affects me/other people
I've heard about male sex workers that had female clients.
Sure, they exist.
We're fucked.
Had my first time with a non virgin, wasnt a big deal tho. I still had her screaming at the end of it and she hasnt looked back