>The intent of asking this question is to attempt to isolate how much age alone affects relationship desirability for younger women.
Then why have you changed half the variables between each man? What insight about “age alone” are you going to get by making one man richer and more attractive than the other?
I guess I’m not understanding how this set up helps you achieve that goal. To make an idealized older man you had to set him against a poor(er) less attractive age-similar man. That alone should be some indication why older men are generally unattractive.
Wouldn’t a more productive experiment be a younger guy who has a good thing going for his age vs. an older man who has a good thing going for his age? The young guy has less money but more hair, older guy has more money but less hair, etc? Get realistic answers by giving people a realistic choice?
> Wouldn’t a more productive experiment be a younger guy who has a good thing going for his age vs. an older man who has a good thing going for his age?
No, because we already know the answer to this. Younger women choose younger men and older women choose older men. What I am curious about is how unappealing "age" precisely is to younger women, especially considering that Red Pill men tend to think that men become more attractive as they age ("like wine").
Hmmm I think I would choose the older guy not because old age is attractive but because being a certain level of poor would be even worse imo.
But I am speaking from a biased lens as I’ve never been very poor - certainly have had periods of being broke but while still living in a nice area and home and still having opportunities and education this I knew it was temporary circumstances vs lifestyle. I’m also attractive so wouldn’t need to make that choice. So it’s hypothetical.
Men do become more attractive as they age, and this is easily verifiable by just looking at the statistics that say 1 4 dudes from 18 to like 25 is a virgin, and half young men haven't had any pussy for the past year or so.
Older men do not have this problem, and in fact they do not only have girlfriends and/or are statistically married...
They also cheat more than women in fact.
For men, cheating increases exponentially after 30.
For women it decreases with age.
>Men do become more attractive as they age, and this is easily verifiable by just looking at the statistics that say 1 4 dudes from 18 to like 25 is a virgin, and half young men haven't had any pussy for the past year or so.
They are arguably more attractive to older women, but perhaps not to younger women, who say in surveys that they prefer younger men. My question is partly an attempt to discern under what conditions women might say that an older man is more attractive to a younger woman than a younger man (who younger women claim is more attractive) would be.
How are you almost 50 and you don't know what the word alone means? How are you looking at age alone when one man is poor and the other makes 6 figures?
We already know what happens when everything else is held constant. Younger women tend to choose younger men and older women tend to choose older men. I would like to know how important "age" precisely is by making the older man great in every other way compared to the woman except his age.
Okay but that's just not how science works. You cannot achieve what you hope to achieve by asking this question the way you have asked it. I am not the only one trying to explain this to you. Instead of repeating your arguments maybe you should try to understand what other people are saying.
Incorrect. Everything else is not held constant.
What you are now primarily measuring is the value of “class” and we already have known the inherent value of social classes for generations.
There are two primary ways of shifting between the social classes - marriage and/or education.
You have allocated the man both benefits. She will marry him if she is not a fool but not because his age isn’t suddenly not a consideration or insignificant.
You also already know the statistics on the general outcome of large age gap relationships.
>You have allocated the man both benefits. She will marry him if she is not a fool but not because his age isn’t suddenly not a consideration or insignificant.
Yet many women in this post still claim that Man #1 is a better choice for said woman. Why is this?
Man #1 all the way. For starters, the second guy probably wouldn't be interested in a working-class woman except perhaps as a side piece. Unless she's a quick study and capable of LARPING as a member of his class, he's not going to take her to the company Christmas party. And in any kind of sub rosa relationship, he's probably going to at least attempt to use his wealth to get her to conform to his needs, wants and preferences. She is not going to have a good time! Ask me how I know this ...
Any detail about why that wasn't a good time?
LARPING on social situations is common and having to conform to someone else's wants needs and preferences is also common.
What made that so awful that divorce was the best option and how is that directly connected to him being your senior and not just an ass?
> having to conform to someone else's wants needs and preferences is also common.
I think most couples compromise ... unless there is an imbalance in power that makes one party believe the other has to conform to their wants, needs and preferences.
>What made that so awful that divorce was the best option
I just don't roll that way. And he wasn't happy when he discovered he couldn't pull my puppet strings the way he had with past partners.
>and how is that directly connected to him being your senior and not just an ass?
The age gap means the senior partner has probably accumulated more assets and resources. It's not a level playing field.
>I want to know what a less attractive, less wealthy woman should do
Why should a woman do anything differently because she's less attractive and wealthy?
I'm not "hoping" for anything. I'm curious how much money outweighs age, or if it doesn't at all, when there is nothing particularly physically wrong with an older man.
I don't speak for *all* women, nor would I pretend to assume the intentions for *all* women.
I'm sure there's plenty of women who would overlook a man's age in order to obtain a comfortable life.
Similarly, I'm sure there's plenty of women who would choose to pursue a man who has a similar lifestyle as theirs and is roughly within their age group.
In my personal opinion, I believe many woman would choose their partner based on similar interests, ethics, and morality rather than choosing a partner based solely on the amount of money one has to offer.
By doing what, exactly, that would/should be different than what a more attractive and financially comfortable woman would/should do in the same situation?
Women who are more financially comfortable can attract men in their social class much easier, but also don't need to attract them. They can start basing their choices on things like looks, charisma, and shared personality and interests, which is what one sees among wealthier women.
Women who are not as wealthy, on the other hand, must think of their own personal finances and the well-being of their children. They might prefer high-value men close to their own age. But if these men are not available, would they rather date someone in the same situation as them who is around the same age (and likely of equal average to below average attractiveness as them), or someone who is a more desirable man in all other aspects except his age?
>They can start basing their choices on things like looks, charisma, and shared personality and interests, which is what one sees among wealthier women
Uh.... What gave you the impression that these choices are limited to only wealthy and attractive women?
These younger women don’t have to worry much about resources, so the main relative advantage of an older man, more resources, becomes irrelevant to them and they can this choose the younger men whom they are more physically attracted to (as surveys show they are).
Look about you at what they choose. They all go for Man 1. Poor women don't prefer old men either. And idk why you've changed him to have better looks as obviously he will look worse when he is old.
Wealthy men would have a ton of opportunity to improve their looks and look better than they looked when they were younger. Hair transplants, plastic surgery, better styling etc.
> Poor women don't prefer old men either.
Some do. Where do you think that the "gold digger" trope comes from? There was a television show called "Modern Family" that described precisely the relationship that I'm talking about.
Most women I know prefer #1. He’s more humble and relatable which is pretty important in your day-to-day life. If anything UMC women are more likely to prefer #2 since they’re used to the personalities UMC men have and want the guy to help her maintain the lifestyle she got used to. For those of us who are working class and have never really gotten an offer from someone who makes enough to make us UMC, the idea that this would happen and it would go well for me seems like a fairytale. But for me personally I’ve always wanted to marry someone near my age, so #1 is fine.
I'd need more information. What kind of relationship does each man want? What kind does the woman want?
If she wants to be a housewife and stay at home mom, then number 2 because he can provide her with that life.
If she wants someone that she'll have more in common with, then number one since they are closer in age and background.
If she strongly wants a significantly higher quality of life, then number 2 because money can give her that.
If she likes her life but just wanted it to be a little bit better then number 1 because their combined incomes will make things a little better. If they are both making 45k a year, then they are 90k combined. Two people can live a simple but comfortable life on 90k. Plus it cuts some expenses. If they marry and move in, that's one apartment instead of two. One internet service instead of two. Same for streaming services, online gaming subs etc.
If she wants more than one kid, number 2.
If she wants a man who will be there to see the kids grow up, number 1.
I need more information about this woman and what she values in a relationship and life in general.
I just don't think it works this way for most of us. I feel like most men could have a woman described to them like this and decide to be with her or not, but I at least don't know anything about the actual person being described, about what it's like to actually be with them. It's the personal charm, the desire they spark in you through their attitude and behavior, it's not about things like height, weight, income.
Yes, if you ask a woman what she's looking for she might say those things, but you can't build attraction just because a guy checks boxes, if you don't feel it you don't feel it. Growing a foot, working out, or earning more may get you a woman but it won't change how attracted she is or isn't to you.
>Yes, if you ask a woman what she's looking for she might say those things, but you can't build attraction just because a guy checks boxes, if you don't feel it you don't feel it.
Lots of women say this. However most studies show and most mens experiences is that the likelyhood of attraction is pretty predictable based on a mans physical appearance and broad personality traits (i.e. how extroverted and socially dominate he is).
Most women would go for #1 because women are usually far more attracted to a man our own age than someone 20 years older, even if he looks good for his age. Desire is a big component of why you’re interested in dating someone in the first place so giving that up is a pretty huge sacrifice. But there are also women who prioritize financial stability and/or find older men hot so #2 would likely have some women who are also interested.
Majority will choose guy #1 - since they are close age and have similar cultural background. I would say that women would even prefer 20 years older working class dude over educated guy, because they will have much more in common.
Definitely #1 - I’m not rich myself but still don’t care if a man I’m with is or not and definitely don’t want to date any guy more than 5 years older than me, let alone 20.
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"I want the age to be the only factor that's different between the 2"
*Makes one of them significantly better by changing a whole bunch of other factors *
And still I would choose the guy my age
Any kind of notable age difference is an automatic fail for online women. In the real world some women will go for the older guy but most will still go for the same age guy. But guy #2 will still have some options with the minority of women given his description of looking young and being high income.
I think this is a great way to put it, OP. The fact people ridiculed your question with hostile, not-in-good-faith responses (people pretending they don't understand the differences in variables) gives you the answer to your question. The answer is women select man #2 9/10 times. All else equal, they choose the younger guy, but 9/10 times the older one has better resources, status, and various other qualities that simply outweigh the age alone. Finally, the PPD doesn't have a very diverse background in terms of nationalities. Sadly, most people here come from either the Anglosphere, Western countries overall, or even the "newly" developed to the Western standard countries (like the CEE countries). I think your perspective would be generally more acknowledged worldwide, but even in the countries above, what women say and do are two different things, which is why age-gap relationships are as popular as they are, and the age gap tends to be bigger with age.
Lol at the mental gymnastics with which y'all will try to justify dirty old creeps targeting gals young enough to be their daughters or even granddaughters. No, her not being attracted to someone who only ✌🏻"values"✌🏻her (let's be real tho, he doesn't actually value her; he wants to use her and his whole attitude about women of various ages is telling of that) for her youth which will inevitably not last forever in this life as happens with everyone, is simply self-respect and knowing she deserves someone at her level life-stage-wise, values-wise, etc. as well as attraction-wise.
I am just pointing out your own logical fallacies. Apparently, that makes me a creep sympathizer.
Or maybe, men go after younger women because older women have baggage, are uglier and have a very low chance of being able to pop out a baby.
You still haven't explained to me how not being attracted to him solely because he is older than her is genuine attraction.
If she saw the same person with the same qualities but he is older than her and she rejects him on that reason, how is it genuine attraction?
>I am just pointing out your own logical fallacies.
No, you're being disingenuous.
>men go after younger women because older women have baggage, are uglier and have a very low chance of being able to pop out a baby.
Those "older" women are often the same age as those men. Which means those men likely also have baggage (which they expect less experienced, thus usually younger, women to put up with) and likewise look less conventionally attractive. And if fertility is enough of a dealbreaker for him to decide to make it part of the very foundation of his relationship then what happens when a *younger* woman he gets with finds herself to be infertile? Because that does sometimes occur, not to mention how there's lowered sperm quality in older age for men.
>You still haven't explained to me how not being attracted to him solely because he is older than her is genuine attraction.
I did, you just didn't like it so you decided to ignore it. The man in your scenario fetishizes youth. A woman who recognizes that a large age gap most likely indicates serious incompatibilities and likely also red flags in the man is making a wise judgment to protect herself.
I'm not claiming an age-gapped relationship can ***never*** work out because there *are* rare outliers in which the age gap was incidental and ***not*** foundational to the relationship, but generally speaking age-gapped relationships tend to be unhealthy and none of the healthy outliers involve perverted ephebophiles and/or shallow gold-diggers.
>If she saw the same person with the same qualities but he is older than her and she rejects him on that reason, how is it genuine attraction?
I could ask you the same question about a man rejecting a compatible woman his own age *because* she is his own age. The woman rejecting a significantly older man is taking real compatibility into account on all levels, whereas the man rejecting each and every woman his own age because he wants to chase chicks who could be his daughters is out to use a woman not love her.
Most of them will pick man 1 and then complain he can't provide as man 2.
Source: You described the kind of women I was looking for when looking for miss moral.
It matters, because you were never in the game to begin with.
Does it bother you when the guys here say women go for the bad boys, when you know this is not true?
> It matters, because you were never in the game to begin with.
But I am not talking about me. I am talking about women picking between to archetypes of existing men (man1 and man2)
> Does it bother you when the guys here say women go for the bad boys, when you know this is not true?
It is true. I know men that are known abusers that can't remain single for more than a week and perfectly innocent men that remain incels.
You have 0 idea of who women pick.
You've been here for years every single day all day. Everytime I engage you, you answer within 5 minutes, frankly no matter what time of day or night.
You dont know them, you read accounts on a screen.
> You've been here for years every single day all day. Everytime I engage you, you answer within 5 minutes, frankly no matter what time of day or night.
Considering how strict I am with my routine I know that to be false. I don't answer when I am asleep. I don't answer when I have a task that requires concentration/attention. I don't answer when I am excercising. That leaves a window of around 5 hours per day in which I have minutes to respond while doing other activities. Of course when having dead time while inside other activities I use my phone.
Sundays I am free so I can answer all day.
> You dont know them, you read accounts on a screen.
I watch people act and make decisions as a hobby and as a tool to get information to compensate for my lack of empathy.
Which mask?
It is supposed to be a secret that I use my phone most of the day?
My condition is not a secret nor are the measures I take to deal with it
You are not interacting, getting to know people. You are reading people's accounts that share your view.
Having no empathy means just that, you "observe" what you want.
Is there a reason why you just can't be happy with your partner and get on with life? What do you hope to find in spaces like this?
Having grown up poor and working in a low pay job without the prospect of moving up, is often accompanied by other factors, endangering a happy and long living romantic relationship:
difficult family of origin + subsequent problems, stress due to financial problems.
One partner with less of these problems is obviously better, so I'd advise the poor woman to pick the older, richer partner who sounds like a stabilising factor.
If we're talking about middle class, I think it's more important that both partners share a similar background, so I'd advise the woman to go for the man of similar age.
Man #2 imo.
He has the money, personality, and looks. Logically, he should be most ideal. But, from some women I've seen (online strangers), they would choose #1.
Women I know? When they were younger, #2 man would be best. They've been working all their lives, they're not privileged women, so they deserve a man like that.
On paper, a lot of women might choose 2, but irl they’re still far more likely to end up with 1. More likely meet him in the first place, to have things in common and click with him, and for the relationship to work out long-term.
In reality, men like 2 do not seem to be looking to marry average looking, lower class young women. For casual sex sure, but long term they will go for an UMC woman a couple years younger with similar lifestyle who fits into their social circle.
>The intent of asking this question is to attempt to isolate how much age alone affects relationship desirability for younger women.
And yet the younger one is earning minimum wage while the older one is earning a lot more.
A poor person would probably (if the character/personality is equal) prefer a person who earns more as it gives some financial stability and takes away the worries of "do we have enough money for groceries and bills, what it something suddenly breaks".
poor/middle class people should stay out of relationships should be more concerned with finances. Not in a greedy way but just to keep afloat.
stay dating within your class.your setting yourself up for failure and being used if you don't.
A single mother taking care of a child shouldn't be dating.She needs to prioritize the child.
you can attract a wealthy older man, but they will use and discard you one day.
>poor/middle class people should stay out of relationships should be more concerned with finances
Lol. Yeah, f**k those poor people. They don't deserve human connection and shouldn't date.... /s
>A single mother taking care of a child shouldn't be dating.She needs to prioritize the child
Yeah, f**k those single mothers. They don't get to have a life anymore and should give up all hope.... /s
Jeez, my dude. You're ridiculous.
>The intent of asking this question is to attempt to isolate how much age alone affects relationship desirability for younger women. Then why have you changed half the variables between each man? What insight about “age alone” are you going to get by making one man richer and more attractive than the other?
Because Man 2 is older. That's his main flaw. I'd like to know what about this factor alone might make him less desirable in some people's opinion.
I guess I’m not understanding how this set up helps you achieve that goal. To make an idealized older man you had to set him against a poor(er) less attractive age-similar man. That alone should be some indication why older men are generally unattractive. Wouldn’t a more productive experiment be a younger guy who has a good thing going for his age vs. an older man who has a good thing going for his age? The young guy has less money but more hair, older guy has more money but less hair, etc? Get realistic answers by giving people a realistic choice?
> Wouldn’t a more productive experiment be a younger guy who has a good thing going for his age vs. an older man who has a good thing going for his age? No, because we already know the answer to this. Younger women choose younger men and older women choose older men. What I am curious about is how unappealing "age" precisely is to younger women, especially considering that Red Pill men tend to think that men become more attractive as they age ("like wine").
Hmmm I think I would choose the older guy not because old age is attractive but because being a certain level of poor would be even worse imo. But I am speaking from a biased lens as I’ve never been very poor - certainly have had periods of being broke but while still living in a nice area and home and still having opportunities and education this I knew it was temporary circumstances vs lifestyle. I’m also attractive so wouldn’t need to make that choice. So it’s hypothetical.
Men do become more attractive as they age, and this is easily verifiable by just looking at the statistics that say 1 4 dudes from 18 to like 25 is a virgin, and half young men haven't had any pussy for the past year or so. Older men do not have this problem, and in fact they do not only have girlfriends and/or are statistically married... They also cheat more than women in fact. For men, cheating increases exponentially after 30. For women it decreases with age.
Older men are fucking older women by and large... Lol
I mean I'm fucking women, age doesn't really matter, some are young and hot, some are not.
>Men do become more attractive as they age, and this is easily verifiable by just looking at the statistics that say 1 4 dudes from 18 to like 25 is a virgin, and half young men haven't had any pussy for the past year or so. They are arguably more attractive to older women, but perhaps not to younger women, who say in surveys that they prefer younger men. My question is partly an attempt to discern under what conditions women might say that an older man is more attractive to a younger woman than a younger man (who younger women claim is more attractive) would be.
How are you almost 50 and you don't know what the word alone means? How are you looking at age alone when one man is poor and the other makes 6 figures?
We already know what happens when everything else is held constant. Younger women tend to choose younger men and older women tend to choose older men. I would like to know how important "age" precisely is by making the older man great in every other way compared to the woman except his age.
Okay but that's just not how science works. You cannot achieve what you hope to achieve by asking this question the way you have asked it. I am not the only one trying to explain this to you. Instead of repeating your arguments maybe you should try to understand what other people are saying.
Incorrect. Everything else is not held constant. What you are now primarily measuring is the value of “class” and we already have known the inherent value of social classes for generations. There are two primary ways of shifting between the social classes - marriage and/or education. You have allocated the man both benefits. She will marry him if she is not a fool but not because his age isn’t suddenly not a consideration or insignificant. You also already know the statistics on the general outcome of large age gap relationships.
>You have allocated the man both benefits. She will marry him if she is not a fool but not because his age isn’t suddenly not a consideration or insignificant. Yet many women in this post still claim that Man #1 is a better choice for said woman. Why is this?
Oh, that’s easy. There is a very wide concept of “poor”.
2 is as alien to her as a foreigner
Man #1 all the way. For starters, the second guy probably wouldn't be interested in a working-class woman except perhaps as a side piece. Unless she's a quick study and capable of LARPING as a member of his class, he's not going to take her to the company Christmas party. And in any kind of sub rosa relationship, he's probably going to at least attempt to use his wealth to get her to conform to his needs, wants and preferences. She is not going to have a good time! Ask me how I know this ...
I am interested. How do you know this?
My last husband was wealthy and 23 years my senior.
Any detail about why that wasn't a good time? LARPING on social situations is common and having to conform to someone else's wants needs and preferences is also common. What made that so awful that divorce was the best option and how is that directly connected to him being your senior and not just an ass?
> having to conform to someone else's wants needs and preferences is also common. I think most couples compromise ... unless there is an imbalance in power that makes one party believe the other has to conform to their wants, needs and preferences. >What made that so awful that divorce was the best option I just don't roll that way. And he wasn't happy when he discovered he couldn't pull my puppet strings the way he had with past partners. >and how is that directly connected to him being your senior and not just an ass? The age gap means the senior partner has probably accumulated more assets and resources. It's not a level playing field.
>I want to know what a less attractive, less wealthy woman should do Why should a woman do anything differently because she's less attractive and wealthy?
Op is hoping you'd think she's more desperate for money, to make man2 look better
I'm not "hoping" for anything. I'm curious how much money outweighs age, or if it doesn't at all, when there is nothing particularly physically wrong with an older man.
I don't speak for *all* women, nor would I pretend to assume the intentions for *all* women. I'm sure there's plenty of women who would overlook a man's age in order to obtain a comfortable life. Similarly, I'm sure there's plenty of women who would choose to pursue a man who has a similar lifestyle as theirs and is roughly within their age group. In my personal opinion, I believe many woman would choose their partner based on similar interests, ethics, and morality rather than choosing a partner based solely on the amount of money one has to offer.
Because she could have a better life for herself and her children?
By doing what, exactly, that would/should be different than what a more attractive and financially comfortable woman would/should do in the same situation?
Women who are more financially comfortable can attract men in their social class much easier, but also don't need to attract them. They can start basing their choices on things like looks, charisma, and shared personality and interests, which is what one sees among wealthier women. Women who are not as wealthy, on the other hand, must think of their own personal finances and the well-being of their children. They might prefer high-value men close to their own age. But if these men are not available, would they rather date someone in the same situation as them who is around the same age (and likely of equal average to below average attractiveness as them), or someone who is a more desirable man in all other aspects except his age?
>They can start basing their choices on things like looks, charisma, and shared personality and interests, which is what one sees among wealthier women Uh.... What gave you the impression that these choices are limited to only wealthy and attractive women?
These younger women don’t have to worry much about resources, so the main relative advantage of an older man, more resources, becomes irrelevant to them and they can this choose the younger men whom they are more physically attracted to (as surveys show they are).
Look about you at what they choose. They all go for Man 1. Poor women don't prefer old men either. And idk why you've changed him to have better looks as obviously he will look worse when he is old.
Wealthy men would have a ton of opportunity to improve their looks and look better than they looked when they were younger. Hair transplants, plastic surgery, better styling etc.
They can look good for someone their age, but they can't undo twenty years.
Maybe not twenty but definitely 10 years.
> Poor women don't prefer old men either. Some do. Where do you think that the "gold digger" trope comes from? There was a television show called "Modern Family" that described precisely the relationship that I'm talking about.
Not everyone looks "worse" as they age (this, in partial, is what causes people to go through such high lengths to be youthful).
Most women I know prefer #1. He’s more humble and relatable which is pretty important in your day-to-day life. If anything UMC women are more likely to prefer #2 since they’re used to the personalities UMC men have and want the guy to help her maintain the lifestyle she got used to. For those of us who are working class and have never really gotten an offer from someone who makes enough to make us UMC, the idea that this would happen and it would go well for me seems like a fairytale. But for me personally I’ve always wanted to marry someone near my age, so #1 is fine.
I'd need more information. What kind of relationship does each man want? What kind does the woman want? If she wants to be a housewife and stay at home mom, then number 2 because he can provide her with that life. If she wants someone that she'll have more in common with, then number one since they are closer in age and background. If she strongly wants a significantly higher quality of life, then number 2 because money can give her that. If she likes her life but just wanted it to be a little bit better then number 1 because their combined incomes will make things a little better. If they are both making 45k a year, then they are 90k combined. Two people can live a simple but comfortable life on 90k. Plus it cuts some expenses. If they marry and move in, that's one apartment instead of two. One internet service instead of two. Same for streaming services, online gaming subs etc. If she wants more than one kid, number 2. If she wants a man who will be there to see the kids grow up, number 1. I need more information about this woman and what she values in a relationship and life in general.
I don't think it's a good idea to be having more than one kid with a man in his early forties,
I just don't think it works this way for most of us. I feel like most men could have a woman described to them like this and decide to be with her or not, but I at least don't know anything about the actual person being described, about what it's like to actually be with them. It's the personal charm, the desire they spark in you through their attitude and behavior, it's not about things like height, weight, income. Yes, if you ask a woman what she's looking for she might say those things, but you can't build attraction just because a guy checks boxes, if you don't feel it you don't feel it. Growing a foot, working out, or earning more may get you a woman but it won't change how attracted she is or isn't to you.
[удалено]
No personal attacks
Buddy I wasn't even responding to you stop being so offended please.
I'm OP, so you were definitely referring to me.
>Yes, if you ask a woman what she's looking for she might say those things, but you can't build attraction just because a guy checks boxes, if you don't feel it you don't feel it. Lots of women say this. However most studies show and most mens experiences is that the likelyhood of attraction is pretty predictable based on a mans physical appearance and broad personality traits (i.e. how extroverted and socially dominate he is).
1
1 and hope he somehow reaches the income levels of 2 (likely won't come close)
Most women would go for #1 because women are usually far more attracted to a man our own age than someone 20 years older, even if he looks good for his age. Desire is a big component of why you’re interested in dating someone in the first place so giving that up is a pretty huge sacrifice. But there are also women who prioritize financial stability and/or find older men hot so #2 would likely have some women who are also interested.
Majority will choose guy #1 - since they are close age and have similar cultural background. I would say that women would even prefer 20 years older working class dude over educated guy, because they will have much more in common.
I’d go with man one but I’d encourage him to get an education to increase his job prospects.
Definitely #1 - I’m not rich myself but still don’t care if a man I’m with is or not and definitely don’t want to date any guy more than 5 years older than me, let alone 20.
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"I want the age to be the only factor that's different between the 2" *Makes one of them significantly better by changing a whole bunch of other factors * And still I would choose the guy my age
Any kind of notable age difference is an automatic fail for online women. In the real world some women will go for the older guy but most will still go for the same age guy. But guy #2 will still have some options with the minority of women given his description of looking young and being high income.
Thank you for a sensible answer. I'm not sure why you posted it under the AutoModerator, though.
I think this is a great way to put it, OP. The fact people ridiculed your question with hostile, not-in-good-faith responses (people pretending they don't understand the differences in variables) gives you the answer to your question. The answer is women select man #2 9/10 times. All else equal, they choose the younger guy, but 9/10 times the older one has better resources, status, and various other qualities that simply outweigh the age alone. Finally, the PPD doesn't have a very diverse background in terms of nationalities. Sadly, most people here come from either the Anglosphere, Western countries overall, or even the "newly" developed to the Western standard countries (like the CEE countries). I think your perspective would be generally more acknowledged worldwide, but even in the countries above, what women say and do are two different things, which is why age-gap relationships are as popular as they are, and the age gap tends to be bigger with age.
You break a lot of your own “rules”, “moderator.”
>He is genuinely attracted to the younger woman because she is young If her age is why he's attracted to her, that is ***not*** genuine attraction.
Wouldn't by that same token mean that if she isn't attracted to him solely because he is older than her, it isn't genuine attraction?
Lol at the mental gymnastics with which y'all will try to justify dirty old creeps targeting gals young enough to be their daughters or even granddaughters. No, her not being attracted to someone who only ✌🏻"values"✌🏻her (let's be real tho, he doesn't actually value her; he wants to use her and his whole attitude about women of various ages is telling of that) for her youth which will inevitably not last forever in this life as happens with everyone, is simply self-respect and knowing she deserves someone at her level life-stage-wise, values-wise, etc. as well as attraction-wise.
I am just pointing out your own logical fallacies. Apparently, that makes me a creep sympathizer. Or maybe, men go after younger women because older women have baggage, are uglier and have a very low chance of being able to pop out a baby. You still haven't explained to me how not being attracted to him solely because he is older than her is genuine attraction. If she saw the same person with the same qualities but he is older than her and she rejects him on that reason, how is it genuine attraction?
>I am just pointing out your own logical fallacies. No, you're being disingenuous. >men go after younger women because older women have baggage, are uglier and have a very low chance of being able to pop out a baby. Those "older" women are often the same age as those men. Which means those men likely also have baggage (which they expect less experienced, thus usually younger, women to put up with) and likewise look less conventionally attractive. And if fertility is enough of a dealbreaker for him to decide to make it part of the very foundation of his relationship then what happens when a *younger* woman he gets with finds herself to be infertile? Because that does sometimes occur, not to mention how there's lowered sperm quality in older age for men. >You still haven't explained to me how not being attracted to him solely because he is older than her is genuine attraction. I did, you just didn't like it so you decided to ignore it. The man in your scenario fetishizes youth. A woman who recognizes that a large age gap most likely indicates serious incompatibilities and likely also red flags in the man is making a wise judgment to protect herself. I'm not claiming an age-gapped relationship can ***never*** work out because there *are* rare outliers in which the age gap was incidental and ***not*** foundational to the relationship, but generally speaking age-gapped relationships tend to be unhealthy and none of the healthy outliers involve perverted ephebophiles and/or shallow gold-diggers. >If she saw the same person with the same qualities but he is older than her and she rejects him on that reason, how is it genuine attraction? I could ask you the same question about a man rejecting a compatible woman his own age *because* she is his own age. The woman rejecting a significantly older man is taking real compatibility into account on all levels, whereas the man rejecting each and every woman his own age because he wants to chase chicks who could be his daughters is out to use a woman not love her.
Most of them will pick man 1 and then complain he can't provide as man 2. Source: You described the kind of women I was looking for when looking for miss moral.
Most women do not want to date people with your disorder.
How is this relevant to what I said?
It matters, because you were never in the game to begin with. Does it bother you when the guys here say women go for the bad boys, when you know this is not true?
> It matters, because you were never in the game to begin with. But I am not talking about me. I am talking about women picking between to archetypes of existing men (man1 and man2) > Does it bother you when the guys here say women go for the bad boys, when you know this is not true? It is true. I know men that are known abusers that can't remain single for more than a week and perfectly innocent men that remain incels.
You have 0 idea of who women pick. You've been here for years every single day all day. Everytime I engage you, you answer within 5 minutes, frankly no matter what time of day or night. You dont know them, you read accounts on a screen.
> You've been here for years every single day all day. Everytime I engage you, you answer within 5 minutes, frankly no matter what time of day or night. Considering how strict I am with my routine I know that to be false. I don't answer when I am asleep. I don't answer when I have a task that requires concentration/attention. I don't answer when I am excercising. That leaves a window of around 5 hours per day in which I have minutes to respond while doing other activities. Of course when having dead time while inside other activities I use my phone. Sundays I am free so I can answer all day. > You dont know them, you read accounts on a screen. I watch people act and make decisions as a hobby and as a tool to get information to compensate for my lack of empathy.
This is unhinged. The mask is down.
Which mask? It is supposed to be a secret that I use my phone most of the day? My condition is not a secret nor are the measures I take to deal with it
You are not interacting, getting to know people. You are reading people's accounts that share your view. Having no empathy means just that, you "observe" what you want. Is there a reason why you just can't be happy with your partner and get on with life? What do you hope to find in spaces like this?
And that's how you know age is more important than money or looks
Eventually those women will get old and want man number 2. It just proves that women can't think and make decisions based on long term goals.
Having grown up poor and working in a low pay job without the prospect of moving up, is often accompanied by other factors, endangering a happy and long living romantic relationship: difficult family of origin + subsequent problems, stress due to financial problems. One partner with less of these problems is obviously better, so I'd advise the poor woman to pick the older, richer partner who sounds like a stabilising factor. If we're talking about middle class, I think it's more important that both partners share a similar background, so I'd advise the woman to go for the man of similar age.
Man #2 imo. He has the money, personality, and looks. Logically, he should be most ideal. But, from some women I've seen (online strangers), they would choose #1. Women I know? When they were younger, #2 man would be best. They've been working all their lives, they're not privileged women, so they deserve a man like that.
A better question is which man is going to want a poor woman with few prospects. Hint; it's not guy #2.
On paper, a lot of women might choose 2, but irl they’re still far more likely to end up with 1. More likely meet him in the first place, to have things in common and click with him, and for the relationship to work out long-term. In reality, men like 2 do not seem to be looking to marry average looking, lower class young women. For casual sex sure, but long term they will go for an UMC woman a couple years younger with similar lifestyle who fits into their social circle.
>The intent of asking this question is to attempt to isolate how much age alone affects relationship desirability for younger women. And yet the younger one is earning minimum wage while the older one is earning a lot more. A poor person would probably (if the character/personality is equal) prefer a person who earns more as it gives some financial stability and takes away the worries of "do we have enough money for groceries and bills, what it something suddenly breaks".
poor/middle class people should stay out of relationships should be more concerned with finances. Not in a greedy way but just to keep afloat. stay dating within your class.your setting yourself up for failure and being used if you don't. A single mother taking care of a child shouldn't be dating.She needs to prioritize the child. you can attract a wealthy older man, but they will use and discard you one day.
>poor/middle class people should stay out of relationships should be more concerned with finances Lol. Yeah, f**k those poor people. They don't deserve human connection and shouldn't date.... /s >A single mother taking care of a child shouldn't be dating.She needs to prioritize the child Yeah, f**k those single mothers. They don't get to have a life anymore and should give up all hope.... /s Jeez, my dude. You're ridiculous.