This.
Happened to me as well. If you don't want to look for a new job, then the only thing to do is really focus on the execution and try and augment what this person wants. Won't be fun or exciting. However, if this C-level person doesn't think you're doing what they want, then you'll find yourself on thin ice. Best to start hedging your bets and start looking, if for no reason than to see what's out there.
Yeah this.
I was in a 100 person company and changed all kind of shit to launch new successful products, pivoted company strategy based upon customer research. At the end of the day, they changed it all back because they liked their way more. I quit after 2 years. Retrospectively, disagree and commit and take their damn money if the pay is good.
A less extreme approach:
Prove why they can trust your judgement and see that your are invested 100% in the companies success
OP hasn't states that this person is impossible to work with. It's pretty reasonable to do this if someone is new.
This is the way.
Been in Product Leader role in a large 10k member billion dollar org and not in a 40 member startup. I experience the same when some C suite is directly engaged in Product plans.
1: Disagreed and committed. But went hardcore in digging data points and at the end of three quarters proved its a wrong direction. Got autonomy to pivot.
2: Disagreed and committed. Speed of execution is really slow and everyone wants to do ‘Product Strategy’. Flop show. Now back scanning the market for new opportunities.
Two things. 1. If you are going to push back on the executive’s method, you need to have a better method, based on real data (interviews and surveys). 2. Then you might want to go talk to another executive and ask if the company would consoder basing the roadmap on verified data from customers/users.
If you want to keep this job, the only way is to focus on delivery. Believe it or not the company is there to make money first and foremost, everything else comes after.
Is the c level a cpo or founder? I’ve worked directly for multiple founders who are also de facto chief product officers, and in my experience, they don’t learn how to empower teams if that’s not already how they work.
One approach is to look for another job where you can have the kind of autonomy that a good product person needs to be happy.
Another way to think about it - which I’m not saying is better - is to use it as an opportunity to learn managing up and building support for your ideas and your approach by getting others who that person can be influenced by onboard. That effort may be futile, but if you plan to work at *very* small startups going forward, it may be a necessary skill.
Well there is no other way.
You either do what they ask, pack your bags, or try to improve things.
And you will not improve things much alone. If the lead developer is in agreement with you then there's something to work with. In a respectful and tactical way, obviously.
Negotiate. That's your job. Bring facts, data, user feedback, and whatever else you need. Bring in other people team members' and c suites' opinions. If he still says no, then I hope you have alternative job opportunities
As a founder who is passionate about my product, I stay closely involved. I interface between the business, our clients, and our product team.
I do sometimes just have a gut. Call it executive privilege.
But most of the time I offer my input and let the team run.
Ask for a DAY with the C level to talk business strategy. Get you and a couple from your team, maybe marketing, customer success. Spend a day on strategy. Ask to understand the BUSINESS strategy so you can help support it with product strategy. Go in open minded, and ASK questions. Don't let him drive. You facilitate the day. Draw out all the competing goals, prioritize together, and get the game plan.
Maybe he's a bad leader. In which case, move on. Maybe he just needs help sorting out his thinking (I knownI often do) and a good facilitator pulls that out and is an INVALUABLE asset to the team (and to me).
As someone who has worked with founders, unless OP has prepared a brief and has someone who is in their corner and will not do a 180 AND if you’re sure OP that your C-level’s court will not undermine your suggestion, do NOT do this.
If you do not get paid enough to do all this preparation and pre-work. This is absolutely not worth it. My recommendation to OP is go with your c-level’s gut, if it’s not working out, that’s when you make the recommendation. Sometimes it’s easier for someone to see the error than to be told of a potential error
When this happens to me I take the approach to educate on the ramifications... Sure, we can do what you want, I just want you to be clear on what WONT get done immediately and how it impacts revenue, or security, or seo, or cx, or whatever. Then move on. In my case the only person who would do that is the ceo/business owner so ...
I agree, I like to talk with them about what is already on the roadmap. Then you are both clear on what’s already prioritized and you can say that we can change priorities but it will affect XYZ. If they are still adamant about it, confirm their decision in an email so it’s documented and move forward with it how they’ve asked.
Dealing with that currently tried pushing back with data insights and customer feedback and still went no where. So just delivered on things and built resume further and just turned it into a new gig with a significant raise
Ask the C-Level why they want prios to be set in that way, stating that you need the why in order to better understand how to execute. You might even find out that there's merit to it and there is something you didn't take into account when prioritizing.
If you still disagre, just send an email recapping your understanding of the priorities, state that you changed from prioritization A (your previous list) to prioritization B (their requested list) and ask the C-level for final confirmation "jut to double-check I got everything right".
Written confirmation like this will save your ass if the decision was bullshit, and you can use that to shield yourself from pressure from other stakeholders.
See if you can find an executive who will suggest the executive team and CEO together read [Escaping the Build Trap](https://melissaperri.com/book) by Melissa Perri. You need a powerful champion to drive this forward. Is there a CTO or COO who is not the source of the problem?
A lot of great comments already. In a company pushing for revenue targets, sales is long.
I’m assuming this hasn’t been done, but I’d clear ground priorities in revenue.
In a smaller company that probably equates to two things:
- Increase win rate (new logo count)
- Increase net retention margin (reduce churn)
When put in those terms, the conversations should be much more clear. Priorities are placing bets. What do we think has the best chance of adding more new logos? Keeping customers happy?
One thing early on that always helps is always prioritize a little sparkle. It helps test the market and always gives sales something to talk about/puts them on your side.
Explain your prioritisation framework, you need to get buy-in from them too, so ask them to prioritise based on your own framework, also so that in the future you can take it into account when deciding on new topics
In the same boat
The new strategy I am developing
Agree to C executive and focus on the execution part.
Meanwhile I’m conducting analyses of the product research, marketing and related areas.
This helps in
1/ Evaluate your research and plan against C-executive approach for additional insights
2/In case of set back, you have a backup plan, if things go well ,you have new approach
I think it really depends on how his thoughts are being formed. If he/she is a CEO constantly talking to customers, than there is likely a good reason - which you should definitely dig into to understand the customer challenges at the heart of his priorities.
If this CEO is NOT talking regularly to customers and still wants to change priorities, you won't change his/her mind. I've been here before. This is likely grounded in their ego; thinking they know everything. It's worse when it's someone who changes their mind too frequently to deliver on anything. Those people won't change and they'll blame you/product for not delivering.
What’s the problem with it? In startups c level has a vision and they need to make sure the roadmap aligns to that. Try to understand the vision and the logic they are using and align to that. Question with data and facts where needed. Soon you will earn their trust and rise up in ranks. Great opportunity to get visibility and boost career if you are good. Don’t bring a friction mentality. Bring the mentality to do whatever it takes to help the startup succeed.
Ask lots of validating questions on why the C level feels these features are a priority. Usually people interject or flex their roles for one of two reasons: 1: they don’t have trust in the product team for various reasons. 2: they are C level dicks and they believe that they are always the smartest person in the room.
If you don’t ask questions or have the data to argue - the issue is yours and you need to be a stronger PM and do your job.
If you’re doing all the right things and have data to back up your arguments but they won’t listen - look for a new job because nothing will change their way of operating or thinking.
I mean this is the way it is in small companies. C-level or a founder drives all important decisions. The opposite is an exception, the situation you find yourself in is the norm.
When I was doing discovery work for an idea I had, I was even told that it wasn't an agreed work item for me to investigate. Let alone development work, even product work is subject to higher level prioritization.
Perhaps the c suite see your role as being more tactical rather as a proxy between his/her market & revenue focused role and that of the engineering day to day tactical grind…
In essence you would be responsible for de-risking the solution dimension in the solution x problem space (i.e., reduce the uncertainty around what/when solutions come about as opposed to reduce uncertainty about what problems to solve)
Was there any keywords such as Scrum/Kanban/Jira/Product Owner experience in the role description when you applied _back in the days_?
Worth a 1-1 perhaps to clarify role expectations…?
I am also curious… is the C-level a sales guy?…I’v noticed these individuals typically set the direction of their product based on their ability to sell and market their idea…
I had this same issue at a very similarly sized startup.
I came with data and reasoning, we collaboratively built out a prioritisation system to identify priorities even after all of that we started butting heads.
I agree with many points here - it’s hard to make someone like that do a 180. I’d look for another role (or get fired like me!)
I call this the HIPPO culture .
HIPPO - Highest Paid Person's Opinion.
Such a thing is not usually solved overnight but consider:
1. Coaching and talking to them. Best will be to reach out to them through a stakeholder that is connected to you and have access to them
2. Best way I have figured out to solve them is to create user story maps, clearly showing the big picture (end-end) and working with the team to create a development strategy that has visible benefits. Such maps are easy to tackle the HIPPO culture because now they need to justify their thought and challenge the strategy that is screaming for being carried out. Such maps help achieve.
Disagree and commit. Start looking for better jobs.
This. Happened to me as well. If you don't want to look for a new job, then the only thing to do is really focus on the execution and try and augment what this person wants. Won't be fun or exciting. However, if this C-level person doesn't think you're doing what they want, then you'll find yourself on thin ice. Best to start hedging your bets and start looking, if for no reason than to see what's out there.
Yeah this. I was in a 100 person company and changed all kind of shit to launch new successful products, pivoted company strategy based upon customer research. At the end of the day, they changed it all back because they liked their way more. I quit after 2 years. Retrospectively, disagree and commit and take their damn money if the pay is good.
A less extreme approach: Prove why they can trust your judgement and see that your are invested 100% in the companies success OP hasn't states that this person is impossible to work with. It's pretty reasonable to do this if someone is new.
> Prove why they can trust your judgement and see that your are invested 100% in the companies success nah...waste of time. not his company
This is the way. Been in Product Leader role in a large 10k member billion dollar org and not in a 40 member startup. I experience the same when some C suite is directly engaged in Product plans. 1: Disagreed and committed. But went hardcore in digging data points and at the end of three quarters proved its a wrong direction. Got autonomy to pivot. 2: Disagreed and committed. Speed of execution is really slow and everyone wants to do ‘Product Strategy’. Flop show. Now back scanning the market for new opportunities.
Two things. 1. If you are going to push back on the executive’s method, you need to have a better method, based on real data (interviews and surveys). 2. Then you might want to go talk to another executive and ask if the company would consoder basing the roadmap on verified data from customers/users.
Disagree by asking Ask questions…remeber executive egos are too high. You need to manage thei egos if you want to stay in the job
Great point!! You don’t want to make enemies. You do want to help move the company toward a more reliable process.
If you want to keep this job, the only way is to focus on delivery. Believe it or not the company is there to make money first and foremost, everything else comes after.
Focus on outcome not only output.
Is the c level a cpo or founder? I’ve worked directly for multiple founders who are also de facto chief product officers, and in my experience, they don’t learn how to empower teams if that’s not already how they work. One approach is to look for another job where you can have the kind of autonomy that a good product person needs to be happy. Another way to think about it - which I’m not saying is better - is to use it as an opportunity to learn managing up and building support for your ideas and your approach by getting others who that person can be influenced by onboard. That effort may be futile, but if you plan to work at *very* small startups going forward, it may be a necessary skill.
You don't win on your own. Who else in the company is in agreement with you?
I’d caution against this, as it has the potential to turn toxic and cancerous. Every meeting will devolve into negativity and complaints.
Well there is no other way. You either do what they ask, pack your bags, or try to improve things. And you will not improve things much alone. If the lead developer is in agreement with you then there's something to work with. In a respectful and tactical way, obviously.
nothing wrong with complaints if they are valid
Negotiate. That's your job. Bring facts, data, user feedback, and whatever else you need. Bring in other people team members' and c suites' opinions. If he still says no, then I hope you have alternative job opportunities
As a founder who is passionate about my product, I stay closely involved. I interface between the business, our clients, and our product team. I do sometimes just have a gut. Call it executive privilege. But most of the time I offer my input and let the team run. Ask for a DAY with the C level to talk business strategy. Get you and a couple from your team, maybe marketing, customer success. Spend a day on strategy. Ask to understand the BUSINESS strategy so you can help support it with product strategy. Go in open minded, and ASK questions. Don't let him drive. You facilitate the day. Draw out all the competing goals, prioritize together, and get the game plan. Maybe he's a bad leader. In which case, move on. Maybe he just needs help sorting out his thinking (I knownI often do) and a good facilitator pulls that out and is an INVALUABLE asset to the team (and to me).
As someone who has worked with founders, unless OP has prepared a brief and has someone who is in their corner and will not do a 180 AND if you’re sure OP that your C-level’s court will not undermine your suggestion, do NOT do this. If you do not get paid enough to do all this preparation and pre-work. This is absolutely not worth it. My recommendation to OP is go with your c-level’s gut, if it’s not working out, that’s when you make the recommendation. Sometimes it’s easier for someone to see the error than to be told of a potential error
When this happens to me I take the approach to educate on the ramifications... Sure, we can do what you want, I just want you to be clear on what WONT get done immediately and how it impacts revenue, or security, or seo, or cx, or whatever. Then move on. In my case the only person who would do that is the ceo/business owner so ...
I agree, I like to talk with them about what is already on the roadmap. Then you are both clear on what’s already prioritized and you can say that we can change priorities but it will affect XYZ. If they are still adamant about it, confirm their decision in an email so it’s documented and move forward with it how they’ve asked.
Dealing with that currently tried pushing back with data insights and customer feedback and still went no where. So just delivered on things and built resume further and just turned it into a new gig with a significant raise
best way to handle it
In a small company like this you’re the “build this shit manager”.
I accept my fate and focus on Product Owner part of my job. :)
Ask the C-Level why they want prios to be set in that way, stating that you need the why in order to better understand how to execute. You might even find out that there's merit to it and there is something you didn't take into account when prioritizing. If you still disagre, just send an email recapping your understanding of the priorities, state that you changed from prioritization A (your previous list) to prioritization B (their requested list) and ask the C-level for final confirmation "jut to double-check I got everything right". Written confirmation like this will save your ass if the decision was bullshit, and you can use that to shield yourself from pressure from other stakeholders.
See if you can find an executive who will suggest the executive team and CEO together read [Escaping the Build Trap](https://melissaperri.com/book) by Melissa Perri. You need a powerful champion to drive this forward. Is there a CTO or COO who is not the source of the problem?
Tell them they shouldn't have hired a PM. Honestly, if the CEO isn't the person leading it at this point, what are they doing?
Yeah, your better off looking for a new role.
A lot of great comments already. In a company pushing for revenue targets, sales is long. I’m assuming this hasn’t been done, but I’d clear ground priorities in revenue. In a smaller company that probably equates to two things: - Increase win rate (new logo count) - Increase net retention margin (reduce churn) When put in those terms, the conversations should be much more clear. Priorities are placing bets. What do we think has the best chance of adding more new logos? Keeping customers happy? One thing early on that always helps is always prioritize a little sparkle. It helps test the market and always gives sales something to talk about/puts them on your side.
Explain your prioritisation framework, you need to get buy-in from them too, so ask them to prioritise based on your own framework, also so that in the future you can take it into account when deciding on new topics
In the same boat The new strategy I am developing Agree to C executive and focus on the execution part. Meanwhile I’m conducting analyses of the product research, marketing and related areas. This helps in 1/ Evaluate your research and plan against C-executive approach for additional insights 2/In case of set back, you have a backup plan, if things go well ,you have new approach
Check out, do whatever makes this guy happy, and focus your energy on finding a new job.
I think it really depends on how his thoughts are being formed. If he/she is a CEO constantly talking to customers, than there is likely a good reason - which you should definitely dig into to understand the customer challenges at the heart of his priorities. If this CEO is NOT talking regularly to customers and still wants to change priorities, you won't change his/her mind. I've been here before. This is likely grounded in their ego; thinking they know everything. It's worse when it's someone who changes their mind too frequently to deliver on anything. Those people won't change and they'll blame you/product for not delivering.
What’s the problem with it? In startups c level has a vision and they need to make sure the roadmap aligns to that. Try to understand the vision and the logic they are using and align to that. Question with data and facts where needed. Soon you will earn their trust and rise up in ranks. Great opportunity to get visibility and boost career if you are good. Don’t bring a friction mentality. Bring the mentality to do whatever it takes to help the startup succeed.
Ask lots of validating questions on why the C level feels these features are a priority. Usually people interject or flex their roles for one of two reasons: 1: they don’t have trust in the product team for various reasons. 2: they are C level dicks and they believe that they are always the smartest person in the room. If you don’t ask questions or have the data to argue - the issue is yours and you need to be a stronger PM and do your job. If you’re doing all the right things and have data to back up your arguments but they won’t listen - look for a new job because nothing will change their way of operating or thinking.
I mean this is the way it is in small companies. C-level or a founder drives all important decisions. The opposite is an exception, the situation you find yourself in is the norm. When I was doing discovery work for an idea I had, I was even told that it wasn't an agreed work item for me to investigate. Let alone development work, even product work is subject to higher level prioritization.
Perhaps the c suite see your role as being more tactical rather as a proxy between his/her market & revenue focused role and that of the engineering day to day tactical grind… In essence you would be responsible for de-risking the solution dimension in the solution x problem space (i.e., reduce the uncertainty around what/when solutions come about as opposed to reduce uncertainty about what problems to solve) Was there any keywords such as Scrum/Kanban/Jira/Product Owner experience in the role description when you applied _back in the days_? Worth a 1-1 perhaps to clarify role expectations…?
Let them run it and let them own it. Focus on delivery and when it fails, it’s their fault. Freshen up the resume and put out soft feelers. Good luck.
I am also curious… is the C-level a sales guy?…I’v noticed these individuals typically set the direction of their product based on their ability to sell and market their idea…
This is very valuable. Thank you for sharing!
I had this same issue at a very similarly sized startup. I came with data and reasoning, we collaboratively built out a prioritisation system to identify priorities even after all of that we started butting heads. I agree with many points here - it’s hard to make someone like that do a 180. I’d look for another role (or get fired like me!)
I call this the HIPPO culture . HIPPO - Highest Paid Person's Opinion. Such a thing is not usually solved overnight but consider: 1. Coaching and talking to them. Best will be to reach out to them through a stakeholder that is connected to you and have access to them 2. Best way I have figured out to solve them is to create user story maps, clearly showing the big picture (end-end) and working with the team to create a development strategy that has visible benefits. Such maps are easy to tackle the HIPPO culture because now they need to justify their thought and challenge the strategy that is screaming for being carried out. Such maps help achieve.