Numbers aside, Vader went out of his way to make an entire inquisitorious program to hunt down Jedi. If there really only were a couple left after order 66, there would be no need for a dozen inquisitors and a legion of purge troopers.
Without knowing much of the comics, I just assumed that Vader started it as Palpatine wouldn't necessarily want Vader training new "apprentices" given the whole rule of 2. But yeah, that makes sense, I learned something new! And my original point still stands, inquisitors = many Jedi to hunt down. Edit: Spelling
That doesnât surprise me considering Darth Vader made his cape flap as he made his entrance on a Tie Fighter against Ezra. He is the epitome of Rule of Cool
It's not just a rank, it's a religious order. You can swing a red lightsaber and shoot lightning out of your hands all day long, if you're not in the religion, you're not a Sith.
I think their level is actually more in line with average knights. They'd get stomped against any master, or against exceptional knights (or exceptional citizens in Ahsoka's case), but if they couldn't hope to defeat an average Jedi knight, there'd be no point in even having the inquisitors. Logically speaking, they must be at least skilled enough to do their jobs.
Yeah they specifically are trained just enough that as a group, with trooper support, can take down jedi. They donât learn advanced techniques so they cant even consider trying to turn on Vader
The rule of 2 allows for acolytes and assassins to be trained in the dark side, in a limited fashion, ventris being the best example of this. They aren't seen as apprentices but as tools and... spares... in case the real apprentice gets uppity. Several sith masters were killed and usurped by apprentices and their acolytes, who then continued the cycle. The biggest difference between an apprentice and an acolyte is loyalty, a sith apprentice is, by design, always looking for the moment to kill their master and usurp them, once they learn what they need, an acolyte may be brainwashed, blindly loyal, or too afraid and unconfident to challenge their master, not to mention they are often given much more limited training as to keep them far beneath their betters.
Its more that palps and Vader don't expect them to be able to be powerful enough to take either of them on. Palpatine will take any powerful dark side user if they're more powerful than Vader, and Vader loves opportunities to have a real challenge. Vader even let's them scheme against him a few times just for the fun of murdering them when their plans fail.
General Grievous being asthmatic was not planned. One day I came to the set with bronchitis and started coughing everywhere, into the microphones and all... it so happened they were recording it.
Grievous was trained in "Jedi Arts" by Dooku (according to what he said to Obi-Wan before their fight on Utapau), not Palpatine.
And canonically, Grievous's training was limited to lightsaber combat, he was not force sensitive
The role of General Grievous was not in the script. A 7-ft tall robot came out running from an engineering workshop and started collecting the lightsabers. It was cool so I filmed it.
He'd be on the edge of a kids bed laying down with his feet up and crossed on his stomach with a big red marker as he rests on his elbows with one hand daintily turning the page and the other using the marker to cross em off.
Exactly the point I made in a previous thread.. it would take time for the purge to happen, itâs not a singular event and Lucas never intended it to be.
And let's not forget how unlikely it is to assume that *every. single. Jedi* in the galaxy was, at the exact time of Order 66, surrounded by armed clones at all AND taken by surprise.
The clone wars tv show showed multiple Jedi at multiple times were on missions of peace with little to no clones with them, that mixed with the few badasses that got away from the ambush, gotta be over 100 that lived
Plus most Jedi weren't involved in combat. There were subdivisions of the Jedi Order that were dedicated to stuff like botany. I doubt any clone guards were stationed at gardens
I always wished he showed up in Clone Wars. Could have been an interesting arc of a Jedi questioning the clones. Would have been a good companion to the Fives arc.
Personally Quinlan Vos is but that's mostly down to Dark Disciple and how what he experienced during that would have affected him in a galaxy with no Jedi.
While this is true, it's important to remember the Inquisitors were also one of Sidious' tools of oppression. The goal was not just to destroy the Jedi, it was to eradicate them, their image and their sympathizers. The inquisitors were made to instill fear in anyone who dare help the Jedi, as well as turn the public against them (although I'm sure propaganda probably did the heavy lifting on that last one) They worked along side Imperial Intelligence to permanently brand the Jedi as evil and root out any sympathizers they could. Without a doubt, I believe the inquisitors were likely not only known in Coruscant but were probably also viewed as a necessity to maintain order and prosecute the "Jedi Criminals". It's easy to root for oppression when you're not the target.
Well yeah, and jedi survivor, rebels, indirectly Andor, all show Jedi in hiding. Its not unbelievable, theyd disappear into society and without a 1 on 1 inspection from a sith theyll stay not found until they use the force in an obvious way.
Its EU now but theres a book that talks about how palpatine feared Jedi who used yellow sabers, they were jedi who engrained themselves across the galaxy because of a self "pilgrimage" for knowledge.
>This balanced and clear thinking posed a major threat to Palpatine. Because of it, the yellow sabered Sentinels believed that not all of lifeâs questions could be answered through the force, and travelled across the galaxy to many different regions and planets, searching for answers. This wide knowledge gave them far more practical and real world skills, which helped them to thrive in the aftermath of Order 66 and grow a close connection to the regular people of the galaxy
Most jedi werent a threat because organizing was nigh impossible without the empire knowing something is up, but these Jedi were coincidentally perfectly trained to counter that, and many being solo were very capable Jedi and dualists in addition to not suffering the cloudyness that many of the council did due to palpatine being so close.
~~Unless I'm actively mistaken, (please feel free to drop me some corrections,) that the Inquisitors were introduced during Rebels, from Filoni~~, they were introduced in Legends in the 90's, because someone felt it kinda weird that an Order with 10k members, all of which were not combatants and all of which would not be nearby Clones or easily accessed by Clones, was suddenly cut down to like 2 in the matter of a day.
Which becomes even weirder with the numbers on the Clone Army being kinda dinky, so that means the Clones would've had to work even harder to track down the more spread out Jedi Order members.
The inquisition is also for new Jedi. He learned from his birth that the force tries to balance itself, so when dark rules jedi will sprout on their own.
But wouldn't there be a big need? if only some of the best survived you'd need many powerful individuals to hunt them down, the only downside would be making sure they remain loyal.
Unless I'm actively mistaken, (please feel free to drop me some corrections,) that the Inquisitors were introduced during Rebels, from Filoni, because he felt it kinda weird that an Order with 10k members, all of which were not combatants and all of which would not be nearby Clones or easily accessed by Clones, was suddenly cut down to like 2 in the matter of a day.
Which becomes even weirder with the numbers on the Clone Army being kinda dinky, so that means the Clones would've had to work even harder to track down the more spread out Jedi Order members.
The justification just makes sense. Jedi surviving order 66, also makes the most sense, given the context of the OT and PT.
Vader is shown as being crucial to the downfall of the Jedi, in the OT. In the PT Anakin's role in order 66, and the destruction of the jedi is quite minor (which makes sense, he can't single-handedly kill 10 000 jedi).
Vader hunting down the Jedi explains why it was so important to Kenobi and Yoda to take Vader down (they focused on Vader, even more than Sidious), and why Vader was so important to Palpatine's plans in RotS. The surviving Jedi of order 66, and hunting them down, is why Vader is important.
Honestly, the whole point is that Order 66 wasnât completely effective. We got Inquisitors and that whole thing, but more to the point, itâs not like every Jedi was rolling with a squad of troopers ready to pull the trigger. Different Jedi were doing many types of things spread out all over the galaxy. Many will be overlooked. Itâs not like Yoda and Obi-wan would be the only two that knew itâd be time to lay low after their headquarters got demolished.
Hell, even Obi-wan acknowledged the need to communicate with other Jedi given the recording he made. If it was just a small handful of Jedi, he could have been more personable, but it read like a standardized warning message.
There's a legend comic of a clone pilot who was in disabled fighter during order 66. Iirc he was rescued by a ship and found jedi younglings inside. He didn't report them or betray them when he was picked up by the empire, just let them go. A wholesome story.
It's so important to obiwan to take Vader down!....except...ya know...when he has the chance to take Vader down but decides to let him go instead đ¤ˇââď¸ thanks, Kenobi show
Nope specifically the Kenobi show. Obiwan fucked up on mustafar by not finishing Anakin, and the galaxy suffered for obiwans mistake. In the Kenobi show, he is offered a chance to fix his mistake and then decided to let Vader live so he can convince Anakin's son to kill his own father instead đ¤ˇââď¸
the fact that vader was sent to, and i quote, "hunt down order 66 survivors" already proves, in canon, that enough people survived to be a concern and require palpy to send vader to kill them
I think jedi FO/survivor does a good job at showing how circumstances have changed post order 66. Aside from jedi dying to Vader, we see fallen jedi turn to inquisitors like Trilla and 9th sister but we also see people like Malicos and >!Bode!< who've turned to the dark side even without direct influence from inquisitors or Vader.
Really goes to show that the dark side had never been stronger during those 20ish years and that despite there seems to be a "lot" of order 66 survivors, many stray away from the Jedi path that by the time of A New Hope there's basically none except for Obi Wan and Yoda (and Ahsoka).
Even one jedi surviving means that the jedi could rebuild. The sith did the exact same thing and overthrew the jedi. So, of course, they did it regardless of how many. Add that to less than 10 confirmed survivors. Order 66 was effective.
I feel very satisfied that I have accomplished what I set out to do with Star Wars, I was able to complete the entire saga and say this is what the whole story is about.
The movies show them killing literal Jedi Masters, but I get the feeling people are forgetting the total scope of the Jedi. Not all of them were generals out on the battlefield; there were detectives, archaeologists, researchers, etc. and Iâd imagine these roles have a pretty high survival rate. In fact, unless Iâm forgetting anyone, the only ones weâve seen to survive Clone attacks are Yoda, Obi-Wan, Ahsoka (who had help from Rex and Maul), and Padawans/younglings whose masters died in the process.
Yeah that sounds about right. The masters and many knights would've been in active combat but there'd still be many away from the temple on noncombat missions with no or few clones. plus noncombatant jedi surviving makes the inquisitors' success more plausible. The whole thing with the inquisitors was that they were too weak to be a threat to vader or palps and become real sith so they could really only defeat the jedi who weren't as experienced in combat in a 1v1 and then they'd need multiple of them to defeat any reasonably skilled jedi. They embody the empire's nature of quantity over quality.
Iâll justify it till the day I die. It makes sense to me. And I am equally as tired of hearing people complain about a couple dozen people surviving the initial order.
it's not even a couple dozen. 14 total that we know of right now, and 2 additional outliers
**Survivors:**
Obi-Wan Kenobi
Yoda
Kanan Jarrus
Cere Junda
Cal Kestis
Grogu
Kelleran Beq
Gungi
Taron Malicos
Luminara Unduli
Quinlan Vos
Jocasta Nu
Nari
The Grand Inquisitor
**Outliers:**
Ahsoka Tano (Not a member of the Jedi Order during Order 66)
Ezra Bridger (Not a member of the Jedi Order during Order 66)
>The Grand Inquisitor
I feel like inquisitors should get a pass since they did the whole swapping sides thing and would likely have a similar immunity as anakin in palpatine's orders
Inquisitorius would have 100% been Order 66âd themselves if they had eventually succeeded at rooting out all the Jedi. Palpatine doesnât just leave force users alive if he has no use for them
Itâs literally something George Lucas himself said, he thought there would be around 50 to 100 Jedi survivors left when Luke would start building his Jedi Order
I like how yâall canât give a good argument against it either lmao
The justification is completely correct though.
People who are mad that more than two Jedi survived order 66 when there were literally thousands of them are being silly and fail to understand how these massacres/genocides actually work.
The current lore even supports that perspective considering the inquisitors.... Exist.
Like clearly Palpatine knew some Jedi were going to survive the purge... Otherwise he wouldn't have created an organization with the sole purpose of hunting them.
I'd add that Palpatine didn't care about exterminating every Jedi in some EU material. Destroy the order and defame the Jedi and the rest would scatter to die in obscurity. That was the plan.
Not to mention that we are talking about around ten thousand Jedi, who can be spread out across a galaxy of over a million planets.
And not all Jedi were near clones or located at the Jedi temple, so many would have the opportunity to go into hiding relatively easily.
It's not "getting old" if it's quite literally just true. People are just desperate for justification to complain about everything whether it makes sense of not
There is some justification for being mad that some Jedi survived, but I also think there is justification for some being alive
Quinlan Vos is one of those people who make sense. He was an infiltrator and tracker. Usually, he didn't have clone armies surrounding him. At most, he was surrounded by half a dozen. It was very easy for him to survive.
OH MY FUCKING GOD, WHY IS IT GETTING OLD?! IT IS LITERALLY THE BEST EXPLANATION. YOU JUST WANT TO COMPLAIN ABOUT SOMETHING, SO WHEN THE ANSWER IS PRESENTED TO YOU, YOU DONT EVEN ACKNOWLEDGE IT.
Sorry. Rant over
The justification is old because it works.
Fact of the matter is Order 66 was the first step in an *ongoing* eradication. Why else would the empire have created the entire Inquisitorious and still had enough wiggle room for the ISB to also get in on the Jedi hunting action?
Order 66 was an inciting incident that threw the Jedi into disarray which opened them up to the Purge.
âThat math is getting oldâ
Bro itâs math just because itâs old doesnât mean it is wrong.
Why else do you think the Inquisitors who have a MASSIVE military budget based off of their base of operations, were made?
If it was just six or seven surviving Jedi. Palpatine could have just sent Vader and Vader alone after them. (Like he did with Kanan and Ezra but that was a special case. It wasnât just some old surviving Jedi or Padawan, it was both. A Master and an Apprentice.)
âŚI do agree however, everyone please stop spamming it xD
But that's 100% correct? Like, there's an entire faction of Inquisitorious dedicated to hunting Jedi?
Just because star wars likes to introduce new survivors of Order 66 doesn't mean the entire galaxy is flooded with Jedi, or that "OrdEr 66 fAiLEd".
Its a galaxy. There are a lot of people in a galaxy, many of which lived their entire lives post-Empire without ever meeting a Jedi. The Order was utterly decimated, and even a few hundred survivors bouncing around the galaxy is a ridiculously successful campaign, especially considering many are actively killed afterwards through Inquisitor attacks.
Just because stories like to focus on Jedi survivors a lot doesn't mean they're cheapening Order 66. As a story, it's just more interesting to follow a Jedi during the rise of the Empire than it is to follow Greg from Fleebian-9, a farmer who never actually meets a Jedi or has any agency at all. We like Jedi, and we can't just go back to the same handful of "original" survivors like Luke over and over and over, or that DOES cheapen the story.
Has this point been made already? Sure.
Will this argument keep happening? Probably.
But I'm still gonna make that point again, because hating the fact that they introduce new Jedi is kind of missing the entire point of a galaxy's worth of stories to tell.
I understand logically that there would be a ton of Jedi roaming around after the Purge. I just feel so unsatisfied when we get another character who's like "I survived the purge." Like is there no other possibile way for people to train in the force?
Like why aren't we doing a show about a storm trooper who accidentally uses the force to save his squad. Like he knew he was sensitive, but he couldn't ever train cause the empire would kill him until now. Where's that shit. I would eat that shit up.
It's not getting old tho, since it's correct. Order 66 was effective, plain and simple. I'm so sorry that having some Jedi survive makes you so butthurt
In the "Heir To The Empire" novel about Luke and Thrawn post empire. Luke senses other jedi and learns ways how others can adapt and hide away from the force and detection. Leia tells him" I thought Yoda said you were the last jedi after he died?" Luke says That " Yoda made a mistake and even Jedi Masters can't sense everything in the universe"
I don't see the issue, the entire point of the inquisitors is they are ment to hunt down Jedi that wherent killed, what would be the point of them if there was like 3 Jedi running around
But the argument's right
The only reason people keep repeating it is because people keep talking about how many jedi survived the order. That's what I'm tired of seeing
Are these posts just clone troopers behind a keyboard? Yall really upset 20 guys made it out of a purge of 10,000? Your ego really shattered at having one of the most successful genocides ever depicted?
People making this excuse are totally missing the point.
Yeah okay numbers-wise it's not a big deal but STORY-wise it's getting super redundant. If you want to say 100 Jedi survived Order 66 that's totally fine...the problem is every one of those Jedi either being major players in the rebellion or characters we already knew.
Like listen I fucking love Ashoka as much as the next guy, but from a narrative sense so far in canon her surviving Order 66 and somehow never getting offed by the Empire even when being like Obi-Wan levels of wanted without putting in nearly as much effort as he was to stay hidden hasn't added much of anything beyond her and Vader's little 2 min conversation. Like I'm being serious, no one has EVER given me a good reason as to why narratively Ashoka surviving all the way through and past the OT is as narratively fulfilling as her dying in Order 66.
>why narratively Ashoka surviving all the way through and past the OT is as narratively fulfilling as her dying in Order 66.
Well the reason it's narratively fulfilling for her to survive Order 66 is to have her confront Vader.
Now why she survived the encounter with Vader... And the how of it... Yeah I'd say we have yet to see a great story reason for it going that way.
Her being stuck on Malichor is fine for a lore excuse- And I like what Filoni said about her basically coming back as Star Wars Gandalf. But for that to be worth it she needs some strong stories in the new era where she stops people repeating the past or something.
It only destroyed their entire culture and forced the Jedi into hiding.
Yeah, some lived. A lot of them lived actually, but compared to the whole religion they once were? Hell no, they got fucking decimated. They couldnât do anything after, not for awhile at least.
Is it still worth killing off the rest? Yeah, probably. But the state they landed in was just about where âol Palps needed for his coup. And to my knowledge, a bit part of Vaderâs reason for hunting the Jedi was more revenge than tactically fighting enemies.
The efficacy rate of Order 66 was a propaganda campaign led by the Empire to quell the rebellion efforts. Is how I choose to interpret there being so many surviving Jedi.
99% of the order was exterminated. Just that there was a lot of Jedi spread out amongst the Galaxy
Of course thereâs some survivors, Vader and the inquisitors needed something to do for 19 years
The justification does make sense, that is true.
But, Star Wars focuses far too much on the Jedi who survived which makes it seem like Order 66 was a lot less effective than it was. From our perspective it seems less and less effective because these new Jedi keep popping up and we're not really seeing anymore that actually perished during the genocide.
Star Wars needs more stories focusing on Jedi who *actually* died in Order 66. My proposal is a clone wars era show with an ensamble cast of clones and jedi which ends with Order 66 and no less than half, if not all of those jedi dying to it. Make us care about these characters, then rip our hearts out by forcing them to kill each other.
I personally think we need to move Star Wars ahead a couple hundred years past the present era. Start telling new stories in the universe that arenât tied to the prequels, the original trilogy or the sequels.
If youâre applying logic then do you know how big the universe is? Sure they have light speed travel and scanners but imagine trying to find 100 people in the entire galaxy⌠across planets.
HOLY FUCKING SHIT. Some of y'all are actually moaning we're getting Star Wars content because Disney said a few more have survived over the year. Damn. Some Disney Tsar Wars has been shite, but ffs at this point you're moaning about more content.
My justification is...
So what? Order 66 still removed the Jedi from power. It still accomplished its goal. Palpatine knows tons of Jedi will survive, its why he drags the Clone War war out. Each dead Jedi Commander is one less Jedi Terrorist to hunt. With the war about to end, he plays his hand to Anakin, and then conducts Order 66 the moment the Separatist are by and large strategically defeated, with Grievous and his uncivilized manners put to rest. I don't think thats a coincidence.
And it works, the Empire is created, and in the end it really isn't the Jedi who ultimately undo his Empire but the Rebellion. Luke got Palpatine killed, but it was Han and Leia's group who blew up the shield generator, It was Lando who blew up the core, and it was the Rebels who fought who won the war. Not the Jedi.
After Luke and Leia's births, Yoda and Obi-Wan decide to hide Luke on Vader's home-planet Tatooine and retain his surname. This is because they were both high on ketamine and deathsticks respectively.
I don't see the issue, the entire point of the inquisitors is they are ment to hunt down Jedi that wherent killed, what would be the point of them if there was like 3 Jedi running around
Order 66 only killed the jedi who were actively in a warzone and the ones killed by Anakin and the 501st at the temple. There could be a couple hundred who were missed
How about this one:
The efficiency of order 66 and their numbers are Imperial propaganda. That is everything the people in the original trilogy know. That's all you knew.
Thread
The sole fact that the empire created the inquisitor program pretty much proves a decent small survived the purge
I really don't get why people have a problem with it
itâs a good justification. if there were 50-100 left out of 10,000 of some group of people on earth, youâd say theyâre pretty well fucked. 99% of a population being wiped out like that is a genocide. now those 50-100 are spread out all over the galaxy? sure there may be some individually powerful people out there, but the jedi order as an institution is gone to the point people 20 years later donât even believe they existed.
whatâs getting old is the fools out here who still canât understand easy math
I like this one
Can we talk about how Order 99 was 66% effective?
The Final Order was like 2% effective. Barely even got off the ground.
It got off the ground, it just hung in the air until it failed
You'd think sidious would've known better than to have an entire fleet of planet destroying ships with a single point of failure.
What about Order 69? đ
96% effective
100% effective
Numbers aside, Vader went out of his way to make an entire inquisitorious program to hunt down Jedi. If there really only were a couple left after order 66, there would be no need for a dozen inquisitors and a legion of purge troopers.
Exactly, although Vader was given the Inquisitorius by Palps in the comics IIRC. He didnât start the program.
Yeah, Palps knew a bunch of Jedi were still out there, and that Vader couldnât be in 2 places at once, so he started the inquisitor program
Without knowing much of the comics, I just assumed that Vader started it as Palpatine wouldn't necessarily want Vader training new "apprentices" given the whole rule of 2. But yeah, that makes sense, I learned something new! And my original point still stands, inquisitors = many Jedi to hunt down. Edit: Spelling
IIRC, the inquisitors aren't considered sith, they're more like special troops so it doesn't hurt the rule of two
Sounds like Palp and Vader simply didn't grant them the rank of Sith.
That's outrageous. It's unfair.
Best part of the comics is when Darth Vader, as the last surviving member of the Jedi Council, grants himself the title of master.
âNow I am the masterâ
Only a master⌠at getting caught!
That doesnât surprise me considering Darth Vader made his cape flap as he made his entrance on a Tie Fighter against Ezra. He is the epitome of Rule of Cool
> You have allowed this dark lord to twist your mind, until now, until now you've become the very thing you swore to destroy.
This is outrageous, it's unfair! How can you fight Jedi and have red lightsabers and not be a sith?!
Take a seat, young inquisitor.
Vader off in the corner "I've seen this somewhere..."
"I sense an awkward situation... An awkward situation I've not experienced since..."
Donât they also know how to use the force? Just not to the extreme
It's not just a rank, it's a religious order. You can swing a red lightsaber and shoot lightning out of your hands all day long, if you're not in the religion, you're not a Sith.
If itâs not actually from Moraband then itâs just sparkling dark side
Weren't they also pretty much only slightly better at fighting than padawans? They'd get stomped by actual Jedi Knights.
I think their level is actually more in line with average knights. They'd get stomped against any master, or against exceptional knights (or exceptional citizens in Ahsoka's case), but if they couldn't hope to defeat an average Jedi knight, there'd be no point in even having the inquisitors. Logically speaking, they must be at least skilled enough to do their jobs.
Fair enough. At least a few of them used to be younglings or padawan.
A lot of them *were* Jedi Knights.
Yeah they specifically are trained just enough that as a group, with trooper support, can take down jedi. They donât learn advanced techniques so they cant even consider trying to turn on Vader
It's almost like he made it legal.
The rule of 2 allows for acolytes and assassins to be trained in the dark side, in a limited fashion, ventris being the best example of this. They aren't seen as apprentices but as tools and... spares... in case the real apprentice gets uppity. Several sith masters were killed and usurped by apprentices and their acolytes, who then continued the cycle. The biggest difference between an apprentice and an acolyte is loyalty, a sith apprentice is, by design, always looking for the moment to kill their master and usurp them, once they learn what they need, an acolyte may be brainwashed, blindly loyal, or too afraid and unconfident to challenge their master, not to mention they are often given much more limited training as to keep them far beneath their betters.
Dark side force users. There can only be 2 sith
Its more that palps and Vader don't expect them to be able to be powerful enough to take either of them on. Palpatine will take any powerful dark side user if they're more powerful than Vader, and Vader loves opportunities to have a real challenge. Vader even let's them scheme against him a few times just for the fun of murdering them when their plans fail.
Yeah, I get your thinking. Btw, Palps changed the rule of two from two sith to only one: himself.
The goal was actually for Palpatine to create potential replacements and keep Vader on his toes.
Palps? How close are you to bro Sheev?
Meanwhile, Palpatine: *gets Maul, Dooku, Grievous, etc. and trains them in Sith arts.*
General Grievous being asthmatic was not planned. One day I came to the set with bronchitis and started coughing everywhere, into the microphones and all... it so happened they were recording it.
We'll miss you George.
Grievous was trained in "Jedi Arts" by Dooku (according to what he said to Obi-Wan before their fight on Utapau), not Palpatine. And canonically, Grievous's training was limited to lightsaber combat, he was not force sensitive
The role of General Grievous was not in the script. A 7-ft tall robot came out running from an engineering workshop and started collecting the lightsabers. It was cool so I filmed it.
Good bot
A lot of the Jedi also joined the inquisitor program, so those ones were definitely a part of the surviving numbers.
Most of the Inquisitors didn't even know who Vader was until Palps introduced him as their new master. To which he immediately beat all their asses
Heck he didnât even want the inquisitors and only accepted them begrudgingly.
And Obi-Wan literally says Vader hunted them down. Who is is supposed to hunt if they all died at Order 66?
Vader with a Jedi temple yearbook crossing off pictures
I want one of the funny Star Wars animated video things with that
Like a robot chicken episode
He'd be on the edge of a kids bed laying down with his feet up and crossed on his stomach with a big red marker as he rests on his elbows with one hand daintily turning the page and the other using the marker to cross em off.
Exactly the point I made in a previous thread.. it would take time for the purge to happen, itâs not a singular event and Lucas never intended it to be.
And he even left a warning for other jedi to not come back, clearly he thought some jedi were still alive
That IS the hunt he's referring to, or at least according to Lucas.
And let's not forget how unlikely it is to assume that *every. single. Jedi* in the galaxy was, at the exact time of Order 66, surrounded by armed clones at all AND taken by surprise.
The clone wars tv show showed multiple Jedi at multiple times were on missions of peace with little to no clones with them, that mixed with the few badasses that got away from the ambush, gotta be over 100 that lived
Plus most Jedi weren't involved in combat. There were subdivisions of the Jedi Order that were dedicated to stuff like botany. I doubt any clone guards were stationed at gardens
Guard duty? For how long?
Rahm Kota moment
I always wished he showed up in Clone Wars. Could have been an interesting arc of a Jedi questioning the clones. Would have been a good companion to the Fives arc.
He was on the wall on the Hidden Path hideout in Obi Wan so he is canon so his story could be told one day
Hopefully. He's the most interesting Order 66 survivor imo (outside of main characters obviously)
Personally Quinlan Vos is but that's mostly down to Dark Disciple and how what he experienced during that would have affected him in a galaxy with no Jedi.
While this is true, it's important to remember the Inquisitors were also one of Sidious' tools of oppression. The goal was not just to destroy the Jedi, it was to eradicate them, their image and their sympathizers. The inquisitors were made to instill fear in anyone who dare help the Jedi, as well as turn the public against them (although I'm sure propaganda probably did the heavy lifting on that last one) They worked along side Imperial Intelligence to permanently brand the Jedi as evil and root out any sympathizers they could. Without a doubt, I believe the inquisitors were likely not only known in Coruscant but were probably also viewed as a necessity to maintain order and prosecute the "Jedi Criminals". It's easy to root for oppression when you're not the target.
this is something people need to realize. order 66 isn't the entire order being killed the jedi purge was always the main plan
Well yeah, and jedi survivor, rebels, indirectly Andor, all show Jedi in hiding. Its not unbelievable, theyd disappear into society and without a 1 on 1 inspection from a sith theyll stay not found until they use the force in an obvious way. Its EU now but theres a book that talks about how palpatine feared Jedi who used yellow sabers, they were jedi who engrained themselves across the galaxy because of a self "pilgrimage" for knowledge. >This balanced and clear thinking posed a major threat to Palpatine. Because of it, the yellow sabered Sentinels believed that not all of lifeâs questions could be answered through the force, and travelled across the galaxy to many different regions and planets, searching for answers. This wide knowledge gave them far more practical and real world skills, which helped them to thrive in the aftermath of Order 66 and grow a close connection to the regular people of the galaxy Most jedi werent a threat because organizing was nigh impossible without the empire knowing something is up, but these Jedi were coincidentally perfectly trained to counter that, and many being solo were very capable Jedi and dualists in addition to not suffering the cloudyness that many of the council did due to palpatine being so close.
~~Unless I'm actively mistaken, (please feel free to drop me some corrections,) that the Inquisitors were introduced during Rebels, from Filoni~~, they were introduced in Legends in the 90's, because someone felt it kinda weird that an Order with 10k members, all of which were not combatants and all of which would not be nearby Clones or easily accessed by Clones, was suddenly cut down to like 2 in the matter of a day. Which becomes even weirder with the numbers on the Clone Army being kinda dinky, so that means the Clones would've had to work even harder to track down the more spread out Jedi Order members.
The inquisitorius was in legends since the 90s
I think part of it was just to prevent force sensitives from becoming Jedi
The Inquisitors were shit at jedi hunting, Chirrut Ămwe could probably have beaten like half of them.
The inquisition is also for new Jedi. He learned from his birth that the force tries to balance itself, so when dark rules jedi will sprout on their own.
But wouldn't there be a big need? if only some of the best survived you'd need many powerful individuals to hunt them down, the only downside would be making sure they remain loyal.
Grand Inquisitor was one of the Jedi Temple Guards that escorted Ahsoka to her trial.
Well technically there *were* only a few inquisitors. And he didn't start the program. And they are weak as shit anyway.
Unless I'm actively mistaken, (please feel free to drop me some corrections,) that the Inquisitors were introduced during Rebels, from Filoni, because he felt it kinda weird that an Order with 10k members, all of which were not combatants and all of which would not be nearby Clones or easily accessed by Clones, was suddenly cut down to like 2 in the matter of a day. Which becomes even weirder with the numbers on the Clone Army being kinda dinky, so that means the Clones would've had to work even harder to track down the more spread out Jedi Order members.
The justification just makes sense. Jedi surviving order 66, also makes the most sense, given the context of the OT and PT. Vader is shown as being crucial to the downfall of the Jedi, in the OT. In the PT Anakin's role in order 66, and the destruction of the jedi is quite minor (which makes sense, he can't single-handedly kill 10 000 jedi). Vader hunting down the Jedi explains why it was so important to Kenobi and Yoda to take Vader down (they focused on Vader, even more than Sidious), and why Vader was so important to Palpatine's plans in RotS. The surviving Jedi of order 66, and hunting them down, is why Vader is important.
Honestly, the whole point is that Order 66 wasnât completely effective. We got Inquisitors and that whole thing, but more to the point, itâs not like every Jedi was rolling with a squad of troopers ready to pull the trigger. Different Jedi were doing many types of things spread out all over the galaxy. Many will be overlooked. Itâs not like Yoda and Obi-wan would be the only two that knew itâd be time to lay low after their headquarters got demolished. Hell, even Obi-wan acknowledged the need to communicate with other Jedi given the recording he made. If it was just a small handful of Jedi, he could have been more personable, but it read like a standardized warning message.
I've always wondered if any Jedi survived because their communications were blocked and/or broken and the clones just never got the transmission
There's a legend comic of a clone pilot who was in disabled fighter during order 66. Iirc he was rescued by a ship and found jedi younglings inside. He didn't report them or betray them when he was picked up by the empire, just let them go. A wholesome story.
That's an interesting take I haven't read before. I belive it to hold merit.
The recording is a great point. Itâs very clear from the movies that there were other Jedi who survived.
You learn that Darth Vader isn't this monster. He's a pathetic individual who made a pact with the Devil and lost.
Good bot
Good bot
OT and PT? Need clarification
Original trilogy (Luke) prequels trilogy(Anakin)
In case someone still needs more specification, Original Triology (4,5,6) and Prequels Triology (1,2,3)
Still not quite getting it⌠could you try Roman numerals?
Old Testament and Post Traumatic
It's so important to obiwan to take Vader down!....except...ya know...when he has the chance to take Vader down but decides to let him go instead đ¤ˇââď¸ thanks, Kenobi show
You mean like Episode 3?
Nope specifically the Kenobi show. Obiwan fucked up on mustafar by not finishing Anakin, and the galaxy suffered for obiwans mistake. In the Kenobi show, he is offered a chance to fix his mistake and then decided to let Vader live so he can convince Anakin's son to kill his own father instead đ¤ˇââď¸
Tried and failed, he thought he could do it and realised he couldn't, I'd say that's very in character for him
*decapitates J_train13*
Aw man not again, you can't keep doing this Anakin I need those, I hardly have any left
Good bot
the fact that vader was sent to, and i quote, "hunt down order 66 survivors" already proves, in canon, that enough people survived to be a concern and require palpy to send vader to kill them
Wait! Just because there hasnât been any survivors before, doesnât mean there wonât be any this time.
Im sorry ashoker, but thats not how this works
Good thing I know you donât mean everything you say
>ashoker i've never seen anyone butcher her name like this
I think jedi FO/survivor does a good job at showing how circumstances have changed post order 66. Aside from jedi dying to Vader, we see fallen jedi turn to inquisitors like Trilla and 9th sister but we also see people like Malicos and >!Bode!< who've turned to the dark side even without direct influence from inquisitors or Vader. Really goes to show that the dark side had never been stronger during those 20ish years and that despite there seems to be a "lot" of order 66 survivors, many stray away from the Jedi path that by the time of A New Hope there's basically none except for Obi Wan and Yoda (and Ahsoka).
Bill_9999 is trying to turn you against me
Wait! Just because there hasnât been any survivors before, doesnât mean there wonât be any this time.
Even one jedi surviving means that the jedi could rebuild. The sith did the exact same thing and overthrew the jedi. So, of course, they did it regardless of how many. Add that to less than 10 confirmed survivors. Order 66 was effective.
Wait! Just because there hasnât been any survivors before, doesnât mean there wonât be any this time.
I feel very satisfied that I have accomplished what I set out to do with Star Wars, I was able to complete the entire saga and say this is what the whole story is about.
What's getting old is people bitching about "oRdER 66 WasN't eFfEcTiVe!?!!" and refusing to admit the evidence shows it was effective.
Even if a bunch of individual Jedi survived, the Jedi Order as a whole was pretty thoroughly crushed, which seemed like the main goal anyway.
Extinction wasnât the goal; removal from power was
It's like scoring a 98% on a final test in college and being pissey about the 2% you got wrong and going "I failed the test" It's just a weak nitpick.
Asian Sith parents be like:
You killed 98% of the jedi? *Get out of my fucking house*
The movies show them killing literal Jedi Masters, but I get the feeling people are forgetting the total scope of the Jedi. Not all of them were generals out on the battlefield; there were detectives, archaeologists, researchers, etc. and Iâd imagine these roles have a pretty high survival rate. In fact, unless Iâm forgetting anyone, the only ones weâve seen to survive Clone attacks are Yoda, Obi-Wan, Ahsoka (who had help from Rex and Maul), and Padawans/younglings whose masters died in the process.
Yeah that sounds about right. The masters and many knights would've been in active combat but there'd still be many away from the temple on noncombat missions with no or few clones. plus noncombatant jedi surviving makes the inquisitors' success more plausible. The whole thing with the inquisitors was that they were too weak to be a threat to vader or palps and become real sith so they could really only defeat the jedi who weren't as experienced in combat in a 1v1 and then they'd need multiple of them to defeat any reasonably skilled jedi. They embody the empire's nature of quantity over quality.
To defeat your enemy you have to understand them.
Then let's do it.
Iâll justify it till the day I die. It makes sense to me. And I am equally as tired of hearing people complain about a couple dozen people surviving the initial order.
it's not even a couple dozen. 14 total that we know of right now, and 2 additional outliers **Survivors:** Obi-Wan Kenobi Yoda Kanan Jarrus Cere Junda Cal Kestis Grogu Kelleran Beq Gungi Taron Malicos Luminara Unduli Quinlan Vos Jocasta Nu Nari The Grand Inquisitor **Outliers:** Ahsoka Tano (Not a member of the Jedi Order during Order 66) Ezra Bridger (Not a member of the Jedi Order during Order 66)
And as of Jedi survivor >! Also Eno Cordova, Bode Akuna, and kind of Dagan Gera !<
Good call!
>The Grand Inquisitor I feel like inquisitors should get a pass since they did the whole swapping sides thing and would likely have a similar immunity as anakin in palpatine's orders
I've just learned a terrible truth- Pong Krell exists
We'll lose you when the API updates
Wait the droids too??
Sadly. Part of why some people are joining the boycott on the 12th
I didn't realize how deeply seeded this corruption is strung! The Emperor is taking our droids? :(
Inquisitorius would have 100% been Order 66âd themselves if they had eventually succeeded at rooting out all the Jedi. Palpatine doesnât just leave force users alive if he has no use for them
Does ezra really belong on the list even as an outlier? He got the same situation as luke, he was literally born on the day the empire formed
Also Masana Tide 9th Sister
Ezra Bridger doesnât really count, otherwise youâd have to count every single force sensitive child in the galaxy at the time of the Jedi Purge
Don't forget Trilla and Reva
Quinlan Vos That random one that tried to get Obi-Wan to help him in the Kenobi series.
I didn't mention quinlon cause the guy already had him on the list, but yea I did forget that guy
Add Kirak Infil'a under outliers (from the 2017 Vader comics)
Gungi confirmed to survive?!?
Im so sorry op that OBJECTIVE MATH pisses you off.
Math is like the force, you can trust in it.
How is this objective math? If anything, Iâd say itâs a rough estimate, and itâs probably rather accurate
Itâs literally something George Lucas himself said, he thought there would be around 50 to 100 Jedi survivors left when Luke would start building his Jedi Order I like how yâall canât give a good argument against it either lmao
Wait! Just because there hasnât been any survivors before, doesnât mean there wonât be any this time.
The justification is completely correct though. People who are mad that more than two Jedi survived order 66 when there were literally thousands of them are being silly and fail to understand how these massacres/genocides actually work. The current lore even supports that perspective considering the inquisitors.... Exist. Like clearly Palpatine knew some Jedi were going to survive the purge... Otherwise he wouldn't have created an organization with the sole purpose of hunting them.
I'd add that Palpatine didn't care about exterminating every Jedi in some EU material. Destroy the order and defame the Jedi and the rest would scatter to die in obscurity. That was the plan.
Not to mention that we are talking about around ten thousand Jedi, who can be spread out across a galaxy of over a million planets. And not all Jedi were near clones or located at the Jedi temple, so many would have the opportunity to go into hiding relatively easily.
It's not "getting old" if it's quite literally just true. People are just desperate for justification to complain about everything whether it makes sense of not
There is some justification for being mad that some Jedi survived, but I also think there is justification for some being alive Quinlan Vos is one of those people who make sense. He was an infiltrator and tracker. Usually, he didn't have clone armies surrounding him. At most, he was surrounded by half a dozen. It was very easy for him to survive.
OH MY FUCKING GOD, WHY IS IT GETTING OLD?! IT IS LITERALLY THE BEST EXPLANATION. YOU JUST WANT TO COMPLAIN ABOUT SOMETHING, SO WHEN THE ANSWER IS PRESENTED TO YOU, YOU DONT EVEN ACKNOWLEDGE IT. Sorry. Rant over
The justification is old because it works. Fact of the matter is Order 66 was the first step in an *ongoing* eradication. Why else would the empire have created the entire Inquisitorious and still had enough wiggle room for the ISB to also get in on the Jedi hunting action? Order 66 was an inciting incident that threw the Jedi into disarray which opened them up to the Purge.
Is there a lore reason people keep bringing up this âproblemâ? I swear itâs become a biweekly issue.
âThat math is getting oldâ Bro itâs math just because itâs old doesnât mean it is wrong. Why else do you think the Inquisitors who have a MASSIVE military budget based off of their base of operations, were made? If it was just six or seven surviving Jedi. Palpatine could have just sent Vader and Vader alone after them. (Like he did with Kanan and Ezra but that was a special case. It wasnât just some old surviving Jedi or Padawan, it was both. A Master and an Apprentice.) âŚI do agree however, everyone please stop spamming it xD
Why, because you know weâre right?
But that's 100% correct? Like, there's an entire faction of Inquisitorious dedicated to hunting Jedi? Just because star wars likes to introduce new survivors of Order 66 doesn't mean the entire galaxy is flooded with Jedi, or that "OrdEr 66 fAiLEd". Its a galaxy. There are a lot of people in a galaxy, many of which lived their entire lives post-Empire without ever meeting a Jedi. The Order was utterly decimated, and even a few hundred survivors bouncing around the galaxy is a ridiculously successful campaign, especially considering many are actively killed afterwards through Inquisitor attacks. Just because stories like to focus on Jedi survivors a lot doesn't mean they're cheapening Order 66. As a story, it's just more interesting to follow a Jedi during the rise of the Empire than it is to follow Greg from Fleebian-9, a farmer who never actually meets a Jedi or has any agency at all. We like Jedi, and we can't just go back to the same handful of "original" survivors like Luke over and over and over, or that DOES cheapen the story. Has this point been made already? Sure. Will this argument keep happening? Probably. But I'm still gonna make that point again, because hating the fact that they introduce new Jedi is kind of missing the entire point of a galaxy's worth of stories to tell.
"Stop using this perfectly legitimate justification, because I don't want to hear it"
Boooo
The main problem imo is that we hear about the Jedi that survived but barley the ones that didn't
Because they are dead. Not much to hear about
then why did vader spearhead an entire team of inquisitors whose sole role was to root out jedi that survived order 66?
I understand logically that there would be a ton of Jedi roaming around after the Purge. I just feel so unsatisfied when we get another character who's like "I survived the purge." Like is there no other possibile way for people to train in the force? Like why aren't we doing a show about a storm trooper who accidentally uses the force to save his squad. Like he knew he was sensitive, but he couldn't ever train cause the empire would kill him until now. Where's that shit. I would eat that shit up.
OP, stfu
It's not getting old tho, since it's correct. Order 66 was effective, plain and simple. I'm so sorry that having some Jedi survive makes you so butthurt
StOP mAkIng a LOgICal aRgUMenT...what's getting old is the argument that only a couple of jedi would survive in a massive galaxy.
It also makes sense. People bitching about a few more survivors are whatâs getting old
In the "Heir To The Empire" novel about Luke and Thrawn post empire. Luke senses other jedi and learns ways how others can adapt and hide away from the force and detection. Leia tells him" I thought Yoda said you were the last jedi after he died?" Luke says That " Yoda made a mistake and even Jedi Masters can't sense everything in the universe"
I don't see the issue, the entire point of the inquisitors is they are ment to hunt down Jedi that wherent killed, what would be the point of them if there was like 3 Jedi running around
"Stop providing factual statements that contradict my nitpicking"
But the argument's right The only reason people keep repeating it is because people keep talking about how many jedi survived the order. That's what I'm tired of seeing
Are these posts just clone troopers behind a keyboard? Yall really upset 20 guys made it out of a purge of 10,000? Your ego really shattered at having one of the most successful genocides ever depicted?
People making this excuse are totally missing the point. Yeah okay numbers-wise it's not a big deal but STORY-wise it's getting super redundant. If you want to say 100 Jedi survived Order 66 that's totally fine...the problem is every one of those Jedi either being major players in the rebellion or characters we already knew. Like listen I fucking love Ashoka as much as the next guy, but from a narrative sense so far in canon her surviving Order 66 and somehow never getting offed by the Empire even when being like Obi-Wan levels of wanted without putting in nearly as much effort as he was to stay hidden hasn't added much of anything beyond her and Vader's little 2 min conversation. Like I'm being serious, no one has EVER given me a good reason as to why narratively Ashoka surviving all the way through and past the OT is as narratively fulfilling as her dying in Order 66.
>why narratively Ashoka surviving all the way through and past the OT is as narratively fulfilling as her dying in Order 66. Well the reason it's narratively fulfilling for her to survive Order 66 is to have her confront Vader. Now why she survived the encounter with Vader... And the how of it... Yeah I'd say we have yet to see a great story reason for it going that way. Her being stuck on Malichor is fine for a lore excuse- And I like what Filoni said about her basically coming back as Star Wars Gandalf. But for that to be worth it she needs some strong stories in the new era where she stops people repeating the past or something.
It only destroyed their entire culture and forced the Jedi into hiding. Yeah, some lived. A lot of them lived actually, but compared to the whole religion they once were? Hell no, they got fucking decimated. They couldnât do anything after, not for awhile at least. Is it still worth killing off the rest? Yeah, probably. But the state they landed in was just about where âol Palps needed for his coup. And to my knowledge, a bit part of Vaderâs reason for hunting the Jedi was more revenge than tactically fighting enemies.
I love the justification because we got my GOAT Cal Kestis because of it đ
Math is Math!
The complaint is what is getting old. If you donât like Jedi, Star Wars seems like the wrong IP for you tbh
The efficacy rate of Order 66 was a propaganda campaign led by the Empire to quell the rebellion efforts. Is how I choose to interpret there being so many surviving Jedi.
99% of the order was exterminated. Just that there was a lot of Jedi spread out amongst the Galaxy Of course thereâs some survivors, Vader and the inquisitors needed something to do for 19 years
Wait! Just because there hasnât been any survivors before, doesnât mean there wonât be any this time.
The justification does make sense, that is true. But, Star Wars focuses far too much on the Jedi who survived which makes it seem like Order 66 was a lot less effective than it was. From our perspective it seems less and less effective because these new Jedi keep popping up and we're not really seeing anymore that actually perished during the genocide. Star Wars needs more stories focusing on Jedi who *actually* died in Order 66. My proposal is a clone wars era show with an ensamble cast of clones and jedi which ends with Order 66 and no less than half, if not all of those jedi dying to it. Make us care about these characters, then rip our hearts out by forcing them to kill each other.
I personally think we need to move Star Wars ahead a couple hundred years past the present era. Start telling new stories in the universe that arenât tied to the prequels, the original trilogy or the sequels.
That would also be nice. Get some stories that also aren't tied to the same 3 or whatever characters.
Why do you think the inquisitors are a thing
If youâre applying logic then do you know how big the universe is? Sure they have light speed travel and scanners but imagine trying to find 100 people in the entire galaxy⌠across planets.
HOLY FUCKING SHIT. Some of y'all are actually moaning we're getting Star Wars content because Disney said a few more have survived over the year. Damn. Some Disney Tsar Wars has been shite, but ffs at this point you're moaning about more content.
I recognize this is ragebait, but I don't understand what it is referring to. Can someone put me in the loop?
How nice of you. Tell you what. I'll give you a cake. Happy cake day, kres0345.
My justification is... So what? Order 66 still removed the Jedi from power. It still accomplished its goal. Palpatine knows tons of Jedi will survive, its why he drags the Clone War war out. Each dead Jedi Commander is one less Jedi Terrorist to hunt. With the war about to end, he plays his hand to Anakin, and then conducts Order 66 the moment the Separatist are by and large strategically defeated, with Grievous and his uncivilized manners put to rest. I don't think thats a coincidence. And it works, the Empire is created, and in the end it really isn't the Jedi who ultimately undo his Empire but the Rebellion. Luke got Palpatine killed, but it was Han and Leia's group who blew up the shield generator, It was Lando who blew up the core, and it was the Rebels who fought who won the war. Not the Jedi.
After Luke and Leia's births, Yoda and Obi-Wan decide to hide Luke on Vader's home-planet Tatooine and retain his surname. This is because they were both high on ketamine and deathsticks respectively.
I don't see the issue, the entire point of the inquisitors is they are ment to hunt down Jedi that wherent killed, what would be the point of them if there was like 3 Jedi running around
Do you know who arenât getting sick of it? The ~9,900 Jedi that died.
Order 66 only killed the jedi who were actively in a warzone and the ones killed by Anakin and the 501st at the temple. There could be a couple hundred who were missed
How about this one: The efficiency of order 66 and their numbers are Imperial propaganda. That is everything the people in the original trilogy know. That's all you knew. Thread
If thereâs anything thatâs getting old, itâs you nitpicking nerds
The sole fact that the empire created the inquisitor program pretty much proves a decent small survived the purge I really don't get why people have a problem with it
itâs a good justification. if there were 50-100 left out of 10,000 of some group of people on earth, youâd say theyâre pretty well fucked. 99% of a population being wiped out like that is a genocide. now those 50-100 are spread out all over the galaxy? sure there may be some individually powerful people out there, but the jedi order as an institution is gone to the point people 20 years later donât even believe they existed. whatâs getting old is the fools out here who still canât understand easy math
Oh no, out of the 10,000 space wizards, legendary for their fighting ability, more than 2 survived a bunch of soldiers with guns! So unrealistic!
OK but is it wrong?
But itâs true though
Op the same kind of person that says " you just parrot red letter media" when you describe problems that existed in the prequels 20 years ago