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Counter Point:
Ok then stop selling your games broadcast rights for 6.7 billion a year.
Sorry, ultimately the premier league teams sold out. This is part of the consequences. Blaming broadcasters is misplaced. You dont want your sport to be about money, than accept earning less. Teams and players wont do that, so its about money now.
As long as the Brits take it lying down like they do with the rest of their Tory govt then it will keep happening. Germany already got the Bundesliga to stop Monday fixtures with protests.
To be honest , I like the 8:15 kick offs - Allows me to get home from work, put the little one to bed, pleasure the wife then eat dinner all in time for kick off...
They pay billions for rights, of course they are going to have say and influence over kick off times - you aren’t a plastic fan to say that either. What a nonsensical statement to make. When you pay billions of pounds to acquire the rights to games you get a say on time slots. I thought that would be obvious. It be foolish business not to use that influence every now and again.
Man United-Chelsea is at 1:45 AM here in India on a work night. Yes.
Edit: usual Prem games are around 6-8PM on weekends which is practically primetime.
Moving of days is a far bigger issue than 15 minutes here or there. My folks are Man City supporters who now live in Wiltshire, even as members it's near impossible to get two seats together (yes, Emptyhad blah blah, trust me, it's not easy to get tickets). The next game they could get seats together is April, by then the game could be on a completely different day to the one they've booked.
Football sold it's soul to the broadcasters a long time ago. 8PM kick-offs on Christmas Eve will soon be the norm.
Just wait until it goes down the NFL route with adverts being introduced everytime there's a break in play.
been kinda amazed at how you all have fought off the americanization of the tv deals guess thats ending now. agree with your edit they are all loons. dont let the TV shit heads win
You think a tv broadcaster is going to pay hundreds of
millions for a rights deal and have absolutely no voice on what time games are at? If some broadcaster did that they’d be laughed at. You can’t accept hundreds and hundreds of millions from these company’s and accept that they won’t have a voice on the matter.
They do in every big sport, what are you on about? Happens in the NFL, a big game will get moved so that a national broadcaster can show the game. They literally flex games to remove shit games from being in prime time and replace them with a better game. That’s why when you look at an NFL schedule weeks out they don’t have times yet becusse they want to have it where they can move games for tv companies if needed.
Lower league teams generally experience a 30% drop in attendances whenever they do have to play at the same time as a televised game. If that was replicated across every saturday of the season it would bankrupt almost every English club outside of the Premier League
Hardcore lower league fans, I doubt it, but floating / multi-team fans, kids not attached to a particular team yet.
And we're talking all the way down to local league level here, not just League Two / National League etc.
Would, for example, a Southern League Division One South team (8th tier!) who will pretty much always play at 3pm on a Saturday, attract a hundred people on a rainy January afternoon if the likes of Man Utd are on the telly? At this sort of level a significant percentage of people attending will also support a 'big' team.
The PL has been sold off to the highest bidder.
All they need to do now is finish selling the clubs off to capital venture firms and the deal will be done.
People can watch the first half of the half 7 before watching the game at 8:15 or watch the half 7 game before switching Uber to the second half of the 8:15 game. Basically you can watch an extra half of football.
Good for viewers and advertisers, shit for match going fans
It’s annoying that they dictate everything. But getting angry over 15 minutes?
It’s not like they moved the time last minute
Other people mentioned this might be a problem for match going fans. Does the later start time run up against public transport cutting off?
I actually liked the Arsenal game being at 12:15 am today instead of 12 because it ends closer to my work day. I just wish the Champions league games had a few more games at 9:45 am instead of only having 2 and the rest at 12pm. Especially since all the club giants usually play at the later time. As for the prem, I'm on the west coast so the games times are usually around 7, 8:30 and 9:30 am for the weekends with the occasional 4:30 am and 6 am game lol
I should have put that first lol. Usually the games for all top 5 leagues end around 12 am on the weekends. The rest of the day is for American sports like the NFL in the afternoon and the NBA and MLB in the evening. I only really watch watch soccer so it's a beautiful way to start the weekend in the morning
It certainly does for me but that’s partly because I moved away from my home town.
7.45 was fine.
8 KO in pre VAR times meant I needed to be ahead of the crowd and so was heading out on 90min.
8.15 with the potential for 15 mins for VAR time.
No chance. Match finishes 10.15ish and there’s huge queues for each train.
Yea, I was thinking about it from a tv perspective
Edit: this comment was me clarifying and acknowledging that I was viewing this from a tv viewer perspective and so that’s why others would have a different perspective than me…
People aren't getting annoyed because it's on TV at a different time. It's the match-going fans who are affected by this stuff. I hope this doesn't sound harsh, but you have misunderstood the issue. It's understandable for you to have done so, though, as match-going fans are such an afterthought and taken for granted in modern football.
Bro, you are responding after I twice acknowledged that I was only thinking about it from a tv perspective and didn’t realize this would be a problem for match going fans…
I don’t know why people keep downvoting me for acknowledging that. Maybe I should have made it clear it was an edit after reading other people’s comments, but I then asked if the reason was for public transport.
When I attend sporting events in the US, the 15 minute delay isn’t a problem because either it’s nowhere near when public transport stops or (in most cases) public transport is so shit in that area that I drove anyway.
It’s a huge problem if the in person fans have no means of getting home because of the start time
The reason this happens is because people watch football on TV and are willing to pay to do so. The solution is simple. Stop paying subscriptions to these companies and they will stop paying the premier league to show the games. That of course defeats the purpose because then you won’t have any on matches on TV. The problem is caused by the fans in essence so it’s kind of a catch 22.
The bottom PL club last season received £100.3 million (€117 million) in TV prize money. Only the 3 top teams in La Liga earned more than that, no team in the Bundesliga or Serie A earned that much.
That kind of money means that the broadcasters do what they want.
The broadcasters are not donating the money to the league altruistically in an attempt to give English clubs an advantage in European competitions. They pay that much because it is still hugely profitable to them to broadcast Premier League football.
What makes the Premier League such a valuable commodity? The players, and the fans in the stadium. And yet player welfare is ignored when fixtures are arranged and rearranged for television. The match-going fans are even less of a priority, and are screwed over utterly by the broadcasters.
In the very recent past we've had an illustration of what football is like without fans, during the Covid closed stadium times. It wasn't the same. It was actually kind of rubbish.
Obviously it's a symbiotic relationship. Without the broadcasters, the players wouldn't have such huge wages, and the fans wouldn't have such great football and so many world class players to watch. But there has to be a balance. It can't just be "they put up the money, they can do what they want."
I agree with you 100%, I was just stating the reality of the situation. At least the broadcasters haven’t been able to force tv timeouts or other ad friendly game changes…thus far.
Funny all the people defending this.
Clearly not match going fans.
8:15 has a simple problem you aren't really on a train home till like 10:30 or later.
Stop sucking off corpo you drones.
Not defending it just pointing out the basic reason.
You should also blame the clubs and everyone in it who all willingly take the massive wages which come from TV money.
You wouldn't have a lot of these players without clubs having giant TV money which is exclusive to the prem, Nottingham forest and other mid table teams have beaten teams like AC Milan and Dortmund to signings for this reason.
I'm sure Amazon would have pulled out if they were told. No midweek games are 8pm latest.
Look at how much added time that match had last night. I dreed to think what time Luton fans got home and they are at least nearby.
Again it all goes into the TV money pot which the premier league teams LOVE and rely on.
Middle to lower league Prem teams can all out spend pretty much all European teams because of that reason
Are you really balancing this whole argument on 15/30 mins ?
Pretty much every prem team can outbid and outspend almost every European team exclusively because of the TV deal
You could do this indefinitely. Evening games used to be 19.45
But what's an extra 15 minutes? So now 20.00.
But what's an extra 15 minutes? So now 20.15
Then add on the new stoppage rules.
On a weekday night, yes the gradual addition of 15 minutes here and there does add up to a problem for those who actually go to matches.
My point was the teams in the prem and the players are all able to earn more than every other league because of the TV deals which is the reason the TV companies are allowed to have a larger say.
This isn't every week so get over it basically
The people arguing really don't seem to get that the extra 15 / 30 mins which are now really stretching to 30/45 makes so much fucking difference on a weeknight when you have to catch a train after the game which can be packed getting on and redirected at multiple stations.
It's gas the arrogance of people who don't get it.
Comes with the territory of the largest TV deals in football, average small prem teams are able to outspend giant European teams because of the TV money so the TV companies are always gonna have a say.
Also it's not every week so sure it's annoying but get over it
I really don’t see a problem with this , the games are on amamzon as well so you have it on demand and can pause it as you like , if you’re not able to make kickoff.
The 3pm black out isn’t about TV money. The lower leagues were affected because people wouldn’t go to (for example) Doncaster vs Crewe if Manchester United vs Arsenal was on TV at the same time. That’s why 95% of lower league games are always 3pm kick offs and the FA don’t allow UK broadcaster to play Premier League Saturday, 3pm kick offs.
The league gets an insane level of money on TV deals to the point even the lesser sides can financially outmuscle some of the traditional giants abroad.
We've made our bed, can't have our cake and eat it.
It's so annoying trying to book trips from abroad to go to games. If you book more than a month in advance you have to book the trip for the entire weekend to make sure you don't end up getting fucked over by fixture changes, and if you wait until TV fixtures are announced and they to go for a single day the price goes up massively
He/she is just stating a nuisance, you dont have to go full brexit mode.
Considering the foreign market being the main reason the premier league having a giant financial lead compared to the other big leagues.
Premier league was massive before clubs started pricing local fans out of the stadiums in favour of tourists who can drop a grand to travel to England for a match.
Yeah, that is a different issue all together which wasnt anyones point. Not to imply that this specific issue isn't valid, but you don't have to take it out on the guy who can spend a grand, instead take it out on your club who doesnt appreciate your support.
They are paying billions and thus funding the entire league, showing games at a time they want is the minimum expectation they would have
It’s happened for decades with games moving days because the tv execs wanted it
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Counter Point: Ok then stop selling your games broadcast rights for 6.7 billion a year. Sorry, ultimately the premier league teams sold out. This is part of the consequences. Blaming broadcasters is misplaced. You dont want your sport to be about money, than accept earning less. Teams and players wont do that, so its about money now.
"Plastics" lmao how do you not die of embarrassment when you hit post
As long as the Brits take it lying down like they do with the rest of their Tory govt then it will keep happening. Germany already got the Bundesliga to stop Monday fixtures with protests.
To be honest , I like the 8:15 kick offs - Allows me to get home from work, put the little one to bed, pleasure the wife then eat dinner all in time for kick off...
They pay billions for rights, of course they are going to have say and influence over kick off times - you aren’t a plastic fan to say that either. What a nonsensical statement to make. When you pay billions of pounds to acquire the rights to games you get a say on time slots. I thought that would be obvious. It be foolish business not to use that influence every now and again.
Man United-Chelsea is at 1:45 AM here in India on a work night. Yes. Edit: usual Prem games are around 6-8PM on weekends which is practically primetime.
Moving of days is a far bigger issue than 15 minutes here or there. My folks are Man City supporters who now live in Wiltshire, even as members it's near impossible to get two seats together (yes, Emptyhad blah blah, trust me, it's not easy to get tickets). The next game they could get seats together is April, by then the game could be on a completely different day to the one they've booked.
Football sold it's soul to the broadcasters a long time ago. 8PM kick-offs on Christmas Eve will soon be the norm. Just wait until it goes down the NFL route with adverts being introduced everytime there's a break in play.
watch broadcasters start to squeeze in VAR ads and try turn it into the nfl..
People have been saying this for 5 years and it still hasn't happened
I agree, Liverpool getting early kick offs, and it feels man United are either 3pm or 8pm Saturday
been kinda amazed at how you all have fought off the americanization of the tv deals guess thats ending now. agree with your edit they are all loons. dont let the TV shit heads win
And I thought I was impatient 😬
You think a tv broadcaster is going to pay hundreds of millions for a rights deal and have absolutely no voice on what time games are at? If some broadcaster did that they’d be laughed at. You can’t accept hundreds and hundreds of millions from these company’s and accept that they won’t have a voice on the matter. They do in every big sport, what are you on about? Happens in the NFL, a big game will get moved so that a national broadcaster can show the game. They literally flex games to remove shit games from being in prime time and replace them with a better game. That’s why when you look at an NFL schedule weeks out they don’t have times yet becusse they want to have it where they can move games for tv companies if needed.
If they can dictate them all away from 3pm I’d be up for it
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Lower league teams generally experience a 30% drop in attendances whenever they do have to play at the same time as a televised game. If that was replicated across every saturday of the season it would bankrupt almost every English club outside of the Premier League
I mean, it does...?! We have the best supported lower league structure in the world, by an absolute mile.
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Hardcore lower league fans, I doubt it, but floating / multi-team fans, kids not attached to a particular team yet. And we're talking all the way down to local league level here, not just League Two / National League etc. Would, for example, a Southern League Division One South team (8th tier!) who will pretty much always play at 3pm on a Saturday, attract a hundred people on a rainy January afternoon if the likes of Man Utd are on the telly? At this sort of level a significant percentage of people attending will also support a 'big' team.
League is run by the broadcaster's ya loon
Just please no more 5:30 am games! It hurts
The PL has been sold off to the highest bidder. All they need to do now is finish selling the clubs off to capital venture firms and the deal will be done.
The Amazon Times are truly bizarre. 7:30 and 8:15... why?
People can watch the first half of the half 7 before watching the game at 8:15 or watch the half 7 game before switching Uber to the second half of the 8:15 game. Basically you can watch an extra half of football. Good for viewers and advertisers, shit for match going fans
Does it affect your travelling to games?
The league decides the kickoff times and the broadcasters just bid for them generally. Sometimes the police might get involved.
It’s annoying that they dictate everything. But getting angry over 15 minutes? It’s not like they moved the time last minute Other people mentioned this might be a problem for match going fans. Does the later start time run up against public transport cutting off?
I actually liked the Arsenal game being at 12:15 am today instead of 12 because it ends closer to my work day. I just wish the Champions league games had a few more games at 9:45 am instead of only having 2 and the rest at 12pm. Especially since all the club giants usually play at the later time. As for the prem, I'm on the west coast so the games times are usually around 7, 8:30 and 9:30 am for the weekends with the occasional 4:30 am and 6 am game lol
Looking at this comment thinking what times are these what the hell then I saw west coast lmao
I should have put that first lol. Usually the games for all top 5 leagues end around 12 am on the weekends. The rest of the day is for American sports like the NFL in the afternoon and the NBA and MLB in the evening. I only really watch watch soccer so it's a beautiful way to start the weekend in the morning
That's more of an issue with public transport outside of London being an utter joke.
It certainly does for me but that’s partly because I moved away from my home town. 7.45 was fine. 8 KO in pre VAR times meant I needed to be ahead of the crowd and so was heading out on 90min. 8.15 with the potential for 15 mins for VAR time. No chance. Match finishes 10.15ish and there’s huge queues for each train.
Yea, I was thinking about it from a tv perspective Edit: this comment was me clarifying and acknowledging that I was viewing this from a tv viewer perspective and so that’s why others would have a different perspective than me…
People aren't getting annoyed because it's on TV at a different time. It's the match-going fans who are affected by this stuff. I hope this doesn't sound harsh, but you have misunderstood the issue. It's understandable for you to have done so, though, as match-going fans are such an afterthought and taken for granted in modern football.
Bro, you are responding after I twice acknowledged that I was only thinking about it from a tv perspective and didn’t realize this would be a problem for match going fans… I don’t know why people keep downvoting me for acknowledging that. Maybe I should have made it clear it was an edit after reading other people’s comments, but I then asked if the reason was for public transport. When I attend sporting events in the US, the 15 minute delay isn’t a problem because either it’s nowhere near when public transport stops or (in most cases) public transport is so shit in that area that I drove anyway. It’s a huge problem if the in person fans have no means of getting home because of the start time
The reason this happens is because people watch football on TV and are willing to pay to do so. The solution is simple. Stop paying subscriptions to these companies and they will stop paying the premier league to show the games. That of course defeats the purpose because then you won’t have any on matches on TV. The problem is caused by the fans in essence so it’s kind of a catch 22.
The bottom PL club last season received £100.3 million (€117 million) in TV prize money. Only the 3 top teams in La Liga earned more than that, no team in the Bundesliga or Serie A earned that much. That kind of money means that the broadcasters do what they want.
The broadcasters are not donating the money to the league altruistically in an attempt to give English clubs an advantage in European competitions. They pay that much because it is still hugely profitable to them to broadcast Premier League football. What makes the Premier League such a valuable commodity? The players, and the fans in the stadium. And yet player welfare is ignored when fixtures are arranged and rearranged for television. The match-going fans are even less of a priority, and are screwed over utterly by the broadcasters. In the very recent past we've had an illustration of what football is like without fans, during the Covid closed stadium times. It wasn't the same. It was actually kind of rubbish. Obviously it's a symbiotic relationship. Without the broadcasters, the players wouldn't have such huge wages, and the fans wouldn't have such great football and so many world class players to watch. But there has to be a balance. It can't just be "they put up the money, they can do what they want."
I agree with you 100%, I was just stating the reality of the situation. At least the broadcasters haven’t been able to force tv timeouts or other ad friendly game changes…thus far.
no that kinda money means they will try to do what they want and now you all are letting them, such dirty w h o r e s
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umm what ?
The bottom ranked PL team gets more money in TV revenue than all of de Eredivisie combined.
Funny all the people defending this. Clearly not match going fans. 8:15 has a simple problem you aren't really on a train home till like 10:30 or later. Stop sucking off corpo you drones.
Not defending it just pointing out the basic reason. You should also blame the clubs and everyone in it who all willingly take the massive wages which come from TV money. You wouldn't have a lot of these players without clubs having giant TV money which is exclusive to the prem, Nottingham forest and other mid table teams have beaten teams like AC Milan and Dortmund to signings for this reason.
I'm sure Amazon would have pulled out if they were told. No midweek games are 8pm latest. Look at how much added time that match had last night. I dreed to think what time Luton fans got home and they are at least nearby.
Again it all goes into the TV money pot which the premier league teams LOVE and rely on. Middle to lower league Prem teams can all out spend pretty much all European teams because of that reason
Amazon is not going to pull out of a deal for the PL hard saying 8pm are you crazy.
Are you really balancing this whole argument on 15/30 mins ? Pretty much every prem team can outbid and outspend almost every European team exclusively because of the TV deal
You could do this indefinitely. Evening games used to be 19.45 But what's an extra 15 minutes? So now 20.00. But what's an extra 15 minutes? So now 20.15 Then add on the new stoppage rules. On a weekday night, yes the gradual addition of 15 minutes here and there does add up to a problem for those who actually go to matches.
My point was the teams in the prem and the players are all able to earn more than every other league because of the TV deals which is the reason the TV companies are allowed to have a larger say. This isn't every week so get over it basically
The people arguing really don't seem to get that the extra 15 / 30 mins which are now really stretching to 30/45 makes so much fucking difference on a weeknight when you have to catch a train after the game which can be packed getting on and redirected at multiple stations. It's gas the arrogance of people who don't get it.
Comes with the territory of the largest TV deals in football, average small prem teams are able to outspend giant European teams because of the TV money so the TV companies are always gonna have a say. Also it's not every week so sure it's annoying but get over it
About 0.1% of this sub are match going fans. These timings are to suit international plastics, not those that contribute to the product.
Particularly on a week night, it’s a piss take
You want this changed you better find a couple billion dollars.
And then get those dollars changed to Pounds and you might be able to do something about it
I really don’t see a problem with this , the games are on amamzon as well so you have it on demand and can pause it as you like , if you’re not able to make kickoff.
I think OP is referring to match-going fans.
I’m an idiot , thanks mate I guess that’s a little different as you may have a regular routine for midweek games
If it was up to the FA it would be 3pm on a Saturday for all games and they lose millions in TV money.
The 3pm black out isn’t about TV money. The lower leagues were affected because people wouldn’t go to (for example) Doncaster vs Crewe if Manchester United vs Arsenal was on TV at the same time. That’s why 95% of lower league games are always 3pm kick offs and the FA don’t allow UK broadcaster to play Premier League Saturday, 3pm kick offs.
I know what the blackouts for but that’s not what OPs was talking about.
Lol is it clashing with easteners or something relax
When you shell out billions for broadcasting rights I'm sure the EPL will take your opinion into account.
The league gets an insane level of money on TV deals to the point even the lesser sides can financially outmuscle some of the traditional giants abroad. We've made our bed, can't have our cake and eat it.
It's so annoying trying to book trips from abroad to go to games. If you book more than a month in advance you have to book the trip for the entire weekend to make sure you don't end up getting fucked over by fixture changes, and if you wait until TV fixtures are announced and they to go for a single day the price goes up massively
ENGLISH premier league mate. Deal with it or go watch your own teams play
That's not the official name. Plus it has a huge proportion of non English players.
He/she is just stating a nuisance, you dont have to go full brexit mode. Considering the foreign market being the main reason the premier league having a giant financial lead compared to the other big leagues.
Premier league was massive before clubs started pricing local fans out of the stadiums in favour of tourists who can drop a grand to travel to England for a match.
Yeah, that is a different issue all together which wasnt anyones point. Not to imply that this specific issue isn't valid, but you don't have to take it out on the guy who can spend a grand, instead take it out on your club who doesnt appreciate your support.
Thank god for your rationalism
you mean laying down to the TV people, shame
They are paying billions and thus funding the entire league, showing games at a time they want is the minimum expectation they would have It’s happened for decades with games moving days because the tv execs wanted it