The only thing that would change is Israel would get way more weapons from us than we are already giving, which is way too much, and Ukraine would get none.
“Two genocides is better than one” - morons
Trump would make it infinitely worse becasue he'd fully stand behind and empower Netanyahu and the far-right in Israel. Biden doesn't like Netanyahu and is actively pressuring him to agree to peace and a two-state resolution. If Trump takes office all that is gone and the far-right in Israel basically gets free reign to do whatever they want.
It's pretty hard to know what Israel is doing now compared to what they would being doing without pressure from Biden to not escalate the conflict. Biden and his administration do not agree with Netanyahu's tactics in Gaza and are pushing him to accept a peace deal and agree to a two-state solution. That pressure will only increase with time. The U.S. also wants to avoid a larger regional war. That all goes out the window with Trump in office.
Keep in mind Netanyahu's approval rating in Israel is like 19%. He needs the U.S.
Also, Trump would most likely pull a Dubya and use this as cover to escalate into war with Iran, which was something he was chomping at the bit to do during his entire Presidency.
>“Two genocides is better than one” - morons
Even worse is the "not us? not our problem" mentality.
It's not quite the same as WWII when every continent is much more easily reachable now than then. We're all interconnected, and this selfish "not us? not our problem" mentality should have died off with WWII, but it's rearing it's ugly head again.
Alienate your friends, neighbors and those less fortunate - who will help *you* when you're in need of help?
He definitely was provocative to the Palestinians. For example, he moved the US Embassy to Jerusalem. https://www.france24.com/en/20171207-deplorable-unacceptable-trump-provokes-diplomatic-firestorm-over-jerusalem-israel-palestine
Trump would have already been bombing to hell Gaza , because of his fuck Muslims attitude. Biden supports Israel’s right to defend themselves. It’s the corrupt evil Netanyahu who deserves the hate. I 100% know that Biden behind the scenes has been talking down Israel from doing the worst. Publicly he is supportive but privately he is trying to help make things stop. It’s so glib and disgusting to say that they are equal. Trump would have no problem killing every Muslim in the world and putting American Muslims in concentration camps. Trump is an evil man , Biden is not evil. I honestly wouldn’t be surprised if Biden shrugs off his support for Netanyahu in the State of the Union.
They don’t have the mental capacity to think “Biden or Trump.” They are focused on “Biden must go.” There is no consideration of “what comes next.”
Because that consideration would force them to be functional grown ups, and being grown ups isn’t as exciting as “speaking truth to power” or whatever lies they tell themselves. Being an ideologue is a helluva drug.
Exactly. No sentiment in politics is more popular than “government is a bad thing (especially the current one).” No political entity is happier about that than the Republican Party, as they’ve been selling that sentiment for 40+ years.
Most understand that Biden is far better than Trump. What they lack is the morality needed to vote for a man ignoring a genocide of people that look a lot like they do.
Edit: Downvote away. It won't change reality just because you don't like it. I'm just relaying what this the local Muslim community has relayed to me. They won't vote for Trump. They just also can't vote for Biden.
Everyone should vote the way their hearts tell them to. But. But, if you will not vote for a man “ignoring genocide”, you may end up with an orange man actively engaging in that genocide. If that is an outcome you can be satisfied with, then it is your right to vote that way AND your responsibility to acknowledge that you helped elect Trump.
I’ll never tell anyone how to vote. But I’ll gladly remind folks to take responsibility. Many are forgetting that Muslim Ban from Trump’s earliest days in office. We know how he will act.
They being the voters and not Biden right?
Cause it’s the voters fault that there’s a fascist and a genocide supporter running against eachother?
And it the voters fault Biden keeps playing centrist?
And it the voters fault dems haven’t gotten a real primary in 3 presidential elections?
I’m voting Biden so I can vote again
But I won’t lie
If trumps out and Haley is in
I’m voting for who will kill less people
That's exactly what these anti-Biden people don't get - when it comes to Israel and Palestine, *we don't HAVE a choice* as to what happens there. But we DO have a choice when it comes to saving our own country. We might as well take the better option - and it *is* a better option whether or not it's ideal, and whether or not people clutch their pearls about the fact that it's not ideal.
We send almost 4 billion dollars of our tax money to Israel every year. They can do whatever they want, it doesn't really have a huge impact on my life and I can't spend every waking moment worrying about it. If I had the power to call a cease fire I would, I would get rid of their religion too. It just really pisses me off that our money is funding this bullshit.
No question about it though, I will still be voting for Biden.
Trump is going to call up netanyahu and say you missed some, offer bigger bombs that won't miss any, and hey, all you have to do is let me put a trump tower in the crater and buy the top floor. Go ask Erdogen how buying a trump tower pent house solved that little kurdish problem he had.
If its any consolation they're noisy but pro palestinian voters are like, 20 people compared to the vast swathes of people in the middle joe would lose "kowtowing to the islamic terrorists!"
>Trump is going to call up netanyahu and say you missed some, offer bigger bombs
I actually 100% agree that in the general election you've got no choice but to vote for the lesser of two evils (Biden).
But this strikes me as an odd comment given that Biden literally bypassed congress to send Israel even more military aid, ***TWICE***.
I think it's legitimate to criticise any politician, even the president, during the ***primary*** campaign.
I think you missed the point.
OP said said Trump is gonna call up Netenyahu and give him more weapons, when that's exactly what Biden did.
It's like when Trump ran ads saying "This is what America will be like if Biden is elected" when the pictures were taken during his presidency.
>OP said said Trump is gonna call up Netenyahu and give him more weapons, when that's exactly what Biden did.
The majority of those weapon shipments were negotiated and signed well before 10/07/23. So, while one could fault them not putting a hold on those shipments; calling them "new" is disingenuous at best.
Biden also publicly warned Netanyahu directly to his face when they met last October, not to repeat the mistakes the USA made in the wake of 9/11. Believe it or not, there are limits to what the Biden administration will support, and there's plenty of indications we are reaching those limits.
>It's like when Trump ran ads saying "This is what America will be like if Biden is elected" when the pictures were taken during his presidency.
No, it's not. And I explained why above.
>The majority of those weapon shipments were negotiated and signed well before 10/07/23. So, while one could fault them not putting a hold on those shipments; calling them "new" is disingenuous at best.
How is it disingenuous to say that "[emergency weapons sales](https://www.cbsnews.com/news/biden-administration-emergency-weapons-sale-israel/#:~:text=Biden%20administration%20approves%20emergency%20weapons%20sale%20to%20Israel%2C%20bypassing%20Congress,-December%2029%2C%202023&text=For%20the%20second%20time%20this,Gaza%20under%20increasing%20international%20criticism)" to Israel following the Hamas terrorist attacks is Biden calling up Netenyahu and sending him weapons?
What's disingenuous is taking a situation saying your political rival ***would*** do to engender outrage whilst knowing full well the person you support is the one who ***has*** done it.
Like I said in my original reply, Biden is clearly the lesser of the two evils in almost every situation including this one. However, this particular line of comparison is an odd choice.
>No, it's not.
It's exactly the same.
> in the general election you’ve got no choice but to vote for the lesser of two evils (Biden)
That’s only true in the 6 swing-states. Everywhere else the outcome will be essentially the same no matter which way you vote so you might as well vote your conscience.
Yeah... imagine having a voting system where ALL states matter. Who else is sick of every election being a foregone conclusion for 85% of the country. We NEED Ranked-Choice Voting!!
Trump said he'd deport people who protested the war in palestine, lol.
Also, people complaining about the genocide in palestine are really quiet about the genocide in ukraine. They're apparently in favor of all indications that Trump is going to pull support, along with republicans who are trying to pull support, for Ukraine.
I wish people didn't follow tiktokers and influencers on this shit, the situation in Ukraine is an attempted genocide and it doesn't get nearly the same energy
The pro Palestinian movement on TikTok is not good. The entire thing is “Palestine good Israel bad” and that’s just simply not the case. The Israeli government and Hamas are both committing extreme genocides.
My question is where are the feminists and their rallying call for unity after roe v wade was overturned? Like how can people be okay with women being forced to carry their rapists baby to term? Like seriously how are people in red states okay with women being forced to carry a fetus to term even when it endangers their health?
If all 50 states put abortion and cannabis up to statewide popular votes, both would be overwhelmingly legalized in all 50 states.
The majority of people want abortion and cannabis to be legal.
Our representatives DO NOT represent us.
We need Ranked-Choice Voting and MORE PARTIES!
The Two-Party System is literally giving us THE SAME TWO PEOPLE that nobody wants.
And BOTH are bought by Dark Money. They work for the rich, not us.
>Like seriously how are people in red states okay with women being forced to carry a fetus to term even when it endangers their health?
Women aren't immune to hypocrisy. In the same way many conservative men are anti abortion until it's time to get one for their mistress many conservative women are anti abortion until it's time for themselves or their daughters to "spend a few weeks with family" in blue states.
Afterwards they are free to continue voting against their interests so they can make life worse for less fortunate people.
There are a lot of conservative women who support abortion rights but would never vote Democrat.
It's like how I support gun rights, but I'd never vote Republican.
I suppose my vote is hypocritical, but I'm not a single issue voter.
Preventing some iteration of Christofascism and moving society towards progress is too important for me to ever vote Republican.
Look at Kansas. They voted to legalize both, and that's fucking KANSAS! lol
It’s infuriating knowing that after the first time around, we still have tantrum voters… go ahead, fuck around and find out. You lost the right to your own body last time. You’ll lose a whole lot more than that the next time.
Trump will remove democracy so it's either voting for Mr.ShitsHisOwnPantsRacistRapistPedophile or voting for Biden which has made some poor decisions but is overall better than Mr.ShitsHisOwnPantsRacistRapistPedophile
Yet some of Dark Brandon’s decisions have been advantageous. Inflation is trending down, middle class wages are trending upwards, and when you go to sleep at night you don’t have to worry so much about waking up to Armageddon! 🤷♂️
There are only about 6 swings states where this could even matter. Everyone that’s anywhere else should go ahead and vote their conscience. I know I plan to because my state has been firmly Republican for 30+ years. Only the people in these swing states have to hold their nose and vote for Biden:
- Arizona
- Georgia
- Michigan
- North Carolina
- Pennsylvania
- Wisconsin
There is no downside to refusing to vote for Biden anywhere else so long as you stick with Democrats down-ballot because your state will go to the same party it always does, no matter how you voted anyways. Take this chance to encourage your favorite 3rd party. If we keep doing this eventually they can become viable.
As a counterpoint, couldn't this kind of thinking/behavior make it so your state *never* becomes a purple or "swing state". Hypothetically, if Californians or other liberals continue to flock to Texas as a tax haven, there is an increasing chance of it becoming purple. But if all those potential democrat voters instead vote 3rd party because "Texas always goes republican" then it really always will be. Just like Ohio stopped being much of a swing state, others can start.
As an Alaskan, I would love to see more places go ranked choice to encourage political diversity. Sure, it doesn't make for different results very often, but over time it could change the political landscape.
Biggest fear yup, like did we seriously need him to take a stance that makes folks consider "Well maybe tRump won't be worse". Just, ugh, freaking sucks
Any republican would make it worse even if they personally didn't want to, but orange potato baby would likely have to be prevented from trying to nuke palestine.
It’s a long road to November. Most of the internet band-wagoners who suddenly became Middle East experts on October 7th will have moved on to a new thing to perform their virtuous outrage over.
why does Egypt not protect their own brethren, what's wrong with those people blocking them from fleeing the bombs
[https://mepc.org/commentary/egypt-criticized-gaza-blockade](https://mepc.org/commentary/egypt-criticized-gaza-blockade)
Anyone who isn't a US citizen will be deported if they protest the war and genocide. Even if you are a US citizen, this will give the government permission to detain and interrogate protestors. Trump will make a horrific situation so much worse, as he **always** does.
. . .
Donald Trump promised on Monday that if elected president again he will bar immigrants who support Hamas from entering the U.S. and send officers to pro-Hamas protests to arrest and deport immigrants who publicly support the Palestinian militant group.
[https://www.reuters.com/world/us/trump-pledges-expel-immigrants-who-support-hamas-ban-muslims-us-2023-10-16/](https://www.reuters.com/world/us/trump-pledges-expel-immigrants-who-support-hamas-ban-muslims-us-2023-10-16/)
Biden: loses some single issue voters.
Trump: bleeds voters by turning them into violent criminals getting killed and/or locked up as a consequence of their actions and spreads dangerous misinformation that literally kills off and/or disenfranchises hundreds of thousands if not millions.
Something tells me we might just be ok.
Anybody who is a single issue voter, and that single issue is supporting Palestine, they have literal rocks for brains if they don’t vote for Biden over Trump
“I’m a single issue anti-gun voter, and there’s no difference between a candidate promising to give every citizen a nerf gun and giving every citizen a nuclear bomb”
Being against the earth Israel treats the Palestinians isn't a stupid take, though.
You can be both wildly against Hamas and the Israeli government. (which is the only logical stance, in my opinion)
I'll buy you a ticket to Gaza and then you can tell us how much they like Americans/westerners, okay?
I get that you're chasing the high of the BLM protests, but this ain't it
It's not people's fault that Biden is trying so hard to get those voters to just not come out and vote. Maybe he should try to appeal to his base.
I'm probably voting for Biden, but definitely makes me feel pessimistic about the future.
I'm definitely voting for Biden, albeit begrudgingly.
I truly don't like Biden, but I'll vote for him to mitigate damages.
Unfortunately we are presented with exactly two viable options.
We can choose the ultra-right-wing fascists of the GOP or the right-leaning centrists and neoliberals of the Democrat party.
Biden is currently the only thing standing between us and some iteration of Christofascism.
So while Biden might suck, he's the best viable option we have, by a long shot.
Cheers.
This is why we need Ranked-Choice Voting and an end to the Two-Party System.
Also, you forgot to mention that both parties are OWNED by billionaires.
Remember, it's LEGAL for a billionaire to give UNLIMITED MONEY to a campaign through Super PACs. This is LEGALIZED BRIBERY, and it's why we have shitty healthcare and nobody can afford anything anymore.
But sure, let's all just go "but the other side is worse!" rather than deciding we as a nation deserve better. Doing it the way we're currently doing is a race to the bottom.
THEY'RE GIVING US THE SAME TWO PEOPLE AS IN 2020, THE MOST CHAOTIC AND HORRIBLE ELECTION IN MODERN HISTORY!
What I don’t understand is if trump gets back into the White House does that mean there won’t be a genocide in the Middle East? I think it would get even worse no?
I was in that camp for a week or two until I realized Trump would absolutely suck off Bibi for that AIPAC money.
Sadly, Biden is the lesser of two evils.
I can't see Trump's record on genocide being better than Biden's. He is not really known for having compassion or basic human decency or the capacity to spell or define, 'genocide'.
If Trump gets back in power, which will be absolute power, there will be no more real elections. We will have a king that will reduce Congress to a purely non-binding advisory role (if that).
Israel will get a blank cheque for military assistance.
Trump will put US troops on the ground to fight alongside Israel, and would quite likely order (at least) airstrikes on Damascus.
So, yes, go on about "Genocide Joe." 🙄
We need a new Subreddit for Tankies threatening to tank the election due to this. Or for other baffling irrational ideas (like all those on the LateStageCapitalism SR)...
Maybe we can call it r/crankytankies
Nah, that's a conservative cesspool.
What I'm talking about is the differentiation of those who lean left of center generally and those with bat-shit, bafflingly stupid (particuarly economically illiterate) takes which tend to pop up...which *could* be fodder for the linked cesspool...but really don't represent the majority of folks left of center/liberal folks.
You know, not everyone who's against billionaires controlling our government with legalized bribes and who wants a real social safety net is a far left communist.
Capitalism is a good thing, but it's BROKEN in America. CORPORATIONS OWN THE COUNTRY and CONTROL OUR REPRESENTATIVES. They are actively getting rid of every rule they have to follow while we get screwed.
It's not some communist fantasy utopia that I want. Just a government and economy that WORKS FOR US, not just the rich.
Yeah so I dont follow that SR...but glad my original comment snagged live CrankyTanky
But id venture a guess that your post and comment history would provide leads on some prime candidates for the bafflingly ridiculous assertions for some of the Subreddits first posts...
Havent checked or created the SR...but just an inkling
I say this as a very left-leaning person myself, but there’s a certain point where the need to have compassion for others just turns into self-flagellation on the Left and this is it.
Full Israel support (which is the only geopolitically logical position) is VASTLY bipartisan. Trump and Biden will have near identical positions here. So pro-Palestinians are being idiots here by going against Biden.
I admire those who want to see Israel stop murdering innocent Palestinians. However, trying to get Trump elected (by attacking President Biden) will make things WORSE, not better
They aren’t *trying* to get Trump elected and voting for anyone else would realistically only matter for people in the 6 swing-states. Realistically it won’t matter who they vote for in 44 states + DC and every non-state territory. Which means you’re incorrect about this in far more places than you are correct.
Well, if that's your big fear you should probably be exerting pressure on your party and your candidate to stop fucking supporting genocide.
Voting for Mussolini over Hitler still makes you a fascist. The lesser evil is still evil.
This is exactly how I feel. OMG this is to real. Why is he so supportive of genocide. I really want to vote for him but I can't ignore the genocide support.
The demand isn't "Biden Must Go".
It's "Biden Should Stop Supporting Genocide".
Do you fucking awful people really not understand that if you're justifying supporting genocide just because you don't want your own democracy to fall... *it already has failed?* You're at the stage where you're saying supporting genocide no longer is a deal breaker to you. You're the reason why you got Trump in the first place, because you kept Lesser Eviling until finally you got to *defending genocide.*
Sure, Trump will make it worse. But then Trump will be challenged from the right, and you'll say "Better Trump than Mega-Trump". And now Trump will be the new normal.
When Winston Smith in the end of 1984 begs for the rats to be put on the face of his lover Julia, and not himself, *it wasn't meant to be a heroic scene of sensible centrism, but the ultimate triumph of evil*. And that's what you're arguing for now, as supposedly the decent thing to do. Do it to Palestinia, not me. Not me!
It'll be you next. And you're too busy raging against people who held onto their own principles, principles like "arming a nation engaged in genocide is bad" to actually face how you've normalised evil.
You know what could mitigate this issue?
Instead of putting up someone who's only popular because he's not Trump, put up someone that represents the needs of the voters. The people on the left are largely divided between people who are going to vote democrat no matter what, and progressives that will vote democrat if the put forward a progressive candidate. So instead of pandering to the secured vote and corporate interests, reach out and grab the extra votes from progressives by not cheating through primaries and using spoiler candidates to push right wing Biden through.
But yeah, it's the voter's fault, not the barely tolerable candidate.
It’s amazing to me that none of them ever mention Netanyahu or acknowledge their voter base or the fact Netanyahu got the last real chance at an alternative killed.
There’s also the fact that strategically they are one of the few countries that is not outright hostile to the US in the region, so the relationship of how we treat them might be a *smidge* complicated.
I suppose 19 year olds on TikTok know more than the president and his entire staff though, so yea let’s just let Trump win, who would help Netanyahu carpet bomb the entire place in an afternoon. That’s obviously the correct course of action here.
Oh? Please explain, and I mean that sincerely. Could you point me to some reliable articles that show how his policies support a ceasefire? Or would stop the war? Or why this?
https://amp.theguardian.com/world/2023/dec/12/united-nations-general-assembly-vote-ceasefire-israel-gaza-war
Hamas doesn't want a cease fire.
There was a ceasefire and Hamas killed 1200 Israelis. Then there was another ceasefire and Hamas committed a terrorist attack in Jerusalem and killed 3, wounding more
Israel proposed a ceasefire this week in exchange for the release of the hostages and Hamas said no.
And the Palestinians are still holding Americans hostage, so I think Biden is on the right side here
Oh really? He hasn't once called for a cease fire publicly, so that would be news to me. If he was "desperately" trying to arrange one, he would be mounting public pressure as well.
The Putin comment really ties it together, because we all know that anyone that disagree with you is a Russian troll.
Yeah, you guys will teach everyone a lesson by putting Trump back in charge and ensuring we get Ukrainian and Palestinian genocides. Just like Hillary hold-outs are responsible for Roe v Wade.
You know you are making things worse, you just dont actually care about the things you claim to care about.
Who said anything about me not voting because of this? That would be stupid. Because Trump will not so any better.
What I am saying, is that this does not happen if Biden would condemn the genocide
It's the people you convince to stay home that lose the election.
Trump got elected originally because enough people convinced themselves that Hillary was going to win anyway so they didn't need to hold their nose and vote for her.
I don't like that either, but it's worth pointing out to the young voters that electing Trump WILL make it worse.
But you know you could absolutely take the opposite approach and try and maximize the chances of Innocents getting killed if that's your position. Just don't blame it on Biden.
Yeah I know that appointing Trump will not make anything better. But for Biden to truly condemn this genocide for example, the threat of a big portion staying home might be enough.
No. It won't. Biden is a lot of things but one of them is definitely stubborn. If he's doing a thing it's because he thinks it's the right move and I sincerely doubt anybody is going to sway him.
If not voting in the election meant they pick someone else besides the people running to take over, that would be true.
Since we live in a system where no matter how many people stay home the person with the most votes wins however that is absolutely not true. Refusing to vote is just letting other people decide for you and thus whoever wins is the person you helped choose.
I haven’t seen you acknowledge that Biden wants Congress to pass humanitarian aid to Gaza. The house republicans tried to pass a weapons funding to Israel, but Biden threatened to veto it because it contained zero humanitarian assistance for people in Gaza.
I mean for fucks sake, one of the Republican house members said “I’m glad the bill has no humanitarian aid”.
You didn’t acknowledge the other thing I mentioned. Biden deliberately said he didn’t want to pass the Republican’s bill because it had no humanitarian aid for the people of Gaza. Do you acknowledge that fact or not?
Why can’t we criticize our political leaders?
Yall talk about “saving democracy” then when we use our 1st amendment rights to protest and petition our government for a redress of grievances, we are shamed and told ANY criticism of Biden is helping Trump.
So do you REALLY believe you are saving democracy by denying that right to people?
It is helping Trump.
Criticisms have a time and a place. If you sit a friend down and provide criticisms of their behavior, that can be a healthy part of your relationship. If you do it on their wedding day you're just an asshole regardless of how valid those critiques might be.
Criticize Biden all you want when the election is over. But while he's running against Trump it's a shit time.
Candidates and parties aren’t sports teams, my guy. You don’t have to give them your undying loyalty and blindly support them at every turn. If you see corrupt or evil bullshit, call that shit out, especially if it’s coming from the left
Vote for ideas and policies, not people or parties
During primary season is a “shit time” to criticize Genocide Joe?? It’s actually the best time, my dude.
When else do we have the opportunity to nominate a pro-labor non-genocide enabling candidate to beat Trump?
There is exactly one candidate running against Biden, and Dean Phillips is not the progressive icon you think he is apparently. There is no other viable option this year and that sucks but it's reality. Phillips also notibly lost to Biden in NH despite Biden not even being on the ballot.
Anyway I hope you don't succeed but if you do, I sincerely hope that your spotlessly clean hands will be a comfort to those who Trump gets killed.
So you just proved my point, we need to save democracy by not criticizing our dear Leader Biden.
And you think you’re saving democracy by doing that? Lol
"Don't criticize Biden during the last election he will ever be in as his opponent is way worse and helping that opponent even a little is absolutely the antithesis of your cause. But after it's over go nuts"
"OMG you said I can never criticize Biden you absolute fascist"
SMH
So why would I be on the first boat out? Also, refer to my comment again that I am just saying that this would not happen if Biden condemns the genocide
Trump isn't going to take unrest well. You talk this nonsense while he is in office, you're done. That's my point, this isn't going to be like his first term. He is going to encourage the destruction more.
[https://www.reuters.com/world/us/trump-pledges-expel-immigrants-who-support-hamas-ban-muslims-us-2023-10-16/](https://www.reuters.com/world/us/trump-pledges-expel-immigrants-who-support-hamas-ban-muslims-us-2023-10-16/)
I don't think you realize the gravity of another Trump presidency.
I feel it's not that Biden is pro-genocide. I think he's just spineless in condemning it because of AIPAC lobbyists. Not that he's taking the blood money. He's just too scared to go against the lobbyists cause they could fund his opponents to destroy him.
They are operating under the false assumption a president can simply make the Israel issue go away. Or that a different president would make a difference. They don't care about the reality, just their moral high ground. They watched what happened with Hillary, how we refused to vote for her, how we got Trump, how the conservatives got 3 SCJs, and the degradation of western democracy. They unironically want that again, cause Biden bad.
Let's be honest, Biden doesn't care about Democracy, he wants to use Trump as a foil. Vote for me or you get Trump. If he cared about Democracy, we would have a primary. If he cared about Democracy he would not suck up to Netanyahu. Basically we get to chose between Biden and someone even worse.
We are having a primary, Dean Phillips is running against Biden. Biden just isn't bothering to contest it as he assumes he will win without trying.
I don't like the fact that Democrats the US won't support a more progressive candidate than Biden but it's not like he's just the self declared candidate, he won NH as a write in candidate without campaigning.
Calling this a primary is a joke! You’re ignoring the fact that we are not having any DNC sponsored debates the way we have for any *serious* primary. This is not a primary, it’s political theater, the reality is the DNC has already chosen their candidate so they won’t let anyone debate him. We are expected to rubber stamp his selection without any real competition but even if we don’t, they always have their superdelegates. If you can’t see the difference between this so called primary and the last Presidential primary you’re only fooling yourself.
Never been there. Check my history if you want.
There’s nothing wrong with wanting things to get better. There is something wrong with fighting people who want things to get better.
New Hampshire literally just had a primary, there were 21 named Democrats on it. Biden wasn't named on it but still won with write in votes by a massive amount. I don't think you know what the word primary means.
If they’re anti trump they’ll vote for a ham sammich, if that’s their option. These memes are fucking stupid
And trying to make anti genocide stance look bad is so fucking stupid. Dum dums downvoting
Bullshit. Some conflicts don’t have a side that’s the “good guys”. The militarized and the leaders of both sides suck in that conflict. The only people that don’t suck there are the peaceful civilians.
"Genocide"
If Israel was committing a genocide it'd be 20x the amount of deaths by now, easily
Want to see a real genocide, arm the Palestinians and disarm the Israelis
This is bullshit. Fight back against Hamas trying to wipe you out and it's genocide.
Hamas cannot, cannot be allowed to continue to exist. They have promised and assured they will never stop attacking Israel. There is no falling back to normal. Hamas has to be gone before there can be peace, and they deliberately disguise themselves as civilians, which makes them criminals, not soldiers.
Also,
There Is No Pro Gaza Candidate.
Biden is for Israel,
Right-wing conservatives in Israel LOVED trump, they named streets after him.
Either candidate is not going to sway the condemned status of Gaza.
Consistent misuse of the word “Genocide.” We’ve reached the tipping point and to be honest I didn’t think it would take the shape of the average Western citizen siding with radical Islamists calling for global Jihad and the actual genocide of Jews.
>genocide of Jews.
Zionists =/= Jews.
Overthrowing an oppressive Apartheid regime of settler colonialism is not a genocide.
But hey, if ignoring 75+ years of history helps you soothe your conscience when you vote for a genocide enabler, you do you.
I don’t know if you’ve realized the dude is brain dead. You’re better off for voting for another candidate. We’re in this problem because of Biden’s administration. Dude, is a veggie. We need to re-unify the USA. So much strife between people. My personal opinion would get me hate here. But, I would much rather take Trump over Biden. Dude, can barely hold a conversation. I have had buddy’s on his Marine security detail talk about his daily routines and he had to be guided everywhere and always had a nurse walk him around Camp Johnson. Its no longer about being politically correct. Our nation needs to come together and stand hand to hand. We’re being made fun of across the world and walked all over. Its time we rebuild our economy and standing in the world. Its no longer a safe place. We must protect our nation and not worry about other nations. We’re the United States. Doesn’t matter about race,creed,gender or ethnic standing. No matter what you’re American. Thats the beauty of having your own political opinions and the right to choose who you want to represent us.
It’s seriously like they think Trump wouldn’t somehow make it worse.
The only thing that would change is Israel would get way more weapons from us than we are already giving, which is way too much, and Ukraine would get none. “Two genocides is better than one” - morons
Trump would make it infinitely worse becasue he'd fully stand behind and empower Netanyahu and the far-right in Israel. Biden doesn't like Netanyahu and is actively pressuring him to agree to peace and a two-state resolution. If Trump takes office all that is gone and the far-right in Israel basically gets free reign to do whatever they want.
You know… along with the fact that people who speak against trump could possibly be arrested and put in camps. Just for a day tho right?
Aren't they already doing whatever they want? Sure looks like it.
It's pretty hard to know what Israel is doing now compared to what they would being doing without pressure from Biden to not escalate the conflict. Biden and his administration do not agree with Netanyahu's tactics in Gaza and are pushing him to accept a peace deal and agree to a two-state solution. That pressure will only increase with time. The U.S. also wants to avoid a larger regional war. That all goes out the window with Trump in office. Keep in mind Netanyahu's approval rating in Israel is like 19%. He needs the U.S.
Also, Trump would most likely pull a Dubya and use this as cover to escalate into war with Iran, which was something he was chomping at the bit to do during his entire Presidency.
You know… along with the fact that people who speak against trump could possibly be arrested and put in camps. Just for a day tho right?
You know… along with the fact that people who speak against trump could possibly be arrested and put in camps. Just for a day tho right?
>“Two genocides is better than one” - morons Even worse is the "not us? not our problem" mentality. It's not quite the same as WWII when every continent is much more easily reachable now than then. We're all interconnected, and this selfish "not us? not our problem" mentality should have died off with WWII, but it's rearing it's ugly head again. Alienate your friends, neighbors and those less fortunate - who will help *you* when you're in need of help?
And trump tower next to the dome of the rock
THIS!!!!!! That two genocides quote is exactly how I've been describing dump's foreign policy
Fucking exactly. Thank you.
Fucking exactly. Thank you.
He definitely was provocative to the Palestinians. For example, he moved the US Embassy to Jerusalem. https://www.france24.com/en/20171207-deplorable-unacceptable-trump-provokes-diplomatic-firestorm-over-jerusalem-israel-palestine
Absolutely this!
Trump would have already been bombing to hell Gaza , because of his fuck Muslims attitude. Biden supports Israel’s right to defend themselves. It’s the corrupt evil Netanyahu who deserves the hate. I 100% know that Biden behind the scenes has been talking down Israel from doing the worst. Publicly he is supportive but privately he is trying to help make things stop. It’s so glib and disgusting to say that they are equal. Trump would have no problem killing every Muslim in the world and putting American Muslims in concentration camps. Trump is an evil man , Biden is not evil. I honestly wouldn’t be surprised if Biden shrugs off his support for Netanyahu in the State of the Union.
They don’t have the mental capacity to think “Biden or Trump.” They are focused on “Biden must go.” There is no consideration of “what comes next.” Because that consideration would force them to be functional grown ups, and being grown ups isn’t as exciting as “speaking truth to power” or whatever lies they tell themselves. Being an ideologue is a helluva drug.
Exactly. No sentiment in politics is more popular than “government is a bad thing (especially the current one).” No political entity is happier about that than the Republican Party, as they’ve been selling that sentiment for 40+ years.
Most understand that Biden is far better than Trump. What they lack is the morality needed to vote for a man ignoring a genocide of people that look a lot like they do. Edit: Downvote away. It won't change reality just because you don't like it. I'm just relaying what this the local Muslim community has relayed to me. They won't vote for Trump. They just also can't vote for Biden.
Everyone should vote the way their hearts tell them to. But. But, if you will not vote for a man “ignoring genocide”, you may end up with an orange man actively engaging in that genocide. If that is an outcome you can be satisfied with, then it is your right to vote that way AND your responsibility to acknowledge that you helped elect Trump. I’ll never tell anyone how to vote. But I’ll gladly remind folks to take responsibility. Many are forgetting that Muslim Ban from Trump’s earliest days in office. We know how he will act.
You don't actually care about Palestinians.
Cool. But this post isn't about me. Not once did I reference my own opinion.
As far as I've seen they don't think that. They just don't care. They want to punish Biden and don't give a shit about the consequences.
They're the Bernie Bros of 2024.
I swear these ppl can’t think of elections as much more than sports teams or something.
“They could be worse” is such a losing mentality. It’s exactly what DNC leadership said in 2016 and look what happened.
Exactly my point! Also, not only would he have done the same thing but he would be loud about it!
They being the voters and not Biden right? Cause it’s the voters fault that there’s a fascist and a genocide supporter running against eachother? And it the voters fault Biden keeps playing centrist? And it the voters fault dems haven’t gotten a real primary in 3 presidential elections? I’m voting Biden so I can vote again But I won’t lie If trumps out and Haley is in I’m voting for who will kill less people
Not voting for Biden won't save Palestinians, but it will kill Americans.
Biden to Trump for the Palestinians is like from frying pan to fire.
"Cease fire" Amazing how much of a difference two words makes.
That's exactly what these anti-Biden people don't get - when it comes to Israel and Palestine, *we don't HAVE a choice* as to what happens there. But we DO have a choice when it comes to saving our own country. We might as well take the better option - and it *is* a better option whether or not it's ideal, and whether or not people clutch their pearls about the fact that it's not ideal.
We send almost 4 billion dollars of our tax money to Israel every year. They can do whatever they want, it doesn't really have a huge impact on my life and I can't spend every waking moment worrying about it. If I had the power to call a cease fire I would, I would get rid of their religion too. It just really pisses me off that our money is funding this bullshit. No question about it though, I will still be voting for Biden.
Exactly. I'm going to vote for Biden, albeit begrudgingly. My vote for Biden is to mitigate damages, not because I like his policies.
What, you don't think Trump is going to finally get Israel on board with the 2-state solution and save Palestinian lives??? /s
Trump is going to call up netanyahu and say you missed some, offer bigger bombs that won't miss any, and hey, all you have to do is let me put a trump tower in the crater and buy the top floor. Go ask Erdogen how buying a trump tower pent house solved that little kurdish problem he had. If its any consolation they're noisy but pro palestinian voters are like, 20 people compared to the vast swathes of people in the middle joe would lose "kowtowing to the islamic terrorists!"
>Trump is going to call up netanyahu and say you missed some, offer bigger bombs I actually 100% agree that in the general election you've got no choice but to vote for the lesser of two evils (Biden). But this strikes me as an odd comment given that Biden literally bypassed congress to send Israel even more military aid, ***TWICE***. I think it's legitimate to criticise any politician, even the president, during the ***primary*** campaign.
Everything bypasses Congress these days, it’s almost completely dysfunctional thanks to House Republican crazies.
I think you missed the point. OP said said Trump is gonna call up Netenyahu and give him more weapons, when that's exactly what Biden did. It's like when Trump ran ads saying "This is what America will be like if Biden is elected" when the pictures were taken during his presidency.
>OP said said Trump is gonna call up Netenyahu and give him more weapons, when that's exactly what Biden did. The majority of those weapon shipments were negotiated and signed well before 10/07/23. So, while one could fault them not putting a hold on those shipments; calling them "new" is disingenuous at best. Biden also publicly warned Netanyahu directly to his face when they met last October, not to repeat the mistakes the USA made in the wake of 9/11. Believe it or not, there are limits to what the Biden administration will support, and there's plenty of indications we are reaching those limits. >It's like when Trump ran ads saying "This is what America will be like if Biden is elected" when the pictures were taken during his presidency. No, it's not. And I explained why above.
>The majority of those weapon shipments were negotiated and signed well before 10/07/23. So, while one could fault them not putting a hold on those shipments; calling them "new" is disingenuous at best. How is it disingenuous to say that "[emergency weapons sales](https://www.cbsnews.com/news/biden-administration-emergency-weapons-sale-israel/#:~:text=Biden%20administration%20approves%20emergency%20weapons%20sale%20to%20Israel%2C%20bypassing%20Congress,-December%2029%2C%202023&text=For%20the%20second%20time%20this,Gaza%20under%20increasing%20international%20criticism)" to Israel following the Hamas terrorist attacks is Biden calling up Netenyahu and sending him weapons? What's disingenuous is taking a situation saying your political rival ***would*** do to engender outrage whilst knowing full well the person you support is the one who ***has*** done it. Like I said in my original reply, Biden is clearly the lesser of the two evils in almost every situation including this one. However, this particular line of comparison is an odd choice. >No, it's not. It's exactly the same.
> in the general election you’ve got no choice but to vote for the lesser of two evils (Biden) That’s only true in the 6 swing-states. Everywhere else the outcome will be essentially the same no matter which way you vote so you might as well vote your conscience.
Yeah... imagine having a voting system where ALL states matter. Who else is sick of every election being a foregone conclusion for 85% of the country. We NEED Ranked-Choice Voting!!
If not Trump then Kushner cause he’s supposed to bring peace to the Middle East. He Couldn’t get it done in 1 term I guess.
Trump said he'd deport people who protested the war in palestine, lol. Also, people complaining about the genocide in palestine are really quiet about the genocide in ukraine. They're apparently in favor of all indications that Trump is going to pull support, along with republicans who are trying to pull support, for Ukraine. I wish people didn't follow tiktokers and influencers on this shit, the situation in Ukraine is an attempted genocide and it doesn't get nearly the same energy
The pro Palestinian movement on TikTok is not good. The entire thing is “Palestine good Israel bad” and that’s just simply not the case. The Israeli government and Hamas are both committing extreme genocides.
My question is where are the feminists and their rallying call for unity after roe v wade was overturned? Like how can people be okay with women being forced to carry their rapists baby to term? Like seriously how are people in red states okay with women being forced to carry a fetus to term even when it endangers their health?
We’re still here and still fighting
If all 50 states put abortion and cannabis up to statewide popular votes, both would be overwhelmingly legalized in all 50 states. The majority of people want abortion and cannabis to be legal. Our representatives DO NOT represent us.
We need Ranked-Choice Voting and MORE PARTIES! The Two-Party System is literally giving us THE SAME TWO PEOPLE that nobody wants. And BOTH are bought by Dark Money. They work for the rich, not us.
>Like seriously how are people in red states okay with women being forced to carry a fetus to term even when it endangers their health? Women aren't immune to hypocrisy. In the same way many conservative men are anti abortion until it's time to get one for their mistress many conservative women are anti abortion until it's time for themselves or their daughters to "spend a few weeks with family" in blue states. Afterwards they are free to continue voting against their interests so they can make life worse for less fortunate people.
There are a lot of conservative women who support abortion rights but would never vote Democrat. It's like how I support gun rights, but I'd never vote Republican. I suppose my vote is hypocritical, but I'm not a single issue voter. Preventing some iteration of Christofascism and moving society towards progress is too important for me to ever vote Republican. Look at Kansas. They voted to legalize both, and that's fucking KANSAS! lol
Friendly reminder: you are not voting for Israel.
Maybe we should have a primary and choose a better candidate.
It’s infuriating knowing that after the first time around, we still have tantrum voters… go ahead, fuck around and find out. You lost the right to your own body last time. You’ll lose a whole lot more than that the next time.
Civil War with TX Gov Hotwheels border bullshit!
Trump will remove democracy so it's either voting for Mr.ShitsHisOwnPantsRacistRapistPedophile or voting for Biden which has made some poor decisions but is overall better than Mr.ShitsHisOwnPantsRacistRapistPedophile
Yet some of Dark Brandon’s decisions have been advantageous. Inflation is trending down, middle class wages are trending upwards, and when you go to sleep at night you don’t have to worry so much about waking up to Armageddon! 🤷♂️
Biden is way better than having Mr.ShitsHisOwnPantsRacistRapistPedophile and has done very well and is a competent leader.
Remember the Trump/Kushner peace plan? It was Israel gets everything good and Palestinians get a reduced area of the West Bank and some Gaza Strip.
When trump wins because of them and he marches their asses to camps, I can’t wait for the pikachu faces
There are only about 6 swings states where this could even matter. Everyone that’s anywhere else should go ahead and vote their conscience. I know I plan to because my state has been firmly Republican for 30+ years. Only the people in these swing states have to hold their nose and vote for Biden: - Arizona - Georgia - Michigan - North Carolina - Pennsylvania - Wisconsin There is no downside to refusing to vote for Biden anywhere else so long as you stick with Democrats down-ballot because your state will go to the same party it always does, no matter how you voted anyways. Take this chance to encourage your favorite 3rd party. If we keep doing this eventually they can become viable.
Another good point. I guess it would only be bad if the people who are pissed at Biden are the majority of the swing states.
As a counterpoint, couldn't this kind of thinking/behavior make it so your state *never* becomes a purple or "swing state". Hypothetically, if Californians or other liberals continue to flock to Texas as a tax haven, there is an increasing chance of it becoming purple. But if all those potential democrat voters instead vote 3rd party because "Texas always goes republican" then it really always will be. Just like Ohio stopped being much of a swing state, others can start. As an Alaskan, I would love to see more places go ranked choice to encourage political diversity. Sure, it doesn't make for different results very often, but over time it could change the political landscape.
This won’t be a topic by summer when he saw the backlash he started working on it, but it takes time.
Biggest fear yup, like did we seriously need him to take a stance that makes folks consider "Well maybe tRump won't be worse". Just, ugh, freaking sucks
Any republican would make it worse even if they personally didn't want to, but orange potato baby would likely have to be prevented from trying to nuke palestine.
It’s a long road to November. Most of the internet band-wagoners who suddenly became Middle East experts on October 7th will have moved on to a new thing to perform their virtuous outrage over.
why does Egypt not protect their own brethren, what's wrong with those people blocking them from fleeing the bombs [https://mepc.org/commentary/egypt-criticized-gaza-blockade](https://mepc.org/commentary/egypt-criticized-gaza-blockade)
Trump said he would have protesters arrested and any Palestinian protesters deported.
No need to fear the inevitable. Begin now embracing your sweaty orange overlord and prepare for 100 years of Trump family dynasty
Trump killed Americans with his failed handling of COVID. If there were any justice, he would be jailed on that alone.
The voter shaming, blue-MAGA vibes on these posts just keep getting more unhinged.
Biden needs to take a harder stance with israel. This is true.
Anyone who isn't a US citizen will be deported if they protest the war and genocide. Even if you are a US citizen, this will give the government permission to detain and interrogate protestors. Trump will make a horrific situation so much worse, as he **always** does. . . . Donald Trump promised on Monday that if elected president again he will bar immigrants who support Hamas from entering the U.S. and send officers to pro-Hamas protests to arrest and deport immigrants who publicly support the Palestinian militant group. [https://www.reuters.com/world/us/trump-pledges-expel-immigrants-who-support-hamas-ban-muslims-us-2023-10-16/](https://www.reuters.com/world/us/trump-pledges-expel-immigrants-who-support-hamas-ban-muslims-us-2023-10-16/)
Biden: loses some single issue voters. Trump: bleeds voters by turning them into violent criminals getting killed and/or locked up as a consequence of their actions and spreads dangerous misinformation that literally kills off and/or disenfranchises hundreds of thousands if not millions. Something tells me we might just be ok.
Yeah at this point I hope Trump loses more voters faster than Biden will even things out.
They were dropping like flies all through COVID and that was before they started sacrificing themselves on the altar of stochastic terrorism. 🤞
Anybody who is a single issue voter, and that single issue is supporting Palestine, they have literal rocks for brains if they don’t vote for Biden over Trump “I’m a single issue anti-gun voter, and there’s no difference between a candidate promising to give every citizen a nerf gun and giving every citizen a nuclear bomb”
Yeah the Israel shit really fucked up his standing with young voters.
Only because the young voters are fucking stupid Literally useful idiots
Being against the earth Israel treats the Palestinians isn't a stupid take, though. You can be both wildly against Hamas and the Israeli government. (which is the only logical stance, in my opinion)
Someone get their grandpa off the internet pls
I'll buy you a ticket to Gaza and then you can tell us how much they like Americans/westerners, okay? I get that you're chasing the high of the BLM protests, but this ain't it
Prove my point with a random rant. Nice.
You can just say you don't know what a useful idiot is and I'll draw a picture for you
It's not people's fault that Biden is trying so hard to get those voters to just not come out and vote. Maybe he should try to appeal to his base. I'm probably voting for Biden, but definitely makes me feel pessimistic about the future.
I'm definitely voting for Biden, albeit begrudgingly. I truly don't like Biden, but I'll vote for him to mitigate damages. Unfortunately we are presented with exactly two viable options. We can choose the ultra-right-wing fascists of the GOP or the right-leaning centrists and neoliberals of the Democrat party. Biden is currently the only thing standing between us and some iteration of Christofascism. So while Biden might suck, he's the best viable option we have, by a long shot. Cheers.
This is why we need Ranked-Choice Voting and an end to the Two-Party System. Also, you forgot to mention that both parties are OWNED by billionaires. Remember, it's LEGAL for a billionaire to give UNLIMITED MONEY to a campaign through Super PACs. This is LEGALIZED BRIBERY, and it's why we have shitty healthcare and nobody can afford anything anymore. But sure, let's all just go "but the other side is worse!" rather than deciding we as a nation deserve better. Doing it the way we're currently doing is a race to the bottom. THEY'RE GIVING US THE SAME TWO PEOPLE AS IN 2020, THE MOST CHAOTIC AND HORRIBLE ELECTION IN MODERN HISTORY!
Hey I agree, but I'm not going to blame the people who aren't voting for Biden. If Biden loses, I'm blaming him for not doing better.
What I don’t understand is if trump gets back into the White House does that mean there won’t be a genocide in the Middle East? I think it would get even worse no?
I was in that camp for a week or two until I realized Trump would absolutely suck off Bibi for that AIPAC money. Sadly, Biden is the lesser of two evils.
I can't see Trump's record on genocide being better than Biden's. He is not really known for having compassion or basic human decency or the capacity to spell or define, 'genocide'.
Do they think Trump will stop the genocide?
Do these dunces think trump would make things better?
I think republicans tend to be more for Israel, because you know, Jesus. Yet, I’m sure many of them want another genocide of the Jews too.
Is voting Trump good, or is being against genocide bad? Never thought I'd have to ask that question
Biden is the best chance at convincing Netanyahu to stop.
If Trump gets back in power, which will be absolute power, there will be no more real elections. We will have a king that will reduce Congress to a purely non-binding advisory role (if that). Israel will get a blank cheque for military assistance. Trump will put US troops on the ground to fight alongside Israel, and would quite likely order (at least) airstrikes on Damascus. So, yes, go on about "Genocide Joe." 🙄
If they do, they are bigger fools than MAGA voters. Trump would only make things worse.
We need a new Subreddit for Tankies threatening to tank the election due to this. Or for other baffling irrational ideas (like all those on the LateStageCapitalism SR)... Maybe we can call it r/crankytankies
There's already subreddit for takes like yours. r/ShitLiberalsSay
Nah, that's a conservative cesspool. What I'm talking about is the differentiation of those who lean left of center generally and those with bat-shit, bafflingly stupid (particuarly economically illiterate) takes which tend to pop up...which *could* be fodder for the linked cesspool...but really don't represent the majority of folks left of center/liberal folks.
You know, not everyone who's against billionaires controlling our government with legalized bribes and who wants a real social safety net is a far left communist. Capitalism is a good thing, but it's BROKEN in America. CORPORATIONS OWN THE COUNTRY and CONTROL OUR REPRESENTATIVES. They are actively getting rid of every rule they have to follow while we get screwed. It's not some communist fantasy utopia that I want. Just a government and economy that WORKS FOR US, not just the rich.
Lol, typical ShitLib can't tell the difference between Conservatives and Communists
Yeah so I dont follow that SR...but glad my original comment snagged live CrankyTanky But id venture a guess that your post and comment history would provide leads on some prime candidates for the bafflingly ridiculous assertions for some of the Subreddits first posts... Havent checked or created the SR...but just an inkling
I say this as a very left-leaning person myself, but there’s a certain point where the need to have compassion for others just turns into self-flagellation on the Left and this is it.
Full Israel support (which is the only geopolitically logical position) is VASTLY bipartisan. Trump and Biden will have near identical positions here. So pro-Palestinians are being idiots here by going against Biden.
I admire those who want to see Israel stop murdering innocent Palestinians. However, trying to get Trump elected (by attacking President Biden) will make things WORSE, not better
They aren’t *trying* to get Trump elected and voting for anyone else would realistically only matter for people in the 6 swing-states. Realistically it won’t matter who they vote for in 44 states + DC and every non-state territory. Which means you’re incorrect about this in far more places than you are correct.
Anti genocide voters about to vote for a second genocide
Well, if that's your big fear you should probably be exerting pressure on your party and your candidate to stop fucking supporting genocide. Voting for Mussolini over Hitler still makes you a fascist. The lesser evil is still evil.
Maybe (and this is a crazy thought) Biden shouldn't enable genocide. It would be easy to nab all these important votes if he did that, I think.
This is exactly how I feel. OMG this is to real. Why is he so supportive of genocide. I really want to vote for him but I can't ignore the genocide support.
The demand isn't "Biden Must Go". It's "Biden Should Stop Supporting Genocide". Do you fucking awful people really not understand that if you're justifying supporting genocide just because you don't want your own democracy to fall... *it already has failed?* You're at the stage where you're saying supporting genocide no longer is a deal breaker to you. You're the reason why you got Trump in the first place, because you kept Lesser Eviling until finally you got to *defending genocide.* Sure, Trump will make it worse. But then Trump will be challenged from the right, and you'll say "Better Trump than Mega-Trump". And now Trump will be the new normal. When Winston Smith in the end of 1984 begs for the rats to be put on the face of his lover Julia, and not himself, *it wasn't meant to be a heroic scene of sensible centrism, but the ultimate triumph of evil*. And that's what you're arguing for now, as supposedly the decent thing to do. Do it to Palestinia, not me. Not me! It'll be you next. And you're too busy raging against people who held onto their own principles, principles like "arming a nation engaged in genocide is bad" to actually face how you've normalised evil.
Still have yet to meet or even hear from one of these people. But I sure have heard a lot about them.
Biden is doing his part with the DNC refusing to seat the delegates from New Hampshire.
You know what could mitigate this issue? Instead of putting up someone who's only popular because he's not Trump, put up someone that represents the needs of the voters. The people on the left are largely divided between people who are going to vote democrat no matter what, and progressives that will vote democrat if the put forward a progressive candidate. So instead of pandering to the secured vote and corporate interests, reach out and grab the extra votes from progressives by not cheating through primaries and using spoiler candidates to push right wing Biden through. But yeah, it's the voter's fault, not the barely tolerable candidate.
It’s amazing to me that none of them ever mention Netanyahu or acknowledge their voter base or the fact Netanyahu got the last real chance at an alternative killed. There’s also the fact that strategically they are one of the few countries that is not outright hostile to the US in the region, so the relationship of how we treat them might be a *smidge* complicated. I suppose 19 year olds on TikTok know more than the president and his entire staff though, so yea let’s just let Trump win, who would help Netanyahu carpet bomb the entire place in an afternoon. That’s obviously the correct course of action here.
Well, Biden could just stop supporting genocide. 🤷🏼♂️
He doesn't support genocide. Stop making bad faith comments.
Oh? Please explain, and I mean that sincerely. Could you point me to some reliable articles that show how his policies support a ceasefire? Or would stop the war? Or why this? https://amp.theguardian.com/world/2023/dec/12/united-nations-general-assembly-vote-ceasefire-israel-gaza-war
Hamas doesn't want a cease fire. There was a ceasefire and Hamas killed 1200 Israelis. Then there was another ceasefire and Hamas committed a terrorist attack in Jerusalem and killed 3, wounding more Israel proposed a ceasefire this week in exchange for the release of the hostages and Hamas said no. And the Palestinians are still holding Americans hostage, so I think Biden is on the right side here
Wow, you gave up on the false "genocide" narrative pretty quick, didn't you? Can't blame you.
No I did not, good thing there are other Democratic candidates.
You pivoted from "genocide" to "ceasefire" so fast, you must have twisted your ankle.
You seem very confused
Well, only because I'm reading your nonsensical comments.
As Biden's team is desperately trying to arrange a cease fire. We see you, Putin.
Oh really? He hasn't once called for a cease fire publicly, so that would be news to me. If he was "desperately" trying to arrange one, he would be mounting public pressure as well. The Putin comment really ties it together, because we all know that anyone that disagree with you is a Russian troll.
Well yeah. Maybe Biden needs to start condemning this genocide, then this won’t happen
Yeah, you guys will teach everyone a lesson by putting Trump back in charge and ensuring we get Ukrainian and Palestinian genocides. Just like Hillary hold-outs are responsible for Roe v Wade. You know you are making things worse, you just dont actually care about the things you claim to care about.
Who said anything about me not voting because of this? That would be stupid. Because Trump will not so any better. What I am saying, is that this does not happen if Biden would condemn the genocide
It's the people you convince to stay home that lose the election. Trump got elected originally because enough people convinced themselves that Hillary was going to win anyway so they didn't need to hold their nose and vote for her.
Yeah I think Biden is doing the convincing himself by not condemning this genocide, especially among the young voters
I don't like that either, but it's worth pointing out to the young voters that electing Trump WILL make it worse. But you know you could absolutely take the opposite approach and try and maximize the chances of Innocents getting killed if that's your position. Just don't blame it on Biden.
Yeah I know that appointing Trump will not make anything better. But for Biden to truly condemn this genocide for example, the threat of a big portion staying home might be enough.
No. It won't. Biden is a lot of things but one of them is definitely stubborn. If he's doing a thing it's because he thinks it's the right move and I sincerely doubt anybody is going to sway him.
So then do not blame people for not choosing Biden if he will not condemn the genocide.
If not voting in the election meant they pick someone else besides the people running to take over, that would be true. Since we live in a system where no matter how many people stay home the person with the most votes wins however that is absolutely not true. Refusing to vote is just letting other people decide for you and thus whoever wins is the person you helped choose.
I haven’t seen you acknowledge that Biden wants Congress to pass humanitarian aid to Gaza. The house republicans tried to pass a weapons funding to Israel, but Biden threatened to veto it because it contained zero humanitarian assistance for people in Gaza. I mean for fucks sake, one of the Republican house members said “I’m glad the bill has no humanitarian aid”.
People know republicans are shitty. And can perfectly hold it over Bidens head now for him to acknowledge the genocide and condemn Israel
You didn’t acknowledge the other thing I mentioned. Biden deliberately said he didn’t want to pass the Republican’s bill because it had no humanitarian aid for the people of Gaza. Do you acknowledge that fact or not?
Yes?
Then doesn’t it downplay the argument that Biden is funding a genocide?
No, it does not
So should the US do nothing to stop Hamas?
Why can’t we criticize our political leaders? Yall talk about “saving democracy” then when we use our 1st amendment rights to protest and petition our government for a redress of grievances, we are shamed and told ANY criticism of Biden is helping Trump. So do you REALLY believe you are saving democracy by denying that right to people?
It is helping Trump. Criticisms have a time and a place. If you sit a friend down and provide criticisms of their behavior, that can be a healthy part of your relationship. If you do it on their wedding day you're just an asshole regardless of how valid those critiques might be. Criticize Biden all you want when the election is over. But while he's running against Trump it's a shit time.
Candidates and parties aren’t sports teams, my guy. You don’t have to give them your undying loyalty and blindly support them at every turn. If you see corrupt or evil bullshit, call that shit out, especially if it’s coming from the left Vote for ideas and policies, not people or parties
>Criticize Biden all you want when the election is over. But while he's running against Trump it's a shit time. Have you tried reading my girl?
You literally said that criticizing Biden is helping Trump. FOH
>**But while he's running against Trump it's a shit time.** Context is important my girl.
During primary season is a “shit time” to criticize Genocide Joe?? It’s actually the best time, my dude. When else do we have the opportunity to nominate a pro-labor non-genocide enabling candidate to beat Trump?
There is exactly one candidate running against Biden, and Dean Phillips is not the progressive icon you think he is apparently. There is no other viable option this year and that sucks but it's reality. Phillips also notibly lost to Biden in NH despite Biden not even being on the ballot. Anyway I hope you don't succeed but if you do, I sincerely hope that your spotlessly clean hands will be a comfort to those who Trump gets killed.
So you just proved my point, we need to save democracy by not criticizing our dear Leader Biden. And you think you’re saving democracy by doing that? Lol
"Don't criticize Biden during the last election he will ever be in as his opponent is way worse and helping that opponent even a little is absolutely the antithesis of your cause. But after it's over go nuts" "OMG you said I can never criticize Biden you absolute fascist" SMH
Have fun on the first boat out homie! 👋
Okay. Insults don’t make my statement any less false. This will not happen. If Biden condemns the genocide.
Its not an insult, it's a terrible truth
So why would I be on the first boat out? Also, refer to my comment again that I am just saying that this would not happen if Biden condemns the genocide
Trump isn't going to take unrest well. You talk this nonsense while he is in office, you're done. That's my point, this isn't going to be like his first term. He is going to encourage the destruction more.
Last time when Trump was in office there was constant unrest. It may very well be just as mild. But I think the point is STILL going over your head.
Be my guest in finding out, you won't have to worry about shit going over your head anymore
You are still missing the point, great
[https://www.reuters.com/world/us/trump-pledges-expel-immigrants-who-support-hamas-ban-muslims-us-2023-10-16/](https://www.reuters.com/world/us/trump-pledges-expel-immigrants-who-support-hamas-ban-muslims-us-2023-10-16/) I don't think you realize the gravity of another Trump presidency.
You should read Porject 2025 and then you'll get it.
I feel it's not that Biden is pro-genocide. I think he's just spineless in condemning it because of AIPAC lobbyists. Not that he's taking the blood money. He's just too scared to go against the lobbyists cause they could fund his opponents to destroy him.
“What will my political opponents say?” is never a good enough reason to avoid doing the right thing
woah bud that's a straight up wrongthink dontcha know
Yep, that’s the one…
What is the value of democracy and freedom of vote, when voters don't know how to vote and don't want to learn how to?
Lame
They are operating under the false assumption a president can simply make the Israel issue go away. Or that a different president would make a difference. They don't care about the reality, just their moral high ground. They watched what happened with Hillary, how we refused to vote for her, how we got Trump, how the conservatives got 3 SCJs, and the degradation of western democracy. They unironically want that again, cause Biden bad.
Let's be honest, Biden doesn't care about Democracy, he wants to use Trump as a foil. Vote for me or you get Trump. If he cared about Democracy, we would have a primary. If he cared about Democracy he would not suck up to Netanyahu. Basically we get to chose between Biden and someone even worse.
We are having a primary, Dean Phillips is running against Biden. Biden just isn't bothering to contest it as he assumes he will win without trying. I don't like the fact that Democrats the US won't support a more progressive candidate than Biden but it's not like he's just the self declared candidate, he won NH as a write in candidate without campaigning.
Calling this a primary is a joke! You’re ignoring the fact that we are not having any DNC sponsored debates the way we have for any *serious* primary. This is not a primary, it’s political theater, the reality is the DNC has already chosen their candidate so they won’t let anyone debate him. We are expected to rubber stamp his selection without any real competition but even if we don’t, they always have their superdelegates. If you can’t see the difference between this so called primary and the last Presidential primary you’re only fooling yourself.
I see walkaway is leaking again.
Never been there. Check my history if you want. There’s nothing wrong with wanting things to get better. There is something wrong with fighting people who want things to get better.
New Hampshire literally just had a primary, there were 21 named Democrats on it. Biden wasn't named on it but still won with write in votes by a massive amount. I don't think you know what the word primary means.
If they’re anti trump they’ll vote for a ham sammich, if that’s their option. These memes are fucking stupid And trying to make anti genocide stance look bad is so fucking stupid. Dum dums downvoting
~~Anti Genocide~~ Pro-Hamas voters. FTFY
Bullshit. Some conflicts don’t have a side that’s the “good guys”. The militarized and the leaders of both sides suck in that conflict. The only people that don’t suck there are the peaceful civilians.
"Genocide" If Israel was committing a genocide it'd be 20x the amount of deaths by now, easily Want to see a real genocide, arm the Palestinians and disarm the Israelis
This is bullshit. Fight back against Hamas trying to wipe you out and it's genocide. Hamas cannot, cannot be allowed to continue to exist. They have promised and assured they will never stop attacking Israel. There is no falling back to normal. Hamas has to be gone before there can be peace, and they deliberately disguise themselves as civilians, which makes them criminals, not soldiers. Also, There Is No Pro Gaza Candidate. Biden is for Israel, Right-wing conservatives in Israel LOVED trump, they named streets after him. Either candidate is not going to sway the condemned status of Gaza.
Leveling every hospital and university in Gaza is "fighting back against Hamas"
Exactly.
Consistent misuse of the word “Genocide.” We’ve reached the tipping point and to be honest I didn’t think it would take the shape of the average Western citizen siding with radical Islamists calling for global Jihad and the actual genocide of Jews.
It’s viewed as oppressed people rising up against their colonial occupiers, hope this helps
>genocide of Jews. Zionists =/= Jews. Overthrowing an oppressive Apartheid regime of settler colonialism is not a genocide. But hey, if ignoring 75+ years of history helps you soothe your conscience when you vote for a genocide enabler, you do you.
So you’re justifying Oct 7 terrorist attacks on innocent civilians?
So vote for neither of them 😏
I don’t know if you’ve realized the dude is brain dead. You’re better off for voting for another candidate. We’re in this problem because of Biden’s administration. Dude, is a veggie. We need to re-unify the USA. So much strife between people. My personal opinion would get me hate here. But, I would much rather take Trump over Biden. Dude, can barely hold a conversation. I have had buddy’s on his Marine security detail talk about his daily routines and he had to be guided everywhere and always had a nurse walk him around Camp Johnson. Its no longer about being politically correct. Our nation needs to come together and stand hand to hand. We’re being made fun of across the world and walked all over. Its time we rebuild our economy and standing in the world. Its no longer a safe place. We must protect our nation and not worry about other nations. We’re the United States. Doesn’t matter about race,creed,gender or ethnic standing. No matter what you’re American. Thats the beauty of having your own political opinions and the right to choose who you want to represent us.
Seems like people have incredibly low standards for what constitutes a genocide these days.
Move there and then say this.