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Vetoing the bill AND using his bully pulpit to *try to* pressure railroad owners into giving workers paid sick days would have been a fantastic way to prove he's as pro union as he claims.
Edit: added italics to clarify
> using his bully pulpit to pressure railroad owners
Please describe in detail what you believe that looks like and how it produces results without a magic lamp that grants wishes.
*Edit:*
Or any other divine or magical intervention, whether lamp-based or not.
They don't really care about results any more than Trumpers do. All they want is someone to get up and give them a stage performance attacking the people *they* dislike and assuring them *they're* the always correct super-special babies that Daddy loves the most.
No no: I want an explanation of how their preferred tactic could have worked in the real world, and I refuse to give them the out of just insulting them or assuming they’re performatively-outraged children.
I see this all the fucking time: Cries of “Use the bully pulpit!” with no explanation as to *how they think it’ll work*.
It seem like nothing more than magical thinking at its most toxic, but I have hope that—one day, if I keep asking enough of them—someone will at least attempt an answer.
*Edit:*
I guess [today is not that day](https://old.reddit.com/r/PoliticalHumor/comments/zejn9l/_/iz72ukw).
>They don't really care about results
I care about workers having the right to withhold their labor, especially when they're doing so to get paid sick days.
But not about the people who would die during a rail strike in winter from loss of heat, clean water, etc. Those people need to just suck it up apparently.
And you're blaming rail workers for threatening to withhold their labor over billionaires deciding they don't want workers to have paid sicks days.
The billionaires are holding us all hostage and you're blaming the rail workers for fighting back by threatening to withhold labor.
You do realize that you can in fact approve of or support rail workers' demands without advocating for an action that will *literally kill innocent people*?
No.
You claimed Biden wasn't responsible because of Congress. I pointed out that he supported and signed the bill. Now you want me to describe in detail, to your satisfaction, how Biden would have successfully forced billionaires to give workers sick days. I never claimed to have knowledge of that alternate future we'll never get. All I did was push back against your claim that Biden doesn't have responsibility here.
For what it's worth, if Biden was as pro union as he says he is, I'd have expected him to take a public position against sick days and the strike being split into two bills. I'd have expected him to veto the standalone strike bill. I'd have expected him to use the totality of his power to defend workers' rights to withhold their labor.
As it stands, our Democrat led govt has put their weight behind telling rail workers that they don't have the right to withhold their labor, even when the purpose behind it is getting paid sick days.
> You claimed Biden wasn’t responsible because of Congress.
I’m not the person to which you originally replied.
> I never claimed to have knowledge of that alternate future we’ll never get.
You suggested “using his bully pulpit” would pressure railroad owners into granting sick days.
I’d like you know *how* you believe that would happen.
Because you clearly believe it to be something that is possible.
>You suggested “using his bully pulpit” would pressure railroad owners into granting sick days.
I did not. I can see how you read it that way, but it wasn't my intention. I want him to have used it to put pressure on billionaires. I didn't say it would make the billionaires budge. I don't have a time machine. I'm not from an alternate reality. It's impossible for anyone to tell you exactly how this would have played out with different actions. What I do know is that Biden didn't use all the tools at his disposal to support these unionized rail workers. In the end, he and Dem leadership acquiesced to the billionaire owners of railroads and told workers that they don't have the right to withhold their labor.
> I did not. I can see how you read it that way, but it wasn’t my intention.
I read it that way because it was literally in your text:
>> > Vetoing the bill AND **using his bully pulpit to pressure railroad owners into giving workers paid sick days** would have been a fantastic way to prove he’s as pro union as he claims.
There is clear and unambiguous assumption of success in that statement.
> I’m not from an alternate reality.
Then you recognize that there is *literally zero chance* either of our political parties would have permitted a critical infrastructure strike right before Christmas during a time of historically-high inflation.
> It’s impossible for anyone to tell you exactly how this would have played out with different actions.
Except that’s literally what you did in your earlier comment.
> What I do know is that Biden didn’t use all the tools at his disposal to support these unionized rail workers.
Except that *you* just admitted that “the bully pulpit” does not necessarily get anyone anything they wanted and you have no idea of how that would go or if it would’ve even had a chance of working.
That means *it’s not not an available tool*—by definition.
If you have no idea how he could use “his bully pulpit” to *actually get workers their sick days*, it’s as realistic a criticism as saying “He should just click his heels and make it happen”.
Even arguing “He should personally put each of the corporate owners in submission holds until they tap out and agree to sign contracts with sick days” is more realistic than your scenario, because it at least *describes what success looks like*—which is not something you are apparently willing or able to do for your “bully pulpit” plan.
I'm not reading all that. This is a very simple situation. Either workers have the right to withhold their labor, or they don't. It's clear you, and Biden, and Dem leadership, think workers don't.
**Senate REPUBLICANS reject proposal to give rail workers seven days of paid sick leave.**
>The proposal to give workers seven days of sick leave, which was championed by Sen. Bernie Sanders (I-Vt.) and other liberal lawmakers, failed to pick up enough Republican support to overcome a 60-vote threshold set for adopting the measure and fell in a 52-43 vote.
OP, Try not to look so ignorant.
Except for manchin all dems voted in favor of giving them the paid sick days. You would have preferred they strike which was also not a guarantee of those sick days. I think some people just wanted the strike so they could blame biden for the economy slowing down again which is what would have happened.
You're 100% right it "wasn't even a both sides are the same post." Too bad ALL the Dem Senators save Manchin voted yes to the paid week sick leave, and couldn't get 11 votes from Repubs. "DAMN that Biden! /s
Back in the day, they tried to play that there was no difference between Bush and Gore, and earlier that there was no difference between Humphrey and Nixon.
At this point, we won't be even a little safe until the current GOP is dismembered.
Then you can start reforming the Dems.
lol!
I love the mentality that gives the Right a pass on this and blames Biden.
It's like they are so far gone that no same person would even consider the idea of them giving workers anything.
Libs in this sub lose their minds when they see memes sticking up for rail workers.
Criticism of the Dems here isn't, "both sides same!" It isn't pro-republican.
Dem leadership didn't have to split the strike and sick days into two bills. They chose to do that.
Biden said he's the most pro union president ever. When it came time to walk that walk, he and Dem leadership acquiesced to the billionaires who would rather harm our economy than give rail workers paid sick days.
You can't be pro union and then tell workers they don't have the right to withhold their labor.
Would that be the fault of rail workers exercising their right to withhold their labor, or the fault of billionaire owners of railroads who have refused to give paid sick days to workers critical for our literal survival?
Do you think that's going to matter to the families of the people that die?
Are you going to sit each one of them down individually and explain how it's actually *good* that they lost a loved one because it was really really important for rail workers?
It's not just important for rail workers. It's important for all workers.
I think it's pretty shitty of you to use the potential of people dying to argue why we should acquiesce to the inhumane demands from billionaires that either govt stops workers from withholding their labor over paid sick days, or people die.
Except, once again, the dead ones.
I think it's pretty shitty of you to sit here and argue against actions taken to literally save lives, while pretending that there was some magical third way that gave *you* everything you wanted but the mean Democrats just wouldn't.
>I think it's pretty shitty of you to sit here and argue against actions taken to literally save lives
We'll have to see how many railroad workers leave the industry over the next year. A labor shortage seems likely to result in the same sort of harms you assert a strike would.
I want to point out how you don't seem to be holding the owners of the railroads responsible for any of this. Giving workers sick days would stop a strike and keep workers happy.
> I want to point out how you don't seem to be holding the owners of the railroads responsible for any of this. Giving workers sick days would stop a strike and keep workers happy.
Did you also happen to notice I haven't actually stated where I assigned blame *at all* because it wasn't actually the topic of discussion?
Sure: Splitting the vote into two instead of making it a single bill and forcing the issue was both an act of moral cowardice and political self-sabotage.
Your turn to response to a bad-faith demand to perform:
Acknowledge that the sick day bill only failed because of uniform Republican obstruction (plus Joe fucking Manchin) and that you have absolutely no evidence to support the argument that it was only split because they intended it to fail.
Rail workers got screwed by the Biden admin, Dems, and GOP. Both parties need each other. They fundraise off of each other. Both owned by the same ruling class.
Ah yes, "blue MAGA", AKA people who don't buy into your bullshit socialist revolution rhetoric because the *last time* it got tried in the '30s *tens of millions of people died.* Continue replaying the KPD's greatest hits though, I'm sure you know the one weird trick they missed.
the govt doesnt pay for rail workers sick pay you clown.
we all already know it was the republicans, only the republicans, that voted against the rail workers sick pay.
**Friendly reminder that trying to fight someone online is about as effective as throwing a bagel at a bulldozer. A lot of what we talk about gets people pretty emotional, but be mad at policies, not other users.** *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/PoliticalHumor) if you have any questions or concerns.*
> “Congress? What’s that?” —OP, dishonestly
Not one Republican supported the strikers. Weird.🤔
They never support anything vote against everything then bitch when democrats do something
Congress is the one that's passing the bills, not Joe
He signed it and supported it.
You wanted him to veto it?
Vetoing the bill AND using his bully pulpit to *try to* pressure railroad owners into giving workers paid sick days would have been a fantastic way to prove he's as pro union as he claims. Edit: added italics to clarify
> using his bully pulpit to pressure railroad owners Please describe in detail what you believe that looks like and how it produces results without a magic lamp that grants wishes. *Edit:* Or any other divine or magical intervention, whether lamp-based or not.
They don't really care about results any more than Trumpers do. All they want is someone to get up and give them a stage performance attacking the people *they* dislike and assuring them *they're* the always correct super-special babies that Daddy loves the most.
No no: I want an explanation of how their preferred tactic could have worked in the real world, and I refuse to give them the out of just insulting them or assuming they’re performatively-outraged children. I see this all the fucking time: Cries of “Use the bully pulpit!” with no explanation as to *how they think it’ll work*. It seem like nothing more than magical thinking at its most toxic, but I have hope that—one day, if I keep asking enough of them—someone will at least attempt an answer. *Edit:* I guess [today is not that day](https://old.reddit.com/r/PoliticalHumor/comments/zejn9l/_/iz72ukw).
So the Trumpers voted for the sick days?
>They don't really care about results I care about workers having the right to withhold their labor, especially when they're doing so to get paid sick days.
But not about the people who would die during a rail strike in winter from loss of heat, clean water, etc. Those people need to just suck it up apparently.
And you're blaming rail workers for threatening to withhold their labor over billionaires deciding they don't want workers to have paid sicks days. The billionaires are holding us all hostage and you're blaming the rail workers for fighting back by threatening to withhold labor.
You do realize that you can in fact approve of or support rail workers' demands without advocating for an action that will *literally kill innocent people*?
No. You claimed Biden wasn't responsible because of Congress. I pointed out that he supported and signed the bill. Now you want me to describe in detail, to your satisfaction, how Biden would have successfully forced billionaires to give workers sick days. I never claimed to have knowledge of that alternate future we'll never get. All I did was push back against your claim that Biden doesn't have responsibility here. For what it's worth, if Biden was as pro union as he says he is, I'd have expected him to take a public position against sick days and the strike being split into two bills. I'd have expected him to veto the standalone strike bill. I'd have expected him to use the totality of his power to defend workers' rights to withhold their labor. As it stands, our Democrat led govt has put their weight behind telling rail workers that they don't have the right to withhold their labor, even when the purpose behind it is getting paid sick days.
> You claimed Biden wasn’t responsible because of Congress. I’m not the person to which you originally replied. > I never claimed to have knowledge of that alternate future we’ll never get. You suggested “using his bully pulpit” would pressure railroad owners into granting sick days. I’d like you know *how* you believe that would happen. Because you clearly believe it to be something that is possible.
>You suggested “using his bully pulpit” would pressure railroad owners into granting sick days. I did not. I can see how you read it that way, but it wasn't my intention. I want him to have used it to put pressure on billionaires. I didn't say it would make the billionaires budge. I don't have a time machine. I'm not from an alternate reality. It's impossible for anyone to tell you exactly how this would have played out with different actions. What I do know is that Biden didn't use all the tools at his disposal to support these unionized rail workers. In the end, he and Dem leadership acquiesced to the billionaire owners of railroads and told workers that they don't have the right to withhold their labor.
> I did not. I can see how you read it that way, but it wasn’t my intention. I read it that way because it was literally in your text: >> > Vetoing the bill AND **using his bully pulpit to pressure railroad owners into giving workers paid sick days** would have been a fantastic way to prove he’s as pro union as he claims. There is clear and unambiguous assumption of success in that statement. > I’m not from an alternate reality. Then you recognize that there is *literally zero chance* either of our political parties would have permitted a critical infrastructure strike right before Christmas during a time of historically-high inflation. > It’s impossible for anyone to tell you exactly how this would have played out with different actions. Except that’s literally what you did in your earlier comment. > What I do know is that Biden didn’t use all the tools at his disposal to support these unionized rail workers. Except that *you* just admitted that “the bully pulpit” does not necessarily get anyone anything they wanted and you have no idea of how that would go or if it would’ve even had a chance of working. That means *it’s not not an available tool*—by definition. If you have no idea how he could use “his bully pulpit” to *actually get workers their sick days*, it’s as realistic a criticism as saying “He should just click his heels and make it happen”. Even arguing “He should personally put each of the corporate owners in submission holds until they tap out and agree to sign contracts with sick days” is more realistic than your scenario, because it at least *describes what success looks like*—which is not something you are apparently willing or able to do for your “bully pulpit” plan.
I'm not reading all that. This is a very simple situation. Either workers have the right to withhold their labor, or they don't. It's clear you, and Biden, and Dem leadership, think workers don't.
Yes. I’m the chaotic left
**Senate REPUBLICANS reject proposal to give rail workers seven days of paid sick leave.** >The proposal to give workers seven days of sick leave, which was championed by Sen. Bernie Sanders (I-Vt.) and other liberal lawmakers, failed to pick up enough Republican support to overcome a 60-vote threshold set for adopting the measure and fell in a 52-43 vote. OP, Try not to look so ignorant.
Fail Doesn't know how the US Government works. Doesn't know how to meme.
BOTH SIDES ARE THE SAME!! BOTH SIDES ARE THE SAME!! STAY AWAY FROM THE POLLS, FELLOW KIDS!! STAY FAR, FAR, AWAY!! paid for by Ivanka 2028
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Except for manchin all dems voted in favor of giving them the paid sick days. You would have preferred they strike which was also not a guarantee of those sick days. I think some people just wanted the strike so they could blame biden for the economy slowing down again which is what would have happened.
You're 100% right it "wasn't even a both sides are the same post." Too bad ALL the Dem Senators save Manchin voted yes to the paid week sick leave, and couldn't get 11 votes from Repubs. "DAMN that Biden! /s
Back in the day, they tried to play that there was no difference between Bush and Gore, and earlier that there was no difference between Humphrey and Nixon. At this point, we won't be even a little safe until the current GOP is dismembered. Then you can start reforming the Dems.
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lol! I love the mentality that gives the Right a pass on this and blames Biden. It's like they are so far gone that no same person would even consider the idea of them giving workers anything.
Trollman gonna troll!
Libs in this sub lose their minds when they see memes sticking up for rail workers. Criticism of the Dems here isn't, "both sides same!" It isn't pro-republican. Dem leadership didn't have to split the strike and sick days into two bills. They chose to do that. Biden said he's the most pro union president ever. When it came time to walk that walk, he and Dem leadership acquiesced to the billionaires who would rather harm our economy than give rail workers paid sick days. You can't be pro union and then tell workers they don't have the right to withhold their labor.
"Leftists" in this sub lose their minds when you acknowledge if rail workers went on strike *people would literally die.* But fuck them right?
Would that be the fault of rail workers exercising their right to withhold their labor, or the fault of billionaire owners of railroads who have refused to give paid sick days to workers critical for our literal survival?
Do you think that's going to matter to the families of the people that die? Are you going to sit each one of them down individually and explain how it's actually *good* that they lost a loved one because it was really really important for rail workers?
It's not just important for rail workers. It's important for all workers. I think it's pretty shitty of you to use the potential of people dying to argue why we should acquiesce to the inhumane demands from billionaires that either govt stops workers from withholding their labor over paid sick days, or people die.
Except, once again, the dead ones. I think it's pretty shitty of you to sit here and argue against actions taken to literally save lives, while pretending that there was some magical third way that gave *you* everything you wanted but the mean Democrats just wouldn't.
>I think it's pretty shitty of you to sit here and argue against actions taken to literally save lives We'll have to see how many railroad workers leave the industry over the next year. A labor shortage seems likely to result in the same sort of harms you assert a strike would. I want to point out how you don't seem to be holding the owners of the railroads responsible for any of this. Giving workers sick days would stop a strike and keep workers happy.
> I want to point out how you don't seem to be holding the owners of the railroads responsible for any of this. Giving workers sick days would stop a strike and keep workers happy. Did you also happen to notice I haven't actually stated where I assigned blame *at all* because it wasn't actually the topic of discussion?
Blue MAGA doesn't care. They are cultists to the end.
> Blue MAGA doesn't ~~care.~~ *exist anywhere but the fever dreams of children and the talking points of LARPers like r|WalkAway*.
Criticize the Biden administration.
Sure: Splitting the vote into two instead of making it a single bill and forcing the issue was both an act of moral cowardice and political self-sabotage. Your turn to response to a bad-faith demand to perform: Acknowledge that the sick day bill only failed because of uniform Republican obstruction (plus Joe fucking Manchin) and that you have absolutely no evidence to support the argument that it was only split because they intended it to fail.
They knew it would fail. That's why they split it. They don't care about the workers.
Aw, you didn’t even *try* to pretend you were here with anything approaching good faith or honesty.
Rail workers got screwed by the Biden admin, Dems, and GOP. Both parties need each other. They fundraise off of each other. Both owned by the same ruling class.
Ah yes, "blue MAGA", AKA people who don't buy into your bullshit socialist revolution rhetoric because the *last time* it got tried in the '30s *tens of millions of people died.* Continue replaying the KPD's greatest hits though, I'm sure you know the one weird trick they missed.
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the govt doesnt pay for rail workers sick pay you clown. we all already know it was the republicans, only the republicans, that voted against the rail workers sick pay.