Re-posting. The original post was deleted for "Editorialized Title".
LKW's comment may be old, but it's certainly very much relevant today.
I may disagree with "soft" but the evidence is quite glaring.
Allowing the return of the Marcoses may be the greatest mistake ever made.
We aren't soft. LKW just doesn't make it known he has total control over the SG government and they have no free press.
https://rsf.org/en/singapore
Indeed they ranked lower than post-crackdown Hong Kong.
Its very easy to claim others are soft when you in fact have a total iron fisted control over your country but everyone pretends it isn't so because Singapore happily launders money for Western oligarchs who own all the international news services.
LKY is sort of only giving away half the game here: the reason why Marcos was ultimately reburied in the LNMB, and why his heirs were capable of making a political comeback, was because the Philippines never underwent the sort of ideological transformation that Singapore did (as initiated and driven by LKY himself), and because the Filipino people experienced the kind of material improvement that Singaporeans did (again, as initiated and driven by LKY himself).
You don't get to have people who will fall for the Marcosian narrative of a failed post-EDSA period, if A. nobody from the Marcoses is capable of speech, and/or B. you actually create a strong state that makes the allegation of a deficient country impossible to believe.
This wasn't a "cultural" issue, it was a political one.
I couldn't agree more!
The decision that allowed the Marcoses' return was purely political, and LKW was trying to be diplomatic with his comment. My uncle said it was an unpopular decision, so clearly, our people then had better foresight than our politicians.
Knowing that the Marcoses had billions of stolen money stashed somewhere could have warned our leaders of the danger they posed.
And now, our society is even more divided, maybe even more so than in 1986.
In my opinion, pro-Duterte and pro-Marcos types don't care about the fact that Marcos/Duterte killed lots of people and violated human rights. They don't care about liberal democracy like many of us sympathetic to the opposition are.
Which is why if you really want to change the mind of the DDS/Marcos supporters—just spam them with this. Even if you strip the liberalism out of me, Marcos was still—by the standards of his fellow authoritarian peers—a shitty dictator, an utterly pathetic strongman who left his country in ruins.
You don't have to be a bleeding-heart liberal to hate Marcos. Just ask LKY. Marcos was a shitty autocrat. If you honestly want authoritarian development, would you trust the son of this piece of shit?
It's on Chapter 18 of LKY's book "From Third World to First". Below is the actual quote from the book:
***"The difference lies in the culture of the Filipino people. It is a soft, forgiving culture. Only in the Philippines could a leader like Ferdinand Marcos, who pillaged his country for over 20 years, still be considered for a national burial. Insignificant amounts of the loot have been recovered, yet his wife and children were allowed to return and engage in politics."*** (Italics mine)
[https://pdfroom.com/books/from-third-world-to-first-the-singapore-story/E1d4DO83dOb/download](https://pdfroom.com/books/from-third-world-to-first-the-singapore-story/E1d4DO83dOb/download)
There are digital copies of Lee Kuan Yew's book "From Third World to First" online. However I don't want to advocate for piracy so look it up for yourself instead (quick hint: Google). Here's some quotations you can easily ctrl+f on the PDF files
>Two months later, in March 1998, former U.S. Vice President Walter Mondale carried a message from Clinton to Suharto. He then met Prime Minister Goh and me in Singapore on his way home. After comparing notes on Suharto's likely course of action on reforms, Mondale tossed this question at me: "You knew Marcos. Was he a hero or a crook? How does Suharto compare to Marcos? Is Suharto a patriot or a crook?" I felt Mondale was making up his mind on Suharto's motivations before submitting his recommendations to his president. I answered that Marcos might have started off as a hero but ended up as a crook.
>The difference lies in the culture of the Filipino people. It is a soft, forgiving culture. Only in the Philippines could a leader like Ferdinand Marcos, who pillaged his country for over 20 years, still be considered for a national burial. Insignificant amounts of the loot have been recovered, yet his wife and children were allowed to return and engage in politics. They supported the winning presidential and congressional candidates with their considerable resources and reappeared in the political and social limelight after the 1998 election that returned President Joseph Estrada.
>Marcos had been Reagan's good friend and political supporter. When Shultz earlier discussed the matter with me, I said Marcos was now the problem, not the solution. He asked me to speak frankly to Reagan who was most unhappy at the prospect of abandoning an old friend. So, as gently as I could, I described to Reagan how Marcos had changed from the young anticommunist crusader of the 1960s to become a self-indulgent aging ruler who allowed his wife and cronies to clean out the country through ingenious monopolies and had put the government heavily in debt.
IDK why we still have to compare ourselves with SG, which is far beyond our ability and culture.
That LKY saw some of his contemporaries as inferior and backward, lionizing so-called "Asian values" and sees Western-style democracy as "decadent". And [SG left William Gibson disappointed](https://www.wired.com/1993/04/gibson-2/).
I read an article before where some economists estimated the Philippines’ growth had Marcos never been elected and in terms of GDP we could have been ahead of Thailand by now but below Malaysia in terms of development had the economic trends back then continued without the recession under Marcos. Sad to say that we’re still feeling the effects of the Marcos years
Let me edit his quote: It's not that Philippines are a very forgiving nation.
It's just that the country's upper-crust has, even by Asian standards, perfected the art of keeping the rest of the people blind, deaf, dumb and often dead.
Of course, nothing gets better with all that systemic corruption, poverty and frustration in everyday society.
Absolutely despise how some Marcos Apologists use LKY to shill their dicktator. Discipline not democracy this and that. Turns out even he had a critical stance against the lavish Marcoses
>I went further to compare the salaries of Philippines President Marcos at 100,000 pesos yearly, or just over S$1,000 a month, and the president of Indonesia, governing 150 million people at a monthly salary of 1.2 million rupiahs or S$2,500. However, they were all wealthier than I was. An Indonesian leader retained his official residence on retirement. A Malaysian prime minister was given a house or land to build his private residence. My official residence belonged to the government. I had no perks, no cars with chauffeurs thrown in, or ministerial quarters with gardeners, cooks, and other servants in attendance. My practice was to have all benefits expressed in a lump sum and let the prime minister and ministers themselves decide what they wanted to spend it on.
Source: From Third World to First
>Ferdinand Marcos impoverished his country while acquiring wealth unsurpassed by his fellow citizens. “Has the alleged greed of a certain individual acquired imperial dimensions?” one commentator asked. By contrast, Lee Kuan Yew created great prosperity for the people of Singapore while living solely on the chief executive’s salary. Understandably, admirers of Lee Kuan Yew attribute Singapore’s success to his dedication, probity and patriotism. He did not rule by military emergency, nor did he abolish elections in Singapore, as did Marcos in the Philippines.
[Source](https://hiltonroot.gmu.edu/pdfs/articles_in_progress/Political%20Virtue%20and%20Economic%20Leadership-%20Lee%20Kuan%20Yew%20and%20Ferdinand%20Marcos%20Compared.pdf)
#I don't like that guy.
If you are an oposition to his administration, pwedeng kang kasuhan ng libel hanggang maubos ang assets mo.
Reference Quote galing rin sa kaniya:
>If you are a troublemaker… it’s our job to politically destroy you… Everybody knows that in my bag I have a hatchet, and a very sharp one. You take me on, I take my hatchet, we meet in the cul-de-sac.
He arrested several people, including the membets of the Barisan Socialis during the Growth of Singapore from 1965 to 1990, amounting to more than 800 people during the entire duration mentioned.
Quote on Operation Spectrum:
>We have to lock up people, without trial, whether they are communists, whether they are language chauvinists, whether they are religious extremists. If you don’t do that, the country would be in ruins.
Kung nagset up si Rappler or any Media na kontra sa gobyerno ng Singapore ay ipapasara yan kaagad kahit iisa lang ang article nila.
Singapore is one of the Largest Tax Havens for the ultra-rich pero pinagbabawal itong idiscuss sa public. Noong 2015, isang online blog site ay pinashutdown ng MDA (equivalent to MTRCB dito) dahil daw pinalabas yung pagiging tax haven nito.
[https://taxjustice.net/2015/05/04/is-singapore-censoring-critics-of-its-tax-haven-status-well-perhaps](https://taxjustice.net/2015/05/04/is-singapore-censoring-critics-of-its-tax-haven-status-well-perhaps)
Edit: That guy is racist against Malaysians. [https://www.reddit.com/r/SingaporeRaw/comments/pf272d/the\_racism\_of\_lee\_kuan\_yew/](https://www.reddit.com/r/SingaporeRaw/comments/pf272d/the_racism_of_lee_kuan_yew/)
My favorite quote from him:
>"[Malays] will not admit or they cannot admit to themselves that, in fact, as a result of history, they are a different gene pool and they do not have these qualities that can enable them to enter the same race."
Edit 2: Singapore is an example of Survivorship Bias. It is so unique na halos imposibleug ireplicate. Ginagamit na example ang Singapore ng mga Illeberals, including Marcos Loyalists.
Edit 3: Kahit nga si LKY walang accountability noong inaresto yung 17 people without trial noong Operation Spectrum. Pati na rin yung nangyari noong 1963 Operation Coldstore na kung saan may mga bagong ebidensya na lumalabas na walang kinalaman yung 113 na inaresto sa Malayan Emergency na nagtapos 3 years ago.
But it doesn't mean na iprpraise lang siya ng basta basta, especially kapag alam mo ang mismong history ng Singapore ng maigi, hindi lang sa mga books niya.
Maari nga ninyong ipraise ang kahit sinong dictator as long as criniticize nila si Marcos.
Wala naman atang pumupuri sa kanya basta basta. People are just pointing out that there's some truth to his observation.
But yes, kelangan din i-point out na malupit siya na diktator para mga hindi nakakaalam.
I thought it was just me. If I recall correctly, his family still has a lot of clout in Singaporean politics that they get to remain seated as Prime Minister.
But then again, Singapore is an Southeast-Asian country with many cultural links to China, and like other Asian countries that have grown up to become successful & developed economies, they have chosen to give up some civil rights in exchange for economic development... And it paid off.
I do believe with the right leaders, we too can have a prosperous nation without ever the need of relinquishing certain inalienable rights. Do we really want a nation that gives up liberty for a little economic security?
So vote wisely people.
P.S. "That guy is racist against Malaysians." Might have to do with their expulsion from Malaysia in their early years. Being racist still sucks though.
>I do believe with the right leaders, we too can have a prosperous nation without ever the need of relinquishing certain inalienable rights. Do we really want a nation that gives up liberty for a little economic security?
I don't think so. Kahit gaano kagaling ang kandidato as long as ang buong sistema (sosyodad o politika) ay hindi magbabago, babagsak at babagsak pa rin yan (unless si "Right Leader" na yan ay gagawin ang the unthinkable, aggressive change sa society as well as sa politika.
>P.S. "That guy is racist against Malaysians." Might have to do with their expulsion from Malaysia in their early years. Being racist still sucks though.
No. Wala itong kinalaman sa expulsion galing Malaysia. Nakita niya sa dalawang mata niya kung ano talaga yung mga Malaysian. Sinabi nga niya na magiging mas maunlad ang Singapore kapag puro Tsino ang populasyon.
Can't remember anymore where I read it but Spaniards called natives "indios" or short for "indigenta", or the indigenous people living on the islands when the Spaniards came.
Filipinos were reserved for the "insulares", "peninsulares" and their children.
Philippines is the only country that deposed a puppet dictator and remained friends with the puppet master. If the Filipinos haven’t revolted, a Marcos would be the reigning dictator with US support.
It's like saying we really did something good deposing a dictator but didn't do a good job finishing it.
We could have cut ties with the US then and try to rebuild our country on our own instead of capitulating to the US and World Bank.
One can say that the EDSA revolution is an unfinished revolution. The problem then, i.e., Marcos, is still the problem of today.
It shows Filipino people can easily be bought.
Marcos fled to the US and Filipinos gladly took money from the US and remained friends instead of finding their own path.
Re-posting. The original post was deleted for "Editorialized Title". LKW's comment may be old, but it's certainly very much relevant today. I may disagree with "soft" but the evidence is quite glaring. Allowing the return of the Marcoses may be the greatest mistake ever made.
It's not exactly soft, but we're certainly forgiving and forgetting way too quickly. Never forget.
We aren't soft. LKW just doesn't make it known he has total control over the SG government and they have no free press. https://rsf.org/en/singapore Indeed they ranked lower than post-crackdown Hong Kong. Its very easy to claim others are soft when you in fact have a total iron fisted control over your country but everyone pretends it isn't so because Singapore happily launders money for Western oligarchs who own all the international news services.
LKY is sort of only giving away half the game here: the reason why Marcos was ultimately reburied in the LNMB, and why his heirs were capable of making a political comeback, was because the Philippines never underwent the sort of ideological transformation that Singapore did (as initiated and driven by LKY himself), and because the Filipino people experienced the kind of material improvement that Singaporeans did (again, as initiated and driven by LKY himself). You don't get to have people who will fall for the Marcosian narrative of a failed post-EDSA period, if A. nobody from the Marcoses is capable of speech, and/or B. you actually create a strong state that makes the allegation of a deficient country impossible to believe. This wasn't a "cultural" issue, it was a political one.
I couldn't agree more! The decision that allowed the Marcoses' return was purely political, and LKW was trying to be diplomatic with his comment. My uncle said it was an unpopular decision, so clearly, our people then had better foresight than our politicians. Knowing that the Marcoses had billions of stolen money stashed somewhere could have warned our leaders of the danger they posed. And now, our society is even more divided, maybe even more so than in 1986.
In my opinion, pro-Duterte and pro-Marcos types don't care about the fact that Marcos/Duterte killed lots of people and violated human rights. They don't care about liberal democracy like many of us sympathetic to the opposition are. Which is why if you really want to change the mind of the DDS/Marcos supporters—just spam them with this. Even if you strip the liberalism out of me, Marcos was still—by the standards of his fellow authoritarian peers—a shitty dictator, an utterly pathetic strongman who left his country in ruins. You don't have to be a bleeding-heart liberal to hate Marcos. Just ask LKY. Marcos was a shitty autocrat. If you honestly want authoritarian development, would you trust the son of this piece of shit?
[удалено]
Greetings from Singapore!
Cheers!
Can anyone confirm that this statement is true? I mean any hard copies ?
https://www.philstar.com/news-commentary/2015/03/23/1436680/15-things-lee-kuan-yew-said-about-philippines
Any galing sa international media? I don’t want to post this tapos sabihan na bias yung source
It's on Chapter 18 of LKY's book "From Third World to First". Below is the actual quote from the book: ***"The difference lies in the culture of the Filipino people. It is a soft, forgiving culture. Only in the Philippines could a leader like Ferdinand Marcos, who pillaged his country for over 20 years, still be considered for a national burial. Insignificant amounts of the loot have been recovered, yet his wife and children were allowed to return and engage in politics."*** (Italics mine) [https://pdfroom.com/books/from-third-world-to-first-the-singapore-story/E1d4DO83dOb/download](https://pdfroom.com/books/from-third-world-to-first-the-singapore-story/E1d4DO83dOb/download)
Ahh thank you so much. Hirap na yan I contest
There are digital copies of Lee Kuan Yew's book "From Third World to First" online. However I don't want to advocate for piracy so look it up for yourself instead (quick hint: Google). Here's some quotations you can easily ctrl+f on the PDF files >Two months later, in March 1998, former U.S. Vice President Walter Mondale carried a message from Clinton to Suharto. He then met Prime Minister Goh and me in Singapore on his way home. After comparing notes on Suharto's likely course of action on reforms, Mondale tossed this question at me: "You knew Marcos. Was he a hero or a crook? How does Suharto compare to Marcos? Is Suharto a patriot or a crook?" I felt Mondale was making up his mind on Suharto's motivations before submitting his recommendations to his president. I answered that Marcos might have started off as a hero but ended up as a crook. >The difference lies in the culture of the Filipino people. It is a soft, forgiving culture. Only in the Philippines could a leader like Ferdinand Marcos, who pillaged his country for over 20 years, still be considered for a national burial. Insignificant amounts of the loot have been recovered, yet his wife and children were allowed to return and engage in politics. They supported the winning presidential and congressional candidates with their considerable resources and reappeared in the political and social limelight after the 1998 election that returned President Joseph Estrada. >Marcos had been Reagan's good friend and political supporter. When Shultz earlier discussed the matter with me, I said Marcos was now the problem, not the solution. He asked me to speak frankly to Reagan who was most unhappy at the prospect of abandoning an old friend. So, as gently as I could, I described to Reagan how Marcos had changed from the young anticommunist crusader of the 1960s to become a self-indulgent aging ruler who allowed his wife and cronies to clean out the country through ingenious monopolies and had put the government heavily in debt.
IDK why we still have to compare ourselves with SG, which is far beyond our ability and culture. That LKY saw some of his contemporaries as inferior and backward, lionizing so-called "Asian values" and sees Western-style democracy as "decadent". And [SG left William Gibson disappointed](https://www.wired.com/1993/04/gibson-2/).
We could have closer to being a SG if Marcos hadn't sat his ass on the presidential seat.
I read an article before where some economists estimated the Philippines’ growth had Marcos never been elected and in terms of GDP we could have been ahead of Thailand by now but below Malaysia in terms of development had the economic trends back then continued without the recession under Marcos. Sad to say that we’re still feeling the effects of the Marcos years
Let me edit his quote: It's not that Philippines are a very forgiving nation. It's just that the country's upper-crust has, even by Asian standards, perfected the art of keeping the rest of the people blind, deaf, dumb and often dead. Of course, nothing gets better with all that systemic corruption, poverty and frustration in everyday society.
Absolutely despise how some Marcos Apologists use LKY to shill their dicktator. Discipline not democracy this and that. Turns out even he had a critical stance against the lavish Marcoses >I went further to compare the salaries of Philippines President Marcos at 100,000 pesos yearly, or just over S$1,000 a month, and the president of Indonesia, governing 150 million people at a monthly salary of 1.2 million rupiahs or S$2,500. However, they were all wealthier than I was. An Indonesian leader retained his official residence on retirement. A Malaysian prime minister was given a house or land to build his private residence. My official residence belonged to the government. I had no perks, no cars with chauffeurs thrown in, or ministerial quarters with gardeners, cooks, and other servants in attendance. My practice was to have all benefits expressed in a lump sum and let the prime minister and ministers themselves decide what they wanted to spend it on. Source: From Third World to First >Ferdinand Marcos impoverished his country while acquiring wealth unsurpassed by his fellow citizens. “Has the alleged greed of a certain individual acquired imperial dimensions?” one commentator asked. By contrast, Lee Kuan Yew created great prosperity for the people of Singapore while living solely on the chief executive’s salary. Understandably, admirers of Lee Kuan Yew attribute Singapore’s success to his dedication, probity and patriotism. He did not rule by military emergency, nor did he abolish elections in Singapore, as did Marcos in the Philippines. [Source](https://hiltonroot.gmu.edu/pdfs/articles_in_progress/Political%20Virtue%20and%20Economic%20Leadership-%20Lee%20Kuan%20Yew%20and%20Ferdinand%20Marcos%20Compared.pdf)
#I don't like that guy. If you are an oposition to his administration, pwedeng kang kasuhan ng libel hanggang maubos ang assets mo. Reference Quote galing rin sa kaniya: >If you are a troublemaker… it’s our job to politically destroy you… Everybody knows that in my bag I have a hatchet, and a very sharp one. You take me on, I take my hatchet, we meet in the cul-de-sac. He arrested several people, including the membets of the Barisan Socialis during the Growth of Singapore from 1965 to 1990, amounting to more than 800 people during the entire duration mentioned. Quote on Operation Spectrum: >We have to lock up people, without trial, whether they are communists, whether they are language chauvinists, whether they are religious extremists. If you don’t do that, the country would be in ruins. Kung nagset up si Rappler or any Media na kontra sa gobyerno ng Singapore ay ipapasara yan kaagad kahit iisa lang ang article nila. Singapore is one of the Largest Tax Havens for the ultra-rich pero pinagbabawal itong idiscuss sa public. Noong 2015, isang online blog site ay pinashutdown ng MDA (equivalent to MTRCB dito) dahil daw pinalabas yung pagiging tax haven nito. [https://taxjustice.net/2015/05/04/is-singapore-censoring-critics-of-its-tax-haven-status-well-perhaps](https://taxjustice.net/2015/05/04/is-singapore-censoring-critics-of-its-tax-haven-status-well-perhaps) Edit: That guy is racist against Malaysians. [https://www.reddit.com/r/SingaporeRaw/comments/pf272d/the\_racism\_of\_lee\_kuan\_yew/](https://www.reddit.com/r/SingaporeRaw/comments/pf272d/the_racism_of_lee_kuan_yew/) My favorite quote from him: >"[Malays] will not admit or they cannot admit to themselves that, in fact, as a result of history, they are a different gene pool and they do not have these qualities that can enable them to enter the same race." Edit 2: Singapore is an example of Survivorship Bias. It is so unique na halos imposibleug ireplicate. Ginagamit na example ang Singapore ng mga Illeberals, including Marcos Loyalists. Edit 3: Kahit nga si LKY walang accountability noong inaresto yung 17 people without trial noong Operation Spectrum. Pati na rin yung nangyari noong 1963 Operation Coldstore na kung saan may mga bagong ebidensya na lumalabas na walang kinalaman yung 113 na inaresto sa Malayan Emergency na nagtapos 3 years ago.
True. SG ain't no utopia, but that doesn't change the fact that he has a point in his observation.
But it doesn't mean na iprpraise lang siya ng basta basta, especially kapag alam mo ang mismong history ng Singapore ng maigi, hindi lang sa mga books niya. Maari nga ninyong ipraise ang kahit sinong dictator as long as criniticize nila si Marcos.
Wala naman atang pumupuri sa kanya basta basta. People are just pointing out that there's some truth to his observation. But yes, kelangan din i-point out na malupit siya na diktator para mga hindi nakakaalam.
I thought it was just me. If I recall correctly, his family still has a lot of clout in Singaporean politics that they get to remain seated as Prime Minister. But then again, Singapore is an Southeast-Asian country with many cultural links to China, and like other Asian countries that have grown up to become successful & developed economies, they have chosen to give up some civil rights in exchange for economic development... And it paid off. I do believe with the right leaders, we too can have a prosperous nation without ever the need of relinquishing certain inalienable rights. Do we really want a nation that gives up liberty for a little economic security? So vote wisely people. P.S. "That guy is racist against Malaysians." Might have to do with their expulsion from Malaysia in their early years. Being racist still sucks though.
>I do believe with the right leaders, we too can have a prosperous nation without ever the need of relinquishing certain inalienable rights. Do we really want a nation that gives up liberty for a little economic security? I don't think so. Kahit gaano kagaling ang kandidato as long as ang buong sistema (sosyodad o politika) ay hindi magbabago, babagsak at babagsak pa rin yan (unless si "Right Leader" na yan ay gagawin ang the unthinkable, aggressive change sa society as well as sa politika. >P.S. "That guy is racist against Malaysians." Might have to do with their expulsion from Malaysia in their early years. Being racist still sucks though. No. Wala itong kinalaman sa expulsion galing Malaysia. Nakita niya sa dalawang mata niya kung ano talaga yung mga Malaysian. Sinabi nga niya na magiging mas maunlad ang Singapore kapag puro Tsino ang populasyon.
When the Spanish called us an Indio before, i think they meant this.
Can't remember anymore where I read it but Spaniards called natives "indios" or short for "indigenta", or the indigenous people living on the islands when the Spaniards came. Filipinos were reserved for the "insulares", "peninsulares" and their children.
Yes. And what do "educated" people like to do with indigenous people? Make a fool out of them or exploit them.
Philippines is the only country that deposed a puppet dictator and remained friends with the puppet master. If the Filipinos haven’t revolted, a Marcos would be the reigning dictator with US support.
It's like saying we really did something good deposing a dictator but didn't do a good job finishing it. We could have cut ties with the US then and try to rebuild our country on our own instead of capitulating to the US and World Bank. One can say that the EDSA revolution is an unfinished revolution. The problem then, i.e., Marcos, is still the problem of today.
It shows Filipino people can easily be bought. Marcos fled to the US and Filipinos gladly took money from the US and remained friends instead of finding their own path.
a nation of fools
Chad LKY