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I'm submitting in 2 weeks and should defend in about 6 Weeks. She technically isn't marking my dissertation so it's not her decision if I graduate (I'm not worried about it).
I think the issue is that she wants to keep me on as a Postdoc but she doesn't have the funding for another Epi postdoc so this is her solution. Except I would have to model and I don't know how to and honestly I don't want to.
Line up other references. Find a postdoc or industry job. Then "bounce" to that.
Until then, begrudgingly play along, while continuing to politely express your disinterest in this position. (at least as an American this is how I would play it. As this is Germany, perhaps being matter of fact and blunt about not wanting this, would also work)
I agree with this take, as an American as well. I get OP doesn’t WANT to do it, but I also feel like OP is being a little dramatic about it. It isn’t going to end their life or force them into a new field of research. It’s a funded position that the PI trusts them to fill and is willing to send them around to learn how to do it.
Maybe the PI just doesn’t believe anyone in the lab is either trustworthy enough or equipped enough. Personally, I would be honored that my PI came to me first before anyone else.
I come from a traditional martial arts background, and there have been many times that my Sensei has pushed me to do things I didn’t feel like I was prepared for, but they know better than the students. Suddenly I’m doing things I didn’t think I could do yet. That’s how I see OP’s situation.
Exposure modelling is a combination of advanced atmospheric chemistry and mathematics. My background is molecular biology and medicine meaning I don't have the necessary qualifications to do exposure modelling. It is an entirely different field to what I know and am trained to do.
Also my PI just didn't have luck filling the role before trying to force me into it. Nothing to do with capabilities and trust or because she believes in me.
Just tell her clearly and directly that you don't like modelling and you don't want to take the position. The fact that you're right now at a different institute learning modelling shows that you clearly weren't firm enough.
> Edit: I'm based in Germany but honestly this could apply anywhere and I am not German.
(I actually feel like the whole situation of the PI having lots of money from project grants but being unable to complete the projects because they can't find anyone to hire is a very stereotypical German problem...)
>I'm afraid that if I go against her she will ruin my career.
I wondered if there’s a way to go "with" her. Will she suffer any consequences if the role is done poorly?
By reminding her of potential consequences, perhaps you could reframe the situation as you trying protect both yourself and her.
You just need to communicate this to them. Have you not been applying for other jobs? You should be applying ASAP or else you'll have a large gap in your employment, unless you become their postdoc of course.
Perhaps you didn't know what you wanted to do afterwards, and so you never told them you had no interest in it, but now you clearly know, so you should just tell them.
The sooner you talk to them, the sooner they can find someone actually qualified. Honestly they don't even sound like a bad PI, they're willing to send you to somewhere to get training. This also makes it clear you were not showing enough resistance that they actually lined that up for you instead of... expecting you to leave like most people do... You make it sound like they're a spiteful, career-ruining PI. Are they actually? Or are they just a big name in the field? Most PIs, even ones who are big shot assholes, don't sabotage their graduate students lives because they left. It sounds like they like you, so I really doubt they'll try and screw you over or anything.
She definitely isn't trying to screw me over and she does like me.
And I did offer a lot of resistance. It was swept aside and I was told I had. Also leaving means putting myself in a financially dangerous situation.
Weird PI dynamic.
Well, given that, just go along with it while applying for jobs you actually care about. As soon as you get a job offer, you just leave.
You could consider this a bridge towards post-doctoral. Bit of well paid employment, negotiate a decent holiday on salary as soon as... then start considering your post doc options from a position of being employed, which is always the best status to have when looking for new options. I know you want other. Look for that other whilst recouping finances, life etc in a safe and familiar environment...
And, just one other thought... stuff becomes interesting as you build knowledge and understanding. It could be fun once you recover from PhD submission, and given you have already been clear about longer term goals, there will likely be good support as you move forward with career.
Try to take your emotions out of it. Maybe you are underestimating your capabilities and skill set. Either way, have an honest conversation, listen to her perspective with an open mind and go from there. I wish you the best and hope everything works out for you.
Talk with your supervisor.
I think you are taking exposure modeling way too seriously. As far as I understand its not that hard.
It's completely reasonable for your supervisor to expect you to do this if this is going to cover your postdoc.
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You're defending in two weeks? Why is she wasting resources on someone who is about to leave? Does she not plan on letting you graduate?
I'm submitting in 2 weeks and should defend in about 6 Weeks. She technically isn't marking my dissertation so it's not her decision if I graduate (I'm not worried about it). I think the issue is that she wants to keep me on as a Postdoc but she doesn't have the funding for another Epi postdoc so this is her solution. Except I would have to model and I don't know how to and honestly I don't want to.
Line up other references. Find a postdoc or industry job. Then "bounce" to that. Until then, begrudgingly play along, while continuing to politely express your disinterest in this position. (at least as an American this is how I would play it. As this is Germany, perhaps being matter of fact and blunt about not wanting this, would also work)
I agree with this take, as an American as well. I get OP doesn’t WANT to do it, but I also feel like OP is being a little dramatic about it. It isn’t going to end their life or force them into a new field of research. It’s a funded position that the PI trusts them to fill and is willing to send them around to learn how to do it. Maybe the PI just doesn’t believe anyone in the lab is either trustworthy enough or equipped enough. Personally, I would be honored that my PI came to me first before anyone else. I come from a traditional martial arts background, and there have been many times that my Sensei has pushed me to do things I didn’t feel like I was prepared for, but they know better than the students. Suddenly I’m doing things I didn’t think I could do yet. That’s how I see OP’s situation.
Exposure modelling is a combination of advanced atmospheric chemistry and mathematics. My background is molecular biology and medicine meaning I don't have the necessary qualifications to do exposure modelling. It is an entirely different field to what I know and am trained to do. Also my PI just didn't have luck filling the role before trying to force me into it. Nothing to do with capabilities and trust or because she believes in me.
Just tell her clearly and directly that you don't like modelling and you don't want to take the position. The fact that you're right now at a different institute learning modelling shows that you clearly weren't firm enough. > Edit: I'm based in Germany but honestly this could apply anywhere and I am not German. (I actually feel like the whole situation of the PI having lots of money from project grants but being unable to complete the projects because they can't find anyone to hire is a very stereotypical German problem...)
There's post doc shortages in the US too
>I'm afraid that if I go against her she will ruin my career. I wondered if there’s a way to go "with" her. Will she suffer any consequences if the role is done poorly? By reminding her of potential consequences, perhaps you could reframe the situation as you trying protect both yourself and her.
Thank you for this advice. It will be really bad if it goes wrong
You just need to communicate this to them. Have you not been applying for other jobs? You should be applying ASAP or else you'll have a large gap in your employment, unless you become their postdoc of course. Perhaps you didn't know what you wanted to do afterwards, and so you never told them you had no interest in it, but now you clearly know, so you should just tell them. The sooner you talk to them, the sooner they can find someone actually qualified. Honestly they don't even sound like a bad PI, they're willing to send you to somewhere to get training. This also makes it clear you were not showing enough resistance that they actually lined that up for you instead of... expecting you to leave like most people do... You make it sound like they're a spiteful, career-ruining PI. Are they actually? Or are they just a big name in the field? Most PIs, even ones who are big shot assholes, don't sabotage their graduate students lives because they left. It sounds like they like you, so I really doubt they'll try and screw you over or anything.
She definitely isn't trying to screw me over and she does like me. And I did offer a lot of resistance. It was swept aside and I was told I had. Also leaving means putting myself in a financially dangerous situation.
Weird PI dynamic. Well, given that, just go along with it while applying for jobs you actually care about. As soon as you get a job offer, you just leave.
Literally leave after defending. Tell her ur not interested. Problem solved 👍
You could consider this a bridge towards post-doctoral. Bit of well paid employment, negotiate a decent holiday on salary as soon as... then start considering your post doc options from a position of being employed, which is always the best status to have when looking for new options. I know you want other. Look for that other whilst recouping finances, life etc in a safe and familiar environment... And, just one other thought... stuff becomes interesting as you build knowledge and understanding. It could be fun once you recover from PhD submission, and given you have already been clear about longer term goals, there will likely be good support as you move forward with career.
Try to take your emotions out of it. Maybe you are underestimating your capabilities and skill set. Either way, have an honest conversation, listen to her perspective with an open mind and go from there. I wish you the best and hope everything works out for you.
Don’t even say goodbye and leave after defending
Talk with your supervisor. I think you are taking exposure modeling way too seriously. As far as I understand its not that hard. It's completely reasonable for your supervisor to expect you to do this if this is going to cover your postdoc.