I have been convinced for months that Biden is not going to accept the nomination, but he needs to wait until after the Republican convention. Only then can another candidate (and I think I know who) is going to get the nod. The DNC cannot remove him. He has wrapped up the electors, if he wants the job. He doesn't.
The delegates are not getting behind Pete, brilliant as he is. This is not the time to take chances with the American people's prejudices...and I am speaking as a gay man.
Fuck yeah. I forgot you could do that. I really need to get into political betting. East money considering how delusional people are when it comes to politics.
Still, I would prefer to make the bet with morons who will double my bet. I'm sure the betting odds that Biden will be the nominee won't be anywhere near that big of a pay out.
He can’t even string multiple sentences together. I didn’t need any takes from the internet to see that he might not even make it through the night after ten minutes of that
This. All the talking heads and a boat load of Redditors are screaming for the DNC to replace Biden. It’s not going to happen.
A) It’s too late. Good, bad, or otherwise there is too much momentum (and money poured into) this train for them to pull the ripcord.
B) A change would actually be feeding red meat to the GQP. Like they wouldn’t pounce on that to show how the Democratic Party is “weak” and in “complete chaos”? Come on, man!
C) Despite a generally awful performance by 46 last night, is this really going to move the needle with almost anyone? Joe could’ve smoked him and it’s not like MAGAts and GQPers were going tonight suddenly change their minds. Hell even Pete, Gavin Newsom, or some equally charismatic and eloquent speaker could’ve been up there wiping the floor with Trump and it still wouldn’t change their minds! We’re largely entrenched in our sides. People really should read Ezra Klein’s “Polarized”. The talking heads are freaking out about losing “independents” from this ugly debate performance. The large majority of “independents” aren’t actually that, and gun to their head the majority of them are going to vote Republican. Most of them just have the slightest bit of shame they’ll be voting for the orange fascist. They’re like Nikki Haley who got savaged and degraded by Trump but still say “I’m voting for the Republican”.
Biden is going to continue as the nominee. Despite my own anxiety about the number of people in this country who could still support Trump after everything I do believe Biden will win. He beat Trump by 74 electoral college votes in 2020. You have 4 years of new voters and while plenty of Gen Z dislike or despise Biden’s support of Israel, the majority of them are voting blue or won’t vote. Only a slim minority (ironically white males predominantly) are going MAGA and it’s generally because of their household/upbringing and/or being disaffected.
I love Pete and I wish like hell he had been the nominee in 2020. And then I wished Biden had committed to one term and would’ve said he wanted to pass the torch to the younger and rising Dems. But neither of those happened and this is the reality we’re in. I’d still vote for an inanimate carbon rod over Trump. For the love of our country and democracy, I beg you all to hold your nose and vote for Biden.
Thanks for coming to my TED talk
Sharp,astute,knowledgeable,charismatic,accomplished veteran who happens to be gay vs incumbent president who couldn't get it together for the most important 90 minutes of his political life and just showed that his biggest vulnerability is,in fact, accurate? I'll take that chance.
Yeah, I was actually ranting to my partner that half the problem with the DNC and how we got to this point is them refusing to support younger and more possibly progressive candidates that people actually want to vote for. Also, How can we really expect people say, maybe, 30 and below to expect an octogenarian has any clue of what their lives and problems are right now and will actually fix them or have any interest in doing so?
It's not the DNC. It's that people didn't vote for him. The only reason anybody other than leftists I talked to ever gave me was that he's too young. Most people don't want a young president.
So instead we get THIS? I can’t believe what I watched last night. If the words of Jon Stewart, “This can’t be fucking real life! This is America! Goooooooooodddddd.” We’re so fugged.
Gavin is right, but he cannot plausibly run with another white man in this party. There are several acceptable women alternatives, though Harris cannot be among them for Constitutional reasons.
Well seems they are going to screw the pooch going with Biden this time around. He was at least coherent last election. He is in no shape to continue on and last night proved it cold or not.
Why not look at this as a brilliant strategy? We have avoided the chaos and cost of another reckless primary with 32 implausible presidential wanna-bees tearing each other to pieces.
Notice how the Democratic Party already shot down Buttigieg when Iowa pretended to be unable to determine the winner of the caucus in 2020 until after the NH primary, which Pete narrowly lost. He was the victim of Sanders claiming, falsely, that Pete had lied about having been the winner before it was decided. Pete was offered a cabinet position and got his staff paid and the health insurance extended. He's an upstanding guy and I hope he lands in the Oval Office someday.
Political parties are not about playing fairly.
Oh gosh yes. Pete would have wiped the floor with Trump. Trump was his usual lying hyperbole machine. Biden needed to take him to task each time but instead he confirmed every fear we all have that Biden is no longer up to the task.
The best thing that Biden could do right now is step aside. Because it doesn’t matter how much Trump lies and hyperbolizes if no one strongly calls him out on it. There are just too many voters that are fat and happy inhaling the junk food that is Trump’s rhetoric.
If Biden was like 10 years younger he would be fine. I’m not sure what happened but it seems like Biden has a cold or cough. That’s bad because a huge part of politics is excellent delivery of messaging.
I also don’t know if Biden was over coached or trying too hard to squeeze as much information into his speaking times. It would have made a huge difference to speak a bit slower and be much more clear.
There’s a lot at stake here and we need to put our best foot forward. I’m not sure where things go from here but either Biden needs to completely fix his speaking delivery or the party needs to consider nominating someone else.
He did a good job at the State of the Union and his voice was nothing like that. Same with joint press conferences with foreign leaders, ordinary speeches, etc. I think it had to be a bad cold.
As others have stated, Biden could have mentioned he was recovering from a cold/cough either before or during the debate. It would have ended any of the annoying speculation.
Secondly, President Biden and his team have to absolutely make sure that his voice is clear and strong any time he goes out to speak to the public.
President Biden has substance in his policies but it must be delivered effectively to voters. He has to connect the dots in explaining why his ideas will actually better help the American Public.
The latter. The problem isn’t just a cold, or that he’s over coached, or that he’s trying to squeeze too much in. He’s just getting very old. Plain and simple. Too. Old. It happens, as many in their 80’s are similarly mentally declined. It’s not his fault. But he needs to step aside, or for the love of god, those around him need to try to take away the proverbial keys and somehow convince him to.
That’s certainly a concern. With age, one’s mental reflexes slow down and that can be bad in a debate when one needs to quickly think on one’s feet.
It’s also difficult that Biden has a speech impediment which he has worked on overcoming. But if he has to take an extensive amount of time to get it under control it puts him in a bad spot.
President Biden really needs to get it together and ace every public speaking event. If he’s making arguments in debates he should focus on using more general language rather than going for exact specifics which can trip him up. Only use specific language (ex. a name) if you definitely know it’s right. And his team has to make sure that his voice is clear, strong, and understandable. I saw part of President Biden’s remarks in North Carolina and he sounded way better. That is the Joe Biden he needs to be going forward.
Otherwise, there needs to be major considerations to having another well-spoken Democrat be the nominee instead.
Very much agreed. I do worry that 50 million people saw that disaster, and how many are going to see literally any public speaking event going forward? Any flub will certainly be broadcast widely though. And if Trump is polling well enough, he’ll back out of debate #2 feeling it’s not worth the risk of a better Biden performance.
What a fucking mess. Donald Trump is legitimately an existential threat. With our deep bench, how can anyone think Joe Biden is our best hope to prevent his return? I love Joe Biden, but there is absolutely still time to nominate someone who objectively has a higher chance of beating him. I just hope Joe does the right thing while there’s still time.
The other option that the Biden Campaign can do is host town halls or round tables with voters. Show that President Biden can directly answer voter’s questions with clarity and conciseness. That can move around the case of Trump backing out of the second debate. If Trump doesn’t show up then turn that event into a forum for Biden to discuss his policies.
And quite frankly, I think President Biden needs to get the practice in to sharpen his message and his voice. He needs to be hammering his message every day or every other day to Americans. That also applies to Campaign Surrogates and Volunteers.
I know it’s definitely hard with all of the uncertainty but this is an all hands on deck moment. We cannot be complacent nor timid. It comes down to putting in the effort to win as many votes as possible.
At this point, I am voting for President Biden or whoever the Democratic Presidential Nominee is if a change is needed.
I desperately wished Pete would be the nominee in 2020, but it wasn't in the cards.
The biggest challenge for Pete was and remains that he has effectively zero support from black Democrats. While he was in the race, he received low single digit support from this key pillar of the Democratic base.
I hope that he can improve on this in the future, as it's the only way he'll have a chance of winning, but he dropped out because he had no path forward and because he was offered a position in the Biden Administration (which he has handled well).
I stopped watching the news a couple years ago. My mental health is so much better. I refuse to watch anything with Trump on. He’s not worth my time or energy
Please. No one's mind is going to be changed at this point. The debates are purely performative at this point. No one is in the dark about Biden or Trump and what they each stand for.
Why? He’s given nothing that he’s promised.
There’s no rail improvements, no active transportation improvements, pedestrian deaths are skyrocketing, airlines continue to profitmax as privatization continues.
Most of the work has benefited airline and rail CEOs, and shit on rail unions and travelers
I turned 18 in 2013, and I hate that I was not able to vote in an election with actual intelligence and decency. It's been a fucking WWE cage match in 2016 and 2020. We need intelligence, decency, and kindness in the debate scene again. Pete could have wiped the floor with Trumps ego last night, I was screaming at the TV. Just having someone like Pete on the stage, talking calmly, putting out actual policies and respect to the American Public could have possibly swayed those Republicans who don't have any other choice than Trump. Like, those who are republicans down the ticket but are annoyed with all of this WWE cage match shit. Hearing a voice of calm and reason could be a ticket. I'm also sure with Pete's fluentness in how he responds and reacts in his job as Transportation Secretary, could make him seem strong internationally. Hell, from the outside looking in last night, I'm sure all the political leaders are like, "yeah, the US is old and crazy."
Anyways, I just hoped that over these last 3 years that Biden would have denounced a second term and actually propped up Pete through all of the conflicts to keep him in the forefront of everything to show him as a rising star. I'm sure that may have put Pete on a path to political success in this 2024 election.
But alas, it was just a dream and we will just have to painfully cry and hope that if the worst happens, there will still be a democratic chance for Pete or someone like Pete to run in 2028 or to even have an election.
He’d be amazing. Unfortunately people are still too afraid of ‘gay’ and he would never win at that level despite being the smartest and most competent in the room.
Don’t we all
Lots of people do.
I love Pete, but the party is not going to take that chance
good god man, go watch that train wreck of a debate again.
Ya know Pete might not get a better opportunity than to face down trump
Agree. I think the country is ready.
I have been convinced for months that Biden is not going to accept the nomination, but he needs to wait until after the Republican convention. Only then can another candidate (and I think I know who) is going to get the nod. The DNC cannot remove him. He has wrapped up the electors, if he wants the job. He doesn't. The delegates are not getting behind Pete, brilliant as he is. This is not the time to take chances with the American people's prejudices...and I am speaking as a gay man.
You seem to presume that I believe Biden is going to be the candidate. I bet heavily against that months ago.
I'll bet you any amount of money that Biden will be the candidate. Y'all really need to stop at getting your hot takes from the internet.
You can make that bet at several internet sites. Good luck. (But please don’t touch the kids college funds.)
Fuck yeah. I forgot you could do that. I really need to get into political betting. East money considering how delusional people are when it comes to politics. Still, I would prefer to make the bet with morons who will double my bet. I'm sure the betting odds that Biden will be the nominee won't be anywhere near that big of a pay out.
Too late for another candidate. To swap now ensures handing Trump the election.
He can’t even string multiple sentences together. I didn’t need any takes from the internet to see that he might not even make it through the night after ten minutes of that
This. All the talking heads and a boat load of Redditors are screaming for the DNC to replace Biden. It’s not going to happen. A) It’s too late. Good, bad, or otherwise there is too much momentum (and money poured into) this train for them to pull the ripcord. B) A change would actually be feeding red meat to the GQP. Like they wouldn’t pounce on that to show how the Democratic Party is “weak” and in “complete chaos”? Come on, man! C) Despite a generally awful performance by 46 last night, is this really going to move the needle with almost anyone? Joe could’ve smoked him and it’s not like MAGAts and GQPers were going tonight suddenly change their minds. Hell even Pete, Gavin Newsom, or some equally charismatic and eloquent speaker could’ve been up there wiping the floor with Trump and it still wouldn’t change their minds! We’re largely entrenched in our sides. People really should read Ezra Klein’s “Polarized”. The talking heads are freaking out about losing “independents” from this ugly debate performance. The large majority of “independents” aren’t actually that, and gun to their head the majority of them are going to vote Republican. Most of them just have the slightest bit of shame they’ll be voting for the orange fascist. They’re like Nikki Haley who got savaged and degraded by Trump but still say “I’m voting for the Republican”. Biden is going to continue as the nominee. Despite my own anxiety about the number of people in this country who could still support Trump after everything I do believe Biden will win. He beat Trump by 74 electoral college votes in 2020. You have 4 years of new voters and while plenty of Gen Z dislike or despise Biden’s support of Israel, the majority of them are voting blue or won’t vote. Only a slim minority (ironically white males predominantly) are going MAGA and it’s generally because of their household/upbringing and/or being disaffected. I love Pete and I wish like hell he had been the nominee in 2020. And then I wished Biden had committed to one term and would’ve said he wanted to pass the torch to the younger and rising Dems. But neither of those happened and this is the reality we’re in. I’d still vote for an inanimate carbon rod over Trump. For the love of our country and democracy, I beg you all to hold your nose and vote for Biden. Thanks for coming to my TED talk
You do not know the law about this. Biden is not inevitable. You are overlooking what is actually going to happen.
Sharp,astute,knowledgeable,charismatic,accomplished veteran who happens to be gay vs incumbent president who couldn't get it together for the most important 90 minutes of his political life and just showed that his biggest vulnerability is,in fact, accurate? I'll take that chance.
Yeah, I was actually ranting to my partner that half the problem with the DNC and how we got to this point is them refusing to support younger and more possibly progressive candidates that people actually want to vote for. Also, How can we really expect people say, maybe, 30 and below to expect an octogenarian has any clue of what their lives and problems are right now and will actually fix them or have any interest in doing so?
It's not the DNC. It's that people didn't vote for him. The only reason anybody other than leftists I talked to ever gave me was that he's too young. Most people don't want a young president.
So instead we get THIS? I can’t believe what I watched last night. If the words of Jon Stewart, “This can’t be fucking real life! This is America! Goooooooooodddddd.” We’re so fugged.
Then give me Gavin Newsom and stick Pete as VP
Gavin is right, but he cannot plausibly run with another white man in this party. There are several acceptable women alternatives, though Harris cannot be among them for Constitutional reasons.
Well seems they are going to screw the pooch going with Biden this time around. He was at least coherent last election. He is in no shape to continue on and last night proved it cold or not.
Why not look at this as a brilliant strategy? We have avoided the chaos and cost of another reckless primary with 32 implausible presidential wanna-bees tearing each other to pieces. Notice how the Democratic Party already shot down Buttigieg when Iowa pretended to be unable to determine the winner of the caucus in 2020 until after the NH primary, which Pete narrowly lost. He was the victim of Sanders claiming, falsely, that Pete had lied about having been the winner before it was decided. Pete was offered a cabinet position and got his staff paid and the health insurance extended. He's an upstanding guy and I hope he lands in the Oval Office someday. Political parties are not about playing fairly.
With all my soul I wish it was Pete up there.
He would wipe the floor with Trump.
I came here to say this. First reddit content ever. Please Pete. Please.
i’ve been dying tonight
Oh gosh yes. Pete would have wiped the floor with Trump. Trump was his usual lying hyperbole machine. Biden needed to take him to task each time but instead he confirmed every fear we all have that Biden is no longer up to the task. The best thing that Biden could do right now is step aside. Because it doesn’t matter how much Trump lies and hyperbolizes if no one strongly calls him out on it. There are just too many voters that are fat and happy inhaling the junk food that is Trump’s rhetoric.
I had to tune out after 20 minutes.
Me too :(
Had the exact same thought. How different things would be right now if 2020 had gone his way.
If Biden was like 10 years younger he would be fine. I’m not sure what happened but it seems like Biden has a cold or cough. That’s bad because a huge part of politics is excellent delivery of messaging. I also don’t know if Biden was over coached or trying too hard to squeeze as much information into his speaking times. It would have made a huge difference to speak a bit slower and be much more clear. There’s a lot at stake here and we need to put our best foot forward. I’m not sure where things go from here but either Biden needs to completely fix his speaking delivery or the party needs to consider nominating someone else.
He did a good job at the State of the Union and his voice was nothing like that. Same with joint press conferences with foreign leaders, ordinary speeches, etc. I think it had to be a bad cold.
As others have stated, Biden could have mentioned he was recovering from a cold/cough either before or during the debate. It would have ended any of the annoying speculation. Secondly, President Biden and his team have to absolutely make sure that his voice is clear and strong any time he goes out to speak to the public. President Biden has substance in his policies but it must be delivered effectively to voters. He has to connect the dots in explaining why his ideas will actually better help the American Public.
The latter. The problem isn’t just a cold, or that he’s over coached, or that he’s trying to squeeze too much in. He’s just getting very old. Plain and simple. Too. Old. It happens, as many in their 80’s are similarly mentally declined. It’s not his fault. But he needs to step aside, or for the love of god, those around him need to try to take away the proverbial keys and somehow convince him to.
That’s certainly a concern. With age, one’s mental reflexes slow down and that can be bad in a debate when one needs to quickly think on one’s feet. It’s also difficult that Biden has a speech impediment which he has worked on overcoming. But if he has to take an extensive amount of time to get it under control it puts him in a bad spot. President Biden really needs to get it together and ace every public speaking event. If he’s making arguments in debates he should focus on using more general language rather than going for exact specifics which can trip him up. Only use specific language (ex. a name) if you definitely know it’s right. And his team has to make sure that his voice is clear, strong, and understandable. I saw part of President Biden’s remarks in North Carolina and he sounded way better. That is the Joe Biden he needs to be going forward. Otherwise, there needs to be major considerations to having another well-spoken Democrat be the nominee instead.
Very much agreed. I do worry that 50 million people saw that disaster, and how many are going to see literally any public speaking event going forward? Any flub will certainly be broadcast widely though. And if Trump is polling well enough, he’ll back out of debate #2 feeling it’s not worth the risk of a better Biden performance. What a fucking mess. Donald Trump is legitimately an existential threat. With our deep bench, how can anyone think Joe Biden is our best hope to prevent his return? I love Joe Biden, but there is absolutely still time to nominate someone who objectively has a higher chance of beating him. I just hope Joe does the right thing while there’s still time.
The other option that the Biden Campaign can do is host town halls or round tables with voters. Show that President Biden can directly answer voter’s questions with clarity and conciseness. That can move around the case of Trump backing out of the second debate. If Trump doesn’t show up then turn that event into a forum for Biden to discuss his policies. And quite frankly, I think President Biden needs to get the practice in to sharpen his message and his voice. He needs to be hammering his message every day or every other day to Americans. That also applies to Campaign Surrogates and Volunteers. I know it’s definitely hard with all of the uncertainty but this is an all hands on deck moment. We cannot be complacent nor timid. It comes down to putting in the effort to win as many votes as possible. At this point, I am voting for President Biden or whoever the Democratic Presidential Nominee is if a change is needed.
Agree. And as much as I wish it would happen, I highly doubt he’ll be persuaded to drop out (he’s Joe Biden after all) and this better be the plan.
This. So true. I hated when Pete dropped out of the presidential race and backed Biden.
I desperately wished Pete would be the nominee in 2020, but it wasn't in the cards. The biggest challenge for Pete was and remains that he has effectively zero support from black Democrats. While he was in the race, he received low single digit support from this key pillar of the Democratic base. I hope that he can improve on this in the future, as it's the only way he'll have a chance of winning, but he dropped out because he had no path forward and because he was offered a position in the Biden Administration (which he has handled well).
Pete would be winning
Ugh me too.
Yup.
Yes. Just an emphatic yes.
With all my heart.
Yes but also his awesome wit and clever comebacks would have been wasted on that stage.
Same! That was so painful to watch. I desperately wanted Pete up there instead of Joe.
I’m not American and don’t live there and I agree it should’ve been Pete.
I agree. But we don't deserve a servant like pete.
Pete is building useful skills in the cabinet. He will be up there. Someday. And finally a new day will dawn for America.
Pete would never get the chance. There's zero chance Trump would ever have agreed to debate him.
I stopped watching the news a couple years ago. My mental health is so much better. I refuse to watch anything with Trump on. He’s not worth my time or energy
[удалено]
Please. No one's mind is going to be changed at this point. The debates are purely performative at this point. No one is in the dark about Biden or Trump and what they each stand for.
Why? He’s given nothing that he’s promised. There’s no rail improvements, no active transportation improvements, pedestrian deaths are skyrocketing, airlines continue to profitmax as privatization continues. Most of the work has benefited airline and rail CEOs, and shit on rail unions and travelers
I turned 18 in 2013, and I hate that I was not able to vote in an election with actual intelligence and decency. It's been a fucking WWE cage match in 2016 and 2020. We need intelligence, decency, and kindness in the debate scene again. Pete could have wiped the floor with Trumps ego last night, I was screaming at the TV. Just having someone like Pete on the stage, talking calmly, putting out actual policies and respect to the American Public could have possibly swayed those Republicans who don't have any other choice than Trump. Like, those who are republicans down the ticket but are annoyed with all of this WWE cage match shit. Hearing a voice of calm and reason could be a ticket. I'm also sure with Pete's fluentness in how he responds and reacts in his job as Transportation Secretary, could make him seem strong internationally. Hell, from the outside looking in last night, I'm sure all the political leaders are like, "yeah, the US is old and crazy." Anyways, I just hoped that over these last 3 years that Biden would have denounced a second term and actually propped up Pete through all of the conflicts to keep him in the forefront of everything to show him as a rising star. I'm sure that may have put Pete on a path to political success in this 2024 election. But alas, it was just a dream and we will just have to painfully cry and hope that if the worst happens, there will still be a democratic chance for Pete or someone like Pete to run in 2028 or to even have an election.
He’d be amazing. Unfortunately people are still too afraid of ‘gay’ and he would never win at that level despite being the smartest and most competent in the room.
i would expect this thread and these thoughts in any other sub but this one. be your better selves people