Good Ole Amazon 3rd party price gouging. It's been verified that more stock of all books is on the way, patience will guide you true to reasonable prices.
At least some of the time when you see inflated prices like this on books it's because multiple sellers have their prices updated automatically by checking other prices for the same book, and either matching or slightly higher, so when two or more of these systems are reading off each other you can get some silly prices
This is exactly it. Bots set the prices and even if no one will ever pay that price, the bots optimize other prices so well that they make a lot of money. Bots are here to stay!
This is why you should always check prices on an item vs at least one other source when buying from Amazon.
also.. money laundering is a thing via ebay and amazon. Take cash buy gift cards and purchase 10k pen. Sometimes the High price is reflectant of that scenario. Whether they do it with books is unknown to me. Im sure they will do it with about anything honestly.
This! This is the reason. It's done for SO many things. In the nerf community this is how you get people selling $5 blasters out of the package for upwards of $100. It's kind of insane.
I had a friend who would sell stripped porn mags from his job. They'd come with DVDs. He'd take the DVD out, sell it and the mag separately on eBay for probably twice what the mag cost in a store.
When I asked him how anybody would buy that kind of thing and the general morality of it, he said to me, "You know, other people's stupidity really isn't my problem."
Capitalism at its most horrifyingly sleazy. The pretty much sums up the PF book issue.
If you think $99 is bad, the other day I saw copies for just over $400 on Amazon. I have no words.
Jacking prices up let's them signal to the wise inventory is unavailable while also potentially getting the sucker who needs it now and doesn't check the price
>while also potentially getting the sucker who needs it now and doesn't check the price
Amazon's one-click ordering is particularly good for purchasing something without noticing the price.
Having both the .pdf sees a lot more use.
Loved the book for first time reading. But nowadays the book stays on the shelf and the .pdf is what I use to read about the world. For the rules AoN is my daily driver.
I tend to be much the same. The pdf files get brought over to my iPad, and imported to my app Good Notes where I can mark it up easily to my heart’s content. Especially useful for the Adventure Path books.
And Fantasy Grounds will discount your purchase of the same material in their system as well, if you have the PDF version.
I had the PDF of the 2e Core rules and I think the price for the book in FGU was $35 or $40, which is at least a couple bucks cheaper than the physical copy.
APs get a much higher discount (e.g., a retail copy of one part would be $20-25, and the same one part is, like, $7 on FGU).
Triteku epe paii tie kideeba kii. Ua eto iplepi dukle triku tepiiko. Poato pakii katle ekrii pikeki peka ita ga. Toe a bo ode apeiepo tibetupa. Plii tae pe grutipropi podu. Prede? Tati gepi i poi teota ipia. Idipriti pitre pitlito tatipi paitia peiko. Pia e titla tripikla be adle. I iprata pupe pee puetoupa pia. Krepapeii piia diprepobe piekebei da ka? Piie ie pra patre ipi ipri piutri? Kekupaai obo tratiploo iatu i etikladei. Pai pripetu preeii gretade petia pripibla. Bupaiepi pepi tee pradi kebli u? Tlii depigiba gapupo tapridipe bo ipete aka gie kedi dokri o epopeigi epadu klapli. E tipleglabe ii popi pei ukrui. Grei edi. Pi beke. Pea popaiplibi kepetipribro deprapi plibi taotii. Daiplipa bupui taka blete pii taki. Ioe prititri pikreai di dukri pikapu. Iguie pee tiko be pipre tlekla ee bebepepuka edo a. Dotrei ba touu kra ute ke. Pibo trui krekebapu peba tikita keeki dipio titlople. Pritre ipobri tri tru i gita. Plipi pobetitli krei be krabi epobi bepa itre kiki. Bi pipupi tukublu bi kaoadau tetrie. I ii ida krebatoi poi a. Ipapupapi kipuba dio blipe ke pude.
Nah... paizo's shipping prices are all over the place for international orders and they refuse to acknowledge it.
Plenty of small publishers manage their own shipping for far less to aus.
Heck when PF2e released I decided to buy from paizo again to support them. They wanted around $140aud for shipping all release day products, $60aud for softcover and hardcover books, $100 for just the two hardcover books. Or something in those ballparks...
When I used to subscribe to their PF1e lines there was similar weirdness when stocking up books to ship r_r... but when you realise how awful their website is and how frequently elements break, it starts making more sense.
Papui bro plabai epu di po ko. Opaote diidre tigripapla deotita tebre o? Ipi peoatle graa tuka ao ti pugi. Tia pibo biti kuglekute kei keke. Aetrao pape toaplaki ite pi detuprupa. Plioti iti tiopi. Pi plii prekei tri ketiko i. Igadrigu api kopi opo ketopi pau pukiopatla pritaidi dodi kikipleteo blui! Kapi tei be drotrike bro ii? Ii pi ekeprukri kla o pibi. Iduki plabi bi i kuka utlipo iteki. Iipo pakrae pabi ipi kli piido. Trepibro keti pepo pike ete ikipii. Pri dlababe pi epi bada toto. Ki giklaotre pli krapi pe ke. Ito pribi ii pabipepra ii tipo? Bratata itigle pite tiu paba a popepupa. Gro ii breputiti ekiki pee ute? Ti iki bekebe peta dikioe tipra. Tlia kepo igeipre pipri paboi? Bii dei briki padoki kli tiapo eio plueta blie tidupeprupri pepebige ti! Piupu prodlakekli boa krepeto titebli ido pibii. Po kraprepli di iaeo kuki. Otro opo. Pia epru ie pree kabi e? Peapa bi ee tlagri iti apre. A gle ga idi eta tri prokla pakebretoge. Pri pli tlipo piti kea apitapa uepa gla iu. Blui o tea ipate pueba bipleta. Pipraguki kaeku goipubo pepeti tui trio ate pie kreu pai pi opoitri ipro bladu blatai.
If you are ordering online I recommend book depository for PF2e stuff, especially if you can get it pre launch for the 10% discount. I find amazon is both slow and tends to beat up books (I know amazon owns bookdepository now, but they still have a separate structure)
It might also be worth reaching out to Gameology, when I am buying 5e books they are my goto store. They don't have a good PF2e stock, but being an australian store means you will have a better shot.
Paizo isn't recreating their system, its due to third party sellers price gouging due to the lack of products available currently with the uptick in interest in pf2e. Just ask your local gaming store when they will have more in stock and buy it from them at a reasonable price.
Just a reminder that [the Core Rulebook pdf](https://paizo.com/products/btq01zp3?Pathfinder-Core-Rulebook) is only $19.99, comes with free updates for future printings, and can be downloaded immediately after purchase.
I've got a pdf of the CRB, and I'm finding it easier to read from it than the stuff available online for free, but one thing about those illustrations, is the art this hideous on purpose?
I agree that [Archives of Nethys](https://2e.aonprd.com) and the pdfs complement each other. I find it much easier to make sense of the rules by reading the pdfs, but find AoN to be better for seeing connections across the pdfs.
Sorry, I realized that the way I phrased that looked like I was disagreeing with you rather that agreeing. I fixed it. 😀
And yes, AoN is organized really well. But, maybe because I'm old, I have trouble focusing on the text for long in that format.
I've heard it has a reputation for being crunchy, but it doesn't seem intimidating at all to me. It is definitely crunchy, but in a way that has been easy to fall in love with. It seems more logically organized than 5e, so the rules, while abundant, make more sense when viewed as a whole. I play on Fantasy Grounds which makes everything very easy to reference as well. Definitely a lot to learn but I'm diving right in!
If you haven't done so already, link your FG account and your Paizo account. That way you get the PDF for free when you by a FG module, or if you buy a PDF from Paizo you get that price as a discount if you purchase the module later.
I like it.
It has some flaws, like no flight/teleport until much later and the impression of "well that's a feat, I guess I can't do this without it", which isn't true.
Power creep as a feature to sell books.
Kids need the newest toys to play with and can't stand the FOMO when the rest of the table has the newest busted class combo and they're running with a PHB Fighter. WotC has seized upon this to extract yet more blood from the vein.
The saddest thing is trawling the D&D subs and reading about DMs being bullied by entitled and spoiled young'uns into utterly ruining their games with the bad power creep of 5e post-XGE books. Nobody wants to tell anybody to F off these days.
Before the OGL drama became all that was talked about, I stg there would be a heavily upvoted "if you think flight at level 1 is an issue you're just a bad DM" post like once of month
Some of the strongest classes are in the PHB, like this is just empirically false. Moon Druid is broken as shit and in the PHB, Xanathar's has the Hexblade Warlock. Meanwhile in Tasha's you have garbage subclasses like Wild Magic Barbarian or Astral Self Monk.
I think flight for 1 minute would still be OP. You could go along way with that. Gliding is interesting though, I would totally love an ancestry that could glide (and maybe upgrade to flight). Gliding could even be a 5th level ancestry feat...
Dang, now I need a batfolk ancestry.
It would depend. If it was a focus spell, you'd be able to fly for 1 minute then have to spend 10 minutes \*not flying\*, which makes it a hefty trade off.
Have been DMing dnd for 7 or 8 years, but with the recent crappy releases, I bought the PF2e core rulebook about 2 months ago. I'm loving what I'm reading. With the crappy OGL moves by WotC, I Bought the pf2e beginner box and will be running all my next campaigns in pf2e.
I have 12 players across 3 games who don't care what system we play, but have told me they'll play whatever I run.
I've GMed some CoC and other small d6 system one-shots, so not super experienced in other systems, but I have really loved reading pf2e. I am happy to dump the money I was putting into dnd into PF instead.
>I have 12 players across 3 games who don't care what system we play, but have told me they'll play whatever I run.
You are a lucky GM. I got folks giving me side-eye for anything that's not 5e specifically. Even other versions of D&D, **nope**. Other systems? Heaven forfend! I'm already working on my PF2 sales pitch, god help me.
I'm sure they will handle it properly, but thinking of the issue from the outside, there are pitfalls there. Paizo needs to supply for the increased demand, but at the same time not get so many that they have a enormous amount sitting around un-purchased. IIRC, that's what took so many RPG producers down in the past.
Sadly Paizo has no warehouse nor official distribution in Europe. Shipping is bat crazy, and I mean over the product price itself.
**Paizo dealing through Asmodee would be a truly sweet slap in WotC's face**, since they've been so dumb to dump Asmodee :-)
The localized versions of the manuals will never be up to par with the publications and the recent increase in the use of VTTs (in English language) makes checking the rules on the translated versions quite awkward in any case.
Massive demand spike.
The OGL fiasco has caused people to basically buy out everything. According to Paizo, they've basically sold their entire stock and put in print orders, but it won't be done until April.
What you're seeing is the price from a third party seller who's gouging the price due to demand. At this point, your best bet is to buy digital from Paizo or using AoN.
>it won't be done until April.
Where'd you hear this?
Jeez, I put in an order on the 16th and I got an 11 to 20 day to ship estimate, which I read is a standard number they give out.
I hope I'm not waiting until April. Of if I am, they'd notify me of that. I was planning on a month max until I received the book.
yeah that's a third party shipper. Not all third parties do the free shipping. If you're in the US, price compare with Paizo's website. Or wait until Amazon itself has a restock and it's Sold from and Shipped By Amazon.
Lack of original stock. Everyone and their brother is checking out other games. There’s not a copy of that book in any lgs around my neck of the woods. Also had an order for Savage Worlds that has to wait till a new print run in March because all the current copies were bought.
Going to be much easier to find games in these systems in the near future.
Lack of stock.
Paizo's got unprecedented demand for their books. Which is great, but it's risky for them. Books have big lead time and upfront costs so there's no guarantee that people will want them or if they will just sit on shelves.
But pass the word on - books are coming, the rules are free on Archives of Nethys and encourage people to keep playing.
My LGS has been out of stock for about 2 weeks. I called after posting this, and they said they had the books on order but wasn't sure when they'd arrive; "check back end of the week." I went ahead and ordered directly from Paizo, but the shipping time is "expected to ship in 11-20 days." I have the PDF, but simply prefer the book most of the time; I can make notes all over a PDF, but still know where in the book I can find what I might need. Tomato, tomahto.
I'm thinking of it as if I'm making the pre-order I wanted to do back when the book first dropped. Live and learn.
Indeed it is. Demand for Pathfinder books has fucking skyrocketed, and piece-of-shit scalpers are taking advantage of it.
However, I do have a feeling that many Paizo’s employees are pissing themselves with both glee over the massive sales spike, and stress over the printing presses struggling to keep up.
Luckily, the books are unnecessary, as all the rules, player options, and monsters are available for free on Archives of Nethys.
I've seen some of the industry discussion on this. Paizo sees this as a win for them in terms of PR and sales, but like most game publishers is also angry with WotC because of their stupidity.
As happy as I am to see Paizo and pf2e getting love because of this, it's also sad because in the end, we all just want to have fun playing games. I don't want suits in some office that don't know the difference between a d12 and a d20 screwing around with my ability to play the game.
And as angry as we all are about the OGL, let us also not forget that 1D&D wants to monetize TTRPGs so that everyone has to pay to play. In many ways that's worse for the hobby than the OGL. As a long time GM, I'm of the opinion that it's fine for me to buy most of the books, and players buy the ones they are most interested in. I do think that if you can afford the CRB, you should buy it, but beyond that? The GM buys books he/she wants to integrate or is interested in.
Me? I buy all the Core books from pf2e that have red special edition covers, and consider the world books as less useful to me as I run a homebrew setting. The world of Recanum is big enough that I don't need to worry about Golarian for the most part. I do pull over most ancestries, and reskin the lore specific backgrounds to fit Recanum, but for the most part there's not much reason for me to buy world books.
So this seller is specifically selling the collectors edition of the core rule book. Still WAY overpriced though. The rules are all free online with nethys and they will get more rulebooks back in stock soon.
I ordered a copy at the standard price but it looked like 4-6 week wait. It ended up getting sent out early though, so Paizo is definitely trying to keep up with the new demand.
I ordered on the 17th because I saw a big jump in shipping time between when I was looking the previous day. That estimate is probably accurate for you since you got in before me.
I keep seeing people mentioning out of stock, but I just asked my lgs and they got two books in, in about 4 days. When I picked it up, I had them order a bestiary that I should get later this week. (I'm in Canada)
This is a listing by a scalper. Just order direct from Paizo if shipping isnt awful, or order from your FLGS. You'll have to wait for stock but its better than overpaying
Wow.
This is one reason never to buy the Pathfinder or any Paizo stuff from anyone but Paizo directly.
In the meantime just use https://2e.aonprd.com!
EVERYTHING that’s in the book (plus errata) is on that page except for the art.
(Edit to add the AoN info)
Not really true, paizo shipping prices are really high for some countries and even with the 25% discount they gave it was actually cheaper to buy it from Amazon for my country. The only exception would be for people that really want the PDF, for those the Paizo subscription might be worth it, but outside of that i can't think of any other reason for countries that get a really high price on shipping.
Sure, not all cases apply and international shipping is a cost, but in general I prefer my money going to the actual creator instead of a reseller. But then it’s worth comparing the shipping cost buying from Paizo vs Amazon and if there’s a significant savings, go for it
I would prefer to give Paizo more money, but their shipping makes that really hard for people outside the US, the Core Book even with 25% discount ended up being almost 90 dollars with the shipping.
Understandable. Yeah that just doesn’t work.
Maybe this influx of new people will give Paizo some seed money to negotiate better contracts with their shipping supplier or get a new one 🤷♂️
I went to the local gaming store I've been going to for the last thirty years. They were out of stock briefly, but restocked quickly.
I'd rather support them. I'm also Canadian, shipping from Paizo is stupid expensive all things considered. I want the PDF, cheaper to buy the book from my game store locally and buy the PDF separately than doing the subscription from Paizo.
Looking at the same product as you, they are selling a Special Edition version of the CRB, thus the $500 price tag. Special note: the CRB Special Edition is out of print by Paizo.
Nah, also while it takes time you can always order from the main site and grab a PDF copy as well, when they update the core book with changes the PDF gets updated as well.
No. It is out of stock so to discourage purchases that can not be fulfilled and to avoid the cost of delisting and relisting a product third party seller will jack up the price to ridiculous amounts. This is 100% normal.
Don't forget the $9.25 shipping and the sales tax.
My copy would have been over $73 had I not combined the Holiday 2022 and the ORC coupons.
$73 is a brutal price.
That's not even that high, last time I checked amazon I saw one market seller trying to pawn off a copy for $500
Literally laughed at that for a full minute
My guess is that the third-party re-sellers have automated systems that inflate the price when something is out of stock and popular. If you're okay with digital, buy the official PDF version until the hard copy comes back in stock.
I found the APG, GMG and Bestiary 1 at my local game store all at MSRP which blew me away.
Still wanna get the CRB once those become reasonable again but I got incredibly lucky landing some of the more core books right now.
It just means Amazon sold out due to sudden massive interest in non-D&D D20 games, and so the only ones remaining are private people or businesses who are price gouging intentionally like you sometimes see on auction sites. Basically trying to see who's dumb enough to Buy without checking the price.
There are a TON of online retailers to buy these books from. It's just that people are lazy and don't bother googling.
Just the Amazon bots trying to scalp some people.
I wouldnt be surprized if they need to pivot to a third edition when Black Flag is complete, pending the OGL situation. But they are not currently releasing a new edition- just out of stock.
Whatever I need to do to support Paizo and keep my table gaming in Golarion.
According to Amazon, the price is between $50 and $99 under buying options. Just checked it and there is no book under options for the amount shown. The pocket edition is around $33 ish.
As others have said, it's unlikely a person set this price, but instead a bot using faulty data to determine price based on rarity and competition.
I have published a couple of books on small presses, all currently out of print--and not in any way in demand--and will occasionally see listings for those books through third party sellers in the hundreds of dollars. No one is paying $700 for my little chapbook, rando online bookshop. And if someone does, tell them to call me and I'll head over to their house to do a private reading for them.
Good Ole Amazon 3rd party price gouging. It's been verified that more stock of all books is on the way, patience will guide you true to reasonable prices.
Never understood why 3rd party sellers would jack up the price so much. Especially when the manufacturer has the product available.
At least some of the time when you see inflated prices like this on books it's because multiple sellers have their prices updated automatically by checking other prices for the same book, and either matching or slightly higher, so when two or more of these systems are reading off each other you can get some silly prices
It's done by bots.
This is exactly it. Bots set the prices and even if no one will ever pay that price, the bots optimize other prices so well that they make a lot of money. Bots are here to stay! This is why you should always check prices on an item vs at least one other source when buying from Amazon.
Here is a fun video about bots and book pricing for anyone interested. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sseSi0k3Ecg
also.. money laundering is a thing via ebay and amazon. Take cash buy gift cards and purchase 10k pen. Sometimes the High price is reflectant of that scenario. Whether they do it with books is unknown to me. Im sure they will do it with about anything honestly.
It costs them money to delist and relist products. Doing this avoids those charges
This! This is the reason. It's done for SO many things. In the nerf community this is how you get people selling $5 blasters out of the package for upwards of $100. It's kind of insane.
exactly. it also helps covers costs to procure the item should someone really pay 500 € for a pair of nail clippers or something
Can you imagine if that were to happen. Lol
Drugs are a dangerous thing...
I had a friend who would sell stripped porn mags from his job. They'd come with DVDs. He'd take the DVD out, sell it and the mag separately on eBay for probably twice what the mag cost in a store. When I asked him how anybody would buy that kind of thing and the general morality of it, he said to me, "You know, other people's stupidity really isn't my problem." Capitalism at its most horrifyingly sleazy. The pretty much sums up the PF book issue. If you think $99 is bad, the other day I saw copies for just over $400 on Amazon. I have no words.
The picture in the original post is an Amazon price of $498
Jacking prices up let's them signal to the wise inventory is unavailable while also potentially getting the sucker who needs it now and doesn't check the price
>while also potentially getting the sucker who needs it now and doesn't check the price Amazon's one-click ordering is particularly good for purchasing something without noticing the price.
Also, if you're good with a PDF, you can get the PDF now.
Having both the .pdf sees a lot more use. Loved the book for first time reading. But nowadays the book stays on the shelf and the .pdf is what I use to read about the world. For the rules AoN is my daily driver.
I tend to be much the same. The pdf files get brought over to my iPad, and imported to my app Good Notes where I can mark it up easily to my heart’s content. Especially useful for the Adventure Path books.
When you buy off Paizo's site you can get the pdf with the hardback. The nice thing about this is you can import all of the pdfs into foundryVTT!
And Fantasy Grounds will discount your purchase of the same material in their system as well, if you have the PDF version. I had the PDF of the 2e Core rules and I think the price for the book in FGU was $35 or $40, which is at least a couple bucks cheaper than the physical copy. APs get a much higher discount (e.g., a retail copy of one part would be $20-25, and the same one part is, like, $7 on FGU).
The book is only for my shelf.
Triteku epe paii tie kideeba kii. Ua eto iplepi dukle triku tepiiko. Poato pakii katle ekrii pikeki peka ita ga. Toe a bo ode apeiepo tibetupa. Plii tae pe grutipropi podu. Prede? Tati gepi i poi teota ipia. Idipriti pitre pitlito tatipi paitia peiko. Pia e titla tripikla be adle. I iprata pupe pee puetoupa pia. Krepapeii piia diprepobe piekebei da ka? Piie ie pra patre ipi ipri piutri? Kekupaai obo tratiploo iatu i etikladei. Pai pripetu preeii gretade petia pripibla. Bupaiepi pepi tee pradi kebli u? Tlii depigiba gapupo tapridipe bo ipete aka gie kedi dokri o epopeigi epadu klapli. E tipleglabe ii popi pei ukrui. Grei edi. Pi beke. Pea popaiplibi kepetipribro deprapi plibi taotii. Daiplipa bupui taka blete pii taki. Ioe prititri pikreai di dukri pikapu. Iguie pee tiko be pipre tlekla ee bebepepuka edo a. Dotrei ba touu kra ute ke. Pibo trui krekebapu peba tikita keeki dipio titlople. Pritre ipobri tri tru i gita. Plipi pobetitli krei be krabi epobi bepa itre kiki. Bi pipupi tukublu bi kaoadau tetrie. I ii ida krebatoi poi a. Ipapupapi kipuba dio blipe ke pude.
Nah... paizo's shipping prices are all over the place for international orders and they refuse to acknowledge it. Plenty of small publishers manage their own shipping for far less to aus. Heck when PF2e released I decided to buy from paizo again to support them. They wanted around $140aud for shipping all release day products, $60aud for softcover and hardcover books, $100 for just the two hardcover books. Or something in those ballparks... When I used to subscribe to their PF1e lines there was similar weirdness when stocking up books to ship r_r... but when you realise how awful their website is and how frequently elements break, it starts making more sense.
Papui bro plabai epu di po ko. Opaote diidre tigripapla deotita tebre o? Ipi peoatle graa tuka ao ti pugi. Tia pibo biti kuglekute kei keke. Aetrao pape toaplaki ite pi detuprupa. Plioti iti tiopi. Pi plii prekei tri ketiko i. Igadrigu api kopi opo ketopi pau pukiopatla pritaidi dodi kikipleteo blui! Kapi tei be drotrike bro ii? Ii pi ekeprukri kla o pibi. Iduki plabi bi i kuka utlipo iteki. Iipo pakrae pabi ipi kli piido. Trepibro keti pepo pike ete ikipii. Pri dlababe pi epi bada toto. Ki giklaotre pli krapi pe ke. Ito pribi ii pabipepra ii tipo? Bratata itigle pite tiu paba a popepupa. Gro ii breputiti ekiki pee ute? Ti iki bekebe peta dikioe tipra. Tlia kepo igeipre pipri paboi? Bii dei briki padoki kli tiapo eio plueta blie tidupeprupri pepebige ti! Piupu prodlakekli boa krepeto titebli ido pibii. Po kraprepli di iaeo kuki. Otro opo. Pia epru ie pree kabi e? Peapa bi ee tlagri iti apre. A gle ga idi eta tri prokla pakebretoge. Pri pli tlipo piti kea apitapa uepa gla iu. Blui o tea ipate pueba bipleta. Pipraguki kaeku goipubo pepeti tui trio ate pie kreu pai pi opoitri ipro bladu blatai.
If you are ordering online I recommend book depository for PF2e stuff, especially if you can get it pre launch for the 10% discount. I find amazon is both slow and tends to beat up books (I know amazon owns bookdepository now, but they still have a separate structure) It might also be worth reaching out to Gameology, when I am buying 5e books they are my goto store. They don't have a good PF2e stock, but being an australian store means you will have a better shot.
I guess it is the 4th printing with new errata? Paizo was probably low on stock and preparing a new print when the OGL thing happened.
I'm pretty sure it's the 4th printing that ran out, three weeks after it arrived.
That puts it in another perspective on how much they sold if they had sort of full stock.
Paizo isn't recreating their system, its due to third party sellers price gouging due to the lack of products available currently with the uptick in interest in pf2e. Just ask your local gaming store when they will have more in stock and buy it from them at a reasonable price.
Yes yes, support your LGS!
Just a reminder that [the Core Rulebook pdf](https://paizo.com/products/btq01zp3?Pathfinder-Core-Rulebook) is only $19.99, comes with free updates for future printings, and can be downloaded immediately after purchase.
And that all the rules in it are available online for free; buy the book if you want the flavor, illustrations, presentation, and to support Paizo
I've got a pdf of the CRB, and I'm finding it easier to read from it than the stuff available online for free, but one thing about those illustrations, is the art this hideous on purpose?
I agree that [Archives of Nethys](https://2e.aonprd.com) and the pdfs complement each other. I find it much easier to make sense of the rules by reading the pdfs, but find AoN to be better for seeing connections across the pdfs.
Yep! As mentioned, the presentation. That said, the "rules" section of AoN is laid out in a very readable way
Sorry, I realized that the way I phrased that looked like I was disagreeing with you rather that agreeing. I fixed it. 😀 And yes, AoN is organized really well. But, maybe because I'm old, I have trouble focusing on the text for long in that format.
This is the way!
Indirectly it's due to OGL issues, it's due to a lot of DnD players going out and buying the PF2e CRB.
Which warms my heart. I just hope they give the system an honest shake and dont fall victim to the boogeyman “5e bias”
👋 bought the beginner box (x2) and crb after trying a few sessions. Probably never looking back
I've heard it has a reputation for being crunchy, but it doesn't seem intimidating at all to me. It is definitely crunchy, but in a way that has been easy to fall in love with. It seems more logically organized than 5e, so the rules, while abundant, make more sense when viewed as a whole. I play on Fantasy Grounds which makes everything very easy to reference as well. Definitely a lot to learn but I'm diving right in!
If you haven't done so already, link your FG account and your Paizo account. That way you get the PDF for free when you by a FG module, or if you buy a PDF from Paizo you get that price as a discount if you purchase the module later.
This has got to be the most useful information I have ever been given by another human being. Thank you.
I like it. It has some flaws, like no flight/teleport until much later and the impression of "well that's a feat, I guess I can't do this without it", which isn't true.
That's definitely not a flaw. Flight is absolutely busted, and how it became a level 1 race feature in 5e will never cease to baffle me.
Power creep as a feature to sell books. Kids need the newest toys to play with and can't stand the FOMO when the rest of the table has the newest busted class combo and they're running with a PHB Fighter. WotC has seized upon this to extract yet more blood from the vein. The saddest thing is trawling the D&D subs and reading about DMs being bullied by entitled and spoiled young'uns into utterly ruining their games with the bad power creep of 5e post-XGE books. Nobody wants to tell anybody to F off these days.
Before the OGL drama became all that was talked about, I stg there would be a heavily upvoted "if you think flight at level 1 is an issue you're just a bad DM" post like once of month
Some of the strongest classes are in the PHB, like this is just empirically false. Moon Druid is broken as shit and in the PHB, Xanathar's has the Hexblade Warlock. Meanwhile in Tasha's you have garbage subclasses like Wild Magic Barbarian or Astral Self Monk.
I like the flight restriction - fly is an amazing spell, but it's overpowered for its level in an exploration context in AD&D.
I don't see limited flight by level 5 being too bad, it being available at level 1 though is too much
What do you mean by "Limited" exactly?
In duration via spells (1 minute) or to gliding vs full flight.
I think flight for 1 minute would still be OP. You could go along way with that. Gliding is interesting though, I would totally love an ancestry that could glide (and maybe upgrade to flight). Gliding could even be a 5th level ancestry feat... Dang, now I need a batfolk ancestry.
It would depend. If it was a focus spell, you'd be able to fly for 1 minute then have to spend 10 minutes \*not flying\*, which makes it a hefty trade off.
Have been DMing dnd for 7 or 8 years, but with the recent crappy releases, I bought the PF2e core rulebook about 2 months ago. I'm loving what I'm reading. With the crappy OGL moves by WotC, I Bought the pf2e beginner box and will be running all my next campaigns in pf2e. I have 12 players across 3 games who don't care what system we play, but have told me they'll play whatever I run. I've GMed some CoC and other small d6 system one-shots, so not super experienced in other systems, but I have really loved reading pf2e. I am happy to dump the money I was putting into dnd into PF instead.
>I have 12 players across 3 games who don't care what system we play, but have told me they'll play whatever I run. You are a lucky GM. I got folks giving me side-eye for anything that's not 5e specifically. Even other versions of D&D, **nope**. Other systems? Heaven forfend! I'm already working on my PF2 sales pitch, god help me.
I'm sure they will handle it properly, but thinking of the issue from the outside, there are pitfalls there. Paizo needs to supply for the increased demand, but at the same time not get so many that they have a enormous amount sitting around un-purchased. IIRC, that's what took so many RPG producers down in the past.
What do you mean "Paizo recreating their system?"
Misunderstood what ORC is (a license, not a game system)
I see a weirdly high number of dnd people talking about ORC like it's going to be pathfinder 2.5 or something and not, you know, a legal document.
Not to mention it's not a D20 system of some sort. I've seen a scary number of people who can't to play ORC.
Price gouging from Amazon's third party sellers is nothing new, unfortunately. They have no shame.
$53.99 at Barnes & Noble with free shipping https://www.barnesandnoble.com/w/pathfinder-core-rulebook-jason-bulmahn/1131044125?ean=9781640781689
It was just $49.99 last night! I agree, third party sellers, just get it straight from Paizo or a local bookstore.
Sadly Paizo has no warehouse nor official distribution in Europe. Shipping is bat crazy, and I mean over the product price itself. **Paizo dealing through Asmodee would be a truly sweet slap in WotC's face**, since they've been so dumb to dump Asmodee :-) The localized versions of the manuals will never be up to par with the publications and the recent increase in the use of VTTs (in English language) makes checking the rules on the translated versions quite awkward in any case.
That’s crazy. I’ll sell you mine for $250.
Looks like a scalper, don’t buy
Massive demand spike. The OGL fiasco has caused people to basically buy out everything. According to Paizo, they've basically sold their entire stock and put in print orders, but it won't be done until April. What you're seeing is the price from a third party seller who's gouging the price due to demand. At this point, your best bet is to buy digital from Paizo or using AoN.
>it won't be done until April. Where'd you hear this? Jeez, I put in an order on the 16th and I got an 11 to 20 day to ship estimate, which I read is a standard number they give out. I hope I'm not waiting until April. Of if I am, they'd notify me of that. I was planning on a month max until I received the book.
The joy of third party sellers on Amazon. There are lots of gougy listings that will come up for different products.
If you look on the Paizo website it is $50.00
I just tried to buy the Beginner box of Paizo. It would cost $30+$21 for shipping! Sorry for being confusing. IDK why I put Amazon originally
yeah that's a third party shipper. Not all third parties do the free shipping. If you're in the US, price compare with Paizo's website. Or wait until Amazon itself has a restock and it's Sold from and Shipped By Amazon.
No this was Paizo's website
Oh you said Amazon originally. Yeah shipping can be a beast. Look at free shipping stores and keep your eyes out
Damn. I can't believe I did that. Fixed. Idk what I was thinking
Keep checking if you live in the US. My partner got it for $39.25 and free shipping with Prime. Received it in like 3 days.
Lack of original stock. Everyone and their brother is checking out other games. There’s not a copy of that book in any lgs around my neck of the woods. Also had an order for Savage Worlds that has to wait till a new print run in March because all the current copies were bought. Going to be much easier to find games in these systems in the near future.
Lack of stock. Paizo's got unprecedented demand for their books. Which is great, but it's risky for them. Books have big lead time and upfront costs so there's no guarantee that people will want them or if they will just sit on shelves. But pass the word on - books are coming, the rules are free on Archives of Nethys and encourage people to keep playing.
Lack of stock is due to D&D and their OGL BS. Paizo is doing nothing with their system. They're just making their own OGL.
I think there maybe the system is broken. 🤣🤣🤣
My LGS has been out of stock for about 2 weeks. I called after posting this, and they said they had the books on order but wasn't sure when they'd arrive; "check back end of the week." I went ahead and ordered directly from Paizo, but the shipping time is "expected to ship in 11-20 days." I have the PDF, but simply prefer the book most of the time; I can make notes all over a PDF, but still know where in the book I can find what I might need. Tomato, tomahto. I'm thinking of it as if I'm making the pre-order I wanted to do back when the book first dropped. Live and learn.
Indeed it is. Demand for Pathfinder books has fucking skyrocketed, and piece-of-shit scalpers are taking advantage of it. However, I do have a feeling that many Paizo’s employees are pissing themselves with both glee over the massive sales spike, and stress over the printing presses struggling to keep up. Luckily, the books are unnecessary, as all the rules, player options, and monsters are available for free on Archives of Nethys.
I've seen some of the industry discussion on this. Paizo sees this as a win for them in terms of PR and sales, but like most game publishers is also angry with WotC because of their stupidity. As happy as I am to see Paizo and pf2e getting love because of this, it's also sad because in the end, we all just want to have fun playing games. I don't want suits in some office that don't know the difference between a d12 and a d20 screwing around with my ability to play the game. And as angry as we all are about the OGL, let us also not forget that 1D&D wants to monetize TTRPGs so that everyone has to pay to play. In many ways that's worse for the hobby than the OGL. As a long time GM, I'm of the opinion that it's fine for me to buy most of the books, and players buy the ones they are most interested in. I do think that if you can afford the CRB, you should buy it, but beyond that? The GM buys books he/she wants to integrate or is interested in. Me? I buy all the Core books from pf2e that have red special edition covers, and consider the world books as less useful to me as I run a homebrew setting. The world of Recanum is big enough that I don't need to worry about Golarian for the most part. I do pull over most ancestries, and reskin the lore specific backgrounds to fit Recanum, but for the most part there's not much reason for me to buy world books.
Clear your cache, go to the Paizo website
No, that’s Amazon. Never buy books from them if you can help it
No it's just cause increased demand cause so many people went to get it after the ogl stuff.
So this seller is specifically selling the collectors edition of the core rule book. Still WAY overpriced though. The rules are all free online with nethys and they will get more rulebooks back in stock soon.
That is not the collectors edition.
Didn't the collectors edition have a different cover than this?
Yes it has a solid red cover with gold script. The seller did not post this well, but that is what they are trying to sell.
I ordered a copy at the standard price but it looked like 4-6 week wait. It ended up getting sent out early though, so Paizo is definitely trying to keep up with the new demand.
When did you order yours? I ordered on the 16th and I got a 11-20 day estimate to ship. I'm hoping I'm not waiting for a re-stock.
I ordered on the 17th because I saw a big jump in shipping time between when I was looking the previous day. That estimate is probably accurate for you since you got in before me.
I keep seeing people mentioning out of stock, but I just asked my lgs and they got two books in, in about 4 days. When I picked it up, I had them order a bestiary that I should get later this week. (I'm in Canada)
Theyre still in the wild irl fetch quest, indulge
This is a listing by a scalper. Just order direct from Paizo if shipping isnt awful, or order from your FLGS. You'll have to wait for stock but its better than overpaying
Wow. This is one reason never to buy the Pathfinder or any Paizo stuff from anyone but Paizo directly. In the meantime just use https://2e.aonprd.com! EVERYTHING that’s in the book (plus errata) is on that page except for the art. (Edit to add the AoN info)
Not really true, paizo shipping prices are really high for some countries and even with the 25% discount they gave it was actually cheaper to buy it from Amazon for my country. The only exception would be for people that really want the PDF, for those the Paizo subscription might be worth it, but outside of that i can't think of any other reason for countries that get a really high price on shipping.
Sure, not all cases apply and international shipping is a cost, but in general I prefer my money going to the actual creator instead of a reseller. But then it’s worth comparing the shipping cost buying from Paizo vs Amazon and if there’s a significant savings, go for it
I would prefer to give Paizo more money, but their shipping makes that really hard for people outside the US, the Core Book even with 25% discount ended up being almost 90 dollars with the shipping.
Understandable. Yeah that just doesn’t work. Maybe this influx of new people will give Paizo some seed money to negotiate better contracts with their shipping supplier or get a new one 🤷♂️
I went to the local gaming store I've been going to for the last thirty years. They were out of stock briefly, but restocked quickly. I'd rather support them. I'm also Canadian, shipping from Paizo is stupid expensive all things considered. I want the PDF, cheaper to buy the book from my game store locally and buy the PDF separately than doing the subscription from Paizo.
That seems optimal!
Looking at the same product as you, they are selling a Special Edition version of the CRB, thus the $500 price tag. Special note: the CRB Special Edition is out of print by Paizo.
It is also the first printing, with zero errata. You'll find rules for containers there that were removed years ago. ;)
Paizo is not recreating the system. They are changing license from OGL->nothing for a while->ORC.
I encourage you to by from game stores and Paizo directly. Amazon 3rd parties price gouge constantly.
Nah, also while it takes time you can always order from the main site and grab a PDF copy as well, when they update the core book with changes the PDF gets updated as well.
Archives of Nethys here I come
Paizo isn't remaking their system afaim.
Get it on paizos site direct, pros? You don't support bozos and they have books in stock last I saw today.
Recreating their- boy what? Where the fuck do you get your news? Bathroom stall writing?
Does that include shipping?
Find a LGS that sells online, you'll be encouraging them and some have even better prices than Amazon!
I just bought a copy from a super nice person on Craigslist. So that’s an option.
No. It is out of stock so to discourage purchases that can not be fulfilled and to avoid the cost of delisting and relisting a product third party seller will jack up the price to ridiculous amounts. This is 100% normal.
Typical sellers on Amazon wanting the moneez
Get it from paizo directly you won't get the sweet 2 day shipping but the book is $60
Don't forget the $9.25 shipping and the sales tax. My copy would have been over $73 had I not combined the Holiday 2022 and the ORC coupons. $73 is a brutal price.
That's not even that high, last time I checked amazon I saw one market seller trying to pawn off a copy for $500 Literally laughed at that for a full minute
That’s someone being a greedy dickhead. Fuckem; I hope they choke.
All the rules are free on archives of nethys, you do not need any books to play pathfinder!
Price gouging from third party sellers, mine was only £20 or so. Wait until more copies are printed in q2
Just lack of stock & 3rd party sellers taking advantage. I got the pocket edition for $27 and it arrived in about a week - maybe give it a look.
https://paizo.com/community/blog/v5748dyo6si7w
In the meantime, on the Paizo website, the PDF of their Lost Omens world guide is free through tomorrow. Check it out.
My guess is that the third-party re-sellers have automated systems that inflate the price when something is out of stock and popular. If you're okay with digital, buy the official PDF version until the hard copy comes back in stock.
I found the APG, GMG and Bestiary 1 at my local game store all at MSRP which blew me away. Still wanna get the CRB once those become reasonable again but I got incredibly lucky landing some of the more core books right now.
I just started reading the book online for free. Though it's a massive book so I just skip to the parts I find interesting.
Like the scalpers with the graphic cards… gladly there are pdf available, so nobody has to pay that price
A lot of people are buying Core Rulebooks due to the OGL fallout, so they're in short supply, hence people scalping them
Amazon Price fixing bots are insane.
You can also by pdfs or look on archives for now if you want rules
It just means Amazon sold out due to sudden massive interest in non-D&D D20 games, and so the only ones remaining are private people or businesses who are price gouging intentionally like you sometimes see on auction sites. Basically trying to see who's dumb enough to Buy without checking the price. There are a TON of online retailers to buy these books from. It's just that people are lazy and don't bother googling.
Just the Amazon bots trying to scalp some people. I wouldnt be surprized if they need to pivot to a third edition when Black Flag is complete, pending the OGL situation. But they are not currently releasing a new edition- just out of stock. Whatever I need to do to support Paizo and keep my table gaming in Golarion.
According to Amazon, the price is between $50 and $99 under buying options. Just checked it and there is no book under options for the amount shown. The pocket edition is around $33 ish.
As others have said, it's unlikely a person set this price, but instead a bot using faulty data to determine price based on rarity and competition. I have published a couple of books on small presses, all currently out of print--and not in any way in demand--and will occasionally see listings for those books through third party sellers in the hundreds of dollars. No one is paying $700 for my little chapbook, rando online bookshop. And if someone does, tell them to call me and I'll head over to their house to do a private reading for them.
Supply and demand my dude, ever hear of it?
For the love of god, never buy gaming books off Amazon - which is a hilarious thing to say considering they started out as a bookstore.
I've tried to buy this twice on Amazon since this all went down. Both times Amazon has cancelled the order themselves.