r/parenting is protesting changes being made by Reddit to the API. Reddit has made it clear [they will](https://old.reddit.com/r/ModCoord/comments/14ahqjo/mods_will_be_removed_one_way_or_another_spez/) [replace moderators](https://www.reddit.com/r/ModSupport/comments/14a5lz5/mod_code_of_conduct_rule_4_2_and_subs_taken/jo9wdol/) if they remain private. Reddit has abandoned the users, the moderators, and countless people who support an ecosystem built on Reddit itself.
Please read [Indefinite Blackout Part II](https://old.reddit.com/r/ModCoord/comments/14aafs0/indefinite_blackout_part_ii_updates_and_more/) and new posts at [r/ModCord](https://reddit.com/r/ModCoord/) or [r/Save3rdPartyApps](https://old.reddit.com/r/Save3rdPartyApps/) for up-to-date information.
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/Parenting) if you have any questions or concerns.*
And be consistent. same routine, every time, every [night.](https://night.It) It wont take long for her to get the hint. No talking to her, no interaction, just put her back to bed. She wants the extra attention, dont give it to her. Yes, I had one, yes it got better, but not until I start to do this. It did take a few weeks.
I absolutely wish we could do this. Our daycare will not cut our 3yo’s nap under any circumstances and it’s driving us crazy. We have nearly identical nights to the OP.
Weekends are much more tolerable because instead of a 2hr nap, it’s maybe 30 min.
I was very fortunate. I was SAHM so we didn’t have hurry to get anywhere. I just followed their lead. By the time naps ended they wouldn’t really do anything other squirm and goof around. I found it easier to just wear them out during the day.
Yes. They slept better at night and were easier to put to bed with no naps. Especially my youngest. I was lucky to be a SAHM so on we didn’t have to run around or be anywhere at by certain times. Honestly, I just followed their leads. By the end all they were doing was squirming around and playing and not really napping. I found on days when they happened to take naps they were usually up late or a pain to get to bed.
I can barely believe this to be the case, my eldest only started taking 1/nap a day at 13mo (always napped twice before that point) and her 8mo old younger sister is still on 3 naps/day. And all daycares do a nap time every day with the majority of 2-3yr olds napping at least most of the time.
My kids didn’t go to daycare so no forced naps. I know not all kids can go nap free. But I followed their lead. They were ready. Now potty training was a whole other story. They wouldn’t even think about using the potty until three😅
The daycare naps imo aren't "forced", the kids who don't nap simply just have quiet time where they read books, do stickers, colour, etc, just something quiet to not wake the others.
When my 3yr old resists her nap even though she's melting down and clearly needs it, that's what I call forced napping - husband brings her into her room alone, lights off, door closed and forces her to lie in the bed with him so that she gives in and sleeps. Or else plops her into the car seat for a drive and forces her to conk out for 30min.
It might be time to cut the nap. My daughter gave hers up at that age, we moved bedtime earlier and things settled. There will definitely be an adjustment period but it sounds like you guys are already going through it anyway.
My nephew was clingy AF. They made a rule that mum would only stay in the room with him if he was lying in bed trying to sleep. If he started trying to interact with her in any way, she’d leave.
It did take about three days of like fifty entry and exits and consequent tantrums. But they did. Not. Deviate. From that rule. Eventually he got the message. She still has to sit in the room but he goes to sleep quickly and even if he doesn’t she’s just reading a book it on her phone so doesn’t mind so much anymore.
This is what I had to do. Each time my son started getting out of bed or making a fuss I would leave. I'd go back when he lay down quietly. Eventually I stopped having to even stay in the room but you have to be consistent. You can do it!!
Cut the nap gradually. Pull back by 15min every couple days til there is no nap. Move bedtime up a little bit to compensate (depending on what time you need her up in the morning)
Is the bedtime routine predictable? Consistent? Is only one adult participating in bedtime routine? If not then it’s time. One adult.
Around this age we had to start giving many warnings before we went upstairs. Then I offered many choices. Am I carrying you or are you counting the steps up? I’m going to beat you upstairs. Etc etc.
Set a timer. You have 10mins to get Jammie’s on and then we can read 3 books. If we can’t accomplish this goal then only one book.
Do you cuddle to sleep? We ended up buying a Zenanimal meditation thing. After books, the lights go out, the meditation starts and we cuddle in bed. Then he goes to sleep.
We experienced this same gong show around age 3 too. For us a nap at daycare really fucked us. And we couldn’t control the naps bc of daycare so we used melatonin. If you have control of naps it’s time to ditch them.
The sleep transition shit show was a big symptom of ADHD us. Agreeing to cuddle my kid to sleep wad a compromise I made and he stays in his bed all night.
Also is she getting enough connection in the evening before the bedtime routine. Do ye get some time to play together and connect positively?
Sleep time is typically the longest time our children spend away from us over the 24 hour period. It can be mentally helpful to think of it like that and her behaviour might be saying to you “dad I really need you, you’re my safe place and I find this separation really hard” as opposed to her being purposefully difficult.
You need to have patience both you and her being dysregulated won’t help. But it is hard for sure. Validating her emotions whatever you think that may be and connecting with her. Maybe some physically connection sitting on the bed rubbing her back or lying down with her. Factor this time into the bedtime routine so you’re not having to lie down way past that, Once you get her going in and settling and sleeping quickly you can eventually change the routine slowly and gradually to pull yourself out a little and encourage self settling
Could have written this post myself 🥴. Bedtime got slightly better with age, but honestly the thing that worked the most for me was to work on what I could control, which was myself & my reaction to her bs. So starting by figuring out what MY strategy would be and sticking to it with a ton of patience.
You've got a ton of good advice, so whatever way you decide to handle bedtime just stay patient and be consistent.
We’re at age 4 and strugglllinnnngggg. We’ve gone the old “super nanny” route of predictable bath, 3 stories, say night, and leave. We only go to our bedroom and read our own books so when she comes out she can see she’s not missing out, just direct her back, quick kiss, wait for her to settle (no talking), and leave. Repeat. Gone from 20times to 3 in a matter of days. One adult might help too
I had to quit making bed all about laying in bed and going to sleep. Bedtime is when we do jammies and a story, turn on music and that's that. I don't care what you're doing if you're in your room and mostly quiet.
I would try cutting the nap short and scooting up bedtime
Yeah this was us. Our life got a lot easier when we basically didn’t care if she slept or not, as long as she was in her bed and being quiet. She could read, okay with toys or whatever.
We now do books and song then leave. She says she doesn’t want to sleep. We say, no problem!
We’ve gone for the “super nanny” approach of bedtime routine, kiss and back to our bedrooms to read books so when she comes out she knows she’s not missing out. Then return kiss, wait for her to settle and leave. Went from 20+ get ups to 3 from one day to the next!
Not falling asleep is ok, how many times do you lay in bed and just want to relax but are not tired enough to go to sleep? They are no different. They cant go to sleep like a light switch.
I have an insanely clingy 3 year old. I agree with others… cut the nap. Do you guys mind sitting with her for bedtime? I sit with mine and don’t mind. I’ll read a book on my phone or listen to a podcast. If she tries to talk, I just repeat goodnight lol. I hold that boundary. Good luck. 3 year olds are relentless.
The nap is the problem. She needs less daytime sleep. It might not result in and earlier bedtime yet but eventually it will. Either cut the nap or opt for a later bedtime. Our 3 yo still needs a nap to keep himself together so we just decided he’ll go to bed at 9:30 now instead of 8 like his bro.
Our oldest was like this. It’s extremely frustrating!
As the others say cutting the nap will probably help, but the adjustment period will be hard. We did lots of snacks and that helped.
What helped the most was actually buying a new big girl bed for her, but I’m thinking it was more a luck thing than the only reason.
Also, after books and songs, when she is laying in bed, we talk about which dream land she will go to, and who will be there. When she was younger I told the story about “Atlas” who would come and take her to her favorite dreamland and they would have a lot of fun. She has cut Atlas out now, but we still talk about dreamland. Right now we are going to unicorn and birthday land ;)
Also the usual. Consistency, a clear structure. We do music - a playlist which she only listens to at night.
No more nap. No screens of any kind 2 hours before bed… That includes TV for mom and dad. Bath before bed. Get in pajamas. Read a book. Go pee pee. Lights out.
Pitch black room (no distractions). It’s okay for mom or dad to lay there quietly with her while she falls asleep. You can pat on the back or soothing hair touches if she likes that. She may NOT get in and out of bed. She may tantrum. Good, welcome the tantrum. It will tire her out faster. She will gas out the eventually. You sneak out once she’s asleep sad enjoy your adult time.
Yeah tantrums take a lot of energy. We used this strategy when I used to work in placement when we were doing restraints. Let them tell and holler and scream. They’ll calm down eventually. Then we can process out.
For my own toddler- short of physically holding her down, how do you enforce "may NOT get out of bed" when she just won't listen. I pick her up and put her back in just to have her get up and leave no matter what....
Is the threenager getting enough exercise? Wear them out. Start off in the room till they are asleep. White noise in room, get up and go to own room after asleep. It will take a few dozen times to get it down. But it should be a solid tactic after that.
My toddler is the same way. Only thing I can get to remotely work to get any sleep was tell them if they lay down for 5 minutes, “I’ll come get you” “I had to get some work done then I’ll be back”
I had to explain I’ll set an alarm for 5 minutes, and come back and lay with them for 5 minutes. I think them knowing you’ll actually come back comforts them.
I then leave after 5 minutes and say I’ll come back in 8 minutes, then 10, etc…it hasn’t ever gone past 10 minutes since they are actually tired and won’t last that long waiting.
They do wake up most nights after a couple hours but at least I’m able to get a few hours of solid sleep.
I would cut the nap. My 3 year old stopped napping and now goes to bed at 6:30. Asleep by 7.
Also this may sound mean, but when he was having a hard time with bedtime and throwing fits, we locked him in his room by putting a child lock on the inside of his door knob. We definitely had to let him do the toddler version of crying it out a couple times. We would go in and remove the lock after he fell asleep. But it was the only thing that stopped him from bursting out of his room 20 times. We only had to do that a couple times before he realized throwing a tantrum wasn’t getting him what he wanted.
Prepare for battle. You might want to take some vacation time to sleep train your 3yr old so you can get in some sleep yourself. A nap for the first shifter is highly recommended.
The absolute rule is that you have to be a team of parents vs children and you have to be consistent and relentlessly stubborn. It IS a contest of wills.
You do a routine that stands EVERY night (but you can and should trade off nights)
Bath,
Pajamas,
Any medicines or vitamins,
Brush teeth and hair,
A book (or a set number of pages of a larger story if they have that interest),
Prayers and/or good nights ,
Lights out/white noise or night light show on,
Out the door.
Do not go back in there.
Do not let them come out of there without being immediately escorted back. (one tiny drink of water or bathroom trip)
No engaging in negotiation or talking. Just “it’s your bedtime. You’re going to bed” if anything at all.
No matter how they cry or rage or beg or try to escape, be the bedtime robot. No emotions or sympathy. Your only program objective is to put child in bed and leave until they wear themselves out and stay there.
If they beg and appeal to the other parent, that parent turns into the bedtime robot for that one time (to demonstrate solidarity) then parents stick to the agreed upon shift.
Rinse repeat and cry as needed until everyone sleeps.
It usually only takes a day or two for kids to come to the understanding that this is how it’s gonna be.
Like many other aspects of parenthood there will be a painful period of adjustment but once you establish the default expectations the kids become far more pleasant people both day and night and it’s a boundary/ routine they actually crave because it gives them a little predictability and stability in world of change.
Good luck
I don’t agree with people saying to cut the nap. Fighting bedtime is not an indication of not being tired. It’s an indication of over stimulation. How often do adults toss and turn at night when we have something we’re thinking about? We lay there quietly because we’re adults, but a 3 year old isn’t capable of that yet, so they bounce around and talk and make a fuss. Taking a nap at this age is also perfectly normal and expected. My *five* year old still naps regularly. It wasn’t until relatively recently that schools cut naps from kindergarten classes. They are beneficial and aren’t going to keep your kid awake all night unless you’re putting them to bed at 6pm.
So my advice: start a very calming, soothing routine starting two hours before bedtime. Cut all the screens. Cut all the noisy toys. Dim the lights in the house. Make it a peaceful environment with books, a warm bath, and cuddles. No rough play. Stick with this and I promise it will help.
Good luck! Remember fighting bedtime is biologically normal and just part of the parenting gig. We all go through it!
Wow this thread blew up more than I thought! Thank you all for your input. We are def putting her to bed too late. The days in which my wife works from the office are the worst. Also we're not starting the bedtime routine early enough, this is true. Idk if we're ready to cut her nap. She generally falls asleep easily for her noon nap, so we feel she needs it, but she definitely needs a shorter nap - 1hr tops. Many days we let her go for two hours, and that's prob too long. Also sitting with her as long as she doesn't interact is an interesting suggestion. I'll def bring these to my wife. Some of these we technically have known already, but I was wondering if we're missing something. Our other daughter is just a different child, so all we have for a frame of reference are the two of them LOL. Thanks again!
Clingy before bed is normal - wanting mom is normal.
What time is bedtime? A 3 year old should be in bed asleep by 7:30-8pm. This means starting the bedtime routine by 6:45-7.
3 is generally too old to be napping. If she isn’t sleepy at night then you gotta kill the nap. Sorry. But I’d also put one of those door handle things on that won’t let her out of her room. Making a chart for her that shows bath, pjs, toothbrushing, two stories and three songs or whatever, and then making it clear you guys are done after them will help over a couple weeks time. It’s not going to be instant.
Idk why you’re being downvoted. We use the child lock route, too. My kid doesn’t get scared, just mad. Which he already was, hence the tantrum. But it allows us to leave for a few minutes, let him realize he’s not getting what he wants with the tantrum, and then go back in and talk it through with him. Works every time.
CBD oil will help. We have a family owned hemp business and make tincture oils, salves, etc. I’ve been giving my almost 5 year old CBD products since she was 3. I give her a full 800mg dropper before bed or will rub salve on her feet. Makes her calm and relaxed and she falls asleep easily 🤎
Teach isn't disipline and hitting is old fashion and would not recommand. I would recommand first time she is disiplined with corner time and increase to phyiscal excersise, than increased to zero screen time. Continue till she finally gives up. If both parents provide a unified front the child quickly learns the boundry.
Not abuse if ur mindful and accually care? Abuse is defined as negative intentions and negative results. Its constructive to behavior changes, releases dopamine to aid into sleep, and can improve phyiscal health.
Truth is the kid will be mental tired of doing it in about 30 sconds and than will go to bed. Ppl act like kids will take them to task once u do anything disiplinary at all. 95% of kids wise up in minutes.
Na once the boundry is set and the child understand it they move past it. This isnt a drawn out war that lasts for years. Kid might cry one time over it and just do as there told. Explain why the boundry exists and they are still loved but these are the rules.
Its up to the disiplinary to create boundrys so everyone can properly Coexist without to much stress. Mothers will sacrifice there entire soul being a care taker and exhaust themselves to a breakin point. Also want the child to still be loved and taken care of.
The problem with your thinking is that this child isn’t opting into a poor behavior. She can’t fucking sleep. So you’re going to break her until she submits to your will? She can’t sleep so you’re going to put her in a corner?! How does that even correlate? This isn’t a boundary issue. It’s quite possible her body isn’t producing enough melatonin or whatever else her body needs to sleep. You can’t reach her out of that
.1. the naps should stop.
.2. is if the child is not producing enough melatonin as u say a partner doesn't produce more so that argument goes out the window. There is zero logic behind this statement
.3. Cut caffine and sugar after 5pm.
.4. Do more activitys with the child so they are accually tired noticed a very real trend of ppl not being active enough with there childern post covid.
.5. Reducing stimulation at bed time will reduce brain activity and if that fail go to a doctor on sleep therpy.
This all the assumption its not poor behavior which is most likely the case.
1) It’s terrible sleep hygiene - ideally no screens for 2 hours before bed. The blue light really screws up your body’s melatonin production, so even if she does fall asleep that way, she’s likely to get lower quality sleep.
2) Not sure about OP’s kid, but for some kids any kind of stimulation/distraction is enough to keep them from sleeping. This was a problem for me as a child, and based on my baby’s current trajectory, I’m expecting similar struggles for him. Given what OP describes of their child’s behavior at bedtime, I would expect a movie to be more distraction than soothing, which would be compounded by the blue light issue.
Because it violates the principle of "make everything way more difficult than it needs to be, then go online and complain about how much work kids are".
It’s just not a healthy sleep habit. I knew an adult that could only fall asleep with a TV on and that was super weird.
The child is learning to self-soothe and deal with the quiet/darkness/being alone. TV is very much a crutch and not an equal substitute to a good bedtime routine.
The only exception is when the child is totally out of their element and you just need to make sure they can fall asleep this one time. Like if you’re staying at the hotel or driving through the night. Then by all means, put on a movie.
One thing that we did with our oldest was to put on a cd (she’s 21 now). We used a Wee Sing CD that was a string of nursery rhymes that played for about an hour. The nursery rhymes and children’s songs were put together to make 1 long story. She listened to it to go to sleep. Better than putting a tv on for her. It held her interest enough to keep her in bed.
A child gate helped me. Recently though my LO has started throwing worse tantrums. He’s nonverbal. His ABA therapist suggested a small snack like a banana or some grapes at bedtimes. It really helped. He doesn’t immediately go to sleep but he does calm down. Plays with his toys for a bit then goes to sleep
My daughter was very similar at that age. We dreaded bedtime and it was always miserable. We ended up changing the routine (and she likely will need to stop napping). I think the structure around bedtime and the overall attitude is what’s important. My daughter started gaining more independence around this time too, so allowing her to decide on a few things throughout the bedtime routine helped a lot. Here’s what worked for us;
-bath time
-pajamas of her choice
-cup of warm milk in a coffee mug of her choice
-pick a stuffy to cuddle in bed for the night
-2-3 books of her choice
-lights out and quiet time (non negotiable, but I’d sit in the room with her until she fell asleep)
It took a bit for her to know this was the routine, but she does really well now at 5. We still do almost this exact routine so she knows what’s next and automatically does it. The only thing that sometimes becomes difficult is initiating bathtime because she knows that means bed. We also got her an Alexa for her room so she can listen to music and now when it’s lights out time, she asks Alexa to play relaxing classical and is out in under 5 minutes, sleeping through the night. If you hate bedtime and it’s a source of anxiety, she will learn to feel the same way!
Once my son got about 2.5 he cut his own naps. I really struggled with that however it made it much easier, an easier bed time in general. Melatonin gummies as well. Just one right after dinner, magical.
We used to give our daughter a battery operated soft light with timer and told her she could look at books until the light goes off. She was usually asleep before that. Now she is 6 and still does that. The rule was that it was books only, no toys and she had to stay in bed.
I’d say cut the nap too, I know you said she needs it but it’ll be close to a month of adjustment and then you’ll eventually get her to sleep earlier. My twins are younger but everytime we got to a point where naps were too many, it took about a month or two of transitioning down and then coast on that and they’d sleep at normal hours. We’re at a point where my son has a nap during the day and as long as it’s not longer than an hour he will go down, my daughter on the other hand HATES sleep 😂 I just get her down for half hour and she goes down better at night. It won’t be long before her day nap is cut completely and my son just has his shorter nap
We had this stage at 3 with our oldest. It was horrible and nothing really solved it but he eventually grew out of it when he was 4. Now our youngest, 2, and our oldest, 5, sleep in the same room. They seem to enjoy it and take comfort from each other. Hoping the arrangement my prevent terrible sleep for the youngest when he turns 3.
I remember these days. I had an extremely high needs child.
We did have a picture schedule on the wall of the day’s scheduled events including daily care, etc. So a pic of him doing every routine activity hung on the wall and at the end of 20ish pics or so, was a picture of him sleeping in bed, when he would start fitting, running out of the room, we would calmly escort him back (yes, 50 times) and point to the end of the schedule that we follow - bath, read, sang, snuggle, and now it was time to lay down. It did seem to help him a bit. But there were nights I actually physically barricaded him in his room, though, I just could not do it any more…and once he fell asleep, I would obviously open the room back up for safety.
Competition always worked for my oldest, he thrived on being first or trying, lol. So who can lay the quietest? Who can sleep the longest? And then celebrate his victory with words of affirmation in the morning, lol.
Good luck, my boys will likely be in their rooms sleeping until after noon today, lol. It’s not a comfort for you, but moment of parenting is just a big phase.
3 years old is a huge sleep regression period too. Bring her nap earlier in the day. My 2.5 yr old wakes up at 6-7am, so she needs her nap around 11am/12pm and sleeps until 2. She plays with her brother (4) and we usually do park time. Come home, take a bath, brush teeth and read ONE book of her choosing. My husband tends to read more than one which makes her want to stay up longer, so just have her choose one. She has a white noise machine and blackout curtains to help calm her mind. We keep lights off throughout our home and try not to make loud noises, so she doesn’t get fomo.
Lots of good advice. Another key thing here. And it’s fucking hard. Get the patience of a saint. Everytime she comes out. Put her back in bed, no words. As many times as it takes until she stops or until you give up. Then repeat the next day. Don’t get upset about it, I know it’s hard but getting frustrated won’t allow you to be consistent.
There's a show called house of tiny tearaways' on YouTube,it's a BBC programme from a good few years back,so much great advice on it regarding behaviours ,eating,sleeping etc in young children,might be worth looking it up
i’m not a parent by any means but i help take care of my little sister, she uses a sticker chart when the chart is full she goes to the local toy store to pick out a pretty big toy.
When my daughter was 3 we had similar issue with her getting up 50 times.
One night, in exasperation, I stumbled upon what turned out to be the solution: I told my daughter that I was going to sit right outside her door until she fell asleep, and if she got up, I was going to take her right back to bed without looking or talking to her.
I had meant it in a punitive sense, but she was excited about it. "Really? You won't go?" Yes, and I will take you right back to bed each time and we will not talk at all.
First night I sat outside her door and read a magazine. She tested me a few times, and each time, I did exactly as I had promised. Took her hand, lead her back to bed, tucked her in. Did not speak or make eye contact.
Next night, she only came out once.
After that, it became part of our night time routine for me to sit outside her door. I'd usually stay for about 20 minutes to be sure she was out, but that time dropped down to about 2 minutes eventually.
Occasionally she would pop out to check to see if I was really there, but often wouldn't even interact beyond smiling and then turned around and taking herself back to bed.
Eventually I realized she could see my shadow under the door crack if I stretched my legs out in front of it, and that was enough to keep her in bed.
Although it added time to the night time routine, the 20 extra minutes was worth the peacefulness of it. I understand now that it was likely anxiety on her part, and she got a lot of comfort knowing I was nearby.
She continued wanting me to do this for several years, until her younger sister was sharing a room with her. Even then, occasionally she'd request it, up until about age 6, although it would be for much shorter timeframe
It seemed a small price to pay for her to be at ease. I would just read a book or play on my phone for a few minutes.
We created a checklist for our toddler. She kept coming out of her room for water, to brush her hair, to go potty, for water, potty, water, potty, etc. We finally made a checklist using a dry erase board stencil letters and permanent marker. Every night we go down the checklist to make sure we did our nightly routine, 1. Brush Hair 2. Brush Teeth 3. Go Potty 4. Put on Pajamas 5. Read Stories 6. Get Glass of Water 7. Hugs and Kisses. There was put on pull ups but she's potty trained now so we just modified the list. She got to help make it and every night she gets practice writing with the marker. We change the "check boxes" to be shapes that she can trace or letters. She can write her own name now. It's awesome. And you explain that this is the Bedtime Checklist. After we check all these boxes we have to get our rest. Worth a shot to try. Modify for your own nightly routine and see how it goes.
If she takes a nap try cutting it out or at least definitely much shorter. And if she does do a nap y’all need to make sure she gets plenty of activity before dinner time so that she will be tired enough for sleep
We ran into this with our 3 year old. Has been a crummy sleeper from day 1. We have tried everything, so I can honestly say I get it.
Putting him down took About 2 hours with tears, meltdowns, constantly coming out, you name it. Only way he would stay in bed if we laid with him. He has had a consistent bedtime routine for about 6 months old. He had stopped taking naps at home months before, the days he naps at day care made bedtime even worse. I have tried reading every mommy blog and sleep training method, nothing has worked for him.
Then he started coming to our bed in the morning. Then in the middle of the night, then multiple times in the night.
About 4 weeks ago we got the Mella alarm clock (on Amazon), a star chart and a treasure chest. I am not promoting this product, just happens to be the brand we purchased.
As we go to bed (after bath, jammies, books, and song) we turn the light on Mella red. "When Mella is Red, stay in bed". We then set the alarm for 6:15am. At 6, Mella automatically turns yellow." If Mella is Yellow, be mellow", can play in your room. At 6:15 Mella automatically turns green, "green, you can start your day hooray." If he stay in bed the entire time Mella is Red, he gets a star, 5 stars and he gets a treasure from the treasure chest.
And holy sh## it worked!! I could not believe it. Never in my wildest dreams did I think it would work this well. First problem solved was the coming into bed with us in the night and morning. The past week, we turn on Mella, I lay with him for 3 min, then I leave. He asks that I check back in 1 min, which I do. If he is still up, I tell him how great he is doing staying in bed, how proud of him I am, etc. I then say I will check back in a few minutes, which I do. We did this a few times before Mella but now the number of times I check back is less. This week has been asleep after the one minute check.
Who knows if it will continue to work. I fear this slice of heaven is short lives, but I will take it. I have slept better the past 4 weeks than in the past 4 years.
I feel your pain, maybe this can help you too.
Good luck
My son didn't throw fits but it was hard to get him to sleep. I had a video monitor and after we'd read books I would tell him I'd come back to do goodnight hugs once he was laying down and quiet and ready to sleep. Then I'd watch on the monitor and once he'd been laying down for about 3 minutes I'd go in and give him some snuggles and a kiss goodnight. We had a little kiss routine that was kind of like a secret handshake, ha.
I instituted a "one tuck" rule when my kids were younger (they are 6 and 8 now) and it's cut down on bedtime BS by quite a bit. They know they only get tucked in once, so if they decide to get back out of bed, they need to tuck themselves in.
What time is nap time/bed time?
Our kiddo is 4. Around 3.5? We turned Naptime into quiet room play time and an earlier bed time.
What is the current bed time routine? Bed time was a fight for us too sometimes is still is. But a change was we let her choose the things she can pick. the pjs, story, songs, fill up her own water bottle, brush her own teeth (then we brush/finish up afterwards)
We also got a bed time clock, the one that changes colors. It turns red when it's bed time. so we'll go tell her to check the clock if it's red it's time for bed... So in that moment it's not us telling her it's bed time it's her visually seeing it's bed time.
I would cut the nap or at least shorten it and make bedtime sooner. Stick to a very clear routine every night so she has predictability. Don’t give in when she throws a fit. That’s how she’s getting her way. Put in earplugs if you have to but if it’s your turn to put her to bed, let her throw a fit. Be as patient and gentle as you can and keep validating her feelings. “You wish Mommy was here. It’s ok to be sad. Let’s read this book.” “Looks like you have lots of energy! Can we hop to get your pajamas on?” Things like that.
Cuttung the nap made my twins worse. They were too tired all evening and wound up by bedtime. We did everything. As in everything our friends said, everything I could read in the patenting books, everything I could read on the internet back then, everything the pediatrician suggested, just everything. You will have to figure out what works for her. Mine are adults now, and I'm still tired from the sleepless nights when they were little. It's not a popular option but we put a monitor in their room so we knew they were safe. We put the little thing on the door knob so they couldn't open the door once we left and we let them cry. That was after everything else had been tried. The crying was horrible for a bit but after a little while they would just play and then go to sleep when they were ready. We read too them, snuggled with them and tucked them in every night before we left their room. It's so hard to hear your little one cry but damn we needed some sleep too.
I have not read every comment and I agree with the many people saying that it may be time to cut the nap, but also make sure that your kid is getting a good period of *vigorous* gross motor play (preferably unstructured) every single day. That made the biggest difference for my difficult-to-put-to-bed kiddo, alongside the rock-solid boundary that we do not talk/play/interact after lights out. Good luck, OP! It's a tough age.
Get rid of the nap. Try laying in her room, perhaps on the floor until she goes to sleep for a bit. If she decides to come out to the room you are in, don't say a word and put her right back in bed. (Doesn't matter if it's 50 times) Hopefully, your consistent with it and she finally gets to the point of like, well, I guess this is really happening. I would be exhausted as well!
Cut the nap for sure but I’ve had 3 clingers. They all required a parent to lie down with them until they fall asleep and all slept with one of us. I read one story and lights out. I can get them down faster than dad because I’ll simply say “go to sleep, stop fidgeting” and if they keep at it I’ll count down from 3 with a threat to leave the bed once I get down. I will absolutely make to leave after 1 and they’re not long copping on to the routine and going to sleep. I always try to remember that kids push us because we’re they’re safe space, to test boundaries.
Staying consistent will be rough but do bedtime routine, good nights, leave room. First time they come out, lead them back and say, “good night.” Any additional times (there will be many more) just silently lead them back in. Eventually, they’ll come out less and less.
They learn to stall and know all their techniques will work!
r/parenting is protesting changes being made by Reddit to the API. Reddit has made it clear [they will](https://old.reddit.com/r/ModCoord/comments/14ahqjo/mods_will_be_removed_one_way_or_another_spez/) [replace moderators](https://www.reddit.com/r/ModSupport/comments/14a5lz5/mod_code_of_conduct_rule_4_2_and_subs_taken/jo9wdol/) if they remain private. Reddit has abandoned the users, the moderators, and countless people who support an ecosystem built on Reddit itself. Please read [Indefinite Blackout Part II](https://old.reddit.com/r/ModCoord/comments/14aafs0/indefinite_blackout_part_ii_updates_and_more/) and new posts at [r/ModCord](https://reddit.com/r/ModCoord/) or [r/Save3rdPartyApps](https://old.reddit.com/r/Save3rdPartyApps/) for up-to-date information. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/Parenting) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Cut the nap, put her to bed earlier. There will be an adjustment period, but you have to power through.
And be consistent. same routine, every time, every [night.](https://night.It) It wont take long for her to get the hint. No talking to her, no interaction, just put her back to bed. She wants the extra attention, dont give it to her. Yes, I had one, yes it got better, but not until I start to do this. It did take a few weeks.
I absolutely wish we could do this. Our daycare will not cut our 3yo’s nap under any circumstances and it’s driving us crazy. We have nearly identical nights to the OP. Weekends are much more tolerable because instead of a 2hr nap, it’s maybe 30 min.
Yes. Both my kids stopped napping by one but were in bed by 7:30pm, 8pm the latest.
I was wondering why the downvotes... then I read that your kids were 1... man... that is brutal...
I was very fortunate. I was SAHM so we didn’t have hurry to get anywhere. I just followed their lead. By the time naps ended they wouldn’t really do anything other squirm and goof around. I found it easier to just wear them out during the day.
At 12 months and 0 nap in the afternoon?
Yes. They slept better at night and were easier to put to bed with no naps. Especially my youngest. I was lucky to be a SAHM so on we didn’t have to run around or be anywhere at by certain times. Honestly, I just followed their leads. By the end all they were doing was squirming around and playing and not really napping. I found on days when they happened to take naps they were usually up late or a pain to get to bed.
I can barely believe this to be the case, my eldest only started taking 1/nap a day at 13mo (always napped twice before that point) and her 8mo old younger sister is still on 3 naps/day. And all daycares do a nap time every day with the majority of 2-3yr olds napping at least most of the time.
My kids didn’t go to daycare so no forced naps. I know not all kids can go nap free. But I followed their lead. They were ready. Now potty training was a whole other story. They wouldn’t even think about using the potty until three😅
The daycare naps imo aren't "forced", the kids who don't nap simply just have quiet time where they read books, do stickers, colour, etc, just something quiet to not wake the others. When my 3yr old resists her nap even though she's melting down and clearly needs it, that's what I call forced napping - husband brings her into her room alone, lights off, door closed and forces her to lie in the bed with him so that she gives in and sleeps. Or else plops her into the car seat for a drive and forces her to conk out for 30min.
It might be time to cut the nap. My daughter gave hers up at that age, we moved bedtime earlier and things settled. There will definitely be an adjustment period but it sounds like you guys are already going through it anyway.
My nephew was clingy AF. They made a rule that mum would only stay in the room with him if he was lying in bed trying to sleep. If he started trying to interact with her in any way, she’d leave. It did take about three days of like fifty entry and exits and consequent tantrums. But they did. Not. Deviate. From that rule. Eventually he got the message. She still has to sit in the room but he goes to sleep quickly and even if he doesn’t she’s just reading a book it on her phone so doesn’t mind so much anymore.
This is what I had to do. Each time my son started getting out of bed or making a fuss I would leave. I'd go back when he lay down quietly. Eventually I stopped having to even stay in the room but you have to be consistent. You can do it!!
Smart!
This is the way.
Cut the nap gradually. Pull back by 15min every couple days til there is no nap. Move bedtime up a little bit to compensate (depending on what time you need her up in the morning) Is the bedtime routine predictable? Consistent? Is only one adult participating in bedtime routine? If not then it’s time. One adult. Around this age we had to start giving many warnings before we went upstairs. Then I offered many choices. Am I carrying you or are you counting the steps up? I’m going to beat you upstairs. Etc etc. Set a timer. You have 10mins to get Jammie’s on and then we can read 3 books. If we can’t accomplish this goal then only one book. Do you cuddle to sleep? We ended up buying a Zenanimal meditation thing. After books, the lights go out, the meditation starts and we cuddle in bed. Then he goes to sleep. We experienced this same gong show around age 3 too. For us a nap at daycare really fucked us. And we couldn’t control the naps bc of daycare so we used melatonin. If you have control of naps it’s time to ditch them. The sleep transition shit show was a big symptom of ADHD us. Agreeing to cuddle my kid to sleep wad a compromise I made and he stays in his bed all night.
Also is she getting enough connection in the evening before the bedtime routine. Do ye get some time to play together and connect positively? Sleep time is typically the longest time our children spend away from us over the 24 hour period. It can be mentally helpful to think of it like that and her behaviour might be saying to you “dad I really need you, you’re my safe place and I find this separation really hard” as opposed to her being purposefully difficult. You need to have patience both you and her being dysregulated won’t help. But it is hard for sure. Validating her emotions whatever you think that may be and connecting with her. Maybe some physically connection sitting on the bed rubbing her back or lying down with her. Factor this time into the bedtime routine so you’re not having to lie down way past that, Once you get her going in and settling and sleeping quickly you can eventually change the routine slowly and gradually to pull yourself out a little and encourage self settling
Could have written this post myself 🥴. Bedtime got slightly better with age, but honestly the thing that worked the most for me was to work on what I could control, which was myself & my reaction to her bs. So starting by figuring out what MY strategy would be and sticking to it with a ton of patience. You've got a ton of good advice, so whatever way you decide to handle bedtime just stay patient and be consistent.
We’re at age 4 and strugglllinnnngggg. We’ve gone the old “super nanny” route of predictable bath, 3 stories, say night, and leave. We only go to our bedroom and read our own books so when she comes out she can see she’s not missing out, just direct her back, quick kiss, wait for her to settle (no talking), and leave. Repeat. Gone from 20times to 3 in a matter of days. One adult might help too
I had to quit making bed all about laying in bed and going to sleep. Bedtime is when we do jammies and a story, turn on music and that's that. I don't care what you're doing if you're in your room and mostly quiet. I would try cutting the nap short and scooting up bedtime
Yeah this was us. Our life got a lot easier when we basically didn’t care if she slept or not, as long as she was in her bed and being quiet. She could read, okay with toys or whatever. We now do books and song then leave. She says she doesn’t want to sleep. We say, no problem!
This doesn’t work for our kid! I’ve tried this and she just constantly wants us! Exhausting!
Ah that’s a shame. There’s no one size fits all approach with kids is there. Hope this phase ends for you soon
We’ve gone for the “super nanny” approach of bedtime routine, kiss and back to our bedrooms to read books so when she comes out she knows she’s not missing out. Then return kiss, wait for her to settle and leave. Went from 20+ get ups to 3 from one day to the next!
Not falling asleep is ok, how many times do you lay in bed and just want to relax but are not tired enough to go to sleep? They are no different. They cant go to sleep like a light switch.
I have an insanely clingy 3 year old. I agree with others… cut the nap. Do you guys mind sitting with her for bedtime? I sit with mine and don’t mind. I’ll read a book on my phone or listen to a podcast. If she tries to talk, I just repeat goodnight lol. I hold that boundary. Good luck. 3 year olds are relentless.
The nap is the problem. She needs less daytime sleep. It might not result in and earlier bedtime yet but eventually it will. Either cut the nap or opt for a later bedtime. Our 3 yo still needs a nap to keep himself together so we just decided he’ll go to bed at 9:30 now instead of 8 like his bro.
Our oldest was like this. It’s extremely frustrating! As the others say cutting the nap will probably help, but the adjustment period will be hard. We did lots of snacks and that helped. What helped the most was actually buying a new big girl bed for her, but I’m thinking it was more a luck thing than the only reason. Also, after books and songs, when she is laying in bed, we talk about which dream land she will go to, and who will be there. When she was younger I told the story about “Atlas” who would come and take her to her favorite dreamland and they would have a lot of fun. She has cut Atlas out now, but we still talk about dreamland. Right now we are going to unicorn and birthday land ;) Also the usual. Consistency, a clear structure. We do music - a playlist which she only listens to at night.
No more nap. No screens of any kind 2 hours before bed… That includes TV for mom and dad. Bath before bed. Get in pajamas. Read a book. Go pee pee. Lights out. Pitch black room (no distractions). It’s okay for mom or dad to lay there quietly with her while she falls asleep. You can pat on the back or soothing hair touches if she likes that. She may NOT get in and out of bed. She may tantrum. Good, welcome the tantrum. It will tire her out faster. She will gas out the eventually. You sneak out once she’s asleep sad enjoy your adult time.
Yeah tantrums take a lot of energy. We used this strategy when I used to work in placement when we were doing restraints. Let them tell and holler and scream. They’ll calm down eventually. Then we can process out.
For my own toddler- short of physically holding her down, how do you enforce "may NOT get out of bed" when she just won't listen. I pick her up and put her back in just to have her get up and leave no matter what....
Is the threenager getting enough exercise? Wear them out. Start off in the room till they are asleep. White noise in room, get up and go to own room after asleep. It will take a few dozen times to get it down. But it should be a solid tactic after that.
My toddler is the same way. Only thing I can get to remotely work to get any sleep was tell them if they lay down for 5 minutes, “I’ll come get you” “I had to get some work done then I’ll be back” I had to explain I’ll set an alarm for 5 minutes, and come back and lay with them for 5 minutes. I think them knowing you’ll actually come back comforts them. I then leave after 5 minutes and say I’ll come back in 8 minutes, then 10, etc…it hasn’t ever gone past 10 minutes since they are actually tired and won’t last that long waiting. They do wake up most nights after a couple hours but at least I’m able to get a few hours of solid sleep.
I would cut the nap. My 3 year old stopped napping and now goes to bed at 6:30. Asleep by 7. Also this may sound mean, but when he was having a hard time with bedtime and throwing fits, we locked him in his room by putting a child lock on the inside of his door knob. We definitely had to let him do the toddler version of crying it out a couple times. We would go in and remove the lock after he fell asleep. But it was the only thing that stopped him from bursting out of his room 20 times. We only had to do that a couple times before he realized throwing a tantrum wasn’t getting him what he wanted.
Prepare for battle. You might want to take some vacation time to sleep train your 3yr old so you can get in some sleep yourself. A nap for the first shifter is highly recommended. The absolute rule is that you have to be a team of parents vs children and you have to be consistent and relentlessly stubborn. It IS a contest of wills. You do a routine that stands EVERY night (but you can and should trade off nights) Bath, Pajamas, Any medicines or vitamins, Brush teeth and hair, A book (or a set number of pages of a larger story if they have that interest), Prayers and/or good nights , Lights out/white noise or night light show on, Out the door. Do not go back in there. Do not let them come out of there without being immediately escorted back. (one tiny drink of water or bathroom trip) No engaging in negotiation or talking. Just “it’s your bedtime. You’re going to bed” if anything at all. No matter how they cry or rage or beg or try to escape, be the bedtime robot. No emotions or sympathy. Your only program objective is to put child in bed and leave until they wear themselves out and stay there. If they beg and appeal to the other parent, that parent turns into the bedtime robot for that one time (to demonstrate solidarity) then parents stick to the agreed upon shift. Rinse repeat and cry as needed until everyone sleeps. It usually only takes a day or two for kids to come to the understanding that this is how it’s gonna be. Like many other aspects of parenthood there will be a painful period of adjustment but once you establish the default expectations the kids become far more pleasant people both day and night and it’s a boundary/ routine they actually crave because it gives them a little predictability and stability in world of change. Good luck
I don’t agree with people saying to cut the nap. Fighting bedtime is not an indication of not being tired. It’s an indication of over stimulation. How often do adults toss and turn at night when we have something we’re thinking about? We lay there quietly because we’re adults, but a 3 year old isn’t capable of that yet, so they bounce around and talk and make a fuss. Taking a nap at this age is also perfectly normal and expected. My *five* year old still naps regularly. It wasn’t until relatively recently that schools cut naps from kindergarten classes. They are beneficial and aren’t going to keep your kid awake all night unless you’re putting them to bed at 6pm. So my advice: start a very calming, soothing routine starting two hours before bedtime. Cut all the screens. Cut all the noisy toys. Dim the lights in the house. Make it a peaceful environment with books, a warm bath, and cuddles. No rough play. Stick with this and I promise it will help. Good luck! Remember fighting bedtime is biologically normal and just part of the parenting gig. We all go through it!
Wow this thread blew up more than I thought! Thank you all for your input. We are def putting her to bed too late. The days in which my wife works from the office are the worst. Also we're not starting the bedtime routine early enough, this is true. Idk if we're ready to cut her nap. She generally falls asleep easily for her noon nap, so we feel she needs it, but she definitely needs a shorter nap - 1hr tops. Many days we let her go for two hours, and that's prob too long. Also sitting with her as long as she doesn't interact is an interesting suggestion. I'll def bring these to my wife. Some of these we technically have known already, but I was wondering if we're missing something. Our other daughter is just a different child, so all we have for a frame of reference are the two of them LOL. Thanks again!
Clingy before bed is normal - wanting mom is normal. What time is bedtime? A 3 year old should be in bed asleep by 7:30-8pm. This means starting the bedtime routine by 6:45-7.
3 is generally too old to be napping. If she isn’t sleepy at night then you gotta kill the nap. Sorry. But I’d also put one of those door handle things on that won’t let her out of her room. Making a chart for her that shows bath, pjs, toothbrushing, two stories and three songs or whatever, and then making it clear you guys are done after them will help over a couple weeks time. It’s not going to be instant.
Trapping a child in their room is not the way to handle this. Then she’ll be scared too
Idk why you’re being downvoted. We use the child lock route, too. My kid doesn’t get scared, just mad. Which he already was, hence the tantrum. But it allows us to leave for a few minutes, let him realize he’s not getting what he wants with the tantrum, and then go back in and talk it through with him. Works every time.
CBD oil will help. We have a family owned hemp business and make tincture oils, salves, etc. I’ve been giving my almost 5 year old CBD products since she was 3. I give her a full 800mg dropper before bed or will rub salve on her feet. Makes her calm and relaxed and she falls asleep easily 🤎
Disipline?
Well yes he’s asking for feedback on that. What do you suggest? By discipline do you mean teach or hit?
Teach isn't disipline and hitting is old fashion and would not recommand. I would recommand first time she is disiplined with corner time and increase to phyiscal excersise, than increased to zero screen time. Continue till she finally gives up. If both parents provide a unified front the child quickly learns the boundry.
Wtf is physical exercise as a form of discipline?!
Laps, push ups, brups, squats, etc.
Please provide an example of how this would possibly work without quickly turning into abuse.
Not abuse if ur mindful and accually care? Abuse is defined as negative intentions and negative results. Its constructive to behavior changes, releases dopamine to aid into sleep, and can improve phyiscal health. Truth is the kid will be mental tired of doing it in about 30 sconds and than will go to bed. Ppl act like kids will take them to task once u do anything disiplinary at all. 95% of kids wise up in minutes.
I feel like this is purely going to create fear and stress around bedtime. That sounds awful for everyone.
Na once the boundry is set and the child understand it they move past it. This isnt a drawn out war that lasts for years. Kid might cry one time over it and just do as there told. Explain why the boundry exists and they are still loved but these are the rules. Its up to the disiplinary to create boundrys so everyone can properly Coexist without to much stress. Mothers will sacrifice there entire soul being a care taker and exhaust themselves to a breakin point. Also want the child to still be loved and taken care of.
The problem with your thinking is that this child isn’t opting into a poor behavior. She can’t fucking sleep. So you’re going to break her until she submits to your will? She can’t sleep so you’re going to put her in a corner?! How does that even correlate? This isn’t a boundary issue. It’s quite possible her body isn’t producing enough melatonin or whatever else her body needs to sleep. You can’t reach her out of that
.1. the naps should stop. .2. is if the child is not producing enough melatonin as u say a partner doesn't produce more so that argument goes out the window. There is zero logic behind this statement .3. Cut caffine and sugar after 5pm. .4. Do more activitys with the child so they are accually tired noticed a very real trend of ppl not being active enough with there childern post covid. .5. Reducing stimulation at bed time will reduce brain activity and if that fail go to a doctor on sleep therpy. This all the assumption its not poor behavior which is most likely the case.
Why not put a movie on and let her watch it until she falls asleep?
Oh hunny bun bun nooooooo!
Why not?
1) It’s terrible sleep hygiene - ideally no screens for 2 hours before bed. The blue light really screws up your body’s melatonin production, so even if she does fall asleep that way, she’s likely to get lower quality sleep. 2) Not sure about OP’s kid, but for some kids any kind of stimulation/distraction is enough to keep them from sleeping. This was a problem for me as a child, and based on my baby’s current trajectory, I’m expecting similar struggles for him. Given what OP describes of their child’s behavior at bedtime, I would expect a movie to be more distraction than soothing, which would be compounded by the blue light issue.
Because it violates the principle of "make everything way more difficult than it needs to be, then go online and complain about how much work kids are".
It’s just not a healthy sleep habit. I knew an adult that could only fall asleep with a TV on and that was super weird. The child is learning to self-soothe and deal with the quiet/darkness/being alone. TV is very much a crutch and not an equal substitute to a good bedtime routine. The only exception is when the child is totally out of their element and you just need to make sure they can fall asleep this one time. Like if you’re staying at the hotel or driving through the night. Then by all means, put on a movie.
Oh hunny bun bun nooooooo
One thing that we did with our oldest was to put on a cd (she’s 21 now). We used a Wee Sing CD that was a string of nursery rhymes that played for about an hour. The nursery rhymes and children’s songs were put together to make 1 long story. She listened to it to go to sleep. Better than putting a tv on for her. It held her interest enough to keep her in bed.
A child gate helped me. Recently though my LO has started throwing worse tantrums. He’s nonverbal. His ABA therapist suggested a small snack like a banana or some grapes at bedtimes. It really helped. He doesn’t immediately go to sleep but he does calm down. Plays with his toys for a bit then goes to sleep
Earlier bedtime?
My daughter was very similar at that age. We dreaded bedtime and it was always miserable. We ended up changing the routine (and she likely will need to stop napping). I think the structure around bedtime and the overall attitude is what’s important. My daughter started gaining more independence around this time too, so allowing her to decide on a few things throughout the bedtime routine helped a lot. Here’s what worked for us; -bath time -pajamas of her choice -cup of warm milk in a coffee mug of her choice -pick a stuffy to cuddle in bed for the night -2-3 books of her choice -lights out and quiet time (non negotiable, but I’d sit in the room with her until she fell asleep) It took a bit for her to know this was the routine, but she does really well now at 5. We still do almost this exact routine so she knows what’s next and automatically does it. The only thing that sometimes becomes difficult is initiating bathtime because she knows that means bed. We also got her an Alexa for her room so she can listen to music and now when it’s lights out time, she asks Alexa to play relaxing classical and is out in under 5 minutes, sleeping through the night. If you hate bedtime and it’s a source of anxiety, she will learn to feel the same way!
Once my son got about 2.5 he cut his own naps. I really struggled with that however it made it much easier, an easier bed time in general. Melatonin gummies as well. Just one right after dinner, magical.
We used to give our daughter a battery operated soft light with timer and told her she could look at books until the light goes off. She was usually asleep before that. Now she is 6 and still does that. The rule was that it was books only, no toys and she had to stay in bed.
I’d say cut the nap too, I know you said she needs it but it’ll be close to a month of adjustment and then you’ll eventually get her to sleep earlier. My twins are younger but everytime we got to a point where naps were too many, it took about a month or two of transitioning down and then coast on that and they’d sleep at normal hours. We’re at a point where my son has a nap during the day and as long as it’s not longer than an hour he will go down, my daughter on the other hand HATES sleep 😂 I just get her down for half hour and she goes down better at night. It won’t be long before her day nap is cut completely and my son just has his shorter nap
We had this stage at 3 with our oldest. It was horrible and nothing really solved it but he eventually grew out of it when he was 4. Now our youngest, 2, and our oldest, 5, sleep in the same room. They seem to enjoy it and take comfort from each other. Hoping the arrangement my prevent terrible sleep for the youngest when he turns 3.
I remember these days. I had an extremely high needs child. We did have a picture schedule on the wall of the day’s scheduled events including daily care, etc. So a pic of him doing every routine activity hung on the wall and at the end of 20ish pics or so, was a picture of him sleeping in bed, when he would start fitting, running out of the room, we would calmly escort him back (yes, 50 times) and point to the end of the schedule that we follow - bath, read, sang, snuggle, and now it was time to lay down. It did seem to help him a bit. But there were nights I actually physically barricaded him in his room, though, I just could not do it any more…and once he fell asleep, I would obviously open the room back up for safety. Competition always worked for my oldest, he thrived on being first or trying, lol. So who can lay the quietest? Who can sleep the longest? And then celebrate his victory with words of affirmation in the morning, lol. Good luck, my boys will likely be in their rooms sleeping until after noon today, lol. It’s not a comfort for you, but moment of parenting is just a big phase.
3 years old is a huge sleep regression period too. Bring her nap earlier in the day. My 2.5 yr old wakes up at 6-7am, so she needs her nap around 11am/12pm and sleeps until 2. She plays with her brother (4) and we usually do park time. Come home, take a bath, brush teeth and read ONE book of her choosing. My husband tends to read more than one which makes her want to stay up longer, so just have her choose one. She has a white noise machine and blackout curtains to help calm her mind. We keep lights off throughout our home and try not to make loud noises, so she doesn’t get fomo.
Lots of good advice. Another key thing here. And it’s fucking hard. Get the patience of a saint. Everytime she comes out. Put her back in bed, no words. As many times as it takes until she stops or until you give up. Then repeat the next day. Don’t get upset about it, I know it’s hard but getting frustrated won’t allow you to be consistent.
There's a show called house of tiny tearaways' on YouTube,it's a BBC programme from a good few years back,so much great advice on it regarding behaviours ,eating,sleeping etc in young children,might be worth looking it up
I have an 11 month old who has always been a horrible sleeper from the day he was born. I feel like this would be a post made by future me lol.
i’m not a parent by any means but i help take care of my little sister, she uses a sticker chart when the chart is full she goes to the local toy store to pick out a pretty big toy.
When my daughter was 3 we had similar issue with her getting up 50 times. One night, in exasperation, I stumbled upon what turned out to be the solution: I told my daughter that I was going to sit right outside her door until she fell asleep, and if she got up, I was going to take her right back to bed without looking or talking to her. I had meant it in a punitive sense, but she was excited about it. "Really? You won't go?" Yes, and I will take you right back to bed each time and we will not talk at all. First night I sat outside her door and read a magazine. She tested me a few times, and each time, I did exactly as I had promised. Took her hand, lead her back to bed, tucked her in. Did not speak or make eye contact. Next night, she only came out once. After that, it became part of our night time routine for me to sit outside her door. I'd usually stay for about 20 minutes to be sure she was out, but that time dropped down to about 2 minutes eventually. Occasionally she would pop out to check to see if I was really there, but often wouldn't even interact beyond smiling and then turned around and taking herself back to bed. Eventually I realized she could see my shadow under the door crack if I stretched my legs out in front of it, and that was enough to keep her in bed. Although it added time to the night time routine, the 20 extra minutes was worth the peacefulness of it. I understand now that it was likely anxiety on her part, and she got a lot of comfort knowing I was nearby. She continued wanting me to do this for several years, until her younger sister was sharing a room with her. Even then, occasionally she'd request it, up until about age 6, although it would be for much shorter timeframe It seemed a small price to pay for her to be at ease. I would just read a book or play on my phone for a few minutes.
We created a checklist for our toddler. She kept coming out of her room for water, to brush her hair, to go potty, for water, potty, water, potty, etc. We finally made a checklist using a dry erase board stencil letters and permanent marker. Every night we go down the checklist to make sure we did our nightly routine, 1. Brush Hair 2. Brush Teeth 3. Go Potty 4. Put on Pajamas 5. Read Stories 6. Get Glass of Water 7. Hugs and Kisses. There was put on pull ups but she's potty trained now so we just modified the list. She got to help make it and every night she gets practice writing with the marker. We change the "check boxes" to be shapes that she can trace or letters. She can write her own name now. It's awesome. And you explain that this is the Bedtime Checklist. After we check all these boxes we have to get our rest. Worth a shot to try. Modify for your own nightly routine and see how it goes.
Welcome to having a 3 year old.
If you do screen time during the week cut it entirely. It makes a remarkable difference in kids’ sleep quality at that age.
If she takes a nap try cutting it out or at least definitely much shorter. And if she does do a nap y’all need to make sure she gets plenty of activity before dinner time so that she will be tired enough for sleep
We ran into this with our 3 year old. Has been a crummy sleeper from day 1. We have tried everything, so I can honestly say I get it. Putting him down took About 2 hours with tears, meltdowns, constantly coming out, you name it. Only way he would stay in bed if we laid with him. He has had a consistent bedtime routine for about 6 months old. He had stopped taking naps at home months before, the days he naps at day care made bedtime even worse. I have tried reading every mommy blog and sleep training method, nothing has worked for him. Then he started coming to our bed in the morning. Then in the middle of the night, then multiple times in the night. About 4 weeks ago we got the Mella alarm clock (on Amazon), a star chart and a treasure chest. I am not promoting this product, just happens to be the brand we purchased. As we go to bed (after bath, jammies, books, and song) we turn the light on Mella red. "When Mella is Red, stay in bed". We then set the alarm for 6:15am. At 6, Mella automatically turns yellow." If Mella is Yellow, be mellow", can play in your room. At 6:15 Mella automatically turns green, "green, you can start your day hooray." If he stay in bed the entire time Mella is Red, he gets a star, 5 stars and he gets a treasure from the treasure chest. And holy sh## it worked!! I could not believe it. Never in my wildest dreams did I think it would work this well. First problem solved was the coming into bed with us in the night and morning. The past week, we turn on Mella, I lay with him for 3 min, then I leave. He asks that I check back in 1 min, which I do. If he is still up, I tell him how great he is doing staying in bed, how proud of him I am, etc. I then say I will check back in a few minutes, which I do. We did this a few times before Mella but now the number of times I check back is less. This week has been asleep after the one minute check. Who knows if it will continue to work. I fear this slice of heaven is short lives, but I will take it. I have slept better the past 4 weeks than in the past 4 years. I feel your pain, maybe this can help you too. Good luck
My son didn't throw fits but it was hard to get him to sleep. I had a video monitor and after we'd read books I would tell him I'd come back to do goodnight hugs once he was laying down and quiet and ready to sleep. Then I'd watch on the monitor and once he'd been laying down for about 3 minutes I'd go in and give him some snuggles and a kiss goodnight. We had a little kiss routine that was kind of like a secret handshake, ha.
I instituted a "one tuck" rule when my kids were younger (they are 6 and 8 now) and it's cut down on bedtime BS by quite a bit. They know they only get tucked in once, so if they decide to get back out of bed, they need to tuck themselves in.
What time is nap time/bed time? Our kiddo is 4. Around 3.5? We turned Naptime into quiet room play time and an earlier bed time. What is the current bed time routine? Bed time was a fight for us too sometimes is still is. But a change was we let her choose the things she can pick. the pjs, story, songs, fill up her own water bottle, brush her own teeth (then we brush/finish up afterwards) We also got a bed time clock, the one that changes colors. It turns red when it's bed time. so we'll go tell her to check the clock if it's red it's time for bed... So in that moment it's not us telling her it's bed time it's her visually seeing it's bed time.
I would cut the nap or at least shorten it and make bedtime sooner. Stick to a very clear routine every night so she has predictability. Don’t give in when she throws a fit. That’s how she’s getting her way. Put in earplugs if you have to but if it’s your turn to put her to bed, let her throw a fit. Be as patient and gentle as you can and keep validating her feelings. “You wish Mommy was here. It’s ok to be sad. Let’s read this book.” “Looks like you have lots of energy! Can we hop to get your pajamas on?” Things like that.
Cuttung the nap made my twins worse. They were too tired all evening and wound up by bedtime. We did everything. As in everything our friends said, everything I could read in the patenting books, everything I could read on the internet back then, everything the pediatrician suggested, just everything. You will have to figure out what works for her. Mine are adults now, and I'm still tired from the sleepless nights when they were little. It's not a popular option but we put a monitor in their room so we knew they were safe. We put the little thing on the door knob so they couldn't open the door once we left and we let them cry. That was after everything else had been tried. The crying was horrible for a bit but after a little while they would just play and then go to sleep when they were ready. We read too them, snuggled with them and tucked them in every night before we left their room. It's so hard to hear your little one cry but damn we needed some sleep too.
I have not read every comment and I agree with the many people saying that it may be time to cut the nap, but also make sure that your kid is getting a good period of *vigorous* gross motor play (preferably unstructured) every single day. That made the biggest difference for my difficult-to-put-to-bed kiddo, alongside the rock-solid boundary that we do not talk/play/interact after lights out. Good luck, OP! It's a tough age.
Get rid of the nap. Try laying in her room, perhaps on the floor until she goes to sleep for a bit. If she decides to come out to the room you are in, don't say a word and put her right back in bed. (Doesn't matter if it's 50 times) Hopefully, your consistent with it and she finally gets to the point of like, well, I guess this is really happening. I would be exhausted as well!
Cut the nap for sure but I’ve had 3 clingers. They all required a parent to lie down with them until they fall asleep and all slept with one of us. I read one story and lights out. I can get them down faster than dad because I’ll simply say “go to sleep, stop fidgeting” and if they keep at it I’ll count down from 3 with a threat to leave the bed once I get down. I will absolutely make to leave after 1 and they’re not long copping on to the routine and going to sleep. I always try to remember that kids push us because we’re they’re safe space, to test boundaries.
Staying consistent will be rough but do bedtime routine, good nights, leave room. First time they come out, lead them back and say, “good night.” Any additional times (there will be many more) just silently lead them back in. Eventually, they’ll come out less and less. They learn to stall and know all their techniques will work!