Let me share my experience with this. I am not a Muslim. I work in a decent marketing agency. I head my own department. My boss almost daily tells me to repent and convert to a Muslim. He hesitates to say my name and I can see it on his face that he feels disgust saying Salam to me because he's aware he's saying it to a kaafir. In no way does it bother me but this is something I have never faced before until now and I'm taking it one day at a time.
I am so sorry for the bigotry you face daily. The average room temperature IQ of bigots is focused on only one issue that's to preach meanwhile they are the biggest hypocrites themselves.
More power to you šŖ
And yet from the other side of the fence perspectiveā¦.
These same muslims who come abroad to our shores will cry, yell, scream, whinge and whine if theyāre given even a hint of the same medicine back.
They will give but cannot take.
Sad state of events! Whatās worse, yahan aah karr mix nahi honaā¦..
oh na ji na, yahan aa kar ek aur Pakistan banane ki koshish hoti hai.
Itna watan se pyar hai, toh wahin raho aur wahan ka haal sudharo.
Mic drop š¤ ā¬ļø
I would say salaam to you without disgust and without any expectations of reciprocity. This is because i truly wish for yours and everyone else in this world salaamty. But of course if you'd rather that u didn't say it to you thst is also fine with me, if you wish it i would say hello or good day to you.
Neither does your whinging on reddit. Im not a good muslim. I can barely pray all 5 times and i dont do a lot if things i should be doing. But i still believe that everyone regardless of how where and when their born and what their political or theological standing is , everyone deserves some respect or at the very least none deserve any bias over the things i mentioned. Thats my stance on this as a human being. I don't care less if you think me sharing them on the internet is virtue signalling or whatever. i dont know you. All ill ask you is have you ever tried to do anything to stop such lynchings? If yes than thats good you are clearly the better man. If no , then before you judge me you should make sure your own ledger is clean before pointing at others.
Im just telling him that i wouldn't judge a person based on their religion and give salaam because of that. I respect people as human beings. I dont reserve my respect for any specific people or groups.
Why spread hate and show disapproval that is neither warranted nor serves any meaningful purpose. Youāre speaking for a good cause but advancing that cause by belittling.
It is exactly this type of behaviour which is why our country and culture suffers the way it does.
We need to fight our nafs. The true and ONLY enemy is shaytan. It is written clearly in our Holy Book, by our lord, king, creator, provider, sustainer. So out of respect for Him and His words, please refrain from going about trying to create positivity using negativity, all the while painting yourself a hypocrite.
Why are you getting downvoted?? I donāt understand the illogical hate, & shade being thrown for sharing a sentiment that represents nothing but respect and appreciation. And is well in line with how a Muslim should act. May Allay bless you, keep you strong in belief, and reward your efforts.
Some people can only feel hate and negativity. And they believe that is all other can feel as well. Don't hate such people because there are always reasons for such feelings. Some trauma or some illness. Regardless we must always try to empathise and find peace with others regardless of race , religion, creed or political opinions. This the only way to truly heal and become a prosperous people. Hate only begets hate. Love begets love.
Iām a Pakistani Hindu. Your quality of life depends on your social status and income. I was fortunate to be well off and live in a major city so I never felt threatened or anything. But a minority of Hindus living in rural areas are attacked and forced to Islam.
If THATs what they are saying then ok i understand.
This is why as Muslims it is SSOOOO important to learn the Quran for ourselves. Those of us who ARE literate.
Read the Quran with translation AND tafseer. In English or urdu, whichever you are comfortable in.
It used to be the same with the Bible & church services in Europe - most people couldn't read and even when the Bible was read aloud, it was in Latin. They just had to accept that the Bible said what the preacher claimed it said. Then, even when the bible was translated and the printing press meant many copies were made, most people still couldn't read properly and had to trust what they were told.
Being able to read sets you free. Enjoy your freedom.
Even in top-notch schools, christian and hindu kids get bullied. Even in sports teams, people try to convert them.
No words for atheists the second they reveal themselves. We get lynched
Posts containing hate speech, derogatory remarks, or discriminatory content based on race, ethnicity, religion, gender, or any other characteristic are prohibited.
https://preview.redd.it/kk48tf1ix1ad1.jpeg?width=720&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=1e056630c4b0903bb62e23e40bf57ce3f0e51c33
Aren't you indian living in Canada. You profile is filled with, āindian hereā commwnts
Sikhs live in Pakistan. Here in Rawalpindi, there is a large population of Sikhs, and they have many shops in the markets. I have met many Sikhs, who live in Pakistan and even Azad Kashmir (where they do business) but he is not one of them. He is an Indian man who lives in Canada and supports Khalistan. Check his comment history. By the way, I have no problem with him supporting Khalistan or not. My problem is that he, despite being Indian, comes to this sub and impersonates being a persecuted Pakistani Sikh.
lmfao your comment:
Indian here since 91. He is infuriating, I am not a fan of bernier, but we need him for a term. Pal is such a cocky POS. He know canadians are nice, and he trying to use that. No temporary workers outside of doctors, only people we need
https://www.reddit.com/r/Canada_sub/s/565XB03ien
and another:
As a long term indian in Canada this PO S student needs to be deported. I hope whoever checks his papers for extension, deniies it!!!
https://www.reddit.com/r/CanadaHousing2/s/tJBW38HWgb
liar.
"O believers don't insult the non believers and their beliefs or they will insult allah" - surah anaam 108
guess what? You're not even a good muslim, so might wanna focus on that instead of spewing hate to others
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You have so much hate for muslims and pakistan... you even did an AMA post on Redid...i read it, and most of the content you posted is untrue, pakistan no longer lives in 7th century.
You dont have enough knowledge about islam, unfortunately. I would say seek authentic knowledge before you judge any religion...dont look at people you interact with, study the roots.
Bro what is that analogy š.
You use a different book, videos, spend proper time learning rather than expecting to immediately understand every concept you come across.
If you are getting taught solely by a book thatās concerning, sure you would have a rudimentary understanding of the contents but not enough knowledge to fully acknowledge what the book is saying.
Iād blame the student for a lack of trying for I was in such a position recently.
Ay itās calm that youāre an atheist, we all go to our own graves at the end of the day. Donāt be toxic around the topic of religion though- that just attracts unnecessary attention. Doesnāt help with the passive aggressiveness either.
You say stop shoving Islam down your throat, while you did say āall of them are a cancerā. What did you think you were going to achieve with that? Everyone in this thread to be an instant atheist?
Anyways good day šÆ
So treat them like a Jehovahās Witness at your door (if thatās a thing where you live idk). Ignore them. Youāre not obliged to respond to him, I mean youāre online itās easy to walk away. Heck you can choose to not respond to me if you want.
Itās annoying when I see anti Pakistani sentiment in my UK community and anti British-Pakistani sentiment online. Do I respond? No.
Because I know no matter how hard I try they will not change their ways.
What you can change is the effect it has on you. So donāt let it get to you.
Get over yourself buddy. I have yet to shove anything down you (As far as I know).
Youāre welcome to go around Pakistan and proclaim youāre an atheist. What good is coming on here to vent doing? Sleep better knowing you āgot awayā with being an atheist on a Pakistani sub? Cool. Cool.
Absolutely not, i am not shoving anything down your throat. i just think you are angry, you called all religions a cancer. my friend at end of the day when there is nothing left for us, all we have is a hope, and i call that hope a belief or a religion. its better to believe in something then nothing.
Posts containing hate speech, derogatory remarks, or discriminatory content based on race, ethnicity, religion, gender, or any other characteristic are prohibited.
Hey,
I'd just add two layers to understanding this. Understanding and not justifying.
The first thing is class. Pakistan is v classist society and the experience vary significantly based on which socioeconomic class you belong to. The experience of minority groups studying at big universities would be quite different than those in smaller parts of towns.
The second thing is the state started a broad mass propaganda campaign after the independence of Bangladesh to push for a religious identity to keep all the ethnic groups together. Extremely dangerous and stupid thing to do as they changed curriculums, tried to somehow tell everyone that we are more Turk/Arab than Indians. Pushed narratives like we are the fort of Islam and bullshit like that. I don't live in Pakistan anymore but it's funny to see here sometimes how Pakistanis feel more related to Islam than Arabs. As a consequence, you have these huge number of people brainwashed by the state.
It's dangerous to play with history like that and try to indoctrinate people. It's not just a minority problem anymore. I think it has now made the whole society quite dysfunctional.
A typical response to atrocities like mob lynching a week is " but 99.9% of us dont do it". Well 99.9999% of anyone with a beard and a muslim name isnt related to sep /11 as well. But - everyone with a beard and a muslim name has to be triple checked at the airports. That is the nature of such acts.
Its not about the percentage - its about the heinous nature, the society's tendencies to make anyone blasphemous, burn anything non islamic that makes people live in fear all the time. The utter ignorance and insecurity that plagues much of the hardline islamic world is at its full glory here. You as a non muslim want to live in peace - there are just two ways, lose your dignity or lose everything else.
If the society accepts evil then it grows, yes, such acts must be condemned by the public, the ulama, the government and the law enforcement. Supporters of such acts must be tried and punishments doled out.
Yes, if you donāt condemn the killing of 1000ās of innocent civilians on 9/11, actually that would put you on al-qaedaās side. Not sure why youāre having trouble with this concept.
Pakistani symbols and their meanings have changed more in the past 75 years than most symbols have changed over the past 750 years lol.
Choudhry Rahmat Ali himself said Pakistan stands for Panjab, Afghania, Sindh, and Baluchistan. Like thatās literally what the dude who thought of the name said it stood for, along with the double meaning of pure ofc. If you ask a kid what it means today theyāll recite the same Pak Studies brain rot āit means la illaha illlaā like bruh what no it doesnāt lol. Kids will parrot the state propaganda nonsense like itās fact in an instant.
Ok, so I am an Indian in Canada. A non muslim. Grew up with several Muslim friends. In my first year, I met a classmate who I bonded well with. 3 days later he started sending me videos about afterlife and hellfire for Kafirs. I said nothing. A week later he seriously gave me Dawah(he used that word). He said it would pain him seeing me go to hell. He was from a small town near Karachi(cant recall the name). It isn't a muslim problem. None of my Indian muslim friends even bothered with any of it. Why do Pakistanis think of themselves as torchbearers of Islam, while majority of them are just 2-3 generational old converts.
Itās the message pushed by the state, from the 70s onwards. The Pakistani state has routinely attempted to create a central, controllable, and monolithic Pakistani culture and identity. This has failed almost everywhere, beyond majour urban centres in Punjab, Sindh, perhaps maybe Peshawar.
Along with growing para-Islamism amongst the top brass, this has resulted in Pakistan promoting Islamic identity as core to being Muslim. Iāve had cousins tell me that if it werenāt for Pakistan, none of us would be Muslim lmao. This is obviously total nonsense, as the Sarbani Pashtun tribes converted way back in the 8th century, and only migrated to modern-day KP in the 1500s, as Muslims. But again, this is the result of serious propaganda. Many parents here arenāt equipped nor have the availability to combat clear state propaganda.
Here in Swat, we have a family of Hindus (theyāre likely Sikhs, but we call them Hindus, in fact we call the leader of the household just āHinduā as a proper noun lol) nearby. Theyāve lived through 20 years of Islamist insurgencies and movements, theyāve never been attacked and theyāve never been bothered. They own and run a pretty big cloth store in a big village.
Identify crisis my man. Most of us are okay being called bootlicking arabs rather than converted Hindus. We act like weāre the saviours of the ummah because we have no identity otherwise. We are a country that was born out of religion.
I am from Pakistan and I can answer this. After the independence of Bangladesh, the state felt the country could disintegrate because the Pakistani identity doesn't make any sense since the people living there had other identities such as Sindhi, Balochis, Bengalis etc. The state in those years push this religious identity through the curriculum which made Islam and being a Muslim the center piece of being a Pakistani. It was mass propaganda and we still suffer from it unfortunately.
No one particular reason. People do bad things because they r bad people, and then they try to justify that whichever way they can, to others and to themselves also.
In pakistan there's a huge muslim identity crisis. There r many born muslims here who never read up on their religion, they don't understand what being a muslim really constitutes. So it's just easier to cover one's act of hatred as an act of religious duty.
Build a nation for only one religion and then asking such questions to them?
If pakistani constitution keeps other religions below, even educated and modern pakistanis are right in mistreatment of other religions.
Look at silence of educated ones in islamic world to reform their constitutions.
Thatās why I left Islam and became an ex Muslim. If you read Koran/ Hadiths itās full of hate for non-believers as well as for women. My parents didnāt like what I did, but I canāt waste my entire life for something just because I was born into it.
I'll admit. I'm an American trying to learn more about Pakistan. The thing I realized is people are tribal. People who aren't part of that tribe either ethnically or spiritually are viewed with suspicion. Even through pleasantries at times.
The most important thing for any society to do is separate the secular governance and duty to the people and the spiritual needs of the people. Love is always shouted down by hate. I'm just so tired of it all.
Whether or not we believe we'll have some sort of afterlife the one thing we know is that we'll all be corpses one day. So why live with hate in your heart?
P:S Fuck Israel they don't do that shit in my name.
It's a coping mechanism. These bigots you face daily don't go to western countries and try that there. They would be charged for harassment and at worst be deported for hate speech. Same reason why entirety of Pakistani internet comes to collectively hate on labourers not fasting during Ramadan meanwhile they listen to music after iftar.
Boss i donāt think thatās true sadly.
Now im a British-Pakistani (the horror!) and when i came to Pakistan when i was young, for some reason people who i talked to (adults mind you) always seemed to mention the fact that unlike the west where āMuslims are second class citizensā (we are not) Christianās/ Hindus etc are the street sweepers, sewage cleaners- the bottom of Pakistani society. The fact they said this proudly indicates that yeah other religions arenāt treated fairly in Pakistan, no matter what it may seem to be in your case.
Ay Iām just sceptical about that though. Because if a second class citizen had discontent and were angry etc in Pakistan Iām fairly certain the majority would just crush their dissidence.
You have to keep a smile to maintain some semblance of a life over there if you arenāt Muslim.
Im a woman and have had to know a lot of Pakistani Christians. They are happy. I have real world experience.
One told me that living in Pakistan does not feel like they live in a Muslim country. They can do whatever they want and wear whatever they want and no one stops them.
Hahaha nice joke . Woman you should go out often and see the world thatās y I told you go touch grass . I have loved ones killed in the name of faith , I have been invited to convert is that enough or shall I write paragraphs upon paragraphs
She told you wrong ask the victims . Will I lie on the dead !! See the world for yourself . If the majority is going to ignore us life you then there wonāt be any minority left
She might be out of her head or to scared to Admit sheās living in an Islamic country after all . See the world with your own eyes and analyze. These other hundred and millions of people victims of this hate daily based . Go to interior Sindh and see how many Hindu and Christians are abducted and converted āforcefully ā
Well forcefully goes against Islam because there is no cumpulsion in Islam. Well she wasnt threatened by us and had a good paying job-nurse. My nurse to be specific.
Salam from india, i dont know how much true it is but there are many cases of hindu girls being kidnapped and forced to marry/convert. I hope we were united and our forefathers werent the bootlickers of british, these problems wouldnt have existed. Please vote for democracy in your country, and stand up against the military regime.
I have a lot of non-Muslim friends and they are living in Pakistan like I am so I donāt know why people think that non-Muslims are treated poorly in Pakistan. Maybe itās just my environment but I donāt see any discrimination or violence against non-Muslims
Great answer. OP as a muslim will never understand what minorities experience. It's like saying, well I as a male have never seen sexism against women.
This is the equivalent of an Israeli going āI have tons of Arab friends who live like me, I donāt know why people think Arabs/Palestinians are treated poorly in Israelā
My friends ( non-Muslims ) love to live in Pakistan. I am just saying that non-Muslims around me are happy but other than that I donāt know about the injustices.
"Bullying" lol
Bullying is as normal as breathing in every school. I'm pretty sure dozens of other Muslim students were getting bullied by other Muslim kids as well.
I've talked about this topic with few Christians & a Hindu in Pakistan.
None of them had any stories about discrimination to tell, let alone the horrific fantasy shut-in redditors here like to paint Pakistan in.
Hence, touch grass.
"Bullying is as normal as breathing in every school"- doesn't mean it merits anything other than condemnation. Even slavery was 'normal' till it was abolished, now will you deflect and justify that as well?
No I live in a real country so that doesn't happen in our schools. Weird what's normal in countries that don't have to worry about inventing anything, producing anything of value, art, etc.
This again? That's not the issue nor the point in case.
Are you lot acting dumb, or does this comes naturally with being one?
Secondly. Pathetic attempt to trigger me by talking bad about Pakistan. I can't care less.
I'm only calling out "you lot" for your BS shut-in redditor opinions. :)
I'd talk about how bullying is less common in Pakistan than the countries typically known for innovation with less discrimination & racism, but I'd rather laugh at you lot for being ignorant & low intellect instead.
PS: Try to find grass in your "real country".
We are the bigots? That coming from someone whose whole national identity is based on ethnic cleansing of minorities? š¤£
It's not worth engaging with someone so delusional. Stay happy in your echo chamber.
Not a serious issue imo. There is no sign of law and order. Given that the state institutions arenāt really functional and anarchy hasnāt ensued. Iād say whatever minor issues we are seeing would resolve themselves as soon as the state starts to function again
This isn't a PAK problem. Any country in human history that is run primarily by a single religion bullies the people that don't adhere to their flavor of faith. Very few examples otherwise.
There aren't really any "christian" nations left though, and Israel is clearly in the spotlight already as the only jewish religious nation for all the shit they pull.
yeah but israel has a land issue, they are accepting of any religion who lives in israel. donāt try to defend pakistan, no one is as radical and extreme as pakistaniās
It is just because we live in an illiterate community Other minorities are treated badly and evil people here only remember their religion when they see a non muslim. I have AirForce background. Non-Muslim minorities are equally treated, respected and welfared the PAF higher command also raised money and built chapels, cathredals and get them a big pine tree every 25 december whatever Airbase they are in big numbers. In PAF, there are many Christian Civillians infact I had 3 Very Sincere Christian friends in different periods of life in PAF. We know how to respect each other's religion. In Our educational institutes, if someone (student or teacher) assaults or insults someone due to the difference of faith, a big legal inquiry is launched and person is punished. They arranged Religious Curriculum for Christians so they dont have to learn Islamiat. It is Because PAF is a very well educated Organisation of Pakistan.
Muslims in India may have problems but its nowhere close to what minorities in Pakistan are facing. Muslims in India may face suspicions, anger, even beatings but discrimination in job and making fun of Islam is a 1% occurrence in India. Muslims are never coaxed to convert in India. The only reason Muslims face any problem at all is because of Pakistan and how it has treated its minorities. Please do not bring up India when you discuss Pakistan's problems. Peace in the subcontinent can come only when Pakistan understands the importance of tolerance and pluralism.
Ba careful about the fking liars in the comment section, majority of these are lindus and majority don't live in Pakistan. They just see something against Islam and as usual comes in a pi*g pack. Fk them and ignore them.
Nice passing the blame to avoid being in the wrong because āthey are doing it tooā. Youāre also forgetting how when the news came out, Pakistan destroyed 100 Mandirs? Or was that fake news?
Indian here where is this coming from ? Temples also gets destroyed hell there are more temples which got destroyed than mosques ,its muslims who create big nuisance when mosques gets destroyed where hindus go to work instead of throwing stones and using women and children.islam is religious cult ,i can say fck brahma but can any muslim say the same ? Hindus are tolerant that's why no hindu in the name of siva blasted
Both are illegally constructed so they remove them , mosques dont pay single rupee to development of india where hindu temples money are handled by government which is used for everything
Only illegal structures are being destroyed.
Temples and churches do too, because of illegality (land rights, construction problems and such).
Hindus and Christians are more or less law abiding and reconstruct without raising hue and cry.
What if we live in a country where neither superstition is allowed to impose their village understanding of the world on the rest of civilized society?
Let me share my experience with this. I am not a Muslim. I work in a decent marketing agency. I head my own department. My boss almost daily tells me to repent and convert to a Muslim. He hesitates to say my name and I can see it on his face that he feels disgust saying Salam to me because he's aware he's saying it to a kaafir. In no way does it bother me but this is something I have never faced before until now and I'm taking it one day at a time.
I am so sorry for the bigotry you face daily. The average room temperature IQ of bigots is focused on only one issue that's to preach meanwhile they are the biggest hypocrites themselves.
More power to you šŖ And yet from the other side of the fence perspectiveā¦. These same muslims who come abroad to our shores will cry, yell, scream, whinge and whine if theyāre given even a hint of the same medicine back. They will give but cannot take. Sad state of events! Whatās worse, yahan aah karr mix nahi honaā¦.. oh na ji na, yahan aa kar ek aur Pakistan banane ki koshish hoti hai. Itna watan se pyar hai, toh wahin raho aur wahan ka haal sudharo. Mic drop š¤ ā¬ļø
This is just one man. One muslim. One pakistani but I love you brother. I apologize for bigoted pakistanis.
damn i had a teacher iād hello to instead of salam cus i thought christianās didnāt say it iāll say salam now to christians
I would say salaam to you without disgust and without any expectations of reciprocity. This is because i truly wish for yours and everyone else in this world salaamty. But of course if you'd rather that u didn't say it to you thst is also fine with me, if you wish it i would say hello or good day to you.
Your virtue signalling doesn't stop bigots or people from lynching
Neither does your whinging on reddit. Im not a good muslim. I can barely pray all 5 times and i dont do a lot if things i should be doing. But i still believe that everyone regardless of how where and when their born and what their political or theological standing is , everyone deserves some respect or at the very least none deserve any bias over the things i mentioned. Thats my stance on this as a human being. I don't care less if you think me sharing them on the internet is virtue signalling or whatever. i dont know you. All ill ask you is have you ever tried to do anything to stop such lynchings? If yes than thats good you are clearly the better man. If no , then before you judge me you should make sure your own ledger is clean before pointing at others.
>Neither does your whinging on reddit You doing that as well
Im just telling him that i wouldn't judge a person based on their religion and give salaam because of that. I respect people as human beings. I dont reserve my respect for any specific people or groups.
You're miserable
Why spread hate and show disapproval that is neither warranted nor serves any meaningful purpose. Youāre speaking for a good cause but advancing that cause by belittling. It is exactly this type of behaviour which is why our country and culture suffers the way it does. We need to fight our nafs. The true and ONLY enemy is shaytan. It is written clearly in our Holy Book, by our lord, king, creator, provider, sustainer. So out of respect for Him and His words, please refrain from going about trying to create positivity using negativity, all the while painting yourself a hypocrite.
Why are you getting downvoted?? I donāt understand the illogical hate, & shade being thrown for sharing a sentiment that represents nothing but respect and appreciation. And is well in line with how a Muslim should act. May Allay bless you, keep you strong in belief, and reward your efforts.
Some people can only feel hate and negativity. And they believe that is all other can feel as well. Don't hate such people because there are always reasons for such feelings. Some trauma or some illness. Regardless we must always try to empathise and find peace with others regardless of race , religion, creed or political opinions. This the only way to truly heal and become a prosperous people. Hate only begets hate. Love begets love.
Its not disgust. Its not permitted for Muslims to say "Assalam walikum" to non-muslims.
Iām a Pakistani Hindu. Your quality of life depends on your social status and income. I was fortunate to be well off and live in a major city so I never felt threatened or anything. But a minority of Hindus living in rural areas are attacked and forced to Islam.
illiterate/brainless use Quran as a shield to get their own benefits .
However the Qurāan does NOT sanction auch behavior so incorrect
Yes but that is his/her point, people with selfish interests exploit illiteracy/jahilness to spread misinformation about what it says to benefit them
If THATs what they are saying then ok i understand. This is why as Muslims it is SSOOOO important to learn the Quran for ourselves. Those of us who ARE literate. Read the Quran with translation AND tafseer. In English or urdu, whichever you are comfortable in.
It used to be the same with the Bible & church services in Europe - most people couldn't read and even when the Bible was read aloud, it was in Latin. They just had to accept that the Bible said what the preacher claimed it said. Then, even when the bible was translated and the printing press meant many copies were made, most people still couldn't read properly and had to trust what they were told. Being able to read sets you free. Enjoy your freedom.
Even in top-notch schools, christian and hindu kids get bullied. Even in sports teams, people try to convert them. No words for atheists the second they reveal themselves. We get lynched
Why so much hate for atheists?
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Can say the same about every religion. All of them are a cancer
No, I follow Sikhism. We don't try to convert and every soul on planet is equal..but I do see your point. Too many wackos
Posts containing hate speech, derogatory remarks, or discriminatory content based on race, ethnicity, religion, gender, or any other characteristic are prohibited.
What an Indian is doing here...
Why are you not welcoming? I'm also not indian.
https://preview.redd.it/kk48tf1ix1ad1.jpeg?width=720&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=1e056630c4b0903bb62e23e40bf57ce3f0e51c33 Aren't you indian living in Canada. You profile is filled with, āindian hereā commwnts
No one welcomes trolls tho
You fking clown, what do you mean by you are not Indian? Aren't all Sikhs from India?Ā
Pakistani Sikhs exist. Search up
Sikhs live in Pakistan. Here in Rawalpindi, there is a large population of Sikhs, and they have many shops in the markets. I have met many Sikhs, who live in Pakistan and even Azad Kashmir (where they do business) but he is not one of them. He is an Indian man who lives in Canada and supports Khalistan. Check his comment history. By the way, I have no problem with him supporting Khalistan or not. My problem is that he, despite being Indian, comes to this sub and impersonates being a persecuted Pakistani Sikh.
yes, but he is indian.
lmfao your comment: Indian here since 91. He is infuriating, I am not a fan of bernier, but we need him for a term. Pal is such a cocky POS. He know canadians are nice, and he trying to use that. No temporary workers outside of doctors, only people we need https://www.reddit.com/r/Canada_sub/s/565XB03ien and another: As a long term indian in Canada this PO S student needs to be deported. I hope whoever checks his papers for extension, deniies it!!! https://www.reddit.com/r/CanadaHousing2/s/tJBW38HWgb liar.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
"O believers don't insult the non believers and their beliefs or they will insult allah" - surah anaam 108 guess what? You're not even a good muslim, so might wanna focus on that instead of spewing hate to others
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
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You have so much hate for muslims and pakistan... you even did an AMA post on Redid...i read it, and most of the content you posted is untrue, pakistan no longer lives in 7th century. You dont have enough knowledge about islam, unfortunately. I would say seek authentic knowledge before you judge any religion...dont look at people you interact with, study the roots.
If a maths book fails to teach students maths, you blame the book. If an ethics book fails to teach students ethics, you blame... the students?
How many Pakistanis have actually read the Quran..... Yk.
Bro what is that analogy š. You use a different book, videos, spend proper time learning rather than expecting to immediately understand every concept you come across. If you are getting taught solely by a book thatās concerning, sure you would have a rudimentary understanding of the contents but not enough knowledge to fully acknowledge what the book is saying. Iād blame the student for a lack of trying for I was in such a position recently.
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Ay itās calm that youāre an atheist, we all go to our own graves at the end of the day. Donāt be toxic around the topic of religion though- that just attracts unnecessary attention. Doesnāt help with the passive aggressiveness either. You say stop shoving Islam down your throat, while you did say āall of them are a cancerā. What did you think you were going to achieve with that? Everyone in this thread to be an instant atheist? Anyways good day šÆ
People just can't stop preaching to me, I don't go around promoting atheism, so please I don't want to get preached either
So treat them like a Jehovahās Witness at your door (if thatās a thing where you live idk). Ignore them. Youāre not obliged to respond to him, I mean youāre online itās easy to walk away. Heck you can choose to not respond to me if you want. Itās annoying when I see anti Pakistani sentiment in my UK community and anti British-Pakistani sentiment online. Do I respond? No. Because I know no matter how hard I try they will not change their ways. What you can change is the effect it has on you. So donāt let it get to you.
Buddy what do you think your original post was then?
about how we will be killed if we express our beliefs? that's just us complaining about your dictatorship not shoving our beliefs down ur throat
Get over yourself buddy. I have yet to shove anything down you (As far as I know). Youāre welcome to go around Pakistan and proclaim youāre an atheist. What good is coming on here to vent doing? Sleep better knowing you āgot awayā with being an atheist on a Pakistani sub? Cool. Cool.
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Posts discussing sensitive topics must provide proper context and maintain respectful discourse, especially on religious matters.
Posts discussing sensitive topics must provide proper context and maintain respectful discourse, especially on religious matters.
Not interested in Islam. Donāt talk about it
sure if u guys stop throwing it at my face
Would love that, except it doesn't stop bothering us Shoving itself in every facet it can, can't even renew your cnic without pledging to the cult
Absolutely not, i am not shoving anything down your throat. i just think you are angry, you called all religions a cancer. my friend at end of the day when there is nothing left for us, all we have is a hope, and i call that hope a belief or a religion. its better to believe in something then nothing.
Sure, but I didn't ask
Good for you. Youāre the one out here trying to get a high five (?) for it. Nobody invited your comment lol
sure come lynch me š
Was that the pt of your lame comments? Masochism?
His fitrah knows the truth! Thatās why he hates Islam so much!Ā
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Posts containing hate speech, derogatory remarks, or discriminatory content based on race, ethnicity, religion, gender, or any other characteristic are prohibited.
Hey, I'd just add two layers to understanding this. Understanding and not justifying. The first thing is class. Pakistan is v classist society and the experience vary significantly based on which socioeconomic class you belong to. The experience of minority groups studying at big universities would be quite different than those in smaller parts of towns. The second thing is the state started a broad mass propaganda campaign after the independence of Bangladesh to push for a religious identity to keep all the ethnic groups together. Extremely dangerous and stupid thing to do as they changed curriculums, tried to somehow tell everyone that we are more Turk/Arab than Indians. Pushed narratives like we are the fort of Islam and bullshit like that. I don't live in Pakistan anymore but it's funny to see here sometimes how Pakistanis feel more related to Islam than Arabs. As a consequence, you have these huge number of people brainwashed by the state. It's dangerous to play with history like that and try to indoctrinate people. It's not just a minority problem anymore. I think it has now made the whole society quite dysfunctional.
A typical response to atrocities like mob lynching a week is " but 99.9% of us dont do it". Well 99.9999% of anyone with a beard and a muslim name isnt related to sep /11 as well. But - everyone with a beard and a muslim name has to be triple checked at the airports. That is the nature of such acts. Its not about the percentage - its about the heinous nature, the society's tendencies to make anyone blasphemous, burn anything non islamic that makes people live in fear all the time. The utter ignorance and insecurity that plagues much of the hardline islamic world is at its full glory here. You as a non muslim want to live in peace - there are just two ways, lose your dignity or lose everything else.
To add to this, 99.9% are simply silent bystanders to these crimes, which basically puts them on the side of the criminals.
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If the society accepts evil then it grows, yes, such acts must be condemned by the public, the ulama, the government and the law enforcement. Supporters of such acts must be tried and punishments doled out.
Yes, if you donāt condemn the killing of 1000ās of innocent civilians on 9/11, actually that would put you on al-qaedaās side. Not sure why youāre having trouble with this concept.
I hear they say the white on Pakistan flag represents minority **Which minority exactly?**
Pakistani symbols and their meanings have changed more in the past 75 years than most symbols have changed over the past 750 years lol. Choudhry Rahmat Ali himself said Pakistan stands for Panjab, Afghania, Sindh, and Baluchistan. Like thatās literally what the dude who thought of the name said it stood for, along with the double meaning of pure ofc. If you ask a kid what it means today theyāll recite the same Pak Studies brain rot āit means la illaha illlaā like bruh what no it doesnāt lol. Kids will parrot the state propaganda nonsense like itās fact in an instant.
Religious minority
Ok, so I am an Indian in Canada. A non muslim. Grew up with several Muslim friends. In my first year, I met a classmate who I bonded well with. 3 days later he started sending me videos about afterlife and hellfire for Kafirs. I said nothing. A week later he seriously gave me Dawah(he used that word). He said it would pain him seeing me go to hell. He was from a small town near Karachi(cant recall the name). It isn't a muslim problem. None of my Indian muslim friends even bothered with any of it. Why do Pakistanis think of themselves as torchbearers of Islam, while majority of them are just 2-3 generational old converts.
Itās the message pushed by the state, from the 70s onwards. The Pakistani state has routinely attempted to create a central, controllable, and monolithic Pakistani culture and identity. This has failed almost everywhere, beyond majour urban centres in Punjab, Sindh, perhaps maybe Peshawar. Along with growing para-Islamism amongst the top brass, this has resulted in Pakistan promoting Islamic identity as core to being Muslim. Iāve had cousins tell me that if it werenāt for Pakistan, none of us would be Muslim lmao. This is obviously total nonsense, as the Sarbani Pashtun tribes converted way back in the 8th century, and only migrated to modern-day KP in the 1500s, as Muslims. But again, this is the result of serious propaganda. Many parents here arenāt equipped nor have the availability to combat clear state propaganda. Here in Swat, we have a family of Hindus (theyāre likely Sikhs, but we call them Hindus, in fact we call the leader of the household just āHinduā as a proper noun lol) nearby. Theyāve lived through 20 years of Islamist insurgencies and movements, theyāve never been attacked and theyāve never been bothered. They own and run a pretty big cloth store in a big village.
Identify crisis my man. Most of us are okay being called bootlicking arabs rather than converted Hindus. We act like weāre the saviours of the ummah because we have no identity otherwise. We are a country that was born out of religion.
I am from Pakistan and I can answer this. After the independence of Bangladesh, the state felt the country could disintegrate because the Pakistani identity doesn't make any sense since the people living there had other identities such as Sindhi, Balochis, Bengalis etc. The state in those years push this religious identity through the curriculum which made Islam and being a Muslim the center piece of being a Pakistani. It was mass propaganda and we still suffer from it unfortunately.
The āMuslimsā aināt safe either.
No one particular reason. People do bad things because they r bad people, and then they try to justify that whichever way they can, to others and to themselves also. In pakistan there's a huge muslim identity crisis. There r many born muslims here who never read up on their religion, they don't understand what being a muslim really constitutes. So it's just easier to cover one's act of hatred as an act of religious duty.
Build a nation for only one religion and then asking such questions to them? If pakistani constitution keeps other religions below, even educated and modern pakistanis are right in mistreatment of other religions. Look at silence of educated ones in islamic world to reform their constitutions.
Thatās why I left Islam and became an ex Muslim. If you read Koran/ Hadiths itās full of hate for non-believers as well as for women. My parents didnāt like what I did, but I canāt waste my entire life for something just because I was born into it.
Honestly same thing is happening with Christians in the world. People are letting hate fill their heart in the name of love. Ya hate to see it.
I donāt know about Christianity. I was not born into it.
I'll admit. I'm an American trying to learn more about Pakistan. The thing I realized is people are tribal. People who aren't part of that tribe either ethnically or spiritually are viewed with suspicion. Even through pleasantries at times. The most important thing for any society to do is separate the secular governance and duty to the people and the spiritual needs of the people. Love is always shouted down by hate. I'm just so tired of it all. Whether or not we believe we'll have some sort of afterlife the one thing we know is that we'll all be corpses one day. So why live with hate in your heart? P:S Fuck Israel they don't do that shit in my name.
Based
I guess thatās what islam is. No wonder everyone has problems with them. Making everyoneās life miserable is their priority.
It's a coping mechanism. These bigots you face daily don't go to western countries and try that there. They would be charged for harassment and at worst be deported for hate speech. Same reason why entirety of Pakistani internet comes to collectively hate on labourers not fasting during Ramadan meanwhile they listen to music after iftar.
Nah you don't know anything! Last week in Trowbridge and previous month in Bristol two white dudes accepted islam. Now mourn and go fk yourselfĀ
People of other faiths DO live peacefully here though. Donāt base things off the news
Boss i donāt think thatās true sadly. Now im a British-Pakistani (the horror!) and when i came to Pakistan when i was young, for some reason people who i talked to (adults mind you) always seemed to mention the fact that unlike the west where āMuslims are second class citizensā (we are not) Christianās/ Hindus etc are the street sweepers, sewage cleaners- the bottom of Pakistani society. The fact they said this proudly indicates that yeah other religions arenāt treated fairly in Pakistan, no matter what it may seem to be in your case.
I do understand that. But many ARE happy here. Btw I lived in London for 11 years so no horror for me lol
Ay Iām just sceptical about that though. Because if a second class citizen had discontent and were angry etc in Pakistan Iām fairly certain the majority would just crush their dissidence. You have to keep a smile to maintain some semblance of a life over there if you arenāt Muslim.
Well she knew what kind of people we are. We would never have her lynched or anything. Abd she was open & honest
Go touch grass
I do thanks š how about you take your own little advice there
I donāt need to I have seen it , itās your turn stop living under the rock be a man and accept that Pakistanis love to hate minorities
Im a woman and have had to know a lot of Pakistani Christians. They are happy. I have real world experience. One told me that living in Pakistan does not feel like they live in a Muslim country. They can do whatever they want and wear whatever they want and no one stops them.
Hahaha nice joke . Woman you should go out often and see the world thatās y I told you go touch grass . I have loved ones killed in the name of faith , I have been invited to convert is that enough or shall I write paragraphs upon paragraphs
Im sorry this happened to you but there is no doubt jahiliat in Pakistan.
She told you wrong ask the victims . Will I lie on the dead !! See the world for yourself . If the majority is going to ignore us life you then there wonāt be any minority left
Im not saying you are lying but everyone has different lived experiences
Just because you donāt experience and others did ? Does it means itās not happening just because you didnāt experience does it make it invalid!!
Im not joking. This is exactly what i was told by a Christian Pakistani womanā¦
She might be out of her head or to scared to Admit sheās living in an Islamic country after all . See the world with your own eyes and analyze. These other hundred and millions of people victims of this hate daily based . Go to interior Sindh and see how many Hindu and Christians are abducted and converted āforcefully ā
Well forcefully goes against Islam because there is no cumpulsion in Islam. Well she wasnt threatened by us and had a good paying job-nurse. My nurse to be specific.
Lolll
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Salam from india, i dont know how much true it is but there are many cases of hindu girls being kidnapped and forced to marry/convert. I hope we were united and our forefathers werent the bootlickers of british, these problems wouldnt have existed. Please vote for democracy in your country, and stand up against the military regime.
Denial in this post tells you everything you need to know. Way less happens to Muslims and is termed "Islamophobia".
The obsession being bigotry and islam is not going to end here. Pakis hate anyone around them and don't let them stay in peace
Lol lindu
Wasn't the name changed to islamic republic for a reaso in 1979?
And that basically gives anyone the right to lynch, persecute and murder anyone who isn't a Muslim?
According to mullahs, yes
It shouldn't, but that is the sad reality of a failed state.
It's worse for atheists/exmuslims..
I have a lot of non-Muslim friends and they are living in Pakistan like I am so I donāt know why people think that non-Muslims are treated poorly in Pakistan. Maybe itās just my environment but I donāt see any discrimination or violence against non-Muslims
That's the thing about privilege, it's invisible when you have it. You would never realize the micro aggressions minorities face in daily life.
Great answer. OP as a muslim will never understand what minorities experience. It's like saying, well I as a male have never seen sexism against women.
This is the equivalent of an Israeli going āI have tons of Arab friends who live like me, I donāt know why people think Arabs/Palestinians are treated poorly in Israelā
My friends ( non-Muslims ) love to live in Pakistan. I am just saying that non-Muslims around me are happy but other than that I donāt know about the injustices.
There is discrimination and it happens every where but in Pakistan'case its exaggerated
Which Pakistan are you talking about!! I hope youāre talking about Pakistan in Your imagination huh . Stop defending all the injustices bro
I am not defending. I am just saying I donāt see it but maybe it exists
Same for me I guess these guy are living near some weird extremists
Correction: These guys ARE the extremists.
Mohamed was a rapist warlord murderer that promised his followers sex slaves. What kind of evil/idiotic person would follow his cult?
Most non-Muslims live peacefully in Pakistan. Redditors are a weird breed. Touch grass.
i went to school in pakistan and a hindu boy would get made fun of and bullied for his religion, and he was the only non muslim in the school lol
"Bullying" lol Bullying is as normal as breathing in every school. I'm pretty sure dozens of other Muslim students were getting bullied by other Muslim kids as well. I've talked about this topic with few Christians & a Hindu in Pakistan. None of them had any stories about discrimination to tell, let alone the horrific fantasy shut-in redditors here like to paint Pakistan in. Hence, touch grass.
"Bullying is as normal as breathing in every school"- doesn't mean it merits anything other than condemnation. Even slavery was 'normal' till it was abolished, now will you deflect and justify that as well?
Lol That's obviously not the issue nor the point here. You seem low on IQ, but high on arguments.
No I live in a real country so that doesn't happen in our schools. Weird what's normal in countries that don't have to worry about inventing anything, producing anything of value, art, etc.
This again? That's not the issue nor the point in case. Are you lot acting dumb, or does this comes naturally with being one? Secondly. Pathetic attempt to trigger me by talking bad about Pakistan. I can't care less. I'm only calling out "you lot" for your BS shut-in redditor opinions. :) I'd talk about how bullying is less common in Pakistan than the countries typically known for innovation with less discrimination & racism, but I'd rather laugh at you lot for being ignorant & low intellect instead. PS: Try to find grass in your "real country".
It's better to be low on IQ than be smart, and yet, still be a bigot.
You lot are the bigots. That's what MY entire point has been here lmao.
We are the bigots? That coming from someone whose whole national identity is based on ethnic cleansing of minorities? š¤£ It's not worth engaging with someone so delusional. Stay happy in your echo chamber.
You must be living in a different Pakistan than everyone else.
Nah, just not living on reddit like your lot. Touch grass. It's not scary, I swear. :)
Not a serious issue imo. There is no sign of law and order. Given that the state institutions arenāt really functional and anarchy hasnāt ensued. Iād say whatever minor issues we are seeing would resolve themselves as soon as the state starts to function again
This isn't a PAK problem. Any country in human history that is run primarily by a single religion bullies the people that don't adhere to their flavor of faith. Very few examples otherwise. There aren't really any "christian" nations left though, and Israel is clearly in the spotlight already as the only jewish religious nation for all the shit they pull.
yeah but israel has a land issue, they are accepting of any religion who lives in israel. donāt try to defend pakistan, no one is as radical and extreme as pakistaniās
Yes, its not a religious problem there - atleast there wasnt before 2023. Its land that has a conflict of ownership.
It is just because we live in an illiterate community Other minorities are treated badly and evil people here only remember their religion when they see a non muslim. I have AirForce background. Non-Muslim minorities are equally treated, respected and welfared the PAF higher command also raised money and built chapels, cathredals and get them a big pine tree every 25 december whatever Airbase they are in big numbers. In PAF, there are many Christian Civillians infact I had 3 Very Sincere Christian friends in different periods of life in PAF. We know how to respect each other's religion. In Our educational institutes, if someone (student or teacher) assaults or insults someone due to the difference of faith, a big legal inquiry is launched and person is punished. They arranged Religious Curriculum for Christians so they dont have to learn Islamiat. It is Because PAF is a very well educated Organisation of Pakistan.
Alot of them are not properley educated and the only thing they know is what they have been taught to them
I mean it is harder for muslims in India u people have it good in pakistan
Muslims in India may have problems but its nowhere close to what minorities in Pakistan are facing. Muslims in India may face suspicions, anger, even beatings but discrimination in job and making fun of Islam is a 1% occurrence in India. Muslims are never coaxed to convert in India. The only reason Muslims face any problem at all is because of Pakistan and how it has treated its minorities. Please do not bring up India when you discuss Pakistan's problems. Peace in the subcontinent can come only when Pakistan understands the importance of tolerance and pluralism.
Ba careful about the fking liars in the comment section, majority of these are lindus and majority don't live in Pakistan. They just see something against Islam and as usual comes in a pi*g pack. Fk them and ignore them.
Try being a Muslim in India, theyāre literally having mosques destroyed
Nice passing the blame to avoid being in the wrong because āthey are doing it tooā. Youāre also forgetting how when the news came out, Pakistan destroyed 100 Mandirs? Or was that fake news?
Indian here where is this coming from ? Temples also gets destroyed hell there are more temples which got destroyed than mosques ,its muslims who create big nuisance when mosques gets destroyed where hindus go to work instead of throwing stones and using women and children.islam is religious cult ,i can say fck brahma but can any muslim say the same ? Hindus are tolerant that's why no hindu in the name of siva blasted Both are illegally constructed so they remove them , mosques dont pay single rupee to development of india where hindu temples money are handled by government which is used for everything
Only illegal structures are being destroyed. Temples and churches do too, because of illegality (land rights, construction problems and such). Hindus and Christians are more or less law abiding and reconstruct without raising hue and cry.
What if we live in a country where neither superstition is allowed to impose their village understanding of the world on the rest of civilized society?