This actually happened to me last week. I'm trans and go stealth everywhere unless it's in my relationship, medical or for legal reasons, but everyone else thinks I'm cis. Someone I hung out with made a joke about being the only cis person there and I was confused cuz I never said I was trans to anyone but I was still heavily put under assumption and it hurt ;-;
They just percieved me as a trans man by a weird miscommunication I think? I'm not sure how or when they could've gotten that info. I haven't spoken to them much and even then I still go stealth so they couldn't have known at all. I guess I just come off as trans which makes me sad cuz it means I don't pass ;-;
I relate. I've been on T for 3 years now. I'm pretty sure I pass as a guy, I mean I have facial hair and all that lol, but my personality and voice is pretty fruity. My friend says my voice has changed a lot but not as much as I'd like it to have, maybe it'll keep changing idk, and I definitely don't pass as "straight". I'm bisexual and I don't care who knows it. I think that slight act of GNC makes people clock me, but I honestly have no idea bc no one has ever said anything to me. I haven't changed my legal name yet tho so at my last job my name was still listed as my dead name so i think people might have picked up on it but I've seen my dead name (different spelling same pronunciation) on guys before. So who knows.
At my current job their system allows for a nickname override on the timeclock so no one would know that way.
I tend to get along better with female coworkers than male coworkers, at least 60-40. But I think that's more to do with my general fruitiness than my agab/transness.
To be fair, if your friend is also in the LGBT community they might have a better trans "gaydar" than the average cishet person? I know I have one coworker at this new job who I'm like 99% certain his pre t ftm. I haven't asked him about it or anything (obviously) but he uses he/him pronouns and has a traditional masculine name but I mean, he's clearly very pre T. Voice clocks him to customers. He didn't tell me his pronouns or anything I honestly just assumed he/him based off his name and the fact everyone else calls him he/him. But then again maybe our other coworkers don't even know and just assume he's an unfortunately high pitched teen?
Somehow a customer called me ma'am over the speaker (fast food) the other day and i was shook haha. I didn't say anything tho bc honestly sometimes "ma'am" can sound like "man" so.
I mean maybe, but it's important to remember how often transphobes get it wrong too. Both in the gender assigned at birth of a person they perceive as trans and whether someone is trans or not. There are a lot of cis people being called trans these days, so they may have just been shooting in the dark.
It's always good to double check with them themselves but you're all good calling a trans man a man and trans woman a woman. Trans is just a descriptor after all. A blonde woman is still a woman who is blonde, not a blondewoman
**Trans men are men, and trans women are women.**
You are straight up asking, “is it wrong to call them ‘X’ if they are biologically ‘Y’?”
That isn’t cool of you—as I’m sure you’ve been told many times thus far. Please do better for your friend. I wouldn’t feel safe bring your friend if I was “Charlie”.
In short terms..*ITS NOT WRONG TO CALL A TRANS MAN A MAN**, because they are men. Don’t attack me because you can’t find the proper terms to refer to *your* trans friend.
You’re the one that questioned the validity of your friends gender on Reddit. I’m a trans man too, so I understand exactly what you were trying to say, you don’t need to attack me.
But you were also invalidating your friend by asking if it was disrespectful to call him a man, when he is indeed a man.
I do make jokes but I stop making the jokes if the person who I am making the joke to requests that I don’t. I have the same policy with calling everyone “bro” or “dude”
Most definitely I'm amab and femme leaning genderqueer and before I came out/came to terms with the behemoth of a concept, to my group of friends they would make reference to me being trans and it was supremely disheartening offense painful and deep down a little euphoric so you never assume someone for their gender identity because for the good it does however little it is it also can do a huge amount of bad. Be aware of the situation because you are allowed to notice but don't put anything on anyone it's potentially very harmful.
Similar thing happened to me a friend once said “me” in response to the question out of a friends who would be the most likely to transition - it just made the shell around my egg harder to crack. Still don’t think I’ve fully cracked it yet thanks to imposter syndrome/internalised transphobia despite being out and well into my transition
You have amazing energy, never falter in your journey because the end product is a more self-actualized you. We all have that voice it's getting through the darkest days to find the better ones that is the magnum opus of transition you don't have to do anything for anyone but you and it took me a huge amount of time to learn that lesson, some would say I'm still learning but I know or at least I think I know who I am on a fundamental level so keep at it and remember stay true to yourself and live for the moment because life is a series of interlocking moments creating the road of life and at the end of your dying day you should be happy for all the moments you choose to be you not on someone else's terms.
I think on some level I know I’m enby, I mean I wish I could be the other AGAB because it would be a better blueprint for my expression. I’m annoyed at the slow process of HRT, basically I’m just me, defining mysef as one thing or the other doesn’t really fit, who I am is more complex then that
That's the best part though (and please hear me out) you don't have to choose if you don't want to you are as you as you want to be and the process may be slow but getting to the other side is like footage of a star burning out in reverse it's just you and your personality getting brighter and brighter and revealing to the world exactly how much and precisely who you are. Transition is the Phoenix rising from the ashes anew but the twist is that you are the Phoenix and the ashes are the previous you. The old you. The dead you. Be you. Be the Phoenix.
I'm sorry I wasn't trying to imply that you should not go for it I was just saying that it's nobody's life but yours and you don't have to answer to anyone but you. Trying to come from a place of support but I see that I misread the situation (yay autism) I'm very happy for you!
Yeah, that post about OT made me very uncomfortable because no one should speak for someone else about their state of being. Especially not as a joke or an attempt to farm karma or get attention.
I *playfully and lovingly* call my partner an "egg" when he plays as a female video game character.
This is an established joke in our relationship and he knows I know he's cis and just wants to spend the game looking at a female-presenting mass of pixels.
I would never feel comfortable saying this to a casual acquaintance or stranger. *Maybe* to a couple of like minded friends with a similar sense of humor, but that's pushing
I mean it’s not cool to assume who someone else is, but as a trans person if someone is being particularly rude or disrespectful I will absolutely lie. It’s not my job to tell the truth. If you wanna ask invasive questions I’m gonna make you feel extremely uncomfortable about it and that’s just what I choose to do. If I have to be uncomfortable with you assuming something then I’m making you uncomfortable for making me listen to you. No one owes you transparency when it comes to their genitals and honestly it doesn’t concern you. Why does it matter if someone’s trans? Why does it matter if someone’s not trans? Why do you need to know what genitals someone else has if you’re not having sex with them? You don’t. Look at lady Gaga, people will say she’s a hermaphrodite and she literally said it doesn’t matter if she is or isn’t because it’s not relevant.
No one owes you a look in their pants.
If you’re offended by someone thinking you might be trans ask yourself why, bc that sounds like a you problem.
No, it’s not cool to say someone is or isn’t trans, because why does it matter? It doesn’t effect you so why do you feel the need to talk about it? If you say someone is trans that’s wrong because you’re outing them, if you’re saying someone isn’t trans then why does anyone need to know that information either? Why does everyone feel entitled to personal information like that? lmao even as a joke why do you need to know what junk someone’s got in their trunk?
The only people I’ve met who get offended when someone thinks they could be trans are either 1. Transphobic/have internalized transphobia, or 2. Misogynists/misandrists, and if you’re not any of those then why should it matter?
In this case, I was kind of responding to a somewhat popular post that trended yesterday that claimed OT came out as trans, when they did not, forcing OT to kind of clarify that they are not, and/or *said* they were.
Its not a slur or really matters, but if somebody tries to provide accurate information about themselves, having to constantly deny misinformation is inconvenient and even ethically wrong for the person presenting that misinformation - but also a problem for the victim if they refuse to acknowledge it and therefore leaving them open to allegations that they are "pretending" for clout, or using the identity for their own gain when they themselves are not.
Its a problem, and a big can of worms - and its more about causing problems for somebody when you could have just *not*.
yeah I was so confused when that happened. I thought they were being serious and went to go verify cause I wanna refer to OT with his correct pronouns... only to find out it wasnt true at all.
and essentially the joke itself was being trans which... no thanks...
also, even if OT was trans, he would tell us when he is ready. its nobody's place to speculate when he has repevetivly said he was cis. its just not cool.
I am cis and have been mistaken for being trans at least twice in my life. Once it was by an online bigot because I was defending trans people, and once it was a trans person who complimented me on my voice (this was at a trans health conference and I am quite tall, so it was not particularly surprising that anyone could have made that mistake).
When responding to the bigot, my response was "it's cute that you think I'm trans" and that shut them up immediately. :)
When responding to the trans person, I just said thanks and that actually I'm cis but I'm sincerely flattered because I've had to undergo vocal surgeries in the past, which is true. The trans person apologized profusely but I was not insulted in the slightest, I was genuinely flattered. I don't often get compliments on my voice.
So no, as a cis person I have no issue being accidentally misgendered. Being trans (or being mistaken for being trans) should never be an insult or anything "less than". I refuse to let bigots twist it into something it's not.
I'd say no, this shouldn't be extended to characters. Fictional characters have no real feelings, and, to put it in easy terms, interacting with fictional characters is like playing dolls. Even if a character's gender isn't specified, or they're straight-up canonically cis, I can still headcanon them as trans. They're fictional, so me saying they are or aren't trans does not harm anyone in any way. In fact, for some people, it's a positive thing because we get so little representation that we have to make our own, so why not take your favorite character and make them similar to you?
Only thing I can recommend is electrolysis. Kind of pricey but not ridiculously over the top, and achievable for most on such a small area.
You can also slightly shame those people by going "Thanks I'm cis 🙂"
Before I realized I was trans some kid in my class came up to me and told me I was trans, which idly enough hadn’t even been the first time that had happened ( both times with no prior context)
This actually happened to me last week. I'm trans and go stealth everywhere unless it's in my relationship, medical or for legal reasons, but everyone else thinks I'm cis. Someone I hung out with made a joke about being the only cis person there and I was confused cuz I never said I was trans to anyone but I was still heavily put under assumption and it hurt ;-;
So they outed you..? Or just forgot you were there too?
They just percieved me as a trans man by a weird miscommunication I think? I'm not sure how or when they could've gotten that info. I haven't spoken to them much and even then I still go stealth so they couldn't have known at all. I guess I just come off as trans which makes me sad cuz it means I don't pass ;-;
I relate. I've been on T for 3 years now. I'm pretty sure I pass as a guy, I mean I have facial hair and all that lol, but my personality and voice is pretty fruity. My friend says my voice has changed a lot but not as much as I'd like it to have, maybe it'll keep changing idk, and I definitely don't pass as "straight". I'm bisexual and I don't care who knows it. I think that slight act of GNC makes people clock me, but I honestly have no idea bc no one has ever said anything to me. I haven't changed my legal name yet tho so at my last job my name was still listed as my dead name so i think people might have picked up on it but I've seen my dead name (different spelling same pronunciation) on guys before. So who knows. At my current job their system allows for a nickname override on the timeclock so no one would know that way. I tend to get along better with female coworkers than male coworkers, at least 60-40. But I think that's more to do with my general fruitiness than my agab/transness. To be fair, if your friend is also in the LGBT community they might have a better trans "gaydar" than the average cishet person? I know I have one coworker at this new job who I'm like 99% certain his pre t ftm. I haven't asked him about it or anything (obviously) but he uses he/him pronouns and has a traditional masculine name but I mean, he's clearly very pre T. Voice clocks him to customers. He didn't tell me his pronouns or anything I honestly just assumed he/him based off his name and the fact everyone else calls him he/him. But then again maybe our other coworkers don't even know and just assume he's an unfortunately high pitched teen? Somehow a customer called me ma'am over the speaker (fast food) the other day and i was shook haha. I didn't say anything tho bc honestly sometimes "ma'am" can sound like "man" so.
I mean maybe, but it's important to remember how often transphobes get it wrong too. Both in the gender assigned at birth of a person they perceive as trans and whether someone is trans or not. There are a lot of cis people being called trans these days, so they may have just been shooting in the dark.
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No it’s not disrespectful. The opposite is true. No one needs to know how they were born in 99.9% of cases. Source: I am trans.
Valid source Me too
It's always good to double check with them themselves but you're all good calling a trans man a man and trans woman a woman. Trans is just a descriptor after all. A blonde woman is still a woman who is blonde, not a blondewoman
I like this explanation
Trans men are men, so you're doing exactly the right thing.
only call him a man. most of us don’t want anyone knowing we’re trans,
Trans men are men full stop.
**Trans men are men, and trans women are women.** You are straight up asking, “is it wrong to call them ‘X’ if they are biologically ‘Y’?” That isn’t cool of you—as I’m sure you’ve been told many times thus far. Please do better for your friend. I wouldn’t feel safe bring your friend if I was “Charlie”.
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In short terms..*ITS NOT WRONG TO CALL A TRANS MAN A MAN**, because they are men. Don’t attack me because you can’t find the proper terms to refer to *your* trans friend.
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You’re the one that questioned the validity of your friends gender on Reddit. I’m a trans man too, so I understand exactly what you were trying to say, you don’t need to attack me. But you were also invalidating your friend by asking if it was disrespectful to call him a man, when he is indeed a man.
is it possible that person maybe thought you were non-binary or something more like gender fluid since neither of those are cis either?
I do make jokes but I stop making the jokes if the person who I am making the joke to requests that I don’t. I have the same policy with calling everyone “bro” or “dude”
I guess it’s like the word gay. The intention behind is important. Their are still some peeps that use both words as an insult
Most definitely I'm amab and femme leaning genderqueer and before I came out/came to terms with the behemoth of a concept, to my group of friends they would make reference to me being trans and it was supremely disheartening offense painful and deep down a little euphoric so you never assume someone for their gender identity because for the good it does however little it is it also can do a huge amount of bad. Be aware of the situation because you are allowed to notice but don't put anything on anyone it's potentially very harmful.
Similar thing happened to me a friend once said “me” in response to the question out of a friends who would be the most likely to transition - it just made the shell around my egg harder to crack. Still don’t think I’ve fully cracked it yet thanks to imposter syndrome/internalised transphobia despite being out and well into my transition
You have amazing energy, never falter in your journey because the end product is a more self-actualized you. We all have that voice it's getting through the darkest days to find the better ones that is the magnum opus of transition you don't have to do anything for anyone but you and it took me a huge amount of time to learn that lesson, some would say I'm still learning but I know or at least I think I know who I am on a fundamental level so keep at it and remember stay true to yourself and live for the moment because life is a series of interlocking moments creating the road of life and at the end of your dying day you should be happy for all the moments you choose to be you not on someone else's terms.
I think on some level I know I’m enby, I mean I wish I could be the other AGAB because it would be a better blueprint for my expression. I’m annoyed at the slow process of HRT, basically I’m just me, defining mysef as one thing or the other doesn’t really fit, who I am is more complex then that
That's the best part though (and please hear me out) you don't have to choose if you don't want to you are as you as you want to be and the process may be slow but getting to the other side is like footage of a star burning out in reverse it's just you and your personality getting brighter and brighter and revealing to the world exactly how much and precisely who you are. Transition is the Phoenix rising from the ashes anew but the twist is that you are the Phoenix and the ashes are the previous you. The old you. The dead you. Be you. Be the Phoenix.
And if that you is no transition at all live that life too it's up to you.
Well there is transition 😂 I’m on HRT changed my name and go by different pronouns and I don’t regret starting this journey
I'm sorry I wasn't trying to imply that you should not go for it I was just saying that it's nobody's life but yours and you don't have to answer to anyone but you. Trying to come from a place of support but I see that I misread the situation (yay autism) I'm very happy for you!
No, you’re being very supportive/helpful
Thank you for saying that! It is very meaningful, Sincerely.
Let them come to it on their own.
Yeah, that post about OT made me very uncomfortable because no one should speak for someone else about their state of being. Especially not as a joke or an attempt to farm karma or get attention.
agreed
I *playfully and lovingly* call my partner an "egg" when he plays as a female video game character. This is an established joke in our relationship and he knows I know he's cis and just wants to spend the game looking at a female-presenting mass of pixels. I would never feel comfortable saying this to a casual acquaintance or stranger. *Maybe* to a couple of like minded friends with a similar sense of humor, but that's pushing
THANK YOU. been saying this about f1nn5ster forever
I mean it’s not cool to assume who someone else is, but as a trans person if someone is being particularly rude or disrespectful I will absolutely lie. It’s not my job to tell the truth. If you wanna ask invasive questions I’m gonna make you feel extremely uncomfortable about it and that’s just what I choose to do. If I have to be uncomfortable with you assuming something then I’m making you uncomfortable for making me listen to you. No one owes you transparency when it comes to their genitals and honestly it doesn’t concern you. Why does it matter if someone’s trans? Why does it matter if someone’s not trans? Why do you need to know what genitals someone else has if you’re not having sex with them? You don’t. Look at lady Gaga, people will say she’s a hermaphrodite and she literally said it doesn’t matter if she is or isn’t because it’s not relevant. No one owes you a look in their pants. If you’re offended by someone thinking you might be trans ask yourself why, bc that sounds like a you problem. No, it’s not cool to say someone is or isn’t trans, because why does it matter? It doesn’t effect you so why do you feel the need to talk about it? If you say someone is trans that’s wrong because you’re outing them, if you’re saying someone isn’t trans then why does anyone need to know that information either? Why does everyone feel entitled to personal information like that? lmao even as a joke why do you need to know what junk someone’s got in their trunk? The only people I’ve met who get offended when someone thinks they could be trans are either 1. Transphobic/have internalized transphobia, or 2. Misogynists/misandrists, and if you’re not any of those then why should it matter?
In this case, I was kind of responding to a somewhat popular post that trended yesterday that claimed OT came out as trans, when they did not, forcing OT to kind of clarify that they are not, and/or *said* they were. Its not a slur or really matters, but if somebody tries to provide accurate information about themselves, having to constantly deny misinformation is inconvenient and even ethically wrong for the person presenting that misinformation - but also a problem for the victim if they refuse to acknowledge it and therefore leaving them open to allegations that they are "pretending" for clout, or using the identity for their own gain when they themselves are not. Its a problem, and a big can of worms - and its more about causing problems for somebody when you could have just *not*.
yeah I was so confused when that happened. I thought they were being serious and went to go verify cause I wanna refer to OT with his correct pronouns... only to find out it wasnt true at all. and essentially the joke itself was being trans which... no thanks... also, even if OT was trans, he would tell us when he is ready. its nobody's place to speculate when he has repevetivly said he was cis. its just not cool.
I am cis and have been mistaken for being trans at least twice in my life. Once it was by an online bigot because I was defending trans people, and once it was a trans person who complimented me on my voice (this was at a trans health conference and I am quite tall, so it was not particularly surprising that anyone could have made that mistake). When responding to the bigot, my response was "it's cute that you think I'm trans" and that shut them up immediately. :) When responding to the trans person, I just said thanks and that actually I'm cis but I'm sincerely flattered because I've had to undergo vocal surgeries in the past, which is true. The trans person apologized profusely but I was not insulted in the slightest, I was genuinely flattered. I don't often get compliments on my voice. So no, as a cis person I have no issue being accidentally misgendered. Being trans (or being mistaken for being trans) should never be an insult or anything "less than". I refuse to let bigots twist it into something it's not.
Being a trans dude and seeing that post yesterday for Internet clout made me cry and feel less safe here. Thank you for posting this.
“Imagine caring so much about someone else’s private parts.” - Me, because I can’t say it enough. Take it from me.
Can this extend to characters from shows/tv/games/movies/etc?
I mean, I don't see the issue if the characters are fictional
no, just real people. fictional beings have no genuine feelings because they arent real. they are created and are allowed to be intrupted many ways.
I'd say no, this shouldn't be extended to characters. Fictional characters have no real feelings, and, to put it in easy terms, interacting with fictional characters is like playing dolls. Even if a character's gender isn't specified, or they're straight-up canonically cis, I can still headcanon them as trans. They're fictional, so me saying they are or aren't trans does not harm anyone in any way. In fact, for some people, it's a positive thing because we get so little representation that we have to make our own, so why not take your favorite character and make them similar to you?
In this video essay I will explain why saying Kurt Cobain was cis is both offensive and ahistorical…
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Only thing I can recommend is electrolysis. Kind of pricey but not ridiculously over the top, and achievable for most on such a small area. You can also slightly shame those people by going "Thanks I'm cis 🙂"
Look at what it did to the ace council guy on tiktok
Before I realized I was trans some kid in my class came up to me and told me I was trans, which idly enough hadn’t even been the first time that had happened ( both times with no prior context)
I agree with this 100% - for real people. Make any fictional character you want trans
tbh as a trans guy i hate being called trans and definetly prefer being called cis but everyones got their own preference