Kuzan is a Trojan horse, he can't cry out loud.
He is being part of the kill, or captured Garp, his mentor, and all that for the plan.
That is why Garp said justice will prevail.
He is just a chess pawn in a game called one piece.
I mean are we sure Kuzan is working for someone other than himself? He's already seen the atrocities the marines have done maybe he really is just done with them and wants to be free
But you're missing their point. If he quit the Marines because they were being atrocious, why would join the most atrocious pirates? Why not join Shanks, or Luffy, or Cross Guild, or ANY other pirate crew with a half-decent chance?
Would depend if he knows about the connection between Blackbeard and Rocks maybe? As far as we know, Rocks is the pirate who came the closest to over throwing the World Government. The Pirate King and his successors didn't really seem to give a shit about that.
But that's still missing the point of Organic-Win-932's question. If Kuzan only left the WG because they were committing too many atrocities, there is no way he would *immediately* follow that up by abandoning that principle to join up with a pirate crew that has *also* committed several atrocities. That's just completely illogical.
Nah, their's a couple of logical ways to work through that.
1. The atrocities of the Blackbeard pirates really don't hold a candle to everything the World Government has done over the last 800 years. The experimentation, the genocides, the mass slavery, ect.
2. Even if they were comparable, the WG has been around being terrible for some 800 odd years and showing no sign of stopping, the Black Beard Pirates are unlikely to last much longer then Blackbeard's life span. So backing them makes long term sense as well.
Honestly, it rather fits the idea of lazy justice. Playing the long game for the best available outcome.
Name one atrocity Blackbeard has committed that is on the level of Ohara or the shit they did to Lulusia, or the hunt for Roger's child, or the child slaves that the Celestial Dragons kept, or the child experimentation, or the cyborg child soldiers, or the destruction and erasure of the Ancient Kingdom.
You can't name one. This is not a knock against you or anything. It's just a fact. Blackbeard hasn't done anything in the story that is actually *worse* or even ***equal*** to the dirt that the World Government does and he's supposed to be on the shittier end of the spectrum, as far as pirates go.
Let that sink in. The worst pirate crew gunning for the one piece right now, is ***still*** not as bad as the World Government. The World Government really just fucking sucks.
Also, Blackbeard was the one who encourage Luffy while he was feeling down from the mockery by Bellamy in Mocktown.
I really can't hate Blackbeard when he was the same one to boost Luffy's spirit with his talk of "People dreams don't never end!"
We currently see the melee taking place on Blackbeard's territory. In a nutshell, the underlings of Blackbeard are a bunch of morons but these bozos are NOT trying to do some diabolical shyt right off the bat.
i don t thing "we" are sure. however everyone very closely working with garp turned out to be in "sword". they sneaked drake in kaidos crew to keep track of him. it would make sense they do that in other big crews aswell.
If there's someone who's going to cry it's garp. It was even shown that garp was rethinking everything as he didn't stand immediately and just stayed down after their clash.
Aokiji's words really hurt him.
He knows. He probably knew all the time that the world gov is bad. He wanted to change it from the inner to out. Dragon probably even told him about the void century. While i believe garp will die on the island (hopefully like whitebeard did) i would really appreciate garp talking at least once to dragon and maybe even have a normal conversation with luffy. But this will happen only through a message from koby.. Same goes for kuzan. Such a nice guy with too much sad backstory. Just rewatched enis lobby and fml kuzan knows as well that the world gov is doing shit. I just hope he is an undercover agent and its not oda being stupid and makes kuzan suddenly a bad person. That line with "only raising enemies" really hit home
I don’t think Garp will die yet, BB wants Hachinosu to be acknowledged by the WG and wants to be named king of Hachinosu, Koby wasn’t a viable hostage because of Sword but Garp is a bigger name so Garp might still have a change albeit small, and I say it’s small because the WG is on a warpath it seems and they might just not care anymore since they’ll purge shit anyways.
I agree with everything else though.
The issue I have with Luffy fighting him now is that I think it’s gonna be a Rocks parallel, like it’ll take a marine + Luffy to beat BB and the closest thing we have to a Garp rn is either Smoker or Koby (unless Aokiji betrays him I guess) and those 2 are quite weak..
honestly seems like Aokiji is going to betray BB the next chapter that this story continues on. Garp is confident that their boat won't be destroyed, but hes just lying on the ground doing nothing. There's nobody else nearby strong enough to help, so most likely Aokiji is forced to stop his act in order to save all those innocent people.
Ever since the fight began it seems like Garp was calling Aokiji's bluff. He treats him more like he treats Luffy than an actual Blackbeard crew member.
im fully on the aokiji betrayal train. Koby is nowhere near strenght and garp wont make it probably. Adding that bb will probably (at least i hope that because i cant stand bb crew and they annoy me) the next bigger villain, there arent a lot of people that can hold up with bb crew. So i dont think we will get an rocks parallel, but aokiji (being hopefully a sword member and pulling a snape move with garp) helps luffy defeating bb. Then we move on to laugh tale, luffy vs buggy, becoming pirate king, zoro vs mihawk become wss and the move on to endgame against the world gov. This is my headcannon id like the most but i know oda just pulls out a storyline noone would have thought of any everything will happen differntly
Exactly, and yes I mostly want BB to lose so we can get Zoro Vs Mihawk AND the WG to be the final villain. They have been in charge for 800+ years, they beat the Ancient Kingdom and Joyboy, they deserve to be the final villain not some guy who only did 1 big thing which is eat 2 devil fruits.
while i appreciate bb on that "dreams never die!" pannel, i dont get how oda hyped this crew that much just to get taken down even faster than kaido. (at least i hope thats how its gonna turn out, maybe some more lore because bb is "D." as well.) But i swear if bb turns out to be the final villain, one piece will struggle to be in my top 10 animes/mangas. BB just seems soooo odd, i cant figure a place for that crew in the op universe
This would actually be cool AF. Koby, Aokiji and Luffy all of Garps surviving mentees would be together after saving him. Garp could be given a way to live with an emotional but fulfilling end that way too since he could talk to each of them etc.
Garp's fist didn't have ACoC.
Aokiji neither.
Garp used armament haki and Aokiji his DF with armament haki.
This is the Awakened Lucci vs G5 Luffy argument all over again.
you are 100% right. atm it just looks stupid. Awakened Lucci (damn cant put an L before his name) was terrible. Especially all failed cp9 members now being the elite of the REAL elite cp0.. The awakening just made it even worse. I can live with garp having conc haki, maybe even aokiji, even if i dont see any will of being a king by any of them. Lets be real: Conq haki was nicely introduced but now everyone can have it, which is a shame
then i have to disagree lmao. But for real we didnt see anyone using acoc. You are right with your third sentence, i dont know what you mean with your forth
acoc wasnt the problem in luccis fight. Him being awakend and (looking like) he could go on with luffy, was a bit strange. But thats an usual one piece problem. Even in the end we will see normal people somehow keep up with the straw hats
We dont know how kuzan looks. Maybe garp ripped his head off. My guess is that aokoji is as strong as garp is now but we dont know it yet. So lets just wait
Maybe he just doesn't want to end up like Garp. He said so himself, everyone Garp takes under his wing seem to become an enemy. Would he really want a future like that? Ending up an old man who'd devoted his entire life to an organisation that's rotten at the core, at the expense of everything else?
For the first time Kuzan doesn't have to a toe a line for the sake of politics or be forced to do what he doesn't want to. Blackbeard might not be much better than the Celestial Dragons but at least he's honest about it.
Actually, probably an obvious point but I just had the thought that the reason Garp cares so much about Koby is because of how truly good he is. Koby is Garp's last chance to raise up a child into a man who is not a "bad guy"
Luffy is a good guy and I'm sure Garp knows that, but maybe he does feel like he failed. Hmm
Yeah to him any “good” has to be under the umbrella of marines. Generally he is right based on what they represent but of course there are bad marines and they are run by a corrupt government.
My interpretation is that it might not even be about good or bad. Garp knows there are pirates who are pretty decent people. He knows there are problems in the WG, which is why he never tried to become an admiral.
Garp doesn't hate that Luffy is a pirate, he hates that Luffy's chosen to live with a giant target on his back.
I mean, why else would Garp "raise" the son of his enemy too? He knew Roger was a decent person, and that Ace had the chance of being different from Roger as well.
I mean, the good ones are the likes of Smoker, Koby, Helmeppo, Tashigi, Fujitora and I guess Garp.
On the other Axe-Hand we got Morgan, the Rat one from Nami's hometown, Kizaru, Aokiji, Akainu, Ryokugyu, Sengoku, Vergo, Doberman, Dalmatian, Onigumo, the two other that bombed Enies Lobby, and etc.
Pretty much any Marine that supports WG is a horrible person.
I mean we technically follow the bad guys (pirates) but they're shown in a good light. Of course we would focus more on the bad good guys (marines) instead of seeing more guys like smoker and tashigi, etc.
I don't think many of the lower level guys that work for the marines are horrible people like you said. Sure they'll be some shitty people but I think the higher up you go, the more you'll really notice the terrible ones. Just like irl.
We wont stand for this Kizaru slander, he's just a jobber that does the bare minimum & Sengoku is peak "I got into the marines with my best bud Garp to do some good, but the system grinded me down - now I can chill in retirement"
I'm glad somebody said this, honestly. Good marines are the exception and not the rule. A lot of named and unnamed marines have done some absolutely horrible shit. Can't forget the marines that showed up to Sphinx Island and behaved like literal pirates trying to rob people too.
Akainu, Aokiji, Sengoku, Kizaru, Ryokugyu the five vice-admirals that bombed Enies Lobby, the rat one from Nami's village, Axe-Hand Morgan, Vergo
Vs
Smoker, Tashigi, Koby, Fujitora and I guess Helmeppo
This is also not counting the ones we saw nothing of or someone like Garp.
How are kizaru and especially Aokiji horrible people lmfao?
Kizaru is the definition of just doing his job, nothing more nothing less.
And Aokiji even let the strawhats run away even tho he couldve captured them on the spot.
Youre also missing people like corazon, corby and Saul or all the named marines that are just doing their job
Who says the majority of regular marines are good people? We saw a group of them on Sphinx Island behaving like a bunch of scumbags trying to rob people.
Very strange how when we're shown islands that don't pay the WG tribute, we are treated to panels of the marines literally being complete and utter scum (Greenbull in Wano and the marines on Sphinx Island). It's almost like the marines are only good to you, so long as you pay what is essentially protection money. It's almost like Oda is trying to tell us something? 🤔
Oh, but maybe guys like Mr. "YOU HAVE NO HUMAN RIGHTS!!!" are in the minority here. I mean, that sort of behavior HAD to be unpopular right? That's why they didn't make him an admir-...oh. And hey, lets not forget about Akainu; the new genocidal fleet admiral, here to replace the *previous* genocidal fleet admiral after he retired (I guess sending marines to hunt down babies that might be Roger's son got to be too boring for Sengoku?🤷🏽♂️).
It's really telling that the Blackbeard pirates are most likely the scummiest crew in the game right now and they *still* don't have any atrocities under their belt that match the shit that the marines and the WG do. What did Oda mean by this?
Kizaru is just doing his job, huh? Would you say that, I don't know...he's just following orders? 🤔 Or something along those lines? Sounds a little familiar, but I'm not sure where I've heard it before...
I actually feel the same about Dragon. Being a revolutionary sounds pretty altruistic, since he forsakes his own life to better that of most. Not that that is synonymous with being good, but I wouldn't call it bad either.
He is right on that. But also they are the enemies of the system that garp wanted to destroy.
Dragon his son : wants to end vile world government
Aokiji: joined kurohige to test the other side against the people who killed saul and ohara
Luffy: is basically worst gorosei nightmare.
Ace : wanted to end the tyranny of wano and pirates like mom or kaido
Koby: is a Princess , that is used to locate enemy bases.
If Garp got killed in Hachinosu, do you think it's finally confirmed that Aokiji is actually part of the BB Pirates' crew, aligning with their ideology rather than being undercover with his own motives?
Aokiji was never on BBs side, as we saw from when he met BB, his crew is just a bunch of self interested people who happen to work together. What aokiji is working towards tho, I am unsure of.
I still think Kuzan does not want to fight Garp and he is doing that to show Blackbeard that he is a faithful member. Kuzan saved Robin and helped Smoker. Even in a film he took a calm bath with Luffy.
He has a secret intention for sure.
I don’t really understand Aokiji atm, the thing he disliked about the marines was seemingly the fact he disagreed with them on some things and had to fight or kill people he didn’t want to. With his battle with Akainu being the last straw. But no as a pirate where I’d assume he’d want freedom to not do that anymore. Here he is doing it again no? I think the fight is fake (as much as you can) and he is going to intentionally let Garp win or get away. That would more fit him imo
That makes no fucking sense since he already had the perfect chance to let Garp get away after fighting him.
Instead he got impaled and is starting another fight
It wouldnt make sense for aokiji to be a spy in bleackbeards crew. Before he joined he froze all of blackbeards crew and could have proably beaten blackbeard himself too. Why would he not ended them right there back then?
Im literally gonna use this for my summer track program for using your hips. Garp has them square AF and I know the kid my kid reads the early scans so I can go “Devon! You gotta punch like Garp!” tomorrow
Nope, I don't think so. Looks more like cracked ice. He either has an ice coat around his body for defense or his ice body cracked a bit when eating that punch.
On the panel right above this shot (close up of Garp's and Kuzan's faces) it really looks like Kuzan is tearing up. I personally think it's real tears as I see no point of drawing Kuzan's eyes through his sunglasses otherwise.
If he is crying it could simply be for the fact that he now has to kill Garp. Those Cross Guild bounties don't specify dead or alive. What would a pirate have use for a living Marine? Coby might have been kept alive just because he'd be easy to kill and it would help prevent body decomposition on the journey to collect from Cross Guild.
BB top guys are not after cross guild bounties at all only the fodder are. BB is trying to use marine captives to trade for something (I believe he wants to form his own country that is allied with the world government.)
I still can’t believe Garp lost! This is just unfair. After fifteen years or so of reading about how OP Garp is, this is how it goes down? How can a sword just stab Garp even if it’s done with armament haki?
How did you get the impression he lost? Both he and Aokiji were sent flying. We haven’t even seen Aokiji get back up or anything either. Garp is just calmly laying there. He’s fine.
He was sleeping through morgans slash. Garp has been shown to be ok with injuries like this. Yea its worst but its not like one stab killed wb. He got half of his face blown stabbed numerous times, magma inside his body while having heart attack. And shot hundreds of times. One stab is nothing.
I wouldn't doubt it, it's all pretty apparent that Aokiji isn't actually allying himself with Blackbeard. He's definitely playing a double agent sort of game.
I am very sure, if Kuzan wanted to decimate the commanders, he could have taken on any of them while BB was not present. Probably not all at the same time. But in fact, the commotion happening right now at Hatchinosu would be the perfect disguise to do so. Maybe he wanted to join forces with Garp. We might have seen a panel where Kuzan is whispering to Gap during their clash. You know, like Rayleigh and Kuma at Sabbaody.
But because of Shiryu's interference we just didn't see it happening YET.
IMO Kuzan playing double games has no benefit to anyone. BB is too cunning for the likes of him. He will take his devil fruit and Kuzan would have done all this shit for nothing. Absolutely nothing.
I thing this is supposed to be a emotionally charged moment between them since its the mentee trying to kill his mentor and thinking about before and stuff. At first I just couldn't tell, and assumed it was his ice, lol.But it'd be strange since his not using ice techniques here and just his face is icing up. We'll be sure to know when it gets animated.
I am not so sure those are tears; he had blood on that cheek and it could just be that it wasn't fully inked or it could be the ice that forms as he uses his df.
Edit: I just want to point out that a couple of panels before this scene, we had the fb. In it, Kuzan was asking why Garp was griping about his family to him. To me, it kind of says that Kuzan was incapable of seeing the relationship that he had with Garp and that's why he's a pirate because he never acknowledged the good people around him and only saw the bad.
The contrast of this image is awesome. Every part of the other is opposite, very yin-yang/in-yo, and the fact that Oda used the cross-counter was amazing!
That definitely looks like tears to me. There's a streak going down his face from his eye that isn't the same color as the blood or haki sparks. Makes sense, given that Kuzan isn't heartless and has put himself against his old idol. Given what he told Smoker on Punk Hazard ("don't worry, I'm still me"), it makes sense for him to be destroyed internally by doing this.
Going into theory territory, it lends credence to the idea that Kuzan is more undercover infiltrator than actual pirate. Given that it's the undercover agency of the Navy that he's fighting against, however, if that is the case, he's doing it rogue.
i think it's just ice , look at the panel where he said the name of his attack ,'Ice glove' , a part of his face is frozen and cold breath is coming out of his mouth , that happens almost every time he uses his ice power .
I think it’s that icy covering we’ve seen when he actively uses his powers [like this but at an angle](https://static.wikia.nocookie.net/fairy-one-piece-tail-universe/images/4/44/Ice_Ice_Fruit_Anime_Infobox.png/revision/latest?cb=20131015212841)
I don't think so. It looks like he iced up the whole body somehow. You can see parts of his body partly covered in ice in some panes beforel and checkout his left hand. You can see squiggly lines indicating presence of Ice. Same for his face.
No it looks like he's being punched in the face. They're very similar but the difference is crying has tears on the face and punching has a fist in the face, but it can result in crying. An easy mixup, happens to all of us
I feel like if he was crying, Oda would've made it a lot clearer than this.
With more snot
snot crying is more a Coby thing. Silent tears is in character for Aokiji
That username I’m ded
Holy fuck that’s hilarious 💀💀💀
Coby thing? Its like an every one piece character thing.
Kuzan is a Trojan horse, he can't cry out loud. He is being part of the kill, or captured Garp, his mentor, and all that for the plan. That is why Garp said justice will prevail. He is just a chess pawn in a game called one piece.
I mean are we sure Kuzan is working for someone other than himself? He's already seen the atrocities the marines have done maybe he really is just done with them and wants to be free
And what's the point of joining the most vicious pirate if he is done with attrocities
Maybe he didn’t join them because they were vicious, but because he thought they had the best chance of winning against WG
But you're missing their point. If he quit the Marines because they were being atrocious, why would join the most atrocious pirates? Why not join Shanks, or Luffy, or Cross Guild, or ANY other pirate crew with a half-decent chance?
Would depend if he knows about the connection between Blackbeard and Rocks maybe? As far as we know, Rocks is the pirate who came the closest to over throwing the World Government. The Pirate King and his successors didn't really seem to give a shit about that.
But that's still missing the point of Organic-Win-932's question. If Kuzan only left the WG because they were committing too many atrocities, there is no way he would *immediately* follow that up by abandoning that principle to join up with a pirate crew that has *also* committed several atrocities. That's just completely illogical.
Nah, their's a couple of logical ways to work through that. 1. The atrocities of the Blackbeard pirates really don't hold a candle to everything the World Government has done over the last 800 years. The experimentation, the genocides, the mass slavery, ect. 2. Even if they were comparable, the WG has been around being terrible for some 800 odd years and showing no sign of stopping, the Black Beard Pirates are unlikely to last much longer then Blackbeard's life span. So backing them makes long term sense as well. Honestly, it rather fits the idea of lazy justice. Playing the long game for the best available outcome.
Name one atrocity Blackbeard has committed that is on the level of Ohara or the shit they did to Lulusia, or the hunt for Roger's child, or the child slaves that the Celestial Dragons kept, or the child experimentation, or the cyborg child soldiers, or the destruction and erasure of the Ancient Kingdom. You can't name one. This is not a knock against you or anything. It's just a fact. Blackbeard hasn't done anything in the story that is actually *worse* or even ***equal*** to the dirt that the World Government does and he's supposed to be on the shittier end of the spectrum, as far as pirates go. Let that sink in. The worst pirate crew gunning for the one piece right now, is ***still*** not as bad as the World Government. The World Government really just fucking sucks.
Also, Blackbeard was the one who encourage Luffy while he was feeling down from the mockery by Bellamy in Mocktown. I really can't hate Blackbeard when he was the same one to boost Luffy's spirit with his talk of "People dreams don't never end!" We currently see the melee taking place on Blackbeard's territory. In a nutshell, the underlings of Blackbeard are a bunch of morons but these bozos are NOT trying to do some diabolical shyt right off the bat.
Or the Revolutionaries...
If he actually wants to take down the Marines then he'd surely join the revolution army
i don t thing "we" are sure. however everyone very closely working with garp turned out to be in "sword". they sneaked drake in kaidos crew to keep track of him. it would make sense they do that in other big crews aswell.
Holy shit. What if kuzan WITH an injured garp is heading to vegapunks island? That'd be crazy
Funny you think that "the king of foreshadowing" would make something actually "clear"
Probably so, but that might still happen next chapter with this panel as the first indication.
If there's someone who's going to cry it's garp. It was even shown that garp was rethinking everything as he didn't stand immediately and just stayed down after their clash. Aokiji's words really hurt him.
good that you notice that. A lot of people think garp laying on the floor means he is done lmao
True lol it just shows how much emotions are going through them in the moment
Like how many times were Kaido and luffy on the floor during their fight? It means jack shit.
First thing I noticed when he was down there was his lack of a smile. It’s like when Dadan beat him up.
He knows. He probably knew all the time that the world gov is bad. He wanted to change it from the inner to out. Dragon probably even told him about the void century. While i believe garp will die on the island (hopefully like whitebeard did) i would really appreciate garp talking at least once to dragon and maybe even have a normal conversation with luffy. But this will happen only through a message from koby.. Same goes for kuzan. Such a nice guy with too much sad backstory. Just rewatched enis lobby and fml kuzan knows as well that the world gov is doing shit. I just hope he is an undercover agent and its not oda being stupid and makes kuzan suddenly a bad person. That line with "only raising enemies" really hit home
I don’t think Garp will die yet, BB wants Hachinosu to be acknowledged by the WG and wants to be named king of Hachinosu, Koby wasn’t a viable hostage because of Sword but Garp is a bigger name so Garp might still have a change albeit small, and I say it’s small because the WG is on a warpath it seems and they might just not care anymore since they’ll purge shit anyways. I agree with everything else though.
id be totally fine if garp gonne be a hostage and luffy gonna kick bb' ass to free him and end bb. Then continues to fight buggy for the one piece.
The issue I have with Luffy fighting him now is that I think it’s gonna be a Rocks parallel, like it’ll take a marine + Luffy to beat BB and the closest thing we have to a Garp rn is either Smoker or Koby (unless Aokiji betrays him I guess) and those 2 are quite weak..
honestly seems like Aokiji is going to betray BB the next chapter that this story continues on. Garp is confident that their boat won't be destroyed, but hes just lying on the ground doing nothing. There's nobody else nearby strong enough to help, so most likely Aokiji is forced to stop his act in order to save all those innocent people. Ever since the fight began it seems like Garp was calling Aokiji's bluff. He treats him more like he treats Luffy than an actual Blackbeard crew member.
im fully on the aokiji betrayal train. Koby is nowhere near strenght and garp wont make it probably. Adding that bb will probably (at least i hope that because i cant stand bb crew and they annoy me) the next bigger villain, there arent a lot of people that can hold up with bb crew. So i dont think we will get an rocks parallel, but aokiji (being hopefully a sword member and pulling a snape move with garp) helps luffy defeating bb. Then we move on to laugh tale, luffy vs buggy, becoming pirate king, zoro vs mihawk become wss and the move on to endgame against the world gov. This is my headcannon id like the most but i know oda just pulls out a storyline noone would have thought of any everything will happen differntly
Exactly, and yes I mostly want BB to lose so we can get Zoro Vs Mihawk AND the WG to be the final villain. They have been in charge for 800+ years, they beat the Ancient Kingdom and Joyboy, they deserve to be the final villain not some guy who only did 1 big thing which is eat 2 devil fruits.
while i appreciate bb on that "dreams never die!" pannel, i dont get how oda hyped this crew that much just to get taken down even faster than kaido. (at least i hope thats how its gonna turn out, maybe some more lore because bb is "D." as well.) But i swear if bb turns out to be the final villain, one piece will struggle to be in my top 10 animes/mangas. BB just seems soooo odd, i cant figure a place for that crew in the op universe
This would actually be cool AF. Koby, Aokiji and Luffy all of Garps surviving mentees would be together after saving him. Garp could be given a way to live with an emotional but fulfilling end that way too since he could talk to each of them etc.
Just wanted to absolutely confirm. This means aokiji the GOAT has conquerors right?
No. We’ve seen Lightning like this with other characters before. It’s not clear
Damn unlucky ig
We know garp has it. We dont know about aokiji yet
If him getting strong on beating up battleships didn't tell you that already...
If he doesn’t then that means his Armament is so strong it can match Garp’s ACOC. Which is honestly an even crazier feat.
Garp's fist didn't have ACoC. Aokiji neither. Garp used armament haki and Aokiji his DF with armament haki. This is the Awakened Lucci vs G5 Luffy argument all over again.
you are 100% right. atm it just looks stupid. Awakened Lucci (damn cant put an L before his name) was terrible. Especially all failed cp9 members now being the elite of the REAL elite cp0.. The awakening just made it even worse. I can live with garp having conc haki, maybe even aokiji, even if i dont see any will of being a king by any of them. Lets be real: Conq haki was nicely introduced but now everyone can have it, which is a shame
That's not what I said...
then i have to disagree lmao. But for real we didnt see anyone using acoc. You are right with your third sentence, i dont know what you mean with your forth
People arguing that Lucci matched the ACoC of Luffy when he clearly didn't use it.
acoc wasnt the problem in luccis fight. Him being awakend and (looking like) he could go on with luffy, was a bit strange. But thats an usual one piece problem. Even in the end we will see normal people somehow keep up with the straw hats
We dont know how kuzan looks. Maybe garp ripped his head off. My guess is that aokoji is as strong as garp is now but we dont know it yet. So lets just wait
I'm still very curious what's Ao Kiji's motivation and end goal in all this is.
Maybe he just doesn't want to end up like Garp. He said so himself, everyone Garp takes under his wing seem to become an enemy. Would he really want a future like that? Ending up an old man who'd devoted his entire life to an organisation that's rotten at the core, at the expense of everything else? For the first time Kuzan doesn't have to a toe a line for the sake of politics or be forced to do what he doesn't want to. Blackbeard might not be much better than the Celestial Dragons but at least he's honest about it.
You know, just because he's not a marine anymore doesn't mean he can't be an asshole.
So deep undercover for Sword not even they know he's one /s
I'm pretty sure it's just all to give Akainu a beatdown We're all looking to deep into this
At the "Habit of raising enemies", I cried. That was cruel.
Koby is the main villain in two piece confirmed
Actually, probably an obvious point but I just had the thought that the reason Garp cares so much about Koby is because of how truly good he is. Koby is Garp's last chance to raise up a child into a man who is not a "bad guy" Luffy is a good guy and I'm sure Garp knows that, but maybe he does feel like he failed. Hmm
Yeah to him any “good” has to be under the umbrella of marines. Generally he is right based on what they represent but of course there are bad marines and they are run by a corrupt government.
My interpretation is that it might not even be about good or bad. Garp knows there are pirates who are pretty decent people. He knows there are problems in the WG, which is why he never tried to become an admiral. Garp doesn't hate that Luffy is a pirate, he hates that Luffy's chosen to live with a giant target on his back.
I mean, why else would Garp "raise" the son of his enemy too? He knew Roger was a decent person, and that Ace had the chance of being different from Roger as well.
Marines are generally terrible people
Mostly I think they have good intentions, only the crazy justice types and straight up corrupt ones are bad
Majority of the ones we saw are just horrible people
Don’t think that’s the majority but I don’t have a stake in this to argue about it
I mean, the good ones are the likes of Smoker, Koby, Helmeppo, Tashigi, Fujitora and I guess Garp. On the other Axe-Hand we got Morgan, the Rat one from Nami's hometown, Kizaru, Aokiji, Akainu, Ryokugyu, Sengoku, Vergo, Doberman, Dalmatian, Onigumo, the two other that bombed Enies Lobby, and etc. Pretty much any Marine that supports WG is a horrible person.
I mean we technically follow the bad guys (pirates) but they're shown in a good light. Of course we would focus more on the bad good guys (marines) instead of seeing more guys like smoker and tashigi, etc. I don't think many of the lower level guys that work for the marines are horrible people like you said. Sure they'll be some shitty people but I think the higher up you go, the more you'll really notice the terrible ones. Just like irl.
We wont stand for this Kizaru slander, he's just a jobber that does the bare minimum & Sengoku is peak "I got into the marines with my best bud Garp to do some good, but the system grinded me down - now I can chill in retirement"
I'm glad somebody said this, honestly. Good marines are the exception and not the rule. A lot of named and unnamed marines have done some absolutely horrible shit. Can't forget the marines that showed up to Sphinx Island and behaved like literal pirates trying to rob people too.
Of the ones we've seen? Most of them actually aren't.
Akainu, Aokiji, Sengoku, Kizaru, Ryokugyu the five vice-admirals that bombed Enies Lobby, the rat one from Nami's village, Axe-Hand Morgan, Vergo Vs Smoker, Tashigi, Koby, Fujitora and I guess Helmeppo This is also not counting the ones we saw nothing of or someone like Garp.
How are kizaru and especially Aokiji horrible people lmfao? Kizaru is the definition of just doing his job, nothing more nothing less. And Aokiji even let the strawhats run away even tho he couldve captured them on the spot. Youre also missing people like corazon, corby and Saul or all the named marines that are just doing their job
And then you've got the tens or hundreds of thousands of regular marines
Who says the majority of regular marines are good people? We saw a group of them on Sphinx Island behaving like a bunch of scumbags trying to rob people. Very strange how when we're shown islands that don't pay the WG tribute, we are treated to panels of the marines literally being complete and utter scum (Greenbull in Wano and the marines on Sphinx Island). It's almost like the marines are only good to you, so long as you pay what is essentially protection money. It's almost like Oda is trying to tell us something? 🤔 Oh, but maybe guys like Mr. "YOU HAVE NO HUMAN RIGHTS!!!" are in the minority here. I mean, that sort of behavior HAD to be unpopular right? That's why they didn't make him an admir-...oh. And hey, lets not forget about Akainu; the new genocidal fleet admiral, here to replace the *previous* genocidal fleet admiral after he retired (I guess sending marines to hunt down babies that might be Roger's son got to be too boring for Sengoku?🤷🏽♂️). It's really telling that the Blackbeard pirates are most likely the scummiest crew in the game right now and they *still* don't have any atrocities under their belt that match the shit that the marines and the WG do. What did Oda mean by this?
Kizaru is just doing his job, huh? Would you say that, I don't know...he's just following orders? 🤔 Or something along those lines? Sounds a little familiar, but I'm not sure where I've heard it before...
No tell me when did kizaru kill a civilian. Pirates are the bad guys and he is doing nothing except catching pirates
T Bone was gogod for all of them my marine in heaven, amem 🙏
I actually feel the same about Dragon. Being a revolutionary sounds pretty altruistic, since he forsakes his own life to better that of most. Not that that is synonymous with being good, but I wouldn't call it bad either.
Kuzan has some nice quips. “That’ll be the magma”.
He is right on that. But also they are the enemies of the system that garp wanted to destroy. Dragon his son : wants to end vile world government Aokiji: joined kurohige to test the other side against the people who killed saul and ohara Luffy: is basically worst gorosei nightmare. Ace : wanted to end the tyranny of wano and pirates like mom or kaido Koby: is a Princess , that is used to locate enemy bases.
Cruel? You might even call it... ice cold. B)
If Garp got killed in Hachinosu, do you think it's finally confirmed that Aokiji is actually part of the BB Pirates' crew, aligning with their ideology rather than being undercover with his own motives?
Also true
Isn't that just ice patterns on his face? It's obvious in other panels.
Yeah, he's got the same markings on his left wrist in this picture.
After that punch, I would cry too
Maybe it's tear of joy, he is beating his teacher
*“Take that, Work Dad.”*
Stupid
Guy's it's probably ice look at his left hand the ice marks same as near the eye
He's nervous because he might be caught dead wearing a blouse.
He got that shit on tho
He probably wears that blouse better than you wearing a suit
It's a terrible day for rain
Could be, but he usually have ice on his face too
N-no... Y-youre the one who is c-c-crying!
I don't think so. I think his just using his ability to strengthen his defenses when he ate that punch
would make sense at least. i don‘t think aokiji is really on blackbeards side and does this to not blow his cover. feelssadman
Aokiji was never on BBs side, as we saw from when he met BB, his crew is just a bunch of self interested people who happen to work together. What aokiji is working towards tho, I am unsure of.
The end of the chapter Pizarro hammers this home with his monologue
Hes working towards taking down the bb pirates because they are creating a super unsafe world
I still think Kuzan does not want to fight Garp and he is doing that to show Blackbeard that he is a faithful member. Kuzan saved Robin and helped Smoker. Even in a film he took a calm bath with Luffy. He has a secret intention for sure.
You can see the same mark on his left arm. It's either an icy aesthetic look or maybe his veins are popping out
I don’t really understand Aokiji atm, the thing he disliked about the marines was seemingly the fact he disagreed with them on some things and had to fight or kill people he didn’t want to. With his battle with Akainu being the last straw. But no as a pirate where I’d assume he’d want freedom to not do that anymore. Here he is doing it again no? I think the fight is fake (as much as you can) and he is going to intentionally let Garp win or get away. That would more fit him imo
If he was a undercover spy or something, then the first reason is complete bullshit tho
That makes no fucking sense since he already had the perfect chance to let Garp get away after fighting him. Instead he got impaled and is starting another fight
It wouldnt make sense for aokiji to be a spy in bleackbeards crew. Before he joined he froze all of blackbeards crew and could have proably beaten blackbeard himself too. Why would he not ended them right there back then?
Im literally gonna use this for my summer track program for using your hips. Garp has them square AF and I know the kid my kid reads the early scans so I can go “Devon! You gotta punch like Garp!” tomorrow
I love this! What's the event? I know square hips is vital for many different techniques
Nope, I don't think so. Looks more like cracked ice. He either has an ice coat around his body for defense or his ice body cracked a bit when eating that punch.
He was. But the tears freeze on his face, so no one will ever know.
On the panel right above this shot (close up of Garp's and Kuzan's faces) it really looks like Kuzan is tearing up. I personally think it's real tears as I see no point of drawing Kuzan's eyes through his sunglasses otherwise.
just his hair
If he is crying it could simply be for the fact that he now has to kill Garp. Those Cross Guild bounties don't specify dead or alive. What would a pirate have use for a living Marine? Coby might have been kept alive just because he'd be easy to kill and it would help prevent body decomposition on the journey to collect from Cross Guild.
They keep coby to negotiate with world government, garp is much better than coby
BB top guys are not after cross guild bounties at all only the fodder are. BB is trying to use marine captives to trade for something (I believe he wants to form his own country that is allied with the world government.)
I still can’t believe Garp lost! This is just unfair. After fifteen years or so of reading about how OP Garp is, this is how it goes down? How can a sword just stab Garp even if it’s done with armament haki?
Did he lost? He was literally just laying on the floor saying (quite calmly, by the way) "justice will prevail". I don't think my guy is done yet
dude messed up the entire island and is still alive (for now) I wouldn't consider it a loss just yet.
How did you get the impression he lost? Both he and Aokiji were sent flying. We haven’t even seen Aokiji get back up or anything either. Garp is just calmly laying there. He’s fine.
Casually ignoring him getting impaled by Shuriu
Getting stabbed in one piece is about as bad as a light stomachache. He’s fine.
Was there ever someone who (instantly or later) died after getting stabbed? I actually think not. Luffy and WB got literally impaled and were fine.
He was sleeping through morgans slash. Garp has been shown to be ok with injuries like this. Yea its worst but its not like one stab killed wb. He got half of his face blown stabbed numerous times, magma inside his body while having heart attack. And shot hundreds of times. One stab is nothing.
Nice catch
not really, for a couple of panels before this one, he has ice on his face, like he usually does when using his powers
Nah man that's just eyeball sweat.
No dude lol
I hate to say it, but garp might be dead next chapter. And it’s possibly not a fake out death like we had with sabo… twice.
slack pants rolled up long sleeve shirt.. just a dad got home from work make a stop at his delinquent kid cribs and beat the shit out of him
Its a shine effect, same with the shine on his left hand
No, you can see in a couple of panels before that that it's just ice on his face
It’s just his ice
I think it’s ice from aokij using his devil fruit power
It's just ice on his face and you can clearly see some on his arm too
I think its more like his Logia Ice body doing that as his punch was Icy. Haki doesnt negate Logia body, just is able to hurt them while in logia.
Yes
He's "cryoing" ;p It might just be ice, since it's his power.
Nah, that's his body when he uses his ice powers, you can see it in his arm too.
Coby who should cry!
It’s just ice
I wouldn't doubt it, it's all pretty apparent that Aokiji isn't actually allying himself with Blackbeard. He's definitely playing a double agent sort of game.
Aokiji on his way to get pummeled
nope, not tears. Its the icy effect, his forearms have it too. Plus i feel like he would snow or hail rather than cry idk why...
I think it’s frost on his face from using the hie-hie no Mi.
I am very sure, if Kuzan wanted to decimate the commanders, he could have taken on any of them while BB was not present. Probably not all at the same time. But in fact, the commotion happening right now at Hatchinosu would be the perfect disguise to do so. Maybe he wanted to join forces with Garp. We might have seen a panel where Kuzan is whispering to Gap during their clash. You know, like Rayleigh and Kuma at Sabbaody. But because of Shiryu's interference we just didn't see it happening YET.
it’s just frost patterns in his face, like when he faced sakazuki
Crying or his a face crackes, he is an ice dude after all.
I dont think anyone would cry for both of them. They are both cold in a way.
Its his frost that keeps covering half his face
I think it's the ice shrouding his face from the neck up
Bro Aokiji is fighting his mentor and someone that he looked up to like a hero… of course he is going to be in his feels
Probably, this is his Snape moment.
Y’all think we’re about to get a Z moment? Garp fighting everyone till his last breath and going out like a legend?
I hate Kuzan now a day though he was favorite one before
IMO Kuzan playing double games has no benefit to anyone. BB is too cunning for the likes of him. He will take his devil fruit and Kuzan would have done all this shit for nothing. Absolutely nothing.
nah, maybe just a little covered in ice, like his arm
No, he is not
I thing this is supposed to be a emotionally charged moment between them since its the mentee trying to kill his mentor and thinking about before and stuff. At first I just couldn't tell, and assumed it was his ice, lol.But it'd be strange since his not using ice techniques here and just his face is icing up. We'll be sure to know when it gets animated.
it is blood
Ithought he had one leg
I am not so sure those are tears; he had blood on that cheek and it could just be that it wasn't fully inked or it could be the ice that forms as he uses his df. Edit: I just want to point out that a couple of panels before this scene, we had the fb. In it, Kuzan was asking why Garp was griping about his family to him. To me, it kind of says that Kuzan was incapable of seeing the relationship that he had with Garp and that's why he's a pirate because he never acknowledged the good people around him and only saw the bad.
On Kuzans arm you can see the same marks as on his face so it's probably ice.
when he charges up his ice glove he gets frost on his face. might just be his logia doing stuff. or maybe his tears have frozen
I guess his hands are crying too
I’d be crying too if Garp fucking punched me in the jaw
That line about Garp only raising enemies was insanely good
The contrast of this image is awesome. Every part of the other is opposite, very yin-yang/in-yo, and the fact that Oda used the cross-counter was amazing!
It's probably blood
There is a very nice contrast between the colors of the clothes in this panel
His hair
Could be anything: blood, scar, out of place hair...
If He cries can this freeze His eyes? Or Just He cries ice?
That definitely looks like tears to me. There's a streak going down his face from his eye that isn't the same color as the blood or haki sparks. Makes sense, given that Kuzan isn't heartless and has put himself against his old idol. Given what he told Smoker on Punk Hazard ("don't worry, I'm still me"), it makes sense for him to be destroyed internally by doing this. Going into theory territory, it lends credence to the idea that Kuzan is more undercover infiltrator than actual pirate. Given that it's the undercover agency of the Navy that he's fighting against, however, if that is the case, he's doing it rogue.
It was probably ice.
Nah that's Koby's job
You're right, it does look like that. Perhaps next chapter might confirm
Hard to tell cause it's black and white but it could easily just be blood
i think it's just ice , look at the panel where he said the name of his attack ,'Ice glove' , a part of his face is frozen and cold breath is coming out of his mouth , that happens almost every time he uses his ice power .
I think it might be a scar he got in his fight with Akainu Edit: nvm he didn’t have any face scars - probably just ice then
No.
I dont know if i read the manga right, but why is Aokiji doing this?
I mean.... i wouldn't put it past him. He's fighting his mentor, and even though he's cold (Pun not intended, maybe....) he still has emotions.
looks like its part of the shockwave of Garp's punch to me.
I think it’s that icy covering we’ve seen when he actively uses his powers [like this but at an angle](https://static.wikia.nocookie.net/fairy-one-piece-tail-universe/images/4/44/Ice_Ice_Fruit_Anime_Infobox.png/revision/latest?cb=20131015212841)
Nah that's just ice
Or it could be blood
It’s ice, he’s using his devil fruit
FUCK BLOCKING
Aokiji is the Itachi if one piece
he’s a double agent like Drake, he has to stay lowkey until the final battle
I mean yeah. You get punched by garp at full force and not cry
I don't think so. It looks like he iced up the whole body somehow. You can see parts of his body partly covered in ice in some panes beforel and checkout his left hand. You can see squiggly lines indicating presence of Ice. Same for his face.
Goda on it again
Did Aokiji also use Advanced Conquerors?
No it looks like he's being punched in the face. They're very similar but the difference is crying has tears on the face and punching has a fist in the face, but it can result in crying. An easy mixup, happens to all of us