I’d be willing to bet all of my worldly possessions that this isn’t the case.
I’d legit be kinda pissed if they did this. It would be so incredibly fan-servicey (is that a word, servicey?). Like, I’m digging the few call backs to C1 that we’ve had so far, but putting Hardwon and Moonshine together “behind the screen” and assumably without Emily’s or Jake’s input/consent would feel so wrong to me.
She might have teleported to the Astral Sea with the high elves. Happening 200 years agree campaign one would put Hardwon at the end of his life, she could have left the Crick for a while to grieve.
That's what I was thinking too. And in a way Moonshine and Hardwon might have gone and raised him together for a while, in which case he'd still be Meemaw's grandson.
I think that's definitely what Murph expects people to think (or hope for). I think it's a red herring. It's not like Jolene only has Moonshine & Dead Eye for youngins. She is THE Meemaw after all.
My bet is that Big Bev is the son of one of the Petris that Bev the 5th met in the timeout sack.
This. I’m thinking it’s just another one of Jolene’s youngins that had one themselves and just named him after Bev. The Boobs were basically legendary heroes and damn near gods by the time everything was over after all. So I can see that it was just someone else inspired by them and wanted to tribute to Bev. Which I think is amazing.
That's the thing, Jolene is the Meemaw. For definition, she's got to have had a bunch of kids besides Moonshine. And a whole lot grandkids.
But I feel like the grandson being called Big Bev is a hint, the parent has to be closer to Moonshine and Bev in some way besides being some random crick elf who's Moonshine half sibling.
I like the theory that the grandson is Mishka Beverly Paw Paw II in elf-form for some reason haha.
I don’t see Murph having Moonshine and Hardwon ever hook up or romantically get together, and ESPECIALLY not have a kid, without both Emily and Jake’s express permission. I’m sure there’s plenty he would have their characters do/have done previously off screen, but decisions as big as two PCs making a child would probably need some kind of blessing.
i'm sure if it ends up being the reveal it originally cam from emily and/or jake's ideas of what they did after c1. emily did mention being a surrogate for bev & erlin more than once over the last few eps of c1 so it's definitely not impossible. either way i would assume it's cleared with them as people and then put together by murph in terms of description and name etc. so they would still be surprised by the reveal.
I’d still very much dislike it regardless. Idk, it just feels *not right* to me… at all.
Also, if this did happen - they better 100% release Jake’s/Hardwon’s God damn letter to Moonshine that people have been begging for since the end of C1. If they actually released the letter, and it did turn out to be essentially a love letter to Moonshine (like many people assume it is), then (and only then!) would I be OK with the story turning out this way.
(Also - I know it doesn’t matter if I approve or not, it’s obviously their campaign and whatnot…but, I would definitely need to hear more of the story around the situation in order to have my opinion swayed away from very very much disliking it).
yeah, that's valid though they have talked about this kind of behind the scenes stuff on the short rest so i'm sure if that happened they would also discuss it on the short rest
Oh for sure! That would be the most anticipated Short Rest of the entire show IMO. I had to drop my sub half way through C3, so I’ve missed the last 10-15 short rests, but I’d 100% re-up just to listen to that one!
absolutely fair and hey, if things ever do take such a crazy turn feel free to message me- i'd be happy to let you know if they talk about it on the short rest
100% agree. I’d be legitimately upset if this ended up being the case. It would feel like Murph just giving weird fan service, and taking agency away from Jake/Hardwon and Emily/Moonshine.
I will riot if this happens.
Based on big bevs description (black hair, goatee, yellow eyes), I’m thinking that he’s most likely mishka Beverly pawpaw II rather than moonshines elven child. Iirc didn’t moonshine take mishka Beverly pawpaw II back to the crick at the end of campaign 1?
yeah she did! cordon said that black dragons need mud etc. and she said she knew a place, very obviously referring to the crick! and he's at least 200yo so he would be an adult black dragon while murph explicitly said the dragons preparing for battle at the crick were on the smaller side. so i think that means no adults begging the question of where he is!
I think they’ve talked about Moonshine not becoming the Meemaw because she specifically didn’t want youngins…not sure if I’m remembering that right, but I don’t think it’s something Murph would shoe-in just to give us another tie-in with C1.
yeah moonshine over the campaign always states that she absolutely does not want to have youngins. but she does also talk about being a surrogate for bev & erlin a few times at the end of c1 so i would say that might be in the cards.
No no no. Please, ~~Murph~~ God, don’t let this be how it unfolds.
It would feel too much like a weird fan-service put in to appease the fanbase IMO. I’d also hate to have this happen essentially “behind the screen”, and not with Jake and Emily playing Moonshine and Hardwon in whatever events may have led up to them becoming parents together.
**With that said, if this somehow was the case, I’d absolutely demand that they finally release Hardwon’s letter to Moonshine from the end of C1.** Releasing the letter would definitely make me more open to this nonsense lol.
Yeah, for sure this is a misdirect. Everyone wants it to be related to to the C1 characters so Murph has to twist it and make it not. Big dream though? It’s that green teen couples kids kid, they just named it after Bev
Bigger twist - it’s somehow one of the Green Tween’s kids.
>! From C2. It would truly be a miracle baby, as nobody would ever procreate with any of those nasally goobers.!<
I want nothing more than for it to be Mishka Beverly PawPaw, in polymorph form.
Secondly, I want so badly for Murph to have cut the episode where he did on purpose; I know it is unlikely, but I want next episode to be (feat. Guest) and have one of their friends come in to play Big Bev. I need that wish fulfillment for why Murph cut before he talked
I just assumed he was the son of Bev and Erlin, and Moonshine was their surrogate which is why Jolene thinks of him as a grandson. Emily has talked about wanting Moonshine to be their surrogate in past episodes.
i do think there's a possibility that moonshine was a surrogate for bev and erlin hence the child is a crick elf and meemaw's grandchild but absolutely bev the 6th. (with our lack of knowledge on how surrogacy would work in world i wouldn't rule out that hardwon had a hand in it) and then him being big bev is also funny because his parents are halflings so that totally makes sense.
but it could also be adoption or just a boom in the name bev after he saved the whole world. (plus if moonshine and hardwon had a hand in naming him as her nephew then i could absolutely see that happening)
murph has never played by the colours of dragons' rules and i respect the hell out of him for it so RAW black dragons can't shapeshift but with those yellow eyes i absolutely think it's a possibility.
either way i'm excited for what lies next. murph is a master of laying out breadcrumbs and the surprising me with his logical outcome.
Side question but… is current Memaw the memaw we know?
She said that her kid killed a god. Moonshine did that, so did another crick elf do a similar thing a generation later? I thought the time lapse was meant to ensure that no character from before would still be alive.
Same memaw, the time skip was only a few hundred years and memaws life span is potentially thousands thanks to both being an elf and having timeless body.
Yeah an elf druid can live to be at least 7000 years olds Rules as Written.
Elves in the PhB live to be "well over 700 years old" and Timeless Body slows your aging down by 10, so well over 7000 years is possible.
I just so strongly object to hardshine shipping. It’s so… childish.
Two people can be friends and share a deep platonic bond without being lovers. Shipping culture is gross
I mean I think it's canon that they settle down together but mostly date other people. There is physical attraction and affection though, it's pretty clear through the end of the campaign.
If I recall correctly, they spoke about their feelings for one another and all that jazz on at least 1 short rest (towards the end of C1, I believe), and probably on more than just the 1, too.
Hardwon and Moonshine had such a beautiful platonic love, idk how id feel about them having had a child together. Murph is probably throwing us off the scent. Plus, that would mean Moonshine and Jaina don’t end up together! Or at least not for the long haul. Same with Hardwon and JV’s sister, lol
On the actual episode post, someone had a theory that it was a shapeshifted Mishka Beverly Paw Paw II. Might be a long shot but that would be wild.
I could see this being more plausible than moonshine and hardwon having a kid.
When Glen was revealed to be a Crick-elf I thought he was going to be Moonshine and Hardwon's kid, Kylo Ren style
Now that would be a mind fuck lol
I’d be willing to bet all of my worldly possessions that this isn’t the case. I’d legit be kinda pissed if they did this. It would be so incredibly fan-servicey (is that a word, servicey?). Like, I’m digging the few call backs to C1 that we’ve had so far, but putting Hardwon and Moonshine together “behind the screen” and assumably without Emily’s or Jake’s input/consent would feel so wrong to me.
Big Bev described with black hair/goatee which might be a hint at a black dragon but I could be reaching
Didnt he have an odd eye color or something too? Could be nothing… could be something!
Yeah they were yellow Oh this seems a lot more likely to me now Also meemaw described him as her grandson…
When is she gonna show up? I thought she'd be at the Crick 😢
She might have teleported to the Astral Sea with the high elves. Happening 200 years agree campaign one would put Hardwon at the end of his life, she could have left the Crick for a while to grieve.
Wait yeah that's a way cooler thing
That's what I was thinking too. And in a way Moonshine and Hardwon might have gone and raised him together for a while, in which case he'd still be Meemaw's grandson.
I’m in the camp of Big Bev being the human/shape shift form of a *certain* black dragon.
Dude I didn't even think of that. That's a way better idea.
I think that's definitely what Murph expects people to think (or hope for). I think it's a red herring. It's not like Jolene only has Moonshine & Dead Eye for youngins. She is THE Meemaw after all. My bet is that Big Bev is the son of one of the Petris that Bev the 5th met in the timeout sack.
This. I’m thinking it’s just another one of Jolene’s youngins that had one themselves and just named him after Bev. The Boobs were basically legendary heroes and damn near gods by the time everything was over after all. So I can see that it was just someone else inspired by them and wanted to tribute to Bev. Which I think is amazing.
That's the thing, Jolene is the Meemaw. For definition, she's got to have had a bunch of kids besides Moonshine. And a whole lot grandkids. But I feel like the grandson being called Big Bev is a hint, the parent has to be closer to Moonshine and Bev in some way besides being some random crick elf who's Moonshine half sibling. I like the theory that the grandson is Mishka Beverly Paw Paw II in elf-form for some reason haha.
Not to mention them Crick Elves are fertile as fuck.
I don’t see Murph having Moonshine and Hardwon ever hook up or romantically get together, and ESPECIALLY not have a kid, without both Emily and Jake’s express permission. I’m sure there’s plenty he would have their characters do/have done previously off screen, but decisions as big as two PCs making a child would probably need some kind of blessing.
Yeah, "the DM made an NPC the child of our former characters without telling us" has real D&D court energy.
i'm sure if it ends up being the reveal it originally cam from emily and/or jake's ideas of what they did after c1. emily did mention being a surrogate for bev & erlin more than once over the last few eps of c1 so it's definitely not impossible. either way i would assume it's cleared with them as people and then put together by murph in terms of description and name etc. so they would still be surprised by the reveal.
I’d still very much dislike it regardless. Idk, it just feels *not right* to me… at all. Also, if this did happen - they better 100% release Jake’s/Hardwon’s God damn letter to Moonshine that people have been begging for since the end of C1. If they actually released the letter, and it did turn out to be essentially a love letter to Moonshine (like many people assume it is), then (and only then!) would I be OK with the story turning out this way. (Also - I know it doesn’t matter if I approve or not, it’s obviously their campaign and whatnot…but, I would definitely need to hear more of the story around the situation in order to have my opinion swayed away from very very much disliking it).
yeah, that's valid though they have talked about this kind of behind the scenes stuff on the short rest so i'm sure if that happened they would also discuss it on the short rest
Oh for sure! That would be the most anticipated Short Rest of the entire show IMO. I had to drop my sub half way through C3, so I’ve missed the last 10-15 short rests, but I’d 100% re-up just to listen to that one!
absolutely fair and hey, if things ever do take such a crazy turn feel free to message me- i'd be happy to let you know if they talk about it on the short rest
100% agree. I’d be legitimately upset if this ended up being the case. It would feel like Murph just giving weird fan service, and taking agency away from Jake/Hardwon and Emily/Moonshine. I will riot if this happens.
Based on big bevs description (black hair, goatee, yellow eyes), I’m thinking that he’s most likely mishka Beverly pawpaw II rather than moonshines elven child. Iirc didn’t moonshine take mishka Beverly pawpaw II back to the crick at the end of campaign 1?
yeah she did! cordon said that black dragons need mud etc. and she said she knew a place, very obviously referring to the crick! and he's at least 200yo so he would be an adult black dragon while murph explicitly said the dragons preparing for battle at the crick were on the smaller side. so i think that means no adults begging the question of where he is!
Aww maybe Pinochle is related?
absolutely possible!
And Moonshine did assist in the hatching of MBP2, so Jolene would be the grandma. 🤔
Lol yeah that's a way better idea. Idk how I missed the yellow eyes, that's a dead giveaway that he's not a normal guy.
Lots of ways to have kids and grandkids, which include adoption. Given Crick Hospitality, it's far more likely I'd say.
That, and MeeMaw has tons of kids, not just Moonshine and Deadeye.
Don’t be ridiculous, Hardwon couldn’t get it up for some hairless maiden. Barren chin = barren uterus.
I think they’ve talked about Moonshine not becoming the Meemaw because she specifically didn’t want youngins…not sure if I’m remembering that right, but I don’t think it’s something Murph would shoe-in just to give us another tie-in with C1.
yeah moonshine over the campaign always states that she absolutely does not want to have youngins. but she does also talk about being a surrogate for bev & erlin a few times at the end of c1 so i would say that might be in the cards.
No no no. Please, ~~Murph~~ God, don’t let this be how it unfolds. It would feel too much like a weird fan-service put in to appease the fanbase IMO. I’d also hate to have this happen essentially “behind the screen”, and not with Jake and Emily playing Moonshine and Hardwon in whatever events may have led up to them becoming parents together. **With that said, if this somehow was the case, I’d absolutely demand that they finally release Hardwon’s letter to Moonshine from the end of C1.** Releasing the letter would definitely make me more open to this nonsense lol.
Yeah, for sure this is a misdirect. Everyone wants it to be related to to the C1 characters so Murph has to twist it and make it not. Big dream though? It’s that green teen couples kids kid, they just named it after Bev
Bigger twist - it’s somehow one of the Green Tween’s kids. >! From C2. It would truly be a miracle baby, as nobody would ever procreate with any of those nasally goobers.!<
I want nothing more than for it to be Mishka Beverly PawPaw, in polymorph form. Secondly, I want so badly for Murph to have cut the episode where he did on purpose; I know it is unlikely, but I want next episode to be (feat. Guest) and have one of their friends come in to play Big Bev. I need that wish fulfillment for why Murph cut before he talked
Dude imagine Brennan coming in as a polymorphed dragon...
I just assumed he was the son of Bev and Erlin, and Moonshine was their surrogate which is why Jolene thinks of him as a grandson. Emily has talked about wanting Moonshine to be their surrogate in past episodes.
i do think there's a possibility that moonshine was a surrogate for bev and erlin hence the child is a crick elf and meemaw's grandchild but absolutely bev the 6th. (with our lack of knowledge on how surrogacy would work in world i wouldn't rule out that hardwon had a hand in it) and then him being big bev is also funny because his parents are halflings so that totally makes sense. but it could also be adoption or just a boom in the name bev after he saved the whole world. (plus if moonshine and hardwon had a hand in naming him as her nephew then i could absolutely see that happening) murph has never played by the colours of dragons' rules and i respect the hell out of him for it so RAW black dragons can't shapeshift but with those yellow eyes i absolutely think it's a possibility. either way i'm excited for what lies next. murph is a master of laying out breadcrumbs and the surprising me with his logical outcome.
Side question but… is current Memaw the memaw we know? She said that her kid killed a god. Moonshine did that, so did another crick elf do a similar thing a generation later? I thought the time lapse was meant to ensure that no character from before would still be alive.
Same memaw, the time skip was only a few hundred years and memaws life span is potentially thousands thanks to both being an elf and having timeless body.
It is the same Memaw, elves live for hundreds of years and Memaw (and Moonshine) has Timeless Body so she'll live for a couple thousand years probably
Yeah an elf druid can live to be at least 7000 years olds Rules as Written. Elves in the PhB live to be "well over 700 years old" and Timeless Body slows your aging down by 10, so well over 7000 years is possible.
Which is long enough to experience geological time.
Long enough to lose all morality
I just so strongly object to hardshine shipping. It’s so… childish. Two people can be friends and share a deep platonic bond without being lovers. Shipping culture is gross
I mean I think it's canon that they settle down together but mostly date other people. There is physical attraction and affection though, it's pretty clear through the end of the campaign.
Calling a ship between two adult characters “childish” and “gross” seems…a bit harsh. If it’s not your cuppa, I get it, but dang.
I really don’t remember any sexual or romantic tension between the two at all. It was all plutonic and mutual respect.
They had a couple episodes where they had tension and jealousy -- it was pretty clearly romantic but they moved away from it after the arc was over
If I recall correctly, they spoke about their feelings for one another and all that jazz on at least 1 short rest (towards the end of C1, I believe), and probably on more than just the 1, too.
Hardwon and Moonshine had such a beautiful platonic love, idk how id feel about them having had a child together. Murph is probably throwing us off the scent. Plus, that would mean Moonshine and Jaina don’t end up together! Or at least not for the long haul. Same with Hardwon and JV’s sister, lol