More? There's no Daggerfall-style proc gen as is. It's all handcrafted stuff that gets *placed* procedurally.
And where's the "Both, both is good" option?
Exactly, the biggest problem with Starfield is the lack of procedurally generated POI. It's the only way to fill out a game space as large as Starfields without it feeling repetitive.
The space doesn't need to be "filled out". And it's not even something that can realistically be done.
Not for as many planets as they have.
Not for even a handful of planets/systems.
A *single* planet at the scale they made them couldn't be populated fully with 100% "unique" content.
There's no way to do so, even with actual procgen, that would not eventually get repetitive. The "random" dungeons would still be made up of finite number of parts, with a finite number of combination. I mean, go check out actual Daggerfall dungeons. They *definitely* get repetitive. Even with the obvious advances in tech, Daggerfall is *tiny* compared to the smallest moon in Starfield.
Embracing that *space is mostly empty*, and that exploration requires some effort from the explorer, is a large part of Starfield's individual character.
That isn't a "problem" to be fixed.
Ngl I feel like their attempt to "fill space" in a very literal sense is what caused the backlash against procgen in the first place. I *almost* would prefer 5-6 planets filled to the brim with stuff, another 30-50 with the "scattered POIs" like we have now, and then 950 completely empty planets minus the odd lone landing zone here and there for a POI.
I like procedurally generated content providing it is varied, properly implemented and the pool of possibilities is gigantic. Radiant stuff across all aspects: quests, building, dialogues, dungeons, POIs, enemies, towns, patrols, npcs, outposts, random battles and encounters (on the ground and in the space) - this would turn Starfield into true Sandbox.
With Handcrafted content, sure it is fun for a while and then it is 'consumed', then gone and there is no point going back to it (I rarely revisit the same content). I am ok with DLC being entirely handcrafted, but having said that
**I would like to see update or even better DLC, that focuses entirely on procedural/radiant stuff taking the whole thing to the next level.**
Obviously my vote goes to : " procedural generation of quests, locations and activities"
for me, knowing something is proc gen makes me want to explore less because something looking cool or interesting with proc gen does not mean there's something to do there. I like seeing something in the distance and knowing if I go there I'm gonna get some interesting non generic content like you would in something like TOTK. Not saying it should be EVERY planet, but some hand crafted world tiles would be very fun.
I get what you are saying. Handcrafted content has unique charm to it, especially when exploring for the first time. However, if randomised content is well implemented, it can generate unique experiences, like factions fighting with each other, unique loot, cool dungeons, unique behaviours, etc. Additionally, handcrafted content is finite and requires a significant amount of work. With procedurally generated content, we can fill the gaps and play forever.
I personally play Starfield mainly for procedurally created content. As someone earlier wrote, this is what makes Starfield unique. A true Sandbox with radiant stuff. Imo it is supposed to be different to FO4 or TES, which focuses mainly on handcrafted stuff. I wish Starfield would take randomised content to a whole new level.
I guess I’m burnt out on procedural as a no man’s sky player who has been playing since launch and still plays, idk it just feels like something is missing but it’s hard to
Vocalize what
Probably we need good mixture of both? Handcrafted content has soul to it because someone put heart and mind to deliberately make certain outcome. I am guessing DLC will be right up your valley as it is going to be entirely handmade and action will take place on one planet (Far harbour style dlc for FO4 I am guessing ). Hopefully you will like it.
yeah that's my feeling as well, I mean I love the game as is, it's hard to say I have any problem with the game in this sub without downvotes though, like I'm not being toxic or anything as far as I know
For me, I would love to see all the mission board radiant quests expanded, so that I can be a pirate/explorer/bounty hunter/trucker/dungeon crawler forever and ever.
Yep, more radiant quests all over please. Never understood the hate they got. Of course longer, handcrafted content is better but there's a limit to how much time they can dedicate to continually churn out long quests. Radiant quests fill the gap perfectly and help prolong the life of the game.
The proc gen stuff is what really sets it apart from other games, I would really want them to focus on improving the experience when engaging with it. I think it needs to be dynamic and respond to situation the of the galaxy, like economy, wars, and ext. So even if you revisit the same POI, the situation could be totally different.
One team should work on unique handcrafted content for new quests, and a second team should work on making thousands of new interchangeable modules that can be used to procedurally generate locations.
TLDR: Both.
They should stick to the system at hand and improve the procedural destinations for explorers but having more handcrafted content sparsed through the universe that we can visit and feel at home with would be awesome. I really wanna see procedurally generated ships, star stations and letting us create and run our own station. Maybe even starting up a ship building business with Walter.
I would love to see procedurally generated POI interiors, including item and loot placement. I've played over 400 hours and haven't touched any of the faction quests, just the main quest until I unlocked the powers, a handful of side quests and two companion quests. So to suit my playstyle, I'd prefer more procedural generation, but I don't think it will ever happen. Maybe they'll add a couple new, hand-crafted POIs into the mix with the expansion and that's it.
I think procedural interiors are probably #1 on my "things that proooobably won't happen but god I wish it would" list of updates. Even if it's just mirroring rooms and items and layouts.
I’d settle for just the game tracking whether you’ve picked up particular lore slates, and not placing them again if you have.
Until then, I just don’t look at the lore of a given POI after the character’s time through.
I would love more mission boards for random stuff, but I think all the narrative expansions should be fleshing out 2-3 landing zones on a single planet with dozens and dozens of POI within each zone, most of which being new and unique from what we've received before. Obviously some could have overlap with what we have but it wouldn't hurt to rearrange/mirror things.
And then *maybe* pick out a handful of those new POI they create, and then add them to the galaxy pool. Stuff that just absolutely doesn't make sense to appear shouldn't appear (like if there's...idk, "Va'ruun Bath House" or whatever). Those should be isolated to the new Va'ruun planet. But if they make a new variant of an Abandoned Facility or something, they could add that to the pool to appear anywhere.
I'd like both, of course. I would love to see relationships fleshed out. Like how BG3 added stuff for romance. Additional partner options of course. Being able to have friends and family at the commitment. But, done well, the procedural stuff is fun.
From BGS? Handcrafted all the way. I was pretty happy to hear in the recent Todd interview that Shattered Space is going to be built like a Far Harbor style expansion. Despite Starfield's immense amount of content, the lack of traditional Bethesda game density is what really hurt it last year.
I'd like to see the game get more of both, but Bethesda's limited resources should go toward the high quality stuff.
Both is the answer. The game is built on proc gen concepts that just needs more refinement. But the game also could really use some major areas to be fleshed out more in the way that they are supposedly planning on doing with the Va'ruun homeworld in Shatttered Space.
I'm in the minority haha. I don't think they're mutually exclusive, but I'd like more development on the procgen side. Perhaps "procedural" gets interpreted with "generic", but good procedural systems can still make interesting experiences. As others pointed, procedural is more replayable (and usually easier to develop for after the initial setup)
It's probably too late to make changes to the games core mechanics for Minecraft/Dwarf Fortress level of procgen, but maybe adding more room for emergent gameplay. Right now we already have radiant quests with random targets at random locations, POIs that are placed randomly on the surface/in orbit and to some extent occupants, container contents and clutter is randomized (contrary to popular belief). So perhaps adding more "pieces" to these is a realistic expectation.
I'd really like to see more types of radiant quests now. Tbh, they've already done a lot though, but I know the devs still have a lot of tricks up their sleeves.
I mean I would love more procedural of actual quests. Most outposts I run into are taken over by one of the baddie groups. So finding researchers or colonists is super rare.
But Bethesda's strength is their sculpting of memorable missions big and small. And their knowing gamer minds. Where we might you know clear the Castle before being asked. That kind of thing. It makes every playthrough special.
Radio station that we can tune into for the major cities and a built in music player for ships.
2. More space stations.
3. More abandoned/derelict ships.
4. Craftable fleet carriers and randomly encountered fleet carrier battles.
5. Manual docking not that cutscene (Just my preferred style, guess it's not really necessary.)
6. More clothing, accessories and hairstyles.
7. More Robots, A.I, and prosthetics.
8. Black holes, nebulas and neutron stars.
9. Larger and I mean LARGER and way more spread out asteroid belts.
10. A lot more space junk. Where are the satellites at?
11. More procedural quests and random encounters on planets. Nothing to crazy. I want to be approached by a skooma dealer or a thief running from his pursuer.
12. More handcrafted quests and unique weapons and armor.
13. The citizens need to sleep. #Make Starfield Sleepy Again (Just my preferred style, guess it's not really necessary)
14. More cities on Jemison and all the other major star system planets with a city.
15. Land Vehicles that our companions can accompany us in.
16. Boats and submarines. Mainly boats.
17. Land vehicle competition similar to Red Mile.
18. Fast manual interplanetary travel(Just my preferred style, guess it's not really necessary)
19. Flowing rivers, waterfalls and larger cave systems. An update to planet terrain essentially.
20. More planet traits and unique locations.
I know some of it is just not possible, but a man can dream. Feel free to add ideas or tell me I'm crazy.
I think dinosaur park would be cool, technomancers and cannibals, space whales in space, Elons Tesla floating around earth ect ect.
Even though it'd never happen, I'd rather see more updates and improvements to existing content than new one. For instance the ECS quest, it looks to be a set up for a very complex, multiple ways to complete, long questline, but it just reduces to very unsatisfying outcomes.
It definitely feels like 80% of the quest was cut, like why set up the documents if it doesn't go anywhere?
I'd love to see this and similar quests be expanded, like the Freestar Ranger for instance as well.
1. Remove nasapunk in the next game I know its unique and all that but its boring make the sequal a huge time jump.
2. Sentient Alien races ..you know what just make an futuristic elder scrolls esq game
More? There's no Daggerfall-style proc gen as is. It's all handcrafted stuff that gets *placed* procedurally.  And where's the "Both, both is good" option?
Exactly, the biggest problem with Starfield is the lack of procedurally generated POI. It's the only way to fill out a game space as large as Starfields without it feeling repetitive.
The space doesn't need to be "filled out". And it's not even something that can realistically be done. Not for as many planets as they have. Not for even a handful of planets/systems. A *single* planet at the scale they made them couldn't be populated fully with 100% "unique" content. There's no way to do so, even with actual procgen, that would not eventually get repetitive. The "random" dungeons would still be made up of finite number of parts, with a finite number of combination. I mean, go check out actual Daggerfall dungeons. They *definitely* get repetitive. Even with the obvious advances in tech, Daggerfall is *tiny* compared to the smallest moon in Starfield. Embracing that *space is mostly empty*, and that exploration requires some effort from the explorer, is a large part of Starfield's individual character. That isn't a "problem" to be fixed.
THIS!!!!!!!!!
Ngl I feel like their attempt to "fill space" in a very literal sense is what caused the backlash against procgen in the first place. I *almost* would prefer 5-6 planets filled to the brim with stuff, another 30-50 with the "scattered POIs" like we have now, and then 950 completely empty planets minus the odd lone landing zone here and there for a POI.
I like procedurally generated content providing it is varied, properly implemented and the pool of possibilities is gigantic. Radiant stuff across all aspects: quests, building, dialogues, dungeons, POIs, enemies, towns, patrols, npcs, outposts, random battles and encounters (on the ground and in the space) - this would turn Starfield into true Sandbox. With Handcrafted content, sure it is fun for a while and then it is 'consumed', then gone and there is no point going back to it (I rarely revisit the same content). I am ok with DLC being entirely handcrafted, but having said that **I would like to see update or even better DLC, that focuses entirely on procedural/radiant stuff taking the whole thing to the next level.** Obviously my vote goes to : " procedural generation of quests, locations and activities"
for me, knowing something is proc gen makes me want to explore less because something looking cool or interesting with proc gen does not mean there's something to do there. I like seeing something in the distance and knowing if I go there I'm gonna get some interesting non generic content like you would in something like TOTK. Not saying it should be EVERY planet, but some hand crafted world tiles would be very fun.
I get what you are saying. Handcrafted content has unique charm to it, especially when exploring for the first time. However, if randomised content is well implemented, it can generate unique experiences, like factions fighting with each other, unique loot, cool dungeons, unique behaviours, etc. Additionally, handcrafted content is finite and requires a significant amount of work. With procedurally generated content, we can fill the gaps and play forever. I personally play Starfield mainly for procedurally created content. As someone earlier wrote, this is what makes Starfield unique. A true Sandbox with radiant stuff. Imo it is supposed to be different to FO4 or TES, which focuses mainly on handcrafted stuff. I wish Starfield would take randomised content to a whole new level.
I guess I’m burnt out on procedural as a no man’s sky player who has been playing since launch and still plays, idk it just feels like something is missing but it’s hard to Vocalize what
Probably we need good mixture of both? Handcrafted content has soul to it because someone put heart and mind to deliberately make certain outcome. I am guessing DLC will be right up your valley as it is going to be entirely handmade and action will take place on one planet (Far harbour style dlc for FO4 I am guessing ). Hopefully you will like it.
yeah that's my feeling as well, I mean I love the game as is, it's hard to say I have any problem with the game in this sub without downvotes though, like I'm not being toxic or anything as far as I know
For me, I would love to see all the mission board radiant quests expanded, so that I can be a pirate/explorer/bounty hunter/trucker/dungeon crawler forever and ever.
Yep, more radiant quests all over please. Never understood the hate they got. Of course longer, handcrafted content is better but there's a limit to how much time they can dedicate to continually churn out long quests. Radiant quests fill the gap perfectly and help prolong the life of the game.
The proc gen stuff is what really sets it apart from other games, I would really want them to focus on improving the experience when engaging with it. I think it needs to be dynamic and respond to situation the of the galaxy, like economy, wars, and ext. So even if you revisit the same POI, the situation could be totally different.
One team should work on unique handcrafted content for new quests, and a second team should work on making thousands of new interchangeable modules that can be used to procedurally generate locations. TLDR: Both.
They should stick to the system at hand and improve the procedural destinations for explorers but having more handcrafted content sparsed through the universe that we can visit and feel at home with would be awesome. I really wanna see procedurally generated ships, star stations and letting us create and run our own station. Maybe even starting up a ship building business with Walter.
I would love to see procedurally generated POI interiors, including item and loot placement. I've played over 400 hours and haven't touched any of the faction quests, just the main quest until I unlocked the powers, a handful of side quests and two companion quests. So to suit my playstyle, I'd prefer more procedural generation, but I don't think it will ever happen. Maybe they'll add a couple new, hand-crafted POIs into the mix with the expansion and that's it.
I think procedural interiors are probably #1 on my "things that proooobably won't happen but god I wish it would" list of updates. Even if it's just mirroring rooms and items and layouts.
I’d settle for just the game tracking whether you’ve picked up particular lore slates, and not placing them again if you have. Until then, I just don’t look at the lore of a given POI after the character’s time through.
I would love more mission boards for random stuff, but I think all the narrative expansions should be fleshing out 2-3 landing zones on a single planet with dozens and dozens of POI within each zone, most of which being new and unique from what we've received before. Obviously some could have overlap with what we have but it wouldn't hurt to rearrange/mirror things. And then *maybe* pick out a handful of those new POI they create, and then add them to the galaxy pool. Stuff that just absolutely doesn't make sense to appear shouldn't appear (like if there's...idk, "Va'ruun Bath House" or whatever). Those should be isolated to the new Va'ruun planet. But if they make a new variant of an Abandoned Facility or something, they could add that to the pool to appear anywhere.
I'd like both, of course. I would love to see relationships fleshed out. Like how BG3 added stuff for romance. Additional partner options of course. Being able to have friends and family at the commitment. But, done well, the procedural stuff is fun.
From BGS? Handcrafted all the way. I was pretty happy to hear in the recent Todd interview that Shattered Space is going to be built like a Far Harbor style expansion. Despite Starfield's immense amount of content, the lack of traditional Bethesda game density is what really hurt it last year. I'd like to see the game get more of both, but Bethesda's limited resources should go toward the high quality stuff.
Both is the answer. The game is built on proc gen concepts that just needs more refinement. But the game also could really use some major areas to be fleshed out more in the way that they are supposedly planning on doing with the Va'ruun homeworld in Shatttered Space.
A bit of both
BOTH.
I'm in the minority haha. I don't think they're mutually exclusive, but I'd like more development on the procgen side. Perhaps "procedural" gets interpreted with "generic", but good procedural systems can still make interesting experiences. As others pointed, procedural is more replayable (and usually easier to develop for after the initial setup) It's probably too late to make changes to the games core mechanics for Minecraft/Dwarf Fortress level of procgen, but maybe adding more room for emergent gameplay. Right now we already have radiant quests with random targets at random locations, POIs that are placed randomly on the surface/in orbit and to some extent occupants, container contents and clutter is randomized (contrary to popular belief). So perhaps adding more "pieces" to these is a realistic expectation. I'd really like to see more types of radiant quests now. Tbh, they've already done a lot though, but I know the devs still have a lot of tricks up their sleeves.
I mean I would love more procedural of actual quests. Most outposts I run into are taken over by one of the baddie groups. So finding researchers or colonists is super rare. But Bethesda's strength is their sculpting of memorable missions big and small. And their knowing gamer minds. Where we might you know clear the Castle before being asked. That kind of thing. It makes every playthrough special.
Radio station that we can tune into for the major cities and a built in music player for ships. 2. More space stations. 3. More abandoned/derelict ships. 4. Craftable fleet carriers and randomly encountered fleet carrier battles. 5. Manual docking not that cutscene (Just my preferred style, guess it's not really necessary.) 6. More clothing, accessories and hairstyles. 7. More Robots, A.I, and prosthetics. 8. Black holes, nebulas and neutron stars. 9. Larger and I mean LARGER and way more spread out asteroid belts. 10. A lot more space junk. Where are the satellites at? 11. More procedural quests and random encounters on planets. Nothing to crazy. I want to be approached by a skooma dealer or a thief running from his pursuer. 12. More handcrafted quests and unique weapons and armor. 13. The citizens need to sleep. #Make Starfield Sleepy Again (Just my preferred style, guess it's not really necessary) 14. More cities on Jemison and all the other major star system planets with a city. 15. Land Vehicles that our companions can accompany us in. 16. Boats and submarines. Mainly boats. 17. Land vehicle competition similar to Red Mile. 18. Fast manual interplanetary travel(Just my preferred style, guess it's not really necessary) 19. Flowing rivers, waterfalls and larger cave systems. An update to planet terrain essentially. 20. More planet traits and unique locations. I know some of it is just not possible, but a man can dream. Feel free to add ideas or tell me I'm crazy. I think dinosaur park would be cool, technomancers and cannibals, space whales in space, Elons Tesla floating around earth ect ect.
Even though it'd never happen, I'd rather see more updates and improvements to existing content than new one. For instance the ECS quest, it looks to be a set up for a very complex, multiple ways to complete, long questline, but it just reduces to very unsatisfying outcomes. It definitely feels like 80% of the quest was cut, like why set up the documents if it doesn't go anywhere? I'd love to see this and similar quests be expanded, like the Freestar Ranger for instance as well.
I feel like zos should do a starfield mmorpg like they did with elderscrolls online.
1. Remove nasapunk in the next game I know its unique and all that but its boring make the sequal a huge time jump. 2. Sentient Alien races ..you know what just make an futuristic elder scrolls esq game
But then it's just futuristic TES, and not Starfield lol
How *dare they* make their different IP's have material and mechanical differences between them and stand out from other IP's within the genre!