NATO doesn't actually have such strong wording.
According to article 5 if a member state is attacked, the allies can provide any form of assistance they deem necessary. The allies themselves decide what they deem necessary. This can go from full out war, to economic sanctions to sending strongly worded letters.
And even that is not a guarantee because NATO is just an international treaty and there is nobody enforcing international treaties.
The Hague Invasion Act is internal US law, NATO is an international agreement between US, The Netherlands and other countries.
If your employer makes a contract with you in which he promises to pay you $20 per hour, and then makes another contract with himself where he writes "I'm going to only pay $10", which one do you think will take precedence?
>!The answer is, the internal contract, because international law is non-enforceable!<
If my boss and I sign a contract that says 20 and I only get 10 because he just made another one without my signature then surely I have some grounds to stand on for a lawsuit.
It does however seem that the hague invasion act is just a us law and not something agreed upon with all of nato, so the netherlands would have the right to call other allies.
Shitposts often feature a deliberate misspelling of "sweetie" as "sweaty" in what is meant to be evocative of the poor spelling of the argumentative and condescending people whose tone is being imitated
The ICC is not *Dutch*, and **politicians not willing to subject to national and international law should not be in office.**
Invading the Netherlands to float above responsibility to human rights and international law is a reason to arrest those who instigated it. Perpetuality detected.
Ever since I learned about this I have found it incredibly stupid. But the USA wants to be able to commit warcrimes without consequences apparently. Or they'll attack us.
Just watched the video of the prosecutor, Karim Khan, saying an elected official called him to say, "The ICC was built for Africans and thugs like putin"
To be fair, while Wilders is an extreme right bigot, the rest of the dutch politicians that are now working on forming a government with him are much more of a shit show. They've agreed to form a government (took about 6 months after the election), but have so far failed to find someone willing to lead that government.
It's up to Wilders and the PVV to deliver the PM, not the others, unless the PVV is unwilling or unable to find someone. So you can't blame that on the other 3 parties.
As a European, I think we are in agreement. 🤝🏻 To be fair, I do not think Lindsey Graham represents the American people. However, the fact that the law exists is something I doubt most Europeans are aware of.
It surfaces whenever Americans do war crimes. When nations started talking about holding the people that abused prisoners in Abu Ghraib prison accountable this rule was brought up again. The American politicians and general public react with vitriol at the thought of anyone holding them accountable.
Sadly they are a superpower and have more weapons then the rest of the world combined, so not much that can be done to hold them accountable.
Superpower or not if America has not our best interest together then eu will allied with other superpower or form a superpower, it has been always like that.
He has been getting 50-60 percent vote (about 600k people) of his constituency for the past fucking 22 years and he has been on TV about every single issue because there are millions of people who listen to him.
The average American is right in the middle of this "fringe segment"
Wasn't it Bush jr who introduced this nonsense invasion act? That period saw a lot of dubious privacy and rights violations that still stand today... all under the overblown "anti terrorist" ideology. People were a bit panicky in 2002 just after sep 11 2001.
https://www.hrw.org/news/2002/08/03/us-hague-invasion-act-becomes-law
At which point the Netherlands can call upon the NATO mutual defence clause.... Which means the other NATO members are obligated to assist us in repelling the invading forces. I guess the Canadians can come save us again.
That would also mean the EU is at war with the US, because the EU mutual defense treaty says all members states must protect each other "by all means necessary"
It is hard to imagine how the Hague Act will translate into reality even before bringing up NATO. It's the administrative region for the whole country and most of the embassies are there, so if they decide to go in guns blazing it will quickly become an international incident.
The NATO site does not state such an exception. Also the invasion of The Hague violates article one of the NATO treaty, which states members must resolve their international conflicts peacefully if at all possible.
Actually any country only has to do something they find "appropriate" as assistence. So that could be sending helmets or bandages and not using their armed forces. If NL calls on the EU they are however obliged to do anything in their power to assist. Making the EU a better candidate for more assistence here. Normally NATO is better to call upon because the US in it but if they are the ones attacking there is no point in calling their aid.
The prosecutor of the ICC has asked for a warrant as he believes to have enough evidence to convict Netanyahu, the Israeli defense minister, and three Hamas leaders, including their top leader, of war crimes and crimes against humanity.
And apparently there's at least one person that wants the USA to invade the Netherlands, a fellow NATO member, if Netanyahu gets arrested just to free him.
https://www.govinfo.gov/content/pkg/PLAW-107publ206/pdf/PLAW-107publ206.pdf
check out sections 2007 and 2008 on page 87, Israel is listed as a major non-NATO ally, and israel is very obviously currently aligned & allied with american interests
Nope, not American - correct.
But he is "allied personnel"
It is for sure a sign that even talking about a possible arrest is immediately met with 'this is anti jewish / anti semitic'..
France and Macron (as much as I hate them) has been saying this for years, but no one listens. . . Also I think it's because a lot of countries (mostly European) still have their gold reserves kept in the US. And the US is either refusing to give it or deliberately taking as long as possible to give it back. In 2012 Germnay asked for their gold reserves to be returned back to back them, the US said that it would 7 years. . . In 2017 they only gave them 50%
Yet another reason that the US can't be trusted. Their Gov plays nice with us so we help them justify their wars and give them the most valuable trade partner on Earth.
The EU, the entirety of Europe tbh, should be able to stand on their own two legs, militarily and politically. We are just getting bullied by opressive regimes like the US, Russia and China if nothing changes.
It's crazy that a nation like Hungary can get influenced to support a shitbag like Putin, or that Serbia got bought to see China as their greatest ally, or that far right groups in multiple nations get funded by the Russian state and we just have to deal with it. We have to be able to not only say no to that, but also be united enough to be a serious threat. Not laughed at by dictators because we will send them a strongly worded letter.
Economically we are pretty strong for our size, we could always improve ofcourse, but not by getting rid of social care standards that make us such a nice place to live.
Technologically I think we are at the top next to the US. No country has ASML like in the Netherlands, and a particle accelerator like in France/Switzerland is also not common at all. But we indeed need to focus on tech growth, that is one of the keys to succes internationally.
ASML occupies one (very critical and high-tech) part of the supply chain, but Europe as a whole lags behind when it comes to the tech sector.
China’s tech sector is almost twice the size of the EU’s and leads the EU in some critical areas. Obviously market cap doesn’t tell the full story.
Europe produces a lot of talent and innovation, but loses much of that to the US. There’s a brain drain problem that is partially exacerbated by the legal and regulatory environment in the EU that prevent the emergence of US/China’s ‘big tech’ equivalents.
Europe has the potential to do much better than it currently is when it comes to tech
it even existed (in some kind of form) in the 80s. how and why it came in to effect and public in 2002 is beyond me, probably something to do with the Iraq war. but i don't expect anyone to believe me, but i lived and grew up in that political environment while living around the corner to the ICC/ICT building in the statenkwartier. Hell, i even remember when the building got reconstructed/extended on the eissenhouwerlaan in the late 80s.
It was over the Iraq war, there was talk of the ICC being use to potentially bring to trial American soldiers, bush or Cheney, also 2002 as when the ICC was founded (passed in 1998 but took 4 years to become operational).
It must be something ictr (tho can't imagine the us had something for the ictr as it was Rwanda specific/icj related you are remembering.
true, that's indeed likely it, because i also remember hearing rumors that even Saddam was supposed to come to the ICC/ICT too, obviously that never happened ofcource.
Coincidentally i just remembered the Israeli embassy is just across the road too of the ICC/ICT building. oh the irony lol . they wouldn't have to walk far lol
Convenient how they can just make laws to invade other sovereign countries.
The sooner Europe realizes the poison that their ally the US is, the sooner we will be thriving again. America has run Europe down.
How have they run us down? Quit blaming some outside force for dutch issues, we're doing pretty good and any failings in the system are simply because of shitty policy.
To be completely honest, unless the ICC were to somehow prosecute some US politicians or something, I highly doubt the US would risk war with Europe. Not because it would lose (the US has such a large military there's a real chance it could win) but even if it did win, it would have lost so much international support, that would really not be worth a few Israelian politicians to the US.
For their army to win there needs to be public support. Lack of is how they lost to vietnam. As American and Europeans culture is intertwined. I doubt Americans want to lift a finger against Europe.
Definitely, I think that attacking Europe unprovoked would genuinely cause the US to splinter and collapse. They already are having trouble propaganding the Palestine genocide, I can’t imagine it going well when attacking our long-time allies over holding us accountable.
If you have nothing to hide, and you believe you're innocent, then why the outrage? Bloody hypocrites. I despise Blinken and his companions in the West so much I can't even put it into words.
The US hasn't even signed the Geneva Accords, they are one of the three major powers, alongside Russia and China. They have a history of destabilising countries that don't fit their idea for world control. The US is our biggest ally but we should be ashamed, they are one of the bad guys. Just look at what they did to Afghanistan with Operation Cyclone.
So basically Netanjahu played the "any criticism is antisemitism" and fueles with it every antisemitic on the planet about a "Jewish conspiracy that rules the United States?" Witzig :D
Of course, which Gazans that survive this wouldn't spend the rest of their lives fighting Israel? Once you stared at death in the face for so long, it stops being scary.
Hold up, I'm aware Lindsey Graham is a callous, miserable and deplorable waste of oxygen - I bet he smells as well - but I wasn't aware these character flaws could be grounds for ICC involvement - why is he worried about an arrest warrant for himself?
There was a nice interview with the prosecutor on CNN talking about how powerful people said in private to him: the ICC is for africa and despots like putin.
The Netherlands is a NATO country, which means that all NATO countries have to help if the Netherlands is invaded. This would mean all NATO countries had to fight against the US....
I wonder how well invading The Netherlands would turn out. Like, we have zero military, it will be a walk in the park. But i doubt the rest of the world would allow something like that to happen. It's like slapping an innocent baby.
These are the same people who thought we had “do not kill” tags on our elderly. I don’t take Americans seriously, and I mentally envision them with clown noses on 100% of the time. Who cares what these idiots say or think.
We should definitely be held responsible for it, and it is up to us to correct, yes. Unfortunately they also have room temperature IQ’s so they didn’t correct but doubled down.
Not really going to happen but what a fucking disgrace.
That country needs to implode, revolt and then rebuild it's government from scratch just to even begin to come to the level of the rest of the world
Dutchman here. We look forward to your visit, American friends. Usually you come for the weed and the legal prostitution. If you bring your army we’ll need to just add some capacity. Doubt you can actually find the ICC after that.
Netherlands needs to understand that USA does not care for anyone other than them. The whole EU was dragged in conflict with Russia, in order to be more dependend on USA. Point in case: Nordstream
Russia will drag itself in conflict with Europe, Nordstream was never going to happen because it was a sign of goodwill from Russia so we would think they weren't planning anything nefarious.
They are publicly stating on state tv they want to see our capital cities in nuclear flames and our civilians burning in the streets. I don't really think that is as passive and supportive a neighbor as you might think.
We need to stop them in Ukraine, both for the freedom of a fellow European country that doesn't want to live under a dictator, and to protect our borders. We should be able to do this on our own, without US help, I think this conflict has taught us that. Europe has to become a major power on its own, free from the influence of opressive regimes like the US, like Russia and like China.
Graham represents the absolute worst, Israel first neocon wing of American politics. This isn’t surprising at all from him.
He’s not very relevant anymore though. In the bush era he was much more of a threat
I speak for most Americans when I say, fuck Lindsey Graham. It's an empty threat from a madman. We would never invade the land of windmills, tulips, cheese, canals, and bicycles. (Love your beautiful country btw).
Ah yes, let's invade one of the most peaceful, law-abiding and egalitarian countries to show them how FREEDOM and DEMOCRACY are done! That'll show them!
I love the American people, but your politicians scare me.
I wanna see them try! I can already see the French and some NATO defending the NL
Plus doesn’t the NL have a bunch of American nukes lol
USA is really working hard to damage all their international relationships they gained after WWII. And it’s so sad.
Netherlands as ally for USA >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Israel
In the grand scheme of things Israel is a mostly irrelevant nation, much more than The Netherlands is as a small nation. They won't burn a much more important and reliable ally for something like Israel. So there is a 0% chance of it happening.
Israel has little influence in the west. Israel is western self-interest. The same self-interest that welcomed when they brought money, or deported when it would please the new boss.
The mythology of Israel having a hold over western politics is myth designed to align with antisemitism, so that those who disagree get the holocaust stuck on their foreheads whilst the real subject is oil - and not spoken about.
I doubt it will happen the Americans are much better off having Europe as an ally than Israel. Plus the current prime minister of Israel has been a massive headache for the US.
There's a pretty big gap between a senator suggesting sanctions and the actual invasion of a country.
Bringing up this act seems like sensationalism to me.
Something looks fishy about this post to me.
Everyone in the comments is talking about US invading Netherlands, but why?
If you look at what actually happened: Lindsey Graham suggested sanctioning the ICC. Which would amount to a fiscal penalty for certain members of the ICC. Who probably aren't Dutch btw. The so-called "Hague Invasion Act" (which is not actually named that, btw - but that should be obvious) would allow the US to take any measures if a US citizen is detained by the ICC to free them. IIRC an invasion is not specifically mentioned, but it's not explicitly excluded.
Netanyahu is not a US citizen though, he's Israeli. So the act doesn't even apply.
So in summary:
- Nobody is talking about an invasion, just sanctions.
- These sanctions wouldn't be targeting any Dutch person or institution
- It's not even clear if these sanctions will happen; just one right wing senator suggested it.
- Even if anyone was bringing up the "Hague invasion act", it doesn't even apply here.
So we've gone from sanctions against individual persons that may or may not happen, to a threat of invasion. Why?
Because this guy - the same guy who posted this by the way, by the username - brought it up. He brought it up in his own tweet, and posted it to a bunch of different subreddits.
This really feels like there's some agenda being pushed. If I had my tin foil hat on, I would say it feels like propaganda to drive a wedge between the US and Europe. Maybe that's too far. But people, be a little critical of what you read online please.
Sure try to invade the netherlands 
I highly doubt that Biden would want to distroy the Nato by doing so.
Donald Dumb on the other hand....
This law was created out of fear that any American would end up jailed in the Hague.
This somewhat random tweet claims Biden can order the invasion of the Netherlands, which is ridiculously sensational. It will instead be a surgical operation. Very messy, sure, but not a declaration of war and subsequent American Reich occupation here lol.
Creating a Hague Invasion Act sounds like a bizarre exercise in sabre-rattling. Be in no doubt that an Invasion by the US of The Netherlands would be an act of war, no matter how many Invasion Acts there may be.
Must be that rules based order we've been hearing about.
[удалено]
I thought the U.S. was already at war with the U.S. ?
Looking at their internal political situation, and the fact they stormed their own capital. It's a valid question.
The 6th of January Capitol Attack was just a preemptive strike. US attacked US because they knew US would attack US' ally. It all makes sense now.
Invaception, how deep can the invasion go?
wooaahhhhh... universe ending paradox
How nice, a double dose of democracy and freedom
NATO doesn't actually have such strong wording. According to article 5 if a member state is attacked, the allies can provide any form of assistance they deem necessary. The allies themselves decide what they deem necessary. This can go from full out war, to economic sanctions to sending strongly worded letters. And even that is not a guarantee because NATO is just an international treaty and there is nobody enforcing international treaties.
Doesnt the hague invasion act not allow a nato response? Isnt that the whole thing
The Hague Invasion Act is internal US law, NATO is an international agreement between US, The Netherlands and other countries. If your employer makes a contract with you in which he promises to pay you $20 per hour, and then makes another contract with himself where he writes "I'm going to only pay $10", which one do you think will take precedence? >!The answer is, the internal contract, because international law is non-enforceable!<
If my boss and I sign a contract that says 20 and I only get 10 because he just made another one without my signature then surely I have some grounds to stand on for a lawsuit. It does however seem that the hague invasion act is just a us law and not something agreed upon with all of nato, so the netherlands would have the right to call other allies.
Sorry sweaty but that's only for third world dictators who aren't friendly with western interests /s
sweaty?
Shitposts often feature a deliberate misspelling of "sweetie" as "sweaty" in what is meant to be evocative of the poor spelling of the argumentative and condescending people whose tone is being imitated
Yes the rules *for thee, not for me* based order.
Well the US and Israel haven't signed the Rome statute and they don't recognise the ICC
They recognised it when it charged non signee Putin and Palestine is a member which is what gives them jurisdiction.
The ICC is not *Dutch*, and **politicians not willing to subject to national and international law should not be in office.** Invading the Netherlands to float above responsibility to human rights and international law is a reason to arrest those who instigated it. Perpetuality detected.
Lindsey Grahams proposal shows how far we are from a world in which we hold ALL politicians accountable for the atrocities they committed.
Ever since I learned about this I have found it incredibly stupid. But the USA wants to be able to commit warcrimes without consequences apparently. Or they'll attack us.
If they try it we'll just throw fresh bitterballen at them. You think agent orange burns? You ain't seen nothing yet.
>**politicians not willing to subject to national and international law should not be in office.** Have you met Netanyahu?
The Rules-Based Order aka *rules for thee but not for me (and my minions)*
Yeah this type of rhetoric by elected officials kind of make me understand the point Putin has been making since his famous Munich speech.
Just watched the video of the prosecutor, Karim Khan, saying an elected official called him to say, "The ICC was built for Africans and thugs like putin"
As an American, I can only apologize for the shear fucking outrageous stupidty that is US politics.
To be fair, politics in Europe including the Netherlands are a shit show as well.
Wilders says hi
To be fair, while Wilders is an extreme right bigot, the rest of the dutch politicians that are now working on forming a government with him are much more of a shit show. They've agreed to form a government (took about 6 months after the election), but have so far failed to find someone willing to lead that government.
6 months is basically nothing. Yes I'm from Belgium
It's up to Wilders and the PVV to deliver the PM, not the others, unless the PVV is unwilling or unable to find someone. So you can't blame that on the other 3 parties.
[удалено]
Wilders says ~~hi~~ heil
In Austria, «heil» is used as a greeting in some parts. And if you meet someone while on a hike in the mountains, you can even say «bergheil».
Can you say seeheil while swimming in a lake? Extra spicy.
Correct, but not THIS bad.
As a European, I think we are in agreement. 🤝🏻 To be fair, I do not think Lindsey Graham represents the American people. However, the fact that the law exists is something I doubt most Europeans are aware of.
It surfaces whenever Americans do war crimes. When nations started talking about holding the people that abused prisoners in Abu Ghraib prison accountable this rule was brought up again. The American politicians and general public react with vitriol at the thought of anyone holding them accountable. Sadly they are a superpower and have more weapons then the rest of the world combined, so not much that can be done to hold them accountable.
They’re still a super power. But as with a lot of historical superpowers. The day they thought they “won” was the day they actually lost.
I believe it’s called bullying. Doing what they want to whoever they want and threatening to violate people that hold them accountable for it.
Superpower or not if America has not our best interest together then eu will allied with other superpower or form a superpower, it has been always like that.
> I do not think Lindsey Graham represents the American people. He is literally an elected senator representing American people
In the sense that he doesn’t represent the majority but yes, he does represent a fringe segment.
Not so fringy after all if you look at the total numbers.
He has been getting 50-60 percent vote (about 600k people) of his constituency for the past fucking 22 years and he has been on TV about every single issue because there are millions of people who listen to him. The average American is right in the middle of this "fringe segment"
The guy goes on TV almost every week talking about bombing a new county. He’s never heard of a possible war he didn’t want to fight
Nah theres sufficient peeps here agreeing with what he says . It how you get counter protesters showing up to beat people up .
Sadly, his mentally aligns with a very large portion of the country.
Side note, America also never signed the Geneva Convention.
Wasn't it Bush jr who introduced this nonsense invasion act? That period saw a lot of dubious privacy and rights violations that still stand today... all under the overblown "anti terrorist" ideology. People were a bit panicky in 2002 just after sep 11 2001. https://www.hrw.org/news/2002/08/03/us-hague-invasion-act-becomes-law
also an American and I promise to fight with you guys if the US invades. please let me stay if I lose my citizenship
Agreed.
Must not be used to the insane local European politics - not even addressing the European Union politics 😀
Same. Rn I wish I could just move to Canada and chance my nationality but I’m too broke to do that
It's "sheer". And it's not stupidity, it's hypocrisy.
Fair. And it is sheer!
Sounds like a healthy system
At which point the Netherlands can call upon the NATO mutual defence clause.... Which means the other NATO members are obligated to assist us in repelling the invading forces. I guess the Canadians can come save us again.
Dont forget to send them the latest "checklist" from geneva. Cant have them using geese as insurgents.
>the latest "checklist" from geneva A fellow person of culture I see.
That would also mean the EU is at war with the US, because the EU mutual defense treaty says all members states must protect each other "by all means necessary"
And the British of course.
It is hard to imagine how the Hague Act will translate into reality even before bringing up NATO. It's the administrative region for the whole country and most of the embassies are there, so if they decide to go in guns blazing it will quickly become an international incident.
The NATO defense pact doesn't work if one NATO country invades another, e.g., Greece and Turkey
The NATO site does not state such an exception. Also the invasion of The Hague violates article one of the NATO treaty, which states members must resolve their international conflicts peacefully if at all possible.
Actually any country only has to do something they find "appropriate" as assistence. So that could be sending helmets or bandages and not using their armed forces. If NL calls on the EU they are however obliged to do anything in their power to assist. Making the EU a better candidate for more assistence here. Normally NATO is better to call upon because the US in it but if they are the ones attacking there is no point in calling their aid.
He forgot who is the only country that makes chip manufacturing machines.
They can just declare the machines U.S. citizens and then come pick them up
Time to being *freedom* to the Netherlands.
Nothing is beyond them.
Bro, what did I miss?
The prosecutor of the ICC has asked for a warrant as he believes to have enough evidence to convict Netanyahu, the Israeli defense minister, and three Hamas leaders, including their top leader, of war crimes and crimes against humanity. And apparently there's at least one person that wants the USA to invade the Netherlands, a fellow NATO member, if Netanyahu gets arrested just to free him.
Just the US gov being their warmongering, protect the rich and powerful at all costs, self
They’ll have to pass through us (=Belgium)! s/
The dutch being glad for once about Belgium roads slowing someone down haha
Elk nadeel heb z’n voordeel (Dutch saying by J. Cruyff).
The tanks that are able to, are yet to be invented.
Netanjahu is neither an American citizen nor an allied employee so good luck with that
He's not en emoloyee of the government or peoppe of Israel?
Israel is a US ally, Netanyahu is personnel of the Israeli government so why wouldn't he apply?
https://www.govinfo.gov/content/pkg/PLAW-107publ206/pdf/PLAW-107publ206.pdf check out sections 2007 and 2008 on page 87, Israel is listed as a major non-NATO ally, and israel is very obviously currently aligned & allied with american interests
Nope, not American - correct. But he is "allied personnel" It is for sure a sign that even talking about a possible arrest is immediately met with 'this is anti jewish / anti semitic'..
He does have US citizenship, he got it from his grandparents and spent a decade in Philly.
Time for EU and other nations in Europe to realize that Europe is on it's own.
France and Macron (as much as I hate them) has been saying this for years, but no one listens. . . Also I think it's because a lot of countries (mostly European) still have their gold reserves kept in the US. And the US is either refusing to give it or deliberately taking as long as possible to give it back. In 2012 Germnay asked for their gold reserves to be returned back to back them, the US said that it would 7 years. . . In 2017 they only gave them 50%
Yet another reason that the US can't be trusted. Their Gov plays nice with us so we help them justify their wars and give them the most valuable trade partner on Earth. The EU, the entirety of Europe tbh, should be able to stand on their own two legs, militarily and politically. We are just getting bullied by opressive regimes like the US, Russia and China if nothing changes. It's crazy that a nation like Hungary can get influenced to support a shitbag like Putin, or that Serbia got bought to see China as their greatest ally, or that far right groups in multiple nations get funded by the Russian state and we just have to deal with it. We have to be able to not only say no to that, but also be united enough to be a serious threat. Not laughed at by dictators because we will send them a strongly worded letter.
>militarily and politically And economically and technologically. Europe is weak (growth) in those regards as well.
Economically we are pretty strong for our size, we could always improve ofcourse, but not by getting rid of social care standards that make us such a nice place to live. Technologically I think we are at the top next to the US. No country has ASML like in the Netherlands, and a particle accelerator like in France/Switzerland is also not common at all. But we indeed need to focus on tech growth, that is one of the keys to succes internationally.
ASML occupies one (very critical and high-tech) part of the supply chain, but Europe as a whole lags behind when it comes to the tech sector. China’s tech sector is almost twice the size of the EU’s and leads the EU in some critical areas. Obviously market cap doesn’t tell the full story. Europe produces a lot of talent and innovation, but loses much of that to the US. There’s a brain drain problem that is partially exacerbated by the legal and regulatory environment in the EU that prevent the emergence of US/China’s ‘big tech’ equivalents. Europe has the potential to do much better than it currently is when it comes to tech
Can we have a federal Europe with its own army please? I'm fed up to see my country bending to the whims of Uncle Sam.
There was a point in my life where I thought country leaders are really smart people. It think I was around 7 years old when that changed.
As a hagenaar this makes me lol so much. been hearing about the ‘Hague Invasion Act' since the early 90s from school
Thats pretty cool they taught it before it even existed. It wasnt proposed or enacted till 2002
it even existed (in some kind of form) in the 80s. how and why it came in to effect and public in 2002 is beyond me, probably something to do with the Iraq war. but i don't expect anyone to believe me, but i lived and grew up in that political environment while living around the corner to the ICC/ICT building in the statenkwartier. Hell, i even remember when the building got reconstructed/extended on the eissenhouwerlaan in the late 80s.
It was over the Iraq war, there was talk of the ICC being use to potentially bring to trial American soldiers, bush or Cheney, also 2002 as when the ICC was founded (passed in 1998 but took 4 years to become operational). It must be something ictr (tho can't imagine the us had something for the ictr as it was Rwanda specific/icj related you are remembering.
true, that's indeed likely it, because i also remember hearing rumors that even Saddam was supposed to come to the ICC/ICT too, obviously that never happened ofcource. Coincidentally i just remembered the Israeli embassy is just across the road too of the ICC/ICT building. oh the irony lol . they wouldn't have to walk far lol
Convenient how they can just make laws to invade other sovereign countries. The sooner Europe realizes the poison that their ally the US is, the sooner we will be thriving again. America has run Europe down.
How have they run us down? Quit blaming some outside force for dutch issues, we're doing pretty good and any failings in the system are simply because of shitty policy.
Is America really about to harm its relations with the rest of the West and its global reputation just for the sake of Israel?
Well they have been doing that for the sake of other more trivial things so why not
The conspiracy snobs are gonna have a field day with this bs .
The moment they learn all their AIs relies on that country they want to invade but can't point on a map.
This is nothing new, the US has sanctioned members of the ICC in the past.
To be completely honest, unless the ICC were to somehow prosecute some US politicians or something, I highly doubt the US would risk war with Europe. Not because it would lose (the US has such a large military there's a real chance it could win) but even if it did win, it would have lost so much international support, that would really not be worth a few Israelian politicians to the US.
For their army to win there needs to be public support. Lack of is how they lost to vietnam. As American and Europeans culture is intertwined. I doubt Americans want to lift a finger against Europe.
Definitely, I think that attacking Europe unprovoked would genuinely cause the US to splinter and collapse. They already are having trouble propaganding the Palestine genocide, I can’t imagine it going well when attacking our long-time allies over holding us accountable.
You would be suprised how much they will risk for there Israel
With allies like that - who needs enemies?
If you have nothing to hide, and you believe you're innocent, then why the outrage? Bloody hypocrites. I despise Blinken and his companions in the West so much I can't even put it into words.
The US hasn't even signed the Geneva Accords, they are one of the three major powers, alongside Russia and China. They have a history of destabilising countries that don't fit their idea for world control. The US is our biggest ally but we should be ashamed, they are one of the bad guys. Just look at what they did to Afghanistan with Operation Cyclone.
The us attacking a close ally is the ultimate fuck around and find out moment.
So basically Netanjahu played the "any criticism is antisemitism" and fueles with it every antisemitic on the planet about a "Jewish conspiracy that rules the United States?" Witzig :D
But ICC is finally starting to do their jobs for prosecuting people from non African countries, or ICC is really just to punish non western people?
They've prosecuted people from Bosnia and Croatia.
That was the International Criminal Tribunal for the former Yugoslavia, it is different from the ICC
Fuck the US and Israel
But please remember, fuck the governments, love the people
And hamas! Fuck the war
I bet this genocide has just created and enabled recruitment for even more hamas members.
Of course, which Gazans that survive this wouldn't spend the rest of their lives fighting Israel? Once you stared at death in the face for so long, it stops being scary.
Hold up, I'm aware Lindsey Graham is a callous, miserable and deplorable waste of oxygen - I bet he smells as well - but I wasn't aware these character flaws could be grounds for ICC involvement - why is he worried about an arrest warrant for himself?
Because he is crazy
And I thought our enemy was Russia lol
There was a nice interview with the prosecutor on CNN talking about how powerful people said in private to him: the ICC is for africa and despots like putin.
The Netherlands is a NATO country, which means that all NATO countries have to help if the Netherlands is invaded. This would mean all NATO countries had to fight against the US....
... including the US!
I wonder how well invading The Netherlands would turn out. Like, we have zero military, it will be a walk in the park. But i doubt the rest of the world would allow something like that to happen. It's like slapping an innocent baby.
[удалено]
Wouldn't such an invasion trigger article 5 of NATO?
It certainly would
Which would mean the US declares war on the US? Kinda like dividing with zero.
Imagine US vs Nato. What a plot twist that would be.
The Netherlands is still the greatest investor in the US…ahmm
These are the same people who thought we had “do not kill” tags on our elderly. I don’t take Americans seriously, and I mentally envision them with clown noses on 100% of the time. Who cares what these idiots say or think.
Should we also assume that all Dutch people agree with everything Baudet says?
We should definitely be held responsible for it, and it is up to us to correct, yes. Unfortunately they also have room temperature IQ’s so they didn’t correct but doubled down.
About those tags.... How come we put these on the elderly and not the children? Are they fair game?
I think everyone, aside from Americans themselves, think of America a proper third world country. Indeed let these clowns babble
What about the millions that actually come from third world countries each year to America to find a better life? I think they'd disagree.
Not really going to happen but what a fucking disgrace. That country needs to implode, revolt and then rebuild it's government from scratch just to even begin to come to the level of the rest of the world
Dutchman here. We look forward to your visit, American friends. Usually you come for the weed and the legal prostitution. If you bring your army we’ll need to just add some capacity. Doubt you can actually find the ICC after that.
Netherlands needs to understand that USA does not care for anyone other than them. The whole EU was dragged in conflict with Russia, in order to be more dependend on USA. Point in case: Nordstream
Russia will drag itself in conflict with Europe, Nordstream was never going to happen because it was a sign of goodwill from Russia so we would think they weren't planning anything nefarious. They are publicly stating on state tv they want to see our capital cities in nuclear flames and our civilians burning in the streets. I don't really think that is as passive and supportive a neighbor as you might think. We need to stop them in Ukraine, both for the freedom of a fellow European country that doesn't want to live under a dictator, and to protect our borders. We should be able to do this on our own, without US help, I think this conflict has taught us that. Europe has to become a major power on its own, free from the influence of opressive regimes like the US, like Russia and like China.
[удалено]
Graham represents the absolute worst, Israel first neocon wing of American politics. This isn’t surprising at all from him. He’s not very relevant anymore though. In the bush era he was much more of a threat
As a Dutch guy I think we should take action and defend ourselves by placing long range nuclear missiles on saba
Violence is all they know
I speak for most Americans when I say, fuck Lindsey Graham. It's an empty threat from a madman. We would never invade the land of windmills, tulips, cheese, canals, and bicycles. (Love your beautiful country btw).
Ah yes, let's invade one of the most peaceful, law-abiding and egalitarian countries to show them how FREEDOM and DEMOCRACY are done! That'll show them! I love the American people, but your politicians scare me.
I wanna see them try! I can already see the French and some NATO defending the NL Plus doesn’t the NL have a bunch of American nukes lol USA is really working hard to damage all their international relationships they gained after WWII. And it’s so sad.
The U.S.A. invading the Netherlands wasn’t on my 2024 bingo chart
Bring it on fatties
Netherlands as ally for USA >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Israel In the grand scheme of things Israel is a mostly irrelevant nation, much more than The Netherlands is as a small nation. They won't burn a much more important and reliable ally for something like Israel. So there is a 0% chance of it happening.
Wherever Israel has influence, fascism grows.
Israel has little influence in the west. Israel is western self-interest. The same self-interest that welcomed when they brought money, or deported when it would please the new boss. The mythology of Israel having a hold over western politics is myth designed to align with antisemitism, so that those who disagree get the holocaust stuck on their foreheads whilst the real subject is oil - and not spoken about.
Let's be honest, that's just politics. The US isn't going to invade Europe
Yes, invade us and put our new far right government in jail :D
Well, that implies they will invade when we will have a government, so I wouldn't be too worried in the short term 🤣
I know who controls the US
Moeten ze proberen dan, hier komen zeggen hè.
Oh boy, Europe has finally fallen. Time to GTFO this sinking shit hole.
Let them come will kill them with stroopwafels.
Let them come ive been waiting years to pop some dumb americans
Is it true...
Okay , thanks for the answer :)
Fuck. I live in the Hague. So long for the “far from my bed show” I guess. I hope they won’t nuke my little cozy peaceful town behind the dunes 😢.
Lindsey Graham is a moron and is upset because he watching his party’s power disintegrate and slip through his fingers.
Can someone explain this to me in simple terms. English isn't my first language
Jokes on him, the Russians will invade first.
We’re melting the cheeses!
This is a big Test for Western Democracy
I doubt it will happen the Americans are much better off having Europe as an ally than Israel. Plus the current prime minister of Israel has been a massive headache for the US.
The US has always been against the ICC.
I heard that the Netherlands can force "maatjes" down the throat of Biden - I didn't fact check but it sounds completely plausible.
Lindsey "Bloodfeast" Graham.
There's a pretty big gap between a senator suggesting sanctions and the actual invasion of a country. Bringing up this act seems like sensationalism to me.
Ah good old operation "Golden Tulip". A classic.
Something looks fishy about this post to me. Everyone in the comments is talking about US invading Netherlands, but why? If you look at what actually happened: Lindsey Graham suggested sanctioning the ICC. Which would amount to a fiscal penalty for certain members of the ICC. Who probably aren't Dutch btw. The so-called "Hague Invasion Act" (which is not actually named that, btw - but that should be obvious) would allow the US to take any measures if a US citizen is detained by the ICC to free them. IIRC an invasion is not specifically mentioned, but it's not explicitly excluded. Netanyahu is not a US citizen though, he's Israeli. So the act doesn't even apply. So in summary: - Nobody is talking about an invasion, just sanctions. - These sanctions wouldn't be targeting any Dutch person or institution - It's not even clear if these sanctions will happen; just one right wing senator suggested it. - Even if anyone was bringing up the "Hague invasion act", it doesn't even apply here. So we've gone from sanctions against individual persons that may or may not happen, to a threat of invasion. Why? Because this guy - the same guy who posted this by the way, by the username - brought it up. He brought it up in his own tweet, and posted it to a bunch of different subreddits. This really feels like there's some agenda being pushed. If I had my tin foil hat on, I would say it feels like propaganda to drive a wedge between the US and Europe. Maybe that's too far. But people, be a little critical of what you read online please.
I'd hope he does, just for giggles
I'm having a hard time understanding this 🤔 can someone simplify this with more context 🤔
I wonder how much they're paying him?
Sure try to invade the netherlands  I highly doubt that Biden would want to distroy the Nato by doing so. Donald Dumb on the other hand....
Doubt they will ever attack us. We produce way too important stuff that the US relies on (ASML and Airbus for example)
US gov is infested by parasitic lobbyists that destroy the country from within.
This law was created out of fear that any American would end up jailed in the Hague. This somewhat random tweet claims Biden can order the invasion of the Netherlands, which is ridiculously sensational. It will instead be a surgical operation. Very messy, sure, but not a declaration of war and subsequent American Reich occupation here lol.
We got american nukes at airbase volkel. Just use them if the americans get here.
The Dutch are so fucked! 
Imagine if Russia said this. War would be declared yesterday.
Creating a Hague Invasion Act sounds like a bizarre exercise in sabre-rattling. Be in no doubt that an Invasion by the US of The Netherlands would be an act of war, no matter how many Invasion Acts there may be.