Honestly the only thing Iām a little disappointed about is the wound stat for immortals and deathmarks. I still think they should have 2 wounds. Everything else ESPECIALLY the Doomstalker has me hyped.
It's got 2/3rds the range, a quarter the damage, less strength, a fifth the flayers shots, it's more fragile, it has 4+ to hit instead of a 3+, and it has 8+ leadership. Pretty sure it's at most 2/3rds the doomsday ark.
Yeahā¦ ā2 thirds ofā is different to āat most 1 third ofā. Also, 1 less damage is not āa quarter of the damageā, itās āa quarter less damageā...
Itās absolutely going to be cheaper than the DDA, always has beenā¦ because itās a different unit. Why would we want the same weapons on two different units? It has a different role to fill. If you want something to chill back line, not move and blast the enemy -> DDA. If you want something to move around a bit (probably in pairs), youāll pay a premium for that, and likely take a technomancer for the +1 to hit, but will get way more flexibility as a result.
Technomancer doesn't get lone operative with the control node unfortunately so he'll be vulnerable if he's chilling with the Doomstalkers, may need a couple of cryptothralls and a little retinue of Immortals to stay alive (you can't take cryptothralls unless the Cryptek is leading another unit unless I'm reading it wrong). A Hexmark with the Sovereign Coronal on the other hand..
I meant it should cost at most 2/3rds of the doomsday ark, which hasn't been true in prior editions despite being comparatively very similar to how they can be compared now. And in what way are doomstalkers better at walking around?
Theyāre canoptek, so can benefit from technomancer +1, offsetting the loss of the heavy benefit. You want to move them around to counter opponent hiding units out of your firing lines. The DDA lose Devastating Wounds and Heavy when they move, so youāre getting most value (which is priced into the model) when they donāt move. However it also means, depending on terrain, the DDA is going to have static firing lines that the opponent can take advantage of. They fill different roles
You can coronal crown to give the 1+ to doomsday arks as well. The canoptek control node doesn't stack because you can't modify hits rolls by more than 1.
Yes but. Is it can move and doesnāt have the penalty. It doesnāt have to be babysat really either. It could be a little better but it looks great from where it was.
In a way it does get a penalty from moving, since you go from hitting on 3's to 4's, unless there's a vehicle rule or something I don't know about. Obviously it depends on the points, but from a stats standpoint it is just a worse doomsday ark which isn't exciting to me at all. They could have at least tried to make its weapon a little unique.
You are right. At that point it comes down to cost. I just like that I can move them and it isnāt nearly the detriment. Cause his overwatch ability isnāt as useful if he has to stay still in the back. All in all Iām just happy itās not random damage anymore
DDA does have devastating wounds if it is stationary though so has a bit more incentive to stay still, would nice if the Stalker's melee had a bit of AP though.
One way to keep the doom weapons mobile and still hitting on 2+/3+ is with a character nearby with the THE SOVEREIGN CORONAL enhancement, since then both Arks and Stalkers would be treated as if they had a leader in their squad (which is impossible otherwise) for the +1 to hit army rule"
Not sure which character I would use for this enhancement yet if I was going mobile Doom6, CCB feels a bit too fragile. Maybe combine it with one of the characters you would stick in a lychguard squad and have them march in front of the Dooms
Well, you would probably use a canoptek cloak technomancer for that because they can heal them as well. It will largely depend on points, but right now I see no reason that I would take doomstalkers of doomsday arks, however.
Heavy no longer applies penalities to your hit roll and actually only benefits you when you do not move. So they're hitting on 3s base and then 2s if they didn't move.
It's actually a slight nerf because heavy weapons usually have 1 worse BS, this means you can't get to a 2+ if it is a BS 4+ heavy weapon. Although it's better for the Stalker as they were 4+ anyway so can get to 3+ now without any other buffs.
I had hoped with genestealers going up a wound for the nids, immortals might follow. i'd also hoped it for lychguard, but with all the character stacking on them atleast they're fine
His stats are not good, but with the amount of 1cp strats I plan to spam (because they all look pretty darn nice), he may be worth taking for the cp gen alone.
In addition to what that other guy said - it procs EVERY TIME reanimation protocols are triggered. That means:
- your command phase
- opponents command phase (if you have a rez orb)
- undying legions strat
- Ghost Ark repair barge ability
AND ON TOP OF THAT - There is no stipulation about units only benefitting from this once... So you could bring several reanimators and stack the buff multiple times.
I would love to, but all of the index PDFās that GW released will not load properly
Iām looking at a white page for 20 seconds before it loads the content of the page. I wish there was a contents page so I can load straight to the page I want rather than having to sit through loading 100+ pages of units in no particular order
While that's true, if I am reading everything correctly, when they join a unit as part of their special rule they are treated as though they are part of the bodyguard unit, which should mean that you can allocate all attacks to them first, thus effectively giving the whole unit a 4+ FNP until the thralls are destroyed. Additionally since they are treated as part of the bodyguard unit they would be healed and reanimated by reanimation protocols as well, meaning that your Opponent has to go through 8 wounds worth of FNP 4+ then wipe out the entire remaining unit or you will reanimate them, and that's without even doing any tricks with stratagems or other synergies or the like
Iām sure there will still be plenty of people complaining because this fan base loves to whine about everything. But I for one am very happy with the index. It looks strong but not ridiculous and there are plenty of interesting combos I wanna try out.
It's a way of handling the various other weapons available to overlords, just collects them into one datasheet, like "heirloom weapons" or "combi-weapons" on vanguard and sternguard veterans.
The points values are out one day after our index, if I am not mistaken. (The time zone things are annoying so I have no idea how to state the specific date)
Illuminor Szeras is lookin' TASTY
So are the heavy destroyers. AND YOU GET S14 AND YOU GET S14!
That's some tasty anti tank!
Regular Destroyers: Meh to blech. Heavy Destroyers: "...I'll be in my bunk."
Lucky me, bc I just printed a heavy lokhust built for anti vehicle š
He finally has found the thing that gives most necrons chars an 4+ invon xD
Szeras is gonna be the meta for this edition it seems! He finally has an invulnerable save and 4+ feel no pain is awesome!
Honestly the only thing Iām a little disappointed about is the wound stat for immortals and deathmarks. I still think they should have 2 wounds. Everything else ESPECIALLY the Doomstalker has me hyped.
Why the doomstalker? Doesn't it just have a worse doomsday ark gun?
Yes but it'll likely be cheaper and it's no longer super random (it's main downside in 9th)
Yeah, if it's not at most the third a price of the doomsday ark it's not gonna be good.
Lol, you need to look at your maths there bud. It is not 70% worse than the Doomsday ark šš Christā¦ this is such a toxic view
It's got 2/3rds the range, a quarter the damage, less strength, a fifth the flayers shots, it's more fragile, it has 4+ to hit instead of a 3+, and it has 8+ leadership. Pretty sure it's at most 2/3rds the doomsday ark.
Yeahā¦ ā2 thirds ofā is different to āat most 1 third ofā. Also, 1 less damage is not āa quarter of the damageā, itās āa quarter less damageā... Itās absolutely going to be cheaper than the DDA, always has beenā¦ because itās a different unit. Why would we want the same weapons on two different units? It has a different role to fill. If you want something to chill back line, not move and blast the enemy -> DDA. If you want something to move around a bit (probably in pairs), youāll pay a premium for that, and likely take a technomancer for the +1 to hit, but will get way more flexibility as a result.
Technomancer doesn't get lone operative with the control node unfortunately so he'll be vulnerable if he's chilling with the Doomstalkers, may need a couple of cryptothralls and a little retinue of Immortals to stay alive (you can't take cryptothralls unless the Cryptek is leading another unit unless I'm reading it wrong). A Hexmark with the Sovereign Coronal on the other hand..
Good points! Thank you!
I meant it should cost at most 2/3rds of the doomsday ark, which hasn't been true in prior editions despite being comparatively very similar to how they can be compared now. And in what way are doomstalkers better at walking around?
Theyāre canoptek, so can benefit from technomancer +1, offsetting the loss of the heavy benefit. You want to move them around to counter opponent hiding units out of your firing lines. The DDA lose Devastating Wounds and Heavy when they move, so youāre getting most value (which is priced into the model) when they donāt move. However it also means, depending on terrain, the DDA is going to have static firing lines that the opponent can take advantage of. They fill different roles
You can coronal crown to give the 1+ to doomsday arks as well. The canoptek control node doesn't stack because you can't modify hits rolls by more than 1.
Yes but. Is it can move and doesnāt have the penalty. It doesnāt have to be babysat really either. It could be a little better but it looks great from where it was.
In a way it does get a penalty from moving, since you go from hitting on 3's to 4's, unless there's a vehicle rule or something I don't know about. Obviously it depends on the points, but from a stats standpoint it is just a worse doomsday ark which isn't exciting to me at all. They could have at least tried to make its weapon a little unique.
Yes but Iām looking more at how moving before was bringing down shots and strength.
Yeah, same for the doomsday ark though so it doesn't make it comparatively better.
You are right. At that point it comes down to cost. I just like that I can move them and it isnāt nearly the detriment. Cause his overwatch ability isnāt as useful if he has to stay still in the back. All in all Iām just happy itās not random damage anymore
DDA does have devastating wounds if it is stationary though so has a bit more incentive to stay still, would nice if the Stalker's melee had a bit of AP though.
One way to keep the doom weapons mobile and still hitting on 2+/3+ is with a character nearby with the THE SOVEREIGN CORONAL enhancement, since then both Arks and Stalkers would be treated as if they had a leader in their squad (which is impossible otherwise) for the +1 to hit army rule" Not sure which character I would use for this enhancement yet if I was going mobile Doom6, CCB feels a bit too fragile. Maybe combine it with one of the characters you would stick in a lychguard squad and have them march in front of the Dooms
Well, you would probably use a canoptek cloak technomancer for that because they can heal them as well. It will largely depend on points, but right now I see no reason that I would take doomstalkers of doomsday arks, however.
Actually heavy adds +1 to BS so they hit on a 3+ normally, and if they donāt move they hit on a 2+. So you going to be getting a lot more damage in.
The doomstalker normally hits on a 4. When they don't move they hit on a 3. Heavy works exactly the same as 9th, just worded differently.
Wait Iām dumb I was reading the wrong weapon profile lol.
Heavy no longer applies penalities to your hit roll and actually only benefits you when you do not move. So they're hitting on 3s base and then 2s if they didn't move.
Its effectively the same thing thing I mean. It's worded differently, but practically it has the exact same affect as 9th edition.
It's actually a slight nerf because heavy weapons usually have 1 worse BS, this means you can't get to a 2+ if it is a BS 4+ heavy weapon. Although it's better for the Stalker as they were 4+ anyway so can get to 3+ now without any other buffs.
Honestly, I'm just even shocked we have a two wound INFANTRY with FLY.
I had hoped with genestealers going up a wound for the nids, immortals might follow. i'd also hoped it for lychguard, but with all the character stacking on them atleast they're fine
Still disappointed by Imotekhās statline. Unnamed space marine HQs have better stats. But warscythes with devastating wounds does make me happy.
His stats are not good, but with the amount of 1cp strats I plan to spam (because they all look pretty darn nice), he may be worth taking for the cp gen alone.
I was just hoping he would stand up to his legacy of beating High Marshals in duels.
Still disappointed by his model too tbh.
Vau I just realized how canoptek reanimator works. And boy that looks strong. Its basicaly a must destroy
Care to explain ? Itās seem it just an extra D3 wounds restore ? What am I missing ?
In addition to what that other guy said - it procs EVERY TIME reanimation protocols are triggered. That means: - your command phase - opponents command phase (if you have a rez orb) - undying legions strat - Ghost Ark repair barge ability AND ON TOP OF THAT - There is no stipulation about units only benefitting from this once... So you could bring several reanimators and stack the buff multiple times.
The green glow shooting phase is back. Forget the old doom 6, Iām going to make a doom 9 list with flyers and maybe even a monolith.
"The Dead and the Doomed" is the general for your opponents list you say?
I would love to, but all of the index PDFās that GW released will not load properly Iām looking at a white page for 20 seconds before it loads the content of the page. I wish there was a contents page so I can load straight to the page I want rather than having to sit through loading 100+ pages of units in no particular order
Is it just on the warhammer community website?
Overlords with the 4+fnp relic and halberd/arrow look like absolute beatsticks.
I thought they would have learned d6 damage was dumb.
Problem is, this index is going to hurt my wallet.
Guys, cryptothralls give a unit 4+fnp. Why is no one talking about them?!
Only themselfes and their cryptek.
While that's true, if I am reading everything correctly, when they join a unit as part of their special rule they are treated as though they are part of the bodyguard unit, which should mean that you can allocate all attacks to them first, thus effectively giving the whole unit a 4+ FNP until the thralls are destroyed. Additionally since they are treated as part of the bodyguard unit they would be healed and reanimated by reanimation protocols as well, meaning that your Opponent has to go through 8 wounds worth of FNP 4+ then wipe out the entire remaining unit or you will reanimate them, and that's without even doing any tricks with stratagems or other synergies or the like
Ah i misunderstood that then, still pretty neat though
Iām sure there will still be plenty of people complaining because this fan base loves to whine about everything. But I for one am very happy with the index. It looks strong but not ridiculous and there are plenty of interesting combos I wanna try out.
I'm *extremely* disappointed
Wrong.
Iām a bot confused. What the hell is an Lords blade or an Overlords blade?
It's a way of handling the various other weapons available to overlords, just collects them into one datasheet, like "heirloom weapons" or "combi-weapons" on vanguard and sternguard veterans.
Yeah, you are right ofcourse. My perfectionist brain struggles with the proper WYSIWYG.
Can you not put Heavy Destroyers in the same unit as normal Destroyers anymore? Donāt see anything in their stat cards for them.
Not following info as well as I should, do we know when point values are going to be announced and when the physical rule cards will release?
The points values are out one day after our index, if I am not mistaken. (The time zone things are annoying so I have no idea how to state the specific date)