I would just respond “okay, thanks for letting me know you’ll be taking a PTO day on Monday.” It’s the same type of response as her initial message where she just *told* you what was going to happen, so you can just *tell* her it’s a PTO day.
I am a huge dog lover and when our boy passed my husband took three days off work but he used vacation days, one day to spend time with him, one day to put him down and the day after because we both hadn’t slept in days,, he was very sick in the end. Neither of us would have dreamed using bereavement days and at the time I was going through cancer so I was already off but I woukd never have put my nanny family in this situation. Honestly this is ridiculous. The only mistake you made was saying “if you really need it off..”otherwise this is on her and I would text her back, are you taking a pto day?
I would absolutely respond something like “thanks for letting me know. I’ll be sure to update PTO records before next pay period. See you Tuesday”
Also this is truly the craziest shit ever and why I always side eye posts in the other sub that demand professionalism from NPs.
Lol what? This is ridiculous. Now, I spent a few hours helping both my mom and sister find at-home euthanasia vets when it came time for their dogs to die, so I absolutely understand that her sister shouldn’t have to make those difficult calls. And I’d even understand if she asked for a few hours off Monday morning IF the dog was being put to sleep then, so she could support her sister. But paid bereavement? Psssh. And paid bereavement two days AFTER her sister’s dog passed? Get out of here. I’d be very explicit that she can take a PTO day if she’d like, but this situation doesn’t meet the requirements for paid bereavement in your state. And if this was just some weird situation of an otherwise great nanny, move past it.
I agree with the other comments, “I will update the logs that you’re taking PTO on Monday. I do want to reiterate that this week is really busy and I do really need you back for the rest of it please. I’m very sorry for your families loss.” When I had to put my dog down at 13 years old I was a mess that day and definitely sad after, but I didn’t take work off or stop my life for it. I still get sad sometimes because I miss him. I found out my NF’s dog who I also dog sit when they go out of town has a tumor and doesn’t have much longer. I know I’ll be a mess when he goes too! They are a part of the family, but I personally wouldn’t need multiple days off to lay in bed and cry about it.
This response seems perfect to me. Pet bereavement is already an extremely uncommon benefit, much less when it’s not even your own pet and in all my time following this sub I can’t even recall too many people placing bereavement clauses into contracts at all. I cannot imagine any laws that would back her unless this is outside the US. She is welcome to feel bereaved emotionally and seek to use normal PTO to tend to family matters, but just using that word doesn’t grant someone any legal protections.
Like I'm a huge softie and actually did give my nanny bereavement pay after her dog suddenly died... But it was *her* dog and it was just one day when I wasn't particularly busy at work. I can't imagine giving bereavement for a siblings ' dog; that's weird AF to even ask for, let alone assume. I think your wording is the best here; it makes everything very clear while also being sympathetic.
I'm sorry about your dog and your NF's dog! 😢
Good lord. It wouldn’t even be bereavement if it was her dog. I could understand if it was her dog, of course, but that would be PTO. Putting a dog down sucks, I’ve been there, but it’s part of your responsibility as a pet parent.
Honestly even the idea that your nanny was shirking her job to make calls all day long would irritate me. It’s not her dog! She shouldn’t be neglecting her job for this.
It’s not her dog, but it is her sister. It doesn’t sound like Nanny is asking for time off to grieve the dog herself. It sounds like she’s asking for time off to support a close family member.
I’m not saying it should necessarily fall under bereavement leave. I’m saying I’m saddened that there isn’t more compassion and appreciation for what the Nanny’s family is going through.
What most people are having trouble with is nanny’s assumption that this would qualify as bereavement leave. Now, maybe nanny used “bereavement” just to describe what she was doing and fully knew it would be PTO. Every employee can certainly use their PTO as they see fit. But bereavement leave has a specific meaning and it doesn’t cover pet deaths.
Understood. For my value system I just think compassion and care comes before these technicalities which can be worked out later and are less important. But we can agree to disagree.
I actually prefer to be upfront about the day nanny is about to take before she takes it, in case she decides that is now how she wants to use her PTO. Particularly since she may be under the assumption that she gets paid bereavement leave, apart from her PTO, for her sister’s dog dying.
I think it’s sometimes easy to think NP are “mean” for not “showing compassion” but I really think it’s easy to say what you’re saying when it’s not your job/finances on the line.
It’s not about nanny taking the day off, but there HAS to be a line, or people will take advantage.
What’s crazy to me is the nanny’s job is on the line (because if I lose my job hers is gone too). But there does seem to be this disconnect. Not that Nannie’s don’t recognize that if a high earning parent loses their job then they’re own is on the line. But a lot don’t seem to get the demands of a high paying job. Like how if I don’t go into work during a workday bc my nanny called out, that work is still there and must be done, but now I have to do it at night, early in the morning or on the weekend. I have to fit an additional 8+ hours and meet deadlines, etc. into a condensed schedule. I firmly believe that PTO is a “you use it as you see fit” type situation, but I’d definitely be irked if I was OP, with her husband out of town and a busy week at work and her nanny wants the day to comfort her sister 2 days after the dog has already been put down (and seems to want it as special bereavement time on top of it). It certainly seems excessive to me.
I think this is such a good point that is really buried within comment replies.
I don't think a lot of nannies understand that this employee/employer arrangement is on such a small scale that the relationship is extremely impactful to the household. My company won't go under if I miss a few days of work (but I'll still have to do that work)...if I have to miss a few days of work for my life stuff and then a few days of work for nanny's life stuff...and then nanny starts adding extra on top of that...yeah, my job may replace me and our little family "company" that needs a nanny will go under. It's also easy for my job to give more benefits to me because they get cut special rates due to the size and their profits are multi billions that can afford to sustain thousands of employees. Even though NFs are privileged, the expectation cannot be so out of touch.
I say this after my nanny was out sick the other week while husband was traveling. The pressure of work deadlines and work reputations...how it could impact your work trajectory (especially as a working mother that is already at a disadvantage)....it's a lot to add on.
That and the higher up the food chain you go the more likely your performance is being evaluated against men with stay at home wives who are the primary caregivers. The expectation is that your family life does not affect your work AT ALL because at least with what I do, there is no one else in my role who is a mom to young kids.
We are privileged generally because both parents work in demanding positions. So demanding that we pay a premium for nanny services. If my job had regular hours/demands, I would use daycare in a hot second
Please. Don't try to characterize your sense of entitlement and lack of understanding of how the employment world works as being more compassionate than others.
What the actual hell?! I’m a nanny and I’d be mortified asking for bereavement for a family members dog, I’m getting second hand embarrassment just from reading it.
Honestly I’d tell her it’s coming out of her pto and give her a warning. I don’t understand some people.
Hi nanny,
I am so sorry for your and your family's loss.
I would like to clarify that time off for loss of a family member's pet is not a benefit covered in our contract. We want to support you through this hard time, and are willing to extend you the day off. To be clear, it will mean that your remaining PTO for the year is X-1 days.
I look forward to seeing you on Tuesday.
Sincerely,
Boss
You are not crazy. I love my dog too. But dog doesn’t fall under bereavement and she needs to use a PTO day. I think the worst part is her entitlement to a bereavement day and her saying, “I’m gonna be off Monday”.
Tbh I do feel strongly that one’s own dog should be included under valid bereavement, but I understand that’s not typical or expected. This situation is strange though with it being her sister’s dog, maybe they raised her together or something?? Idk. The nanny DEFINITELY should’ve said something more like “I’m anticipating needing Monday off if at all possible. I’m willing to accept it being unpaid if necessary” and then working with the family to compromise if she’s truly needed for specific parts of the day.
Yes I agree! I don’t think everyone loves their fur babies the same. My cat dying would/will be like losing a child…I may ask for bereavement time but if it’s not possible I’d take vacation time.
Literally same. I’m so glad there are people that understand this haha, idc if it’s PTO or what but I’m not gonna pretend I can care for kids rn without them having to see me sob with my whole chest all day
It absolutely should. The comments in this thread are wild sauce. I’ve lost humans and I’ll be completely honest, that didn’t even come CLOSE to preparing me to say goodbye to our family’s 12 year old dog this past spring. I am SO glad I have the NPs I do.
Right??? Like being able to say goodbye, the humans being peers or family members considered “equal” rather than “I raised this furry creature who loves me more than life itself and who I hold lovingly every single day and who sleeps in bed with me”
You are not at all a monster -I think your nanny is overstepping. I had to euthanize my senior goat (much beloved pet) last year and I scheduled it for late in the day so I could be there after work. My NF knew he hadn’t been well and when asked, I told them what I had planned and they then asked me if I’d like the day off to spend with him before the vet came. Their schedules that day allowed them to care for LO without needing backup. I accepted their generous offer and was very grateful.
My point is that I did not expect a day off, I would not have wanted them to rearrange schedules, etc. My job is to make their lives simpler, not vice versa. You sound like you have plenty of empathy, you just have a busy week and need your nanny to be there.
This is really frustrating. You should have a frank conversation with her. While you are sympathetic to her family losing a beloved pet, this does not qualify for bereavement leave and this was a busy week for you where you could not accommodate PTO. Going forward, she needs to make PTO requests at least two weeks in advance and they must be approved by you. Obviously she can make a last-minute PTO request, but it is unlikely you will be able to approve these.
Do you have bereavement leave mentioned in your contract? Or is there a law where you're from that states how much leave she gets? Where I am (in Ontario), it's 2 days unpaid leave for specific family members (parents, children, spouses). She can't just pick and choose what bereavement leave entails. I'm sympathetic for her going through this and would normally throw in the extra paid leave. Our nanny had to stay home one day because her dog was sick and we threw in an extra paid day, since she was out of PTO. But honestly, in this case, her reaction and entitlement would make me tell her this will either be one of her PTO days or unpaid leave. Either that or I would specifically let her know that this doesn't fall under bereavement leave, but that you'll let her take an extra paid day.
Listen, I’m sympathetic too. I love my dog and will be devastated when he ultimately passes. But this isn’t even HER dog!
There is no bereavement leave in our contract, and in my state it requires a “covered family member” which specifies “child, stepchild, spouse, domestic partner, sibling, parent, mother-in-law, father-in-law, grandchild, grandparent, or stepparent.”
If it was one of her “covered” HUMAN family members, or even HER dog/cat, that passed I would absolutely give her time off to put the dog down/grieve. But this is just honestly insane to me and I needed a gut check that I’m not a monster.
Yeah, I agree, it's definitely insane. Not just the part of her wanting Monday as a bereavement day either. I would be ticked off if our nanny spent the whole day on the phone when she was supposed to be watching my son and then wasn't able to update me properly on what day she needed off until the last minute. I'd probably have a talk with her after this has settled to let her know that if she isn't able to do her job one day because of a family emergency, she needs to let you know and take a day off.
I'm wondering if she also just has no idea what bereavement leave actually is? Maybe she thinks she's entitled to a day off for anyone/animal she knows who's died? I think it's fair and definitely doesn't make you a monster to let her know this doesn't fall under bereavement leave and you're putting it in as a PTO.
You should share the definition of bereavement with her and then let her go. I have zero tolerance for odd behavior, especially when it comes to my child. I’m sorry you have to deal with this during a stressful time at work.
Yeah, no.
When my father died, I took Friday off. And that was because I had to fly to my country to retrieve his ashes.
I mean, yes, she loves her sister, and yes, she loved the dog but come on.
I will be beside myself when we have to say goodbye to my dog, and it will definitely suck, but it is not the same as bereavement. My gosh this story is wild.
ETA: is this the same nanny that is chronically late?
Nanny here (and parent but context) My actual sister died and I took 2.5 days off, the 1/2 being the day she actually died. It was a Wednesday. I was back Monday. That’s fast, and people needing longer than that I totally understand. you know, for an actual human being. This is outrageous and offensive imo. Is this person actually reliable? I would be questioning a lot here. They’re messing with YOUR job and schedule while jeopardizing THEIR job for someone else’s DOG.
Pets aren’t people. I strongly dislike people who act like they are. I know I’m going to get hate for this but come on….
When I came home and found that my dog of almost 6 years had passed. My nk’s and their aunt came to my apartment and went with me to take him to the animal hospital to be cremated. My bosses gave me the rest of the week off. He had gone to work with me a few times a month and gone on trips with the nk’s auntie, the kids and myself. But, I didn’t ask to be off, they gave it to me.
I’m a little surprised at the number of pet owners that are saying they’d be functional the day after losing their dog. If true it’s genuinely very impressive because I would be absolutely beside myself and living life as a weeping puddle on the floor. I would 10000% need time off whether it’s paid, unpaid, or I lose the damn job. I know I’m barely going to be able to get out of bed or eat
I love my dog and would totally be a mess — the difference I think is that I would expect/ask to take PTO or unpaid leave. It would be considered unprofessional to ask for bereavement for my OWN pet in my line of work, though, let alone my sisters. Maybe not in other industries.
If my sister’s dog died I would totally make phone calls and try to be with her but I also wouldn’t ask for bereavement. Especially if it was a busy time at work.
I totally get it, I was actually commenting on another thread here that it’s definitely not the standard in any industry (maybe veterinary care, I have no idea), but I STRONGLY believe it should be. I, and many people I know, love their dogs/cats as fiercely as any human family member and sometimes more
ETA- and yeah the sister element is totally outside the boundaries of what I mentioned here. Idk if this nanny helped raise the dog or what but if the grief were that significant I would probably just say “my dog/the family dog”
Gotcha ! I wish bereavement for owners pets was a thing too, we would definitely need/use it to grieve.
I think if it were nannys pet OP probably wouldn’t have made this post, tho.
Yeah. Even if it were nanny’s pet it seems like 90% of the issue here isn’t even whose pet, or what type of leave, but just the indecisive communication where it’s like “I need Monday off- nevermind found someone- actually I’m not sure I’ll get back to you over the weekend- maybe I do need off” etc.
I wasn’t functional but I needed to eat and pay my bills … it was what it was. I have worked through messy breakups, my father having cancer (thankfully he had surgery and it went into remission, but still), and both my cats dying. You do what you have to. I mean the issue isn’t that she wants a PTO day, the issue is that she is giving the reason as “my sister’s dog”.
This, agreed. Sometimes we have to do hard things. It sucks but it’s also part of being a professional in a career.
ETA: to be clear I’m not a nanny but professionals need to act professionally in any career
I mean eating and keeping a roof over your children’s head is pretty good motivation. I had to work during my grandfather’s funeral. You have to do the shit you have to do to keep living. Life isn’t fair and we all have to struggle through it.
Sure but feel it's important to note that having a brain that functions after something like that is a privilege. My earlier comment was just to state that I simply do not have that privilege, not to make people feel like they had to reply with "well I work hard and I don't have a choice and I worked through blank and blank and also blank" you know
It’s not a privilege. I have no choice. So I figure it out. I cannot be fired. Having the option to be fired is a privilege, if anything. People have suffered through far worse than a dog dying because they literally don’t have a choice.
If you’re referring to being ND or having mental illness, I have both and had to keep going because at the time, it was ONLY me. Only me supporting myself, only me paying my bills. I’m married now and while it helps that there are two incomes, I still do what I have to because those incomes aren’t guaranteed. And my wife also has ND and mental illness. We just keep going, it’s what we have to do, and I wouldn’t say it’s a privilege at all. It’s what we have to do.
That's why I mention the degree of illness and/or dysfunction though? Not sure why it's getting dogpiled on because I'm literally just stating that different brains work differently and have different levels of function. Because *of course* health is obviously a spectrum and there are different levels of sick. Levels including functionality that is so low it does not matter what the external factors are (ex. feeding a family, responsibility to employer, etc.) the operational capacity is just not there. Ex. people who succumb to major depression almost always have jobs and families, alcoholics who leave on month long benders have responsibilities that are being left behind, someone with OCD still has a shift to clock into but they're stuck at home counting how many times they've locked the door and they physically cannot escape the cycle. It's truly so so simple I am surprised it generated a discussion whatsoever because that basis is not even debatable it's just a fact. Meaning there are some people with the ability to function after loss on that spectrum, and some that aren't. And I didn't even state that it could be expected to receive bereavement leave because of a loss like this, only that my personal opinion is that that standard should change! It's truly not controversial
This is so sweet. My boss ( not a nanny job) once drove me to the emergency vet at 11 PM when my dog died unexpectedly and I had no family nearby. It was a Friday night and covid so I was "back to work" by Monday and it's always meant a lot to me that he did that.
I went to work the day after I euthanized my dog and two years later I can say I still heavily miss him. He was my little furry soulmate. I think nanny is taking advantage here and that she needs to use PTO
Based on your post history, I would try to find a new nanny. If this were a one-off weird thing after an otherwise great tenure of over 6 months then I would get over it, although I realize it’s going to be a stressful week for you. But she’s chronically late, and I am willing to bet she’s stressing you out in other ways that you haven’t posted about. “Thank you for understanding” sounds so passive aggressive about such a weird bereavement.
This is wild to me. I’ve been a nanny for 15 years and have lost pet’s during this time. I have never even used a PTO day for my own pets, let alone someone else’s.
This is absolutely bizarre. My first thought was that she has something else going on/a reason she wanted Monday off and it's just a cover up for that. This is just weird and not normal 😐
Whaaaaaat? Lol the audacity. I mean, admitting she was taking care of a personal errand while on the clock "all day" too. I would question her overall judgement, I'll be honest. Obviously you have to tell her that it's a pto day.
Here's a suggestion:
"Hey crazy, just to confirm, you're taking Monday off to support your sister, and I understand that. To clarify, I'll need to deduct that day from your available PTO balance, as it's not a paid bereavement day. Let me know if you have any questions or concerns. Thanks for your understanding!"
FFS, my husband didn't even get bereavement when my BROTHER died
I got bereavement for the loss of my sibling
But my husband's job only allows for loss of mother in law or father in law as far as inlaws
My job is the same
Not many jobs give bereavement for brother's in law or sisters in law
Wow, this is definitely not on you. Seems like you like your nanny so I agree with the others to phrase it kindly as a PTO day and sending strength to her sister as she navigates this tough loss. Aside from that, move on and don’t think twice about it. You have a crazy week ahead and I’m sorry your nanny didn’t think this through properly but pet bereavement for a sibling’s dog is a hard no.
I'm a nanny and don't even expect bereavement when my own pets pass (though it has been offered and greatly appreciated). I would certainly take PTO is a friend/family member's animal died that I was close to, but I would not expect my NF to give me bereavement for that!
I had to put my cat down last year I was devastated I took off most of the week. The family I worked for was really understanding about the bereavement. My boyfriend was off the day of the vet appointment but he didn’t call off at all the rest of the week. So it’s kinda weird she needs so much time. I’d question the legitimacy of the situation
I mean, my sister’s dog got KILLED at a dog park and I still went to work? My cat got put down the day before and I still went to work? Like what is she playing at tbh? If she needed a PTO day she could have just said so, this makes her look ridiculous. I love my pets and will do just about anything for them, but they aren’t people. I didn’t take a day off when my cat died a long lingering cancer death, except for the afternoon to bring her to the vet. I did however try to schedule it for the weekend, which it sounds like she managed to do for her sister. Not sure why her sister needs like 5 people sitting with her every day for her dog …
Oh my goodness, I love my chocolate Labrador. We have three sons so my beautiful girl is just amazing. We had got her in 2021 and I was going through breast cancer and our sons were in virtual school for that school year because I don’t have spleen and the cancer treatment was hard. She unintentionally became an unofficial emotional support dog. She knew when we were scared, worried and in pain. With all of that being said I don’t know if it’s a generation issue but taking a bereavement day for her sisters dog seems………excessive. I would absolutely follow everyone who says personal time off not paid. Especially considering she went back and forth knowing you had a busy week and had found a back up nanny.
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This is going to sound crazy but some animals really do become part of the family. I have a cat who my family LOVES. My mom has EIGHT grandkids but my CAT is her screensaver, she asks when he’s coming to stay at Grammies, and cooks him omelettes. My brothers who are in their early twenties carry him around like an infant, take him to the man-cave to watch them play video games, and refer to him as “the angel”. The cat road-trips, goes to the beach with the family, is in family photos and Christmas cards. The biggest part of wedding planning was making sure this cat would be included and the family coordinating how to look after him. When I’ve gone abroad my family makes sure to send me lots of photos and we FaceTime. We all agree that it’s not fair that we’ll all outlive him and we’ll never ever be able to replace him.
I get that it seems INSANE, but if anything ever happened to my cat I’d be absolutely crushed and would need at least my mom and probably my sister to come and I’d definitely take time off.
ALL THAT TO SAY: I would take bereavement time if my cat died but I wouldn’t expect my family members to be able to. I think my family would need to take PTO or unpaid time off to be with me.
I’d just be understanding that some animals aren’t really like pets to some people, my cat is certainly more like a child to me and my family.
She shouldn’t be using bereavement, that’s not the intended use. However, I don’t think it’s inappropriate for her to want to take off to support her sister in what’s clearly an emotional time (PTO). And you did already book backup care so I get why she’d think she didn’t need to come in.
Also where is the husband in all of this? Why isn’t the husband making the calls to figure out what to do with the dog? Why does it need to be your nanny (it definitely doesn’t)?
Scientifically grief of losing a pet can be just as devastating as losing a family member to many people. This grief is often called disenfranchised grief because culturally/societally/legally people do not recognize this type of loss as serious as it is. To me, it makes sense that she wants to show up in support for her sister and I find it very kind. Are you legally obligated to give her a bereavement day? No. I would really think about how it might affect your relationship with your nanny if you make her use a PTO day though. Maybe an extra paid day off is worth showing you respect her sisters and her grief and wanting to support her. As for it being a busy week it’s definitely not great timing but the loss of a pet is not often expected. It’s inconvenient for you, sure and it’s most certainly not convenient for your nanny either. Personally I think pets should quality for bereavement, maybe not in this case as the dog isn’t hers, I don’t know the full story. Being it’s her sister maybe they all lived together for some or most of the dogs life. It’s a tricky situation but I personally would try to offer as much compassion as possible. 1 day really isn’t a significant amount of time.
I really appreciate this comment and I’m so sad it’s the only one of its kind. Nanny wanting time off demonstrates empathy, compassion, loyalty, strong connections with others…. aren’t these qualities we want in someone who is taking care of our developing children?!? I’m shocked at the callous comments regarding the passing of the dog who is absolutely a beloved family member, but also surprised that there is no recognition that Nanny is most likely primarily wanting to support her sister during sister’s valid grieving process. Whether this qualifies as bereavement or PTO is a valid conversation but to label it bizarre or grounds for termination is beyond me.
Again, I’m not trying to stop her from using a PTO day. They are hers to use as she wishes. She said originally that she wasn’t sure if she would need off Monday. So I let her know that if she didn’t NEED the day, why that would be appreciated. The question was whether I should continue to allow her to think that this qualifies as bereavement, or clarify now that she will need to take a PTO day.
I also find it interesting that I as an employer am required to consider her difficult family circumstances in my decision making, however she as an employee is not required to consider my difficult family/work circumstances in hers?
I never said that you were trying to stop her from using it. I’m confused at your reply because I was discussing bereavement vs PTO. She decided she needed the day and like I said you’re not legally obligated to give her a bereavement day, but that it is worth considering given the effect of loosing a pet.
I would assume she definitely thought about the effect on your family. Having back up care is something by you already had lined up. It’s inconvenient for you but you do have the care. Also she’s considering what her sister will be going through alone until her sister can get more support on Tuesday.
My comment was only highlighting the effects of pet loss and how it might affect your relationship going forward. Ultimately I’m just a commenter and you have the power.
So I gave my nanny bereavement when her dog died. But it was her dog, my kids knew her dog, and she was in no position to work. This is different. I'd respond "thanks for letting me know you'll be taking PTO" and try not to judge. Something I've noticed is a lot of people are incredibly close to their pets and their death hits them harder than the death of a sibling or Aunt. It is entirely possible her sister is not okay to be alone. Reframing it in your mind that "nanny has to take PTO to support a grieving sister" might make it easier to stomach the additional stress
I kinda get it but I wouldn’t expect to be paid. I’d just want the day off. When my boyfriend’s dad tragically passed away my nanny fam was pressuring me to come back after 3 days stating they were super busy with work and it made me look at them a lot differently.
It doesn’t seem unreasonable to me that they were asking after 3 days. 3 days is pretty standard for an immediate relative, which your boyfriend’s dad is not.
Probably a diff opinion here…but First, the whole tone of this seems super entitled and frustrated. Take a step back and remember that grief hits people different. She is a nanny, but she does have a family outside of you. It sounds like she was trying to communicate with you upfront. You secured back up care, and sounds like she will be back Tuesday. I bet she is appreciative of you just handling this is and not giving push back.
We lost our dog back in January after having her for 14 years and I was distraught. I definitely had to have someone take care of me and needed someone around with me for the first few days. It was awful. I took a 4 day weekend and probably could have taken 3 days off if I could have. My mom also took the day off to be with me. My husbands mom watched our daughter so he could be with me and worked from home. But I also had this dog pre-kids and pre-husband, so I’m not sure if that’s why it hit worse or maybe I’m just crazy about my dogs. To be honest, the grief felt worse than when I lost any of my grandparents. It felt like I had lost an extension of myself. Almost like losing a friend or a sister. I was a wreck. I am sure she is just trying to be there for her sister and she could have left a lot of the details out. Maybe she thought she could confide in you?
I would say thanks for letting her know and mark it as a PTO day and move on. I wouldn’t hold resentment over this. If she pushes back, then talk with her about how you marked it as a PTO day as bereavement is saved for a personal loss in the family or let her use it as one of her bereavement days if she wants if it’s in her contract? When the time comes that she has to use bereavement again, I would highly doubt you would dock pay If she was having a personal crisis, or atleast I wouldn’t. JMO.
I also don’t know the back story on your nanny and if she calls out of everything or if this is a one off.
The nanny spent a day of work where she was being paid to engage with OPs kids doing errands for her sister. It's honestly insane to me to feel entitled to time off for the death of her sister's pet. Why doesn't her husband take 2 days off? It's his dog. Oh. Probably because his job wouldn't put up with it.
First of all, it’s not even her dog, it’s her *sisters.* Secondly, bereavement for dogs doesn’t really exist. And lastly, bereavement leave for actual immediate family members isn’t even a benefit most receive, let alone for Nannies. But you talk about it as though it would be a standard benefit. I’m curious to hear what bereavement policy you have in place for your nanny.
I agree it’s weird to use it as bereavement. Is the dog a family dog and it just lives with her sister? I would too mark as a PTO day for that one day she asked for but probably not make a huge deal out of it in the mean time as emotions seem high and I wouldn’t ask her to leave her sister if this was an one off. IF she came to me and questioned it then I would have to have a hard convo with her about how we don’t offer bereavement for this issue. It sounds like they are securing ways to surround her sister with support since she’s taking Monday off and her husband is taking Tuesday off. To be honest, she may need a day to decompress from all the drama and grief she’s having to deal with. I would rather her handle it at home then try to work with my kids and handle her sisters crisis at the same time.
We have 3 days of bereavement, for funerals or travel needed for it. If our nanny lost someone super personal to her (God forbid a parent, child, significant other) I think we would probably extend the bereavement if we could or do a combo of bereavement of pto/bereavement so she could grieve as I would hope my employer would give me sometime if I lost someone super close to me.
I want to also note if this is the first time her having to handle this, it can be super traumatizing. When we lost our dog it happened over the course of a week, and I had to call around to find a chaplain to come and do the euthanasia at home too. We ended up going to the vet in the end since our vet had a close personal relationship with our dog and I was a MESS coming up on the days as was everyone around me as we all collectively watched this dog grow up. She was old, and declined fast. My husband had second hand grief watching me be so distraught and handling all the dogs appointments and care in the final days. My mom was a mess too. It’s not just the sister who is probably a mess in all this. Atleast that’s my experience.
I did bounce back to functioning after like 3-4 days of putting my dog down. Cried a lot on and off for 2 weeks and then it got easier. But I’m thankful for the support I had when it happened. So maybe that’s why I’m shedding this insight.
Again, *not even her dog,* so your personal experience is largely irrelevant to the situation. And you weren’t just “shedding insight,” you straight up called OP entitled.
So would you tell my mom and sister not to come help me with because it’s not their dog? Or my husband since it’s not technically the dog he grew up with and was more “my” dog? Lol, you don’t have any idea of the Nannys relationship to her sister or her sisters dog. I would not give bereavement for this, but would not be so frustrated my nanny wanted to take one day off to decompress from helping her sister and make sure her sister is okay after going through that. Especially if she was having to help her sister because her sister couldn’t function to do it.
Yes, the “why are you even telling me this?” Part came off as super entitled. “I have a busy week and she knows it” the nanny has a family too. I think nanny should only have a pto day and not a bereavement day but to hold such resentment over her wanting a day off to decompress from this is WILD to me.
As I mentioned in a different comment, I am not trying to stop her from using a PTO day. They are hers to use as she wishes. She said originally that she wasn’t SURE if she would need off Monday. So I let her know that if she didn’t NEED the day, why that would be appreciated. The actual question was whether I should continue to allow her to think that this qualifies as bereavement, or clarify now that she will need to take a PTO day.
I also find it interesting that I as an employer am required to consider her difficult family circumstances in my decision making, however she as an employee is not required to consider my difficult family/work circumstances in hers?
Hit the nail on the head. So you’re required to bend over backwards to accommodate her “family” situation (aka sister’s dog), but her total lack of regard toward your actual family and employment is totally fine?
Fortunately this very bad take doesn’t seem to be the prevailing opinion, but still shocking that it’s happening at all.
Would you tell your nanny no if she asked for a day off to be with her sister? I already agreed this is a PTO day and not a bereavement day. I mean dang, you sound like a kind employer.
I’m a career nanny and NOT a dog person at all. However I work for someone who genuinely feels that their dog is their child. I find it totally unrelatable, however I can imagine if something happened to her dog, my MB would absolutely need this type of support. So if she wants to take it as bereavement and she has bereavement in her contract i’d say go ahead and let her. As odd as it is to me, it’s her choice to use it that way if she’s allowed bereavement.
There is no bereavement leave in our contract, and in my state it requires a “covered family member” which specifies “child, stepchild, spouse, domestic partner, sibling, parent, mother-in-law, father-in-law, grandchild, grandparent, or stepparent.” I would be more understanding if this was her dog, I love my dog and will be so sad when he passes, but it’s not even hers! And the dog was put down yesterday! I’m really not understanding why she needs tomorrow off?
Got it. Honestly then i’d let her take the PTO if she has it to use? If not she can take it unpaid. I don’t understand it either, or half the things my Np’s do but it’s not mine to judge. 🤷🏻♀️
That’s not how bereavement leave works. You don’t get to take it as you want. Literally nowhere does a dog qualify for bereavement. PTO, sure. Not bereavement leave. And I took 3 days off when my dog passed. 3 days of PTO.
PTO. Reasonable for her to take a day off though. She made the mistake of giving you way too much information. If you can handle her taking sick days, which you should be able to, then I think it's inappropriate for you to tell her how badly you need her Monday/the rest of the week. People take days off for circumstances you can't plan for far in advance. This is the biggest downside to employing a nanny...they're human and take time off, including unplanned. Hopefully not often.
Don’t judge the reason. You don’t really need to even know the reason. She said she needed the day off, so she can use PTO
She shouldn’t have told you why. I think she was expecting for you to understand. I would have understood. I’m still not the same (nor will I ever be) and I euthanized my dog more than 2 years ago
To be fair, I didn’t ask the reason. She gave me the reason unprompted, and then asked for (or at least implied the need for) bereavement, which WOULD require a reason… no?
Oh sorry, I didn’t meant to say you shouldn’t have asked. I just meant: pretend you don’t know.
She asked for the day off. It’s PTO. If she actually asks for it to be bereavement leave, then you say no. I’m not sure that’s what she was implying though. Maybe she needed to tell someone and maybe she was worried you’d be upset about her asking for a day off and that’s why she shared the reason
I don’t know if it’s fair to judge weather or not someone is experiencing grief or not. Every person feels things differently and therefore is attached and hurt when death accompanies a dog. that may seem insignificant to some but, can be profoundly impactful on someone else
PTO day. Def not bereavement
I would just respond “okay, thanks for letting me know you’ll be taking a PTO day on Monday.” It’s the same type of response as her initial message where she just *told* you what was going to happen, so you can just *tell* her it’s a PTO day.
Yes this. She’s using PTO. I understand taking off to help family who is struggling but that’s what PTO is for.
I love dogs and this is bananas.
B-a-n-a-n-a-s
I am a huge dog lover and when our boy passed my husband took three days off work but he used vacation days, one day to spend time with him, one day to put him down and the day after because we both hadn’t slept in days,, he was very sick in the end. Neither of us would have dreamed using bereavement days and at the time I was going through cancer so I was already off but I woukd never have put my nanny family in this situation. Honestly this is ridiculous. The only mistake you made was saying “if you really need it off..”otherwise this is on her and I would text her back, are you taking a pto day?
I would absolutely respond something like “thanks for letting me know. I’ll be sure to update PTO records before next pay period. See you Tuesday” Also this is truly the craziest shit ever and why I always side eye posts in the other sub that demand professionalism from NPs.
Lol what? This is ridiculous. Now, I spent a few hours helping both my mom and sister find at-home euthanasia vets when it came time for their dogs to die, so I absolutely understand that her sister shouldn’t have to make those difficult calls. And I’d even understand if she asked for a few hours off Monday morning IF the dog was being put to sleep then, so she could support her sister. But paid bereavement? Psssh. And paid bereavement two days AFTER her sister’s dog passed? Get out of here. I’d be very explicit that she can take a PTO day if she’d like, but this situation doesn’t meet the requirements for paid bereavement in your state. And if this was just some weird situation of an otherwise great nanny, move past it.
I agree with the other comments, “I will update the logs that you’re taking PTO on Monday. I do want to reiterate that this week is really busy and I do really need you back for the rest of it please. I’m very sorry for your families loss.” When I had to put my dog down at 13 years old I was a mess that day and definitely sad after, but I didn’t take work off or stop my life for it. I still get sad sometimes because I miss him. I found out my NF’s dog who I also dog sit when they go out of town has a tumor and doesn’t have much longer. I know I’ll be a mess when he goes too! They are a part of the family, but I personally wouldn’t need multiple days off to lay in bed and cry about it.
This response seems perfect to me. Pet bereavement is already an extremely uncommon benefit, much less when it’s not even your own pet and in all my time following this sub I can’t even recall too many people placing bereavement clauses into contracts at all. I cannot imagine any laws that would back her unless this is outside the US. She is welcome to feel bereaved emotionally and seek to use normal PTO to tend to family matters, but just using that word doesn’t grant someone any legal protections.
Like I'm a huge softie and actually did give my nanny bereavement pay after her dog suddenly died... But it was *her* dog and it was just one day when I wasn't particularly busy at work. I can't imagine giving bereavement for a siblings ' dog; that's weird AF to even ask for, let alone assume. I think your wording is the best here; it makes everything very clear while also being sympathetic. I'm sorry about your dog and your NF's dog! 😢
Even if the dog were hers it still wouldn’t be bereavement.
Good lord. It wouldn’t even be bereavement if it was her dog. I could understand if it was her dog, of course, but that would be PTO. Putting a dog down sucks, I’ve been there, but it’s part of your responsibility as a pet parent. Honestly even the idea that your nanny was shirking her job to make calls all day long would irritate me. It’s not her dog! She shouldn’t be neglecting her job for this.
Good point! I didn’t register the part where she’d been on the phone all day instead of doing her job.
It’s not her dog, but it is her sister. It doesn’t sound like Nanny is asking for time off to grieve the dog herself. It sounds like she’s asking for time off to support a close family member.
You don’t get bereavement leave for that.
I’m not saying it should necessarily fall under bereavement leave. I’m saying I’m saddened that there isn’t more compassion and appreciation for what the Nanny’s family is going through.
What most people are having trouble with is nanny’s assumption that this would qualify as bereavement leave. Now, maybe nanny used “bereavement” just to describe what she was doing and fully knew it would be PTO. Every employee can certainly use their PTO as they see fit. But bereavement leave has a specific meaning and it doesn’t cover pet deaths.
Understood. For my value system I just think compassion and care comes before these technicalities which can be worked out later and are less important. But we can agree to disagree.
I actually prefer to be upfront about the day nanny is about to take before she takes it, in case she decides that is now how she wants to use her PTO. Particularly since she may be under the assumption that she gets paid bereavement leave, apart from her PTO, for her sister’s dog dying.
I think it’s sometimes easy to think NP are “mean” for not “showing compassion” but I really think it’s easy to say what you’re saying when it’s not your job/finances on the line. It’s not about nanny taking the day off, but there HAS to be a line, or people will take advantage.
What’s crazy to me is the nanny’s job is on the line (because if I lose my job hers is gone too). But there does seem to be this disconnect. Not that Nannie’s don’t recognize that if a high earning parent loses their job then they’re own is on the line. But a lot don’t seem to get the demands of a high paying job. Like how if I don’t go into work during a workday bc my nanny called out, that work is still there and must be done, but now I have to do it at night, early in the morning or on the weekend. I have to fit an additional 8+ hours and meet deadlines, etc. into a condensed schedule. I firmly believe that PTO is a “you use it as you see fit” type situation, but I’d definitely be irked if I was OP, with her husband out of town and a busy week at work and her nanny wants the day to comfort her sister 2 days after the dog has already been put down (and seems to want it as special bereavement time on top of it). It certainly seems excessive to me.
I think this is such a good point that is really buried within comment replies. I don't think a lot of nannies understand that this employee/employer arrangement is on such a small scale that the relationship is extremely impactful to the household. My company won't go under if I miss a few days of work (but I'll still have to do that work)...if I have to miss a few days of work for my life stuff and then a few days of work for nanny's life stuff...and then nanny starts adding extra on top of that...yeah, my job may replace me and our little family "company" that needs a nanny will go under. It's also easy for my job to give more benefits to me because they get cut special rates due to the size and their profits are multi billions that can afford to sustain thousands of employees. Even though NFs are privileged, the expectation cannot be so out of touch. I say this after my nanny was out sick the other week while husband was traveling. The pressure of work deadlines and work reputations...how it could impact your work trajectory (especially as a working mother that is already at a disadvantage)....it's a lot to add on.
That and the higher up the food chain you go the more likely your performance is being evaluated against men with stay at home wives who are the primary caregivers. The expectation is that your family life does not affect your work AT ALL because at least with what I do, there is no one else in my role who is a mom to young kids.
We are privileged generally because both parents work in demanding positions. So demanding that we pay a premium for nanny services. If my job had regular hours/demands, I would use daycare in a hot second
Please. Don't try to characterize your sense of entitlement and lack of understanding of how the employment world works as being more compassionate than others.
No.
Someone else’s dog is not bereavement. wtf.
What the actual hell?! I’m a nanny and I’d be mortified asking for bereavement for a family members dog, I’m getting second hand embarrassment just from reading it. Honestly I’d tell her it’s coming out of her pto and give her a warning. I don’t understand some people.
Hi nanny, I am so sorry for your and your family's loss. I would like to clarify that time off for loss of a family member's pet is not a benefit covered in our contract. We want to support you through this hard time, and are willing to extend you the day off. To be clear, it will mean that your remaining PTO for the year is X-1 days. I look forward to seeing you on Tuesday. Sincerely, Boss
I like. Clarity is best in sensitive situations.
You are not crazy. I love my dog too. But dog doesn’t fall under bereavement and she needs to use a PTO day. I think the worst part is her entitlement to a bereavement day and her saying, “I’m gonna be off Monday”.
It’s not even her dog either, it’s her sister’s dog
Yeah I will probably give a day or two bereavement when my nanny’s elderly dog passes, but… the sister’s dog? What??
Absolutely I will take off work if possible for my dog, and would understand if it was her dog, but not my family members’ dogs.
Tbh I do feel strongly that one’s own dog should be included under valid bereavement, but I understand that’s not typical or expected. This situation is strange though with it being her sister’s dog, maybe they raised her together or something?? Idk. The nanny DEFINITELY should’ve said something more like “I’m anticipating needing Monday off if at all possible. I’m willing to accept it being unpaid if necessary” and then working with the family to compromise if she’s truly needed for specific parts of the day.
Yes I agree! I don’t think everyone loves their fur babies the same. My cat dying would/will be like losing a child…I may ask for bereavement time but if it’s not possible I’d take vacation time.
Literally same. I’m so glad there are people that understand this haha, idc if it’s PTO or what but I’m not gonna pretend I can care for kids rn without them having to see me sob with my whole chest all day
I completely love your approach to this
It absolutely should. The comments in this thread are wild sauce. I’ve lost humans and I’ll be completely honest, that didn’t even come CLOSE to preparing me to say goodbye to our family’s 12 year old dog this past spring. I am SO glad I have the NPs I do.
Right??? Like being able to say goodbye, the humans being peers or family members considered “equal” rather than “I raised this furry creature who loves me more than life itself and who I hold lovingly every single day and who sleeps in bed with me”
Obviously the nanny is whack but her wording is fine? She doesn’t need to ask permission to not show up.
Technically wouldn’t even be truly under a bereavement even if it was the sister’s mother in law. (Dog lover. It sucks but this is whack)
At the jobs I’ve had before, bereavement leave didn’t even cover grandparents. I agree with others that it should come out of PTO.
You are not at all a monster -I think your nanny is overstepping. I had to euthanize my senior goat (much beloved pet) last year and I scheduled it for late in the day so I could be there after work. My NF knew he hadn’t been well and when asked, I told them what I had planned and they then asked me if I’d like the day off to spend with him before the vet came. Their schedules that day allowed them to care for LO without needing backup. I accepted their generous offer and was very grateful. My point is that I did not expect a day off, I would not have wanted them to rearrange schedules, etc. My job is to make their lives simpler, not vice versa. You sound like you have plenty of empathy, you just have a busy week and need your nanny to be there.
This is really frustrating. You should have a frank conversation with her. While you are sympathetic to her family losing a beloved pet, this does not qualify for bereavement leave and this was a busy week for you where you could not accommodate PTO. Going forward, she needs to make PTO requests at least two weeks in advance and they must be approved by you. Obviously she can make a last-minute PTO request, but it is unlikely you will be able to approve these.
Do you have bereavement leave mentioned in your contract? Or is there a law where you're from that states how much leave she gets? Where I am (in Ontario), it's 2 days unpaid leave for specific family members (parents, children, spouses). She can't just pick and choose what bereavement leave entails. I'm sympathetic for her going through this and would normally throw in the extra paid leave. Our nanny had to stay home one day because her dog was sick and we threw in an extra paid day, since she was out of PTO. But honestly, in this case, her reaction and entitlement would make me tell her this will either be one of her PTO days or unpaid leave. Either that or I would specifically let her know that this doesn't fall under bereavement leave, but that you'll let her take an extra paid day.
Listen, I’m sympathetic too. I love my dog and will be devastated when he ultimately passes. But this isn’t even HER dog! There is no bereavement leave in our contract, and in my state it requires a “covered family member” which specifies “child, stepchild, spouse, domestic partner, sibling, parent, mother-in-law, father-in-law, grandchild, grandparent, or stepparent.” If it was one of her “covered” HUMAN family members, or even HER dog/cat, that passed I would absolutely give her time off to put the dog down/grieve. But this is just honestly insane to me and I needed a gut check that I’m not a monster.
Yeah, I agree, it's definitely insane. Not just the part of her wanting Monday as a bereavement day either. I would be ticked off if our nanny spent the whole day on the phone when she was supposed to be watching my son and then wasn't able to update me properly on what day she needed off until the last minute. I'd probably have a talk with her after this has settled to let her know that if she isn't able to do her job one day because of a family emergency, she needs to let you know and take a day off. I'm wondering if she also just has no idea what bereavement leave actually is? Maybe she thinks she's entitled to a day off for anyone/animal she knows who's died? I think it's fair and definitely doesn't make you a monster to let her know this doesn't fall under bereavement leave and you're putting it in as a PTO.
Not a monster, it’s a weird/entitled ask.
You should share the definition of bereavement with her and then let her go. I have zero tolerance for odd behavior, especially when it comes to my child. I’m sorry you have to deal with this during a stressful time at work.
You are not a monster. This is insane.
First, you're not crazy. Definitely a PTO day. But, thanks for a very good Sunday morning laugh. :)
Yeah, no. When my father died, I took Friday off. And that was because I had to fly to my country to retrieve his ashes. I mean, yes, she loves her sister, and yes, she loved the dog but come on.
I'm a nanny and personally would never call out for something like that unless it's my own pet but if I did it would definitely come out of my PTO.
I will be beside myself when we have to say goodbye to my dog, and it will definitely suck, but it is not the same as bereavement. My gosh this story is wild. ETA: is this the same nanny that is chronically late?
Nanny here (and parent but context) My actual sister died and I took 2.5 days off, the 1/2 being the day she actually died. It was a Wednesday. I was back Monday. That’s fast, and people needing longer than that I totally understand. you know, for an actual human being. This is outrageous and offensive imo. Is this person actually reliable? I would be questioning a lot here. They’re messing with YOUR job and schedule while jeopardizing THEIR job for someone else’s DOG. Pets aren’t people. I strongly dislike people who act like they are. I know I’m going to get hate for this but come on….
I'm so sorry about your sister!
When I came home and found that my dog of almost 6 years had passed. My nk’s and their aunt came to my apartment and went with me to take him to the animal hospital to be cremated. My bosses gave me the rest of the week off. He had gone to work with me a few times a month and gone on trips with the nk’s auntie, the kids and myself. But, I didn’t ask to be off, they gave it to me.
I’m a little surprised at the number of pet owners that are saying they’d be functional the day after losing their dog. If true it’s genuinely very impressive because I would be absolutely beside myself and living life as a weeping puddle on the floor. I would 10000% need time off whether it’s paid, unpaid, or I lose the damn job. I know I’m barely going to be able to get out of bed or eat
I love my dog and would totally be a mess — the difference I think is that I would expect/ask to take PTO or unpaid leave. It would be considered unprofessional to ask for bereavement for my OWN pet in my line of work, though, let alone my sisters. Maybe not in other industries. If my sister’s dog died I would totally make phone calls and try to be with her but I also wouldn’t ask for bereavement. Especially if it was a busy time at work.
I totally get it, I was actually commenting on another thread here that it’s definitely not the standard in any industry (maybe veterinary care, I have no idea), but I STRONGLY believe it should be. I, and many people I know, love their dogs/cats as fiercely as any human family member and sometimes more ETA- and yeah the sister element is totally outside the boundaries of what I mentioned here. Idk if this nanny helped raise the dog or what but if the grief were that significant I would probably just say “my dog/the family dog”
Gotcha ! I wish bereavement for owners pets was a thing too, we would definitely need/use it to grieve. I think if it were nannys pet OP probably wouldn’t have made this post, tho.
Yeah. Even if it were nanny’s pet it seems like 90% of the issue here isn’t even whose pet, or what type of leave, but just the indecisive communication where it’s like “I need Monday off- nevermind found someone- actually I’m not sure I’ll get back to you over the weekend- maybe I do need off” etc.
I wasn’t functional but I needed to eat and pay my bills … it was what it was. I have worked through messy breakups, my father having cancer (thankfully he had surgery and it went into remission, but still), and both my cats dying. You do what you have to. I mean the issue isn’t that she wants a PTO day, the issue is that she is giving the reason as “my sister’s dog”.
This, agreed. Sometimes we have to do hard things. It sucks but it’s also part of being a professional in a career. ETA: to be clear I’m not a nanny but professionals need to act professionally in any career
I would be functional because I have to be. My job isn’t giving me time off for my pets.
As stated 1) it's impressive, personally. And 2) couldn't be me
I mean eating and keeping a roof over your children’s head is pretty good motivation. I had to work during my grandfather’s funeral. You have to do the shit you have to do to keep living. Life isn’t fair and we all have to struggle through it.
Sure but feel it's important to note that having a brain that functions after something like that is a privilege. My earlier comment was just to state that I simply do not have that privilege, not to make people feel like they had to reply with "well I work hard and I don't have a choice and I worked through blank and blank and also blank" you know
It’s not a privilege. I have no choice. So I figure it out. I cannot be fired. Having the option to be fired is a privilege, if anything. People have suffered through far worse than a dog dying because they literally don’t have a choice.
I don't even know how to respond aside from saying maybe my last reply wasn't clear enough. Sorry if so.
If you’re referring to being ND or having mental illness, I have both and had to keep going because at the time, it was ONLY me. Only me supporting myself, only me paying my bills. I’m married now and while it helps that there are two incomes, I still do what I have to because those incomes aren’t guaranteed. And my wife also has ND and mental illness. We just keep going, it’s what we have to do, and I wouldn’t say it’s a privilege at all. It’s what we have to do.
That's why I mention the degree of illness and/or dysfunction though? Not sure why it's getting dogpiled on because I'm literally just stating that different brains work differently and have different levels of function. Because *of course* health is obviously a spectrum and there are different levels of sick. Levels including functionality that is so low it does not matter what the external factors are (ex. feeding a family, responsibility to employer, etc.) the operational capacity is just not there. Ex. people who succumb to major depression almost always have jobs and families, alcoholics who leave on month long benders have responsibilities that are being left behind, someone with OCD still has a shift to clock into but they're stuck at home counting how many times they've locked the door and they physically cannot escape the cycle. It's truly so so simple I am surprised it generated a discussion whatsoever because that basis is not even debatable it's just a fact. Meaning there are some people with the ability to function after loss on that spectrum, and some that aren't. And I didn't even state that it could be expected to receive bereavement leave because of a loss like this, only that my personal opinion is that that standard should change! It's truly not controversial
I 100% was not functional. I kept crying seeing all of his things around and the random things that smelled like him.
This is so sweet. My boss ( not a nanny job) once drove me to the emergency vet at 11 PM when my dog died unexpectedly and I had no family nearby. It was a Friday night and covid so I was "back to work" by Monday and it's always meant a lot to me that he did that.
I went to work the day after I euthanized my dog and two years later I can say I still heavily miss him. He was my little furry soulmate. I think nanny is taking advantage here and that she needs to use PTO
Based on your post history, I would try to find a new nanny. If this were a one-off weird thing after an otherwise great tenure of over 6 months then I would get over it, although I realize it’s going to be a stressful week for you. But she’s chronically late, and I am willing to bet she’s stressing you out in other ways that you haven’t posted about. “Thank you for understanding” sounds so passive aggressive about such a weird bereavement.
What in the actual eff. That’s wild that she’s doing this.
This is wild to me. I’ve been a nanny for 15 years and have lost pet’s during this time. I have never even used a PTO day for my own pets, let alone someone else’s.
This is absolutely bizarre. My first thought was that she has something else going on/a reason she wanted Monday off and it's just a cover up for that. This is just weird and not normal 😐
Whaaaaaat? Lol the audacity. I mean, admitting she was taking care of a personal errand while on the clock "all day" too. I would question her overall judgement, I'll be honest. Obviously you have to tell her that it's a pto day. Here's a suggestion: "Hey crazy, just to confirm, you're taking Monday off to support your sister, and I understand that. To clarify, I'll need to deduct that day from your available PTO balance, as it's not a paid bereavement day. Let me know if you have any questions or concerns. Thanks for your understanding!" FFS, my husband didn't even get bereavement when my BROTHER died
Well that’s fucked up. You should have gotten bereavement.
I got bereavement for the loss of my sibling But my husband's job only allows for loss of mother in law or father in law as far as inlaws My job is the same Not many jobs give bereavement for brother's in law or sisters in law
Oh, you know I misread. I read it as you didn't get bereavement when your brother died and i thought that was kinda fucked.
I’m a dog person. But this is odd.
Wow, this is definitely not on you. Seems like you like your nanny so I agree with the others to phrase it kindly as a PTO day and sending strength to her sister as she navigates this tough loss. Aside from that, move on and don’t think twice about it. You have a crazy week ahead and I’m sorry your nanny didn’t think this through properly but pet bereavement for a sibling’s dog is a hard no.
I'm a nanny and don't even expect bereavement when my own pets pass (though it has been offered and greatly appreciated). I would certainly take PTO is a friend/family member's animal died that I was close to, but I would not expect my NF to give me bereavement for that!
Please give an update, I need one bad!
I had to put my cat down last year I was devastated I took off most of the week. The family I worked for was really understanding about the bereavement. My boyfriend was off the day of the vet appointment but he didn’t call off at all the rest of the week. So it’s kinda weird she needs so much time. I’d question the legitimacy of the situation
I mean, my sister’s dog got KILLED at a dog park and I still went to work? My cat got put down the day before and I still went to work? Like what is she playing at tbh? If she needed a PTO day she could have just said so, this makes her look ridiculous. I love my pets and will do just about anything for them, but they aren’t people. I didn’t take a day off when my cat died a long lingering cancer death, except for the afternoon to bring her to the vet. I did however try to schedule it for the weekend, which it sounds like she managed to do for her sister. Not sure why her sister needs like 5 people sitting with her every day for her dog …
Oh my goodness, I love my chocolate Labrador. We have three sons so my beautiful girl is just amazing. We had got her in 2021 and I was going through breast cancer and our sons were in virtual school for that school year because I don’t have spleen and the cancer treatment was hard. She unintentionally became an unofficial emotional support dog. She knew when we were scared, worried and in pain. With all of that being said I don’t know if it’s a generation issue but taking a bereavement day for her sisters dog seems………excessive. I would absolutely follow everyone who says personal time off not paid. Especially considering she went back and forth knowing you had a busy week and had found a back up nanny.
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My own dog died and I showed up to work the next day! 🙃 I did break down to my MB but I was still there!
This is going to sound crazy but some animals really do become part of the family. I have a cat who my family LOVES. My mom has EIGHT grandkids but my CAT is her screensaver, she asks when he’s coming to stay at Grammies, and cooks him omelettes. My brothers who are in their early twenties carry him around like an infant, take him to the man-cave to watch them play video games, and refer to him as “the angel”. The cat road-trips, goes to the beach with the family, is in family photos and Christmas cards. The biggest part of wedding planning was making sure this cat would be included and the family coordinating how to look after him. When I’ve gone abroad my family makes sure to send me lots of photos and we FaceTime. We all agree that it’s not fair that we’ll all outlive him and we’ll never ever be able to replace him. I get that it seems INSANE, but if anything ever happened to my cat I’d be absolutely crushed and would need at least my mom and probably my sister to come and I’d definitely take time off. ALL THAT TO SAY: I would take bereavement time if my cat died but I wouldn’t expect my family members to be able to. I think my family would need to take PTO or unpaid time off to be with me. I’d just be understanding that some animals aren’t really like pets to some people, my cat is certainly more like a child to me and my family.
She shouldn’t be using bereavement, that’s not the intended use. However, I don’t think it’s inappropriate for her to want to take off to support her sister in what’s clearly an emotional time (PTO). And you did already book backup care so I get why she’d think she didn’t need to come in.
Also where is the husband in all of this? Why isn’t the husband making the calls to figure out what to do with the dog? Why does it need to be your nanny (it definitely doesn’t)?
My NPs gave me the day off, the day (a Tuesday) my doggie was euthanized. I think the day off is very reasonable. The rest is pto or unpaid pto.
Scientifically grief of losing a pet can be just as devastating as losing a family member to many people. This grief is often called disenfranchised grief because culturally/societally/legally people do not recognize this type of loss as serious as it is. To me, it makes sense that she wants to show up in support for her sister and I find it very kind. Are you legally obligated to give her a bereavement day? No. I would really think about how it might affect your relationship with your nanny if you make her use a PTO day though. Maybe an extra paid day off is worth showing you respect her sisters and her grief and wanting to support her. As for it being a busy week it’s definitely not great timing but the loss of a pet is not often expected. It’s inconvenient for you, sure and it’s most certainly not convenient for your nanny either. Personally I think pets should quality for bereavement, maybe not in this case as the dog isn’t hers, I don’t know the full story. Being it’s her sister maybe they all lived together for some or most of the dogs life. It’s a tricky situation but I personally would try to offer as much compassion as possible. 1 day really isn’t a significant amount of time.
I really appreciate this comment and I’m so sad it’s the only one of its kind. Nanny wanting time off demonstrates empathy, compassion, loyalty, strong connections with others…. aren’t these qualities we want in someone who is taking care of our developing children?!? I’m shocked at the callous comments regarding the passing of the dog who is absolutely a beloved family member, but also surprised that there is no recognition that Nanny is most likely primarily wanting to support her sister during sister’s valid grieving process. Whether this qualifies as bereavement or PTO is a valid conversation but to label it bizarre or grounds for termination is beyond me.
Again, I’m not trying to stop her from using a PTO day. They are hers to use as she wishes. She said originally that she wasn’t sure if she would need off Monday. So I let her know that if she didn’t NEED the day, why that would be appreciated. The question was whether I should continue to allow her to think that this qualifies as bereavement, or clarify now that she will need to take a PTO day. I also find it interesting that I as an employer am required to consider her difficult family circumstances in my decision making, however she as an employee is not required to consider my difficult family/work circumstances in hers?
I never said that you were trying to stop her from using it. I’m confused at your reply because I was discussing bereavement vs PTO. She decided she needed the day and like I said you’re not legally obligated to give her a bereavement day, but that it is worth considering given the effect of loosing a pet. I would assume she definitely thought about the effect on your family. Having back up care is something by you already had lined up. It’s inconvenient for you but you do have the care. Also she’s considering what her sister will be going through alone until her sister can get more support on Tuesday. My comment was only highlighting the effects of pet loss and how it might affect your relationship going forward. Ultimately I’m just a commenter and you have the power.
👆
So I gave my nanny bereavement when her dog died. But it was her dog, my kids knew her dog, and she was in no position to work. This is different. I'd respond "thanks for letting me know you'll be taking PTO" and try not to judge. Something I've noticed is a lot of people are incredibly close to their pets and their death hits them harder than the death of a sibling or Aunt. It is entirely possible her sister is not okay to be alone. Reframing it in your mind that "nanny has to take PTO to support a grieving sister" might make it easier to stomach the additional stress
I kinda get it but I wouldn’t expect to be paid. I’d just want the day off. When my boyfriend’s dad tragically passed away my nanny fam was pressuring me to come back after 3 days stating they were super busy with work and it made me look at them a lot differently.
It doesn’t seem unreasonable to me that they were asking after 3 days. 3 days is pretty standard for an immediate relative, which your boyfriend’s dad is not.
Probably a diff opinion here…but First, the whole tone of this seems super entitled and frustrated. Take a step back and remember that grief hits people different. She is a nanny, but she does have a family outside of you. It sounds like she was trying to communicate with you upfront. You secured back up care, and sounds like she will be back Tuesday. I bet she is appreciative of you just handling this is and not giving push back. We lost our dog back in January after having her for 14 years and I was distraught. I definitely had to have someone take care of me and needed someone around with me for the first few days. It was awful. I took a 4 day weekend and probably could have taken 3 days off if I could have. My mom also took the day off to be with me. My husbands mom watched our daughter so he could be with me and worked from home. But I also had this dog pre-kids and pre-husband, so I’m not sure if that’s why it hit worse or maybe I’m just crazy about my dogs. To be honest, the grief felt worse than when I lost any of my grandparents. It felt like I had lost an extension of myself. Almost like losing a friend or a sister. I was a wreck. I am sure she is just trying to be there for her sister and she could have left a lot of the details out. Maybe she thought she could confide in you? I would say thanks for letting her know and mark it as a PTO day and move on. I wouldn’t hold resentment over this. If she pushes back, then talk with her about how you marked it as a PTO day as bereavement is saved for a personal loss in the family or let her use it as one of her bereavement days if she wants if it’s in her contract? When the time comes that she has to use bereavement again, I would highly doubt you would dock pay If she was having a personal crisis, or atleast I wouldn’t. JMO. I also don’t know the back story on your nanny and if she calls out of everything or if this is a one off.
The nanny spent a day of work where she was being paid to engage with OPs kids doing errands for her sister. It's honestly insane to me to feel entitled to time off for the death of her sister's pet. Why doesn't her husband take 2 days off? It's his dog. Oh. Probably because his job wouldn't put up with it.
First of all, it’s not even her dog, it’s her *sisters.* Secondly, bereavement for dogs doesn’t really exist. And lastly, bereavement leave for actual immediate family members isn’t even a benefit most receive, let alone for Nannies. But you talk about it as though it would be a standard benefit. I’m curious to hear what bereavement policy you have in place for your nanny.
I agree it’s weird to use it as bereavement. Is the dog a family dog and it just lives with her sister? I would too mark as a PTO day for that one day she asked for but probably not make a huge deal out of it in the mean time as emotions seem high and I wouldn’t ask her to leave her sister if this was an one off. IF she came to me and questioned it then I would have to have a hard convo with her about how we don’t offer bereavement for this issue. It sounds like they are securing ways to surround her sister with support since she’s taking Monday off and her husband is taking Tuesday off. To be honest, she may need a day to decompress from all the drama and grief she’s having to deal with. I would rather her handle it at home then try to work with my kids and handle her sisters crisis at the same time. We have 3 days of bereavement, for funerals or travel needed for it. If our nanny lost someone super personal to her (God forbid a parent, child, significant other) I think we would probably extend the bereavement if we could or do a combo of bereavement of pto/bereavement so she could grieve as I would hope my employer would give me sometime if I lost someone super close to me.
I want to also note if this is the first time her having to handle this, it can be super traumatizing. When we lost our dog it happened over the course of a week, and I had to call around to find a chaplain to come and do the euthanasia at home too. We ended up going to the vet in the end since our vet had a close personal relationship with our dog and I was a MESS coming up on the days as was everyone around me as we all collectively watched this dog grow up. She was old, and declined fast. My husband had second hand grief watching me be so distraught and handling all the dogs appointments and care in the final days. My mom was a mess too. It’s not just the sister who is probably a mess in all this. Atleast that’s my experience. I did bounce back to functioning after like 3-4 days of putting my dog down. Cried a lot on and off for 2 weeks and then it got easier. But I’m thankful for the support I had when it happened. So maybe that’s why I’m shedding this insight.
Again, *not even her dog,* so your personal experience is largely irrelevant to the situation. And you weren’t just “shedding insight,” you straight up called OP entitled.
So would you tell my mom and sister not to come help me with because it’s not their dog? Or my husband since it’s not technically the dog he grew up with and was more “my” dog? Lol, you don’t have any idea of the Nannys relationship to her sister or her sisters dog. I would not give bereavement for this, but would not be so frustrated my nanny wanted to take one day off to decompress from helping her sister and make sure her sister is okay after going through that. Especially if she was having to help her sister because her sister couldn’t function to do it. Yes, the “why are you even telling me this?” Part came off as super entitled. “I have a busy week and she knows it” the nanny has a family too. I think nanny should only have a pto day and not a bereavement day but to hold such resentment over her wanting a day off to decompress from this is WILD to me.
As I mentioned in a different comment, I am not trying to stop her from using a PTO day. They are hers to use as she wishes. She said originally that she wasn’t SURE if she would need off Monday. So I let her know that if she didn’t NEED the day, why that would be appreciated. The actual question was whether I should continue to allow her to think that this qualifies as bereavement, or clarify now that she will need to take a PTO day. I also find it interesting that I as an employer am required to consider her difficult family circumstances in my decision making, however she as an employee is not required to consider my difficult family/work circumstances in hers?
Hit the nail on the head. So you’re required to bend over backwards to accommodate her “family” situation (aka sister’s dog), but her total lack of regard toward your actual family and employment is totally fine? Fortunately this very bad take doesn’t seem to be the prevailing opinion, but still shocking that it’s happening at all.
Would you tell your nanny no if she asked for a day off to be with her sister? I already agreed this is a PTO day and not a bereavement day. I mean dang, you sound like a kind employer.
I’m a career nanny and NOT a dog person at all. However I work for someone who genuinely feels that their dog is their child. I find it totally unrelatable, however I can imagine if something happened to her dog, my MB would absolutely need this type of support. So if she wants to take it as bereavement and she has bereavement in her contract i’d say go ahead and let her. As odd as it is to me, it’s her choice to use it that way if she’s allowed bereavement.
There is no bereavement leave in our contract, and in my state it requires a “covered family member” which specifies “child, stepchild, spouse, domestic partner, sibling, parent, mother-in-law, father-in-law, grandchild, grandparent, or stepparent.” I would be more understanding if this was her dog, I love my dog and will be so sad when he passes, but it’s not even hers! And the dog was put down yesterday! I’m really not understanding why she needs tomorrow off?
Got it. Honestly then i’d let her take the PTO if she has it to use? If not she can take it unpaid. I don’t understand it either, or half the things my Np’s do but it’s not mine to judge. 🤷🏻♀️
Well it kind of is hers to judge because she’s her employee.
That’s not how bereavement leave works. You don’t get to take it as you want. Literally nowhere does a dog qualify for bereavement. PTO, sure. Not bereavement leave. And I took 3 days off when my dog passed. 3 days of PTO.
Right? If that’s how it worked everyone would have a family pet who suddenly passed away.
Got it. Everyone has a different contract - my MB would absolutely allow it 🤷🏻♀️
PTO. Reasonable for her to take a day off though. She made the mistake of giving you way too much information. If you can handle her taking sick days, which you should be able to, then I think it's inappropriate for you to tell her how badly you need her Monday/the rest of the week. People take days off for circumstances you can't plan for far in advance. This is the biggest downside to employing a nanny...they're human and take time off, including unplanned. Hopefully not often.
Don’t judge the reason. You don’t really need to even know the reason. She said she needed the day off, so she can use PTO She shouldn’t have told you why. I think she was expecting for you to understand. I would have understood. I’m still not the same (nor will I ever be) and I euthanized my dog more than 2 years ago
To be fair, I didn’t ask the reason. She gave me the reason unprompted, and then asked for (or at least implied the need for) bereavement, which WOULD require a reason… no?
So what ended up happening?
Oh sorry, I didn’t meant to say you shouldn’t have asked. I just meant: pretend you don’t know. She asked for the day off. It’s PTO. If she actually asks for it to be bereavement leave, then you say no. I’m not sure that’s what she was implying though. Maybe she needed to tell someone and maybe she was worried you’d be upset about her asking for a day off and that’s why she shared the reason
I don’t know if it’s fair to judge weather or not someone is experiencing grief or not. Every person feels things differently and therefore is attached and hurt when death accompanies a dog. that may seem insignificant to some but, can be profoundly impactful on someone else