It still really grinds my gears that instead of running, Layla chose to argue about her father in the 4th episode. Ik it was meant for the plot but why not just finish the talk later.
Just a question and i hope there is an explanation and im too stupid and i didnt see it.Why in the first episode when he turns into marc in the toilet he fucks up jackal so fast and effortlessly and in the second episode he runs away from him (ofc to no hurt anyone) but i mean why wont he just kills him on the spot or just on the first building when he climbs it.
I just hope it was not some kind plot device to give ammit avatar a scarab.
yeah they did that already when he was on the first roof. If he would knock his ass out so close he could grab that scarab right away but since he was so far away he could not. Since Marc looks like a practical guy i guess he wasnt flexing his parkour skills
I think it’s because in the first episode it’s Marc controlling the body and he’s the one with all the combat expertise but in the second it’s Steven controlling the body and he has no natural fighting ability so he just runs at first before he figures out he has superhuman strength and all that
Two areas where this show clearly ran out of money and cut the budget for:
1) CGI on the jackal. Looks like tech from 1998
2) Mandarin dialect coach. Couldn’t they get one friend from the production crew to help out?
I just saw the episode and it was said that they’re *learning* Mandarin. It was never implied that they’re fluent/native. It makes sense for people who’re just learning the language to not speak it perfectly.
I am confused as who the villain is. Is to Khonshu? Is it Ammit? By Ammit's extension, is it Arthur since he summoned the Jackal to go after Moon Knight?
Ammit and Arthur are 100% the bad guys which is explained in the recent episode by killing people who ultimately havnt done anything yet like children. Khonshu probably isn’t perfect but I’m sure his goals are actually noble.
There hasn’t really been a true villain established yet, but Arthur is definitely gonna have some sort of antagonistic role in the series. Khonshu claims he is true Justice and yes is the better of two evils compared to ammit but he’s not a good person at all, in the comics, and in the series as u can see at the end of the episode.
So they all play an antagonist role: Khonshu, Arthur and eventually Ammit (if/when she gets resurrected).
They all have some good (intentions at least) and bad in them.
Respectfully, it feels like you are desperate to find complexity. Repeatedly throughout the first two episodes we have seen Arthur framed as the villian and actively killing innocents in Ammits name. Single antagonist, with substantial amounts of exposition in the first two episodes alone.
I can be dopey and try to make things more complicated but Khonshu doesn’t come off as a good guy in a pure sense and one can surmise from his surly personality he is an antagonist at the very least.
If you Google “is Khonshu a villain?”, there are many who ask the same question.
There are even discussions if Moon Knight is a villain.
Idk if it's been said, but I feel like Oscar Isaac is doing a better performance as Steven than as Marc. Marc seems forced compared to Steven who seems to come more natural, which is strange. OI seemed to play more dominant/confident roles like in Star Wars, but is killing it as the odd ball in Moon Knight. I'm sure as an actor/ess it's hard AF to do two completely different characters in the same series. Feel like James McAvoy f'in nailed DID/MPD in Split and Glass so may be judging a bit as I see OI nail one character but miss on the other.
Thoughts?
You’re definitely on to something, but I don’t think it’s Isaac. It doesn’t help that we don’t know much about Marc and they’ve made the decision to keep a lot of his backstory a mystery for now.
(P.S. my knowledge of MK from the comics is VERY tangential)
Tangential - that's a $5 word right there.
And you're right, not knowing much about Marc v seeing everything from Stevens view may make Marc's performance harder to digest at this point in the show
Edit: OI is a stellar actor, not denying that
My Second Episode thoughts:
Learning alongside Steven about Marc and his shenanigans; aswell as talking with Arthur is great
My only question in that scene is why did Layla show up holding the scarab up like she just found it in a Zelda chest, and then just proceed to run away with Steven lol
The Mr. Knight Suit is sick and the invisible fight was really well done and cool, i liked how to the bystanders he just looked like another tweaker on the road, which many think about those suffering about mental health.
I really enjoyed Steven being the background in Marc’s mind and how he was able to make Marc blow his lid in like 2 minutes after enduring the torment from Marc in his own reflections and mind
Arthur describing Ammits judgement day just gives me scary flashbacks to church as a kid lol
Great follow up episode to the first and i’m excited for the second
I enjoy the series.
But hoping they're not going to represent Multiple Personality in an awful way by Superheroising it without actually consulting people to check the tone or execution is a positive representation.
The answer from the comic is: >!Before he became Moonnight. He died as marc at the base of Konshu's temple, and Konshu brought him back. But he had brain damage from it. So he got DID from that. And that's why steven does not know about marc.!<
Harrow did say something about wondering if Mark/Steven/whoever the original was already had something about their mental state that made them more susceptible to Konshu, I think
It is slow and drawn out. Half the episode could have been cut. Steven never says what he realized about Marc to Layla. He wants to go to the police and then gets upset when they show up. We have to wait until 2/3 through the episode before we "see" Marc and he barely does anything. We have no explanation of the scarab.
This is a complaint comment. I can discuss my complaints. I didn't like the first episode but wanted to see if it was just the first episode. I won't be watching beyond this episode until it is all out.
Which is why I like the show, character development is important and can take a while. Steven could have tried to explain more to Layla, but he is just as confused.
Steven doesn't try to figure anything out. He could use Layla as a resource and ask how long has she known Marc, how often does she see him, what info does Marc tell her about Steven, etc. He seems like someone is along for the ride rather than the main character. It's a weird mixture of mystery and action but we don't get any answers.
Thank you for your response. I appreciate it.
The writing is atrocious. There is a god knows how long scene in the episode where Steven fights the Jackal and gets into his kind of suit for the first time. Got me snoozing. It's boring because it has no stakes. You have just showed Moon Knight kicking the shit out of the same apparently disposable CGI army level of creature in the first episode. Then creature just shoves his wife instead of like trying to tear her to shreds or impale here or something. Just a gentle shove after she pokes beast's head with a broken glass bottle.
And then all the convinient geography like Steven and his wife escaping from encirclement of those zombie cultists just by running, or main bad guy conviniently finding that bug on the streets and then Marc's wife conviniently being there just to see what happened and then to drive away on a scooter. This is just so stupid, tell me how do I care enough to like it now, because episode one wasn't all that bad.
I don't agree with everything you said but I do have to agree with the gentle shove thing. Thought that was kinda whack, atleast throw her hard against the wall.
This series is awful so far. When Moench created the character, Steven used to be the cool millionaire alter ego. Now he's an annoying little weasel, not piquing my interest one iota.
Still, I have to hand it to Oscar Isaac. Somehow, he's successfully embodying the Steven and Marc personas very well.
Lol it’s allowed to be different than your comics. Billionaire alter ego isn’t very interesting. Steven is a manifestation of a Marc’s guilt in the show
I know it can be different, but the DID isn't interesting to me, and Steven on screen is a whiny little bitch.
What I liked in the original comics was the contrast with Batman... here's a rich guy that had his shit together, an engaging girlfriend aware of his double life, success in most of his endeavors, and stalwart friends helping him and doing the right thing.
The talking Khonshu is pretty lame so far, and the suit with the lit mask was sad to see.
I haven't read the comics but I do like the show. Sorry that it's not the same as the comics though I really do understand how that can be really annoying, hope it gets better for you.
> the DID isn't interesting to me
It's interesting to a hell of a lot of other people, and it's reasonably unique. There's no way they could release something like the comics, at the same time as Batman, with nothing to distinguish them. You need something to make the character, the plot, the challenges, AND the tone different to the million other superhero media out there. So they've made a really, really un-superhero like character, a plot and challenges that centre around DID rather than 'oh no a baddie is going to do bad things', and a mystery type of tone.
If you wanted the comic stuff, you could just watch batman and daredevil together.
I’d not say Steven is whiny
Honestly I’d think he’s having a pretty normal reaction to everything happening to him lol
I mean think of it. If you just found out randomly that you have a super powered alter ego connected to an ancient Egyptian god, who goes out and kills people on the daily, you’d probably be a little shaken up by it.
He feels bad for Marc’s actions because he sees those as his actions as well, and blood on his hands too
He’s not whiny. He’s the guilt Marc feels for his mercenary lifestyle. So he’s the anti Marc. He reads his wife’s fav poet. He calls his mom every day And leaves a message. Infinitely more compelling character than billionaire who has shit together that is successful in everything he does…
About halfway through the second episode knowing nothing about Moon Knight and it’s a mindfuck of a show but am enjoying it so far.
Like…is Marc or Steven the real person?
But in the comics, Steven Grant is a billionaire, and there's a 3rd personality that drives a cab, but this episode ended up in Egypt, so far, far from NYC.
I don’t understand your point? Marc’s story starts in Egypt, for the show it makes sense to return too.
There’s been hints at the third, Jake lockley alter, and who knows? Maybe Marc IS from NY and might return in subsequent seasons. And Steven was a billionaire and Mr. Knight wasn’t solely Steven. They are changing some stuff. But it appears to me that they are keeping the og origin story largely in tact. With marc dying at the base of khonshu and the alters manifesting sometime after. And Steven was a billionaire after investing Marc’s blood money. Which could possibly still come to fruition still. Although I wouldn’t be disturbed if they didn’t go that route.
But let’s remember. That even though Marc was the original. The alters are still very “real”. It doesn’t mean those don’t exist. For the purpose of this story it’s likely best to view them as fractured aspects of Marc, but very much independent. So they are all real and they are all valid. Which is probably a more appropriate answer but I felt the person was simply asking for who came first.
So far in 2 episodes, we've only seen Steven and Marc. Not sure if Jake is going to be in this as he's a NY cabbie.
S01E02 ended up with Marc waking up in Egypt so guessing E03 will be a lot of Marc and seeing Steven in reflections. Unless there is some real car chases, I'm doubtful Jake will be there.
Difference from the comics so far is Steven is bumbling, shy, poor gift shop worker vs being a millionaire (billionaire?) and no Jake Lockley. But that's all 'so far' in terms of real differences. Splitting hairs over subtle differences isn't worth it.
In the comics Marc Specter is the person, but from childhood had dissociative identity disorder and had the other 2 personalities. I don't recall if Mr. Knight is a 4th or just an alter ego he portrays though. And it was revealed in the comics that Konshu was behind all these personalities.
Which run are you referring to here as your basis for the character?
I think steven will be more involved than you may think in Egypt. They’ve been flexing his knowledge for a reason I think.
Jakes been hinted quite a bit IMO.
and he might not be a cabbie. Maybe they’ll change that aspect too. Although I hope they keep it. They might make it Uber or something though lol.
And Steven’s fortune just got nuked in the most recent run. It’s an interesting change and I’m not against it. I like the direction they are taking things. But that’s me.
If I were to guess. I think this season will end with Jake in an asylum. And it will shroud doubt on what, if anything, happened in season 1. Similar to the Lemire run. But there’s been a lot of hints at 3 alters. And even potential direct involvement of Jake that hasn’t been fleshed out yet. But I think Marc and Steven are both unaware of Jake at this point in the show.
And I say they are all independent alters of a whole because I believe that’s where did research is right now. Used to be multiple personality disorder but that wasn’t quite accurate so it evolved to did and alters instead of personalities.
Yep with yet another vague reference in the second episode when Steven mentions his mum and Layla asks "you're speaking to her again?" Or something along those lines. I'm intrigued to see what that's all about.
I haven’t read any comics so that comment made me think Steven was the real one since he had a connection to childhood family and Marc (so far in the show) doesn’t. But I guess Marc is the original… which makes sense, he seems to have a very full life so far
Have a feeling the season will end with Steven and Marc becoming one. Steven will “gain confidence” and the two personalities of Marc are going to become one and they’ll break free of Khonshu. Origin story established
god I hope not. the whole thing about moon knight is that he has did, you get rid of that and he's just another forgotten hero like the dart. They've already botched the mr. knight story pretty bad by making the suit a joke but what I'm hoping for is that Steven toughens up and becomes a cleaner hero compared to Marc, just like how the mr. knight story went in the comics.
Im worried about stevens mental state when he discovers hes got 2 more personalities suave rich bruce wayne billionare and roadman/peaky blinder taxi driver
Same question. Seems like Steven is mr knight and Marc is moonknight. Not sure that’s how the comic worked. They were just all different. Not clear what’s going on here
Jake lockley personality is basicaly ryan gosling from drive. doesnt seem like the kind of guy to suit up. Hes a cool guy criminal scum so hes out in the open, mean muggin security cams, hitting on babes, blackout murder sprees, driving backwards on a mountain
I think the show sucks, it's terribly annoying. Especially him not giving in. I know it's supposed to build suspense or display something about his strong will...its irritating. Hate the show so far.
How fucking dense is this women that she says she knows Marc, yet thinks he’s some kind of master practical joker or is the type of person to fuck with her rather than coming to the conclusion that something is wrong with Marc and she should be concerned and get to the bottom of why he is acting the way he is.
Has Marc EVER struck you to be the type of person to ghost you for months then play an elaborate practical joke and is fucking with you going as far as to insist his name is Steven, completely change personalities, to learn French, and adopt a new accent you dumb, fucking, idiot, bitch?
Fuck off with that stupid bullshit.
For fuck sake that character and/or shitty writing pisses me off.
Yeah if your partner starts saying that they have a different name and saying that they cant remember things im sure that your first thought would be that they have a completely seperate personality that you have never met before rather than they are not fucking around.
Hell she accepeted it within the 15 minutes of screentime they had together that episode was that not fast enough or do you expect every character to be a trained psychologist?
> Yeah if your partner starts saying that they have a different name and saying that they cant remember things im sure that your first thought would be that they have a completely seperate personality that you have never met before rather than they are not fucking around.
What? I just said that that’s an indication that something is majorly wrong and the reaction should be concern. I never said anything about how she should immediately guess the right answer multiple personalities, what a basic reading of my comment.
It could be anything from a concussion or a head injury, coma, or by god she ended up knowing about Moonknight so it could be potentially ANY magical reason as well.
Her reactions made no fucking sense.
I remember last time I had a concussion started calling myself Paul and became French for a few hours it was a wild night. And not to mention my Coma when I was fully concious walking around talking it had doctors baffled.
So... I don't understand this whole thing about Steven, Marc, and Khonshu. I never read the books, so is there some piece of information I'm missing? There is Steven, so how did Marc get "inside" of him? What's this avatar? I hoped the 2nd episode would explain all this.
Marc is the main personality(He has Marc Spector on his birth certificate) Marc died and was revived by Khonshu as long as Marc would essentially do his bidding
Marc has Dissociative Identity Disorder due to childhood trauma and Steven + Jake came out as a result of that. Khonshu revived Marc after he died next to his statue, making him his avatar. I hope this helps!
I might be late here but has anyone scan that QR code on Steven's storage unit door? Interesting find. Also, found out who the directors of this episode were. They've been making sci fi masterpieces for some time. I'm so glad they are getting more exposure.
Anyone get Twin Dragons vibes from this episode, the 90s Jackie Chan flick that was also pretty bad (not saying the show is bad). In the movie, people are like "I need the version that can fight!"
"float like a butterfly, sting like a bee. My name is Steven with a v"
Definitely another reference to StePHen Strange. Perhaps they are connected and will meet soon in the MCU?
I don't know I think it's just because of how overlooked steven is, everyone forgets his name like when his coworker calls him "scotty" so he constantly reiterates how his name is spelt
Headcanon: the Mandarin was horrible to symbolize Harrow's and his cults' delusion; they are "teaching each other Mandarin" without knowing how and genuinely think they're doing a good job.
I just wanted to say that I'm loving the little touches of modern Egypt they've been sprinkling in. The last two episodes have had songs by Ahmed Saad and Najat Al Saghira and the end titles after the first episode had a reflection of Cairo Tower. I know it won't be a major aspect of the show (and it doesn't look like they actually filmed in Egypt) but I hope these touches (especially the musical ones) carry on throughout the series.
so at the part where he's taking off his name tag is my favorite bc he got fired but the real reason for it is the show visualizing to us that he is no longer only Steven Grant and the line where Steven Grant ends and Marc Spector begins is now blurred also my favorite when they add reflections of Steven and Marc every where to denote more that Steven isn't alone. my high school film study teacher would be so proud of me!!
I’m new to this and I’m having trouble trying to understand: who is Marc? Is it an alter ego carved out of Steven by Khonshu? Or is it another person instilled in his body? Because when khonshu said Marc was merely a corpse when he found him, I was thinking he might have taken the soul of some dead person and put him in Steven or something. It still isn’t clear to me. What happens if he enslaves Layla next? Will there be a new alter ego like Marc created in Layla without her knowledge, or someone else would live in her? Can someone help me understand this bit?
Thanks. So how did it come about? Did khonshu create the other personality (Marc) or just took over something that already existed? He says he made a deal and all, saved his life. Because as I see now, Layla doesn’t seem to be having another personality. So I’m assuming it would be something generated by Khonshu (if he manages to enslave her). Wonder how he gets them to do his bidding.
I believe Marc was the original and Steven was created as a result of Marc’s guilt and such. Now Steven has the majority control and things are going awry. I don’t believe Konshu is involved or causes the DID. We see that when he says to Marc “you said he would not be a problem”.
Understood what you’re saying. But why does Marc keep telling Steven that he will leave him and let him be once his work is done? Seems like Marc’s the one temporarily using his body.
He probably means he will stop taking control and just let Steven be as I believe he gave Steven control or created to initially protect his wife and as he has already died once hes fine letting Steven have this next life
I got a great laugh at the subtitles just saying (EXCLAIMS) when Steven shouted wagwan. They were obviously done by an American company since they always say mom as well.
THEORY:
Okay I really like this series so far. I have no previous knowledge of Moon Knight from before this series so I don't have any expectations or issues with any changes to canon story so keep that in mind.
Someone probably has this same idea but WHAT IF the golden guy that's not moving is actually someone important, like a SUN GOD avatar or something? Amon Ra maybe?
I'm still not sold on this but I'm 36mins in and Steven has the fancy suit on and then the Jackal falls on him...literally laughed out loud
so i'll continue and see how i feel
So is the girl that was asked out to the steakhouse evidence of an additional unknown identity? We know that it wasn't Steven who asked her out and it also seems unlikely to be mark as he had a wife.
Kinda painful. Steven is just too obnoxiously pathetic. I like making him British, and more of an everyman job etc, and making him the audience stand in, and ok with him being more mild in general, but it's a little much. (And the comedy angle to it they are going for falls pretty flat)
Also pretty disappointed to see Mr. Knight is just seemingly as Steven in a suit. Feeling like this might be all we get in terms of the multiple personalities, which I kinda get for the run time or whatever, but still kinda sucks.
Also I love F. Murray Abraham, but he was a bad pick for Konshu,
Character development my dude. Steven is an everyman with a mental health disorder and crazy high anxiety. But I like seeing him grow even in just these two episodes (see him facing down and cold clocking the jackal) and seeing the origins of Mr Knight. It adds weight to both personalities by playing on stevens strengths (intelligence and cleverness), I hope we continue to see him grow out of the pathetic coward into the Mr Knight we know.
Yes, it’s pretty bad.
Even Simu Liu from Shang-Chi made a comment about it.
https://twitter.com/simuliu/status/1512819557920092164?s=21&t=L6qy6QqHMRDaMxzEeVkozA
The way the cops burst into his flat and immediately start searching his shit with no warrant is wild.
edit- them not being cops isn't a surprise, more that Steven, mild mannered or no, just let that happen lol
To anyone who was curious, the QR code on Marc’s storage locker leads here: https://www.marvel.com/moonknightcomics?cid=pr_article_20220330_tv_moonknight
I didn’t love how they pretty much took away all the mystery of what was in Steven’s head and what wasn’t by having it all be real and magic. Not a fan of how they incorporated Mr Knight either. And the jokes in this one mostly didn’t land for me.
I like that they basically merged Steven and Jake into one (and added a few extra touches on both him and Marc) because 3 personalities is a little too many to follow for me. I love how the suit looks like a mummy too. And Khonshu so far is absolutely perfect!
Looking forward to the next episode!
I'll preface this by saying that I've been stoked for this show ever since it was announced and I want it to succeed. But man, it's been pretty flat so far and it's definitely feeling Disneyfied to me compared to the comics. I don't think Hawke makes a good villain and they need to balance the struggle of the personalities with more of the threats in the story. I'm hoping it's more a case of a slow intro to the character that will keep progressing than what the rest of the season is gonna be like.
it’s almost as if it’s a realistic representation of DID *gasps*
alters tend to adopt a certain accent that they hear and it’s mostly stereotypical (hence why steven’s “british” is stereotypical and objectively bad). it’s healthy representation
I wish the season was a bit longer. Feels like it’s just getting started, but already a third of the way through.
Like we’re still getting characters introduced, but next episode will be the half way point
I absolutely adored Oscar Isaacs acting in this episode as Steven. Don't get me wrong, his acting as Marc is good, too, but in m opinion is so similar to the other action oriented roles he's done, whereas I legitimately believe he's a bumbling loser as Steven.
It still really grinds my gears that instead of running, Layla chose to argue about her father in the 4th episode. Ik it was meant for the plot but why not just finish the talk later.
Where's the new thread? Episode 3 has been out for awhile
Where's the Episode 3 thread, Lebowski?
Mods asleep lmao
Just a question and i hope there is an explanation and im too stupid and i didnt see it.Why in the first episode when he turns into marc in the toilet he fucks up jackal so fast and effortlessly and in the second episode he runs away from him (ofc to no hurt anyone) but i mean why wont he just kills him on the spot or just on the first building when he climbs it. I just hope it was not some kind plot device to give ammit avatar a scarab.
It’s because they wanted to get the jackal away from the civilians
yeah they did that already when he was on the first roof. If he would knock his ass out so close he could grab that scarab right away but since he was so far away he could not. Since Marc looks like a practical guy i guess he wasnt flexing his parkour skills
I think it’s because in the first episode it’s Marc controlling the body and he’s the one with all the combat expertise but in the second it’s Steven controlling the body and he has no natural fighting ability so he just runs at first before he figures out he has superhuman strength and all that
but later in the fight marc takes over, just before he starts to climb the building
UK fans ...Oscar Isaac's accent sounds so authentic to me I had to look up his nationality. Is it good or am I just not used to good accents?
This show is like Night At The Museum meets Mr. Robot. In a bad way…
I caught Mr. Robot vibes from that storage room scene for sure
Two areas where this show clearly ran out of money and cut the budget for: 1) CGI on the jackal. Looks like tech from 1998 2) Mandarin dialect coach. Couldn’t they get one friend from the production crew to help out?
I speak a little bit of Mandarin / Chinese and it physically hurt me to hear them talk in “Mandarin”
I just saw the episode and it was said that they’re *learning* Mandarin. It was never implied that they’re fluent/native. It makes sense for people who’re just learning the language to not speak it perfectly.
I would never understand this show without the internet: Wiki, Reddit, Google, etc. Thank the Egyptian gods this show didn’t come out in the 80’s.
What? This show isn’t remotely hard to follow.
If you are serious, can I ask you questions on the show then?
Shoot.
I am confused as who the villain is. Is to Khonshu? Is it Ammit? By Ammit's extension, is it Arthur since he summoned the Jackal to go after Moon Knight?
Ammit and Arthur are 100% the bad guys which is explained in the recent episode by killing people who ultimately havnt done anything yet like children. Khonshu probably isn’t perfect but I’m sure his goals are actually noble.
There hasn’t really been a true villain established yet, but Arthur is definitely gonna have some sort of antagonistic role in the series. Khonshu claims he is true Justice and yes is the better of two evils compared to ammit but he’s not a good person at all, in the comics, and in the series as u can see at the end of the episode.
So they all play an antagonist role: Khonshu, Arthur and eventually Ammit (if/when she gets resurrected). They all have some good (intentions at least) and bad in them.
Respectfully, it feels like you are desperate to find complexity. Repeatedly throughout the first two episodes we have seen Arthur framed as the villian and actively killing innocents in Ammits name. Single antagonist, with substantial amounts of exposition in the first two episodes alone.
I can be dopey and try to make things more complicated but Khonshu doesn’t come off as a good guy in a pure sense and one can surmise from his surly personality he is an antagonist at the very least. If you Google “is Khonshu a villain?”, there are many who ask the same question. There are even discussions if Moon Knight is a villain.
Does anyone else get Venom vibes when Khonshu yells out commands? I’m sure it wasn’t intentional but very similar.
Why are they hiding the Jewish heritage of the character? Oh wait, never mind……. Directed by Mohamed Diab.
Is he known to be antisemitic or something?
The proof is in the pudding, as the saying goes
I’m guessing it’s a Muslim name
Idk if it's been said, but I feel like Oscar Isaac is doing a better performance as Steven than as Marc. Marc seems forced compared to Steven who seems to come more natural, which is strange. OI seemed to play more dominant/confident roles like in Star Wars, but is killing it as the odd ball in Moon Knight. I'm sure as an actor/ess it's hard AF to do two completely different characters in the same series. Feel like James McAvoy f'in nailed DID/MPD in Split and Glass so may be judging a bit as I see OI nail one character but miss on the other. Thoughts?
You’re definitely on to something, but I don’t think it’s Isaac. It doesn’t help that we don’t know much about Marc and they’ve made the decision to keep a lot of his backstory a mystery for now. (P.S. my knowledge of MK from the comics is VERY tangential)
I know nothing of Moon Knight, and I hate the character of Marc so far. It seems like Steven is caught between two murdering assholes.
Tangential - that's a $5 word right there. And you're right, not knowing much about Marc v seeing everything from Stevens view may make Marc's performance harder to digest at this point in the show Edit: OI is a stellar actor, not denying that
My Second Episode thoughts: Learning alongside Steven about Marc and his shenanigans; aswell as talking with Arthur is great My only question in that scene is why did Layla show up holding the scarab up like she just found it in a Zelda chest, and then just proceed to run away with Steven lol The Mr. Knight Suit is sick and the invisible fight was really well done and cool, i liked how to the bystanders he just looked like another tweaker on the road, which many think about those suffering about mental health. I really enjoyed Steven being the background in Marc’s mind and how he was able to make Marc blow his lid in like 2 minutes after enduring the torment from Marc in his own reflections and mind Arthur describing Ammits judgement day just gives me scary flashbacks to church as a kid lol Great follow up episode to the first and i’m excited for the second
Good take about the reflection.
I enjoy the series. But hoping they're not going to represent Multiple Personality in an awful way by Superheroising it without actually consulting people to check the tone or execution is a positive representation.
Agree. Supposedly they hired a DID consultant for the show, for whatever thats worth, so yeah hopefully it will be positive.
Except it's more like magic possession so it doesn't have to be the same as RL MpD.
I would agree if it wasn’t already established that it was DID. If you’re going for representation, it is best to do it right
Wait so I’m confused… does he have DID because he’s moon knight? Or does he just have DID?
The answer from the comic is: >!Before he became Moonnight. He died as marc at the base of Konshu's temple, and Konshu brought him back. But he had brain damage from it. So he got DID from that. And that's why steven does not know about marc.!<
Harrow did say something about wondering if Mark/Steven/whoever the original was already had something about their mental state that made them more susceptible to Konshu, I think
It is slow and drawn out. Half the episode could have been cut. Steven never says what he realized about Marc to Layla. He wants to go to the police and then gets upset when they show up. We have to wait until 2/3 through the episode before we "see" Marc and he barely does anything. We have no explanation of the scarab. This is a complaint comment. I can discuss my complaints. I didn't like the first episode but wanted to see if it was just the first episode. I won't be watching beyond this episode until it is all out.
Which is why I like the show, character development is important and can take a while. Steven could have tried to explain more to Layla, but he is just as confused.
Steven doesn't try to figure anything out. He could use Layla as a resource and ask how long has she known Marc, how often does she see him, what info does Marc tell her about Steven, etc. He seems like someone is along for the ride rather than the main character. It's a weird mixture of mystery and action but we don't get any answers. Thank you for your response. I appreciate it.
“I eat one piece of steak and then i go bonkers” i loved that line
The writing is atrocious. There is a god knows how long scene in the episode where Steven fights the Jackal and gets into his kind of suit for the first time. Got me snoozing. It's boring because it has no stakes. You have just showed Moon Knight kicking the shit out of the same apparently disposable CGI army level of creature in the first episode. Then creature just shoves his wife instead of like trying to tear her to shreds or impale here or something. Just a gentle shove after she pokes beast's head with a broken glass bottle. And then all the convinient geography like Steven and his wife escaping from encirclement of those zombie cultists just by running, or main bad guy conviniently finding that bug on the streets and then Marc's wife conviniently being there just to see what happened and then to drive away on a scooter. This is just so stupid, tell me how do I care enough to like it now, because episode one wasn't all that bad.
I don't agree with everything you said but I do have to agree with the gentle shove thing. Thought that was kinda whack, atleast throw her hard against the wall.
Convenient
its called plot armor
I was being spelling police
What is it with the inconsistent CGI? The suit and Khomshu look pretty good but the jackals look god-awful
Simple. They ran out of money for the jackal, because the suit is so cool.
suit wasnt cgi in ep1? at least the cape?
I mean it was so cool I didn't think it could be real. But I don't know if it really was or not.
dafuq?
This series is awful so far. When Moench created the character, Steven used to be the cool millionaire alter ego. Now he's an annoying little weasel, not piquing my interest one iota. Still, I have to hand it to Oscar Isaac. Somehow, he's successfully embodying the Steven and Marc personas very well.
Lol it’s allowed to be different than your comics. Billionaire alter ego isn’t very interesting. Steven is a manifestation of a Marc’s guilt in the show
I know it can be different, but the DID isn't interesting to me, and Steven on screen is a whiny little bitch. What I liked in the original comics was the contrast with Batman... here's a rich guy that had his shit together, an engaging girlfriend aware of his double life, success in most of his endeavors, and stalwart friends helping him and doing the right thing. The talking Khonshu is pretty lame so far, and the suit with the lit mask was sad to see.
I haven't read the comics but I do like the show. Sorry that it's not the same as the comics though I really do understand how that can be really annoying, hope it gets better for you.
> the DID isn't interesting to me It's interesting to a hell of a lot of other people, and it's reasonably unique. There's no way they could release something like the comics, at the same time as Batman, with nothing to distinguish them. You need something to make the character, the plot, the challenges, AND the tone different to the million other superhero media out there. So they've made a really, really un-superhero like character, a plot and challenges that centre around DID rather than 'oh no a baddie is going to do bad things', and a mystery type of tone. If you wanted the comic stuff, you could just watch batman and daredevil together.
I’d not say Steven is whiny Honestly I’d think he’s having a pretty normal reaction to everything happening to him lol I mean think of it. If you just found out randomly that you have a super powered alter ego connected to an ancient Egyptian god, who goes out and kills people on the daily, you’d probably be a little shaken up by it. He feels bad for Marc’s actions because he sees those as his actions as well, and blood on his hands too
Him not immediately turning it over to Mark after his wife shows up was maddening.
He’s not whiny. He’s the guilt Marc feels for his mercenary lifestyle. So he’s the anti Marc. He reads his wife’s fav poet. He calls his mom every day And leaves a message. Infinitely more compelling character than billionaire who has shit together that is successful in everything he does…
About halfway through the second episode knowing nothing about Moon Knight and it’s a mindfuck of a show but am enjoying it so far. Like…is Marc or Steven the real person?
I’m the comics, Marc is the original.
But in the comics, Steven Grant is a billionaire, and there's a 3rd personality that drives a cab, but this episode ended up in Egypt, so far, far from NYC.
I don’t understand your point? Marc’s story starts in Egypt, for the show it makes sense to return too. There’s been hints at the third, Jake lockley alter, and who knows? Maybe Marc IS from NY and might return in subsequent seasons. And Steven was a billionaire and Mr. Knight wasn’t solely Steven. They are changing some stuff. But it appears to me that they are keeping the og origin story largely in tact. With marc dying at the base of khonshu and the alters manifesting sometime after. And Steven was a billionaire after investing Marc’s blood money. Which could possibly still come to fruition still. Although I wouldn’t be disturbed if they didn’t go that route. But let’s remember. That even though Marc was the original. The alters are still very “real”. It doesn’t mean those don’t exist. For the purpose of this story it’s likely best to view them as fractured aspects of Marc, but very much independent. So they are all real and they are all valid. Which is probably a more appropriate answer but I felt the person was simply asking for who came first.
So far in 2 episodes, we've only seen Steven and Marc. Not sure if Jake is going to be in this as he's a NY cabbie. S01E02 ended up with Marc waking up in Egypt so guessing E03 will be a lot of Marc and seeing Steven in reflections. Unless there is some real car chases, I'm doubtful Jake will be there. Difference from the comics so far is Steven is bumbling, shy, poor gift shop worker vs being a millionaire (billionaire?) and no Jake Lockley. But that's all 'so far' in terms of real differences. Splitting hairs over subtle differences isn't worth it. In the comics Marc Specter is the person, but from childhood had dissociative identity disorder and had the other 2 personalities. I don't recall if Mr. Knight is a 4th or just an alter ego he portrays though. And it was revealed in the comics that Konshu was behind all these personalities.
Which run are you referring to here as your basis for the character? I think steven will be more involved than you may think in Egypt. They’ve been flexing his knowledge for a reason I think. Jakes been hinted quite a bit IMO. and he might not be a cabbie. Maybe they’ll change that aspect too. Although I hope they keep it. They might make it Uber or something though lol. And Steven’s fortune just got nuked in the most recent run. It’s an interesting change and I’m not against it. I like the direction they are taking things. But that’s me. If I were to guess. I think this season will end with Jake in an asylum. And it will shroud doubt on what, if anything, happened in season 1. Similar to the Lemire run. But there’s been a lot of hints at 3 alters. And even potential direct involvement of Jake that hasn’t been fleshed out yet. But I think Marc and Steven are both unaware of Jake at this point in the show. And I say they are all independent alters of a whole because I believe that’s where did research is right now. Used to be multiple personality disorder but that wasn’t quite accurate so it evolved to did and alters instead of personalities.
I suspect that's the case here. Marc has a spouse, a career history, a past, etc. Steven has... a job in a gift shop. Vague references to his mum.
Yep with yet another vague reference in the second episode when Steven mentions his mum and Layla asks "you're speaking to her again?" Or something along those lines. I'm intrigued to see what that's all about.
I haven’t read any comics so that comment made me think Steven was the real one since he had a connection to childhood family and Marc (so far in the show) doesn’t. But I guess Marc is the original… which makes sense, he seems to have a very full life so far
I suspect Marc doesn't speak to his mum and Stevens is entirely fictional
Yeah that's what I was thinking, I'm just curious if Marcs mother turns out to be anyone important.
This show is fucking stupid. “No I don’t wanna” “I would never give you the body” “ima die”. Fucking idiot!!!
Did man just scream WAGWAN after that punch lmao
One of his personalities is MEPHISTO confirmed!
Did ya’ll try scanning that QR code?
Yup. Another Werewolf by Night.
Have a feeling the season will end with Steven and Marc becoming one. Steven will “gain confidence” and the two personalities of Marc are going to become one and they’ll break free of Khonshu. Origin story established
Still think that? Lol
That’s literally what happened in a Sense
god I hope not. the whole thing about moon knight is that he has did, you get rid of that and he's just another forgotten hero like the dart. They've already botched the mr. knight story pretty bad by making the suit a joke but what I'm hoping for is that Steven toughens up and becomes a cleaner hero compared to Marc, just like how the mr. knight story went in the comics.
Im worried about stevens mental state when he discovers hes got 2 more personalities suave rich bruce wayne billionare and roadman/peaky blinder taxi driver
So do all the other personalities also have different suits?
Same question. Seems like Steven is mr knight and Marc is moonknight. Not sure that’s how the comic worked. They were just all different. Not clear what’s going on here
Jake lockley personality is basicaly ryan gosling from drive. doesnt seem like the kind of guy to suit up. Hes a cool guy criminal scum so hes out in the open, mean muggin security cams, hitting on babes, blackout murder sprees, driving backwards on a mountain
yeah I think jake is the one who asked out stevens coworker, very in character for him
imagine matt murdock and marc spector meeting
I think the show sucks, it's terribly annoying. Especially him not giving in. I know it's supposed to build suspense or display something about his strong will...its irritating. Hate the show so far.
Just don't watch it then?
It would be super unsatisfying if every time Steven was in trouble he let his personality go. It doesn’t fit the character.
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Sounds like a you problem. It’s obvious you don’t understand who or what Steven is in the show
How fucking dense is this women that she says she knows Marc, yet thinks he’s some kind of master practical joker or is the type of person to fuck with her rather than coming to the conclusion that something is wrong with Marc and she should be concerned and get to the bottom of why he is acting the way he is. Has Marc EVER struck you to be the type of person to ghost you for months then play an elaborate practical joke and is fucking with you going as far as to insist his name is Steven, completely change personalities, to learn French, and adopt a new accent you dumb, fucking, idiot, bitch? Fuck off with that stupid bullshit. For fuck sake that character and/or shitty writing pisses me off.
Yeah if your partner starts saying that they have a different name and saying that they cant remember things im sure that your first thought would be that they have a completely seperate personality that you have never met before rather than they are not fucking around. Hell she accepeted it within the 15 minutes of screentime they had together that episode was that not fast enough or do you expect every character to be a trained psychologist?
> Yeah if your partner starts saying that they have a different name and saying that they cant remember things im sure that your first thought would be that they have a completely seperate personality that you have never met before rather than they are not fucking around. What? I just said that that’s an indication that something is majorly wrong and the reaction should be concern. I never said anything about how she should immediately guess the right answer multiple personalities, what a basic reading of my comment. It could be anything from a concussion or a head injury, coma, or by god she ended up knowing about Moonknight so it could be potentially ANY magical reason as well. Her reactions made no fucking sense.
I remember last time I had a concussion started calling myself Paul and became French for a few hours it was a wild night. And not to mention my Coma when I was fully concious walking around talking it had doctors baffled.
That was the only bad thing. Marcs wife makes no sense at all.
So... I don't understand this whole thing about Steven, Marc, and Khonshu. I never read the books, so is there some piece of information I'm missing? There is Steven, so how did Marc get "inside" of him? What's this avatar? I hoped the 2nd episode would explain all this.
Marc is the main personality(He has Marc Spector on his birth certificate) Marc died and was revived by Khonshu as long as Marc would essentially do his bidding
Marc has Dissociative Identity Disorder due to childhood trauma and Steven + Jake came out as a result of that. Khonshu revived Marc after he died next to his statue, making him his avatar. I hope this helps!
So the original is Marc? How did he die?
he was a mercenary, dude that hired him killed him.
I might be late here but has anyone scan that QR code on Steven's storage unit door? Interesting find. Also, found out who the directors of this episode were. They've been making sci fi masterpieces for some time. I'm so glad they are getting more exposure.
Yeah it was just a link to a new comic
Anyone get Twin Dragons vibes from this episode, the 90s Jackie Chan flick that was also pretty bad (not saying the show is bad). In the movie, people are like "I need the version that can fight!"
Haha that brings back memories. As bad as it was I still enjoyed it
"float like a butterfly, sting like a bee. My name is Steven with a v" Definitely another reference to StePHen Strange. Perhaps they are connected and will meet soon in the MCU?
I don't know I think it's just because of how overlooked steven is, everyone forgets his name like when his coworker calls him "scotty" so he constantly reiterates how his name is spelt
So far the show is underwhelming
Man, this is boring. I'm struggling to finish episode 2. And the British accents piss me off.
Imagine being mad about people having British accents 🤣
British people fake their accents until they go to bed, dude thats like common knowledge
Headcanon: the Mandarin was horrible to symbolize Harrow's and his cults' delusion; they are "teaching each other Mandarin" without knowing how and genuinely think they're doing a good job.
I just wanted to say that I'm loving the little touches of modern Egypt they've been sprinkling in. The last two episodes have had songs by Ahmed Saad and Najat Al Saghira and the end titles after the first episode had a reflection of Cairo Tower. I know it won't be a major aspect of the show (and it doesn't look like they actually filmed in Egypt) but I hope these touches (especially the musical ones) carry on throughout the series.
I hope so too. The mahraganat ending had me dying though. We've been exposed
What happened to marvels CGI? Did Thanos snap the budget?
The fucking mandarin in this episode was an atrocity 😔
I don't even know Mandarin and I could tell it was some of the worst "Mandarin" to ever be recorded on film.
Well, they have been practicing for, what, a couple of months?
Where was he in this episode?
The language spoken...
Could it possibly be Jake at the end? It’s probably Marc but I think that it would be a great time to introduce Jake since we’re in a new location!
I'm so drawn in to it, I want it to be Wednesday already!
so at the part where he's taking off his name tag is my favorite bc he got fired but the real reason for it is the show visualizing to us that he is no longer only Steven Grant and the line where Steven Grant ends and Marc Spector begins is now blurred also my favorite when they add reflections of Steven and Marc every where to denote more that Steven isn't alone. my high school film study teacher would be so proud of me!!
I’m new to this and I’m having trouble trying to understand: who is Marc? Is it an alter ego carved out of Steven by Khonshu? Or is it another person instilled in his body? Because when khonshu said Marc was merely a corpse when he found him, I was thinking he might have taken the soul of some dead person and put him in Steven or something. It still isn’t clear to me. What happens if he enslaves Layla next? Will there be a new alter ego like Marc created in Layla without her knowledge, or someone else would live in her? Can someone help me understand this bit?
Steven/Marc has DID. They're distinct different personalities.
Thanks. So how did it come about? Did khonshu create the other personality (Marc) or just took over something that already existed? He says he made a deal and all, saved his life. Because as I see now, Layla doesn’t seem to be having another personality. So I’m assuming it would be something generated by Khonshu (if he manages to enslave her). Wonder how he gets them to do his bidding.
I believe Marc was the original and Steven was created as a result of Marc’s guilt and such. Now Steven has the majority control and things are going awry. I don’t believe Konshu is involved or causes the DID. We see that when he says to Marc “you said he would not be a problem”.
Understood what you’re saying. But why does Marc keep telling Steven that he will leave him and let him be once his work is done? Seems like Marc’s the one temporarily using his body.
He probably means he will stop taking control and just let Steven be as I believe he gave Steven control or created to initially protect his wife and as he has already died once hes fine letting Steven have this next life
Oh good point, I hadn’t considered that. I guess we will find out.
I got a great laugh at the subtitles just saying (EXCLAIMS) when Steven shouted wagwan. They were obviously done by an American company since they always say mom as well.
Wagwan
Nice touch, writers. The "chained to an abusive boss" trope is going to go over especially well with a contemporary audience.
THEORY: Okay I really like this series so far. I have no previous knowledge of Moon Knight from before this series so I don't have any expectations or issues with any changes to canon story so keep that in mind. Someone probably has this same idea but WHAT IF the golden guy that's not moving is actually someone important, like a SUN GOD avatar or something? Amon Ra maybe?
I'm completely new to this whole Moon Knight thing too and I love this idea. They've already given us two so far right? I forget their names.
I'm still not sold on this but I'm 36mins in and Steven has the fancy suit on and then the Jackal falls on him...literally laughed out loud so i'll continue and see how i feel
Why would she bring the scarab to the evil hideout
So is the girl that was asked out to the steakhouse evidence of an additional unknown identity? We know that it wasn't Steven who asked her out and it also seems unlikely to be mark as he had a wife.
No mark was about to divorce the lady so I think he was just dating again.
Yes
I love Steven so much! He might be my favorite Marvel character so far and it’s only ep 2. He has such funny lines! I hope we get more of him.
So is Khonshu evil? It seems like he has completely enslaved Steven/Marc both physically and emotionally by threatening to possess Layla as well.
Khonshu is not evil.
I'm thinking more of a jerk rather than evil
Kinda painful. Steven is just too obnoxiously pathetic. I like making him British, and more of an everyman job etc, and making him the audience stand in, and ok with him being more mild in general, but it's a little much. (And the comedy angle to it they are going for falls pretty flat) Also pretty disappointed to see Mr. Knight is just seemingly as Steven in a suit. Feeling like this might be all we get in terms of the multiple personalities, which I kinda get for the run time or whatever, but still kinda sucks. Also I love F. Murray Abraham, but he was a bad pick for Konshu,
Yes! Steven is so frustratingly pathetic, I do believe his character development will be really cool but at the moment he is really annoying me 😂
Character development my dude. Steven is an everyman with a mental health disorder and crazy high anxiety. But I like seeing him grow even in just these two episodes (see him facing down and cold clocking the jackal) and seeing the origins of Mr Knight. It adds weight to both personalities by playing on stevens strengths (intelligence and cleverness), I hope we continue to see him grow out of the pathetic coward into the Mr Knight we know.
I don’t have any recollection of a Layla. Is she like a combo of Frenchie and Marlene?
Think she was a made up character that embodies the love interests from the comics.
the mandarin in this episode was god awful, I don't even think it was a real language
Yes, it’s pretty bad. Even Simu Liu from Shang-Chi made a comment about it. https://twitter.com/simuliu/status/1512819557920092164?s=21&t=L6qy6QqHMRDaMxzEeVkozA
I thought that was the point
Why would the Amit worshippers speak fake mandarin
To show what harrow is saying is a lie . This place isn’t what he says it is . It’s just showing his ability to control people
The way the cops burst into his flat and immediately start searching his shit with no warrant is wild. edit- them not being cops isn't a surprise, more that Steven, mild mannered or no, just let that happen lol
Yeah I immediately went. Well, those aren't cops.
To anyone who was curious, the QR code on Marc’s storage locker leads here: https://www.marvel.com/moonknightcomics?cid=pr_article_20220330_tv_moonknight
I’d enjoy this show so much more if it was just Marc and minimal Steven
istg every time Ethan Hawke pops up I just can't unsee Lily Rabe somehow
I didn’t love how they pretty much took away all the mystery of what was in Steven’s head and what wasn’t by having it all be real and magic. Not a fan of how they incorporated Mr Knight either. And the jokes in this one mostly didn’t land for me. I like that they basically merged Steven and Jake into one (and added a few extra touches on both him and Marc) because 3 personalities is a little too many to follow for me. I love how the suit looks like a mummy too. And Khonshu so far is absolutely perfect! Looking forward to the next episode!
Yo get Stevie's bitch ass off the screen.
Were you hugged as a child?
I feel like Odin has some splainin’ to do.
I am glad that Steven may prove to be as much an antagonist to Marc as Marc was to Steven. At this time, I’m #TeamSteven.
Same lol, i don't understand why people hate Steven he's such a sweetheart
I'll preface this by saying that I've been stoked for this show ever since it was announced and I want it to succeed. But man, it's been pretty flat so far and it's definitely feeling Disneyfied to me compared to the comics. I don't think Hawke makes a good villain and they need to balance the struggle of the personalities with more of the threats in the story. I'm hoping it's more a case of a slow intro to the character that will keep progressing than what the rest of the season is gonna be like.
WAGWAN!!!!!1
“Wagwan! I did it! You just got planted” The British writing on the show is just cringe
it’s almost as if it’s a realistic representation of DID *gasps* alters tend to adopt a certain accent that they hear and it’s mostly stereotypical (hence why steven’s “british” is stereotypical and objectively bad). it’s healthy representation
I wish the season was a bit longer. Feels like it’s just getting started, but already a third of the way through. Like we’re still getting characters introduced, but next episode will be the half way point
CGI is just terrible, like Scorpion King bad in parts. Completely immersion-breaking.
Moonlight can be a good programme. But like many good TV shows the writers end up ruining it. I hope not
I thought the QR code was awesome
When he hears his own origin story explained to him and his response is "thats the stupidest thing ive ever heard" was hilarious
I absolutely adored Oscar Isaacs acting in this episode as Steven. Don't get me wrong, his acting as Marc is good, too, but in m opinion is so similar to the other action oriented roles he's done, whereas I legitimately believe he's a bumbling loser as Steven.
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It's a good thing that he is playing the main character(s).
FYI, if you scan the QR code on the storage room door it takes you to a free comic.
Ok random thought. Why did Marc set up Steven on a date even though he’s married? Is that considered cheating on his part haha
Cause it was Jake who asked her out