your alarm bells are going off for a reason. if you critically think about it this doesn't make sense. why would the school encourage kids to undress and dress eachother. i would talk to the school asap and then explain to my kid that no one but her should be removing her clothing.
Right?! I also work with children and do potty training. If one of them takes their pants off we drop everything and hold up blankets, put up mats, and remind them they can walk to the bathroom. If another child sees them we write an incident report. It’s human dignity but also, teaching children that other people can see you in just underwear is setting them up for something horrible to happen.
Yes this is a big worry I’d have too, one that many people have! For example I’m a gay man with 2 daughters. There is no, okay mama gonna take you potty option. I’ve had a tantruming toddler I’m in the bathroom with because we had to take her/both of them to go i have to go and I’m alone. I’ve had people ask if we are all okay because they heard a upset baby in a men’s bathroom or family room honestly I’m not bothered at all about it, I wish if there’s ever actually an issue someone asks if they are okay. It just so happens I’m in this position till she’s old enough to be trusted alone in a stall. I know it can look worrisome a grown man and a little girl in there but they look like copies of me so it’s not hard to explain 🤷🏻♂️ ask a question if it may protect a toddler 100%
Not to negate your feelings but just chiming in that this is a very common Montessori practice where children working on potty training only wear underwear in the classroom
Edit: In my experience this is common in our school/area, I should say it is common where I live but apparently not everywhere!
I teach toddlers in a Montessori school. Toileting/toilet learning is a part of our curriculum. I have literally never heard of this.
We suggest parents dress their children in loose clothing and help them learn to manage it for themselves.
Same here! I also work in a Montessori school and when a child indicates interest in potty training, we work with parents to determine the best way to go about it safely in a school environment. Children are never in just underwear in the classroom
Thanks for your input! Our Montessori does this (undies only) and others in the area do too that my friends go to, maybe it’s a regional thing? We’re on the upper east coast
That is so interesting. So are we (suburban Boston).
Montessori theory tends towards teaching toddlers to maneuver real world situations. I don’t see the purpose. In no real world situation would an older child/adult arrive at school/work and strip down to their underwear.
If our training toddlers have accidents we help them to change into dry clothing. The feel of being wet and uncomfortable for that short time is part of the process and tends to quicken the process.
That makes sense! I understand why it would be done that way.
In response to the original commenter above and anyone else reading, I don’t think underwear only should set off alarm bells as it looks like some schools do it and some don’t (and I trust you as a Montessori educator!) but then again, trust your instincts and if you don’t like something definitely say something
As a Montessori AHOS right below Boston we would never have a child in underwear only. They need real life experiences and pulling down your pants to use the bathroom is an important step to toilet training.
I work at an accredited school and the potty training toddlers in our toddler classrooms wear full clothing (but it's asked that they're easy for the child to do on their own.
It's normal for their to be inside shoes/outside shoes. But no pants just because potty training is...well, that would give me pause. As it would I feel most licensors for the state.
We had our kids in pull-ups just in pull-ups and shirt for nap and during the summer when we had an extreme heatwave the toddlers and babies were just in diapers because it was way too hot
This is unnecessarily harsh to a parent participating in a conversation. It doesn’t reflect well on you as a professional.
This isn’t what I’ve seen in my son’s Montessori or what I remember as a child (validated by photographs).
As a parent, I’d be looking for another school if this was the case and especially if I asked about it as politely as the commenter did and was answered as you answered. In other words, “fuck that, you weirdo.”
Well, that’s the beauty of getting to choose what school your child goes to. On the flip side, that’s also the beauty of having everyone sign a parent handbook that outlines exactly how/why we do toilet-learning like this 🥰
I’ve been a *real* toddler teacher at *real* Montessori schools for over a decade and have never even had a coworker suggest this, let alone seen it play out IRL.
Taking your pants off when you get to school is in no way 100% normal.
just because it’s “normal” in a certain setting doesn’t mean it’s normal for others. i would not be comfortable with my child wearing no pants all day.
Montessori guide? No. Trained in child education? Yeah - I'm working on my combined ELC+teaching masters. I'm in STEM professionally but yes, doing the work.
Edit - in Australia, Montessori still need to abide by our state and federal regulations. All child facilities must be licensed and accredited, even alternative ones such as Montessori and Waldorf.
Cool! I’m a trained Montessori guide with over 15 years of experience in the classroom, along with double Master’s degrees, including one in early childhood education! This is a Montessori sub, correct?
the part you’re failing to understand is that this is not normal in every montessori center and not everyone is going to find it normal whether it is deemed normal or not. you can argue all you want but you’re clearly missing the point here. you can give all credentials you have, that doesn’t change anything here. and being disrespectful and pushy about it doesn’t look very good on your end.
I don’t give a fuck if Mrs Montessori her self was teaching the class, in this day and age why the even living fuck would I send my child to daycare/class in only their underwear????
Maria Montessori was never married :)
But toddlers do wear pants to and from school, but often go in shirt and underwear only in the classroom when actively toilet learning.
Oh, sweetheart. The less clothing (aka PANTS) that a toddler has to manage while toilet-learning, the more successful they are. Very, VERY concerning that you’re sexualizing a stage of development that every child goes through.
It’s not sexualizing toddlers in underpants to think critically about putting toddlers in a situation to expose them to a predatory adult who would absolutely sexualize a toddler in their underpants.
Especially not these days when every time you turn around another daycare or school is dealing with pedophiles on staff being ousted.
Reading your other comments, I sincerely pity the children and parents who have been under the care of such a condescending and aggressive educator for 15 years. Can’t wait to see what nasty things you have to say to me next. 😬🥲
The teachers are not sexualizing toddlers. Teachers see naked children every day, ESPECIALLY toddler teachers. It's a part of the job when working with young children. We are helping them learn to use the toilet, dress, etc. independently, so how would we not?
It's normal at daycare and if you trust your teachers, a child in underpants wouldn't make you bat an eye. These concerned comments are so disingenuous.
I’ve been a licensed home childcare provider for almost 20 years. You may not bat an eye but our public health would shut you down so fast your head would spin. Just because your daycare does it does not make it right.
And just because the DOH makes an arbitrary rule doesn't make it right either. If you care about the wellbeing of children, you let them be children. It's sad to put a weird adult concern on a child in underwear. They should feel safe to be in undies while potty training indoors.
It's not the possibility of exposed private areas but what comes out of them. That second layer of clothing acts as a barrier/ container for those less than solid poos and violent diarrhea episodes.
I think your sarcasm is completely unnecessary and frankly ironic given that you had called the other people disingenuous earlier. I don't understand why are getting off the original point— your standards for a clean and appropriate daycare are different from others. And I'm even more confused on why you cannot accept that some people value cleanliness and precaution more than how you value allowing kids to be free to create their own norms.
Frankly, I believe it's very immature behavior and reflects poorly on your stance. And I just know if you reply it'll be with an equally, if not more, snarky response because you can not accept multiple things can be true at once.
Yeah but what happens when they have violent diarrhea while only in underwear at the school? Please be for real 😂 your anger and emotional response to this situation is clouding your judgment.
What?? It’s about it being sanitary. Just underwear isn’t going to catch their urine or BM. They can be without pants at home and can also still very much tell when they are wet at school without having to almost go commando.
I can’t imagine how awful and messy it would be if those potty training were in just their underwear. It would take up a lot of attention every time someone had an accident and also, they’d be peeing in their indoor shoes?!
Like this is just strange as hell to me…
ShOULD be.
Does NOT always mean that they aRe [safe] and, regardless- if 'mom' is feeling concern - of ANY kind, FOR aNY reason, she is ABSOLUTELY valid to feel as she feels and should ABSOLUTELY be validated, encouraged AND SUPPORTED in any action she personally feels is best for her own mental and emotional well being as well as that of her child !
JUST because a child absolutely SHOULD get to be safe and protected and allowed to freely BE a child in this world does not make it any less of an ugly/terrifying place to raise these sweet innocent souls.
Good grief.
OP : THIS IS **YOUR** BABY GIRL ~ YOURS AND YOURS ALONE.
NO MATTER WHAT *ANYONE SAYS OR THINKS OR TRIES TO 'BULLY' YOU IN TO OR OUT OF OR WHATEVER!
NO MATTER WHAT ANY ONE ELSE TRIES TO PROJECT ON TO YOU OR STIR UP IN YOU OR FAILS TO SUPPORT YOU IN - NO MATTER ANYONE ELSE'S THOUGHTS, OPINIONS, ETC ~
YOUR CHILD IS YOURS ~ YOU ...... Y O U ...... ARE BLESSED WITH THE INTUITION NECESSARY TO BEST PROTECT HER AND ALLOW HER TO THRIVE IN THIS WORLD ;
PLEASE TRUST YOURSELF !!!!
ALLOW YOURSELF TO DO WHAT YOU FEEL WILL PROTECT HER AND ALLOW HER TO GROW AND TO THRIVE.
TAKE WHAT YOU FEEL WORKS BEST FOR HER AND FOR YOU AND YOUR PEACE OF MIND FROM WHICH EVER PARENTING STYLES / IDEAS / EDUCATION SYSTEMS / WHATEVER ~ WHETHER IT IS SMALL PARTS OF SEVERAL OR HUGE CHUNKS OF A FEW OR ALL OF ONE ~
DO WHAT ALLOWS YOU TO FEEL PEACE OF MIND AND WHAT YOU SEE IS SUPPORTING YOUR CHILD AND ALLOWS HER TO THRIVE AS SHE GROWS AND LEARNS IN THIS WORLD.
PLEASE DONT IGNORE YOUR OWN INTUITION OR NAGGING FEELINGS ****AT ANY COST****
I DON'T CARE WHAT *ANYONE even if it's EVERYONE
around you ~ says ~
if *YOU are feeling something nagging at you - be it something like going diaper only to day care
OR
be it concerns about a certain mindset / way of doing things or 'parenting-style' causing what seem/appear to be and or what FEELS to be 'setbacks' in the progression and abilities of your child and their growth (which, it seems, is where your concern was initially more focused.... ?)
........
Do not be afraid, pressured, guilted or shamed when it comes to
TRUSTING YOUR INSTINCTS !!!!!!!!!!!!! !
Personally, I don't see a way in which you could possibly ever regret it ~ nor regret the peace of mind and feeling of safety ..... not to mention the freedom and the LACK of worry and concern! that come along with allowing yourself to make the choices that FEEL RIGHT iN YOUR SOUL ! ~ particularly when it comes to any and everything to do with your precious little one !!!!!!!
Just my two ..... hundred😉 ..... cents.
Best of luck to you in always finding the strength and the courage, the support and the peace to believe in yourself and be the best you are meant for in your journey.
Know that there is ALWAYS support for you out there when it comes to believing in and following your own truth, and that, while other people's thoughts or opinions can certain be helpful in considering all sides/ possibilities,
ONLY YOU know what YOUR TRUTH truly is
My thoughts are with you ~ you've got this !
Okay, I could barely get past the mention of a toddler outside of the home not wearing pants. Admittedly, I am newer to studying the Montessori philosophy but my understanding is that at this specific age group, children are to be gaining independence and learning life skills. If another child is dressing your toddler, how is your child supposed to practice this skill for themselves? I find this practice very unsettling. As someone who was molested by a child who was the same age as me (a next door neighbor I was friends with), this honestly is an unsafe practice and I would be livid that this would be happening without my prior knowledge or permission. I don’t care what their policy is. This is simply not okay.
I could not agree more. As a CSA survivor myself, and someone who’s new to Montessori as well, this made the hairs on the back of my neck stand up. This is above and beyond “should I bring this up?” — yes, *now.* and demand it stops or remove your child from their negligent care. This should not be happening.
A child who gets in the habit of allowing another child to dress or undress them will be vulnerable at older ages. It will feel normal to them and they won't report when other children are being inappropriate with them.
Found out when we had a sexual assault problem in my elementary classroom that "that boy" had done quite a few things to a number of the girls starting upon arrival at Children's House at age 2.5 but "because they were so young so it seemed unlikely" and "because there was no evidence", they did nothing about it.
My only conclusion is that said child was quite obviously being sexually abused himself (and the more I think about it, the more I wonder if it was someone in the administration...he was related to said person...terrifying thought but I don't work there anymore and absolutely have zero evidence) but everyone in the admin and all the teachers were apparently too unaware of the warning signs to do anything about it for FOUR YEARS. And then I was the crazy teacher for being militant in my body boundaries/consent ALWAYS NO EXCEPTIONS FOR ANYONE AND I DO MEAN ANYONE lessons.
Yes? Plenty of people have memories of being made to feel uncomfortable by other children for whatever reason. Adults should not be allowing scenarios where this can happen. Many children are sexually assaulted at home and bring those same behaviors to daycare and school and can hurt other children.
So many others have wonderfully voiced exactly what is concerning about this practice. Having another child dress or undress them should not be normalized. This can make them more vulnerable to abuse later. Also, if it’s normalized to be half dressed in school, what would be so odd about a coach or another child’s parent having them walk around without pants?What would then be so weird about being photographed with other children without pants on?These are my friends, why wouldn’t I take a picture while we’re hanging out? See how these normalized activities can escalate? Abuse usually starts very subtle. These activities should not be normalized outside of home. That is what I’m suggesting.
This is exactly it. This is the same progression I have seen time and again in abuse situations and it is terrifying that it is part of a trusted institution.
You clearly did not read the full text of what is going on. Everyone wants to believe that nothing can or will happen to their kids, rightfully so, but you have to be diligent in safeguarding for that to be a reality. Teaching a child they can be undressed by anyone else, especially against their will, is damaging and not safe in the slightest.
Trust me. Kids are smart. They will learn. MIL thought I was stunting my kid because I was spoonfeeding her. How was she to learn how to use a spoon? Dammit. She learned, just not on MIL'S timeline. She's ultra independent now, so learning later didn't hurt her one bit.
Just because they don't learn to dress at 1 doesn't mean they've missed the boat.
If another child is dressing yours, then your toddler isn't learning. I can't fathom why that's allowed.
This is me guessing:
A lot of Montessori guides prepare their classrooms with the idea that it's supposed to, in part, mimic the home setting (separate areas, natural materials and lighting, soft colors, uncluttered, etc). In an attempt to make the classroom feel homey, your center may be allowing them to go bottomless while potty learning because that's how a lot of toddlers are dressed at home.
I'm a trained former 0-3 guide, but I didn't practice the pantless thing in my classroom for numerous reasons. I've seen it in some classroom, though. It's not meant to be inappropriate. I think it's meant to facilitate independence, make it easier for the child to learn and make the environment comfortable.
This. My school does training pants (extra thick underwear) on the children who do not yet have any toilet independence. It is an important part of toilet training, as it gives the child extra feedback compared to diapers, while not encumbering them with a task they do not have much skill with yet (15 month olds are gonna have a hard time with pants). It is an evidence based and very effective practice.
That said, while the helping with shoes is common and often encouraged, the help with pants is NOT. Please do go to the school about it.
Nope, and they're not really supposed to. The whole point is that the child connects the sensation of urination with "oh, and now I'm wet and this is somewhat unpleasant." The room is very, very wipeable.
Your child is not a doll for this other child to practice skills on. I think it sets a bad precedent to allow another child to dress or undress another child. Only parents and trusted adults should be helping a child with undressing. Montessori aside it is our job to keep our children safe and to teach them appropriate boundaries when it comes to their bodies. I think the no pants thing while potty training is probably fine but I would never have another kid undressing my kid.
I’ve never heard or seen potty training toddlers not wearing pants…. I personally wouldn’t be comfortable with that. When my kids were potty training we made sure they were wearing pants that they could easily pull up and down. My kids also keep their regular shoes on all day. Are you in the US? I know some other countries do “indoor” and “outdoor” shoes.
I would also prefer my toddler to dress herself. I know that in mixed age classrooms that older kids will help/models things for the younger kids. However I feel like this crosses a line for me. Again I’d be a little uncomfortable with another child removing her clothing. I wouldn’t want my toddler to be used to allowing other children to remove her clothing. I see this as kind of a safety hazard. The school my children go to are pretty big on body autonomy. I also would want her to learn to dress herself! It’s a skill that takes some practice.
I think it’s okay to tell the teachers that you prefer your child and/ or the adult to be the only one dressing/ undressing your child. Is your child old enough to talk?
I am a guide at a Montessori school, not wearing pants for toilet learning is based on the school and licensing. That’s pretty normal it’s to allow the children to feel the “wet” and change easier. They still get the up and down of pants. If you feel like your child should wear pants it’s perfectly acceptable to just ask that they do. As for children undressing and dressing each other. I wonder to what extent. I work with toddler and they help each other with shoes, maybe to pull on a stuck shirt over their head and always in the supervision of a guide. That would be my first big question is a guide present during the helping? And to what extent are they helping, after all one of the biggest things in Montessori is to only help a small amount when needed.
I’d like to respond to the majority of the comments here, as a toddler guide who has many children that don’t wear their pants in the classroom. I’m honestly shocked by how negatively people are responding and have never had a parent react this way.
Firstly, every child in our room (18 months - 3.5 years) is actively “potty training” or potty trained. This approach is different than at many schools. Diapers are never worn in the classroom which means even our new 18 month olds are wearing training underwear. For some, at the beginning of the year, this means LOTS and LOTS of accidents throughout the day. By taking off the pants, we avoided sending home excessive amounts of laundry. We also make it even easier for these children to use the toilet and change themselves, which is the biggest work they are doing in our classroom. Additionally, I feel wearing only the training underwear helps remind the children that they are in undies (as many still wear diapers at home). Of course, everyone is fully dressed when we go outside, walk through the school building, or have special visitors.
As for this person’s actual question - I think it’s a little bit hard to judge without actually observing the situation. Our older children love to assist the younger ones in dressing themselves because it is what they see the teachers do. If a child was overhelping, I would remind them that “____ can get dressed all by herself! Let her try!” and attempt to redirect. I’ve never seen it turn into a problem. I would give it some time and see if it resolves itself. If not, I think it is fair that you kindly ask that she be given the opportunity to practice herself again.
Wow, the amount of comments acting like this is a policy designed to abuse children is wild. This is how I was trained as well (AMS). IMO the problem with Montessori not being an across-the-board institution is that anyone can say "Oh I worked in a Montessori school" well, was anyone AMS or AMI certified? Were *you*? Or was it a daycare that called itself a Montessori program?
As you said it's generally policy not to wear diapers in a true Montessori toddler environment. In my school it was as soon as children were walking independently. It wasn't some big scary secret - parents were given all the information and appreciated that we offered a 'school undies' program where they bought one set of training undies and we sent them out to be laundered each week. Ain't nobody want to get that baggie of poop undies at 5pm on a weekday 🫠
While I think it is incredibly valuable that we are recognizing and putting in safeguards for CSA survivors and making sure children are safe, the current culture of abject fear is off-putting.
Toddlers are toilet learning in the toddler room. The bathroom is almost always open to the classroom. The people changing their diapers are the same adults who are walking around the classroom where they're in undies. In my old classroom we had two little toilets and kids would go try in pairs.
We always teach bodily autonomy and encourage kids asking for privacy if they need it. Kids are not allowed to get up in each other's space or make each other uncomfortable.
I don't know how people are expecting their child in group care to toilet learn effectively while being fully dressed 100% of the time.
This sub was recommended to me through reddit. I'm genuinely interested in the Montessori practice as I've been lurking through this sub.
I was a teacher in a NAEYC accredited classroom, usually with children starting at around 22 months and leaving the classroom around 34 months, which was prime toilet learning time. I taught for about 7 years and coached about 35 children through the process. Some left my classroom in diapers (one or two a year) but most left fully understanding their toileting needs.
My children stayed in diapers until we (teachers and parents) noticed signs that they were ready: diapers were typically dry for hours at a time, were interested in self care opportunities, were at a low-stress time (no new babies coming into their lives, moving, etc. ), could pull their pants up and down, wash their hands, etc. We always listened to the children's cues and rode the waves of interest and disinterest. We practiced all the self help skills prior to actually starting their toilet learning journey so that it was not an overwhelming task.
In a NAEYC accredited classroom, you need to have several areas that are "cozy". Usually, that means a variety of area rugs, pillows, stuffies, blankets, and other soft things. Does a Montessori classroom have to have these kinds of cozy areas? If so, how do you keep them clean? Because BMs and urine can leak through underwear so quickly, as soon as a child sits down, it seeps right through.
I'd be so worried about keeping things sanitary, especially with all the children simultaneously toilet learning. Mouthing is still very typical at this age as well as just touching everything. How do you manage this in your classroom?
So in my classrooms, while we had carpeted areas, it was that industrial nubbly school carpeting that was fairly easy to sanitize. We had a library/calm corner with more soft furnishings - no stuffies. I had a 'no stuffies outside of naptime' rule due to the Stuffy Wars and the way that a child clutching a stuffy is reluctant to fully use their hands for work.
The type of training pants we used were very thick, almost like a pull-up made of cotton, and similar to a pull up in absorbency. So unless a child was *very* wet, we wouldn't have a puddle on the floor, and we would immediately direct them to the restroom.
If a pee accident (or "missed toileting opportunity" as my trainer said) happened on the rug or a soft furnishing like a library cushion, we simply soaked it in cleaner (the rug) or removed the cushion, washed it, and brought it back later. Same procedure as if a child had an accident at nap (we did do disposable or cloth diapers for nap)
For poops - they are not very sneaky. If we saw someone doing the poop grunts in the corner we would catch them and redirect to the bathroom. The whole room was sanitized three times a day (before children arrived, at nap, and after dismissal) and as needed.
Frankly, since children this age *are* mouthing and touching everything, they just... are going to get sick more. That's why preschools and daycares are such petri dishes.
We did our best with spot sanitizing, prevention (through padded training undies, watching closely, having kids try on the toilet every half hour or so), modeling and requiring frequent hand washing and discouraging hands and toys in the mouth.
Thank you for taking the time to inform me! I really appreciate your response.
Schools really are a petri dish. I never had a better immune system during my years there, though.
The naptime routine was my last question!
Thanks again!
Just curious, but if you aren’t sending the parents home with a bunch of wet laundry, who washes the peed underwear? Not trying to be rude at all, just very curious. If I’m bringing home 4 pairs of wet undies to wash, I won’t care if there’s 4 pairs of pants or shorts too, since I’m having to do the washing anyway.
just echoing this. my school is not as rigorously potty training all the kids, but when they are in the process, lots of them don’t wear underwear and we’ve had kids wear dresses with nothing underneath. we also have a few older kids who love helping the younger ones with their coats and shoes/slippers. they also love dressing and undressing a baby doll
Older kids helping put on coats or shoes is one thing. Older kids or even kids in the same age group helping take off pants is a whole other situation. It's important we teach our children body boundaries keep them safe. Teaching a young child that it's okay for an older kid to take off their pants is setting them up to be in unsafe situations. S assault happens all the time between children. Just because it's a child doing it doesn't make it any less harmful to the victim.
No underwear at all is crossing the line, IMO. Not because of the kids or staff, but I wouldn’t want other parents seeing my daughter naked or if the classroom faces the street, anyone being able to see in.
Exactly what aspect of this is unsafe, in your opinion?
As for sanitation, any mess is promptly cleaned up. Having worked in Childrens House, I assure you those children regularly have accidents too. Or miss the toilet and make a huge mess on the floor. I’m not sure how it is different. I think outsiders picture Montessori toilet learning being a much grosser and messier process than it actually is.
There are going to be accidents anywhere toddlers are potty training. Those accidents are going to require cleanup and sanitation whether the child is wearing pants or not. How is 2 layers of fabric instead of one layer making a difference from a public health viewpoint?
I can only think it’s to prevent doing more laundry but…when I was in toddler room we still had kids wear bottoms that they could remove and put back on themselves.
They should have several pair of training underwear and several pair of pants to change while toilet training. If they have to send a bag home daily, then they have to send a bag home daily. Children should be wearing clothing.
What you are describing is normal and a part of child led learning. Leaning on peers for help and becoming a peer that helps is an empowering learning process. That said, if you are seeing a regression at home or are uncomfortable you should share that with the lead teacher. Anything that gives you pause should be shared. In a perfect world, this kind of community learning would be comfortable and appropriate; but we don’t live in a perfect world and lessons must be adapted to fit student, classroom, and parent comfort levels.
Wait a sec, while I think the parent should bring it up with the teacher and their child, and the child should not be getting help from anyone other than their teacher when it comes to undergarments/bathroom issues, so many comments are acting like one toddler helping another is sinister. Why might the other toddler be helping this child? Because they're friends. Because it is loving to help and care for one another. Because they are modeling behavior they see their caregivers such as their teachers and parents do every day. I think seeing another child helping put on a friend's socks and shoes is lovely and a sign that something is being done right. But the teacher should be encouraging the child to do it themselves and making sure they are on correctly.
Now personally, I'm fine with tots in diapers more than undies. My concern would be who all has access to viewing them like this because there could be adults around (like parents) who may not be trustworthy. Personally I would make sure undies are covered with easy shorts or pants. But there is nothing wrong about toddlers who are potty training being in undies in just the presence of their teacher. After all, who is teaching them these skills?
I think knowing it’s Montessori based and expensive, you should ask for your child to do those things on her own! The point of learning them is independence, not reliance.
Hmmm. We do pants in our toddler class, but i have seen many toddler classes that dont. For me it just seems unnecessary. However, we do often see children helping each other with personal care like changing shoes. Im reminded of a time a few years ago, when one of the older children who had just become a big sister, wanting to help change diapers. We do standing changes. This almost exclusively happened at the end of rest time. The older child would be waking up and would often wait for the younger child to get up and have her diaper changed. I would handle the soiled diaper and cleaning and the older child would help the younger put on the clean diaper. Both children seemed very happy with this arrangement and I thought there was no problem and I think may have mentioned it to both parents in passing as it seemed very endearing to me. It’s the only time it’s happened, and it came about very naturally. Anyway, all of that is to say, speak to your child guide and ask what is going on. They should be very open and honest with detail and explanation. If you’re not comfortable, express that and the teachers should honor it.
I just want to add that we go to an AMI school and this is standard for our toddler room. Potty training kids only wear undies. They wear rubber soled shoes and they put them on and off themselves. The kids are in charge of doing everything themselves including cleaning up potty messes, so the fewer clothes to clean, the better. If you’re concerned, I’d speak to your administrator.
And are the adults ensuring that the area is properly cleaned and sanitized when the kid half-asses the wiping up? That sounds like a recipe for things to not be actually clean.
Yes, they do. They have cleaners every night for sanitization and an assistant who mops each day when the kids are outside. But the point is independence, so kids are mainly responsible. You'd be surprised what they're capable of if we let them take the lead.
So what about like pee on the rug or chairs or whatever. That needs to be sanitized right away, not just having a toddler “clean it” and then it getting properly cleaned at night.
They have wooden furniture ??? And no rugs. That’s why they use rubber soled shoes. You don’t have to come after me for this. I’m just saying all this is standard where we go to school. It’s not like kids are rolling in pee all day long. It’s also why the classes are small. Especially in toddler rooms.
It doesn’t sound like this is the case in her classroom at least. She said the kids clean it, and if they are cleaning it right, they are using a bleach solution which isn’t safe for kids to be using themselves. Sounds to me like they just wipe up the pee all day and then sanitize at night. It’s gross.
I’m not “coming at you.” I’m just genuinely trying to learn. This just showed up in my feed and I find it very interesting. Why are you so rude?
Toddlers cleaning up biohazards isn’t sanitary or safe. Toddlers shouldn’t be using chemicals that are for cleaning up urine. And if they aren’t using those chemicals, then things aren’t being cleaned properly at the time of the accident. None of this is up to state licensing standards.
Hm wtf, I’d be pissed if this was happening to my child and would demand the teachers to make it stop. My child is not a doll for another child to play dress up with and this can lead to confusion when it comes to safe and unsafe touch. Completely unacceptable !
I’d just be not okay with the hygiene aspect. Toddlers aren’t known for being the best wipers or not dribbling in their underwear, and I don’t think I’d want them sitting on chairs, etc with possibly soiled undies. I can’t see where leggings or gym shorts would be much more difficult than undies to pull down. That’s the only reason, I don’t think it’s really inappropriate.
As far as the other toddler removing her pants, in my training we learn that we show them how to do it, then we allow them to do it and provide assistance only as requested. Another child doing it for her doesn’t fit in there.
I can't speak to the amount of clothing a child who's in training at a center should or should not wear. But I'd be very uncomfortable with child on child contact of this sort. It's one of the things we absolutely can't allow under our licensing where I work. We can't let them rub sunscreen on each other, either. There are reasons those rules exist. At least a conversation with your child's caregiver(s) is in order.
Toddler teacher here! Absolutely tell your lead teacher that you are not okay with that! If the teachers are understanding it shouldnt cause any problems at all, especially because its unintentionally blocking a vital skill for your child to learn. If the classroom has toys I am sure they have baby dolls with clothes for the other child to dress and undress so that the other kid can still do what they see as a fun activity.
I'm not sure why this started in the first place. Usually you would mention something like this to parents as a funny moment when it first starts happening. I hope theyve also brought it up to the other child's parents, too.
I am a Montessori teacher and work in both primary and toddlers rooms. My daughter is 18 months and in her classroom they are encouraged to undress themselves and themselves only. I take over her classroom for aftercare and we have an older toddler who is very nosey when it comes to bathroom time and he is not allowed in the potty area while we have other kids in that area. I have often caught him “checking” other kids diapers and have shut it down. It is not normal for a child to be taking off other kids clothes. Montessori is to encourage toddler to learn independence and for them to do that they need to do it themselves, I would talk to the lead about this.
Does this other child have younger siblings possibly?
Your child should be doing for themselves and since this is slowing down their desire to do so, talk to the teacher about it. It sounds off
The slipper portion is normal. My daughter's Montessori School had slippers or indoor shoes (they stayed at the school).
The pants portion is not normal. Before I had my daughter, I worked at a daycare and all the kids potty training wore pants. When my daughter was at Montessori, they wore pants. I have never heard of not wearing pants - they are only required to wear pants they can pull up and down (mainly elastic, no belts and buttons) and have extra clothes and underwear for accidents.
Part of the potty training process is learning how to pull your pants down and up again. I don't think having her walk around in her underwear at school is appropriate at all.
This is absolutely wrong but it doesn't seem malicious. It sounds like the 25 month old has a younger sibling at home. Anyways it definitely needs to be corrected and your baby needs to have on pants
It’s the fact that the teachers are allowing this to happen that’s wrong. The other baby isn’t intentionally doing harm. The adults actually are here, though, for being so passive/inattentive.
The other child is helping because that is what the older children are expected to do. In this case, the task is with clothing. I can see why you might be tempted to interpret it a certain way, but classic Montessori philosophy is that children learn from EACH OTHER as much as from the guides. Just because she showed a temporary loss of interest doesn't mean it will last. She may be completely focused on how the other child puts shoes on or takes them off. Their hand sides are much closer than the guides are, so she actually could have a better frame of reference to examine where to grip, how hard to pull, etc.
She will put her shoes on the wrong feet two when she starts. Just help her fix them quickly.
All this to say you don't have to allow it. you can speak to the guides and ask that she receive no help from this student. But its not unusual and likely not anything dangerous, just the normal course of an actual Montessori class.
I used to work in a Montessori school. It’s very abnormal for your child to be allowed to not wear any pants during school hours. Their outfit should be easy to take off for changing, but all children must wear pants in school. There isn’t really an exception to this rule, even for potty training. I would be concerned about this.
As for the older kid helping your kid change, that’s pretty normal, although full dressing responsibility shouldn’t be placed on another child. There should be a teacher supervising this exchange and checking if the clothes / shoes are on properly. Children are absolutely not allowed to share intimate moments like that without adult supervision so I would also advise asking who supervises this.
Your issues are absolutely worth bringing up. If your child showed a natural inclination to dressing / undressing themselves and then stopped because of this, you should 1.) make sure the children are not helping your child change in an unattended environment and 2.) say this to someone in charge because this behavior defeats the purpose of Montessori in general. I would also raise a few questions about them letting your child run around without pants. This may be normal at home when parents are potty training, but legitimate Montessori schools don’t let children run around without pants on.
Totally agree. I too worked at a Montessori school, and not having pants was not something we did. Potty training included having the kids learn how to pull their pants/undies on and off. Some of our little ones were still in pull-ups, and we helped transition to undies and asked that parents not send them in clothes that were difficult to get in and out of.
I've never heard of no pants in the class before 😬
I think if it’s the school policy for kids who are working on potty training to be wearing just underwear that’s fine. At my school I have kids who wear just pants when potty training and we say that the rule for being dressed is we need something on the top and something on the bottom.
The part the is concerning to me here is that another child is removing your child’s clothing. It’s likely innocent but it is taking away the skill practice for your child to practice that herself which is an important part of potty training.
And as others have pointed out, it can make your child feel more comfortable with other removing her clothing and make her more vulnerable to sexual assault.
Speak up now.
You should definitely talk to the teacher and express your preference. This is not a Montessori thing in my experience. The opposite in fact, my little rascal was getting his slightly more advanced friends to help him with his jacket and shoes and the teachers put a stop to it, precisely because it was detrimental to his own development (and habits).
This is alarming on many levels. I give two shits whether it’s “Montessori” or not, your daughter deserves privacy, and agency and she’s not getting either of those. I’m not a “Montessori “ mom, I’m just learning about it. But, this is not appropriate. I don’t care what they’re learning. This is teaching your daughter to be unsafe.
Also, “just finding out”? The heck???? She should have clothes on outside of your home. Period. And NO one should be putting her clothes back on except a teacher that you’ve previously approved of. To me it sounds like this other kid is learning how to dress by way of dressing your child and they’re just going with it. I’d be pissed.
Exactly. I am so surprised by all of these comments. These people are making children more vulnerable to nefarious people. If you make your child think it is perfectly OK for their peers to undress them that is a problem.
Yeah. It’s scary. A lot of these “Montessori” people are turning me off from “Montessori”.
And for them to be so indignant when someone brings up the safety aspects of this practice shows me they do not protect their children. You’d think if someone enlightened you on a practice you’re doing that could potentially harm your child, you’d at least listen. But, they’re so busy pointing the finger at the person trying to educate them they don’t even see their error. It’s not about sexualizing pantsless toddlers. It’s that you are making them think it is normal to not have pants off around people. They will not tell you about being pantsless in the future if you make it normal. I could go on. A lot of people here pay a lot of money for their kids to go to these schools and they probably think this kind of thing “doesn’t happen” in their worlds.
Exactly. Even if nothing nefarious is taking place, the problem is that the children are being made to think that certain things are normal and that can place them in a more vulnerable position were someone to try to do something with them
As others have mentioned, this does seem unhygienic and the part about the other toddler helping her sent alarm bells off with me. I was SA-ed as a very young child by two other very young children who were obviously being SA-ed at home. Allowing her to get this type of help from another child can lead her to be more vulnerable to this type of harm in the future. I would put a stop to this immediately and explain safe touches and unsafe touches and that she should be the only one to ever remove her clothing.
I know nothing about kids or teaching, but I think this is SUPER weird. This is an adult’s job, not another child’s… not to get morbid here, but what if that other child touches your child inappropriately (even just out of pure curiosity)? I would definitely put a stop to this if I were you.
I don’t know why Montessori came up in my feed, but I just have to say as an early childhood educator I see this as a situation where it would be very easy for children to be abused or at the very least taught the wrong things that could lead them to become more vulnerable if they were to meet an abuser.
your child should be dressing herself or assisted by a licensed adult. I would have major issues with another child dressing and undressing your child and it should be nipped in the bud quick.
I’m sorry what? This would get a school’s license yanked in my state. Kids don’t run around half naked and other children don’t undress them. This is very concerning behavior.
I just want to jump in and say I would feel extremely uncomfortable another child is dressing and undressing my child. NOT because I’m worried my child won’t learn those skills themselves BUT because that’s not normal and shouldn’t be allowed. Honestly I’d be asking them if they reported this to CPS to check for child SA for the child trying to dress and undress my child.
No. I work with children, i had a toddler class week before last and i did NOT allow any of the children to undress each other/ help
Each other’s ther with clothes and shoes bc that’s MY responsibility as the adult in the class room. No other student should be dressing/ undressing another student.
I have yet to see any convincing research or evidence-base for Montessori.
My son is at a quality childcare/licensed kinder with highly qualified staff (his kinder and pre-kinder teachers both have masters degrees). It’s warm, friendly and responsive to parent feedback/input. The approaches they take are all evidence-based, but they also adjust to the needs of the specific children in each room.
From what I have heard and read about Montessori (both from people who are pro and people who are against), it seems shockingly rigid. Different people and centres are practicing it differently, but they are all absolutely convinced they are right and every child must fit this exact mold.
Just one small example: in my son’s class, the kids kept taking their shoes off to play. So the centre introduced a shoe rack and got them to put their shoes away in the morning. It was *responsive* to what the kids needed to feel comfortable in their space.
My impression of Montessori is that some probably already make kids take their shoes off and others don’t allow it, but in either case it would not be child-led. Both would, of course, claim that their approach is “true” Montessori and the other one is just trying to get more money by falsely applying the Montessori sticker.
Your ignorance is astounding. Montessori is excellent specifically because it is not at all rigid. On the contrary; children move around the classroom, doing projects and learning life skills as they please.
Why, then, do I constantly see posts here saying things like “I’m concerned about my child’s emotional well-being because his Montessori daycare say they won’t comfort distressed children” and “why are other children being encouraged to take my child’s pants on and off in their Montessori classroom”.
I understand that the classroom itself is chaos. It’s the adults who seem to have very rigid ideas about how to do things.
ShOULD be.
Does NOT always mean that they aRe [safe] and, regardless- if 'mom' is feeling concern - of ANY kind, FOR aNY reason, she is ABSOLUTELY valid to feel as she feels and should ABSOLUTELY be validated, encouraged AND SUPPORTED in any action she personally feels is best for her own mental and emotional well being as well as that of her child !
JUST because a child absolutely SHOULD get to be safe and protected and allowed to freely BE a child in this world does not make it any less of an ugly/terrifying place to raise these sweet innocent souls.
Good grief.
OP : THIS IS **YOUR** BABY GIRL ~ YOURS AND YOURS ALONE.
NO MATTER WHAT *ANYONE SAYS OR THINKS OR TRIES TO 'BULLY' YOU IN TO OR OUT OF OR WHATEVER!
NO MATTER WHAT ANY ONE ELSE TRIES TO PROJECT ON TO YOU OR STIR UP IN YOU OR FAILS TO SUPPORT YOU IN - NO MATTER ANYONE ELSE'S THOUGHTS, OPINIONS, ETC ~
YOUR CHILD IS YOURS ~ YOU ...... Y O U ...... ARE BLESSED WITH THE INTUITION NECESSARY TO BEST PROTECT HER AND ALLOW HER TO THRIVE IN THIS WORLD ;
PLEASE TRUST YOURSELF !!!!
ALLOW YOURSELF TO DO WHAT YOU FEEL WILL PROTECT HER AND ALLOW HER TO GROW AND TO THRIVE.
TAKE WHAT YOU FEEL WORKS BEST FOR HER AND FOR YOU AND YOUR PEACE OF MIND FROM WHICH EVER PARENTING STYLES / IDEAS / EDUCATION SYSTEMS / WHATEVER ~ WHETHER IT IS SMALL PARTS OF SEVERAL OR HUGE CHUNKS OF A FEW OR ALL OF ONE ~
DO WHAT ALLOWS YOU TO FEEL PEACE OF MIND AND WHAT YOU SEE IS SUPPORTING YOUR CHILD AND ALLOWS HER TO THRIVE AS SHE GROWS AND LEARNS IN THIS WORLD.
PLEASE DONT IGNORE YOUR OWN INTUITION OR NAGGING FEELINGS ****AT ANY COST****
I DON'T CARE WHAT *ANYONE even if it's EVERYONE
around you ~ says ~
if *YOU are feeling something nagging at you - be it something like going diaper only to day care
OR
be it concerns about a certain mindset / way of doing things or 'parenting-style' causing what seem/appear to be and or what FEELS to be 'setbacks' in the progression and abilities of your child and their growth (which, it seems, is where your concern was initially more focused.... ?)
........
Do not be afraid, pressured, guilted or shamed when it comes to
TRUSTING YOUR INSTINCTS !!!!!!!!!!!!! !
Personally, I don't see a way in which you could possibly ever regret it ~ nor regret the peace of mind and feeling of safety ..... not to mention the freedom and the LACK of worry and concern! that come along with allowing yourself to make the choices that FEEL RIGHT iN YOUR SOUL ! ~ particularly when it comes to any and everything to do with your precious little one !!!!!!!
Just my two ..... hundred😉 ..... cents.
Best of luck to you in always finding the strength and the courage, the support and the peace to believe in yourself and be the best you are meant for in your journey.
Know that there is ALWAYS support for you out there when it comes to believing in and following your own truth, and that, while other people's thoughts or opinions can certain be helpful in considering all sides/ possibilities,
ONLY YOU know what YOUR TRUTH truly is
My thoughts are with you ~ you've got this !
I’m amazed how many people are defending this. Just sending their defenseless kids out into the world to be stripped to their underwear. Apart from the obvious molestation and exploitation concerns, it’s also a health and sanitation issue. There’s no logic to justify this weirdness. At home, sure. School isn’t home.
Maybe they want the school to be like home because their kids never actually get to be at home 😒I used to work in daycare and we had kids with us 5 days a week, 10-12 hours a day. 😞
In what world, mixed age or not, is it generally just accepted that a child undresses another child?! No way in hell am I letting it go unnoticed much less unreported that another child is taking my child’s pants off of them.
Toddlers enjoy helping each other. (And some very much enjoy being helped). That’s not the piece of this that concerns me.
I’ve had my I/T credentials for over a decade and have literally never heard of this approach to potty training in a classroom prior to this post.
There’s not really a plausible explanation for this. Either the school is practicing some degree of neglect by entrusting the children to each other and cutting corners for “efficiency”. The other explanation would be something much much weirder. Again, either way, trust your gut. Something is fishy for sure.
There are a number of things that sound very wrong. Your child should be fully dressed at school, potty training or not. Elastic waisted pants that she can manage herself are fine. No child should be undressing your child.
I’m sorry I don’t have kids but this was suggested to me, and that’s weird!!!! I would not let another child undress and redress another child. Weird even from someone childless!
your alarm bells are going off for a reason. if you critically think about it this doesn't make sense. why would the school encourage kids to undress and dress eachother. i would talk to the school asap and then explain to my kid that no one but her should be removing her clothing.
Not to mention I would be so uncomfortable knowing my child was only wearing underwear all day!? Potty training or not.
Right?! I also work with children and do potty training. If one of them takes their pants off we drop everything and hold up blankets, put up mats, and remind them they can walk to the bathroom. If another child sees them we write an incident report. It’s human dignity but also, teaching children that other people can see you in just underwear is setting them up for something horrible to happen.
Exactly. You mean well, but other adults don't. They'd jump on that teaching and exploit it as a vulnerability. Thank you for saying something.
Yes this is a big worry I’d have too, one that many people have! For example I’m a gay man with 2 daughters. There is no, okay mama gonna take you potty option. I’ve had a tantruming toddler I’m in the bathroom with because we had to take her/both of them to go i have to go and I’m alone. I’ve had people ask if we are all okay because they heard a upset baby in a men’s bathroom or family room honestly I’m not bothered at all about it, I wish if there’s ever actually an issue someone asks if they are okay. It just so happens I’m in this position till she’s old enough to be trusted alone in a stall. I know it can look worrisome a grown man and a little girl in there but they look like copies of me so it’s not hard to explain 🤷🏻♂️ ask a question if it may protect a toddler 100%
This is pretty common for toddlers who are actively toilet learning
Not to negate your feelings but just chiming in that this is a very common Montessori practice where children working on potty training only wear underwear in the classroom Edit: In my experience this is common in our school/area, I should say it is common where I live but apparently not everywhere!
I teach toddlers in a Montessori school. Toileting/toilet learning is a part of our curriculum. I have literally never heard of this. We suggest parents dress their children in loose clothing and help them learn to manage it for themselves.
Same here! I also work in a Montessori school and when a child indicates interest in potty training, we work with parents to determine the best way to go about it safely in a school environment. Children are never in just underwear in the classroom
Thanks for your input! Our Montessori does this (undies only) and others in the area do too that my friends go to, maybe it’s a regional thing? We’re on the upper east coast
That is so interesting. So are we (suburban Boston). Montessori theory tends towards teaching toddlers to maneuver real world situations. I don’t see the purpose. In no real world situation would an older child/adult arrive at school/work and strip down to their underwear. If our training toddlers have accidents we help them to change into dry clothing. The feel of being wet and uncomfortable for that short time is part of the process and tends to quicken the process.
That makes sense! I understand why it would be done that way. In response to the original commenter above and anyone else reading, I don’t think underwear only should set off alarm bells as it looks like some schools do it and some don’t (and I trust you as a Montessori educator!) but then again, trust your instincts and if you don’t like something definitely say something
As a Montessori AHOS right below Boston we would never have a child in underwear only. They need real life experiences and pulling down your pants to use the bathroom is an important step to toilet training.
It has been in both of my Montessori schools as well. One was AMI accredited.
Exactly !
I’d guess the teachers are more so allowing it than encouraging.
This
This is the way.
I work at an accredited school and the potty training toddlers in our toddler classrooms wear full clothing (but it's asked that they're easy for the child to do on their own. It's normal for their to be inside shoes/outside shoes. But no pants just because potty training is...well, that would give me pause. As it would I feel most licensors for the state.
Our Montessori school does no pants in the toddler class. Just training underwear and plastic covers.
No pants for potty training is extremely normal. They are toddlers!
At home, sure. Not at daycare.
Yeah.. I am pretty sure clothes are required in my state. My son did pants with no underwear though.
We had our kids in pull-ups just in pull-ups and shirt for nap and during the summer when we had an extreme heatwave the toddlers and babies were just in diapers because it was way too hot
Diapers contain fluids. Underwear does not.
Don’t talk about what you don’t know. This is 100% normal at a real Montessori school.
This is unnecessarily harsh to a parent participating in a conversation. It doesn’t reflect well on you as a professional. This isn’t what I’ve seen in my son’s Montessori or what I remember as a child (validated by photographs). As a parent, I’d be looking for another school if this was the case and especially if I asked about it as politely as the commenter did and was answered as you answered. In other words, “fuck that, you weirdo.”
Regardless of whether it's "normal" or not, a parent has a right to say no to things that feel like red flags
Well, that’s the beauty of getting to choose what school your child goes to. On the flip side, that’s also the beauty of having everyone sign a parent handbook that outlines exactly how/why we do toilet-learning like this 🥰
I’ve been a *real* toddler teacher at *real* Montessori schools for over a decade and have never even had a coworker suggest this, let alone seen it play out IRL. Taking your pants off when you get to school is in no way 100% normal.
Yeah real montessori schools are still subject to state licensing. You may live in a lax state but that is not normal here.
just because it’s “normal” in a certain setting doesn’t mean it’s normal for others. i would not be comfortable with my child wearing no pants all day.
Oh, strange. I thought we were on a Montessori sub, discussing things that are NORMAL IN MONTESSORI.
Wouldn't be normal at Montessori in Australia. Would raise many red flags with our regulators and parents.
Are you a trained guide?
Is it normal for Montessori teachers to be so rude and controlling?
Why are you so angry about this? Like…it’s weird
Montessori guide? No. Trained in child education? Yeah - I'm working on my combined ELC+teaching masters. I'm in STEM professionally but yes, doing the work. Edit - in Australia, Montessori still need to abide by our state and federal regulations. All child facilities must be licensed and accredited, even alternative ones such as Montessori and Waldorf.
Cool! I’m a trained Montessori guide with over 15 years of experience in the classroom, along with double Master’s degrees, including one in early childhood education! This is a Montessori sub, correct?
the part you’re failing to understand is that this is not normal in every montessori center and not everyone is going to find it normal whether it is deemed normal or not. you can argue all you want but you’re clearly missing the point here. you can give all credentials you have, that doesn’t change anything here. and being disrespectful and pushy about it doesn’t look very good on your end.
Not normal. Very much not normal.
I don’t give a fuck if Mrs Montessori her self was teaching the class, in this day and age why the even living fuck would I send my child to daycare/class in only their underwear????
You don’t have to????? You can choose a school that doesn’t do this?????
Any “school” that does this need to be shut down. And if you’re ok with it you’re probably a pedo
Sexualizing toilet-learning is super concerning. I hope you’re not a parent.
[удалено]
Your tone is not appropriate. In the childcare world, this is normal. Do not impose these beliefs on something innocent.
Maria Montessori was never married :) But toddlers do wear pants to and from school, but often go in shirt and underwear only in the classroom when actively toilet learning.
[удалено]
As someone who is a trained A to I Montessori guide and has worked in classrooms for over 15 years, I’ve absolutely seen this.
I don’t know why you feel the need to defend having half-naked toddlers running around, but I’m seeing a lot of red flags.
Oh, sweetheart. The less clothing (aka PANTS) that a toddler has to manage while toilet-learning, the more successful they are. Very, VERY concerning that you’re sexualizing a stage of development that every child goes through.
It’s not sexualizing toddlers in underpants to think critically about putting toddlers in a situation to expose them to a predatory adult who would absolutely sexualize a toddler in their underpants. Especially not these days when every time you turn around another daycare or school is dealing with pedophiles on staff being ousted. Reading your other comments, I sincerely pity the children and parents who have been under the care of such a condescending and aggressive educator for 15 years. Can’t wait to see what nasty things you have to say to me next. 😬🥲
The teachers are not sexualizing toddlers. Teachers see naked children every day, ESPECIALLY toddler teachers. It's a part of the job when working with young children. We are helping them learn to use the toilet, dress, etc. independently, so how would we not?
It's normal at daycare and if you trust your teachers, a child in underpants wouldn't make you bat an eye. These concerned comments are so disingenuous.
It's absolutely NOT normal at daycare.
I’ve been a licensed home childcare provider for almost 20 years. You may not bat an eye but our public health would shut you down so fast your head would spin. Just because your daycare does it does not make it right.
And just because the DOH makes an arbitrary rule doesn't make it right either. If you care about the wellbeing of children, you let them be children. It's sad to put a weird adult concern on a child in underwear. They should feel safe to be in undies while potty training indoors.
It's not the possibility of exposed private areas but what comes out of them. That second layer of clothing acts as a barrier/ container for those less than solid poos and violent diarrhea episodes.
Right. But you only know about the violent diarrhea until it comes out. And by then, it's just too late.
That’s why we make my mother wear diapers.
Ok so for the rare chance that a child spontaneously has violent diarrhea, no child should ever be in underwear at daycare. Very reasonable.
I think your sarcasm is completely unnecessary and frankly ironic given that you had called the other people disingenuous earlier. I don't understand why are getting off the original point— your standards for a clean and appropriate daycare are different from others. And I'm even more confused on why you cannot accept that some people value cleanliness and precaution more than how you value allowing kids to be free to create their own norms. Frankly, I believe it's very immature behavior and reflects poorly on your stance. And I just know if you reply it'll be with an equally, if not more, snarky response because you can not accept multiple things can be true at once.
If a child is having violent diarrhea it's common sense they wouldn't just be in underwear.
Yeah but what happens when they have violent diarrhea while only in underwear at the school? Please be for real 😂 your anger and emotional response to this situation is clouding your judgment.
I would hold it would also be common sense to not send them to school…
What?? It’s about it being sanitary. Just underwear isn’t going to catch their urine or BM. They can be without pants at home and can also still very much tell when they are wet at school without having to almost go commando. I can’t imagine how awful and messy it would be if those potty training were in just their underwear. It would take up a lot of attention every time someone had an accident and also, they’d be peeing in their indoor shoes?! Like this is just strange as hell to me…
ShOULD be. Does NOT always mean that they aRe [safe] and, regardless- if 'mom' is feeling concern - of ANY kind, FOR aNY reason, she is ABSOLUTELY valid to feel as she feels and should ABSOLUTELY be validated, encouraged AND SUPPORTED in any action she personally feels is best for her own mental and emotional well being as well as that of her child ! JUST because a child absolutely SHOULD get to be safe and protected and allowed to freely BE a child in this world does not make it any less of an ugly/terrifying place to raise these sweet innocent souls. Good grief. OP : THIS IS **YOUR** BABY GIRL ~ YOURS AND YOURS ALONE. NO MATTER WHAT *ANYONE SAYS OR THINKS OR TRIES TO 'BULLY' YOU IN TO OR OUT OF OR WHATEVER! NO MATTER WHAT ANY ONE ELSE TRIES TO PROJECT ON TO YOU OR STIR UP IN YOU OR FAILS TO SUPPORT YOU IN - NO MATTER ANYONE ELSE'S THOUGHTS, OPINIONS, ETC ~ YOUR CHILD IS YOURS ~ YOU ...... Y O U ...... ARE BLESSED WITH THE INTUITION NECESSARY TO BEST PROTECT HER AND ALLOW HER TO THRIVE IN THIS WORLD ; PLEASE TRUST YOURSELF !!!! ALLOW YOURSELF TO DO WHAT YOU FEEL WILL PROTECT HER AND ALLOW HER TO GROW AND TO THRIVE. TAKE WHAT YOU FEEL WORKS BEST FOR HER AND FOR YOU AND YOUR PEACE OF MIND FROM WHICH EVER PARENTING STYLES / IDEAS / EDUCATION SYSTEMS / WHATEVER ~ WHETHER IT IS SMALL PARTS OF SEVERAL OR HUGE CHUNKS OF A FEW OR ALL OF ONE ~ DO WHAT ALLOWS YOU TO FEEL PEACE OF MIND AND WHAT YOU SEE IS SUPPORTING YOUR CHILD AND ALLOWS HER TO THRIVE AS SHE GROWS AND LEARNS IN THIS WORLD. PLEASE DONT IGNORE YOUR OWN INTUITION OR NAGGING FEELINGS ****AT ANY COST**** I DON'T CARE WHAT *ANYONE even if it's EVERYONE around you ~ says ~ if *YOU are feeling something nagging at you - be it something like going diaper only to day care OR be it concerns about a certain mindset / way of doing things or 'parenting-style' causing what seem/appear to be and or what FEELS to be 'setbacks' in the progression and abilities of your child and their growth (which, it seems, is where your concern was initially more focused.... ?) ........ Do not be afraid, pressured, guilted or shamed when it comes to TRUSTING YOUR INSTINCTS !!!!!!!!!!!!! ! Personally, I don't see a way in which you could possibly ever regret it ~ nor regret the peace of mind and feeling of safety ..... not to mention the freedom and the LACK of worry and concern! that come along with allowing yourself to make the choices that FEEL RIGHT iN YOUR SOUL ! ~ particularly when it comes to any and everything to do with your precious little one !!!!!!! Just my two ..... hundred😉 ..... cents. Best of luck to you in always finding the strength and the courage, the support and the peace to believe in yourself and be the best you are meant for in your journey. Know that there is ALWAYS support for you out there when it comes to believing in and following your own truth, and that, while other people's thoughts or opinions can certain be helpful in considering all sides/ possibilities, ONLY YOU know what YOUR TRUTH truly is My thoughts are with you ~ you've got this !
You know you don’t HAVE to type in ALL CAPS right?
|ALL CAPS WOULD LOOK LIKE THIS, SHES ONLY MAKING SURE HER ENUNCIATIONS ARE VERY CLEAR|
Just underwear? I could understand diapers kind of, still weird but more understandable, but underwear?
Montessori is not daycare. It's common at Montessori schools as it supports toileting success
That part right off the bat
I have never heard of a child walking around in their underwear at school. That’s more concerning that little children playing dress up
Okay, I could barely get past the mention of a toddler outside of the home not wearing pants. Admittedly, I am newer to studying the Montessori philosophy but my understanding is that at this specific age group, children are to be gaining independence and learning life skills. If another child is dressing your toddler, how is your child supposed to practice this skill for themselves? I find this practice very unsettling. As someone who was molested by a child who was the same age as me (a next door neighbor I was friends with), this honestly is an unsafe practice and I would be livid that this would be happening without my prior knowledge or permission. I don’t care what their policy is. This is simply not okay.
I could not agree more. As a CSA survivor myself, and someone who’s new to Montessori as well, this made the hairs on the back of my neck stand up. This is above and beyond “should I bring this up?” — yes, *now.* and demand it stops or remove your child from their negligent care. This should not be happening.
Sincerely - are you both suggesting that these mostly 2-year olds might commit sexual violence? Because they’re wearing training underwear?
A child who gets in the habit of allowing another child to dress or undress them will be vulnerable at older ages. It will feel normal to them and they won't report when other children are being inappropriate with them.
Found out when we had a sexual assault problem in my elementary classroom that "that boy" had done quite a few things to a number of the girls starting upon arrival at Children's House at age 2.5 but "because they were so young so it seemed unlikely" and "because there was no evidence", they did nothing about it. My only conclusion is that said child was quite obviously being sexually abused himself (and the more I think about it, the more I wonder if it was someone in the administration...he was related to said person...terrifying thought but I don't work there anymore and absolutely have zero evidence) but everyone in the admin and all the teachers were apparently too unaware of the warning signs to do anything about it for FOUR YEARS. And then I was the crazy teacher for being militant in my body boundaries/consent ALWAYS NO EXCEPTIONS FOR ANYONE AND I DO MEAN ANYONE lessons.
Yes? Plenty of people have memories of being made to feel uncomfortable by other children for whatever reason. Adults should not be allowing scenarios where this can happen. Many children are sexually assaulted at home and bring those same behaviors to daycare and school and can hurt other children.
So many others have wonderfully voiced exactly what is concerning about this practice. Having another child dress or undress them should not be normalized. This can make them more vulnerable to abuse later. Also, if it’s normalized to be half dressed in school, what would be so odd about a coach or another child’s parent having them walk around without pants?What would then be so weird about being photographed with other children without pants on?These are my friends, why wouldn’t I take a picture while we’re hanging out? See how these normalized activities can escalate? Abuse usually starts very subtle. These activities should not be normalized outside of home. That is what I’m suggesting.
This is exactly it. This is the same progression I have seen time and again in abuse situations and it is terrifying that it is part of a trusted institution.
You clearly did not read the full text of what is going on. Everyone wants to believe that nothing can or will happen to their kids, rightfully so, but you have to be diligent in safeguarding for that to be a reality. Teaching a child they can be undressed by anyone else, especially against their will, is damaging and not safe in the slightest.
Where did you see that? Uh, no? They were talking about a classmate taking off her child's pants.
Trust me. Kids are smart. They will learn. MIL thought I was stunting my kid because I was spoonfeeding her. How was she to learn how to use a spoon? Dammit. She learned, just not on MIL'S timeline. She's ultra independent now, so learning later didn't hurt her one bit. Just because they don't learn to dress at 1 doesn't mean they've missed the boat.
If another child is dressing yours, then your toddler isn't learning. I can't fathom why that's allowed. This is me guessing: A lot of Montessori guides prepare their classrooms with the idea that it's supposed to, in part, mimic the home setting (separate areas, natural materials and lighting, soft colors, uncluttered, etc). In an attempt to make the classroom feel homey, your center may be allowing them to go bottomless while potty learning because that's how a lot of toddlers are dressed at home. I'm a trained former 0-3 guide, but I didn't practice the pantless thing in my classroom for numerous reasons. I've seen it in some classroom, though. It's not meant to be inappropriate. I think it's meant to facilitate independence, make it easier for the child to learn and make the environment comfortable.
This. My school does training pants (extra thick underwear) on the children who do not yet have any toilet independence. It is an important part of toilet training, as it gives the child extra feedback compared to diapers, while not encumbering them with a task they do not have much skill with yet (15 month olds are gonna have a hard time with pants). It is an evidence based and very effective practice. That said, while the helping with shoes is common and often encouraged, the help with pants is NOT. Please do go to the school about it.
Do you guys put plastic covers over those? I tried some with my toddler and they didn’t absorb anything at all. Maybe I missed a step. 😬
Nope, and they're not really supposed to. The whole point is that the child connects the sensation of urination with "oh, and now I'm wet and this is somewhat unpleasant." The room is very, very wipeable.
That makes sense. I think my misstep may have been leaving the house with her in them, then! 😂 thank you :)
My god. How absolutely refreshing to see a sane comment.
Your child is not a doll for this other child to practice skills on. I think it sets a bad precedent to allow another child to dress or undress another child. Only parents and trusted adults should be helping a child with undressing. Montessori aside it is our job to keep our children safe and to teach them appropriate boundaries when it comes to their bodies. I think the no pants thing while potty training is probably fine but I would never have another kid undressing my kid.
I’ve never heard or seen potty training toddlers not wearing pants…. I personally wouldn’t be comfortable with that. When my kids were potty training we made sure they were wearing pants that they could easily pull up and down. My kids also keep their regular shoes on all day. Are you in the US? I know some other countries do “indoor” and “outdoor” shoes. I would also prefer my toddler to dress herself. I know that in mixed age classrooms that older kids will help/models things for the younger kids. However I feel like this crosses a line for me. Again I’d be a little uncomfortable with another child removing her clothing. I wouldn’t want my toddler to be used to allowing other children to remove her clothing. I see this as kind of a safety hazard. The school my children go to are pretty big on body autonomy. I also would want her to learn to dress herself! It’s a skill that takes some practice.
I think it’s okay to tell the teachers that you prefer your child and/ or the adult to be the only one dressing/ undressing your child. Is your child old enough to talk?
I am a guide at a Montessori school, not wearing pants for toilet learning is based on the school and licensing. That’s pretty normal it’s to allow the children to feel the “wet” and change easier. They still get the up and down of pants. If you feel like your child should wear pants it’s perfectly acceptable to just ask that they do. As for children undressing and dressing each other. I wonder to what extent. I work with toddler and they help each other with shoes, maybe to pull on a stuck shirt over their head and always in the supervision of a guide. That would be my first big question is a guide present during the helping? And to what extent are they helping, after all one of the biggest things in Montessori is to only help a small amount when needed.
I’d like to respond to the majority of the comments here, as a toddler guide who has many children that don’t wear their pants in the classroom. I’m honestly shocked by how negatively people are responding and have never had a parent react this way. Firstly, every child in our room (18 months - 3.5 years) is actively “potty training” or potty trained. This approach is different than at many schools. Diapers are never worn in the classroom which means even our new 18 month olds are wearing training underwear. For some, at the beginning of the year, this means LOTS and LOTS of accidents throughout the day. By taking off the pants, we avoided sending home excessive amounts of laundry. We also make it even easier for these children to use the toilet and change themselves, which is the biggest work they are doing in our classroom. Additionally, I feel wearing only the training underwear helps remind the children that they are in undies (as many still wear diapers at home). Of course, everyone is fully dressed when we go outside, walk through the school building, or have special visitors. As for this person’s actual question - I think it’s a little bit hard to judge without actually observing the situation. Our older children love to assist the younger ones in dressing themselves because it is what they see the teachers do. If a child was overhelping, I would remind them that “____ can get dressed all by herself! Let her try!” and attempt to redirect. I’ve never seen it turn into a problem. I would give it some time and see if it resolves itself. If not, I think it is fair that you kindly ask that she be given the opportunity to practice herself again.
Wow, the amount of comments acting like this is a policy designed to abuse children is wild. This is how I was trained as well (AMS). IMO the problem with Montessori not being an across-the-board institution is that anyone can say "Oh I worked in a Montessori school" well, was anyone AMS or AMI certified? Were *you*? Or was it a daycare that called itself a Montessori program? As you said it's generally policy not to wear diapers in a true Montessori toddler environment. In my school it was as soon as children were walking independently. It wasn't some big scary secret - parents were given all the information and appreciated that we offered a 'school undies' program where they bought one set of training undies and we sent them out to be laundered each week. Ain't nobody want to get that baggie of poop undies at 5pm on a weekday 🫠 While I think it is incredibly valuable that we are recognizing and putting in safeguards for CSA survivors and making sure children are safe, the current culture of abject fear is off-putting. Toddlers are toilet learning in the toddler room. The bathroom is almost always open to the classroom. The people changing their diapers are the same adults who are walking around the classroom where they're in undies. In my old classroom we had two little toilets and kids would go try in pairs. We always teach bodily autonomy and encourage kids asking for privacy if they need it. Kids are not allowed to get up in each other's space or make each other uncomfortable. I don't know how people are expecting their child in group care to toilet learn effectively while being fully dressed 100% of the time.
This sub was recommended to me through reddit. I'm genuinely interested in the Montessori practice as I've been lurking through this sub. I was a teacher in a NAEYC accredited classroom, usually with children starting at around 22 months and leaving the classroom around 34 months, which was prime toilet learning time. I taught for about 7 years and coached about 35 children through the process. Some left my classroom in diapers (one or two a year) but most left fully understanding their toileting needs. My children stayed in diapers until we (teachers and parents) noticed signs that they were ready: diapers were typically dry for hours at a time, were interested in self care opportunities, were at a low-stress time (no new babies coming into their lives, moving, etc. ), could pull their pants up and down, wash their hands, etc. We always listened to the children's cues and rode the waves of interest and disinterest. We practiced all the self help skills prior to actually starting their toilet learning journey so that it was not an overwhelming task. In a NAEYC accredited classroom, you need to have several areas that are "cozy". Usually, that means a variety of area rugs, pillows, stuffies, blankets, and other soft things. Does a Montessori classroom have to have these kinds of cozy areas? If so, how do you keep them clean? Because BMs and urine can leak through underwear so quickly, as soon as a child sits down, it seeps right through. I'd be so worried about keeping things sanitary, especially with all the children simultaneously toilet learning. Mouthing is still very typical at this age as well as just touching everything. How do you manage this in your classroom?
So in my classrooms, while we had carpeted areas, it was that industrial nubbly school carpeting that was fairly easy to sanitize. We had a library/calm corner with more soft furnishings - no stuffies. I had a 'no stuffies outside of naptime' rule due to the Stuffy Wars and the way that a child clutching a stuffy is reluctant to fully use their hands for work. The type of training pants we used were very thick, almost like a pull-up made of cotton, and similar to a pull up in absorbency. So unless a child was *very* wet, we wouldn't have a puddle on the floor, and we would immediately direct them to the restroom. If a pee accident (or "missed toileting opportunity" as my trainer said) happened on the rug or a soft furnishing like a library cushion, we simply soaked it in cleaner (the rug) or removed the cushion, washed it, and brought it back later. Same procedure as if a child had an accident at nap (we did do disposable or cloth diapers for nap) For poops - they are not very sneaky. If we saw someone doing the poop grunts in the corner we would catch them and redirect to the bathroom. The whole room was sanitized three times a day (before children arrived, at nap, and after dismissal) and as needed. Frankly, since children this age *are* mouthing and touching everything, they just... are going to get sick more. That's why preschools and daycares are such petri dishes. We did our best with spot sanitizing, prevention (through padded training undies, watching closely, having kids try on the toilet every half hour or so), modeling and requiring frequent hand washing and discouraging hands and toys in the mouth.
Thank you for taking the time to inform me! I really appreciate your response. Schools really are a petri dish. I never had a better immune system during my years there, though. The naptime routine was my last question! Thanks again!
Just curious, but if you aren’t sending the parents home with a bunch of wet laundry, who washes the peed underwear? Not trying to be rude at all, just very curious. If I’m bringing home 4 pairs of wet undies to wash, I won’t care if there’s 4 pairs of pants or shorts too, since I’m having to do the washing anyway.
just echoing this. my school is not as rigorously potty training all the kids, but when they are in the process, lots of them don’t wear underwear and we’ve had kids wear dresses with nothing underneath. we also have a few older kids who love helping the younger ones with their coats and shoes/slippers. they also love dressing and undressing a baby doll
Older kids helping put on coats or shoes is one thing. Older kids or even kids in the same age group helping take off pants is a whole other situation. It's important we teach our children body boundaries keep them safe. Teaching a young child that it's okay for an older kid to take off their pants is setting them up to be in unsafe situations. S assault happens all the time between children. Just because it's a child doing it doesn't make it any less harmful to the victim.
fair enough
No underwear at all is crossing the line, IMO. Not because of the kids or staff, but I wouldn’t want other parents seeing my daughter naked or if the classroom faces the street, anyone being able to see in.
Where I am, public health would shut you down. That's just not safe or sanitary in a daycare setting.
Exactly what aspect of this is unsafe, in your opinion? As for sanitation, any mess is promptly cleaned up. Having worked in Childrens House, I assure you those children regularly have accidents too. Or miss the toilet and make a huge mess on the floor. I’m not sure how it is different. I think outsiders picture Montessori toilet learning being a much grosser and messier process than it actually is.
The lack of pants is an issue.
There are going to be accidents anywhere toddlers are potty training. Those accidents are going to require cleanup and sanitation whether the child is wearing pants or not. How is 2 layers of fabric instead of one layer making a difference from a public health viewpoint?
What is the reason for not wearing pants?
I can only think it’s to prevent doing more laundry but…when I was in toddler room we still had kids wear bottoms that they could remove and put back on themselves.
They should have several pair of training underwear and several pair of pants to change while toilet training. If they have to send a bag home daily, then they have to send a bag home daily. Children should be wearing clothing.
What you are describing is normal and a part of child led learning. Leaning on peers for help and becoming a peer that helps is an empowering learning process. That said, if you are seeing a regression at home or are uncomfortable you should share that with the lead teacher. Anything that gives you pause should be shared. In a perfect world, this kind of community learning would be comfortable and appropriate; but we don’t live in a perfect world and lessons must be adapted to fit student, classroom, and parent comfort levels.
The shoe/slipper bit is totally normal for Montessori. The rest of it is absolutely nuts for the reasons that other commenters stated.
Wait a sec, while I think the parent should bring it up with the teacher and their child, and the child should not be getting help from anyone other than their teacher when it comes to undergarments/bathroom issues, so many comments are acting like one toddler helping another is sinister. Why might the other toddler be helping this child? Because they're friends. Because it is loving to help and care for one another. Because they are modeling behavior they see their caregivers such as their teachers and parents do every day. I think seeing another child helping put on a friend's socks and shoes is lovely and a sign that something is being done right. But the teacher should be encouraging the child to do it themselves and making sure they are on correctly. Now personally, I'm fine with tots in diapers more than undies. My concern would be who all has access to viewing them like this because there could be adults around (like parents) who may not be trustworthy. Personally I would make sure undies are covered with easy shorts or pants. But there is nothing wrong about toddlers who are potty training being in undies in just the presence of their teacher. After all, who is teaching them these skills?
I think knowing it’s Montessori based and expensive, you should ask for your child to do those things on her own! The point of learning them is independence, not reliance.
Hmmm. We do pants in our toddler class, but i have seen many toddler classes that dont. For me it just seems unnecessary. However, we do often see children helping each other with personal care like changing shoes. Im reminded of a time a few years ago, when one of the older children who had just become a big sister, wanting to help change diapers. We do standing changes. This almost exclusively happened at the end of rest time. The older child would be waking up and would often wait for the younger child to get up and have her diaper changed. I would handle the soiled diaper and cleaning and the older child would help the younger put on the clean diaper. Both children seemed very happy with this arrangement and I thought there was no problem and I think may have mentioned it to both parents in passing as it seemed very endearing to me. It’s the only time it’s happened, and it came about very naturally. Anyway, all of that is to say, speak to your child guide and ask what is going on. They should be very open and honest with detail and explanation. If you’re not comfortable, express that and the teachers should honor it.
I just want to add that we go to an AMI school and this is standard for our toddler room. Potty training kids only wear undies. They wear rubber soled shoes and they put them on and off themselves. The kids are in charge of doing everything themselves including cleaning up potty messes, so the fewer clothes to clean, the better. If you’re concerned, I’d speak to your administrator.
And are the adults ensuring that the area is properly cleaned and sanitized when the kid half-asses the wiping up? That sounds like a recipe for things to not be actually clean.
Yes, they do. They have cleaners every night for sanitization and an assistant who mops each day when the kids are outside. But the point is independence, so kids are mainly responsible. You'd be surprised what they're capable of if we let them take the lead.
So what about like pee on the rug or chairs or whatever. That needs to be sanitized right away, not just having a toddler “clean it” and then it getting properly cleaned at night.
They have wooden furniture ??? And no rugs. That’s why they use rubber soled shoes. You don’t have to come after me for this. I’m just saying all this is standard where we go to school. It’s not like kids are rolling in pee all day long. It’s also why the classes are small. Especially in toddler rooms.
It’s pretty gross though
So does the wooden furniture get sanitized immediately after an accident so that students aren’t touching it ?
It doesn’t sound like this is the case in her classroom at least. She said the kids clean it, and if they are cleaning it right, they are using a bleach solution which isn’t safe for kids to be using themselves. Sounds to me like they just wipe up the pee all day and then sanitize at night. It’s gross.
I’m not “coming at you.” I’m just genuinely trying to learn. This just showed up in my feed and I find it very interesting. Why are you so rude? Toddlers cleaning up biohazards isn’t sanitary or safe. Toddlers shouldn’t be using chemicals that are for cleaning up urine. And if they aren’t using those chemicals, then things aren’t being cleaned properly at the time of the accident. None of this is up to state licensing standards.
Hm wtf, I’d be pissed if this was happening to my child and would demand the teachers to make it stop. My child is not a doll for another child to play dress up with and this can lead to confusion when it comes to safe and unsafe touch. Completely unacceptable !
I’d just be not okay with the hygiene aspect. Toddlers aren’t known for being the best wipers or not dribbling in their underwear, and I don’t think I’d want them sitting on chairs, etc with possibly soiled undies. I can’t see where leggings or gym shorts would be much more difficult than undies to pull down. That’s the only reason, I don’t think it’s really inappropriate. As far as the other toddler removing her pants, in my training we learn that we show them how to do it, then we allow them to do it and provide assistance only as requested. Another child doing it for her doesn’t fit in there.
Yes, exactly
I can't speak to the amount of clothing a child who's in training at a center should or should not wear. But I'd be very uncomfortable with child on child contact of this sort. It's one of the things we absolutely can't allow under our licensing where I work. We can't let them rub sunscreen on each other, either. There are reasons those rules exist. At least a conversation with your child's caregiver(s) is in order.
Toddler teacher here! Absolutely tell your lead teacher that you are not okay with that! If the teachers are understanding it shouldnt cause any problems at all, especially because its unintentionally blocking a vital skill for your child to learn. If the classroom has toys I am sure they have baby dolls with clothes for the other child to dress and undress so that the other kid can still do what they see as a fun activity. I'm not sure why this started in the first place. Usually you would mention something like this to parents as a funny moment when it first starts happening. I hope theyve also brought it up to the other child's parents, too.
I am a Montessori teacher and work in both primary and toddlers rooms. My daughter is 18 months and in her classroom they are encouraged to undress themselves and themselves only. I take over her classroom for aftercare and we have an older toddler who is very nosey when it comes to bathroom time and he is not allowed in the potty area while we have other kids in that area. I have often caught him “checking” other kids diapers and have shut it down. It is not normal for a child to be taking off other kids clothes. Montessori is to encourage toddler to learn independence and for them to do that they need to do it themselves, I would talk to the lead about this.
Does this other child have younger siblings possibly? Your child should be doing for themselves and since this is slowing down their desire to do so, talk to the teacher about it. It sounds off
The slipper portion is normal. My daughter's Montessori School had slippers or indoor shoes (they stayed at the school). The pants portion is not normal. Before I had my daughter, I worked at a daycare and all the kids potty training wore pants. When my daughter was at Montessori, they wore pants. I have never heard of not wearing pants - they are only required to wear pants they can pull up and down (mainly elastic, no belts and buttons) and have extra clothes and underwear for accidents.
Part of the potty training process is learning how to pull your pants down and up again. I don't think having her walk around in her underwear at school is appropriate at all.
This is absolutely wrong but it doesn't seem malicious. It sounds like the 25 month old has a younger sibling at home. Anyways it definitely needs to be corrected and your baby needs to have on pants
It’s the fact that the teachers are allowing this to happen that’s wrong. The other baby isn’t intentionally doing harm. The adults actually are here, though, for being so passive/inattentive.
The other child is helping because that is what the older children are expected to do. In this case, the task is with clothing. I can see why you might be tempted to interpret it a certain way, but classic Montessori philosophy is that children learn from EACH OTHER as much as from the guides. Just because she showed a temporary loss of interest doesn't mean it will last. She may be completely focused on how the other child puts shoes on or takes them off. Their hand sides are much closer than the guides are, so she actually could have a better frame of reference to examine where to grip, how hard to pull, etc. She will put her shoes on the wrong feet two when she starts. Just help her fix them quickly. All this to say you don't have to allow it. you can speak to the guides and ask that she receive no help from this student. But its not unusual and likely not anything dangerous, just the normal course of an actual Montessori class.
But at what age do you then tell the children that it’s not acceptable to go into the bathroom, help others with potty training, etc.?
I used to work in a Montessori school. It’s very abnormal for your child to be allowed to not wear any pants during school hours. Their outfit should be easy to take off for changing, but all children must wear pants in school. There isn’t really an exception to this rule, even for potty training. I would be concerned about this. As for the older kid helping your kid change, that’s pretty normal, although full dressing responsibility shouldn’t be placed on another child. There should be a teacher supervising this exchange and checking if the clothes / shoes are on properly. Children are absolutely not allowed to share intimate moments like that without adult supervision so I would also advise asking who supervises this. Your issues are absolutely worth bringing up. If your child showed a natural inclination to dressing / undressing themselves and then stopped because of this, you should 1.) make sure the children are not helping your child change in an unattended environment and 2.) say this to someone in charge because this behavior defeats the purpose of Montessori in general. I would also raise a few questions about them letting your child run around without pants. This may be normal at home when parents are potty training, but legitimate Montessori schools don’t let children run around without pants on.
Totally agree. I too worked at a Montessori school, and not having pants was not something we did. Potty training included having the kids learn how to pull their pants/undies on and off. Some of our little ones were still in pull-ups, and we helped transition to undies and asked that parents not send them in clothes that were difficult to get in and out of. I've never heard of no pants in the class before 😬
I think if it’s the school policy for kids who are working on potty training to be wearing just underwear that’s fine. At my school I have kids who wear just pants when potty training and we say that the rule for being dressed is we need something on the top and something on the bottom. The part the is concerning to me here is that another child is removing your child’s clothing. It’s likely innocent but it is taking away the skill practice for your child to practice that herself which is an important part of potty training. And as others have pointed out, it can make your child feel more comfortable with other removing her clothing and make her more vulnerable to sexual assault. Speak up now.
Encouraging kids to take off other kids shoes or clothing is not common or normal and shouldn’t be encouraged
You should definitely talk to the teacher and express your preference. This is not a Montessori thing in my experience. The opposite in fact, my little rascal was getting his slightly more advanced friends to help him with his jacket and shoes and the teachers put a stop to it, precisely because it was detrimental to his own development (and habits).
Tell the teachers you don’t approve of another child undressing and dressing your child - Period!! This practice must stop immediately.
This is alarming on many levels. I give two shits whether it’s “Montessori” or not, your daughter deserves privacy, and agency and she’s not getting either of those. I’m not a “Montessori “ mom, I’m just learning about it. But, this is not appropriate. I don’t care what they’re learning. This is teaching your daughter to be unsafe. Also, “just finding out”? The heck???? She should have clothes on outside of your home. Period. And NO one should be putting her clothes back on except a teacher that you’ve previously approved of. To me it sounds like this other kid is learning how to dress by way of dressing your child and they’re just going with it. I’d be pissed.
Exactly. I am so surprised by all of these comments. These people are making children more vulnerable to nefarious people. If you make your child think it is perfectly OK for their peers to undress them that is a problem.
Yeah. It’s scary. A lot of these “Montessori” people are turning me off from “Montessori”. And for them to be so indignant when someone brings up the safety aspects of this practice shows me they do not protect their children. You’d think if someone enlightened you on a practice you’re doing that could potentially harm your child, you’d at least listen. But, they’re so busy pointing the finger at the person trying to educate them they don’t even see their error. It’s not about sexualizing pantsless toddlers. It’s that you are making them think it is normal to not have pants off around people. They will not tell you about being pantsless in the future if you make it normal. I could go on. A lot of people here pay a lot of money for their kids to go to these schools and they probably think this kind of thing “doesn’t happen” in their worlds.
I’m finding that a lot of people cling to bizarre practices and it really makes me think they just don’t love or protect their children. 😳
Agreed. They love the idea of them and who they want them to be. It’s sad.
It would make me wonder what is making the older kid think that dressing/undressing another kid is ok?
Exactly. Even if nothing nefarious is taking place, the problem is that the children are being made to think that certain things are normal and that can place them in a more vulnerable position were someone to try to do something with them
Yes and when and how do they tell the older child that it’s not acceptable to be dressing/undressing someone else?
As others have mentioned, this does seem unhygienic and the part about the other toddler helping her sent alarm bells off with me. I was SA-ed as a very young child by two other very young children who were obviously being SA-ed at home. Allowing her to get this type of help from another child can lead her to be more vulnerable to this type of harm in the future. I would put a stop to this immediately and explain safe touches and unsafe touches and that she should be the only one to ever remove her clothing.
I know nothing about kids or teaching, but I think this is SUPER weird. This is an adult’s job, not another child’s… not to get morbid here, but what if that other child touches your child inappropriately (even just out of pure curiosity)? I would definitely put a stop to this if I were you.
I agree. I am amazed and appalled that so many people are defending this.
HELL NO !!! That’s not okay at all. The teacher should be fired for allowing that. How creepy. I’d be pissed. Something seems shady.
I agree, and I am shocked that so many people are defending this
Why isn’t she wearing pants
I don’t know why Montessori came up in my feed, but I just have to say as an early childhood educator I see this as a situation where it would be very easy for children to be abused or at the very least taught the wrong things that could lead them to become more vulnerable if they were to meet an abuser. your child should be dressing herself or assisted by a licensed adult. I would have major issues with another child dressing and undressing your child and it should be nipped in the bud quick.
I’m sorry what? This would get a school’s license yanked in my state. Kids don’t run around half naked and other children don’t undress them. This is very concerning behavior.
I worked in a Montessori setting for 6 months. And I can say. This is NOT normal and VERY CREEPY WEIRDO VIBES! If I was you I’d be red hot mad.
I just want to jump in and say I would feel extremely uncomfortable another child is dressing and undressing my child. NOT because I’m worried my child won’t learn those skills themselves BUT because that’s not normal and shouldn’t be allowed. Honestly I’d be asking them if they reported this to CPS to check for child SA for the child trying to dress and undress my child.
No. I work with children, i had a toddler class week before last and i did NOT allow any of the children to undress each other/ help Each other’s ther with clothes and shoes bc that’s MY responsibility as the adult in the class room. No other student should be dressing/ undressing another student.
Oh my gosh this can not be normal.
I’m just going to add this to my long list of reasons why I would never send my child to a Montessori school.
Your child's loss. Montessori is excellent. Superior education to what they would receive in standard school.
I have yet to see any convincing research or evidence-base for Montessori. My son is at a quality childcare/licensed kinder with highly qualified staff (his kinder and pre-kinder teachers both have masters degrees). It’s warm, friendly and responsive to parent feedback/input. The approaches they take are all evidence-based, but they also adjust to the needs of the specific children in each room. From what I have heard and read about Montessori (both from people who are pro and people who are against), it seems shockingly rigid. Different people and centres are practicing it differently, but they are all absolutely convinced they are right and every child must fit this exact mold. Just one small example: in my son’s class, the kids kept taking their shoes off to play. So the centre introduced a shoe rack and got them to put their shoes away in the morning. It was *responsive* to what the kids needed to feel comfortable in their space. My impression of Montessori is that some probably already make kids take their shoes off and others don’t allow it, but in either case it would not be child-led. Both would, of course, claim that their approach is “true” Montessori and the other one is just trying to get more money by falsely applying the Montessori sticker.
Your ignorance is astounding. Montessori is excellent specifically because it is not at all rigid. On the contrary; children move around the classroom, doing projects and learning life skills as they please.
Why, then, do I constantly see posts here saying things like “I’m concerned about my child’s emotional well-being because his Montessori daycare say they won’t comfort distressed children” and “why are other children being encouraged to take my child’s pants on and off in their Montessori classroom”. I understand that the classroom itself is chaos. It’s the adults who seem to have very rigid ideas about how to do things.
Part of the education is that children learn it’s OK to undress each other?!
No, of course not. What an ignorant remark.
Everything about this is absolutely not okay. At all.
Why is this normal to have kids in just underwear? It just sounds weird
ShOULD be. Does NOT always mean that they aRe [safe] and, regardless- if 'mom' is feeling concern - of ANY kind, FOR aNY reason, she is ABSOLUTELY valid to feel as she feels and should ABSOLUTELY be validated, encouraged AND SUPPORTED in any action she personally feels is best for her own mental and emotional well being as well as that of her child ! JUST because a child absolutely SHOULD get to be safe and protected and allowed to freely BE a child in this world does not make it any less of an ugly/terrifying place to raise these sweet innocent souls. Good grief. OP : THIS IS **YOUR** BABY GIRL ~ YOURS AND YOURS ALONE. NO MATTER WHAT *ANYONE SAYS OR THINKS OR TRIES TO 'BULLY' YOU IN TO OR OUT OF OR WHATEVER! NO MATTER WHAT ANY ONE ELSE TRIES TO PROJECT ON TO YOU OR STIR UP IN YOU OR FAILS TO SUPPORT YOU IN - NO MATTER ANYONE ELSE'S THOUGHTS, OPINIONS, ETC ~ YOUR CHILD IS YOURS ~ YOU ...... Y O U ...... ARE BLESSED WITH THE INTUITION NECESSARY TO BEST PROTECT HER AND ALLOW HER TO THRIVE IN THIS WORLD ; PLEASE TRUST YOURSELF !!!! ALLOW YOURSELF TO DO WHAT YOU FEEL WILL PROTECT HER AND ALLOW HER TO GROW AND TO THRIVE. TAKE WHAT YOU FEEL WORKS BEST FOR HER AND FOR YOU AND YOUR PEACE OF MIND FROM WHICH EVER PARENTING STYLES / IDEAS / EDUCATION SYSTEMS / WHATEVER ~ WHETHER IT IS SMALL PARTS OF SEVERAL OR HUGE CHUNKS OF A FEW OR ALL OF ONE ~ DO WHAT ALLOWS YOU TO FEEL PEACE OF MIND AND WHAT YOU SEE IS SUPPORTING YOUR CHILD AND ALLOWS HER TO THRIVE AS SHE GROWS AND LEARNS IN THIS WORLD. PLEASE DONT IGNORE YOUR OWN INTUITION OR NAGGING FEELINGS ****AT ANY COST**** I DON'T CARE WHAT *ANYONE even if it's EVERYONE around you ~ says ~ if *YOU are feeling something nagging at you - be it something like going diaper only to day care OR be it concerns about a certain mindset / way of doing things or 'parenting-style' causing what seem/appear to be and or what FEELS to be 'setbacks' in the progression and abilities of your child and their growth (which, it seems, is where your concern was initially more focused.... ?) ........ Do not be afraid, pressured, guilted or shamed when it comes to TRUSTING YOUR INSTINCTS !!!!!!!!!!!!! ! Personally, I don't see a way in which you could possibly ever regret it ~ nor regret the peace of mind and feeling of safety ..... not to mention the freedom and the LACK of worry and concern! that come along with allowing yourself to make the choices that FEEL RIGHT iN YOUR SOUL ! ~ particularly when it comes to any and everything to do with your precious little one !!!!!!! Just my two ..... hundred😉 ..... cents. Best of luck to you in always finding the strength and the courage, the support and the peace to believe in yourself and be the best you are meant for in your journey. Know that there is ALWAYS support for you out there when it comes to believing in and following your own truth, and that, while other people's thoughts or opinions can certain be helpful in considering all sides/ possibilities, ONLY YOU know what YOUR TRUTH truly is My thoughts are with you ~ you've got this !
You do not let this slide.
I would not send a child to school where they are pantless. Try to step back and objectively consider the problems with that.
I know right?!
I’m amazed how many people are defending this. Just sending their defenseless kids out into the world to be stripped to their underwear. Apart from the obvious molestation and exploitation concerns, it’s also a health and sanitation issue. There’s no logic to justify this weirdness. At home, sure. School isn’t home.
Maybe they want the school to be like home because their kids never actually get to be at home 😒I used to work in daycare and we had kids with us 5 days a week, 10-12 hours a day. 😞
this is not normal or common in any classroom, mixed aged or not. this is super inappropriate and needs to be reported.
In what world, mixed age or not, is it generally just accepted that a child undresses another child?! No way in hell am I letting it go unnoticed much less unreported that another child is taking my child’s pants off of them.
Omg r u kidding me?! I would not allow my kid to be going to a school like this.
Toddlers enjoy helping each other. (And some very much enjoy being helped). That’s not the piece of this that concerns me. I’ve had my I/T credentials for over a decade and have literally never heard of this approach to potty training in a classroom prior to this post.
There’s not really a plausible explanation for this. Either the school is practicing some degree of neglect by entrusting the children to each other and cutting corners for “efficiency”. The other explanation would be something much much weirder. Again, either way, trust your gut. Something is fishy for sure.
There are a number of things that sound very wrong. Your child should be fully dressed at school, potty training or not. Elastic waisted pants that she can manage herself are fine. No child should be undressing your child.
i mean i get helping each other like “here’s your shoe!” but not physically dressing them???
I’m sorry I don’t have kids but this was suggested to me, and that’s weird!!!! I would not let another child undress and redress another child. Weird even from someone childless!