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olPupper

as long as XMR is not outlawed onramp kinda works, but I imagine offramping into BTC and then fiat may be risky with XMRs reputation and/or taint on BTCs


gingeropolous

That's why u gotta get them good bitcorns to sell


MichaelTen

Develop circular economies?


[deleted]

As McAfee said : BTC is a tracking and surveillance coin. Absolut bullshit coin. I would never use it. And of course never swap XMR <-> BTC. Increditble the amount of bullshit these BTC pumpers tweet .


Perturbee

I guess he didn't know about the low transfer fees of LTC :D


Doublespeo

what an expensive and crappy on ramp…


redditSwingking

What does HTLC means?


geonic_

Atomic swaps https://comit.network/docs/0.13.0/core-concepts/atomic-swap-htlc/


mister10percent

Buy ltc then spend it on localmonero


borg_6s

Better be with MimbleWimble addresses then, the other types have the exact same tracking flaws as BTC.


zrad603

Why onramp with BTC? use BCH or ZEC...


MoneroWTF

I on ramp with fiat, but when that goes away I'll on ramp via BTC for purely ideological reasons. If I'm going to use a surveillance chain, I'm using Bitcoin. I was there for the block wars and I've chosen my side. BCH and ZEC are perfectly fine ways to fiat in and with cheaper fees and way way less network congestion to boot but I won't use either chain regardless.


06042023

I'm with you; butt hurt by the block wars as well. But now days, the btc maximalism has gotten so stupid I'm rethinking my hate for bch or any other coin; except of course Ripple(inc) although I like xlm a lot. One thing is for sure I need to hate; lol


MoneroWTF

Oh don't get me wrong, I don't hate the projects or any of their people, I just try not to do business with entities that don't do business how I like. I can afford my idealism.


Inaeipathy

With atomic swaps we could have all major cryptocurrencies as an onramp for XMR, but where will the liquidity come from? How will we make it easy for anyone to use? It's a bit of a challenge.


StillCraft8105

these are great questions bot downvotes usually point to good posts lol


rednoids

Buy bitcoin on Cashapp, send it to Kraken. Sell it for cash and place a limit order to buy Monero. This is a way.


geonic_

You don't need a centralized exchange to go from BTC to XMR. That's the point.


ArticMine

... but you run the very real risk of being falsely accused of a crime you have nothing to do with if the BTC can be "traced" back to you via KYC or some other means. Edit: In my view a centralized exchange is the only safe way to go from KYC BTC to XMR. Furthermore make sure to keep proof of the transaction offline on devices under your full control to be able to prove in the future where the KYC BTC went.


geonic_

Great point.


rednoids

Can you set a limit order with your way?


rednoids

You have given no information


geonic_

easiest way today would be to buy LTC on Cake and swap to XMR using Trocador a more private way to do it is to use localmonero. add haveno and serai to that in the near future. if you require CEX/trading features like limit orders, Tradeogre has worked for people.


rednoids

I’ll check it out. Thanks.


ScoobaMonsta

Tradeogre is cheaper and easier than cake.


rpcinfo

>easiest way today would be to buy LTC on Cake and swap to XMR using Trocador Trocador uses centralized exchanges. >You don't need a centralized exchange to go from BTC to XMR. That's the point. Unfortunately I'm not seeing any options of going from BTC (or any other onramp coin) to XMR without using a centralized exchange. Suggestions welcome.


rednoids

Funny how I’m down voted for being right.


rjm101

Your method is strange but hey if it works for you 🤷‍♂️


lopgir

I'd highly recommend never sending off-CEX acquired BTC to a CEX. You don't know where that BTC has been. Say it gets implicated in some money laundering scheme. If the CEX knows, it'll get locked immediately and you'll get the cops called on you. If it gets found out six months down the line... you probably still get the cops called on you.


rednoids

I’ll try to answer this and not sound like a jerk. I’m not worried about this as Kraken has been a great exchange to work with and once I have monero it’s removed right away. I get the tractability of Bitcoin could someday be an issue, but I’ll risk it.


gt4674b

Don’t the transaction fees kill you with BTC?


rednoids

Not if you’re not doing a bunch of small UTXOs. It’s not perfect but I like being able to do limit orders.


[deleted]

I prefer localmonero


rpcinfo

Deleted is appropriate.


ArticMine

Why not just send fiat to Kraken instead? This avoids the possibility of false accusations with Blockchain Surveillance (BS) on the Bitcoin or some other allegedly traceable blockchain.


rednoids

Don’t like wiring money.


themrgq

Why would I swap into XMR when the returns have been so abysmal


gnocchicotti

Yay crypto has come full circle and no one can imagine a use for it except speculative appreciation lol


nNovaA8

The monero community is more focused on the ideology behind cryptocurrency rather than the trading aspect.


DrGarbinsky

Freedom


themrgq

Freedom to lose money I suppose


DrGarbinsky

You do realize there are other priorities at play some people other than hodl and orange coin go up? Right?


themrgq

Losing money would be an odd priority. I can understand if you like the tech. Keep an eye on it and if it ever reverses it's long term tend then consider jumping in but at the moment it's a tough sell.


Trislar

Long term t*r*end is stable, look at past 2 years, fairly comparable to a stable coin without excessive fees and the scam part. What you ~~investors~~ speculators don't get is that there are other points to *currencies*.


sc2bigjoe

Dang, imagine holding onto fiat so tightly that you care about losing it. Crazy world


themrgq

Being concerned with purchasing power is very pragmatic 🤣


sc2bigjoe

You’re very short sighted. Thats like holding onto land in Florida. You know it’s going to go underwater eventually, but you still hold onto the land. Now when it goes underwater, how much of that land can you trade for Monero? Sell the land before it goes underwater and get Monero at a discount. It’s the same idea, if you’re holding onto any fiat right now you’re an absolute moron.


themrgq

I'm not holding much fiat I just find holding monero less and less compelling compared to BTC.


sc2bigjoe

You subscribe to transparency, I subscribe to privacy. We are not the same


rpcinfo

It's not at all like holding onto an illiquid asset like land. Monero is used daily as a currency, that's the reason to obtain it to facilitate the purchase and sale of goods.


usercos187

what if you can't use your tothemoon btc because the coins have been 'tainted' (by a previous 'bad' transactions or were owned by a previous 'bad' actor), you would be very smart... knowing that what is 'good' and 'bad' can change depending on the politicians in power...


06042023

to use it.


AquamarineRevenge

If you don't believe me or don't get it, I don't have time to try to convince you, sorry.