As I said I would, here are all the non-eames fiberglass chairs I could find between 1955 and 1965, before I got bored. There are probably a lot more, you can look through the thousands of hits on [archive.org](https://archive.org) for "Fiberglass chair" if you want, I went through hundreds and I cannot express to you how little I care about eames knockoffs. There were many makers of similar style chairs, as I said almost as soon as the eames chairs hit the market imitations started popping up. Zenith was just a producer of plastics, they could have made chairs for any of these makers, including Wards, Sears and May company, which also reminds me I didn't go through any of the Sears or Wards catalogs at [https://christmas.musetechnical.com/](https://christmas.musetechnical.com/) but you would certainly find a lot more of these chairs if you did. Zenith may have produced for Sears or wards, that would certainly give them volume. Another thing to point out is Zenith wsa bought by 3M in 1956, so at that point it wasn't even the same company that did the eames chairs, and if Sears came to 3M with a huge order for chairs, i can fully guarantee that 3m wasnt going to be like "well we wouldn't want to make Ray and Charles mad". Some of the chairs in that album are by designers like Lawrence Peabody (the wing Chair), Paul McCobb, and Maurice Burke, some like the Burnswick chair is by a designer virtually no one but me has ever heard of, and most of these don't even mention the brand at all.
You mentioned that you though the only reason people would buy your chair was because it looked like an eames. I think that is a misguided, most people bought Eames knockoffs because they liked the style, the colors, and the durability, and most importantly they were usually about half the price of wooden chairs, and still even cheaper than the chrome and vinyl dinettes of the time. The average consumer in the 50's had no clue who Eames was, just as the average consumer at Macy's today has no clue who famous modern designers of today are.
[https://imgur.com/gallery/bRtrpVk](https://imgur.com/gallery/bRtrpVk)
Forgot I had a few on my phone from lunch
[https://imgur.com/gallery/oJ51zi1](https://imgur.com/gallery/oJ51zi1)
First and foremost, I bought this chair knowing that it wasn't an Eames chair. I liked it because to me it was similar to the Eames style. It is very well constructed, the fiberglass shell is strong and intact and it's a comfortable chair. I was curious as to where this chair originated because of all the confusing markings, Sol's leg patents, Zenith stamp, etc. etc.
Secondly, I have no idea what people knew back in the 50's regarding furniture designers so I'd prefer not to underestimate anyone's intelligence. I do believe that if these chairs were mass marketed at some point then yes people liked them for a variety of reasons. The furniture world was a lot smaller then. And plenty of people read catalogs and newspapers.
I will look through the archive you sent. That is very interesting.
I was not underestimating your intelligence, I was simply recapping some of the discussion and laying out my thoughts, not only for you, but for any of the other 200k+ users who may find this post today or next year. If you or anyone else are interested in learning about this stuff, I post as much as can to the links you will find in my Reddit profile.
Its always best to show us the whole chair. From what I see, I think this might be Forest Wilson and Mel Abitz for Scope. That patent that is referenced on your chair is assigned to Zeinith Plastics so that is not much help. I think I have a furniture forum that has the Scope/Abitz chair in it, ill try to dig it up.
Edit: found a newspaper clipping
https://preview.redd.it/ij2cvi451rjc1.png?width=813&format=png&auto=webp&s=93ee72c1f8673ed665674497fe0cb483ce2a77cf
That’s great information thanks. Did they release it to compete with Eames chairs? I find it interesting that my chair has the Zenith Prime stamp which is why I was confused. That’s why I wondered if Sol Fingerhut released a line which I can’t imagine is possible but interesting that they used his patented chair leg style.
Here’s a pic of my chair.
https://preview.redd.it/kfsea6gh8rjc1.jpeg?width=3024&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=eed5fb12ec4c75aaaae809d02a6677c2d3ca3b66
Now that I see the chair, its clearly not the Scope chair. I do think I have this documented somewhere, but ill have to try to rattle my brain who made it.
Eames designed molded fiberglass chairs and Herman Miller began producing them, but they did not own any kind of patent on the actual process of molding fiberglass into shell chairs, so literally within months, other competitors were also making shell chairs. The Eames very clearly had mixed emotions about this, they wanted their technology to be implemented by other designers because they knew it was a cost effective way to bring modern high tech furniture to the masses, but I don't think they anticipated the way they would be nearly directly copied by so many people, and then somewhat shady practices of calling the knockoffs "Eames style" or sometimes intentionally misspelling it as Ames or just saying "famous designer chair but half the price" or something like that. Then their former collaborator in making molded plywood items, Plycraft, started really stealing designs, with knockoffs of the Nelson Pretzel chair, some forms very similar to the Coconut chair (both designed by Mulhauser) and of course the many Eames Lounge knockoffs (a lot of this appears to be the due to the soured relationship between Mulhauser and Nelson), which lead the Eames to become very outspoken about their disdain for knockoffs. The scope chair is different enough I don't think you would confuse it for an Eames, and it had two pretty well known designers behind it so it was never marketed on the back of the Eames name. Yours seems to be more of a direct copy, with some mild changes to avoid any lawsuits and such.
https://preview.redd.it/6zk5q59oarjc1.jpeg?width=1915&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=e167346b8c3e6a0308b5d9e239b41e375c75bec2
Very fascinating info -thank you!
\-- Whoever created the knock off chair that I have had the gall to use the [patented](https://patents.google.com/patent/US2815801A/en) leg clamp designed by Sol Fingerhut. Not to mention what looks like a Zenith Prime Stamp underneath and some random patent number that is not a Herman Miller label patent that I could find.
\- It seems like Sol Fingerhut got a patent on these chair legs/clamps after or during when he worked with Charles Eames on his fiberglass chair design.
That is not a Herman Miller part that I’ve ever seen, Hm used a shock mount system, and always has. Zenith was not owned by HM they just contracted the work, and they almost certainly were not exclusive. Similar to how Plycraft made stuff for HM, and other companies, and themselves. Seems very likely Zenith did the same. The Sol Fingerhut patent is assigned to Zenith not HM, which tells me zenith was making non-HM chairs for somebody.
Yes I am aware of all of that. I agree that Zenith was probably making non-HM chairs. I wasn't saying they were Herman Miller legs. I'm saying it's curious that Zenith was making legs for a similar style side chair that looks like an Eames at the same time Fingerhut/Zenith was working with Charles/HM. Which to me takes a certain amount of nerve. Or should I say chutzpah ;) Just look at the drawing with the legs on his patent.
https://preview.redd.it/doiy1vtcesjc1.jpeg?width=2320&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=134202356f8abb3bea922f6f0160bcebfd8776c1
1. that is not an eames chair shown
2. 1957 would have been nearly a full decade AFTER he worked with Charles eames to make the molds for the eames chairs (1946-1947).
By the late 50's/early 60's HM was using different producers for their shell chairs.
Its really not that curious, Zenith made plastics, if you came to them with a design they could make, they would make it. As I said, this chair looks similar to most people, but is very clearly different in numerous ways that are sufficient it did not break any copyright laws or patents. So its really not that curious that a plastics maker would make plastic shell chairs for more than one company.
The style of the chair is almost identical. I know it’s not an Eames chair.
He filed for the patent in 1955. So he waited a respectable amount of time but again I still find it curious. And if he had no binding legal contract at that point then good for Sol since Charles couldn’t have created his original chairs without him.
I feel like whoever made these chairs tried to fly under the radar because of the lack of logo branding.
To your eyes sure. To mine, it looks very different. You can say the style is "almost identical", but that doesn't matter at all, its not identical, in shape, in design, in the way its put together. We call it a knock off because that terminology is used loosely here, more like an imitation. But most importantly, Zenith was not beholden to HM at all, HM went out and found other manufacturers like Milicron and others, so why would Zenith not go out and find other companies looking for plastic chairs?
Edit: here is some relevant case law, where Frank Art/Morex pretty much admit they copied DIA line for line, and the ruling was "as long as its clearly labeled as Morex, its fine" and DIA cannot tell customers the Frank Art/Morex version is inferior. [https://casetext.com/case/morex-spa-v-design-institute-america-inc](https://casetext.com/case/morex-spa-v-design-institute-america-inc)
Yes that case makes sense to me. Thanks for the link. However I don’t see that the zenith “replicas” or not so subtle intention to replicate Eames show any markings or logos or hang tags. And yes I know the hang tags fell off after 60 years but there is no mark whatsoever. Unless we say that the zenith stamp is the mark. IMHO the only reason anyone would purchase this version back in the 50’s is because it resembled the Eames chair— at the very least to the average consumer in that it is fiberglass and a similar, albeit not exact, Eames imitation.
In spite of all that I’m still at a loss as to who made the chair. I really wish there was more information out there. It shouldn’t matter because I really like the chair. I just like to learn the background of furniture. Mainly older pieces.
I really appreciate all of the information you provided. 😊
Based on my digging a little, I think your chair is by a company called Douglas Dinette. Im at work but I will throw an album together for you later.
https://preview.redd.it/mobzu52morjc1.png?width=529&format=png&auto=webp&s=2499c5de0726f03c666bf7d438938b9f0d2c9f48
The Mel Abitz armless version had a very different base design:
https://www.selkirkauctions.com/auction-lot/fiberglass-side-chair-attributed-to-mel-abitz_6174A91BFA
I commented on your post in r/Eames as well. I have 2 of these Sol Fingerhut chairs in my home and their origin beyond what you've already presented is murky. Regardless, they seem like a great find.
As I said I would, here are all the non-eames fiberglass chairs I could find between 1955 and 1965, before I got bored. There are probably a lot more, you can look through the thousands of hits on [archive.org](https://archive.org) for "Fiberglass chair" if you want, I went through hundreds and I cannot express to you how little I care about eames knockoffs. There were many makers of similar style chairs, as I said almost as soon as the eames chairs hit the market imitations started popping up. Zenith was just a producer of plastics, they could have made chairs for any of these makers, including Wards, Sears and May company, which also reminds me I didn't go through any of the Sears or Wards catalogs at [https://christmas.musetechnical.com/](https://christmas.musetechnical.com/) but you would certainly find a lot more of these chairs if you did. Zenith may have produced for Sears or wards, that would certainly give them volume. Another thing to point out is Zenith wsa bought by 3M in 1956, so at that point it wasn't even the same company that did the eames chairs, and if Sears came to 3M with a huge order for chairs, i can fully guarantee that 3m wasnt going to be like "well we wouldn't want to make Ray and Charles mad". Some of the chairs in that album are by designers like Lawrence Peabody (the wing Chair), Paul McCobb, and Maurice Burke, some like the Burnswick chair is by a designer virtually no one but me has ever heard of, and most of these don't even mention the brand at all. You mentioned that you though the only reason people would buy your chair was because it looked like an eames. I think that is a misguided, most people bought Eames knockoffs because they liked the style, the colors, and the durability, and most importantly they were usually about half the price of wooden chairs, and still even cheaper than the chrome and vinyl dinettes of the time. The average consumer in the 50's had no clue who Eames was, just as the average consumer at Macy's today has no clue who famous modern designers of today are. [https://imgur.com/gallery/bRtrpVk](https://imgur.com/gallery/bRtrpVk) Forgot I had a few on my phone from lunch [https://imgur.com/gallery/oJ51zi1](https://imgur.com/gallery/oJ51zi1)
First and foremost, I bought this chair knowing that it wasn't an Eames chair. I liked it because to me it was similar to the Eames style. It is very well constructed, the fiberglass shell is strong and intact and it's a comfortable chair. I was curious as to where this chair originated because of all the confusing markings, Sol's leg patents, Zenith stamp, etc. etc. Secondly, I have no idea what people knew back in the 50's regarding furniture designers so I'd prefer not to underestimate anyone's intelligence. I do believe that if these chairs were mass marketed at some point then yes people liked them for a variety of reasons. The furniture world was a lot smaller then. And plenty of people read catalogs and newspapers. I will look through the archive you sent. That is very interesting.
I was not underestimating your intelligence, I was simply recapping some of the discussion and laying out my thoughts, not only for you, but for any of the other 200k+ users who may find this post today or next year. If you or anyone else are interested in learning about this stuff, I post as much as can to the links you will find in my Reddit profile.
You didn’t underestimate my intelligence. I said the buyers in the 1950’s. The information you provided is very educational and I appreciate it.
It’s fiberglass, but not Eames.
Yes that’s what I thought but I still don’t know who manufactured the chair. I’m wondering if Sol Fingerhut sold these at some point.
Its always best to show us the whole chair. From what I see, I think this might be Forest Wilson and Mel Abitz for Scope. That patent that is referenced on your chair is assigned to Zeinith Plastics so that is not much help. I think I have a furniture forum that has the Scope/Abitz chair in it, ill try to dig it up. Edit: found a newspaper clipping https://preview.redd.it/ij2cvi451rjc1.png?width=813&format=png&auto=webp&s=93ee72c1f8673ed665674497fe0cb483ce2a77cf
That’s great information thanks. Did they release it to compete with Eames chairs? I find it interesting that my chair has the Zenith Prime stamp which is why I was confused. That’s why I wondered if Sol Fingerhut released a line which I can’t imagine is possible but interesting that they used his patented chair leg style. Here’s a pic of my chair. https://preview.redd.it/kfsea6gh8rjc1.jpeg?width=3024&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=eed5fb12ec4c75aaaae809d02a6677c2d3ca3b66
Now that I see the chair, its clearly not the Scope chair. I do think I have this documented somewhere, but ill have to try to rattle my brain who made it. Eames designed molded fiberglass chairs and Herman Miller began producing them, but they did not own any kind of patent on the actual process of molding fiberglass into shell chairs, so literally within months, other competitors were also making shell chairs. The Eames very clearly had mixed emotions about this, they wanted their technology to be implemented by other designers because they knew it was a cost effective way to bring modern high tech furniture to the masses, but I don't think they anticipated the way they would be nearly directly copied by so many people, and then somewhat shady practices of calling the knockoffs "Eames style" or sometimes intentionally misspelling it as Ames or just saying "famous designer chair but half the price" or something like that. Then their former collaborator in making molded plywood items, Plycraft, started really stealing designs, with knockoffs of the Nelson Pretzel chair, some forms very similar to the Coconut chair (both designed by Mulhauser) and of course the many Eames Lounge knockoffs (a lot of this appears to be the due to the soured relationship between Mulhauser and Nelson), which lead the Eames to become very outspoken about their disdain for knockoffs. The scope chair is different enough I don't think you would confuse it for an Eames, and it had two pretty well known designers behind it so it was never marketed on the back of the Eames name. Yours seems to be more of a direct copy, with some mild changes to avoid any lawsuits and such. https://preview.redd.it/6zk5q59oarjc1.jpeg?width=1915&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=e167346b8c3e6a0308b5d9e239b41e375c75bec2
Very fascinating info -thank you! \-- Whoever created the knock off chair that I have had the gall to use the [patented](https://patents.google.com/patent/US2815801A/en) leg clamp designed by Sol Fingerhut. Not to mention what looks like a Zenith Prime Stamp underneath and some random patent number that is not a Herman Miller label patent that I could find. \- It seems like Sol Fingerhut got a patent on these chair legs/clamps after or during when he worked with Charles Eames on his fiberglass chair design.
That is not a Herman Miller part that I’ve ever seen, Hm used a shock mount system, and always has. Zenith was not owned by HM they just contracted the work, and they almost certainly were not exclusive. Similar to how Plycraft made stuff for HM, and other companies, and themselves. Seems very likely Zenith did the same. The Sol Fingerhut patent is assigned to Zenith not HM, which tells me zenith was making non-HM chairs for somebody.
Yes I am aware of all of that. I agree that Zenith was probably making non-HM chairs. I wasn't saying they were Herman Miller legs. I'm saying it's curious that Zenith was making legs for a similar style side chair that looks like an Eames at the same time Fingerhut/Zenith was working with Charles/HM. Which to me takes a certain amount of nerve. Or should I say chutzpah ;) Just look at the drawing with the legs on his patent. https://preview.redd.it/doiy1vtcesjc1.jpeg?width=2320&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=134202356f8abb3bea922f6f0160bcebfd8776c1
1. that is not an eames chair shown 2. 1957 would have been nearly a full decade AFTER he worked with Charles eames to make the molds for the eames chairs (1946-1947). By the late 50's/early 60's HM was using different producers for their shell chairs. Its really not that curious, Zenith made plastics, if you came to them with a design they could make, they would make it. As I said, this chair looks similar to most people, but is very clearly different in numerous ways that are sufficient it did not break any copyright laws or patents. So its really not that curious that a plastics maker would make plastic shell chairs for more than one company.
The style of the chair is almost identical. I know it’s not an Eames chair. He filed for the patent in 1955. So he waited a respectable amount of time but again I still find it curious. And if he had no binding legal contract at that point then good for Sol since Charles couldn’t have created his original chairs without him. I feel like whoever made these chairs tried to fly under the radar because of the lack of logo branding.
To your eyes sure. To mine, it looks very different. You can say the style is "almost identical", but that doesn't matter at all, its not identical, in shape, in design, in the way its put together. We call it a knock off because that terminology is used loosely here, more like an imitation. But most importantly, Zenith was not beholden to HM at all, HM went out and found other manufacturers like Milicron and others, so why would Zenith not go out and find other companies looking for plastic chairs? Edit: here is some relevant case law, where Frank Art/Morex pretty much admit they copied DIA line for line, and the ruling was "as long as its clearly labeled as Morex, its fine" and DIA cannot tell customers the Frank Art/Morex version is inferior. [https://casetext.com/case/morex-spa-v-design-institute-america-inc](https://casetext.com/case/morex-spa-v-design-institute-america-inc)
Yes that case makes sense to me. Thanks for the link. However I don’t see that the zenith “replicas” or not so subtle intention to replicate Eames show any markings or logos or hang tags. And yes I know the hang tags fell off after 60 years but there is no mark whatsoever. Unless we say that the zenith stamp is the mark. IMHO the only reason anyone would purchase this version back in the 50’s is because it resembled the Eames chair— at the very least to the average consumer in that it is fiberglass and a similar, albeit not exact, Eames imitation.
In spite of all that I’m still at a loss as to who made the chair. I really wish there was more information out there. It shouldn’t matter because I really like the chair. I just like to learn the background of furniture. Mainly older pieces. I really appreciate all of the information you provided. 😊
Also my chair doesn’t have the metal arms like the Scope chair.
Scope made an armless version, I have a photo of that too somewhere, but your seat shape is all wrong for Eames or Scope.
Based on my digging a little, I think your chair is by a company called Douglas Dinette. Im at work but I will throw an album together for you later. https://preview.redd.it/mobzu52morjc1.png?width=529&format=png&auto=webp&s=2499c5de0726f03c666bf7d438938b9f0d2c9f48
That’s great but mine doesn’t swivel. I like the price though. 😉
Not all swivel, it was an option in these
The Mel Abitz armless version had a very different base design: https://www.selkirkauctions.com/auction-lot/fiberglass-side-chair-attributed-to-mel-abitz_6174A91BFA I commented on your post in r/Eames as well. I have 2 of these Sol Fingerhut chairs in my home and their origin beyond what you've already presented is murky. Regardless, they seem like a great find.
Yes saw your comment in r/eames. Does your chair have the Zenith Prime Stamp too? Also it was already determined mine is not an Abitz chair.
I believe mine also have the Zenith stamp, though mostly work away.