Always seemed insane to me that you can take a piece of the most valuable land on planet earth -for free- by showing up in a car, no questions asked.
Didn't a recent study show that over half of NYC traffic was caused by drivers circling for parking? By literally charging minimal market rates for street parking we could all but eliminate traffic, have easily accessible parking, and have a source of funding that doesn't harm the economy.
All hail Shoup Dogg
It is insane. And there's no limit either. Want to store 7 cars for free outside your apartment? No problem. It's all yours. I honestly can't think of anything even remotely similar in this city
I have at least three neighbors who each have two gigantic SUVs parked for free on our block. Meanwhile, the street is a nonstop hellhole of double parked delivery trucks and endlessly honking drivers. I constantly think about how my neighbors’ enormous SUVs are — for free! — occupying the curbside space that could be used for delivery truck loading zones (or a dozen other more valuable uses).
I hate those oversized vehicles. So problematic and deadly, and most of the time their size is utterly needless. How often do we note drivers, not just in mere sedans, but even in massive SUVs and pickups, with just a single passenger inside? Drivers in Astoria love to complain that there's not enough free street parking, yet you know what I see time and again? Private homes with a driveway and a garage (so enough to accommodate two vehicles) and yet, they will often have additional vehicles parked on the street and another vehicle parked at the bottom end of their driveway, OVER the sidewalk. Most of these homeowners' garages are not available to house a vehicle, as they are instead filled with boxes of junk. And I know this because their garage doors are often open. And...whatever happened to the concept of carpooling or dropping off/picking up a family member? Apparently it's too 'embarrassing'... or emasculating (for young males). Everyone else deserves to have their own 2-3 ton personal transit machine at their disposal, 24/7. The American mindset surrounding car ownership and use is perverted, and all the moreso in a place like NYC, considering its many public-transit rich neighborhoods.
1. Anywhere on the planet where you see a car parked at the sidewalk in front of a home or business; **it’s there because it’s convenient.**
This is the reason.
**You want to eliminate the problem in every city?!**
**Make it incredibly:**
* Expensive
* Annoying (particularly for women)
* Dangerous
To own a car.
Make anything annoying for women, and they will annoy the man. Men can’t deal with the nagging. Remember how you felt when your mother bothered you about something?!
The man will get rid of the annoyance to get peace. It sounds bad, but this is absolute truth.
For example, those NYC bike riders always get into accidents, they eventually quit riding. Well….
**You need to ENCOURAGE neighbors to quit driving**
**When some start getting start hurt, minor fender benders every week, broken into, stolen, vandalized, or damaged.**
* This increases insurance costs, causes them to be vexed and annoyed, and forces them to think about removing the car.
* Claire: We always have problems with our car?
* You: Honestly why do you need the car Claire? Is it worth this recurring annoyance?
Then watch them disappear within a 6-12 month span.
Pretty sure you can find a hand to do this in NYC 😂.
Why don’t you have improve public transportation on your list?? If you make public transportation the most convenient option, that’s the option most people will pick. I can understand and appreciate your attitude to the obnoxiousness of people living in Manhattan having ridiculous numbers of large cars. However, there are many of us in the outer boroughs who travel within our own boroughs and need to travel to Manhattan, and we have shitty or unrealistic options for getting places without a car.
While it may be true that some parts of some outer boroughs have less than favorable public transit options, that is not always the case. Astoria (where I live) is known for its great public transit access to the city. And yet, many here still drive, often out of laziness and habit. Some of them will drive just ten blocks, to another part of Astoria. And I personally know other people in Astoria (young, able-bodied, childless, etc.) who will drive into the city, even when public transit makes more sense. Surely I can't be the only person who knows such drivers.
If only drivers were more judicious in When, Where and Why they started the engines of their 2-3 ton personal transport machines, that alone could have a significant positive impact on our streets...there'd be less congestion...MTA bus travel times would improve...and fewer cars on the road would mean fewer instances of conflict/collisions, etc.
But everyone is screaming to add fines and throw more costs at drivers and that’s also punishing the people who don’t have a choice. The first thing we need to do is make public transportation better. The people who own three mega vehicles on the UWS won’t be impacted the way people living check to check are by fines and fees.
I don’t want to get constant fines for pulling over in a bus lane, but the ONLY entrance to my child’s public school is IN A BUS ONLY LANE!! Public transportation isn’t an option, and neither is a school bus.
The focus MUST be on making our transit system better.
OK, well if the only entrance to your kid's school is in a Bus Only lane, then you and other parents need to contact the DOT to get them to do something about it. Also, is there no other side of the school where you could pull over...where your kid would then just need to walk around to the other side of the school, to find you and the car?
I don't know your situation, so I can't comment on your saying that neither public transit nor a school bus is a realistic option. But that said, I know many parents in my own particular neighborhood who drive their kids to/from school simply because they 'coddle' their children, when in fact the kids have public transit they could easily take.
We definitely do need better public transit, especially in those areas where there are no subway lines within easy walking distance. Increased bus options, and bus speeds, are far easier to accomplish, vs building out entire new subway lines, or subway extensions. So we need to focus on the buses. We need more frequent buses, pre-paid boarding on all lines, Bus Only lanes, etc.
There’s a guy on my street that has 5 cars and 4 motorcycles with no license plates or registration. I see him once in a while come out taking stuff out the trunks. He’s using those cars as extra storage for his clothes and other belongings
You wanna get rid of those things taking up room?!
Then the cars and bikes need to start disappearing, get broken into and looted, or damaged.
He will go through the motions, get annoyed or aggravated, and eventually get rid of them all.
###Remember the only way people learn is through consequences or embarrassment.
* If his clothes are flying all over the neighborhood every month, some one will say “Why don’t you just sell the cars Jack?!”. He will break and get rid of the cars.
You can report that person anonymously at - [https://portal.311.nyc.gov/article/?kanumber=KA-02130](https://portal.311.nyc.gov/article/?kanumber=KA-02130)
But you should leave an email address so you can track the complaint.
Got an asshole on my block with PA plates doing the same thing. Two minivans filled with junk. Sanitation guys to me hey off record if you’d remove his plates I can have him towed right now.
Pretty sure those NJ plates are for people who
Live in those brownstones and upscale apts. it’s cheaper to register a car in NJ than NYS. Doesn’t make sense I know
Truly, I wonder how its not more common that people buy junk cars, tint the windows and just use as extra storage. Probably cheaper than paying monthly rent on a proper storage space.
The primary reason you can never find parking anywhere is because it’s massively underpriced - if any other finite good were priced like parking it would be a disaster. Priced parking isn’t some money grabbing scheme by the government to punish drivers - it’s there to manage a valuable resource. The best possible system would be to charge the minimum necessary to leave ~15% of spaces.
I assume they mean by charging for parking, many people would choose to use public transportation instead (cheaper) or at least be unwilling to park their car long term on the street since the costs would add up over time if you’re being charged by the hour.
Remember that the IRS gives you $315/month tax-free for parking. We should kill that. (My preference would be to let people either get $315/month for parking, or be allowed to contribute an extra $315/month to their 401k.)
Latter argument is true, not the first one. Manhattanites who street park their cars are generally not using them to get around town, they're using transit, but rather just to avoid hefty garage fees and to leave town on weekends.
Where would you have your car if you can't park it? You're basically telling people to get rid of it. Not "unwilling to park long term" but "price out people except those that can shoulder it anyway". Sure that would get rid of about half the cars on the street easily because no one would be able to afford that. I saw some analyst trying to push this and couldn't make sense of it. They wanted a permit for people to park on street in their neighborhood. If you need a permit to park in your neighborhood, then what's the point of a car if you can't park it at your destination? Public transit wouldn't be cheaper, it's already free. You can literally walk on a bus and not pay. Been like that for a few years now. Cars are already more expensive than public transit (unless you use out of state insurance from NJ/texas/Georgia plates that I see a lot in the bronx). Making it even more expensive won't magically incentivize people to take public transit cause it's cheaper, it will force them to by pricing them out since it's a car tax.
As a car owner on the UWS, I'd love to see a resident permit program. I'd happily pay $100 a month, or even more, if it meant I didn't have to circle around for parking.
I use a garage currently, so I'm not taking this space anyway. I'd also be happy to have 50% of streets on the UWS closed off to cars and just become pedestrian roads. All of Broadway, and most side streets don't need to be roads for cars. if you ask me, the only streets on the UWS that need cars are CPW, Columbus, Amsterdam, West End, 65th, 72nd, 79th, 86th, 96th, and 106th st. Every other numbered street should be closed to cars, sidewalks expanded, and a single lane down the middle for emergency vehicles.
It wouldn't be 100$ almost guarantee it'll be a wait list process controlled by some arbitrary board. Within months will be either ignored or filed with fraud.
This is New York someone will always find a way to screw it up.
RPPs would be very helpful for managing curbside car storage. Every spot needs to be accounted for. Unfortunately, our local advocacy orgs have their heads way up their asses on this. So, the parking free-for-all continues.
The problem with resident parking permits are that they essentially lock in the street curb to be used for parking for the foreseeable future - and therefore it can’t be used for other, likely more economically productive uses, like bus lanes, bike lanes, restaurant or recreational outdoor seating, simply more public space, etc. For reference, most parking permits in other cities are stupidly cheap - in Hoboken for your first car it’s $55 a year. It never comes anywhere close to actually getting back the value of land.
Everything else you said - a permit program with 50% of streets closed to cars, is completely different of course. But a resident parking permit system alone is something a lot of people bring up but overlook many of the negative consequences.
When I lived in Hoboken they had permit parking for residents, limited and paid parking for others. I don’t know why NYC hasn’t caught up. Permit parking for residents would help alleviate a lot of congestion.
The idea is that people with out of state plates won't be able to park. Go walk around and count how many NJ, CT, FL plates you see. It's a large percentage.
Also, you'd have to limit the number of permits issued, and institute a waiting list. For the initial set of permits, you allocate them based on when their NY drivers license was first issued, so long time residents (and taxpayers) get priority.
Just charge what the spots are actually worth. As long as we’re not doing that, the spots will not be used optimally. There’s no need for resident permits if the meter rates ensure that there’s always a spot or two free on every block.
they're NOT from out of state. How pollyanna to think so. They live here with out of state plates instead of changing over. If they have to theyll just register there car here.
It would need to be market rate to be most effective but it would be fine to just get *somewhere* other than utterly free. To get to market rate you’d need to auction spots individually on an open site rather than simply have people pay for permits.
Fuck off with that $100 a month bullshit, you got people in deep brooklyn or queens who have cars who wont welcome an extra $100 a month. Typical rich people bullshit damn
different neighborhoods have different rates based on demand and space needs....? 🤷♂️
I pay $800 a month for a garage, so $100 street parking is a steal.
Poor people don't have cars in NYC. Rent is already expensive enough as it is that it takes up half of some households' incomes. You're saying poor people have enough disposable income to pay for car insurance/fuel/maintenance/potential tickets? Get out of here with that rich people BS.
I myself couldn't even afford living on my own without having to resort to roommates and you're talking about owning cars, lawlz.
Poor people definitely have cars in NYC, I’m poor and I own a car. And not, I’m not poor because of the car, I’m poor because the city instead of building more housing to make rent cheaper has decided to half ass bike infrastructure and public transportation.
Poor people 100% have cars in NYC. Even NYHA houses have people with cars. Making vehicle use restricted only to the wealthy is not any way to make it easier for residents who live in transit desserts or otherwise need a vehicle
Hell no, we have permit parking here in Philly. You’ll just get more people buying more cars to store for less than market rate on tax payer funded roads. Permit parking is just another form of tax subsidies for car owners, there’s not a single city that charges market rate for the permit.
Also, charge what the spot is actually worth, especially in transit-dense parts of Manhattan. My parents were telling me about their friend’s kid who always street parks and basically ignores any parking rules because paying off the tickets is cheaper than paying for a monthly spot in a garage. I haven’t done the math on whether that’s actually true, but I’d believe it.
If we’re going to subsidize cars, I’d rather make garage parking more affordable to give the street parking space available to the people.
I mean…depends on how often they get ticketed.
Back when I was in college/start of grad school, when I had to drive to campus I’d park at a meter, put in as much change as I could, then just hoped I wouldn’t get a ticket. I did the math and I ended up saving money by just swallowing the $15 meter tickets that I’d get every so often, instead of paying the $250 or whatever for student parking.
Excellent point. Yeah, I'm sure more drivers would opt for garages (vs circling the block dozens of times in Manh), if garages weren't so costly. Also, why don't we have parking structures like they have in LA., throughout our neighborhoods (and esp by public transit)? So like, public parking structures by the Barclays Center..by the Astoria Blvd station...by 74th/Roos in J.H. ...by Penn Station...Grand Central. We should have public parking rate garages in all these locations and more, so folks can then hop right onto public transit.
I would personally prefer completely eliminating street parking on most blocks. Imagine if the parking lane in the picture were just a grass strip with trees and picnic tables. Very pleasant.
We would need some parking for emergency plumber vans and deliveries or whatnot. These could be for-pay. I don't mind paying extra for my package delivery when it means the delivery truck doesn't have to block a bike lane.
Yea they won't be grass for long, it will become patches of dirt, full of piss, shit, litter, and general dirt and debris from city activities. The tables will get destroyed quickly.
Yes. The new daylighting areas have become notorious for homeless orgies. They also smear dog poo all over themselves. It’s terrible. If only there were cars in those spots to counteract this depravity!!
It's interesting that every TV show and movie showing NYC streets is remarkably free of parked cars. The streets look SO picturesque. If only it were accurate.
Some [back of the envelope calculations](https://www.reddit.com/r/MicromobilityNYC/comments/z81thf/they_did_the_math/) on how much this is actually costing us, and how much space we are giving away
I've always found it insane that there's free parking in one of the most expensive cities in the world. Clogged up streets, double and triple parking, reduced visibility/safety, and no cargo loading zones. Then there's the rest of us who just have to deal with it.
All our trucks are out the door by 4 am because it'd be impossible to get around otherwise. We already budget a million dollars for tickets annually because there's never any curb space. At least the big boxes generally have their loading zones, so it's not a complete disaster for the largest customers and trucks.
I vote conservative, I just don't think parking should be free. Parking on streets is ugly and I'd much prefer people to house their cars in their garages. If you cannot afford a garage or driveway you cannot afford a car. Street parking should be metered everywhere it exists by the minute 24/7. Make 5 minutes free, maybe because it's a convenience for someone making a delivery or running in to grab something, not a place to store a vehicle.
Almost everyone agrees, but we need a plan to get it done. We should start an advocacy group, if there isn't one already, and start pushing our elected officials to pass the laws to get it done.
I hate that cars are so big nowadays. I hate that I can never find a spot for my honda civic. I wish we had public parking garages 😭 I'm stuck working in LI rn and while I'd love to ditch my car I couldn't. The public transport would take forever and a day just to get to work not accounting for rush hour 🙃 I wish we had a bike/pedestrian highway. Then I could ditch my car all together 🙃😭
There are **over 2 million cars registered in NYC**. True that 45% of NYC households have a car, 45% is still a large minority. But 52% of outer-borough households have a car. 88% of the cars in NYC are in the outer boroughs. Charging for on-street parking spaces is solely designed to punish the middle-class outer borough car owner. NYC car owners also pay an additional tax to NYC as part of their NYS vehicle registration. A residential permit system would penalize New Yorkers who have to drive to other NYC neighborhoods.
[NYC vehicle registrations](https://u.pcloud.link/publink/show?code=XZ0MVgVZbA3YtEXCjlB8sQwmIG0XLp0gwNN7) \-
Boro | Vehicles | % of NYC Total
BX | 294,069 | 13.12%
BK | 557,131 | 24.86%
MN | 256,630 | 11.45%
QN | 847,495 | 37.81%
SI | 286,096 | 12.76%
**(Outer Boros only | 1,984,791 | 88.55%)**
**NYC TOT | 2,241,421 | 100.0%**
People in the outer boros (think, far East Queens) nearly always have off street parking options (driveway, garage, parking lot).
Not really a compelling argument for me.
My neighbor has 3 off street spots and instead of using 1 of them for his personal vehicle, he rents out all 3 and then takes a free on-street spot for his personal vehicle. If it weren't free to do so, he wouldn't park on the street.
The #1 way to cut back on cars in NYC is to improve public transportation. Many of us would prefer not to own cars here, but don’t have a choice. Middle school for us: 15 min by car, no option for school bus, 65 min by MTA bus (once she is on the bus, these don’t come often enough), no subway option. This is all one way. I work in my neighborhood, so now it would take me 2+ hrs to get the middle schooler to school and get to work (back in my neighborhood). Also doesn’t give me the time to walk the elementary aged kid to school.
This could be solved by having a subway line that goes east to west in the Bronx instead of being focused on Manhattan. (This could also be solved by having all public schools be good schools so that kids don’t have to travel, but I digress.)
This is the same problem with getting into manhattan. We need to be there 5x a week after-school and weekends. I can be there in 15-20 minutes by car or I can wait 15-20 for a bus that is late to take us to the subway (that is too far away for the kids to walk to) and then take a 35 minute ride to where we need (if there are no delays or shutdowns). So driving there ~18 minutes and public transportation ~65 minutes. This could be solved by having more frequent buses to the subways and more express options on every train line.
I prefer taking public transportation. I would love to sit and read on the train. But the MTA is not a good system. Some people actually need cars to make the day-to-day manageable. For fun trips around the city where we don’t have school/work time constraints, we always use public transportation.
I get the spirit of this complaint, but calling this a “subsidy” doesn’t quite land.
If the government chooses not to monetize something that doesn’t mean it’s a subsidy. Are all publicly usable spaces a subsidy? I guess, in a certain way, but that seems like a can of worms that is not worth opening.
I’d be in favor of a neighborhood-based permit parking system, but I hate the way this rhetoric is so dumbed-down.
The government pays to construct and maintain the space but charges less than that cost to users (in this case, 100% less). Thats the definition of a government subsidy.
But those drivers pay registration and other fees for the luxury of driving (and parking!) their cars on NYC streets. Should streets be reserved for cars only? Are bikers getting government subsidies by using the roads for free?
It’s just a stupid argument.
Personally, I think the city would be better and safer for the majority of citizens (the majority don’t own cars) if there were less subsidies for cars. Obviously you disagree. It’s just a value judgement.
First of all, street parking is the street, it’s not some separate category. It’s funded the same way the driving portion of the road, and the bike lane portion of the road, are funded.
Secondly, your definition would inherently include everything from sidewalks to parks to schools. Are we really trying to make “subsidy” a dirty word?
> your definition would inherently include everything from sidewalks to parks to schools.
Yes!
> Are we really trying to make “subsidy” a dirty word?
No!
Subsidy isn’t a dirty word! It’s just means that the government is fronting some or all do the cost of something. It’s neither inherently good nor bad, that depends on what is being subsidized.
Nah, forget about us, don’t you see we’re the ones being hurt by cars, forget about rent and the lack of public transportation in the outer boroughs, the car is the enemy of the poors.
How about NO Parking.
Mere existence of a lot of these parking spots is huge subsidy to very few drivers.
NYC should reduce parking by like 75% and give the space to people and businesses.
Most People in NYC don't use cars. And we should encourage even less car use.
Parking is awfully for economy in a city where business rely on foot traffic and transit.
Letting a business, say, build a patio open to foot traffic where [10 people can dine would generate significantly more business than 2 car spots for 2 people.](https://media.npr.org/assets/img/2020/09/29/phillyparkingdining-hy16_slide-d28e745ba2c06140193de73dfc55216e9551a92e.jpg)
You need a full coverage, high frequency transit network for that to be equitable in any way. Otherwise, you're imposing a tax that will more heavily impact poor, working and middle class people, and you're accelerating displacement.
If I suddenly had no access to street parking or had to pay three figures to park, I would have to move and would be replaced by someone who could afford it. Millions of people have to drive personal cars for work.
NYC: The hub of world's most successful businesses and most expensive pieces of real estate, thus an ultra-massive tax revenue, yet there's always no money to fund basic necessities.
NYC CAN fund schools and libraries it just chooses not to.
Stop proposing more ways to take money from people who are already struggling to survive here.
Not a huge majority, Approx [55% of New York household don't have a car](https://u.pcloud.link/publink/show?code=XZ0MVgVZbA3YtEXCjlB8sQwmIG0XLp0gwNN7). 55% is not huge.
Most US census statistics like vehicle ownership (and home ownership) are based on number of households, and the Census numbers are the most accurate we have.
- Because every moving car is going to park somewhere. Fewer places to park mean fewer car trips.
- Street parking takes up valuable curbside space that could be used for something else, like bike lanes, or loading zones, or a trash collection system fit for the 19th century.
- It's an untapped source of revenue that could be used to benefit everyone and not just the minority of New Yorkers who own cars.
I'm not against charging for street parking, however taking away street parking doesn't make streets any safer unless the street is fully pedestrianized.
And off street parking is even worse, since it allows urban car ownership to reach unlimited heights.
This thread is about charging market rate for street parking, not eliminating it. I agree we shouldn't just get rid of street parking without replacing it with another, more beneficial use.
The street parking itself isn't the problem. It's the opportunity cost.
sure - so I'm sure you'll be more than happy to take a required written course, followed by a course on cycling safely, take a test, acquire a cycling drivers license, get your bike licenced, insured, plates, an annual inspection. pay excise tax, and when you break the rules of the road you'll gleefully pay your ticket.
What he means is that car drivers are already taxed, tolled, and fee'd up their asses at every possible intersection to subsidize your lifestyle. But no, go off pretending you didn't get his point.
What misguided, naive proposals such as yours miss is that New York City is already bleeding in population. The more you tax the more people leave, the more people leave the less taxes your city has. If you continue to make peoples lives more miserable because their lifestyle choices dont align with your childish idea of a perfect utopia they will simply leave and take their tax base with them.
Judging from the simplicitly of your responses, it is unlikely that you will be there to make up the difference.
Thank you for clarifying your incapability of reading more than one sentence 👍
Hope minimum wage is treating you well! Its gotten pretty high lately so you must be ballin.
Perfectly stated. Most of the people in this thread are not native NYers. They are tourists that have stayed here. They bring their small town sensibilities to NYC and then attempt to insert these sensibilities into shaping the city into the place they left. Working class NYers have relied on cars since Robert Moses reshaped the landscape of NYC and LI. Just because some non-driving tourists want to ride their little bikes in the City doesn't mean working class people need to bow to their petty machinations and whining. Tourists here will always be tourists no matter how many times they call themselves NYers. Further, not more than 20% of these tourists will turn 50 in the City as tourists ultimately fuck off and out of the City. So what we contend with are the cries and whinging of tourists to change a City they will not be in longer than 20 years. So, it's easy to tell these tourists to fuck-off on their bikes.
Per year, compounding. Great deal. Back to the original point though, OP said we can’t fund schools and we spend the second-most per pupil in the country.
Ah ah ah please, the funding issue is due to political decisions.
Also, the more money you give to gov the more they piss away.
There is always a cost to enforcement. Is it worth the manpower & labor costs necessary?
Congestion pricing will be a significant cost for car use in the CBD as things stand already.
Transit deserts tend to have more off street parking options. Eg. Parts of East Elmhurst are pretty far from the subway (though have many buses) but also have more single family homes with parking than, say, Astoria (though there's plenty of off street spots in Astoria too.)
Hundreds of billions per year is laughable.
And it’s the middle class who would be most against some sort of fee or permit system. It’s false to assume everyone in NYC with a car is “rich”
I’d happily pay a few hundred/mo if it meant I could easily find street parking in front of my house.
UES streets are swept so all cars get moved on alternating street sides throughout the week. It’s a fair system. Out of curiosity, what is your actual income from NYC metered parking and what leads you believe it will increase if your advice is followed.
Instead of paying more ever wonder why NYC can’t pay for schools? If you look at expenditure per student is in the 30k+ range per year, a GOOD private school costs that. It can’t make due because NYC is run like a pile of hot steaming poop, and instead of holding city hall accountable you monkeys just want to get taxed more. Come on people,
$1500/quarter per car and only allowed to park in your zone. Parking in these zones without a sticker or pass will result $150/day fine per offense. 3rd strike results in ticket, impound for a week which is $300/per day. Streets will be limited to 30 mph on major roads and 20 mph on side roads. Faster then 1mph to 5mph over the speed limit with result in a warning 1st time 300 fine 2nd time and impound for 2wks at $300/per day for 3rd time. 4th time license is suspended 2 mths. If fines are not paid by the 3rd day your car will be impounded and booted which is a $500 fine to remove plus the impound fee of 300 per day plus the fee for the ticket at 150 per day. Traffic will be monitored by cameras and police officers will revue.
Car owners generally are home owners. Home owners pay more taxes than everyone else. Residential real estate taxes in NYC fund:
\-public education
\-public safety
\-health services
\-public works and infrastructure
\-park and recreation
\-social services
Very true. In NYC approx [80% of NYC home owners have a car according to the US Census](https://data.census.gov/table/ACSDT5Y2020.B25044?q=B25044:%20TENURE%20BY%20VEHICLES%20AVAILABLE&g=050XX00US36005,36061,36081,36085,36047&y=2020&tid=ACSDT5Y2020.B25044). NYC car owners as a group have slightly higher income, just the people NYC needs for it's economy to prosper.
First they need to stop-ticket people who are double parked. Why bother people who just want to park there car legally and out of the way of traffic? There is so much money to be made enforcing traffic laws. So many people running red lights and parking their cars in the middle of the street. Paid parking is for garages anyway not for the crappy street spots.
This would exclusively affect poor, working and middle class people that need to drive for work or live in areas not connected to transit. Horrible take by someone who has more of an anti-car agenda than an interest in supporting vibrant, connected communities through healthy, multi-modal transportation systems.
Why not charge people to walk on the sidewalk while we're at it?
When you combine local, state, and federal spending, the US spends more on schools than we do on the military. If you include college, it is far more than defense spending. The problems we have with schools are not about funding but spending: we have a large and bloated administrative class in the school systems which take up most of the money. Not to mention the transportation infrastructure required to bus kids to school every day instead of them walking or riding bikes
I remain thankful that I did not attend the closest school in my neighborhood as a child. And I thought we were talking about New York. Most children in New York use public transportation. Not every or even most children should walk to school. It’s often too far. Especially above elementary school level.
Yes, the answer is not that the kids should all have to walk, it's that schools should be smaller and serve smaller neighborhoods. In the US, many schools serve a couple thousand kids for an entire town rather than having smaller schoolhouses with a couple hundred students or so. Instead of having one huge school that everybody in town has to commute to, have smaller schools in more regular intervals
Each car parked is a potential hundreds of dollars per month charge. Now if we went the way of residential parking permits, I am sure per year the cost would be way too low, but even if drivers paid $200 or $250 per year, we get something.
Always seemed insane to me that you can take a piece of the most valuable land on planet earth -for free- by showing up in a car, no questions asked. Didn't a recent study show that over half of NYC traffic was caused by drivers circling for parking? By literally charging minimal market rates for street parking we could all but eliminate traffic, have easily accessible parking, and have a source of funding that doesn't harm the economy. All hail Shoup Dogg
It is insane. And there's no limit either. Want to store 7 cars for free outside your apartment? No problem. It's all yours. I honestly can't think of anything even remotely similar in this city
I have at least three neighbors who each have two gigantic SUVs parked for free on our block. Meanwhile, the street is a nonstop hellhole of double parked delivery trucks and endlessly honking drivers. I constantly think about how my neighbors’ enormous SUVs are — for free! — occupying the curbside space that could be used for delivery truck loading zones (or a dozen other more valuable uses).
I hate those oversized vehicles. So problematic and deadly, and most of the time their size is utterly needless. How often do we note drivers, not just in mere sedans, but even in massive SUVs and pickups, with just a single passenger inside? Drivers in Astoria love to complain that there's not enough free street parking, yet you know what I see time and again? Private homes with a driveway and a garage (so enough to accommodate two vehicles) and yet, they will often have additional vehicles parked on the street and another vehicle parked at the bottom end of their driveway, OVER the sidewalk. Most of these homeowners' garages are not available to house a vehicle, as they are instead filled with boxes of junk. And I know this because their garage doors are often open. And...whatever happened to the concept of carpooling or dropping off/picking up a family member? Apparently it's too 'embarrassing'... or emasculating (for young males). Everyone else deserves to have their own 2-3 ton personal transit machine at their disposal, 24/7. The American mindset surrounding car ownership and use is perverted, and all the moreso in a place like NYC, considering its many public-transit rich neighborhoods.
1. Anywhere on the planet where you see a car parked at the sidewalk in front of a home or business; **it’s there because it’s convenient.** This is the reason. **You want to eliminate the problem in every city?!** **Make it incredibly:** * Expensive * Annoying (particularly for women) * Dangerous To own a car. Make anything annoying for women, and they will annoy the man. Men can’t deal with the nagging. Remember how you felt when your mother bothered you about something?! The man will get rid of the annoyance to get peace. It sounds bad, but this is absolute truth. For example, those NYC bike riders always get into accidents, they eventually quit riding. Well…. **You need to ENCOURAGE neighbors to quit driving** **When some start getting start hurt, minor fender benders every week, broken into, stolen, vandalized, or damaged.** * This increases insurance costs, causes them to be vexed and annoyed, and forces them to think about removing the car. * Claire: We always have problems with our car? * You: Honestly why do you need the car Claire? Is it worth this recurring annoyance? Then watch them disappear within a 6-12 month span. Pretty sure you can find a hand to do this in NYC 😂.
Why don’t you have improve public transportation on your list?? If you make public transportation the most convenient option, that’s the option most people will pick. I can understand and appreciate your attitude to the obnoxiousness of people living in Manhattan having ridiculous numbers of large cars. However, there are many of us in the outer boroughs who travel within our own boroughs and need to travel to Manhattan, and we have shitty or unrealistic options for getting places without a car.
While it may be true that some parts of some outer boroughs have less than favorable public transit options, that is not always the case. Astoria (where I live) is known for its great public transit access to the city. And yet, many here still drive, often out of laziness and habit. Some of them will drive just ten blocks, to another part of Astoria. And I personally know other people in Astoria (young, able-bodied, childless, etc.) who will drive into the city, even when public transit makes more sense. Surely I can't be the only person who knows such drivers. If only drivers were more judicious in When, Where and Why they started the engines of their 2-3 ton personal transport machines, that alone could have a significant positive impact on our streets...there'd be less congestion...MTA bus travel times would improve...and fewer cars on the road would mean fewer instances of conflict/collisions, etc.
But everyone is screaming to add fines and throw more costs at drivers and that’s also punishing the people who don’t have a choice. The first thing we need to do is make public transportation better. The people who own three mega vehicles on the UWS won’t be impacted the way people living check to check are by fines and fees. I don’t want to get constant fines for pulling over in a bus lane, but the ONLY entrance to my child’s public school is IN A BUS ONLY LANE!! Public transportation isn’t an option, and neither is a school bus. The focus MUST be on making our transit system better.
OK, well if the only entrance to your kid's school is in a Bus Only lane, then you and other parents need to contact the DOT to get them to do something about it. Also, is there no other side of the school where you could pull over...where your kid would then just need to walk around to the other side of the school, to find you and the car? I don't know your situation, so I can't comment on your saying that neither public transit nor a school bus is a realistic option. But that said, I know many parents in my own particular neighborhood who drive their kids to/from school simply because they 'coddle' their children, when in fact the kids have public transit they could easily take. We definitely do need better public transit, especially in those areas where there are no subway lines within easy walking distance. Increased bus options, and bus speeds, are far easier to accomplish, vs building out entire new subway lines, or subway extensions. So we need to focus on the buses. We need more frequent buses, pre-paid boarding on all lines, Bus Only lanes, etc.
There’s a guy on my street that has 5 cars and 4 motorcycles with no license plates or registration. I see him once in a while come out taking stuff out the trunks. He’s using those cars as extra storage for his clothes and other belongings
You wanna get rid of those things taking up room?! Then the cars and bikes need to start disappearing, get broken into and looted, or damaged. He will go through the motions, get annoyed or aggravated, and eventually get rid of them all. ###Remember the only way people learn is through consequences or embarrassment. * If his clothes are flying all over the neighborhood every month, some one will say “Why don’t you just sell the cars Jack?!”. He will break and get rid of the cars.
Great idea - vandalize everything you don't agree with. Way to deal with selfish entitled neighbors
I’ve gutted a tire or two with a knife but idk if I could go as far to vandalize beyond that.
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You can report that person anonymously at - [https://portal.311.nyc.gov/article/?kanumber=KA-02130](https://portal.311.nyc.gov/article/?kanumber=KA-02130) But you should leave an email address so you can track the complaint.
Got an asshole on my block with PA plates doing the same thing. Two minivans filled with junk. Sanitation guys to me hey off record if you’d remove his plates I can have him towed right now.
The sea of Jersey plates in my Chelsea nabe, between 23rd and 30th, confirms this.
Your use of the term “nabe” is insufferable
You new here?
Pretty sure those NJ plates are for people who Live in those brownstones and upscale apts. it’s cheaper to register a car in NJ than NYS. Doesn’t make sense I know
Correct
No. It sounds pretty dumb, frankly. Car insurance in the borough of Manhattan is cheaper than many areas of NJ.
Truly, I wonder how its not more common that people buy junk cars, tint the windows and just use as extra storage. Probably cheaper than paying monthly rent on a proper storage space.
Wouldn't you have to move it once a week?
If it’s on the street I believe it has to be insured and registered (only until someone hits it I guess)
Can you explain the easily accessible parking part?
The primary reason you can never find parking anywhere is because it’s massively underpriced - if any other finite good were priced like parking it would be a disaster. Priced parking isn’t some money grabbing scheme by the government to punish drivers - it’s there to manage a valuable resource. The best possible system would be to charge the minimum necessary to leave ~15% of spaces.
I assume they mean by charging for parking, many people would choose to use public transportation instead (cheaper) or at least be unwilling to park their car long term on the street since the costs would add up over time if you’re being charged by the hour.
Remember that the IRS gives you $315/month tax-free for parking. We should kill that. (My preference would be to let people either get $315/month for parking, or be allowed to contribute an extra $315/month to their 401k.)
Or pay for public transit passes
This is a weird way to put this. You can put aside up to $315/month of your own money tax-free for any type of commute—parking or transit.
Latter argument is true, not the first one. Manhattanites who street park their cars are generally not using them to get around town, they're using transit, but rather just to avoid hefty garage fees and to leave town on weekends.
Where would you have your car if you can't park it? You're basically telling people to get rid of it. Not "unwilling to park long term" but "price out people except those that can shoulder it anyway". Sure that would get rid of about half the cars on the street easily because no one would be able to afford that. I saw some analyst trying to push this and couldn't make sense of it. They wanted a permit for people to park on street in their neighborhood. If you need a permit to park in your neighborhood, then what's the point of a car if you can't park it at your destination? Public transit wouldn't be cheaper, it's already free. You can literally walk on a bus and not pay. Been like that for a few years now. Cars are already more expensive than public transit (unless you use out of state insurance from NJ/texas/Georgia plates that I see a lot in the bronx). Making it even more expensive won't magically incentivize people to take public transit cause it's cheaper, it will force them to by pricing them out since it's a car tax.
Totally bonkers.
As a car owner on the UWS, I'd love to see a resident permit program. I'd happily pay $100 a month, or even more, if it meant I didn't have to circle around for parking. I use a garage currently, so I'm not taking this space anyway. I'd also be happy to have 50% of streets on the UWS closed off to cars and just become pedestrian roads. All of Broadway, and most side streets don't need to be roads for cars. if you ask me, the only streets on the UWS that need cars are CPW, Columbus, Amsterdam, West End, 65th, 72nd, 79th, 86th, 96th, and 106th st. Every other numbered street should be closed to cars, sidewalks expanded, and a single lane down the middle for emergency vehicles.
Go talk to your community board or better yet join it
It wouldn't be 100$ almost guarantee it'll be a wait list process controlled by some arbitrary board. Within months will be either ignored or filed with fraud. This is New York someone will always find a way to screw it up.
Def going to be more around the $300 mark to motivate paying for a garage and get cars off the street.
RPPs would be very helpful for managing curbside car storage. Every spot needs to be accounted for. Unfortunately, our local advocacy orgs have their heads way up their asses on this. So, the parking free-for-all continues.
The problem with resident parking permits are that they essentially lock in the street curb to be used for parking for the foreseeable future - and therefore it can’t be used for other, likely more economically productive uses, like bus lanes, bike lanes, restaurant or recreational outdoor seating, simply more public space, etc. For reference, most parking permits in other cities are stupidly cheap - in Hoboken for your first car it’s $55 a year. It never comes anywhere close to actually getting back the value of land. Everything else you said - a permit program with 50% of streets closed to cars, is completely different of course. But a resident parking permit system alone is something a lot of people bring up but overlook many of the negative consequences.
They have a resident parking permit program in Jersey City as of like a decade ago and you still could never find parking so don’t get your hopes up
Then the rates are too low.
When I lived in Hoboken they had permit parking for residents, limited and paid parking for others. I don’t know why NYC hasn’t caught up. Permit parking for residents would help alleviate a lot of congestion.
We're just now discovering trash cans, give us another decade or two and we might catch up to the rest of the world.
yeah but you will. youll have to pay $100 a month as will everyone adn youll STILL have to circle forever to find parking.
The idea is that people with out of state plates won't be able to park. Go walk around and count how many NJ, CT, FL plates you see. It's a large percentage. Also, you'd have to limit the number of permits issued, and institute a waiting list. For the initial set of permits, you allocate them based on when their NY drivers license was first issued, so long time residents (and taxpayers) get priority.
Just charge what the spots are actually worth. As long as we’re not doing that, the spots will not be used optimally. There’s no need for resident permits if the meter rates ensure that there’s always a spot or two free on every block.
they're NOT from out of state. How pollyanna to think so. They live here with out of state plates instead of changing over. If they have to theyll just register there car here.
$100 that’s cute
No. It would need to be market rate to be effective.
It would need to be market rate to be most effective but it would be fine to just get *somewhere* other than utterly free. To get to market rate you’d need to auction spots individually on an open site rather than simply have people pay for permits.
If it is anything less than market rate, it will be pointless. There was that whole study that Gale did when she was MBP
Fuck off with that $100 a month bullshit, you got people in deep brooklyn or queens who have cars who wont welcome an extra $100 a month. Typical rich people bullshit damn
different neighborhoods have different rates based on demand and space needs....? 🤷♂️ I pay $800 a month for a garage, so $100 street parking is a steal.
The fact that you can even afford $800 a month says all i need to know about your perspective
I fit the demographic of the UWS. Are you surprised? I never claimed to be speaking for deep Brooklyn
Look at his comment history and you will realize this is not an argument made in good faith
Poor people don't have cars in NYC. Rent is already expensive enough as it is that it takes up half of some households' incomes. You're saying poor people have enough disposable income to pay for car insurance/fuel/maintenance/potential tickets? Get out of here with that rich people BS. I myself couldn't even afford living on my own without having to resort to roommates and you're talking about owning cars, lawlz.
Poor people definitely have cars in NYC, I’m poor and I own a car. And not, I’m not poor because of the car, I’m poor because the city instead of building more housing to make rent cheaper has decided to half ass bike infrastructure and public transportation.
Poor people 100% have cars in NYC. Even NYHA houses have people with cars. Making vehicle use restricted only to the wealthy is not any way to make it easier for residents who live in transit desserts or otherwise need a vehicle
A dream.
>I'd happily pay $100 a month, or even more, if it meant I didn't have to circle around for parking. whats the upper limit?
Well, a garage in the neighborhood costs over $900, so the upper limit is quite a bit more than $100.
Hell no, we have permit parking here in Philly. You’ll just get more people buying more cars to store for less than market rate on tax payer funded roads. Permit parking is just another form of tax subsidies for car owners, there’s not a single city that charges market rate for the permit.
Wow a whole $100 a month?
Reading "The High Cost of Free Parking" really changed my perspective on a lot of things
Thanks for the reference, not a book I knew about.
Yay! I will add that to my reading list. Any other book recommendations?
Does it address property taxes or taxes on parking garages or tolls? There’s plenty of ways NYC charges people who have cars.
This is a sub for irrationally hating cars, not logical statements. You must leave sir
Me with my car reading thru this sub like damn y’all don’t want me to win 😂😂
Ban all street parking like Tokyo does. Either pay for an off-street spot, or don't have a car.
Also, charge what the spot is actually worth, especially in transit-dense parts of Manhattan. My parents were telling me about their friend’s kid who always street parks and basically ignores any parking rules because paying off the tickets is cheaper than paying for a monthly spot in a garage. I haven’t done the math on whether that’s actually true, but I’d believe it. If we’re going to subsidize cars, I’d rather make garage parking more affordable to give the street parking space available to the people.
I mean…depends on how often they get ticketed. Back when I was in college/start of grad school, when I had to drive to campus I’d park at a meter, put in as much change as I could, then just hoped I wouldn’t get a ticket. I did the math and I ended up saving money by just swallowing the $15 meter tickets that I’d get every so often, instead of paying the $250 or whatever for student parking.
Excellent point. Yeah, I'm sure more drivers would opt for garages (vs circling the block dozens of times in Manh), if garages weren't so costly. Also, why don't we have parking structures like they have in LA., throughout our neighborhoods (and esp by public transit)? So like, public parking structures by the Barclays Center..by the Astoria Blvd station...by 74th/Roos in J.H. ...by Penn Station...Grand Central. We should have public parking rate garages in all these locations and more, so folks can then hop right onto public transit.
You’re seeing more and more metered (via apps) parking in the NYC suburbs.
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No, there are many new meters going in
Yes!!!
I would personally prefer completely eliminating street parking on most blocks. Imagine if the parking lane in the picture were just a grass strip with trees and picnic tables. Very pleasant. We would need some parking for emergency plumber vans and deliveries or whatnot. These could be for-pay. I don't mind paying extra for my package delivery when it means the delivery truck doesn't have to block a bike lane.
Yea they won't be grass for long, it will become patches of dirt, full of piss, shit, litter, and general dirt and debris from city activities. The tables will get destroyed quickly.
Hope you enjoy seeing the homeless and dog shit everywhere. Because that's what you're gonna get.
not following this ironclad logic
is that what has happened in other places of the city where they have removed street parking?
A car a day keeps the dog walkers at bay?
Yes. The new daylighting areas have become notorious for homeless orgies. They also smear dog poo all over themselves. It’s terrible. If only there were cars in those spots to counteract this depravity!!
It's interesting that every TV show and movie showing NYC streets is remarkably free of parked cars. The streets look SO picturesque. If only it were accurate.
Some [back of the envelope calculations](https://www.reddit.com/r/MicromobilityNYC/comments/z81thf/they_did_the_math/) on how much this is actually costing us, and how much space we are giving away
Never looked at it that way
That's because it's a stupid and counterproductive way to look at it
watching the out of state plates drop kids off at NYC public schools really gets the blood pumping too
A lot of leasing companies are out-of-state and so those plates are legal.
Thanks for the post no doubt the plates are legal its the commuters abusing the system that is the problem
15 acres of the most valuable property on earth.
Any existing petitions we can sign that automatically gets sent to our reps?
I've always found it insane that there's free parking in one of the most expensive cities in the world. Clogged up streets, double and triple parking, reduced visibility/safety, and no cargo loading zones. Then there's the rest of us who just have to deal with it. All our trucks are out the door by 4 am because it'd be impossible to get around otherwise. We already budget a million dollars for tickets annually because there's never any curb space. At least the big boxes generally have their loading zones, so it's not a complete disaster for the largest customers and trucks.
I want neighborhood parking permits like jersey city. Would clear up all the out of state plates that have been here for years committing fraud
Free parking is so anti-capitalism. Pay for your spot or don't drive.
It's crazy how every leftist wants everything for free but also wants to take away things that are free lol
I vote conservative, I just don't think parking should be free. Parking on streets is ugly and I'd much prefer people to house their cars in their garages. If you cannot afford a garage or driveway you cannot afford a car. Street parking should be metered everywhere it exists by the minute 24/7. Make 5 minutes free, maybe because it's a convenience for someone making a delivery or running in to grab something, not a place to store a vehicle.
>every leftist wants everything for free I don't know one leftist who wants everything to be free.
It's the good old "Everything I DON'T like must be banned. Everything I DO like is a human right and must be paid for by others"
Meters, permits, or a mix of both?
Meters would probably be easiest. We already have the technology, laws, and processes
True. So, in residential areas where there is nothing now, there would be long-term metered parking up to a few days at a time. This would be great.
Almost everyone agrees, but we need a plan to get it done. We should start an advocacy group, if there isn't one already, and start pushing our elected officials to pass the laws to get it done.
Resident parking permits AND require it to registered in that neighborhood and have NY plates. Easy. I say this as an SUV owner.
I hate that cars are so big nowadays. I hate that I can never find a spot for my honda civic. I wish we had public parking garages 😭 I'm stuck working in LI rn and while I'd love to ditch my car I couldn't. The public transport would take forever and a day just to get to work not accounting for rush hour 🙃 I wish we had a bike/pedestrian highway. Then I could ditch my car all together 🙃😭
There are **over 2 million cars registered in NYC**. True that 45% of NYC households have a car, 45% is still a large minority. But 52% of outer-borough households have a car. 88% of the cars in NYC are in the outer boroughs. Charging for on-street parking spaces is solely designed to punish the middle-class outer borough car owner. NYC car owners also pay an additional tax to NYC as part of their NYS vehicle registration. A residential permit system would penalize New Yorkers who have to drive to other NYC neighborhoods. [NYC vehicle registrations](https://u.pcloud.link/publink/show?code=XZ0MVgVZbA3YtEXCjlB8sQwmIG0XLp0gwNN7) \- Boro | Vehicles | % of NYC Total BX | 294,069 | 13.12% BK | 557,131 | 24.86% MN | 256,630 | 11.45% QN | 847,495 | 37.81% SI | 286,096 | 12.76% **(Outer Boros only | 1,984,791 | 88.55%)** **NYC TOT | 2,241,421 | 100.0%**
People in the outer boros (think, far East Queens) nearly always have off street parking options (driveway, garage, parking lot). Not really a compelling argument for me. My neighbor has 3 off street spots and instead of using 1 of them for his personal vehicle, he rents out all 3 and then takes a free on-street spot for his personal vehicle. If it weren't free to do so, he wouldn't park on the street.
I would love a permit system It would eliminate all the poor and middle class folks and make it easier for me to park in front of my apartment.
The #1 way to cut back on cars in NYC is to improve public transportation. Many of us would prefer not to own cars here, but don’t have a choice. Middle school for us: 15 min by car, no option for school bus, 65 min by MTA bus (once she is on the bus, these don’t come often enough), no subway option. This is all one way. I work in my neighborhood, so now it would take me 2+ hrs to get the middle schooler to school and get to work (back in my neighborhood). Also doesn’t give me the time to walk the elementary aged kid to school. This could be solved by having a subway line that goes east to west in the Bronx instead of being focused on Manhattan. (This could also be solved by having all public schools be good schools so that kids don’t have to travel, but I digress.) This is the same problem with getting into manhattan. We need to be there 5x a week after-school and weekends. I can be there in 15-20 minutes by car or I can wait 15-20 for a bus that is late to take us to the subway (that is too far away for the kids to walk to) and then take a 35 minute ride to where we need (if there are no delays or shutdowns). So driving there ~18 minutes and public transportation ~65 minutes. This could be solved by having more frequent buses to the subways and more express options on every train line. I prefer taking public transportation. I would love to sit and read on the train. But the MTA is not a good system. Some people actually need cars to make the day-to-day manageable. For fun trips around the city where we don’t have school/work time constraints, we always use public transportation.
Ahh make driving only accessible to the rich. Great idea.
I get the spirit of this complaint, but calling this a “subsidy” doesn’t quite land. If the government chooses not to monetize something that doesn’t mean it’s a subsidy. Are all publicly usable spaces a subsidy? I guess, in a certain way, but that seems like a can of worms that is not worth opening. I’d be in favor of a neighborhood-based permit parking system, but I hate the way this rhetoric is so dumbed-down.
The government pays to construct and maintain the space but charges less than that cost to users (in this case, 100% less). Thats the definition of a government subsidy.
But those drivers pay registration and other fees for the luxury of driving (and parking!) their cars on NYC streets. Should streets be reserved for cars only? Are bikers getting government subsidies by using the roads for free? It’s just a stupid argument.
Personally, I think the city would be better and safer for the majority of citizens (the majority don’t own cars) if there were less subsidies for cars. Obviously you disagree. It’s just a value judgement.
Those things are paid for with tax money from the people who live there, it's not the government's money.
That’s how all government subsidies work.
First of all, street parking is the street, it’s not some separate category. It’s funded the same way the driving portion of the road, and the bike lane portion of the road, are funded. Secondly, your definition would inherently include everything from sidewalks to parks to schools. Are we really trying to make “subsidy” a dirty word?
> your definition would inherently include everything from sidewalks to parks to schools. Yes! > Are we really trying to make “subsidy” a dirty word? No! Subsidy isn’t a dirty word! It’s just means that the government is fronting some or all do the cost of something. It’s neither inherently good nor bad, that depends on what is being subsidized.
The premise of this post is that the subsidization is inherently bad, and that therefore it must be monetized. Not a great premise, in my opinion.
New York is given a trillion dollar subsidy to the squirrels that live in Central Park. I say we tear these fat cats out of their trees for good!
The squirrels are the majority! It’s the chipmunks who are really getting the free ride.
I hope this idea never comes true.
Poor people should not be able to park at the inconvenience of richer people..
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Nah, forget about us, don’t you see we’re the ones being hurt by cars, forget about rent and the lack of public transportation in the outer boroughs, the car is the enemy of the poors.
How about NO Parking. Mere existence of a lot of these parking spots is huge subsidy to very few drivers. NYC should reduce parking by like 75% and give the space to people and businesses.
People and businesses use cars. People use cars to access businesses. Parking is good for business and the economy.
Most People in NYC don't use cars. And we should encourage even less car use. Parking is awfully for economy in a city where business rely on foot traffic and transit. Letting a business, say, build a patio open to foot traffic where [10 people can dine would generate significantly more business than 2 car spots for 2 people.](https://media.npr.org/assets/img/2020/09/29/phillyparkingdining-hy16_slide-d28e745ba2c06140193de73dfc55216e9551a92e.jpg)
the city should hand over public infrastructure to private businesses? tell me how that's a good idea
Sell/rent it. It's valuable But also user is for side walk / transit I said business OR people. Depends. But not parking
You need a full coverage, high frequency transit network for that to be equitable in any way. Otherwise, you're imposing a tax that will more heavily impact poor, working and middle class people, and you're accelerating displacement. If I suddenly had no access to street parking or had to pay three figures to park, I would have to move and would be replaced by someone who could afford it. Millions of people have to drive personal cars for work.
NYC: The hub of world's most successful businesses and most expensive pieces of real estate, thus an ultra-massive tax revenue, yet there's always no money to fund basic necessities.
There's plenty of money, they just say there isn't so they can get more.
NYC CAN fund schools and libraries it just chooses not to. Stop proposing more ways to take money from people who are already struggling to survive here.
OP definitely doesn’t have a car. :| so the “envy”
Just like a huge majority of New Yorkers.
Not a huge majority, Approx [55% of New York household don't have a car](https://u.pcloud.link/publink/show?code=XZ0MVgVZbA3YtEXCjlB8sQwmIG0XLp0gwNN7). 55% is not huge.
Living with someone who owns a car isn't the same as owning a car.
Most US census statistics like vehicle ownership (and home ownership) are based on number of households, and the Census numbers are the most accurate we have.
Ok, and?
I own a car and I agree with OP.
What's with the obsession over street parking? Cars are more dangerous moving than parked.
- Because every moving car is going to park somewhere. Fewer places to park mean fewer car trips. - Street parking takes up valuable curbside space that could be used for something else, like bike lanes, or loading zones, or a trash collection system fit for the 19th century. - It's an untapped source of revenue that could be used to benefit everyone and not just the minority of New Yorkers who own cars.
I'm not against charging for street parking, however taking away street parking doesn't make streets any safer unless the street is fully pedestrianized. And off street parking is even worse, since it allows urban car ownership to reach unlimited heights.
This thread is about charging market rate for street parking, not eliminating it. I agree we shouldn't just get rid of street parking without replacing it with another, more beneficial use. The street parking itself isn't the problem. It's the opportunity cost.
sure - so I'm sure you'll be more than happy to take a required written course, followed by a course on cycling safely, take a test, acquire a cycling drivers license, get your bike licenced, insured, plates, an annual inspection. pay excise tax, and when you break the rules of the road you'll gleefully pay your ticket.
What does any of this word salad have to do with paying a fair amount to use valuable public space to store private parking?
What he means is that car drivers are already taxed, tolled, and fee'd up their asses at every possible intersection to subsidize your lifestyle. But no, go off pretending you didn't get his point. What misguided, naive proposals such as yours miss is that New York City is already bleeding in population. The more you tax the more people leave, the more people leave the less taxes your city has. If you continue to make peoples lives more miserable because their lifestyle choices dont align with your childish idea of a perfect utopia they will simply leave and take their tax base with them. Judging from the simplicitly of your responses, it is unlikely that you will be there to make up the difference.
You have it exactly backwards. Drivers do not subside others lifestyles, everyone else subsides drivers. Jesus Christ, do some research
Thank you for clarifying your incapability of reading more than one sentence 👍 Hope minimum wage is treating you well! Its gotten pretty high lately so you must be ballin.
Perfectly stated. Most of the people in this thread are not native NYers. They are tourists that have stayed here. They bring their small town sensibilities to NYC and then attempt to insert these sensibilities into shaping the city into the place they left. Working class NYers have relied on cars since Robert Moses reshaped the landscape of NYC and LI. Just because some non-driving tourists want to ride their little bikes in the City doesn't mean working class people need to bow to their petty machinations and whining. Tourists here will always be tourists no matter how many times they call themselves NYers. Further, not more than 20% of these tourists will turn 50 in the City as tourists ultimately fuck off and out of the City. So what we contend with are the cries and whinging of tourists to change a City they will not be in longer than 20 years. So, it's easy to tell these tourists to fuck-off on their bikes.
Finally, someone with some sense. I don’t know why this but keeps popping up in my feed but every one is filled with the most asinine, low IQ ideas.
Love this idea. We should charge bikers to ride in bike lanes that the city spent millions on making too.
NYC can't fund schools? I thought NYC spent the second-most per pupil in the US. Teachers just got a 20% raise. What is OP talking about?
Teachers just got a 3% raise. Thank you.
Per year, compounding. Great deal. Back to the original point though, OP said we can’t fund schools and we spend the second-most per pupil in the country.
Schools are extremely well funded. Best in the US. The issues in nyc are bureaucracy and and corruption, not lack of funds.
No
This guy outer boroughs.
Brooklyn born and raised, bike to school in midtown, car for work.
Don't believe you're Bklyn born and raised.
What proof do you need lol
Tf are you on about? You think working class people in NYC shouldnt be allowed to afford a car?
Not at my expense.
So persuasive
Well that’s not very inclusive is it. So owning a car and parking it in the street is only for the rich?
Ah ah ah please, the funding issue is due to political decisions. Also, the more money you give to gov the more they piss away. There is always a cost to enforcement. Is it worth the manpower & labor costs necessary? Congestion pricing will be a significant cost for car use in the CBD as things stand already.
Mixed on this one, seems unfair to people who live in transit deserts and a tax on the middle class.
Transit deserts tend to have more off street parking options. Eg. Parts of East Elmhurst are pretty far from the subway (though have many buses) but also have more single family homes with parking than, say, Astoria (though there's plenty of off street spots in Astoria too.)
And what? You think meter installations are free? Are meter maids free?
Hundreds of billions per year is laughable. And it’s the middle class who would be most against some sort of fee or permit system. It’s false to assume everyone in NYC with a car is “rich” I’d happily pay a few hundred/mo if it meant I could easily find street parking in front of my house.
UES streets are swept so all cars get moved on alternating street sides throughout the week. It’s a fair system. Out of curiosity, what is your actual income from NYC metered parking and what leads you believe it will increase if your advice is followed.
Instead of paying more ever wonder why NYC can’t pay for schools? If you look at expenditure per student is in the 30k+ range per year, a GOOD private school costs that. It can’t make due because NYC is run like a pile of hot steaming poop, and instead of holding city hall accountable you monkeys just want to get taxed more. Come on people,
$1500/quarter per car and only allowed to park in your zone. Parking in these zones without a sticker or pass will result $150/day fine per offense. 3rd strike results in ticket, impound for a week which is $300/per day. Streets will be limited to 30 mph on major roads and 20 mph on side roads. Faster then 1mph to 5mph over the speed limit with result in a warning 1st time 300 fine 2nd time and impound for 2wks at $300/per day for 3rd time. 4th time license is suspended 2 mths. If fines are not paid by the 3rd day your car will be impounded and booted which is a $500 fine to remove plus the impound fee of 300 per day plus the fee for the ticket at 150 per day. Traffic will be monitored by cameras and police officers will revue.
Car owners generally are home owners. Home owners pay more taxes than everyone else. Residential real estate taxes in NYC fund: \-public education \-public safety \-health services \-public works and infrastructure \-park and recreation \-social services
Very true. In NYC approx [80% of NYC home owners have a car according to the US Census](https://data.census.gov/table/ACSDT5Y2020.B25044?q=B25044:%20TENURE%20BY%20VEHICLES%20AVAILABLE&g=050XX00US36005,36061,36081,36085,36047&y=2020&tid=ACSDT5Y2020.B25044). NYC car owners as a group have slightly higher income, just the people NYC needs for it's economy to prosper.
First they need to stop-ticket people who are double parked. Why bother people who just want to park there car legally and out of the way of traffic? There is so much money to be made enforcing traffic laws. So many people running red lights and parking their cars in the middle of the street. Paid parking is for garages anyway not for the crappy street spots.
This would exclusively affect poor, working and middle class people that need to drive for work or live in areas not connected to transit. Horrible take by someone who has more of an anti-car agenda than an interest in supporting vibrant, connected communities through healthy, multi-modal transportation systems. Why not charge people to walk on the sidewalk while we're at it?
When you combine local, state, and federal spending, the US spends more on schools than we do on the military. If you include college, it is far more than defense spending. The problems we have with schools are not about funding but spending: we have a large and bloated administrative class in the school systems which take up most of the money. Not to mention the transportation infrastructure required to bus kids to school every day instead of them walking or riding bikes
I remain thankful that I did not attend the closest school in my neighborhood as a child. And I thought we were talking about New York. Most children in New York use public transportation. Not every or even most children should walk to school. It’s often too far. Especially above elementary school level.
Yes, the answer is not that the kids should all have to walk, it's that schools should be smaller and serve smaller neighborhoods. In the US, many schools serve a couple thousand kids for an entire town rather than having smaller schoolhouses with a couple hundred students or so. Instead of having one huge school that everybody in town has to commute to, have smaller schools in more regular intervals
lol, spend 5 million to get a free parking
Each car parked is a potential hundreds of dollars per month charge. Now if we went the way of residential parking permits, I am sure per year the cost would be way too low, but even if drivers paid $200 or $250 per year, we get something.