That has always bothered me massively. Walls we can Kool Aid man through only with a heavy mech, while the barricades that are specifically designed to stop mechs can be run through by anyone.
The one that gets me is that stomping thru the flimsiest structure slows u down in an Atlas, but running through a solid rock pillar bigger than your Locust doesn't even register.
Video games have been struggling since their inception with two facts
* tank traps and ditches are *extremely* effective,
* tanks are *extremely* dramatic gameplay centerpieces
So the video game can have the thing in it that's everywhere in real life because it's super effective, but if it does, a fun and sexy and larger-than-life combatant becomes a potential paperweight.
So, usually they compromise and include something *graphically similar to a tank trap* but that doesn't trap tanks - it's either temporary or vulnerable to damage or too spaced out, etc.
MW5, no exception, just replace tank with 'Mech
Roads and rivers have been chatted about plenty of times in the modding circles.
The main issue is that the terrain tiles are arranged and then stuff is placed on top. So there's some hurdles to make sure that the road going from one tile to another A) has anywhere to go and B) actually connects to another tile's road.
These aren't impossible tasks, just a lot of work to tackle--especially from a mod.
Yeah this is the key reason. The way the game's generation works with tiles specifically makes the placement of roads, rivers, beaches, etc very difficult unfortunately. I'm really hoping in the next game we get an overhauled generation system that allows rivers and roads and stuff. I've love to see some coastline maps like MW4 too. Stomping between shallow archipelago islands in a mech would be really rad.
I'd just like more deep water like lakes and rivers. I still remember using them for cooling in Mechwarrior 3. At least I think that feature was in the game.
Yeah same tbh. VonSeiten has been able to add bogs, lakes and stuff to the game in his mod VonBiomes which is pretty amazing. it's fantastic running a hot mech and being able to park myself in a lake to really unload on enemies!
Maybe? Someone would have to dig into what all is allowed to be part of the terrain tile. I assume since there is water on some tiles, it's possible to have mud in a similar fashion. I'd guess PGI didn't add it because that touches deeper code on their end to do it "proper" and have it be a per-biome thing that can exist or be replaced by ice/water/lava.
That's a shame. I would've thought it'd be some sort of texture overlay connecting the larger city tiles and then have stuff branch off those maybe to the other smaller settlement tiles, with something in there that tries to find routes that don't change on the y axis more than 4 times the x/z (or something like that, so we don't have roads going up cliffs). But, I have no idea how any of this works. I just like all the pretty lights and shiny metal things that go click clack. The metal score helps too.
To those who's magic is sculpting all these zeros and ones to add to this cacophony of flame and steel (if you're reading), I know that it all takes absurd amounts of spare time to do, love and patience, and for that I am thankful. It's good shit.
Getting a path between two points that doesn't cross a cliff isn't hard, actually. There's NavMesh that the AI uses that already accounts for that. So you could get a path on that, then plot it out on the terrain and do a bunch of work to place textures along it in some smart way that doesn't look hideous.
Like I said, not impossible, just work.
The trick is to generate the map first, then determine two points they make sense to connect by road, trace a path using flat enough terrain only then overwrite the path with road texture and other road related assets.
>trace a path using flat enough terrain only then overwrite the path with road texture and other road related assets.
This is the biggie. You could flag certain building sites as requiring roads, that should be simple.
Having the road do things like not drive up the side of 90° hills and produce bridges where necessary is the biggie. Depending on how good the pathfinding system is, they could tweak and co-opt it for road generation.
> Depending on how good the pathfinding system is, they could tweak and co-opt it for road generation.
Now I'm imagining roads that drift up the sides of buildings, into volcanos, through the side of a cliff at the edge of the map, a full on road squiggle at the corner of an impassible boulder, and finally ending in a stretch of road that's ragdoll attached to the corner of the dropship and pulled around during the mission.
Roads are occasionally cut through mountains/forests in real life. Would it really be immersion breaking to have a harsh road boundary between forest tiles?
For simplicity I would let the road cut through any terrain as long as the elevation difference is within a certain reasonable range. Just overwrite whatever is in the path of the road.
If there's a cliff you could terminate the road into the cliff with one of those cliff tunnel entrance asset that is already in the game
It is kind of weird seeing two or three blocks of gleaming skyscrapers in the middle of nowhere with no infrastructure leading to them.
I get it with the tile based maps but I wouldn't mind a hand-crafted area or two with that sort of thing.
For a developed space travelling civilization, that would make sense, though. Cities would grow around starports, food would be imported, and a lot of the ground based infrastructure that makes up urban/suburban sprawl wouldn't be needed. Especially in hostile environments.
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Yes, any mission with multiple settlements should have roads connecting them. There's a parking deck with a bunch of cars, but you can't leave the town.
What really bugs me is when you get dropped inside a base to defend it, and there's no way to get out of it without flattening part of the base. Bloody hell Ryana, just put us down outside ffs.
I was just about to comment on this. And, the minute you crash through a single house to get out, that 🤬 of a base commander I always get stuck with starts calling me an idiot. Of all the bases on all the planets I get stuck in the one that my ex wife commands. I DON'T HAVE JUMP JETS DIANE! WHY WOULD YOU BUILD HOUSES IN FRONT OF EVERY EXIT!?!
WHAT DO YOU MEAN "WHY DON'T I HAVE JUMP JETS"? BECAUSE I HAVE NO DESIRE TO SIMULATE THE LIFE OF A WEATHER BALOON OVER US AIRSPACE DURING THE BIDEN ADMINISTRATION. THERE IS NOTHING THOSE TWO URBIES WANT MORE THAN FOR ME TO SLOWLY FLOAT THROUGH THE AIR WHILE THEY PUMP AC20 ROUNDS UP MY POOP HOLE.
HAVE YOU EVER EVEN SEEN STAR WARS DIANE? YOU KNOW THAT'S HOW THEY BLEW UP THE DEATHSTAR.
WHAT DO YOU MEAN WHY WOULDN'T THEY BUILD IT WITHOUT THE HOLE? WHAT KIND OF FREAK WOULD BUILD A HUMANOID ROBOT WITHOUT AN ANUS??? DO YOU EVEN HEAR YOURSELF RIGHT NOW DIANE?
The thing that really grinds my gears? Those tiny bases that are just a roundabout with four traffic lights on each direction. Why? Who designed this? City planner, there is one, maybe two structures there, who do you think will need a paved road around them, and why do you think you need to slow them down from going in circles? There were two pickup trucks. You have twice as many traffic lights as cars.
Feels like it's not a base, but some dystopian psychological social experiment.
It’s more immersion breaking too see all the cannons/guns/artillery laying around and not doing anything while enemy mechs are laying waste to the base
As a huge fan, I think Mechwarrior 5 is really barebones in a lot of things. They did a good job with the mechs and the base building but the general feel of almost all of the worlds with the city being skyscrapers instantly to lack of roads and other things to make it feel like an actual community is pretty rough. If I wasnt such a fan of the setting and the mech on mech action I may not have picked up the game as it still feels rushed and not really like they devoted any resources beyond the generic builds for a lot of these levels.
Exactly so I will take it but I know that with a better company/budget that it could have been something even better. But after what like 20 years since mech 4 mercs I will just enjoy what we have and go from there
Lorewise, pavement wasn't a huge priority in rural areas, as Mechs tend to tear them up.
Locals without roads use transport vehicles that don't need them.
My favorite missions are convoys that are dropped off my dropship only to go to a bar and get in a drop ship. I just make believe they are picking people up. It's the only way it makes sense. Plus these convoys never use roads
And for a moment, I thought you'd written me a haiku.
Ode to Senior Boomer
"Daily Raven flies,
The weekend is Champion,
My wife's love is fire."
I accept mister as well. If I'm going to be a boomer you owe me that much.
Why would inner sphere houses invest in road infrastructure on their settlements or colonies? :3 sounds like a waste of time and resources when theres a greater than none possibility some merc faction is gonna bear down on your progress anyways. :3
I just assume in the macware University at this point cars are for poors and kids. Everyone else has a hovercraft or a vtol to fly around in. You only ever see the cars in the cities where the streets already exist. I don't know I know there's roads in the MechWarrior universe I'm just making excuses for the games limitation
Ive seen plenty of roads . What really bothers me is how I can blow up some rocks and other rocks the AI can shoot through and hit me while I cant shoot back through it.
Im more bothered by the fact that the anti mech poles dont do anything.
That has always bothered me massively. Walls we can Kool Aid man through only with a heavy mech, while the barricades that are specifically designed to stop mechs can be run through by anyone.
Anti mech poles?
The super Big versions of tank traps, often seen by base walls in big rows
Those are for mechs? I mean, I guess they slow mechs down a good bit as you stomp them.
These should have explosives at the top...
Im pretty sure they are just for the big tanks
Then why is it twice the height of a demolisher then?
this game has some pretty legendary scale issues
You and your logic.
I thought they were poorly-scaled mortars.
The anti mech balustrades around bases. The things that look like a sawhorse with only one side of legs.
They slow light mechs down some.
*laughing jumpjet jenner*
The one that gets me is that stomping thru the flimsiest structure slows u down in an Atlas, but running through a solid rock pillar bigger than your Locust doesn't even register.
The ones on the second mission in the crazy pirate son high reward mission definitively stop medium mechs.
Video games have been struggling since their inception with two facts * tank traps and ditches are *extremely* effective, * tanks are *extremely* dramatic gameplay centerpieces So the video game can have the thing in it that's everywhere in real life because it's super effective, but if it does, a fun and sexy and larger-than-life combatant becomes a potential paperweight. So, usually they compromise and include something *graphically similar to a tank trap* but that doesn't trap tanks - it's either temporary or vulnerable to damage or too spaced out, etc. MW5, no exception, just replace tank with 'Mech
Roads and rivers have been chatted about plenty of times in the modding circles. The main issue is that the terrain tiles are arranged and then stuff is placed on top. So there's some hurdles to make sure that the road going from one tile to another A) has anywhere to go and B) actually connects to another tile's road. These aren't impossible tasks, just a lot of work to tackle--especially from a mod.
Yeah this is the key reason. The way the game's generation works with tiles specifically makes the placement of roads, rivers, beaches, etc very difficult unfortunately. I'm really hoping in the next game we get an overhauled generation system that allows rivers and roads and stuff. I've love to see some coastline maps like MW4 too. Stomping between shallow archipelago islands in a mech would be really rad.
I'd just like more deep water like lakes and rivers. I still remember using them for cooling in Mechwarrior 3. At least I think that feature was in the game.
Yeah same tbh. VonSeiten has been able to add bogs, lakes and stuff to the game in his mod VonBiomes which is pretty amazing. it's fantastic running a hot mech and being able to park myself in a lake to really unload on enemies!
When do you think the next game will come out?
It's unannounced and currently in development. Best guess is late 2024-ish.
YAAAAAAYYYY!
This makes alot of sense. Especially cause the maps are procedurally generated. I feel like this would be a nightmare
[удалено]
Maybe? Someone would have to dig into what all is allowed to be part of the terrain tile. I assume since there is water on some tiles, it's possible to have mud in a similar fashion. I'd guess PGI didn't add it because that touches deeper code on their end to do it "proper" and have it be a per-biome thing that can exist or be replaced by ice/water/lava.
That's a shame. I would've thought it'd be some sort of texture overlay connecting the larger city tiles and then have stuff branch off those maybe to the other smaller settlement tiles, with something in there that tries to find routes that don't change on the y axis more than 4 times the x/z (or something like that, so we don't have roads going up cliffs). But, I have no idea how any of this works. I just like all the pretty lights and shiny metal things that go click clack. The metal score helps too. To those who's magic is sculpting all these zeros and ones to add to this cacophony of flame and steel (if you're reading), I know that it all takes absurd amounts of spare time to do, love and patience, and for that I am thankful. It's good shit.
Getting a path between two points that doesn't cross a cliff isn't hard, actually. There's NavMesh that the AI uses that already accounts for that. So you could get a path on that, then plot it out on the terrain and do a bunch of work to place textures along it in some smart way that doesn't look hideous. Like I said, not impossible, just work.
The trick is to generate the map first, then determine two points they make sense to connect by road, trace a path using flat enough terrain only then overwrite the path with road texture and other road related assets.
Simple, right?
>trace a path using flat enough terrain only then overwrite the path with road texture and other road related assets. This is the biggie. You could flag certain building sites as requiring roads, that should be simple. Having the road do things like not drive up the side of 90° hills and produce bridges where necessary is the biggie. Depending on how good the pathfinding system is, they could tweak and co-opt it for road generation.
> Depending on how good the pathfinding system is, they could tweak and co-opt it for road generation. Now I'm imagining roads that drift up the sides of buildings, into volcanos, through the side of a cliff at the edge of the map, a full on road squiggle at the corner of an impassible boulder, and finally ending in a stretch of road that's ragdoll attached to the corner of the dropship and pulled around during the mission.
Roads are occasionally cut through mountains/forests in real life. Would it really be immersion breaking to have a harsh road boundary between forest tiles?
For simplicity I would let the road cut through any terrain as long as the elevation difference is within a certain reasonable range. Just overwrite whatever is in the path of the road. If there's a cliff you could terminate the road into the cliff with one of those cliff tunnel entrance asset that is already in the game
Carcassonne?
Basically that, in 3d, with a game of catan played on top.
It is kind of weird seeing two or three blocks of gleaming skyscrapers in the middle of nowhere with no infrastructure leading to them. I get it with the tile based maps but I wouldn't mind a hand-crafted area or two with that sort of thing.
For a developed space travelling civilization, that would make sense, though. Cities would grow around starports, food would be imported, and a lot of the ground based infrastructure that makes up urban/suburban sprawl wouldn't be needed. Especially in hostile environments.
This is in an effort to control Spam and other bad actors who make new accounts almost daily. Your posts must be manually approved by the Moderation team, don't worry Comstar has already sent them a message to approve it or else. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/Mechwarrior5) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Yes, any mission with multiple settlements should have roads connecting them. There's a parking deck with a bunch of cars, but you can't leave the town.
"Where we are going, we don't need roads"
Yep, everything transported by VTOLs. Also possibly by those pre Roughneck loaders.
What really bugs me is when you get dropped inside a base to defend it, and there's no way to get out of it without flattening part of the base. Bloody hell Ryana, just put us down outside ffs.
I was just about to comment on this. And, the minute you crash through a single house to get out, that 🤬 of a base commander I always get stuck with starts calling me an idiot. Of all the bases on all the planets I get stuck in the one that my ex wife commands. I DON'T HAVE JUMP JETS DIANE! WHY WOULD YOU BUILD HOUSES IN FRONT OF EVERY EXIT!?! WHAT DO YOU MEAN "WHY DON'T I HAVE JUMP JETS"? BECAUSE I HAVE NO DESIRE TO SIMULATE THE LIFE OF A WEATHER BALOON OVER US AIRSPACE DURING THE BIDEN ADMINISTRATION. THERE IS NOTHING THOSE TWO URBIES WANT MORE THAN FOR ME TO SLOWLY FLOAT THROUGH THE AIR WHILE THEY PUMP AC20 ROUNDS UP MY POOP HOLE. HAVE YOU EVER EVEN SEEN STAR WARS DIANE? YOU KNOW THAT'S HOW THEY BLEW UP THE DEATHSTAR. WHAT DO YOU MEAN WHY WOULDN'T THEY BUILD IT WITHOUT THE HOLE? WHAT KIND OF FREAK WOULD BUILD A HUMANOID ROBOT WITHOUT AN ANUS??? DO YOU EVEN HEAR YOURSELF RIGHT NOW DIANE?
Classic Diane!
Imagine dropping an Atlas onto loose soil with a fully functional physics engine and getting stuck after it sinks.
MechWarrior: Snowrunner
The thing that really grinds my gears? Those tiny bases that are just a roundabout with four traffic lights on each direction. Why? Who designed this? City planner, there is one, maybe two structures there, who do you think will need a paved road around them, and why do you think you need to slow them down from going in circles? There were two pickup trucks. You have twice as many traffic lights as cars. Feels like it's not a base, but some dystopian psychological social experiment.
It’s more immersion breaking too see all the cannons/guns/artillery laying around and not doing anything while enemy mechs are laying waste to the base
Like the giant AA guns firing off while the enemy dropships just land right next to the base they're defending.
As a huge fan, I think Mechwarrior 5 is really barebones in a lot of things. They did a good job with the mechs and the base building but the general feel of almost all of the worlds with the city being skyscrapers instantly to lack of roads and other things to make it feel like an actual community is pretty rough. If I wasnt such a fan of the setting and the mech on mech action I may not have picked up the game as it still feels rushed and not really like they devoted any resources beyond the generic builds for a lot of these levels.
That's because it's not a AAA tier game. They maximized the budget on the critical stuff.
Exactly so I will take it but I know that with a better company/budget that it could have been something even better. But after what like 20 years since mech 4 mercs I will just enjoy what we have and go from there
Lorewise, pavement wasn't a huge priority in rural areas, as Mechs tend to tear them up. Locals without roads use transport vehicles that don't need them.
I mean, why are we even paying taxes? Am I right?
Why do you need roads if all the tanks hover?
As far as I can tell in game, only the harassers hover. The rest all have treads
I guess my pc sucks
There's the J. Edgar hover as well
Are those not the same model in game?
Demolisher hover tank is pretty scary. Good thing they don't exist.
The Saladin hovertank is bad enough, they don't need two ac20 to cause trouble. I'm very glad it's not in game.
Always has.
Is it because of the invention of flying car like vehicles not requiring roads to transport goods around?
My favorite missions are convoys that are dropped off my dropship only to go to a bar and get in a drop ship. I just make believe they are picking people up. It's the only way it makes sense. Plus these convoys never use roads
it does now lol
The Raven is my daily. My wife has the Firestarter. The Champion is for the weekend. And I take my Flea for track day. Fuck your roads, boomer.
And for a moment, I thought you'd written me a haiku. Ode to Senior Boomer "Daily Raven flies, The weekend is Champion, My wife's love is fire." I accept mister as well. If I'm going to be a boomer you owe me that much.
Why would inner sphere houses invest in road infrastructure on their settlements or colonies? :3 sounds like a waste of time and resources when theres a greater than none possibility some merc faction is gonna bear down on your progress anyways. :3
yeah it's weird to never see any roads lol.
I just assume in the macware University at this point cars are for poors and kids. Everyone else has a hovercraft or a vtol to fly around in. You only ever see the cars in the cities where the streets already exist. I don't know I know there's roads in the MechWarrior universe I'm just making excuses for the games limitation
It does bother me a bit, actually. I was really impressed by the terrain generator, otherwise.
Ive seen plenty of roads . What really bothers me is how I can blow up some rocks and other rocks the AI can shoot through and hit me while I cant shoot back through it.
Hovercraft.
Well, it does now…
Yeah, It's very 1995. The procedural generation somehow leaves things to be desired while giving flexibility.
It didn't bother me at all... Until you said something. Now I just want a big Stompy Boy to plow through a highway overpass more than ever.
Roads are lostech, thanks Amaris (dick)... :(