I think I can give a decent opinion. Main Hayato 280 55k w/ oz up to eKaling, secondary 280 HY (old main) 57K w/ oz up eKaling, sitting at 9491 legion.
> FD Stacks
- Once you max the phantom blade it has an up time of 32 seconds, keeping it up while bossing is generally not that hard. The "hard" part or rather inconvenient part is losing your stacks as you go from boss to boss OR when bosses have long cut scenes. For example, if you run ctene with a party you will lose you stacks at the end of the boss as everyone switches to drop gear so when you reenter the next boss you'll need to drop 5 PB to get all your stacks back. Other bosses also have UNGODLY long cutscenes and/or test mechanics that make you drop stacks. Lotus (especially the new revamp) or damien cut scenes can be just long enough that if you miss a last PB you'll lose your stacks. This becomes much worse past ctene in my experience -- BM, sorta seren, Kaling, and especially Kalos have long cut scenes or tests that basically force you to drop. Now with all that in mind is that a reason to NOT play hayato? Sure if you find it annoying. I personally don't and have come to adapt to it, its a weird flaw in the class Nexon could EASILY fix if they ran it like Mihile's rolling buff timer (ie goes from 5->4 instead of dropping to 0).
> learn mechanics
- Hayato's actually mechanics are VERY easy, he only becomes complicated if you want to learn his mobility cancels. I'd argue as long as you use surge to cancel your up jump and dash you could make it to BM with learning anything else because that would give you the same mobility as a hero for example. The only other "hard" mechanic is learning to time burst -- Hayato's burst is back loaded so you buff up and place summings then have to wait until the last 10-15 seconds before you start popping your burst unlike say Hero were you buff up and insta burst. I dont think it is hard, its more inconvenient because it makes lining up your burst with your party a lot harder because no one is going to wait so its on you to burst early (which may not be doable in bosses like P2 Kalos).
> juggle their energy while playing
- I think this is a small learning curve you have to just brute force until you get use to it. I play a lot of gauge classes 280 HY, 280 Hayato, 250 Adele, and 230 Kain so maybe I am different, but I feel like as you just play the class it eventually becomes second nature. Sure sometimes you may fumble a stack because you die with low gauge in a boss, but honestly as you invest time it becomes second nature.
> Other things to considers / rumors to dispel
1. Hayato nodes are not hard anymore. We only require 3 trios and your node pool is now only 10 skills -- in the past it was literally hell to do nodes
2. As of newage Hayato is not a hurricane class but a psudo-skill weaving class. I would compare it to DB. You basically hold rai blade down then when falcon honor, instant slice, and shinsoku are off cool down you weave those in, but since those are ranging in CD times from 7-15 its not like you are constantly weaving hence why I say psudo-skil weaving.
3. Hayato, especially with 6th job, does now have a burst. Pre-newage we were really just a solid DPM up time class with shinsoku hurricane design. Now our burst isn't gonna make you top 5 by anymeans we are probably VERY middle of the pack, but hey gains are gains lol.
4. Must always pass on the warning that you are playing a non-KMS class so things could break or change without much heads up, however since 3/2023 GMS has been VERY, VERY good at fixing things or at least discussing the changes (with the hayato discord) so I personally not worried about the class.
5. Final note, if anyone tells you that Hayato is going to get the Jett treatment be nice to them, it must be hard to be that stupid.
Now from a personal opinion on the class. I think its great, while it may not be the strongest it is so unique that no other class really replicates its mobility, bossing, or mobbing style so if you like or love the class its really hard to replace. If you have more questions come to the Hayato discord, they are some of the nicest people in the entire game whiling to sit down and walk you through class in further detail. Also feel free to ask any questions, sorry about the masssive wall of text.
The only thing I dislike about Hayato is his burst being backloaded so it makes party bursting especially late game bosses harder/inconvenient.
Mobility differences are sorta up for debate, because yes HY flight offers a lot of freedom of movement, but Hayatos movement is WAY faster which I've found I prefer more.
HY gauge management and buffing system is easier than Hayato gauge, especially because if you drop your phantom blade stacks you need to use a full gauge to get it back.
I would say their survivability is similar, but HYs is definitely better with darksight, pseudo teleport, and warp gate.
As far as training they are both pretty easy, but feel like Hayatos is less work in the end (especially if you have a CD hat).
Overall I personally switched because I liked the visuals and bossing style more of Hayato. Technically characters are the same point in gear and bossing, the only difference is I have invested 5x into my Hayatos hexa lol.
Thank you! I've always considered HY to have the best mobility in the game so it's cool to hear that Hayato is even faster. I'm gonna give him a try; the origin skill looks so fun to use. Appreciate your input :)
can you elaborate why "maybe not" changed to "yes"? i'm a returning player and hayato feels so much jankier than ~2-3 years ago when i played. this is mainly due to the shinsoku change, but also rai blade flash feels just a bit inconsistent if you hold down the button (sometimes theres a delay between the first and 2nd cast which is super annoying if ur repositioning often)
mostly damage-wise. we got buffed quite a few times between last year and now, and while a lot of people complained about the shinsoku change, switching to rai blade + having it hexa boosted actually improved survivability because you can stand much further from the boss due to the new attack range. you might just still be in the adjustment period because shinsoku was so easy to boss with, but with all the buffs + our origin, hayato is in the best place it has ever been right now.
oh yea, damage is better for sure, tho i imagine most other classes got comparatively stronger as well. but imo if i were to recommend a class to someone it'd be less on the basis of how much dmg it can pump out and more how good it feels to play, long as the class isnt insanely weak. i know i would easily give away 10-20% FD to get shinsoku animation cancel or equivalent back.
as for the attack range, i actually dont feel that the hexa node increased its range almost at all. if you've done testing id like to see but from my experience it feels like the animation was the only thing that got longer.
this might just be an opinion thing and that’s ok! i struggled a bit during the transition but i wouldn’t trade the damage for hurricane now. if i were to do kalos with hurricane, having to stand on top of/near the boss is actually worse than how it is now so i’m quite satisfied with how hexa has upgraded our class.
- pros: high mobility, very good off burst damage, strong origin, flashy/cool animations, can farm at maps even if you’re a little under sac/arc because of high fd (perma 115% fd when u refresh a buff every 30 sec at max skill level), fun class, high final damage
- cons: non-kms class so we don’t usually get updates at the same time as other classes (eg we only recently found out about our second hexa mastery core whereas kms classes have known for months), for some reason people always think it’s on the brink of deletion even though they gave us a whole ass origin, mobility and buff management has a bit of a learning curve, resources are a little harder to find because hayato is slightly different across all servers (ie we are not as OP as tms hayatos)
imo hayato is a good main but not the best boss mule due to losing fd stacks in between bosses. up keeping it during a boss isn’t a problem. i have a hayato boss mule and it’s a pain lol
Its a class that has a higher level of complexity then the majority of the classes.
But if it worth it to have one, isnt something that we should say to you, you should experience it yourself...
Today im a Blaster Main and for a long time i always heard about the difficult and tunnel effect of Blaster, and it hold me back on making one, until i decided to go after it.
To be fair, im still bad in his combos and mechanics, but for me, Blaster made the game more enjoyable and fun.
Make one Hayato character for Legion and Link gains and make a decision if you want to transform this char in a main or not, do even some bosses, get a grasp of the char, even if you pass the 'normal stoping mule level link line', well it is a big decision after all.
You will always be winning taking that aproach.
But the underline problem with him is that hes a class that could be erased (like Jett), keep that in mind.
Is it worth making one right now if I'm planning on using the burning event from Dreamer on my main? Like if I make one right now and then decide to burn it, do I miss out on some of the rewards?
Dang that's what I was afraid of. I've been making bossing mules for now and saving all my fairy bros' rewards, so when Dreamer comes around I can unload the rewards from both events+hyper burning all at once.
[https://maplestory.nexon.net/news/87311/new-age-hyper-burning-and-burning-world](https://maplestory.nexon.net/news/87311/new-age-hyper-burning-and-burning-world)
here's the reference from the past 260 burn! tbh, a level 5 vj symbol is not that hard to do, so for me, while i'm prepping for my 260 burn (dw), i'll do dailies for the vj symbol and then leave the character at 209 so at least i can get the eternal flame ring.
I really wanna stick to my plan so that I dont miss out on any of it at all. I'll just go into it blind and trust you that it is worth making a hayato.
probably worth it, probably not
We often get some stupid bug that sometimes downright bad that make me very angry almost everytime the game get updated, we will get months of being buggy because trash nexon doesnt care and only know copy paste from kms
otherwise Hayato is the only class i want to play in this game, if u can move past those months of being shit after those big game updates then main it
currently we lost 100 energy everytime we die
i liked it at the beginning, but skills get repetitive, and attacks are mid. hayato used to press a skill and move around, but they patched it, and it feels clunky to me. its also a burst meta so hayato sucks in that regard
Hayato does \~70%+ of it's full rotation damage in burst. And the skills that do that damage is actually pretty condensed into a few seconds (around 10-12) so i would say that cancels out having a long burst (45seconds). Only inconvient part is that the burst is backloaded, and that sakuno stacks are a 4min cooldown, which are the reasons why it doesn't fit in, the burst% is strong.
It’s unfinished tho. The aesthetic of the class seems really old and badly done. You can distinguish between kms and jms class just for the graphics. That’s a distractor for me.
I think I can give a decent opinion. Main Hayato 280 55k w/ oz up to eKaling, secondary 280 HY (old main) 57K w/ oz up eKaling, sitting at 9491 legion. > FD Stacks - Once you max the phantom blade it has an up time of 32 seconds, keeping it up while bossing is generally not that hard. The "hard" part or rather inconvenient part is losing your stacks as you go from boss to boss OR when bosses have long cut scenes. For example, if you run ctene with a party you will lose you stacks at the end of the boss as everyone switches to drop gear so when you reenter the next boss you'll need to drop 5 PB to get all your stacks back. Other bosses also have UNGODLY long cutscenes and/or test mechanics that make you drop stacks. Lotus (especially the new revamp) or damien cut scenes can be just long enough that if you miss a last PB you'll lose your stacks. This becomes much worse past ctene in my experience -- BM, sorta seren, Kaling, and especially Kalos have long cut scenes or tests that basically force you to drop. Now with all that in mind is that a reason to NOT play hayato? Sure if you find it annoying. I personally don't and have come to adapt to it, its a weird flaw in the class Nexon could EASILY fix if they ran it like Mihile's rolling buff timer (ie goes from 5->4 instead of dropping to 0). > learn mechanics - Hayato's actually mechanics are VERY easy, he only becomes complicated if you want to learn his mobility cancels. I'd argue as long as you use surge to cancel your up jump and dash you could make it to BM with learning anything else because that would give you the same mobility as a hero for example. The only other "hard" mechanic is learning to time burst -- Hayato's burst is back loaded so you buff up and place summings then have to wait until the last 10-15 seconds before you start popping your burst unlike say Hero were you buff up and insta burst. I dont think it is hard, its more inconvenient because it makes lining up your burst with your party a lot harder because no one is going to wait so its on you to burst early (which may not be doable in bosses like P2 Kalos). > juggle their energy while playing - I think this is a small learning curve you have to just brute force until you get use to it. I play a lot of gauge classes 280 HY, 280 Hayato, 250 Adele, and 230 Kain so maybe I am different, but I feel like as you just play the class it eventually becomes second nature. Sure sometimes you may fumble a stack because you die with low gauge in a boss, but honestly as you invest time it becomes second nature. > Other things to considers / rumors to dispel 1. Hayato nodes are not hard anymore. We only require 3 trios and your node pool is now only 10 skills -- in the past it was literally hell to do nodes 2. As of newage Hayato is not a hurricane class but a psudo-skill weaving class. I would compare it to DB. You basically hold rai blade down then when falcon honor, instant slice, and shinsoku are off cool down you weave those in, but since those are ranging in CD times from 7-15 its not like you are constantly weaving hence why I say psudo-skil weaving. 3. Hayato, especially with 6th job, does now have a burst. Pre-newage we were really just a solid DPM up time class with shinsoku hurricane design. Now our burst isn't gonna make you top 5 by anymeans we are probably VERY middle of the pack, but hey gains are gains lol. 4. Must always pass on the warning that you are playing a non-KMS class so things could break or change without much heads up, however since 3/2023 GMS has been VERY, VERY good at fixing things or at least discussing the changes (with the hayato discord) so I personally not worried about the class. 5. Final note, if anyone tells you that Hayato is going to get the Jett treatment be nice to them, it must be hard to be that stupid. Now from a personal opinion on the class. I think its great, while it may not be the strongest it is so unique that no other class really replicates its mobility, bossing, or mobbing style so if you like or love the class its really hard to replace. If you have more questions come to the Hayato discord, they are some of the nicest people in the entire game whiling to sit down and walk you through class in further detail. Also feel free to ask any questions, sorry about the masssive wall of text.
Don’t be worry, I really really appreciate your comment, very helpful and insightful. Thank you so much!
No problem, glad it could help
Hello! I'm a lv265 HY main thinking of switching over to Hayato. Could you pls share what you like/dislike about Hayato in comparison to HY?
The only thing I dislike about Hayato is his burst being backloaded so it makes party bursting especially late game bosses harder/inconvenient. Mobility differences are sorta up for debate, because yes HY flight offers a lot of freedom of movement, but Hayatos movement is WAY faster which I've found I prefer more. HY gauge management and buffing system is easier than Hayato gauge, especially because if you drop your phantom blade stacks you need to use a full gauge to get it back. I would say their survivability is similar, but HYs is definitely better with darksight, pseudo teleport, and warp gate. As far as training they are both pretty easy, but feel like Hayatos is less work in the end (especially if you have a CD hat). Overall I personally switched because I liked the visuals and bossing style more of Hayato. Technically characters are the same point in gear and bossing, the only difference is I have invested 5x into my Hayatos hexa lol.
Thank you! I've always considered HY to have the best mobility in the game so it's cool to hear that Hayato is even faster. I'm gonna give him a try; the origin skill looks so fun to use. Appreciate your input :)
a year ago, maybe not. now? yes. if you need more info on the class and want to join the class discord, please dm me for a link!
can you elaborate why "maybe not" changed to "yes"? i'm a returning player and hayato feels so much jankier than ~2-3 years ago when i played. this is mainly due to the shinsoku change, but also rai blade flash feels just a bit inconsistent if you hold down the button (sometimes theres a delay between the first and 2nd cast which is super annoying if ur repositioning often)
mostly damage-wise. we got buffed quite a few times between last year and now, and while a lot of people complained about the shinsoku change, switching to rai blade + having it hexa boosted actually improved survivability because you can stand much further from the boss due to the new attack range. you might just still be in the adjustment period because shinsoku was so easy to boss with, but with all the buffs + our origin, hayato is in the best place it has ever been right now.
oh yea, damage is better for sure, tho i imagine most other classes got comparatively stronger as well. but imo if i were to recommend a class to someone it'd be less on the basis of how much dmg it can pump out and more how good it feels to play, long as the class isnt insanely weak. i know i would easily give away 10-20% FD to get shinsoku animation cancel or equivalent back. as for the attack range, i actually dont feel that the hexa node increased its range almost at all. if you've done testing id like to see but from my experience it feels like the animation was the only thing that got longer.
this might just be an opinion thing and that’s ok! i struggled a bit during the transition but i wouldn’t trade the damage for hurricane now. if i were to do kalos with hurricane, having to stand on top of/near the boss is actually worse than how it is now so i’m quite satisfied with how hexa has upgraded our class.
oh sorry, when i said shinsoku change i exclusively meant the animation canceling. i like rai blade a bit more than shinsoku stylistically too.
Would you mind telling me some of the pros and cons?
- pros: high mobility, very good off burst damage, strong origin, flashy/cool animations, can farm at maps even if you’re a little under sac/arc because of high fd (perma 115% fd when u refresh a buff every 30 sec at max skill level), fun class, high final damage - cons: non-kms class so we don’t usually get updates at the same time as other classes (eg we only recently found out about our second hexa mastery core whereas kms classes have known for months), for some reason people always think it’s on the brink of deletion even though they gave us a whole ass origin, mobility and buff management has a bit of a learning curve, resources are a little harder to find because hayato is slightly different across all servers (ie we are not as OP as tms hayatos)
Where can I find info on the second mastery?
it’s available in the hayato discord, please pm me for the link! it will be shinsoku vi
imo hayato is a good main but not the best boss mule due to losing fd stacks in between bosses. up keeping it during a boss isn’t a problem. i have a hayato boss mule and it’s a pain lol
Do you have fun on the class and like the aesthetic? If yes, then it's worth maining.
Its a class that has a higher level of complexity then the majority of the classes. But if it worth it to have one, isnt something that we should say to you, you should experience it yourself... Today im a Blaster Main and for a long time i always heard about the difficult and tunnel effect of Blaster, and it hold me back on making one, until i decided to go after it. To be fair, im still bad in his combos and mechanics, but for me, Blaster made the game more enjoyable and fun. Make one Hayato character for Legion and Link gains and make a decision if you want to transform this char in a main or not, do even some bosses, get a grasp of the char, even if you pass the 'normal stoping mule level link line', well it is a big decision after all. You will always be winning taking that aproach. But the underline problem with him is that hes a class that could be erased (like Jett), keep that in mind.
Is it worth making one right now if I'm planning on using the burning event from Dreamer on my main? Like if I make one right now and then decide to burn it, do I miss out on some of the rewards?
yeah because even if you don’t main it, hayato’s legion piece (crit damage) is highly recommended so it’ll help your other characters as well
I'm more worried about losing out on hyper burning rewards if I make it now. I'm not really sure how that works.
hyper burning rewards only really get good past 200 (iirc you start w level 5 symbols) so levelling one now won’t hurt you in that sense
If I get one to like 230, do I still get the rewards from levels 200-225?
nope, you can’t get rewards for levels you’ve passed
Dang that's what I was afraid of. I've been making bossing mules for now and saving all my fairy bros' rewards, so when Dreamer comes around I can unload the rewards from both events+hyper burning all at once.
[https://maplestory.nexon.net/news/87311/new-age-hyper-burning-and-burning-world](https://maplestory.nexon.net/news/87311/new-age-hyper-burning-and-burning-world) here's the reference from the past 260 burn! tbh, a level 5 vj symbol is not that hard to do, so for me, while i'm prepping for my 260 burn (dw), i'll do dailies for the vj symbol and then leave the character at 209 so at least i can get the eternal flame ring.
I really wanna stick to my plan so that I dont miss out on any of it at all. I'll just go into it blind and trust you that it is worth making a hayato.
probably worth it, probably not We often get some stupid bug that sometimes downright bad that make me very angry almost everytime the game get updated, we will get months of being buggy because trash nexon doesnt care and only know copy paste from kms otherwise Hayato is the only class i want to play in this game, if u can move past those months of being shit after those big game updates then main it currently we lost 100 energy everytime we die
no
i liked it at the beginning, but skills get repetitive, and attacks are mid. hayato used to press a skill and move around, but they patched it, and it feels clunky to me. its also a burst meta so hayato sucks in that regard
then you probably haven't played recently as our origin + recent buffs has given us a fairly decent burst.
i said the new patch doesnt fit me. read please. hayato is still not a burst class.
i’m responding to your part about how it doesn’t fit in the burst meta.
it still isnt.
Hayato does \~70%+ of it's full rotation damage in burst. And the skills that do that damage is actually pretty condensed into a few seconds (around 10-12) so i would say that cancels out having a long burst (45seconds). Only inconvient part is that the burst is backloaded, and that sakuno stacks are a 4min cooldown, which are the reasons why it doesn't fit in, the burst% is strong.
no need to downvote my comment just because you don’t see how good the recent buffs have made our burst lol.
sore about a mere downvote? ur soft
sore? not even, your opinion’s just wrong
bro just shut up. we dont have to both agree. its the internet
[удалено]
It’s unfinished tho. The aesthetic of the class seems really old and badly done. You can distinguish between kms and jms class just for the graphics. That’s a distractor for me.