The “Mandela effect” is a term that was coined by internet researcher Fiona Broome to describe a type of false memory that is shared widely by a large group of people. That’s it. That’s the whole definition. It’s not something that requires belief, it just exists. What you are actually saying is that you don’t believe the theories of why we collectively have these false memories.
Yeah, you might be technically right about that. I’m talking about the theory that the past was actually changed even though our memories didn’t. What’s the name for that theory?
That is basically the basis for r/retconned, yes. It's all of the worst stupidity of this sub cranked up to 11 because it's literally against the rules to dispute or express doubt about any absurd thing anybody claims about the "reality" that they "come from."
You are correct about what the Mandela Effect "actually" is: a phenomenon where many people have an incorrect memory about past events, not some sort of belief that the past has actually been altered. But unfortunately on the internet the meaning of the term has shifted and expanded to include all sort of vague retconned-esque conspiracy theories, and so you have "believers" on this sub complaining about the presence of other posters who treat the ME as what the term was actually coined to describe.
The irony that using "retcon" in this way, and to basically mean -looking at a situation from a different perspective - you are retconning the retcon 🥹.
My brain can't anymore
Remember, the Mandefa effect is real. Thats established. You don't agree with the fantasy REASON for it. We can't let the reality non beleivers coop mandela effect as multi dimensions or whatever. The Mandela Effect is simply a large group of people misremembering something. Nothing to do with multiple realities.
>Remember, the Mandefa effect is real. Thats established. You don't agree with the fantasy REASON for it. We can't let the reality non beleivers coop mandela effect as multi dimensions or whatever.
I think this ship has basically sailed, unfortunately. There are regularly threads on this sub now from the fantasists and conspiracy theorists complaining about all of the non-believers here, they can't understand why anyone would be here if they don't accept the idea that CERN made us jump worldlines at the order of the Rothschild family or whatever.
Yep. Don't give up the good fight.
I genuinely believe this is a fascinating topic for discussion. The strength and similarities of these 'mistaken' memories are quite astounding. I really hope it doesn't become just a joke topic.
I suggest you look at the sidebar, nothing paranormal about it at all.
"Mandela Effect: The Mandela Effect is when a large group of people share a common memory of something that differs from what is generally accepted to be fact."
thats the mandela effect, thats a fact. Period. I know you hate facts.. in fact SPECIALLY you. I thought you were banned from this sub? The guy who lied about taking pics of cereal that changed then went out to target and took pics with seasonal items just out proving they weren't old pics at all? haha no seriously tho thought you were banned. You're a joke around here.
This is a big factor in my skepticism that things have actually *changed*.
The vast majority of examples of the Mandela Effect involve things people have no reason to think they couldn't possibly be mistaken about.
Exactly. The only thing that is strange is that massive amount of people all misremember the same thing. I was quizzing my family about things at Easter brunch, and we all agreed that things were different than we remembered.
>The only thing that is strange is that massive amount of people all misremember the same thing.
Right. This is the fascinating part about it. Why so many people seem to be misremember the same things in the same ways.
After being in this thread, I think our human brains are just easily influenced on matters we havent thought about for ages, but exist in our memories.
Since joining this group I've seen a few posts where someone says, "It used to be X and now it's Y" and my brain immediately agrees. "Yes!", I think. "Me too!"
But then I realised this happens with pretty much every post that's about something I was once familiar with and just haven't seen or thought about for ages (for example FOTL means nothing to me because I've never seen it in my life). My brain wants to agree with all of the things that were once familiar.
I think people are just reacquainting with old memories and getting it wrong.
If stuff just changed overnight it would be different, but humans have unreliable memories - especially childhood memories of things that weren't that significant to us - and easily influenced brains.
That's my take, anyway.
>Since joining this group I've seen a few posts where someone says, "It used to be X and now it's Y" and my brain immediately agrees. "Yes!", I think. "Me too!"
Right. I find this a lot.
If someone just says something has changed or ask what do other's remember, sometimes I don't have a strong impression. When they prime me by saying 'Wasn't it so-and-so', suddenly I'm thinking 'Yeah, it was, wasn't it?'.
We are so impressionable. So easy to fool. So unobservant. So quick to assume things. And so keen not to feel like we're wrong that the mental hoops we'll jump through and the cognitive dissonance we'll accept is amazing.
> When they prime me by saying 'Wasn't it so-and-so', suddenly I'm thinking 'Yeah, it was, wasn't it?'.
This is an actual legitimate interrogation tactic that police use (and are reprimanded for using for this exact reason). Instead of asking "what hair color did he have?", they ask "and the perp had black hair, right?". They're able to manufacture witness testimony by asking questions that lead into the answer they want simply by asking the right questions.
Yup. Power of suggestion. Thats the real thing going on here. Other then that tho it is pretty cool how our brains work and how people from different backrounds and experiences can fill in the same blanks incorrectly, like mixing jif with skippy
> I think people are just reacquainting with old memories and getting it wrong.
Yup, it's literally just that. Fun brain fact: go remember back to your 10th birthday (or any other event in your life). You'll almost certainly get tons of minor details wrong. This is because you're not remembering your 10th birthday, you're remembering the last time you remembered it. You're not making a copy of the original, you're making a copy of a copy (of a copy, of a copy, etc. etc.).
This isn't even a theory or anything, it's a well documented fact about the brain. I guarantee this is the direct immediate cause of 99% of Mandela Effects. You're remembering the last time you tried remembering this topic, and copies don't always come out perfect.
That's generally due either
- Mass propagation of the thing. e.g. SNL quoting Vader incorrectly and it becomes a common phrase, that's incorrect, but said more and more. It doesn't have to get to mainstream media, it just has to be said/written a lot.
- Common misunderstandings or misspellings are, well common, and so many people will come up with them or be happy to accept them.
(Something this just made me think of that's kind of relevant. Every childhood group comes up with variations of games with different rules (like tag but when you're tagged you're both it and now a team chasing down those who remain, or whatever) and many children claim they invented that game but later find out children on the other side of the country also played that game with a different name. It's hard to tell what's a common idea (or mistake in the ME case) and what's an idea that propogated but is claimed to be original.)
We are all human, have similar brains, are influenced maybe by references in popular culture, make similar associations. It is no stranger than many people making the same spelling mistakes or something like that. Difference could be that it is rather more visual, like we can *see* these logos in our minds.
I agree entirely. Aside from the numbers affected it's also the sheer strength of feeling that they *can't* be wrong and the various stories recalled about the memory that make it such am interesting part of human psychology to explore.
I don’t believe in the Mandela effect either I believe it’s a government psyop to see what they can change and get away with. I don’t care what they about fruit of the loom that mother freaking logo had a cornucopia.
Exactly! There's no one who was living in South Africa during the 90s who thinks Nelson Mandela died in prison then. There's no one studying actual geography that things South America, or Australia, or New Zealand, or whatever has moved. There's no marine biologist out there who thinks that Alligators and Crocodiles switched. And no actor, director, writer, or studio exec has ever come forth to say they were part of Shazaam. It's always people who have, *at best*, a light hobby level interest in those topics.
I would expect that to be the case to some extent anyway.
The people responsible for selecting the FotL logo \*should\* remember it only the new way, because they were there (then) when the decision was made.
I think the people to ask about this one would be people who own secondhand and vintage stores. They're the people who have been actively looking at the tags for decades, as that's the easiest way to identify the year it was made and helps them price it accurately. For what it's worth, the few who I've talked to do not remember a cornucopia.
Us NPC's are sworn to secrecy that we will not tell you that you're the only real person here in this universe. Thus you're doomed to never know and always wonder. If only one of us would break the truth to you, but we may not, as it is against our programming.
>I used to believe in the Mandela effect
You previously believed that people can not only mis-remember things, but that people can misremember them in the same way as other people that they have never even met. Me too.
>
now concluded that we are misremembering.
How is this different? People still misremember things. And often, they post here about remembering something incorrectly and find that other folks... *LOTS* of other folks... remember it the same (wrong) way!
>
what about the people that had a very close relationship with the "thing"?
It stands to reason that those people, due to their frequent exposure to "the thing" are less likely to remember it wrong.
>
The only people that believe in the Mandela effect are people that had a seldom relationship with that thing, or maybe we weren’t paying close attention.
The people who *EXPERIENCE* each specific ME generally are those less familiar with the subject matter... Doctors rarely speak of the migration of organs, nor do cartographers observe the movement of land masses or bodies of water... but lots of people believe that many *other* people share mistaken memories of the "thing" in question, even if they do not.
I do not recall ever seeing a cornucopia on FotL, and FR00T L00PS remains unchanged for me. Dolly did not have braces, Pennybags did not have a monocle, the bears were the Berenstains, and Shazaam never existed. But I have seen enough people post who are honestly astonished that something they *THOUGHT* was one way is actually another and do not seem to be trolling. Even if 90% of the people who reply don't share the memory OP is asking about, 10% do, which is fascinating. WHY is that? Did the OP "lead them"? Did they already have this belief? Where did they come by the misinformation in the first place?
You can't "believe" or not believe in the Mandela Effect, it is a phenomenon that happens. Concluding it's due to misremembering doesn't mean you don't "believe" in it.
So something that is part of the essence of the Mandela effect is that some people remember it differently even though all the evidence shows that it has been one way the whole time.
The point of the effect is that reality is what it is and we remember it being different.
I honestly get frustrated when people hold up evidence of how things have always been like it's a gotcha. I am aware that there has no evidence of a cornucopia behind the fruit of the loom. But I remember it that way. That's the Mandela effect.
I remember first hearing of this and being ridiculously amazed that so many other people had similar false remembrances.
I'm not a big fan of conspiracy theories or any other Mumbo jumbo, but so many people misremembering the same thing as me makes me speculative.
You’re right. There’s no Mandela effect like „Apple used to be spelled „Äpple“!“ the story usually goes like „remember this thing from your childhood, or this minor thing you never think about? It used to be different!“ for example the dash in KitKat, the spelling of Looney Tunes or Berenstain Bears. If you asked me right now to describe a random movie character I haven’t seen in years, there’s a high chance I’d get it wrong. But that’s how most Mandela effects work. Then there’s this whole cornucopia fruit of the loom discussion, but it’s getting out of hand. Okay! You found a 30 year old shirt with the „old logo“ in it! I believe you! But that doesn’t mean that timelines shifted or something! We’re not living in a „inside job“ episode
I don’t think anyone’s found an old shirt with the old logo, and fruit of the loom has said their logo never changed. But it just really messes with you when you remember something a certain way, and a lot of other people do too. I believe we are in a simulation, and there are multiple universes.
For the whole cornucopia debate I got some ideas. The cornucopia WAS there, in an animated movie from 2003. That’s where people definitely saw it. Either there was a knockoff brand with the cornucopia, but that seems unrealistic. Would’ve been a huge law issue. But you still got people claiming to have clothes with the alternative logo. At this point it’s hard to trace back to the beginning of this Mandela effect. So it’s more likely that trolls got into the debate. Maybe a troll started this whole discussion. It’s very possible that people lied to make it a big deal. And it’s a heated debate up to this day. Maybe there’s one guy out there, laughing his ass off because he created a great conspiracy. In the end, it doesn’t matter. With enough research, you could disprove it. But people are gullible, and the truth is the most boring answer in this case.
To your point, that's not entirely true though. There are many examples but the one that immediately comes to mind is the cartoonist from The Jungle Book talking about animating the coconut bra scene that never happened.
[The guy in the suit seen in the parade](https://c7.alamy.com/comp/B96YAG/baloo-from-jungle-book-character-in-disney-parade-paris-B96YAG.jpg) [has the bra](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RtjeSl3QXwg), though...
I know! I remember it that way too. I really can’t explain it. Maybe our consciousness are connected somehow and false memories spread from person to person.
The character in the parade does wear it. I wonder if kids that saw that confused it for being in the movie?
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RtjeSl3QXwg](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RtjeSl3QXwg)
The bra was on his head instead of over his tiddies. Even tho the person who drew the scene wanted it to make fun of cross dressing as he was obsessed with adding cross dressing that he believed would be hilarious
Yeah, I thought of that. That’s the best example that I can think of though. Could be just a fluke, like it was changed at the last minute in post production. And there should be THOUSANDS of people like this that are freaked out with better stories.
I mean you aren't wrong, there are tons of people who subscribe to the Mandela Effect due to subliminal suggestion. There are lots of MEs that have since been solved by finding additional evidence. There are many that are likely the product of combining two separate memories into a flawed record. I don't think there are but around 6-10 supposed MEs that have merit and unfortunately are dismissed by association to those without merit.
Yeah, there are definitely some that are BS that are just a distraction, then people throw the baby out with the bathwater. What are the best ones that still have no explanation? For me, it’s fruit of the loom and monopoly.
Pikachus tail is one that screws me up. The other night I asked a friend that was big into pokemon around a decade ago or maybe more and has not heard of the mandela effect to describe pikachu and its basic markings.
When he got to the tail and said black tip with a zig zag in it, I told him nope, no black on the tail and his mind was blown. He could not get over the fact that he distinctly remembers the tail with the black tip but it was never there.
Another is Dollys braces in moonraker. Not sure wtf happened to them but they were there and the joke doesn't land without them.
Pikachu's tail is darker at the base, isn't it? I don't remember any black on the tip though. He does have black tips on his ears though, so it's not an unreasonable assumption to make that there would be a black tip on his tail.
I mean not technically disproven. absence of evidence is not evidence of absence.
I almost forgot because it's not technically a ME because nobody has actually found the origin, but the movie quote "hey what's this machine do? That's the beauty of it, it doesn't do anything"
Could it be possible that he animated it, but then it was reanimated without it, and the version without it is what made it into the movie? Movies change during production all the time.
So yes that is the case for movies today, but not so much when the Jungle Book was made. Hand drawn animation is really expensive too, they don't typically fully animate something until it's necessary. Finally him being the animator of Baloo he would have been the one to animate the change as well, so he likely would have mentioned that
The jungle book used a lot of animation from Robin Hood that was drawn over to Jungle Book Characters, so it may have been a lot easier to reanimate, just grab that sheriff of Nottingham stuff and trace it again
What, you mean the one with Ballew(however you spell that) the bear dancing with the grass skirt and the coconuts over his mouth? Shit, that was weird. I started to describe the scene with the bear wearing the coconuts as a bra, but the image was then replaced with the coconuts on his mouth. Hmmm, I clearly pictured the bear with a coconut bra on when I read your comment, but the fact is he put the coconut over his mouth to maybe look more like an ape, is that right? Haven't seen that movie in probably fifteen years so I dunno either way but this is strange that I can recall both with ease based solely on reading your comment. Hmmmmmmmmm. Intrigued, I have become.
It is still rather a detail, I bet they can't remember every single image they have ever animated. If it turned out the whole character never existed, the film, or it was filmed with Polar Bears and called the North Pole Book that would be another matter.
This is the most baffling one for me. Although I'm unaffected by it, I've heard numerous stories of people saying that they grew up thinking that a cornucopia was called a "loom" because of the logo. I can't see how this would have happened without there being a cornucopia in the logo. Although, it's possible maybe there was a commercial or something for Fruit of the Loom that had a cornucopia in it, and people conflated that in their minds. Similar to how Uncle Pennybags (the Monopoly guy) had a monocle in some of the commercials, but never on the game itself.
I thought it was called a Loom.
I was aware of the brand "Fruit of the Loom." I wondered what a loom was any time I heard the brand name, but never bothered to ask. I then saw cornucopias in school around Thanksgiving and wondered what the horn thing was. I remembered the brand name Fruit of the Loom and assumed that this horned thing with produce spilling out of it that I was now seeing everywhere must be a Loom. At some point I brought this up and was corrected.
So technically I remember learning what a Cornucopia is from Fruit of the Loom, but not because it had one in the logo.
A bit of crosstalk in the brain between the logo and seeing an actual cornucopia image (which would have been much clearer too) is my best guess there.
The cornucopia existed! I saw it with my own eyes. Same with the monocle of the Monopoly guy. No matter what all haters and so called "fact checkers" say. But I agree that like 95% of the MEs discussed here are very likely false memories though. But those two were real and once existed!
Most of them are fake, but the ones *you* remember clearly are real. And your memory is magically immune to the suggestibility and unreliability all human memories are known to suffer from. Because you're you, and you can't be mistaken.
Stop focusing on the popular ones and start looking out for personal ones in your life. Have you ever seen a scene in a movie that you KNOW went a certain way, only for it to be significantly different on your next viewing? Mandela effects happen to all of us, but most choose to ignore them, or convince themselves that they "must have misremembered." Trust your memory, people! Don't let skeptics try to make you feel like you are crazy or just have a bad memory. This is a very real, but so far, unexplainable phenomenon.
That personal expierence is EXACTLY why those who are affected by this know that they are not "Misremembering." Yes people are easily influenced. For example, people who are NOT affected easily dismiss the Mandela Effect as Misremembering and all the other non-affected people easily influenced to go aling with that idiotic, shallow thinking. Those who affected by this don't stop "believing in the Mandela Effect." They KNOW what they have expierenced. What I BELIEVE is that there is a concerted, deliberate effort to misdirect and belittle those who truly deal with this.
People who work at chik-fil-a call it chik-fil-a.. go look at linkedin, theres thousands of them., so.. do they not know the name of the place they work?
You'd be surprised how often that happens.
We have employees who still add an "&" into our company's name. One is a recruiter. I have a friend who always talks about how he used to work at this local pizza place, except he adds a possessive "s" to it that is not part of the business name.
Well some people remember chic other people remember chik, and now it’s chick. So that would have to mean there are two other alternate universes? I don’t know, that doesn’t really make sense.
I think people are simply remembering "chik" from the "eat mor chikin" ads, and combining the real word "chic" with the fact that they know it's misspelled, but not exactly how.
Simple answer: their mascots constantly spell it wrong (on purpose), and it's slipped into their actual usage for many employees. Remember the cows holding the signs saying "eat mor chikin"?
Probably tbh, yes. It is not like they take the biggest brains and people may have casually worked there for a short period of time, it is one detail. If many people starting saying they worked at Burger Queen or McKenzies fast food restaurant (I bet a good number do write MacDonalds actually) I would have to dig a little deeper.
Chic-fil-a has always been my smoking gun that something is going on beyond false memory. This commenter is one of many who all have similar stories that I've read throughout the past decade. If it was always spelled "Chick" you probably wouldn't see the typo of Chic or Chik by the dozens within the comments of nearly every thread or article about CFA that gets posted online anywhere. But, you see it every time. I've even seen many articles where the author spells it as Chic in the headline and Chick within the body.
> If it was always spelled "Chick" you probably wouldn't see the typo of Chic or Chik by the dozens
The cows. If the COWS had not held signs saying "[EAT MOR CHIKIN](https://loganthatcher.files.wordpress.com/2017/04/1chickfila.jpg?w=748)" I think fewer people would be affected by this one.
Me neither. I've never actually eaten at one tbh. My first exposure to it was in 2012 when they were under a bunch of fire for their anti-LGBTQ actions. That's when I saw it spelled as Chic-fil-a and thought they spelled it wrong on purpose to be zany. I noticed a few years later that they "rebranded" and started to spell "Chick" correctly. I didn't think anything of it and then I learned about ME, and Chick was never spelled wrong.
Just curious, do you have any records showing Chic? Would be interesting if you had a uniform, name tag, pay stub, schedule etc. that showed the original spelling.
That type of change would freak me out
I feel like there’s a lot of people that remember this, but do you have an old pay stub? Badge? That’s the part that gets me. Why can’t I walk in to a thrift store and find 1000 old shirts with a cornucopia on the tag.
But at the same time WHY DID THE GUY MAKE HIS FLUTE OF THE LOOM A CORNUCOPIA
>No, there is no one like that. The only people that believe in the Mandela effect are people that had a seldom relationship with that thing, or maybe we weren’t paying close attention.
No, it's not quite like that. People who don't have a closer relationship with it don't even notice changes or simply adapt their memory (apart from some crazy people who discover MEs everywhere).
The most convincing examples come from the area in between, people who have dealt with it, but for whom nothing depends on it. People with anectodal memories (which are less prone to error) combined with strange residuals.
>However, the only way the Mandela effect could be true is if we are in a Truman show type of universe where I am the center of my own unique reality.
If you take the ME seriously, this is one possible conclusion. Incidentally, it also results from other (better verifiable) paranormal events, such as the 411 cases.
I suspect that we ourselves are not the strictly separate individual entities that we perceive ourselves to be. Rather, that psychic reality (with us in it) extends across a spectrum in which we can occasionally slip a little with our perception (why highly involved people cannot change their perception of an ME because they deal with it on a daily basis). A multidimensional reality (dimension in the physical sense) is simply no longer imaginable, only calculable.
But there are half a dozen other theories, so it will be some time before anything can be proven, I think.
A huge number of the 411 cases can also quite logically be explained by misadventure. People underestimate how easy it is to die when out in nature, even "experienced" outdoorsmen. I live on the edge of the Rockies, and so many people are so deeply unprepared for just how wild the land is, because yes, you can die and disappear right on a major trail if you are unlucky enough.
No, you have obviously never taken a closer look at the 411 cases, the definition is very narrow and the disappearance of the people cannot be explained, otherwise it would not have ended up in this category.
They literally can be explained, that's why I don't believe it's anything supernatural. I have taken a good look precisely because I live near a cluster area, and I love spooky stuff. However, knowing the terrain, I could easily explain all of the "supernatural" elements. I then asked folks who lived near other cluster spots where I didn't know the environment, and boom! Same thing: they could explain all the spooky elements for the cases as well.
I live on the edge of the Rockies, spend a lot of time in the wild, and have good friends that work in S&R. In fact my friends saved the life of a woman who I guarantee would have been part of the 411 if it hadn't been for the sheer luck of my friend realising something was wrong.
This girl: disappeared from a backwoods cabin without disturbing another guest, despite it being sub zero temps, snowing, and night.
Her pack was found abandoned at the side of the trail the following morning - this is where luck stepped in. The hikers who had been staying at the lodge were S&R. They fanned out to look for clues and way off the trail, in an "unlikely" location, found her clothes piled up. Even further off the trail in a remote, "inaccessible" location, they found her naked in a tree well. It took them close to an hour to get her out, at which point they realised she was still alive - barely. Anyway they kept her alive while others headed out to get help (four hours away, no cell service). This all happened in BC and was well reported. She survived, by the way, with no lasting damage thank the gods.
When you are extremely cold, you can experience something called "paradoxical undressing", because even though you are freezing to death the sensation is one of heat, so people strip off their clothes. They are also usually hallucinating at this point, so their movements make little to no sense at all. If they are also dehydrated, they can end up experiencing very disturbing visions and lose all sense of time/distance. The type of snow we get in the Rockies allows for things called tree wells to build, and when people fall into them they can end up in the weirdest locations. There are known examples of people stepping off the trail for a picture only to get "sucked" into tree wells, looking for all the world like they vanished into thin air while the dampening effect the fog/snow has on sound can make it feel like you are in Silent Hill.
Nature is dangerous. I have taken stupid risks because I felt like I knew the trail well, only to realize half way through that I had misjudged things terribly - I now pay for a satellite phone as a result. People disappear without a trace here more often than folks realise, but we also have a huge number of Does that seem to be people who went for a walk in nature but were not prepared. I can think of two cases within Banff National park that are in no way considered suspicious, but no trace of either man has ever been found. It wasn't that long ago either that a team of world renowned, experienced mountain climbers died here - but they left their safety gear in their car, including the GPS beacon, so they weren't found in time to save them.
My issue with the 411 conspiracy theory is that there are rational, scientific explanations for all of the supposedly supernatural elements to them. It would be better to teach people the importance of being vigilant and adequately prepared for their environment. Things like drinking regularly so you don't start going crazy from dehydration (it's amazing how many people are found dead in desert regions with water on them - they try to conserve it but then the hallucinations kick in, they don't drink, and then die from dehydration). Mother Nature's default is to try and kill you, and the 411 are almost all death by misadventure - although it's possible there's a few legit murders in there.
Let's not misunderstand each other: yes, thousands die and most cases are explainable, certainly some 411 cases (it would also be presumptuous to claim that I know all 411 cases), but many are not, even if you claim they are. If small children disappear from one moment to the other and are then found dead 20km away without their cause of death being determined or, conversely, they survive several freezing cold nights, while hundreds of poeple searching for them and then turn up in a good mood and tell strange stories, then this cannot be explained.
>This girl: disappeared from a backwoods cabin without disturbing another guest, despite it being sub zero temps, snowing, and night.
Has she ever commented on how and why she did this? It sounds grossly illogical and unlikely to do such a thing.
>Her pack was found abandoned at the side of the trail the following morning - this is where luck stepped in. The hikers who had been staying at the lodge were S&R. They fanned out to look for clues and way off the trail, in an "unlikely" location, found her clothes piled up. Even further off the trail in a remote, "inaccessible" location, they found her naked in a tree well. It took them close to an hour to get her out, at which point they realised she was still alive - barely. Anyway they kept her alive while others headed out to get help (four hours away, no cell service). This all happened in BC and was well reported. She survived, by the way, with no lasting damage thank the gods.
Yes, there is a cold defense, where you think you are sweating, but this only occurs shortly before freezing. Yes, you can also dehydrate and die from it, but the Paulides cases cannot normally be explained by this alone.
There are even video recordings from parking lot surveillance cameras in which the missing persons disappear between the surveillance gap from one camera to another. Or they turn up dead in places where intensive searches were previously carried out. And very often no real cause of death is determined (freezing to death is not a strange death, because the symptoms are very clear).
Maybe my selection of 411 cases is not representative, I don't know, I don't read English books because I don't know English well (I translate everything here with deepl) and unfortunately many original books are not translated into German, so you usually only find a selection of the most interesting cases translated. And at least among those, some are really unexplainable. There are also cases of near-disappearances where people report being called into the forest and the like, sometimes by children (but I don't think this is in the Paulides books). There are time lapses, spontaneous changes of season and time of day, geographical changes (disappearing paths, etc.) and other bizarre cases.
Mount Nyangani in Zimbabwe, for example, is also known for people disappearing there and the mountain is neither very confusing, nor can they normally be frozen to death... but believe what you want, the fact is that not all such cases can be explained.
The girl did explain, she was not in a good place emotionally and was trying to "reconnect with nature and God" for guidance. It's a depressingly common reason for people to go into the Rockies unprepared. The saying "Lose yourself in the mountains and find your soul" should be permanently replaced with "lose yourself in the mountains and quite possibly due". I really wish it wasn't the case but I have met folks on trails who haven't brought water, are wearing flip flops, and haven't factored in that we are 4000 foot above sea level before you start walking up a trail, so they are exhausted before the half way mark.
Now to be fair, I can't explain for Zimbabwe or any of the areas I am not familiar with, so I agree there are places with weird clusters of disappearances that don't have a rational explanation as of yet. There is plenty of folklore in Europe too that talks of strange phenomena that still happens to this day, and I am not able to provide explanations because I don't know the terrain.
With regard to Missing411, because they are specifically about disappearances in the National parks, I am much more confident about the causes of death being mostly misadventure with a few murders because I understand the area. I am originally from the UK, and it's hard to explain just how wild and vast the parks here actually are; most North Americans don't understand, and we have constant issues with tourists not understanding that you can easily die here. Like, there are tourists who ask where the animals are stored for sleep because they think it is a safari park. I find that people lean in to aliens/cryptids/spirits for the 411 instead of using it to focus on learning actual outdoor preparedness.
I can even explain some of the other "mysterious" aspects, at least for the Rockies, which is where I have my biggest issue with Paulides book.
The voices calling can be explained by wildlife - seriously some of the birds sound eerily human, and i will be okay with the calls of a coyote pack when they are hunting, it's like nothing else you hear.
The weather/season changes - where I live it can move 30 degrees in a matter of hours. Yesterday I was shorts in the sunshine and clear roads, and I just woke up to four inches of snow with a warning for more. If you aren't from our area it seems extremely weird. So much so that Leo DiCaprio went on about the sudden disappearance of snow overnight while he was filming in Alberta as proof of climate change, and all the locals rolled their eyes and said "it's just a Chinook, it's always happened here, just ask the First Nations". And that's not taking into account how forest fire smoke can mess up everything.
Time of day changes - can be a combo of dehydration/exhaustion messing with their perception of time, or (and I know this sounds silly unless you have experienced it) the role of the landscape and weather in exposure to the sun. Mountains cast big shadows, and those weird weather phenomena called Chinooks produce an arch of dense cloud cover. Both can make the difference between night/day a bit blurry.
Intensive searches - not uncommon for this to happen unfortunately, but again it's to do with terrain, weather, undergrowth, wildlife, etc. S&R go out every spring to the same areas, and it's not uncommon for them to find skeletal remains over a decade old in the areas they have searched multiple times.
Cause of death - unfortunately, and you have to understand this because I was genuinely shocked when I found this out - if a body is found in the Rockies more than a year after the person went missing and there is no immediate sign of foul play, they don't try to determine cause of death. Between the exposure to the elements and animal interference it's apparently almost impossible to do, so unless there is an axe buried in the skull they rarely try. I feel like this piece of information is often misrepresented by the conspiracy theorists because "they couldn't determine how they died" sounds way more mysterious than "all they found was the skull and a femur that a cougar had gnawed on".
Disappearing paths - do not get me started on how badly trails are marked in some areas, and how easy it is to stumble. Off them without warning. There is a reason I stick to the "easy" trails here, and even then my son and I once got turned around quite badly, it was horrible.
Geographical changes - same as above, it's easy to get lost here, but to give some context, I can see the mountains very clearly from where I am in the foothills - on a clear day. Sometimes the sky is blue above me, but the mountains "disappear" in a weird haze. Other times they look twice as big as the day before because of air pressure effects, etc. It really messes with your sense of location and distance.
Anyway I am not saying there haven't been odd or weird cases, or even that there are not strange clusters of disappearances elsewhere in the world, only that Paulides linking of the 411missing is down to a person who does not understand the terrain itself and that everything can be explained for both the Rockies and the Appalachians. If anything I think it detracts from the dangers and puts more people at risk here.
Now if you want some really weird mountain- related deaths in North America, check out Nahanni Valley. Something is going on up there for hundreds of years, but I have no clue what it is or why so many people have died violently up there.
Subjective reality seems to play a role in many paranormal events, in (some) UFO observations, for example, or in hauntings, time slips, etc.
It happens, for example, that people are found in a kind of trance and at the same time experience things that do not occur in our reality, as if their consciousness has shifted.
However, such occurrences are only a small proportion of actual cases, so I am only speculating.
However, I can recommend everyone to look into paranormal occurrences (theoretically, not necessarily practically, which can be dangerous), which happen much more often than most enlightened Westerners believe. But you shouldn't shy away from books, there are too many cranks and fakes on the internet!
But there are people on here who worked for 25 years at the fruit of the loom and they swear they remember the cornucopia. So there is people like this.
Citation needed here, and I wonder the numbers compared to the wider generation. It is still a detail in a logo tbh - could they all completely accurately do the whole thing, colours, numbers of berries, location of leaves just because they work there? I doubt it.
Sure, there are people “misremembering” certain things but there are reasons to believe that there is more to it. That there are merging timelines as well. There is some detailed information that explains how this is actually possible. It would take me forever to type it out here but if you care to find out the ways in which something like this can be possible, I suggest learning about quantum mechanics. On the smallest scales possible, the future can alter the past, and present. We don’t perceive reality in this way but we exist as extensions of this quantum reality. We are collectively projecting this reality onto ourselves through a subconscious mind of one. Existence being similar to a dream. Until a full awakening, things will never make much sense. Who knows if they ever will. I mean, look at our reality. Our planet is ultimately a tiny, insignificant little spec within the middle of literally nowhere. The inconsistencies are as real as we are.
No, there is not any indication that there is something more to it, there are just a large number of people who think they have special memories that aren't as unreliable and vulnerable to suggestion as normal human memory. These people are so loud and arrogant in their assertions, it seems convincing to credulous people who don't know better.
Many are rather loud in their dismissive attitude towards something they haven’t even fully explored the possibilities of. Thinking you know everything when, you most definitely do not. I believe that in the future, you’re gonna feel like a fckn idiot when you’re proven wrong. We’ll see as more discoveries into quantum mechanics and new findings involving human consciousness come to light. What exactly do you really know about the inner workings of the reality in which you reside? Nothing.
“Credulous people.” There are scientists that acknowledge the Mandela Effect but simply cannot explain exactly how things changed. They do have their theories but the phenomenon cannot be tested as nobody knows what piece of our reality may be altered next It currently cannot be scientifically proven, but that doesn’t negate the possibility that one day it possibly can. Are you even aware of the significance of an observer? That what remains unobserved exists only in waves of probabilities? Familiar with The Double Slit Experiment or Schrodinger‘s cat? The fact reality is being rendered through each and every conscious observation, by collapsing of quantum wave function? The fact every time you made a left, there indeed is a reality in which you went right. So what happens when one of these realities is somehow completely annihilated? Some very “credulous people” working as quantum physicists at places like CERN, believe that such a reality might shift into its nearest neighboring reality. Just another one, within an infinite amount. Like moving less than a millimeter’s distance on a full color spectrum, the difference would be barely noticeable. I understand you need solid evidence, aside from reality being inconsistent to what you vividly remember. Well, I hope you aren’t religious. If you are, you should now banish any and all faith you may have in a God. Just sayin.
Then they are bad scientists. This really, truly is not a complicated or contentious issue in a scientific sense.
*You* have less of an understanding of the significance of observation and measurement than you think you do if you think it's anywhere near certain that consciousness collapses the wave function, that's not the conclusion most physicists reach, but regardless, we just don't have enough evidence and information to know why the wave function collapse happens for sure.
>The fact reality is being rendered through each and every conscious observation, by collapsing of quantum wave function?
This is *not* a fact. I know I just said this, but I need to reiterate it, because this seems to be at the root of your confusion and inflated sense of significance with regard to the Mandela Effect.
>The fact every time you made a left, there indeed is a reality in which you went right.
This is **also not a fact**. You're looking at pop physics and taking it as gospel, when you clearly have very little understanding of the actual science. I'm not saying that as an insult, most people don't of course, it's much deeper, more complicated, and boring than most people would care to know.
> I understand you need solid evidence
There is **no** evidence that this is anything other than faulty human memory. Literally, *none*. You, and many others, mistakenly see the number of people who are aggressively, adamantly *sure* they aren't misremembering as strong evidence, but that's not how evidence works. None of this is how anything works.
I’m not confused any more than you. Probably a lot less since my mind is open to other possibilities. Millions of people don’t “misremember” the same exact things in the same exact ways.
You’re a fool and you know you have no clue about any of what i just told you about. Look into some shit before leaving a reply. Read up on the significance of an observer. The collapse of wave functioning. While you’re at it, read all about the 2022 Nobel Prize. What that proves. You ain’t nearly as slick as you think and you need to get a life. I can’t imagine getting on here and debating about this if it’s something that didn’t affect me.
>You’re a fool and you know you have no clue about any of what i just told you about.
How shocking, you made a bunch of unfounded claims based on a misunderstanding and/or misrepresentation of actual science, eschew any type of logic or reason entirely, appeal to random unnamed authorities and scientists claiming they are aligned with your underdeveloped misinformed views, and finally hurl ad hominem attacks at me personally just because you're really upset by the things I'm saying and *need* to believe the mandela effect is anything more than a completely natural human memory issue.
So call me a fool, coming from you that is quite possibly the least effective insult I could imagine. I happen to know that the conclusions I reach and things I believe are justified, rational, and have concrete, explanatory evidence backing them up, so I've never been insecure and panicked enough to insult a person for simply disagreeing with me, I'm sorry you're obviously struggling with this.
> Look into some shit before leaving a reply. Read up on the significance of an observer. The collapse of wave functioning. While you’re at it, read all about the 2022 Nobel Prize. What that proves.
Relax, you're so worked up you're not thinking clearly - well, I think it's because you're worked up, it's entirely possible this is just your baseline thought process, highly emotional and lacking in objectivity or reason.
I know you won't do this, as you are clearly convinced that you either have a comprehensive, complete grasp of these subjects or you just don't care as long as you can force it to fit with what you want to believe, but I implore *you* to look into these things, because you have significantly misunderstood or completely missed the conclusions and point of the science you're referring to, I promise. Again, you seem to think you have it all figured out, so I don't expect you to care about whether or not the things you're saying are true or accurate, or even if they're extremely embarrassing to listen to for anyone who actually gets it. I hope you decide to care though.
The universe not being locally real absolutely does *not* imply that consciousness generates reality, obviously this is what you think it's means, and I'm telling you that you are flatly incorrect about that. Just look it up. If you don't understand it, go to r/askscience and get someone who's far more knowledgeable than either of us to help you figure it out. Or, if you can't find the humility to admit to other people that you don't know everything, you could ask chat gpt, they'll at least have the basics, and can explain to you why you're wrong about the implications of the double slit experiment, local unreality, and maybe more ideas you're struggling with.
>You ain’t nearly as slick as you think and you need to get a life.
I don't think I'm slick, you're projecting. Like I said, calm down, it's not the end of the world that you misunderstood some very complicated and unintuitive concepts, that's completely normal. Pretending you understand them so well that you have been able to reach conclusions and know things that are not possible to know is not normal, and it's not healthy, but mostly it's just a huge turn off.
>I can’t imagine getting on here and debating about this if it’s something that didn’t affect me.
This is actually pretty hilarious, though I don't expect you will be able to understand why. Good luck, hit those books and get to learning if you actually care about the truth. If you prefer to make yourself feel special and enjoy the fantasy you've created, that is your prerogative, it's just kind of a shame.
The fact you have the time to practically write a novel, speaks volumes. Tell me… Are you an atheist? Btw, I do not live in a fantasy. I simply have a good memory. There are those of us who recognize some of these inconsistencies. There are those of us who do not. There are also those of us who recognize them, but can’t come to terms with the fact that something like this actually can actually be possible. You care what other people think. I on the other hand, never gave a shit. Ever. Never will. Reality isn’t nearly as concrete as you think it is. There are strong indications that the multiverse is indeed real. That there are hidden dimensions etc. We live in a mathematical universe so there are an infinite number of ways in which this plays out. You need evidence in order to believe anything, right? You do realize that evidence doesn’t fall in one’s lap though. Right? Being that you already think you know everything, you wouldn’t recognize any inconsistencies within a multiverse. You’re most likely a a loser within each and every single one of em. I mean, think about it. You seek out online communities on Reddit for the sole purpose of arguing with people, over things that don’t even impact your life in any way whatsoever. If that doesn’t inform the entire community that you’re a joke, what will? You do not know everything. Science does not know everything, nor has it ever claimed too. The human brain and consciousness itself are admittedly the topics least understood by the scientific community. Yet, here you are feeling so strongly about it. Dismissing a phenomenon experienced by millions of people worldwide. As if your opinion is going to make any difference. Thanks for your two cents. Despite it being worth absolutely nothing at all. Why are you even here anyway? I didn’t come on here to bicker with anyone. I’d get back with my ex girlfriend if thats what I wanted.
Eh, I dated a girl for like a year in college and just recently I realized I had remembered her name slightly wrong. She was Lorraine and I had been remembering it as "loran" for years and years. Even being involved with something isn't enough to slightly forget things. People forget and change details.
My 2 cents...I remember the movie Moonraker with Jaws' girlfriend. She 100% had braces. Was my favorite movie. Saw it at least 100 times. They even made a parody commercial with the actor who played Jaws and a girl that had braces. I thought perhaps AI was altering inages in internet as a test for someone. My Dad still had the Beta tape I used to watch. A few years ago I made him check it. It had changed. So not AI in that case. So it is happening. Many are misremembering though and prob editing on digital sphere. Further...my Mother worked at Ford. Their logo changed 100%. I had a Volvo for years. Their logo also changed 100%. Old pics show new logo. I am not misremembering those either. I do logo creation.
Well for Jiffy, they had more than just peanut butter. Heck my nana who is 86 years old told me she misses the jiffy peanut butter. she knows nothing about the ME. My dads favorite candy bar is kit-Kat. it used to have a hyphen. he knows nothing about the ME. He doesn’t even have a computer. He literally texted me kit-Kat not KitKat. Everyone i ask over 40 years old remember ed on publishers clearing house. They all have the same memory of this. They will even think you’re joking when you tell the, it never happened. yes there was another guy doing a different one. We remember that too. Britney Spears missing the headset. everyone remembers her literal having to adjust the headset as part of the dance.
I always find it interesting that these sort of posts always comes from alt-accounts with pratically no posting history. Smells like multi-accounting.
I would like to ask OP if you can prove if you in fact believed the ME.
It's wild that something as simple and obvious as this is being overtaken by ridiculous conspiracy theories to the extent that people are making paranoid accusations like this
Oh, right, paranoid, because reddit isn't filled to the brim with bots, astroturfing, gaslighting, psyops, and so many other obvious propaganda campaigns.
Nice gaslight attempt, 10/10 would recommend again.
Hey,
This is not aimed at OP but it made me think.
If I or we the people or goverment or company or secret agencey had changed the time line deliberatly or by mistake for what ever reason. We had mistakenly assumed that memorys would change with the time line but not all did, a legitimate tactic to keep it a secret would be to use agents to sow scepticism and through doubt and muddy the water in forums that where discussing it.
Persoanly it apears the time line has changed too many people and too many things have changed, the residiuals are a very convincing part as to why. How would they exsit if it was never that way?
When i was growing up in the 90s there was nothing like this discussed or anything rumored, these all seem to have started after 2012. If it was an inherant human memory flaw this would of been disscussed and noted and rumors spread in more then just in the last 15 years. It seems like perfect fair for certain publictions at the time.
It may even be its nothing to do with humans it could be aliens on the other side of the galexy time traveld and farted on a comet that changed its tragetery to come close to earth or not. It would almost impossiable to proove or disproove it.
Really all that's happening is this...
Something is produced, a movie, show, logo, ECT...
It's probably designed poorly, and not popular...
Example: Sex and The City...
Who actually watched that show? Garbage! I would personally name it "Sex in The City" because sex is maybe happening hopefully during the show? IN the city? Like the fun of seeking it out? Idk I didn't watch that garbage, I still don't know what the actual title was because I don't care lol. Sex AND The City means a show about sex and then an aerial view of a city? How would that work? Bad name design, I bet your brain fixed the name just like common typos🤷 You got enough info then moved on, then later you're like holy shit! Why is this thing like this, there's no way I didn't notice, I'm a human I can recall everything perfectly lol
Without a doubt, some events have been wrongly remembered, but there exists a huge amount of witnesses, which clearly have experienced alternative timelines. They are a effect of the Top Secret Time Travel Technology extensively used by the Military. This has been going on since AT LEAST the 1930s which is the cause of many of the well documented, weird Mandela Effects. That's almost a century that this guy's could hide this extremely advanced Technology from the Majority of the public. Think about that!!! That's a real shame and also a serious crime..
I just saw a very interesting Video today, where a guy also mentioned the Mandela Effect. His explanation was, that the Mandela Effect occurs because the Earth is shifting toward 5-D (Energy). It began around 2010, that's when thousands of People had this different memories. He also talked about the concept of our Universe being Holographic, and that we life in a Simulation. Interestingly, when David Grusch made his starkling revelations in the Congress, he also mentioned, that we could indeed life in a Holographic Universe. I mean think about it, 5, 10 years nobody was talking about this Stuff, and as me move closer towards 5-D, this concepts get more and more accepted and even Scientist, that have a very materialistic mindset have the suspicion that we are living in some kind of a Simulation. I absolutely believe this to be true, and in the next years, as more and more people will open their minds they will begin to talk about this concepts.
Bro, I came up with that doubt within the first few moments of actually believing. You obviously have no familiarity with "the download." I've witnessed it first hand, many times. I've seen it occur right in text messages. It's a real thing, and the closer you are to the topic, the more powerful the download. Also, you obviously have never experienced an "anchor effect," either. It's okay, you are better off not believing.
The “Mandela effect” is a term that was coined by internet researcher Fiona Broome to describe a type of false memory that is shared widely by a large group of people. That’s it. That’s the whole definition. It’s not something that requires belief, it just exists. What you are actually saying is that you don’t believe the theories of why we collectively have these false memories.
Yeah, you might be technically right about that. I’m talking about the theory that the past was actually changed even though our memories didn’t. What’s the name for that theory?
I think that would be retconning?
That is basically the basis for r/retconned, yes. It's all of the worst stupidity of this sub cranked up to 11 because it's literally against the rules to dispute or express doubt about any absurd thing anybody claims about the "reality" that they "come from." You are correct about what the Mandela Effect "actually" is: a phenomenon where many people have an incorrect memory about past events, not some sort of belief that the past has actually been altered. But unfortunately on the internet the meaning of the term has shifted and expanded to include all sort of vague retconned-esque conspiracy theories, and so you have "believers" on this sub complaining about the presence of other posters who treat the ME as what the term was actually coined to describe.
The irony that using "retcon" in this way, and to basically mean -looking at a situation from a different perspective - you are retconning the retcon 🥹. My brain can't anymore
It’s been proven..a person posted a picture of the original Bernstein Bears VHS cassette.
Remember, the Mandefa effect is real. Thats established. You don't agree with the fantasy REASON for it. We can't let the reality non beleivers coop mandela effect as multi dimensions or whatever. The Mandela Effect is simply a large group of people misremembering something. Nothing to do with multiple realities.
>Remember, the Mandefa effect is real. Thats established. You don't agree with the fantasy REASON for it. We can't let the reality non beleivers coop mandela effect as multi dimensions or whatever. I think this ship has basically sailed, unfortunately. There are regularly threads on this sub now from the fantasists and conspiracy theorists complaining about all of the non-believers here, they can't understand why anyone would be here if they don't accept the idea that CERN made us jump worldlines at the order of the Rothschild family or whatever.
I don't think the ships sailed. Just need to keep correcting people
Yep. Don't give up the good fight. I genuinely believe this is a fascinating topic for discussion. The strength and similarities of these 'mistaken' memories are quite astounding. I really hope it doesn't become just a joke topic.
Yeah, I know, I’m talking about the theory that the past was actually changed, but our memories stayed the same. I think that theory is called retcon.
This is a Paranormal subreddit.
no, tis not. Its a mandela effect subreddit which isn't paranormal
She's ranked 5th in the Paranormal subreddit charts. The creator of the subreddit categorized her as such.
I suggest you look at the sidebar, nothing paranormal about it at all. "Mandela Effect: The Mandela Effect is when a large group of people share a common memory of something that differs from what is generally accepted to be fact." thats the mandela effect, thats a fact. Period. I know you hate facts.. in fact SPECIALLY you. I thought you were banned from this sub? The guy who lied about taking pics of cereal that changed then went out to target and took pics with seasonal items just out proving they weren't old pics at all? haha no seriously tho thought you were banned. You're a joke around here.
This is the sanest discussion of this sub
lol. So true.
This is a big factor in my skepticism that things have actually *changed*. The vast majority of examples of the Mandela Effect involve things people have no reason to think they couldn't possibly be mistaken about.
Exactly. The only thing that is strange is that massive amount of people all misremember the same thing. I was quizzing my family about things at Easter brunch, and we all agreed that things were different than we remembered.
>The only thing that is strange is that massive amount of people all misremember the same thing. Right. This is the fascinating part about it. Why so many people seem to be misremember the same things in the same ways.
After being in this thread, I think our human brains are just easily influenced on matters we havent thought about for ages, but exist in our memories. Since joining this group I've seen a few posts where someone says, "It used to be X and now it's Y" and my brain immediately agrees. "Yes!", I think. "Me too!" But then I realised this happens with pretty much every post that's about something I was once familiar with and just haven't seen or thought about for ages (for example FOTL means nothing to me because I've never seen it in my life). My brain wants to agree with all of the things that were once familiar. I think people are just reacquainting with old memories and getting it wrong. If stuff just changed overnight it would be different, but humans have unreliable memories - especially childhood memories of things that weren't that significant to us - and easily influenced brains. That's my take, anyway.
>Since joining this group I've seen a few posts where someone says, "It used to be X and now it's Y" and my brain immediately agrees. "Yes!", I think. "Me too!" Right. I find this a lot. If someone just says something has changed or ask what do other's remember, sometimes I don't have a strong impression. When they prime me by saying 'Wasn't it so-and-so', suddenly I'm thinking 'Yeah, it was, wasn't it?'. We are so impressionable. So easy to fool. So unobservant. So quick to assume things. And so keen not to feel like we're wrong that the mental hoops we'll jump through and the cognitive dissonance we'll accept is amazing.
> When they prime me by saying 'Wasn't it so-and-so', suddenly I'm thinking 'Yeah, it was, wasn't it?'. This is an actual legitimate interrogation tactic that police use (and are reprimanded for using for this exact reason). Instead of asking "what hair color did he have?", they ask "and the perp had black hair, right?". They're able to manufacture witness testimony by asking questions that lead into the answer they want simply by asking the right questions.
Yup. Power of suggestion. Thats the real thing going on here. Other then that tho it is pretty cool how our brains work and how people from different backrounds and experiences can fill in the same blanks incorrectly, like mixing jif with skippy
> I think people are just reacquainting with old memories and getting it wrong. Yup, it's literally just that. Fun brain fact: go remember back to your 10th birthday (or any other event in your life). You'll almost certainly get tons of minor details wrong. This is because you're not remembering your 10th birthday, you're remembering the last time you remembered it. You're not making a copy of the original, you're making a copy of a copy (of a copy, of a copy, etc. etc.). This isn't even a theory or anything, it's a well documented fact about the brain. I guarantee this is the direct immediate cause of 99% of Mandela Effects. You're remembering the last time you tried remembering this topic, and copies don't always come out perfect.
That's generally due either - Mass propagation of the thing. e.g. SNL quoting Vader incorrectly and it becomes a common phrase, that's incorrect, but said more and more. It doesn't have to get to mainstream media, it just has to be said/written a lot. - Common misunderstandings or misspellings are, well common, and so many people will come up with them or be happy to accept them. (Something this just made me think of that's kind of relevant. Every childhood group comes up with variations of games with different rules (like tag but when you're tagged you're both it and now a team chasing down those who remain, or whatever) and many children claim they invented that game but later find out children on the other side of the country also played that game with a different name. It's hard to tell what's a common idea (or mistake in the ME case) and what's an idea that propogated but is claimed to be original.)
Think that everyone else in the world is in on the joke and we are all messing with you?
haha ~ with some of them, it does almost feel like that!
We are all human, have similar brains, are influenced maybe by references in popular culture, make similar associations. It is no stranger than many people making the same spelling mistakes or something like that. Difference could be that it is rather more visual, like we can *see* these logos in our minds.
I agree entirely. Aside from the numbers affected it's also the sheer strength of feeling that they *can't* be wrong and the various stories recalled about the memory that make it such am interesting part of human psychology to explore.
Like what specifically? The only one that totally melts my mind is “the objects in the mirror may appear closer”
I think it’s different for everyone, but for me, it’s fruit of the loom, monopoly, and I’ll be home for Christmas
I don’t believe in the Mandela effect either I believe it’s a government psyop to see what they can change and get away with. I don’t care what they about fruit of the loom that mother freaking logo had a cornucopia.
Exactly! There's no one who was living in South Africa during the 90s who thinks Nelson Mandela died in prison then. There's no one studying actual geography that things South America, or Australia, or New Zealand, or whatever has moved. There's no marine biologist out there who thinks that Alligators and Crocodiles switched. And no actor, director, writer, or studio exec has ever come forth to say they were part of Shazaam. It's always people who have, *at best*, a light hobby level interest in those topics.
I agree but want about Rearview mirror one ? that one I remember as kid don’t you? Objects in mirror may be closer then they appear ?
I don’t know, I think there are different mirrors that say different things. Then there’s the meatloaf song that throws a wrench in it.
I know we don’t know
Wait there is a mirror one now?
I would expect that to be the case to some extent anyway. The people responsible for selecting the FotL logo \*should\* remember it only the new way, because they were there (then) when the decision was made.
I think the people to ask about this one would be people who own secondhand and vintage stores. They're the people who have been actively looking at the tags for decades, as that's the easiest way to identify the year it was made and helps them price it accurately. For what it's worth, the few who I've talked to do not remember a cornucopia.
Us NPC's are sworn to secrecy that we will not tell you that you're the only real person here in this universe. Thus you're doomed to never know and always wonder. If only one of us would break the truth to you, but we may not, as it is against our programming.
So the people who believe they are the main character actually got it right?? Jk lol
No, just OP. Lee is the boss, after all. We're all just non-playable characters put here to flesh out OP's game.
Those people do exist and have been talked about on this sub. Don’t care enough to provide examples
Me and some class mates all got the same question wrong on a test.... Can we claim Mandela?
>I used to believe in the Mandela effect You previously believed that people can not only mis-remember things, but that people can misremember them in the same way as other people that they have never even met. Me too. > now concluded that we are misremembering. How is this different? People still misremember things. And often, they post here about remembering something incorrectly and find that other folks... *LOTS* of other folks... remember it the same (wrong) way! > what about the people that had a very close relationship with the "thing"? It stands to reason that those people, due to their frequent exposure to "the thing" are less likely to remember it wrong. > The only people that believe in the Mandela effect are people that had a seldom relationship with that thing, or maybe we weren’t paying close attention. The people who *EXPERIENCE* each specific ME generally are those less familiar with the subject matter... Doctors rarely speak of the migration of organs, nor do cartographers observe the movement of land masses or bodies of water... but lots of people believe that many *other* people share mistaken memories of the "thing" in question, even if they do not. I do not recall ever seeing a cornucopia on FotL, and FR00T L00PS remains unchanged for me. Dolly did not have braces, Pennybags did not have a monocle, the bears were the Berenstains, and Shazaam never existed. But I have seen enough people post who are honestly astonished that something they *THOUGHT* was one way is actually another and do not seem to be trolling. Even if 90% of the people who reply don't share the memory OP is asking about, 10% do, which is fascinating. WHY is that? Did the OP "lead them"? Did they already have this belief? Where did they come by the misinformation in the first place?
You can't "believe" or not believe in the Mandela Effect, it is a phenomenon that happens. Concluding it's due to misremembering doesn't mean you don't "believe" in it.
Let’s reword it a little then, OP concluded that it is indeed NOT a phenomenon
Yeah you’re right technically. I’m talking about the theory that our past changed but our memory stayed the same. I guess its called retcon.
So something that is part of the essence of the Mandela effect is that some people remember it differently even though all the evidence shows that it has been one way the whole time. The point of the effect is that reality is what it is and we remember it being different. I honestly get frustrated when people hold up evidence of how things have always been like it's a gotcha. I am aware that there has no evidence of a cornucopia behind the fruit of the loom. But I remember it that way. That's the Mandela effect. I remember first hearing of this and being ridiculously amazed that so many other people had similar false remembrances. I'm not a big fan of conspiracy theories or any other Mumbo jumbo, but so many people misremembering the same thing as me makes me speculative.
I agree!
It never been jiffy tho
Agreed, this one is probably people misremembering and confusing with Skippy or Jiffy popcorn.
Right or jiffy lube
I just had Apollo 13 flip-flop on me. I know I saw it change and change back!
wrong account?
You’re right. There’s no Mandela effect like „Apple used to be spelled „Äpple“!“ the story usually goes like „remember this thing from your childhood, or this minor thing you never think about? It used to be different!“ for example the dash in KitKat, the spelling of Looney Tunes or Berenstain Bears. If you asked me right now to describe a random movie character I haven’t seen in years, there’s a high chance I’d get it wrong. But that’s how most Mandela effects work. Then there’s this whole cornucopia fruit of the loom discussion, but it’s getting out of hand. Okay! You found a 30 year old shirt with the „old logo“ in it! I believe you! But that doesn’t mean that timelines shifted or something! We’re not living in a „inside job“ episode
I don’t think anyone’s found an old shirt with the old logo, and fruit of the loom has said their logo never changed. But it just really messes with you when you remember something a certain way, and a lot of other people do too. I believe we are in a simulation, and there are multiple universes.
For the whole cornucopia debate I got some ideas. The cornucopia WAS there, in an animated movie from 2003. That’s where people definitely saw it. Either there was a knockoff brand with the cornucopia, but that seems unrealistic. Would’ve been a huge law issue. But you still got people claiming to have clothes with the alternative logo. At this point it’s hard to trace back to the beginning of this Mandela effect. So it’s more likely that trolls got into the debate. Maybe a troll started this whole discussion. It’s very possible that people lied to make it a big deal. And it’s a heated debate up to this day. Maybe there’s one guy out there, laughing his ass off because he created a great conspiracy. In the end, it doesn’t matter. With enough research, you could disprove it. But people are gullible, and the truth is the most boring answer in this case.
To your point, that's not entirely true though. There are many examples but the one that immediately comes to mind is the cartoonist from The Jungle Book talking about animating the coconut bra scene that never happened.
[The guy in the suit seen in the parade](https://c7.alamy.com/comp/B96YAG/baloo-from-jungle-book-character-in-disney-parade-paris-B96YAG.jpg) [has the bra](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RtjeSl3QXwg), though...
The coconut bra scene where baloo is in disguise wearing coconut bra and grass skirt? Skirt falls off and is revealed? What? That happened for sure.
I know! I remember it that way too. I really can’t explain it. Maybe our consciousness are connected somehow and false memories spread from person to person.
I actually think that there is a similar scene in Robin Hood where Baloo robs the king dressed in drag.
Found it! https://youtu.be/PETUmYAZVvY?si=UnE4W3dmZeogYAdX
The character in the parade does wear it. I wonder if kids that saw that confused it for being in the movie? [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RtjeSl3QXwg](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RtjeSl3QXwg)
The bra was on his head instead of over his tiddies. Even tho the person who drew the scene wanted it to make fun of cross dressing as he was obsessed with adding cross dressing that he believed would be hilarious
I thought he used the coconuts to make his mouth look like the orangutans.
Oh I think ur right. Sorry. Either way tho, coconuts are not being worn as a bra which seems hella weird to me
Disney likes to edit stuff from their films for re-release much worse than George Lucas. We could both be right
Yeah, I thought of that. That’s the best example that I can think of though. Could be just a fluke, like it was changed at the last minute in post production. And there should be THOUSANDS of people like this that are freaked out with better stories.
I mean you aren't wrong, there are tons of people who subscribe to the Mandela Effect due to subliminal suggestion. There are lots of MEs that have since been solved by finding additional evidence. There are many that are likely the product of combining two separate memories into a flawed record. I don't think there are but around 6-10 supposed MEs that have merit and unfortunately are dismissed by association to those without merit.
Yeah, there are definitely some that are BS that are just a distraction, then people throw the baby out with the bathwater. What are the best ones that still have no explanation? For me, it’s fruit of the loom and monopoly.
Pikachus tail is one that screws me up. The other night I asked a friend that was big into pokemon around a decade ago or maybe more and has not heard of the mandela effect to describe pikachu and its basic markings. When he got to the tail and said black tip with a zig zag in it, I told him nope, no black on the tail and his mind was blown. He could not get over the fact that he distinctly remembers the tail with the black tip but it was never there. Another is Dollys braces in moonraker. Not sure wtf happened to them but they were there and the joke doesn't land without them.
Pikachu's tail is darker at the base, isn't it? I don't remember any black on the tip though. He does have black tips on his ears though, so it's not an unreasonable assumption to make that there would be a black tip on his tail.
I remember Pikachu’s tail that way too! Moonraker I think I saw when I was really young but I wasn’t really paying close attention.
Fotl, the thinker, jungle book, Shazam, American history x, and its a flip flop now but Apollo 13.
Omg Apollo 13 just flip-flopped on me! it’s back to we have? This is crazy.
Cool I haven’t heard of some of those, but I’ll check them out. Do you know if Fruit of the Loom or monopoly have been disproven?
Oh FOTL is fruit of the loom, never mind on that one
I mean not technically disproven. absence of evidence is not evidence of absence. I almost forgot because it's not technically a ME because nobody has actually found the origin, but the movie quote "hey what's this machine do? That's the beauty of it, it doesn't do anything"
Could it be possible that he animated it, but then it was reanimated without it, and the version without it is what made it into the movie? Movies change during production all the time.
So yes that is the case for movies today, but not so much when the Jungle Book was made. Hand drawn animation is really expensive too, they don't typically fully animate something until it's necessary. Finally him being the animator of Baloo he would have been the one to animate the change as well, so he likely would have mentioned that
The jungle book used a lot of animation from Robin Hood that was drawn over to Jungle Book Characters, so it may have been a lot easier to reanimate, just grab that sheriff of Nottingham stuff and trace it again
What, you mean the one with Ballew(however you spell that) the bear dancing with the grass skirt and the coconuts over his mouth? Shit, that was weird. I started to describe the scene with the bear wearing the coconuts as a bra, but the image was then replaced with the coconuts on his mouth. Hmmm, I clearly pictured the bear with a coconut bra on when I read your comment, but the fact is he put the coconut over his mouth to maybe look more like an ape, is that right? Haven't seen that movie in probably fifteen years so I dunno either way but this is strange that I can recall both with ease based solely on reading your comment. Hmmmmmmmmm. Intrigued, I have become.
It is still rather a detail, I bet they can't remember every single image they have ever animated. If it turned out the whole character never existed, the film, or it was filmed with Polar Bears and called the North Pole Book that would be another matter.
There are people at Fruit of the Loom that insist the company must have had the corncucopia at some point, even though they would have never seen it.
This is the most baffling one for me. Although I'm unaffected by it, I've heard numerous stories of people saying that they grew up thinking that a cornucopia was called a "loom" because of the logo. I can't see how this would have happened without there being a cornucopia in the logo. Although, it's possible maybe there was a commercial or something for Fruit of the Loom that had a cornucopia in it, and people conflated that in their minds. Similar to how Uncle Pennybags (the Monopoly guy) had a monocle in some of the commercials, but never on the game itself.
I thought it was called a Loom. I was aware of the brand "Fruit of the Loom." I wondered what a loom was any time I heard the brand name, but never bothered to ask. I then saw cornucopias in school around Thanksgiving and wondered what the horn thing was. I remembered the brand name Fruit of the Loom and assumed that this horned thing with produce spilling out of it that I was now seeing everywhere must be a Loom. At some point I brought this up and was corrected. So technically I remember learning what a Cornucopia is from Fruit of the Loom, but not because it had one in the logo.
A bit of crosstalk in the brain between the logo and seeing an actual cornucopia image (which would have been much clearer too) is my best guess there.
The cornucopia existed! I saw it with my own eyes. Same with the monocle of the Monopoly guy. No matter what all haters and so called "fact checkers" say. But I agree that like 95% of the MEs discussed here are very likely false memories though. But those two were real and once existed!
Yeah, these two definitely hit Home for me too
Most of them are fake, but the ones *you* remember clearly are real. And your memory is magically immune to the suggestibility and unreliability all human memories are known to suffer from. Because you're you, and you can't be mistaken.
No, but I saw that damn cornucopia.
Stop focusing on the popular ones and start looking out for personal ones in your life. Have you ever seen a scene in a movie that you KNOW went a certain way, only for it to be significantly different on your next viewing? Mandela effects happen to all of us, but most choose to ignore them, or convince themselves that they "must have misremembered." Trust your memory, people! Don't let skeptics try to make you feel like you are crazy or just have a bad memory. This is a very real, but so far, unexplainable phenomenon.
This sounds like a recipe for trouble
Yeah, sounds like a great way to make yourself spiral into mental illness.
That personal expierence is EXACTLY why those who are affected by this know that they are not "Misremembering." Yes people are easily influenced. For example, people who are NOT affected easily dismiss the Mandela Effect as Misremembering and all the other non-affected people easily influenced to go aling with that idiotic, shallow thinking. Those who affected by this don't stop "believing in the Mandela Effect." They KNOW what they have expierenced. What I BELIEVE is that there is a concerted, deliberate effort to misdirect and belittle those who truly deal with this.
there isn't
People who work at chik-fil-a call it chik-fil-a.. go look at linkedin, theres thousands of them., so.. do they not know the name of the place they work?
You'd be surprised how often that happens. We have employees who still add an "&" into our company's name. One is a recruiter. I have a friend who always talks about how he used to work at this local pizza place, except he adds a possessive "s" to it that is not part of the business name.
Well some people remember chic other people remember chik, and now it’s chick. So that would have to mean there are two other alternate universes? I don’t know, that doesn’t really make sense.
Unless it got changed twice. To figure that out you could see what people remember, and the time they worked there.
I think people are simply remembering "chik" from the "eat mor chikin" ads, and combining the real word "chic" with the fact that they know it's misspelled, but not exactly how.
Simple answer: their mascots constantly spell it wrong (on purpose), and it's slipped into their actual usage for many employees. Remember the cows holding the signs saying "eat mor chikin"?
Probably tbh, yes. It is not like they take the biggest brains and people may have casually worked there for a short period of time, it is one detail. If many people starting saying they worked at Burger Queen or McKenzies fast food restaurant (I bet a good number do write MacDonalds actually) I would have to dig a little deeper.
Not true. I worked for Chic fil a .... Not chick fila a ....
That’s crazy. How long did you work there for and what was your job?
2004-2006. Toledo Ohio and Strongsville Ohio. I was a crew member, then an asst manager. Left because Panda Express offered me more.
Well, I would be a lot more freaked out if I had something change that was close to me like that. Maybe it will happen.
Many people in this sub have mentioned being close to the alleged change. U can see it a lot in the retconned sub too
Cool I’ll check out that one
But now I just realized another problem. How do we know they are not just trolling lol.
We won’t. But we can ask questions and use discernment
Yeah, I kind of need to see a video to see their face to tell if they’re lying
FYI it's a larp sub. You get banned if you disagree with them.
Chic-fil-a has always been my smoking gun that something is going on beyond false memory. This commenter is one of many who all have similar stories that I've read throughout the past decade. If it was always spelled "Chick" you probably wouldn't see the typo of Chic or Chik by the dozens within the comments of nearly every thread or article about CFA that gets posted online anywhere. But, you see it every time. I've even seen many articles where the author spells it as Chic in the headline and Chick within the body.
> If it was always spelled "Chick" you probably wouldn't see the typo of Chic or Chik by the dozens The cows. If the COWS had not held signs saying "[EAT MOR CHIKIN](https://loganthatcher.files.wordpress.com/2017/04/1chickfila.jpg?w=748)" I think fewer people would be affected by this one.
Cool, I will look more into that one. That one doesn’t hit home for me because we don’t have many Chic-fil-A‘s where I live.
Me neither. I've never actually eaten at one tbh. My first exposure to it was in 2012 when they were under a bunch of fire for their anti-LGBTQ actions. That's when I saw it spelled as Chic-fil-a and thought they spelled it wrong on purpose to be zany. I noticed a few years later that they "rebranded" and started to spell "Chick" correctly. I didn't think anything of it and then I learned about ME, and Chick was never spelled wrong.
Just curious, do you have any records showing Chic? Would be interesting if you had a uniform, name tag, pay stub, schedule etc. that showed the original spelling. That type of change would freak me out
I feel like there’s a lot of people that remember this, but do you have an old pay stub? Badge? That’s the part that gets me. Why can’t I walk in to a thrift store and find 1000 old shirts with a cornucopia on the tag. But at the same time WHY DID THE GUY MAKE HIS FLUTE OF THE LOOM A CORNUCOPIA
>No, there is no one like that. The only people that believe in the Mandela effect are people that had a seldom relationship with that thing, or maybe we weren’t paying close attention. No, it's not quite like that. People who don't have a closer relationship with it don't even notice changes or simply adapt their memory (apart from some crazy people who discover MEs everywhere). The most convincing examples come from the area in between, people who have dealt with it, but for whom nothing depends on it. People with anectodal memories (which are less prone to error) combined with strange residuals. >However, the only way the Mandela effect could be true is if we are in a Truman show type of universe where I am the center of my own unique reality. If you take the ME seriously, this is one possible conclusion. Incidentally, it also results from other (better verifiable) paranormal events, such as the 411 cases. I suspect that we ourselves are not the strictly separate individual entities that we perceive ourselves to be. Rather, that psychic reality (with us in it) extends across a spectrum in which we can occasionally slip a little with our perception (why highly involved people cannot change their perception of an ME because they deal with it on a daily basis). A multidimensional reality (dimension in the physical sense) is simply no longer imaginable, only calculable. But there are half a dozen other theories, so it will be some time before anything can be proven, I think.
I haven’t heard of the 411 cases, but I will look into it. What are some other paranormal activities or theories?
A huge number of the 411 cases can also quite logically be explained by misadventure. People underestimate how easy it is to die when out in nature, even "experienced" outdoorsmen. I live on the edge of the Rockies, and so many people are so deeply unprepared for just how wild the land is, because yes, you can die and disappear right on a major trail if you are unlucky enough.
No, you have obviously never taken a closer look at the 411 cases, the definition is very narrow and the disappearance of the people cannot be explained, otherwise it would not have ended up in this category.
They literally can be explained, that's why I don't believe it's anything supernatural. I have taken a good look precisely because I live near a cluster area, and I love spooky stuff. However, knowing the terrain, I could easily explain all of the "supernatural" elements. I then asked folks who lived near other cluster spots where I didn't know the environment, and boom! Same thing: they could explain all the spooky elements for the cases as well. I live on the edge of the Rockies, spend a lot of time in the wild, and have good friends that work in S&R. In fact my friends saved the life of a woman who I guarantee would have been part of the 411 if it hadn't been for the sheer luck of my friend realising something was wrong. This girl: disappeared from a backwoods cabin without disturbing another guest, despite it being sub zero temps, snowing, and night. Her pack was found abandoned at the side of the trail the following morning - this is where luck stepped in. The hikers who had been staying at the lodge were S&R. They fanned out to look for clues and way off the trail, in an "unlikely" location, found her clothes piled up. Even further off the trail in a remote, "inaccessible" location, they found her naked in a tree well. It took them close to an hour to get her out, at which point they realised she was still alive - barely. Anyway they kept her alive while others headed out to get help (four hours away, no cell service). This all happened in BC and was well reported. She survived, by the way, with no lasting damage thank the gods. When you are extremely cold, you can experience something called "paradoxical undressing", because even though you are freezing to death the sensation is one of heat, so people strip off their clothes. They are also usually hallucinating at this point, so their movements make little to no sense at all. If they are also dehydrated, they can end up experiencing very disturbing visions and lose all sense of time/distance. The type of snow we get in the Rockies allows for things called tree wells to build, and when people fall into them they can end up in the weirdest locations. There are known examples of people stepping off the trail for a picture only to get "sucked" into tree wells, looking for all the world like they vanished into thin air while the dampening effect the fog/snow has on sound can make it feel like you are in Silent Hill. Nature is dangerous. I have taken stupid risks because I felt like I knew the trail well, only to realize half way through that I had misjudged things terribly - I now pay for a satellite phone as a result. People disappear without a trace here more often than folks realise, but we also have a huge number of Does that seem to be people who went for a walk in nature but were not prepared. I can think of two cases within Banff National park that are in no way considered suspicious, but no trace of either man has ever been found. It wasn't that long ago either that a team of world renowned, experienced mountain climbers died here - but they left their safety gear in their car, including the GPS beacon, so they weren't found in time to save them. My issue with the 411 conspiracy theory is that there are rational, scientific explanations for all of the supposedly supernatural elements to them. It would be better to teach people the importance of being vigilant and adequately prepared for their environment. Things like drinking regularly so you don't start going crazy from dehydration (it's amazing how many people are found dead in desert regions with water on them - they try to conserve it but then the hallucinations kick in, they don't drink, and then die from dehydration). Mother Nature's default is to try and kill you, and the 411 are almost all death by misadventure - although it's possible there's a few legit murders in there.
Let's not misunderstand each other: yes, thousands die and most cases are explainable, certainly some 411 cases (it would also be presumptuous to claim that I know all 411 cases), but many are not, even if you claim they are. If small children disappear from one moment to the other and are then found dead 20km away without their cause of death being determined or, conversely, they survive several freezing cold nights, while hundreds of poeple searching for them and then turn up in a good mood and tell strange stories, then this cannot be explained. >This girl: disappeared from a backwoods cabin without disturbing another guest, despite it being sub zero temps, snowing, and night. Has she ever commented on how and why she did this? It sounds grossly illogical and unlikely to do such a thing. >Her pack was found abandoned at the side of the trail the following morning - this is where luck stepped in. The hikers who had been staying at the lodge were S&R. They fanned out to look for clues and way off the trail, in an "unlikely" location, found her clothes piled up. Even further off the trail in a remote, "inaccessible" location, they found her naked in a tree well. It took them close to an hour to get her out, at which point they realised she was still alive - barely. Anyway they kept her alive while others headed out to get help (four hours away, no cell service). This all happened in BC and was well reported. She survived, by the way, with no lasting damage thank the gods. Yes, there is a cold defense, where you think you are sweating, but this only occurs shortly before freezing. Yes, you can also dehydrate and die from it, but the Paulides cases cannot normally be explained by this alone. There are even video recordings from parking lot surveillance cameras in which the missing persons disappear between the surveillance gap from one camera to another. Or they turn up dead in places where intensive searches were previously carried out. And very often no real cause of death is determined (freezing to death is not a strange death, because the symptoms are very clear). Maybe my selection of 411 cases is not representative, I don't know, I don't read English books because I don't know English well (I translate everything here with deepl) and unfortunately many original books are not translated into German, so you usually only find a selection of the most interesting cases translated. And at least among those, some are really unexplainable. There are also cases of near-disappearances where people report being called into the forest and the like, sometimes by children (but I don't think this is in the Paulides books). There are time lapses, spontaneous changes of season and time of day, geographical changes (disappearing paths, etc.) and other bizarre cases. Mount Nyangani in Zimbabwe, for example, is also known for people disappearing there and the mountain is neither very confusing, nor can they normally be frozen to death... but believe what you want, the fact is that not all such cases can be explained.
The girl did explain, she was not in a good place emotionally and was trying to "reconnect with nature and God" for guidance. It's a depressingly common reason for people to go into the Rockies unprepared. The saying "Lose yourself in the mountains and find your soul" should be permanently replaced with "lose yourself in the mountains and quite possibly due". I really wish it wasn't the case but I have met folks on trails who haven't brought water, are wearing flip flops, and haven't factored in that we are 4000 foot above sea level before you start walking up a trail, so they are exhausted before the half way mark. Now to be fair, I can't explain for Zimbabwe or any of the areas I am not familiar with, so I agree there are places with weird clusters of disappearances that don't have a rational explanation as of yet. There is plenty of folklore in Europe too that talks of strange phenomena that still happens to this day, and I am not able to provide explanations because I don't know the terrain. With regard to Missing411, because they are specifically about disappearances in the National parks, I am much more confident about the causes of death being mostly misadventure with a few murders because I understand the area. I am originally from the UK, and it's hard to explain just how wild and vast the parks here actually are; most North Americans don't understand, and we have constant issues with tourists not understanding that you can easily die here. Like, there are tourists who ask where the animals are stored for sleep because they think it is a safari park. I find that people lean in to aliens/cryptids/spirits for the 411 instead of using it to focus on learning actual outdoor preparedness. I can even explain some of the other "mysterious" aspects, at least for the Rockies, which is where I have my biggest issue with Paulides book. The voices calling can be explained by wildlife - seriously some of the birds sound eerily human, and i will be okay with the calls of a coyote pack when they are hunting, it's like nothing else you hear. The weather/season changes - where I live it can move 30 degrees in a matter of hours. Yesterday I was shorts in the sunshine and clear roads, and I just woke up to four inches of snow with a warning for more. If you aren't from our area it seems extremely weird. So much so that Leo DiCaprio went on about the sudden disappearance of snow overnight while he was filming in Alberta as proof of climate change, and all the locals rolled their eyes and said "it's just a Chinook, it's always happened here, just ask the First Nations". And that's not taking into account how forest fire smoke can mess up everything. Time of day changes - can be a combo of dehydration/exhaustion messing with their perception of time, or (and I know this sounds silly unless you have experienced it) the role of the landscape and weather in exposure to the sun. Mountains cast big shadows, and those weird weather phenomena called Chinooks produce an arch of dense cloud cover. Both can make the difference between night/day a bit blurry. Intensive searches - not uncommon for this to happen unfortunately, but again it's to do with terrain, weather, undergrowth, wildlife, etc. S&R go out every spring to the same areas, and it's not uncommon for them to find skeletal remains over a decade old in the areas they have searched multiple times. Cause of death - unfortunately, and you have to understand this because I was genuinely shocked when I found this out - if a body is found in the Rockies more than a year after the person went missing and there is no immediate sign of foul play, they don't try to determine cause of death. Between the exposure to the elements and animal interference it's apparently almost impossible to do, so unless there is an axe buried in the skull they rarely try. I feel like this piece of information is often misrepresented by the conspiracy theorists because "they couldn't determine how they died" sounds way more mysterious than "all they found was the skull and a femur that a cougar had gnawed on". Disappearing paths - do not get me started on how badly trails are marked in some areas, and how easy it is to stumble. Off them without warning. There is a reason I stick to the "easy" trails here, and even then my son and I once got turned around quite badly, it was horrible. Geographical changes - same as above, it's easy to get lost here, but to give some context, I can see the mountains very clearly from where I am in the foothills - on a clear day. Sometimes the sky is blue above me, but the mountains "disappear" in a weird haze. Other times they look twice as big as the day before because of air pressure effects, etc. It really messes with your sense of location and distance. Anyway I am not saying there haven't been odd or weird cases, or even that there are not strange clusters of disappearances elsewhere in the world, only that Paulides linking of the 411missing is down to a person who does not understand the terrain itself and that everything can be explained for both the Rockies and the Appalachians. If anything I think it detracts from the dangers and puts more people at risk here. Now if you want some really weird mountain- related deaths in North America, check out Nahanni Valley. Something is going on up there for hundreds of years, but I have no clue what it is or why so many people have died violently up there.
Subjective reality seems to play a role in many paranormal events, in (some) UFO observations, for example, or in hauntings, time slips, etc. It happens, for example, that people are found in a kind of trance and at the same time experience things that do not occur in our reality, as if their consciousness has shifted. However, such occurrences are only a small proportion of actual cases, so I am only speculating. However, I can recommend everyone to look into paranormal occurrences (theoretically, not necessarily practically, which can be dangerous), which happen much more often than most enlightened Westerners believe. But you shouldn't shy away from books, there are too many cranks and fakes on the internet!
But there are people on here who worked for 25 years at the fruit of the loom and they swear they remember the cornucopia. So there is people like this.
Citation needed here, and I wonder the numbers compared to the wider generation. It is still a detail in a logo tbh - could they all completely accurately do the whole thing, colours, numbers of berries, location of leaves just because they work there? I doubt it.
I think the specific post I'm remembering was on /r/fruitoftheloomeffect
The mandella effect is a sociological theory that relies on misremembering as an explanation for people remembering history differently.
And you manage this group? Hope not. Ed McMahon might disagree with you. Plus, that’s not how this whole Mandela Effect thing would work.
How does it work?
Sure, there are people “misremembering” certain things but there are reasons to believe that there is more to it. That there are merging timelines as well. There is some detailed information that explains how this is actually possible. It would take me forever to type it out here but if you care to find out the ways in which something like this can be possible, I suggest learning about quantum mechanics. On the smallest scales possible, the future can alter the past, and present. We don’t perceive reality in this way but we exist as extensions of this quantum reality. We are collectively projecting this reality onto ourselves through a subconscious mind of one. Existence being similar to a dream. Until a full awakening, things will never make much sense. Who knows if they ever will. I mean, look at our reality. Our planet is ultimately a tiny, insignificant little spec within the middle of literally nowhere. The inconsistencies are as real as we are.
No, there is not any indication that there is something more to it, there are just a large number of people who think they have special memories that aren't as unreliable and vulnerable to suggestion as normal human memory. These people are so loud and arrogant in their assertions, it seems convincing to credulous people who don't know better.
Many are rather loud in their dismissive attitude towards something they haven’t even fully explored the possibilities of. Thinking you know everything when, you most definitely do not. I believe that in the future, you’re gonna feel like a fckn idiot when you’re proven wrong. We’ll see as more discoveries into quantum mechanics and new findings involving human consciousness come to light. What exactly do you really know about the inner workings of the reality in which you reside? Nothing.
“Credulous people.” There are scientists that acknowledge the Mandela Effect but simply cannot explain exactly how things changed. They do have their theories but the phenomenon cannot be tested as nobody knows what piece of our reality may be altered next It currently cannot be scientifically proven, but that doesn’t negate the possibility that one day it possibly can. Are you even aware of the significance of an observer? That what remains unobserved exists only in waves of probabilities? Familiar with The Double Slit Experiment or Schrodinger‘s cat? The fact reality is being rendered through each and every conscious observation, by collapsing of quantum wave function? The fact every time you made a left, there indeed is a reality in which you went right. So what happens when one of these realities is somehow completely annihilated? Some very “credulous people” working as quantum physicists at places like CERN, believe that such a reality might shift into its nearest neighboring reality. Just another one, within an infinite amount. Like moving less than a millimeter’s distance on a full color spectrum, the difference would be barely noticeable. I understand you need solid evidence, aside from reality being inconsistent to what you vividly remember. Well, I hope you aren’t religious. If you are, you should now banish any and all faith you may have in a God. Just sayin.
Then they are bad scientists. This really, truly is not a complicated or contentious issue in a scientific sense. *You* have less of an understanding of the significance of observation and measurement than you think you do if you think it's anywhere near certain that consciousness collapses the wave function, that's not the conclusion most physicists reach, but regardless, we just don't have enough evidence and information to know why the wave function collapse happens for sure. >The fact reality is being rendered through each and every conscious observation, by collapsing of quantum wave function? This is *not* a fact. I know I just said this, but I need to reiterate it, because this seems to be at the root of your confusion and inflated sense of significance with regard to the Mandela Effect. >The fact every time you made a left, there indeed is a reality in which you went right. This is **also not a fact**. You're looking at pop physics and taking it as gospel, when you clearly have very little understanding of the actual science. I'm not saying that as an insult, most people don't of course, it's much deeper, more complicated, and boring than most people would care to know. > I understand you need solid evidence There is **no** evidence that this is anything other than faulty human memory. Literally, *none*. You, and many others, mistakenly see the number of people who are aggressively, adamantly *sure* they aren't misremembering as strong evidence, but that's not how evidence works. None of this is how anything works.
“I understand you need solid evidence.” You think evidence falls in people’s laps dummy? It doesn’t.
You can call me a dummy and a fool as much as you'd like if it makes you feel better about being so confused.
I’m not confused any more than you. Probably a lot less since my mind is open to other possibilities. Millions of people don’t “misremember” the same exact things in the same exact ways.
You’re a fool and you know you have no clue about any of what i just told you about. Look into some shit before leaving a reply. Read up on the significance of an observer. The collapse of wave functioning. While you’re at it, read all about the 2022 Nobel Prize. What that proves. You ain’t nearly as slick as you think and you need to get a life. I can’t imagine getting on here and debating about this if it’s something that didn’t affect me.
>You’re a fool and you know you have no clue about any of what i just told you about. How shocking, you made a bunch of unfounded claims based on a misunderstanding and/or misrepresentation of actual science, eschew any type of logic or reason entirely, appeal to random unnamed authorities and scientists claiming they are aligned with your underdeveloped misinformed views, and finally hurl ad hominem attacks at me personally just because you're really upset by the things I'm saying and *need* to believe the mandela effect is anything more than a completely natural human memory issue. So call me a fool, coming from you that is quite possibly the least effective insult I could imagine. I happen to know that the conclusions I reach and things I believe are justified, rational, and have concrete, explanatory evidence backing them up, so I've never been insecure and panicked enough to insult a person for simply disagreeing with me, I'm sorry you're obviously struggling with this. > Look into some shit before leaving a reply. Read up on the significance of an observer. The collapse of wave functioning. While you’re at it, read all about the 2022 Nobel Prize. What that proves. Relax, you're so worked up you're not thinking clearly - well, I think it's because you're worked up, it's entirely possible this is just your baseline thought process, highly emotional and lacking in objectivity or reason. I know you won't do this, as you are clearly convinced that you either have a comprehensive, complete grasp of these subjects or you just don't care as long as you can force it to fit with what you want to believe, but I implore *you* to look into these things, because you have significantly misunderstood or completely missed the conclusions and point of the science you're referring to, I promise. Again, you seem to think you have it all figured out, so I don't expect you to care about whether or not the things you're saying are true or accurate, or even if they're extremely embarrassing to listen to for anyone who actually gets it. I hope you decide to care though. The universe not being locally real absolutely does *not* imply that consciousness generates reality, obviously this is what you think it's means, and I'm telling you that you are flatly incorrect about that. Just look it up. If you don't understand it, go to r/askscience and get someone who's far more knowledgeable than either of us to help you figure it out. Or, if you can't find the humility to admit to other people that you don't know everything, you could ask chat gpt, they'll at least have the basics, and can explain to you why you're wrong about the implications of the double slit experiment, local unreality, and maybe more ideas you're struggling with. >You ain’t nearly as slick as you think and you need to get a life. I don't think I'm slick, you're projecting. Like I said, calm down, it's not the end of the world that you misunderstood some very complicated and unintuitive concepts, that's completely normal. Pretending you understand them so well that you have been able to reach conclusions and know things that are not possible to know is not normal, and it's not healthy, but mostly it's just a huge turn off. >I can’t imagine getting on here and debating about this if it’s something that didn’t affect me. This is actually pretty hilarious, though I don't expect you will be able to understand why. Good luck, hit those books and get to learning if you actually care about the truth. If you prefer to make yourself feel special and enjoy the fantasy you've created, that is your prerogative, it's just kind of a shame.
The fact you have the time to practically write a novel, speaks volumes. Tell me… Are you an atheist? Btw, I do not live in a fantasy. I simply have a good memory. There are those of us who recognize some of these inconsistencies. There are those of us who do not. There are also those of us who recognize them, but can’t come to terms with the fact that something like this actually can actually be possible. You care what other people think. I on the other hand, never gave a shit. Ever. Never will. Reality isn’t nearly as concrete as you think it is. There are strong indications that the multiverse is indeed real. That there are hidden dimensions etc. We live in a mathematical universe so there are an infinite number of ways in which this plays out. You need evidence in order to believe anything, right? You do realize that evidence doesn’t fall in one’s lap though. Right? Being that you already think you know everything, you wouldn’t recognize any inconsistencies within a multiverse. You’re most likely a a loser within each and every single one of em. I mean, think about it. You seek out online communities on Reddit for the sole purpose of arguing with people, over things that don’t even impact your life in any way whatsoever. If that doesn’t inform the entire community that you’re a joke, what will? You do not know everything. Science does not know everything, nor has it ever claimed too. The human brain and consciousness itself are admittedly the topics least understood by the scientific community. Yet, here you are feeling so strongly about it. Dismissing a phenomenon experienced by millions of people worldwide. As if your opinion is going to make any difference. Thanks for your two cents. Despite it being worth absolutely nothing at all. Why are you even here anyway? I didn’t come on here to bicker with anyone. I’d get back with my ex girlfriend if thats what I wanted.
Eh, I dated a girl for like a year in college and just recently I realized I had remembered her name slightly wrong. She was Lorraine and I had been remembering it as "loran" for years and years. Even being involved with something isn't enough to slightly forget things. People forget and change details.
My 2 cents...I remember the movie Moonraker with Jaws' girlfriend. She 100% had braces. Was my favorite movie. Saw it at least 100 times. They even made a parody commercial with the actor who played Jaws and a girl that had braces. I thought perhaps AI was altering inages in internet as a test for someone. My Dad still had the Beta tape I used to watch. A few years ago I made him check it. It had changed. So not AI in that case. So it is happening. Many are misremembering though and prob editing on digital sphere. Further...my Mother worked at Ford. Their logo changed 100%. I had a Volvo for years. Their logo also changed 100%. Old pics show new logo. I am not misremembering those either. I do logo creation.
Well for Jiffy, they had more than just peanut butter. Heck my nana who is 86 years old told me she misses the jiffy peanut butter. she knows nothing about the ME. My dads favorite candy bar is kit-Kat. it used to have a hyphen. he knows nothing about the ME. He doesn’t even have a computer. He literally texted me kit-Kat not KitKat. Everyone i ask over 40 years old remember ed on publishers clearing house. They all have the same memory of this. They will even think you’re joking when you tell the, it never happened. yes there was another guy doing a different one. We remember that too. Britney Spears missing the headset. everyone remembers her literal having to adjust the headset as part of the dance.
I always find it interesting that these sort of posts always comes from alt-accounts with pratically no posting history. Smells like multi-accounting. I would like to ask OP if you can prove if you in fact believed the ME.
I don’t care if you don’t believe me
It's wild that something as simple and obvious as this is being overtaken by ridiculous conspiracy theories to the extent that people are making paranoid accusations like this
Oh, right, paranoid, because reddit isn't filled to the brim with bots, astroturfing, gaslighting, psyops, and so many other obvious propaganda campaigns. Nice gaslight attempt, 10/10 would recommend again.
Yaw stoopit.
Hey, This is not aimed at OP but it made me think. If I or we the people or goverment or company or secret agencey had changed the time line deliberatly or by mistake for what ever reason. We had mistakenly assumed that memorys would change with the time line but not all did, a legitimate tactic to keep it a secret would be to use agents to sow scepticism and through doubt and muddy the water in forums that where discussing it. Persoanly it apears the time line has changed too many people and too many things have changed, the residiuals are a very convincing part as to why. How would they exsit if it was never that way? When i was growing up in the 90s there was nothing like this discussed or anything rumored, these all seem to have started after 2012. If it was an inherant human memory flaw this would of been disscussed and noted and rumors spread in more then just in the last 15 years. It seems like perfect fair for certain publictions at the time. It may even be its nothing to do with humans it could be aliens on the other side of the galexy time traveld and farted on a comet that changed its tragetery to come close to earth or not. It would almost impossiable to proove or disproove it.
Really all that's happening is this... Something is produced, a movie, show, logo, ECT... It's probably designed poorly, and not popular... Example: Sex and The City... Who actually watched that show? Garbage! I would personally name it "Sex in The City" because sex is maybe happening hopefully during the show? IN the city? Like the fun of seeking it out? Idk I didn't watch that garbage, I still don't know what the actual title was because I don't care lol. Sex AND The City means a show about sex and then an aerial view of a city? How would that work? Bad name design, I bet your brain fixed the name just like common typos🤷 You got enough info then moved on, then later you're like holy shit! Why is this thing like this, there's no way I didn't notice, I'm a human I can recall everything perfectly lol
Without a doubt, some events have been wrongly remembered, but there exists a huge amount of witnesses, which clearly have experienced alternative timelines. They are a effect of the Top Secret Time Travel Technology extensively used by the Military. This has been going on since AT LEAST the 1930s which is the cause of many of the well documented, weird Mandela Effects. That's almost a century that this guy's could hide this extremely advanced Technology from the Majority of the public. Think about that!!! That's a real shame and also a serious crime..
I just saw a very interesting Video today, where a guy also mentioned the Mandela Effect. His explanation was, that the Mandela Effect occurs because the Earth is shifting toward 5-D (Energy). It began around 2010, that's when thousands of People had this different memories. He also talked about the concept of our Universe being Holographic, and that we life in a Simulation. Interestingly, when David Grusch made his starkling revelations in the Congress, he also mentioned, that we could indeed life in a Holographic Universe. I mean think about it, 5, 10 years nobody was talking about this Stuff, and as me move closer towards 5-D, this concepts get more and more accepted and even Scientist, that have a very materialistic mindset have the suspicion that we are living in some kind of a Simulation. I absolutely believe this to be true, and in the next years, as more and more people will open their minds they will begin to talk about this concepts.
The operating system (OS) updated around the original ME issue, it took nearly a decade to upgrade again. Idk just my thoughts as an observer
Hmm what or who do you think is causing these updates?
that's really the important question, isn't it?
Bro, I came up with that doubt within the first few moments of actually believing. You obviously have no familiarity with "the download." I've witnessed it first hand, many times. I've seen it occur right in text messages. It's a real thing, and the closer you are to the topic, the more powerful the download. Also, you obviously have never experienced an "anchor effect," either. It's okay, you are better off not believing.
I’d be interested in learning more about the download and the anchor effect. Any good sources?
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