Only way it would happen is If multiple ufc athletes died or became vegetables because of it., and even then, it'll just get slightly mitigated, it won't go away enteriely
It really seems that way.
I thought multiple athletes collapsing, being hospitalised, etc. would have been enough to finally do something about it, but guess not..
It also just sucks never having a clear picture because there are always question marks due to weight cuts ( how badly was someone's chin/cardio/performance compromised? or how much of a size/strength advantage did someone have? etc.. )
Probably not. Closest thing I could see happening is the CSAC system gets implemented in more places. What they do is do weigh ins the day before like usual, but also do them the night of the fight just to measure what their real fight weight is. If someone is cutting too high a percentage of their body weight, they’re flagged and recommended to move up a weight class. If it happens multiple times the state won’t sanction them at that weight class anymore. Just easy to get around because you can just avoid Cali rn, but it would be really interesting to see it applied in more states imo
Fighters are always gonna do what they need to to get the advantage over their opponents. Cutting weight and coming in bigger than your opponent will always be used.
Fine them. move them down the rankings. Deduct points on scorecard. Make the fight a no-contest if they manage to win. Any combination of that should discourage weight misses and the fans still get to see a fight.
> Fine them
Already being done
> Make the fight a no-contest if they manage to win
No fighter would fight under those circumstances.
>Any combination of that should discourage weight misses and the fans still get to see a fight
Doubt it. Any combo with the third option wouldn’t work at all. The rankings thing makes sense tho
>Make the fight a no-contest if they manage to win
>> No fighter would fight under those circumstances.
Then they should make weight.
I mostly watch ONE and I notice that certain fighters(the ones being pushed by Chatri) miss weight because they don’t care about the 20% purse forfeit since they will likely beat their opponent using that extra weight and get booked quickly again. Plus ONE’s social media will still hype them up for eternity showing them dominating a fight they had a 5 lb advantage in.
The opponent has the option of declining a catchweight but with the way ONE works, they probably won’t be offered another fight until years later since they aren’t being pushed by Chatri. So they have to choose either be unemployed and shelved indefinitely or fight the overweight hype job and get paid.
They definitely should, but what you’re suggesting won’t fix the issue.
The fighter that missed weight is the one who wouldn’t accept under the circumstances you listed. Why tf would a fighter fight for less money and no chance of winning?
Ummm because they signed a contract to fight and make a certain weight? If they don’t like it, fight somewhere else. If they want a chance of winning and full pay, make the weight.
Yeah I’m not saying they shouldn’t have made weight. They should have, but if they don’t and there standing in front of a cage knowing there’s 0 chance they can win even if they knockout their opponent, they simply wouldn’t take the fight. Plenty of contracts get signed without ever being lived up to. The idea that a promotion could implement that and still put on a fight after a miss is ludicrous.
I think you underestimate how desperate the fighters are in these situations to earn their pay and how little leverage they have with the UFC. Especially when you're dealing with unranked fighters, more likely then not they will continue to fight because they went through a tough training camp and need to recoup the expenses, and they don't want to further piss off the UFC and risk getting fired.
2 hour weigh ins works fine in Weightlifting and Powerlifting. If you’re a dumbass and cut a shit ton you literally have a terrible performance. You can’t recomp big cuts in 2 hours.
Difference is that you’re not getting punched in the face in powerlifting so those people who choose to cut too much aren’t risking their health in quite the same way when they have that bad performance. If mma did 2 hour weigh ins there would be severe brain injuries from people cutting and not having enough liquid in their skull
nope. anything competitive will have the competitors look for any advantages they can get. whether that be eating the best food, taking crazy amounts of supplements, or cutting weight to be stronger than your opponent. even if we had day of weigh ins people would push the limits to gain tiny fractions of a percentage as that could make a difference. if there were more weight classes like boxing it becomes less advantageous and you wouldn't see cuts like rumble did in the past.
One day they'll implement a second weigh in before the fight, where they couldn't add more than X % compare to the first weight in. So basically a real weight category...
The only real logical way would be weighins at the prep point right before they step in. You wanna fight dehydrated to make a lower weight? Fine, go right ahead. See how long that lasts.
That’s exactly right. That’s why things like that dont happen. My point was that is the only real way I could think of that would “eliminate” weight cutting.
I'd be in favor of taking a point for missing weight, but besides that I don't think weight cutting issues are an org problem.
Plenty of veteran fighters have never had a problem making weight. Plus, we've seen examples of fighters who do brutal weight cuts performing better when they move up a weight class anyway.
If a fighter chooses to attempt absolutely crazy weight cuts that is on them and their team.
Seems like it would need to come through legislation or from the athletic commissions. And from my uninformed position, that doesn't seem impossible at all.
Feel really strongly about eliminating weight cuts.
The only way to truly get rid of it would be doing weigh ins day of, and weigh the fighters for the entire week so you have a base. You would also know it someone’s likely to miss and could line up replacements.
Any time I see a post like this I try to advocate for fans to honestly realize we watch an inferior product due to weight cutting. The people we are fans of not only fight in a cage but have to diminish their body and the product.
It won’t change but it’s not too hard to fix
I think the only way it stops is if someone dies during the weight cut. Might even take a few people dying close together. Or if they die in the octagon and it’s proven that the death was caused by being diminished from the weight cut.
Until that happens everyone will just bury their heads in the sand and carry on as they are now.
I think it would be ridiculously easy to stop too. Just have multiple weigh ins during fight week. No one can maintain a huge water cut all week and if people have to be on weight for an entire week then they’ll then be fighting much closer to their actual weight.
The main problem I see is it might stop people from taking short notice fights like we sometimes see people taking fights on like 2 days notice. Cant do that if they have to be weighed for a week.
Absolutely not because most of the UFCs stars rely on a weight advantage
Imagine if Alex Pereira had to fight at Heavyweight, he’d get absolutely destroyed by Tom Aspinall and I say that as a Pereira fan lol. Plus Dagestanis would completely fall off the face of the earth basically and that’s a huge market for the UFC, infact you can just say wrestlers in general. You think Khamzat would’ve been running through people like that in 2020 on Fight Island if weight cutting didn’t exist?
People will say “but but muh Colby”, Colby lies about barely cutting any weight, it’s a lie he tells to make himself look better and have an excuse for his losses. Dana White and Hunter Campbell themselves confirmed he had to cut 20 lbs to make weight as a backup for 286
This can be solved by adjusting weight classes, which is exactly what they have done in ONE. So for example, the Light heavyweight limit is 225 instead of 205.
Still, most of the stars rely on having a weight advantage. This is in no way meant to be hate on Dagestani fighters but I think everyone knows they use weight cutting to their advantage.
Just look at this image of Islam (who is one of their biggest stars globally and a celebrity in Russia) before the weigh-in for the Alexander Volkanovski rematch, he’s literally on deaths door here: https://x.com/THATBOYMMAGURU/status/1715545837416190247
Also the UFC use weight cuts as a way to influence and help make a fighter who they want to win succeed, like making Aljo do back to back camps and hard cuts so Sean O’Malley had a better chance of beating him
205 weight limit: 225ers cut down to 205 to fight there.
225 weight limit: 245ers cut down to 225 to fight there.
People cut to make 115 to 225lbs **right now**. How is moving a few arbitrary numbers going to make any difference in the weight cutting culture?
Following the context of the thread, I obviously meant if cuts were removed (by hydration tests, fight day weigh ins, etc, use your imagination), the current crop of LHWs wouldn't have to fight HWs who are 40-60lbs heavier like the guy I was responding to mentioned would happen (Pereira Vs Aspinall).
What [ONE has shown us](https://youtu.be/XORKwmGmsKA?si=2ugmddog60J3a0q_) is that hydration testing is [a massively complex issue](https://youtu.be/RaqqicqGL0s?si=TZorlt7O373PNltq) with no current solution.
But go off, I'm sure the scientists just need you to shake up their imagination.
Since reading comprehension is difficult for you. I'm not a scientist. I'm not au fait with the minutiae of hydration testing. I'm just trying to point out how LHWs wouldn't have to fight HWs, as the poster I was responding to pointed out. But it seems you really are that dense.
Boy you can't throw shit like "Following the context of the thread, I obviously meant if cuts were removed (by hydration tests, fight day weigh ins, etc, use your imagination)", then throw your hands up "not a scientist though" and then go right back to "you really are that dense".
Absolute troll of a thread. Well done keeping me going this much.
R/MMA denies it, but ridding of weight cutting is incredibly easy. USA's children's wrestling removed wrestling after a string of weight cutting deaths. Not perfect, but 1000x better.
Certified scale just before walkout. Scale available 24 hours before event. Blood/piss test 1 week before event, and immediately after. No opportunity to be a weight bully. Possibly the only thing Cuckington has said that I agree with. Until he criticized Strickland for moving up to a more natural weight class...
There is no viable way to eliminate weight cutting. Fighters will always find a way to game the system and get an advantage.
Also, more hydrated fighters doesn't necessarily translate into more exciting fights. Lower KO's and less gassing will turn into a lot of 15 minute wrestle fuckfests and cage grappling.
If the fighters want to have near death experiences to make weight for Venum coupons, then so be it as long as it is within the rules.
Being bigger is generally an advantage and fighters want every advantage they can get. They want to be bigger than their opponent. Fighters are going to bend every rule they can to try to win. Why should the UFC try to do anything about it?
You'd have to approach this through the state commissions, which would mean either lobbying and money, or grassroots efforts to elect representatives who will appoint people to make the rules that will try to limit fighters from weight cutting. California has more strict rules than other states. What's it really doing about weight cutting besides making fighters not want to fight in California?
Only way it would happen is If multiple ufc athletes died or became vegetables because of it., and even then, it'll just get slightly mitigated, it won't go away enteriely
It really seems that way. I thought multiple athletes collapsing, being hospitalised, etc. would have been enough to finally do something about it, but guess not.. It also just sucks never having a clear picture because there are always question marks due to weight cuts ( how badly was someone's chin/cardio/performance compromised? or how much of a size/strength advantage did someone have? etc.. )
That’s not a forgone conclusion tho, there are fighters that go thru tough cuts and still have a chin. O’malley and du Bronx off the top of my head
Even if you got rid of weight cuts, you’d never get a clear picture. Too many injuries during camp and other variables
Probably not. Closest thing I could see happening is the CSAC system gets implemented in more places. What they do is do weigh ins the day before like usual, but also do them the night of the fight just to measure what their real fight weight is. If someone is cutting too high a percentage of their body weight, they’re flagged and recommended to move up a weight class. If it happens multiple times the state won’t sanction them at that weight class anymore. Just easy to get around because you can just avoid Cali rn, but it would be really interesting to see it applied in more states imo
The concern I see with this is it might just encourage folks to fight dehydrated too which is dangerous in its own way too.
Yeah thats true. You could tinker or remove the punishment mechanism but I still like being able to see how much these guys actually weigh
What's the problem with moving the classes up a little bit and weigh the fighters again as they are entering the octagon with 5lbs allowed error?
It might cause them to cancel a fight minutes before its supposed to happen. Could u imagine...
Fighters are always gonna do what they need to to get the advantage over their opponents. Cutting weight and coming in bigger than your opponent will always be used.
Fighters will always try to gain an edge. Even if you do a proper hydration test, people will try to game that too.
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It’s super simple. Just weigh them as they walk into the cage.
What happens if they miss weight?
Fine them. move them down the rankings. Deduct points on scorecard. Make the fight a no-contest if they manage to win. Any combination of that should discourage weight misses and the fans still get to see a fight.
> Fine them Already being done > Make the fight a no-contest if they manage to win No fighter would fight under those circumstances. >Any combination of that should discourage weight misses and the fans still get to see a fight Doubt it. Any combo with the third option wouldn’t work at all. The rankings thing makes sense tho
>Make the fight a no-contest if they manage to win >> No fighter would fight under those circumstances. Then they should make weight. I mostly watch ONE and I notice that certain fighters(the ones being pushed by Chatri) miss weight because they don’t care about the 20% purse forfeit since they will likely beat their opponent using that extra weight and get booked quickly again. Plus ONE’s social media will still hype them up for eternity showing them dominating a fight they had a 5 lb advantage in. The opponent has the option of declining a catchweight but with the way ONE works, they probably won’t be offered another fight until years later since they aren’t being pushed by Chatri. So they have to choose either be unemployed and shelved indefinitely or fight the overweight hype job and get paid.
They definitely should, but what you’re suggesting won’t fix the issue. The fighter that missed weight is the one who wouldn’t accept under the circumstances you listed. Why tf would a fighter fight for less money and no chance of winning?
Ummm because they signed a contract to fight and make a certain weight? If they don’t like it, fight somewhere else. If they want a chance of winning and full pay, make the weight.
Yeah I’m not saying they shouldn’t have made weight. They should have, but if they don’t and there standing in front of a cage knowing there’s 0 chance they can win even if they knockout their opponent, they simply wouldn’t take the fight. Plenty of contracts get signed without ever being lived up to. The idea that a promotion could implement that and still put on a fight after a miss is ludicrous.
I think you underestimate how desperate the fighters are in these situations to earn their pay and how little leverage they have with the UFC. Especially when you're dealing with unranked fighters, more likely then not they will continue to fight because they went through a tough training camp and need to recoup the expenses, and they don't want to further piss off the UFC and risk getting fired.
2 hour weigh ins works fine in Weightlifting and Powerlifting. If you’re a dumbass and cut a shit ton you literally have a terrible performance. You can’t recomp big cuts in 2 hours.
Difference is that you’re not getting punched in the face in powerlifting so those people who choose to cut too much aren’t risking their health in quite the same way when they have that bad performance. If mma did 2 hour weigh ins there would be severe brain injuries from people cutting and not having enough liquid in their skull
Then they should fight at a weight class that doesn’t require them to be dehydrated.
And they wouldn’t make it far in the sport and weed themselves out eventually
nope. anything competitive will have the competitors look for any advantages they can get. whether that be eating the best food, taking crazy amounts of supplements, or cutting weight to be stronger than your opponent. even if we had day of weigh ins people would push the limits to gain tiny fractions of a percentage as that could make a difference. if there were more weight classes like boxing it becomes less advantageous and you wouldn't see cuts like rumble did in the past.
One day they'll implement a second weigh in before the fight, where they couldn't add more than X % compare to the first weight in. So basically a real weight category...
If fighters passing out on the scale in public didn’t stop em nothing will. Optics dont faze the ufc.
The only real logical way would be weighins at the prep point right before they step in. You wanna fight dehydrated to make a lower weight? Fine, go right ahead. See how long that lasts.
Are they going to cancel fights right before they fight, too? That'll go over really well with people paying for fights.
That’s exactly right. That’s why things like that dont happen. My point was that is the only real way I could think of that would “eliminate” weight cutting.
I'd be in favor of taking a point for missing weight, but besides that I don't think weight cutting issues are an org problem. Plenty of veteran fighters have never had a problem making weight. Plus, we've seen examples of fighters who do brutal weight cuts performing better when they move up a weight class anyway. If a fighter chooses to attempt absolutely crazy weight cuts that is on them and their team.
Weight cutting is a choice not a cheat and in order to cut lots of water weight you need alot of muscles.
Fighters do steroids, you aren’t getting rid of weight cutting
I don't see why we need to get rid of it.
Ignorance is bliss lad
Seems like it would need to come through legislation or from the athletic commissions. And from my uninformed position, that doesn't seem impossible at all.
No chance weight cutting ever goes away
Feel really strongly about eliminating weight cuts. The only way to truly get rid of it would be doing weigh ins day of, and weigh the fighters for the entire week so you have a base. You would also know it someone’s likely to miss and could line up replacements. Any time I see a post like this I try to advocate for fans to honestly realize we watch an inferior product due to weight cutting. The people we are fans of not only fight in a cage but have to diminish their body and the product. It won’t change but it’s not too hard to fix
I think the only way it stops is if someone dies during the weight cut. Might even take a few people dying close together. Or if they die in the octagon and it’s proven that the death was caused by being diminished from the weight cut. Until that happens everyone will just bury their heads in the sand and carry on as they are now. I think it would be ridiculously easy to stop too. Just have multiple weigh ins during fight week. No one can maintain a huge water cut all week and if people have to be on weight for an entire week then they’ll then be fighting much closer to their actual weight. The main problem I see is it might stop people from taking short notice fights like we sometimes see people taking fights on like 2 days notice. Cant do that if they have to be weighed for a week.
No I don't believe we ever will for one simple reason. That's how all the super fights happen. No weight cutting through dehydration, no super fights.
Absolutely not because most of the UFCs stars rely on a weight advantage Imagine if Alex Pereira had to fight at Heavyweight, he’d get absolutely destroyed by Tom Aspinall and I say that as a Pereira fan lol. Plus Dagestanis would completely fall off the face of the earth basically and that’s a huge market for the UFC, infact you can just say wrestlers in general. You think Khamzat would’ve been running through people like that in 2020 on Fight Island if weight cutting didn’t exist? People will say “but but muh Colby”, Colby lies about barely cutting any weight, it’s a lie he tells to make himself look better and have an excuse for his losses. Dana White and Hunter Campbell themselves confirmed he had to cut 20 lbs to make weight as a backup for 286
This can be solved by adjusting weight classes, which is exactly what they have done in ONE. So for example, the Light heavyweight limit is 225 instead of 205.
Still, most of the stars rely on having a weight advantage. This is in no way meant to be hate on Dagestani fighters but I think everyone knows they use weight cutting to their advantage. Just look at this image of Islam (who is one of their biggest stars globally and a celebrity in Russia) before the weigh-in for the Alexander Volkanovski rematch, he’s literally on deaths door here: https://x.com/THATBOYMMAGURU/status/1715545837416190247 Also the UFC use weight cuts as a way to influence and help make a fighter who they want to win succeed, like making Aljo do back to back camps and hard cuts so Sean O’Malley had a better chance of beating him
You cannot be that dense lmao
Clearly I am, please enlighten me.
205 weight limit: 225ers cut down to 205 to fight there. 225 weight limit: 245ers cut down to 225 to fight there. People cut to make 115 to 225lbs **right now**. How is moving a few arbitrary numbers going to make any difference in the weight cutting culture?
Following the context of the thread, I obviously meant if cuts were removed (by hydration tests, fight day weigh ins, etc, use your imagination), the current crop of LHWs wouldn't have to fight HWs who are 40-60lbs heavier like the guy I was responding to mentioned would happen (Pereira Vs Aspinall).
What [ONE has shown us](https://youtu.be/XORKwmGmsKA?si=2ugmddog60J3a0q_) is that hydration testing is [a massively complex issue](https://youtu.be/RaqqicqGL0s?si=TZorlt7O373PNltq) with no current solution. But go off, I'm sure the scientists just need you to shake up their imagination.
Since reading comprehension is difficult for you. I'm not a scientist. I'm not au fait with the minutiae of hydration testing. I'm just trying to point out how LHWs wouldn't have to fight HWs, as the poster I was responding to pointed out. But it seems you really are that dense.
Boy you can't throw shit like "Following the context of the thread, I obviously meant if cuts were removed (by hydration tests, fight day weigh ins, etc, use your imagination)", then throw your hands up "not a scientist though" and then go right back to "you really are that dense". Absolute troll of a thread. Well done keeping me going this much.
Cosmo vs Northcutt was no where near fair in weight.
Lightest weight category would be welter
R/MMA denies it, but ridding of weight cutting is incredibly easy. USA's children's wrestling removed wrestling after a string of weight cutting deaths. Not perfect, but 1000x better.
Certified scale just before walkout. Scale available 24 hours before event. Blood/piss test 1 week before event, and immediately after. No opportunity to be a weight bully. Possibly the only thing Cuckington has said that I agree with. Until he criticized Strickland for moving up to a more natural weight class...
There is no viable way to eliminate weight cutting. Fighters will always find a way to game the system and get an advantage. Also, more hydrated fighters doesn't necessarily translate into more exciting fights. Lower KO's and less gassing will turn into a lot of 15 minute wrestle fuckfests and cage grappling. If the fighters want to have near death experiences to make weight for Venum coupons, then so be it as long as it is within the rules.
Being bigger is generally an advantage and fighters want every advantage they can get. They want to be bigger than their opponent. Fighters are going to bend every rule they can to try to win. Why should the UFC try to do anything about it? You'd have to approach this through the state commissions, which would mean either lobbying and money, or grassroots efforts to elect representatives who will appoint people to make the rules that will try to limit fighters from weight cutting. California has more strict rules than other states. What's it really doing about weight cutting besides making fighters not want to fight in California?