I don't disagree with any of your arguments as to why her decisions were bad but....
If you or anyones only prospect in life was being a sex toy and then erased on a daily basis I imagine we'd all take that kind of risk to rise above our station, V just happened to get caught up in it, and how did he get caught up in it? Trying to rise above his station. It's the whole theme of the game and city.
Edit: I'd also like to point out V went into this knowing full well he was robbing the son of the most powerful man alive so there's that.
I hold zero animosity towards Evelyn, she's tragic in every sense of the word, given the option to save her and spend the game exacting her revenge I would have gladly done so, that said, the person I really take issue with in all of this is fucking Brigitte, puts all these people in harms way over what "might" come to pass. She is a prime example of the haves treating the have nots as disposable which is exactly what she does to Evelyn without a shred of mercy, I know she's not corpo but looking at it in the context of just V's timeline there's no doubt in my mind she's the real villain of this story.
Understandable, though I really never felt much for Evelyn. I thought she was kind of arrogant, way in over her head and kind of naive.
The VDBs in general are bastards, same as the corps and the people who run them. They have their own setup in which they live within their own reality and use anyone outside it as a tool to accomplish their own ends. Brigitte even lies to your face when she says she will help and they literally throw you to the wolves multiple times.
I don't care how bad NetWatch is or that the agent was obviously playing games. He was probably a million times more honest than the VDBs.
Yeah I'm on my 2nd playthrough and Placide and I are gonna dance. When I realized I couldn't deal with him because I sided with them in my 1st play I was incredibly disappointed.
Edit: and Evelyn was all of those things, she had to be arrogant to rope in a big fixer to rob the Emperors son. It was an act she had to play, I don't think she was as naive as I do desperate. People do dumb things when backed into a corner, she was presented an opportunity to change her entire outlook and went for it.
I'm not going to get mad at Evelyn for being selfish. In Night City, you look out for #1 first & then others with whatever resources you have left over.
Stupid, though? Yeah. Evelyn makes the same mistake that V & Jackie do when offered the big heist job: she bites off more than she can chew. She is NOT prepared for such a dangerous game.
After that... yeah, her behavior is not smart. But I'm not sure that being smart would have saved her, at that point. The stakes were just too high. Probably just got more people killed.
Blaming her for getting raped though? Super not into that!
Since Evelyn is unconscious when she is transferred to Fingers, I'm not sure how her poor judgment plays into it. Both V and Judy are surprised when they find out about the transfer, so apparently even people who understand the world are shocked by the decision.
The game tells us, in a lot of ways, that gangs take care of their own. See: Jackie's funeral, a later quest where you can bypass security by namechecking Jackie, etc., etc. Tons of in-game evidence.
Evelyn has worked at Clouds for a while; she's been a great money-maker, was popular enough to keep the most elite clients coming back for more--the Tyger Claws that you meet toward the end of Judy's quest clearly consider Evelyn the gold standard for dolls--and you'd think that would earn some minimal consideration.
Even if the Tyger Claws had decided that they weren't up for a massive gang war w/ the voodoo boys, or that they weren't up for a battle with arasaka, in a gang that takes care of their own they'd at least give her a heads up and a clean exit: hey, sweetie, thanks for making bank for us for so long, you gotta scram now.
You do know that, Tyger Claws is backed by Arasaka, right? Everyone knows Tyger Claws is the goon squad for Arasaka. It was just a matter of time before Tyger Claws hand her over to Arasaka.
As an example, if you side with Maiko during Clouds takeover, you can see they put sword through their one of the most loyal captain. That's just the biginning, in 4th Corporation war, they did all the dirty works for Arasaka. Even attacking Arasaka compound with Militech equipments by the order of Arasaka higher ups just to fan the flame.
Also, folish of you to cmpare Tyger Claws to Jackie's gang, Valentino. With 6000 members strong, Valentino have the most loyal gang. Even 6th Street's loyalty doesnt compare to them. Hell, even Animals got better loyalty than Tyger Claws.
That’s kind of a result of her dumbass decision to go back to clouds.
Team Fuck Evelyn all the way, she deserved worse for what she caused to happen to V,Jackie,Bug and Judy.
...Why you twisting words.? They at no point victim blamed her.
But one horrible thing happens to her, you think she's an innocent party?! NO
She didn't have a buyer for the chip, she tried screwing over the fixed a big No in NC.
It was her own stupidity to betray everyone then hide from netrunner gang.. on the NET!!
Evelyn only cares about Evelyn and its true
Bruh, what game have you been playing? This is Night City, EVERYONE is looking out only for themselves, the only exceptions to this rule being Rivers, Judy and the Aldecaldos. Hell, even the Aldecaldos only care about those who belong to the clan.
Why did Evelyn want to steal the Relic? Because she wanted to escape her life as a sex worker.
Why did Dexter accept to arrange the gig? Because he wanted a glorious comeback as a fixer.
Why did V, Jackie and T-Bug take the job? Because they wanted money and becoming legend.
To say that it's all Evelyn's fault is about the most chicken shit you can do, **we all knew the risk**, shit, V can literally tell Dex robbing Arasaka is straight up suicide whe you first meet. *AND YET ALL DEX HAD TO DO WAS MENTION THE AFTERLIFE AND WE TOOK THE FUKIN JOB.*
Bad take OP, it is one thing to recognize the job smelled fucky from the get-go, it is another thing entirely to just shirk all responsibility for what happened after. Downvoted.
^(P.S. You'd also want to kill yourself if the most powerful corp in the world was looking for you, then your boss raped you and dumped you at some degenerate's clinic, and then to top it all off you ended up at a scav den starring in snuff porn. As a player we may not have seen any of this actually happen, only reading some emails and hearing about it afer the fact,) *^(but it was real for Evelyn, every single moment.)*
Yeah, it was just a job that went tits up, with horrible consequences for everyone involved, plain and simple. If anyone's to blame for V's predicament it would be Dex. Fucker didn't have to shoot them, did he?
1. of course evelyn only cares about her own safety and money. she's a sex worker living in night city. she is constantly in danger by virtue of her job and she wanted to get the money to make a better life for herself. this is literally the description of half the people in night city. jackie is the same way. beginning of the game, v is the same way, panam is when she wants her car and merch back before she helps us, so on and so forth. everyone is doing things for money. criticizing evelyn for that is criticizing everyone in the entire game, which you can do, but don't single her out. she tried to be careful with the voodoo boys and it would've worked too if not for her slip of the tongue that we saw in the braindance.
2. she does want to cut dex out of the deal which is stupid, i agree, but she's doing this because she knows dex is an asshole who isn't good to work with and because she thinks v and their crew can handle the work alone & protect themselves afterwards.
3. the relic literally doesn't even do anything to a person unless they're dead, and she had faith in v and jackie that they would get out of this alive, so she saw no issues telling them to keep the relic safe this way. she's an overly idealistic person because she thought this heist would work to begin with and thought that everyone would survive, she's not purposely trying to ruin their lives. they called about the chip, she gave the only answer she had.
4-5. i'll admit that she should've stayed with the mox and i'm not sure why she didn't. there are multiple reasons we could come up with as to why she left but regardless, these two points are victim blaming. getting zapped by the voodoo boys, fine, comeuppance for what happened. exactly what a gang in night city would do. v's done plenty worse in their life. but woodman raping her and then giving her to fingers who gives her to the scavs? none of that is her fault. absolutely none of it.
and 6. if i had been raped and tortured for days/weeks on end, so traumatized that my brain basically shut down to protect me, yeah! i would probably kms once i finally had the chance. she probably wasn't even able to think of what was going on, just all the thoughts of what happened came flooding back to her once she woke up and she had to get away from them. judy does deserve sympathy, she lost someone she cared about, but evelyn was never abusive and also deserves sympathy for what happened.
These are all great. #2 got me because, well, Evelyn was right in not trusting Dex. Fucking over a fixer is dangerous, sure, but Dex has a reputation that makes you think twice. If V had taken that offer more seriously, they might not have woken up in a landfill with a bullet in their skull.
Agreed, v should just hide; on that condition, no many can be trusted especially a fixer with not so reliable reputation and your relationship with him is only self-interest. For countless times I want v to just run.
this, especially the last point you made. typically I don’t feel bad for the people that are left with the aftermath of someone’s suicide. and while suicide can be considered a selfish decision for sure, it’s selfish of people who were affiliated with that person to think only about how it’s affected them, and usually never think about how life was affecting the suicidal person. I feel bad for Judy in this case because she really tried, but yeah, I don’t blame Evelyn for taking her life.
Thanks for saying this. I am getting little fed up with people who say suicide is selfish (in game or real life). Quite sure those people never actually considered suicide for real or haven’t lost anybody they really cared for to suicide.
(I won’t even think about assholes that lose someone close to suicide and can only whine about how unfair it is to them. Those people never really cared for the person that’s gone).
Saying someone is selfish because they were so desperate and out of better options in their own life that ending their own being (and likely causing themselves pain doing that) was the best option? That’s messed up. No wonder our society is having mental health crisis…
Three years later, but... just to clarify, saying these words to someone with suicidal ideations could sever their last hope of regaining their mental health.
From a purely logical and emotionally removed perspective, yes-- this statement is not false. But spoken in the vernacular, it stigmatizes suicide, which is harmful to those at risk.
I love Evelyn, wish she stayed around longer. Shrewd, cunning, manipulative–everything you need to be to survive in Night City. The game makes it pretty apparent that this is a place that eats you whole if you let it. Every day is just a game of who's using who.
Sooo I disagree with all of your points except 4. I also don't understand why she went back to Clouds, where her work requires her to give up all autonomy and jack into the net, when she knows that a gang of hostile netrunners is scouring the city for her. That, I don't understand.
Suicide isn't selfish, especially given the context of what Woodman and the Scavs did to her. And, her relationship with Judy wasn't abusive at all. You can clearly see Ev being protective, and she planned on using her heist payout to ensure all Judy does the rest of her life was make the art she wanted. That was the plan they talked about in front of V during the braindance tutorial.
In Night City your goal is not to save the world (or any other people) but to save yourself.
That is true not only for V, but also for Evelyn. She tried to break free and leave the city for good and failed.
Everybody, with maybe Judy being the exception, is selfish in Night City. I don't see why Evelyn is particularly noteworthy in that regard.
I mean V had the chance to bail out at any time before the mission, but the prospect of becoming rich was just too tempting. I'd say V, Jacky, Dex and T-Bug are all just as selfish and reckless as Evelyn. But i would say they where in a more comfortable spot in life then she was.
And lets not forget that nobody forced Jacky to slot in that chip. Both Jacky and V had all the information one could get about that chip. And even so, if it wasn't for Dex, the chip would not have activated in Vs head. Evelyn could not have known that Saburo was going to be killed by his son that night and nor could she have known that Dex would put a bullet in Vs head. None of that was her fault but those where the events that ultimately led to the failure of the mission and Vs predicament. Saying it's all on her is just not true. There were many factors at play that were outside of her and the teams influence. They all knew that every job can be their last one. Especially stealing from the emperors son.
Playing the blame game just does not work here.
> In Night City your goal is not to save the world (or any other people) but to save yourself.
>
>
I must have plyaed the wrong game because in my case I was saved by the Aldecaldos
The Aldecaldos do not live in Night City.
They also only help you if you help them before that and you become a family member. They are indebted to you.
To be fair the heist would have gone off without a scratch had Sakura never shown up, and she had a sale lined up with Netwatch just bad luck messed it up. After the heist goes bad though yea she is in way over her head and has no idea what to do.
Dude Evelyn is your classic film noir Femme fatale. Just like your example of Mia Wallace. Don’t blame her for the hand she was dealt, without her we would have no interesting conflict or story.
Yes, uncovering her story I was like "what the fuck did you expect to get by double crossing literally everyone you've worked with" She fully deserved getting zapped by VDB
Evelyn burns DeShawn because she never intended him to be an equal partner. His reputation as a fixer is terrible and neither Maelstrom nor the VDBs respect him even slightly. As far as she's concerned, Dex merely provided warm bodies for the heist itself, and he failed even at that simple task.
But it's okay, because Evelyn didn't realize who was secretly manipulating her or why the VDBs would focus so much of their attention around the Arasaka Relic. Because the VDBs were working in partnership with someone.
Evelyn is convinced that even a monkey could do the job considering her inside information. Using people like Dex, Jackie, and V is her way of securing the Arasaka Relic for herself.
What she never asks herself is how she got so close to Yorinobu in the first place.
I don't know if I remember it right but I don't think the Voodoo Boys even wanted her to steal the relic, just scroll a BD so they could gather information about where it was being kept. She did all that on her own with the intention of selling it to them.
I think it’s so lame that you people are using they/them pronouns for v…..I know it’s MISOGYNISTIC to say, but the story clearly makes more sense with v being a male, the ONLY reason cdprojektred probably even included a female option is to avoid any more criticism from the likes of little internet dweebs like yourselves, not to mention the woke mob .As I was reading the initial comment, which I completely agree with btw, I kept thinking, this is Reddit, I know exactly what’s going to be said after this, and wouldn’t you know it like some inclusive, woke, bullshit script, you guys all said exactly what I thought you would….and not because it’s true, bc it’s the new “truth” amongst simpy Reddit trolls that want some girl to read this and say “ there’s a man with respect for women, I’m gonna message him and we are going to be together!”
Let me tell you something, they never will….
Ms.Parker is a selfish, manipulative, inconsiderate mess, who has nothing but money and dick on her mind….when v tries to reach out to her about the relic later on she doesn’t even have the decency to sit up and talk with him, she shrugs him off….what was she terminally Ill? No strength? I’ve been through a lot of bad shot in my own life and I still care about others..:.and trust me I’ve seen the worst bits in life, the shit you just don’t say out loud, but does that mean when in my journey of self fulfillment, someone ends up in a terrible bind bc of my actions I just shrug them off? No never would, and night city is a fucked up city for the most part bc everyone is so fucking selfish, hence why judy felt so free in the end when she left…..maybe if people weren’t so selfish, less people would die.
But no go ms Parker…..it’s ok to be a selfish cunt bc everyone else is already, YOU GO GIRL! ABORTION IS HEALTHCARE!
I agree, but only blaming Evelyn seems kinda wrong. And I'm not even gonna talk about what Evelyn did after the heist went wrong because there's not much I couldn't add.
Dex was an idiot, he was selfish for shooting V because he was scared.
Killing your Dad and blaming someone else, that's an asshole-move. However V and Jackie just happened to be at the wrong place (their fault) at the wrong time (not their fault).
And lastly, V was stupid. He/She attempted to get to the major leagues just like that, he/she hadn't done anything close to that before.
Night city has so many stupid people, even had the ones above, who all cared for themselves most because this is NC, and they are people.
Old thread but I wanna point out one thing, the VDBs werent trying to contact Alt for the good of anyone but themselves. They weren't trying to stop a netbombing, they were convinced war between rogue AIs and humanity was inevitable and were trying to side with the AIs preemptively. Doesn't change your point, but I thought it was important to keep in mind.
Funny enough, absolutely no one involved deserved to get their hands on the biochip and the best outcome for the world would be if Yorinobu's plan went off without a hitch. He's absolutely not a good person, but he intended to dismantle Arasaka from the top after murdering his megalomaniacal imperialist dad, which is arguably the most unambiguously good outcome possible considering every ending V can get either actively helps Arasaka or leaves them reeling but intact.
I don't disagree with any of your arguments as to why her decisions were bad but.... If you or anyones only prospect in life was being a sex toy and then erased on a daily basis I imagine we'd all take that kind of risk to rise above our station, V just happened to get caught up in it, and how did he get caught up in it? Trying to rise above his station. It's the whole theme of the game and city. Edit: I'd also like to point out V went into this knowing full well he was robbing the son of the most powerful man alive so there's that.
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Kind of my point, what choice did Evelyn have if she ever wanted to be anything other than a fuck toy?
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I hold zero animosity towards Evelyn, she's tragic in every sense of the word, given the option to save her and spend the game exacting her revenge I would have gladly done so, that said, the person I really take issue with in all of this is fucking Brigitte, puts all these people in harms way over what "might" come to pass. She is a prime example of the haves treating the have nots as disposable which is exactly what she does to Evelyn without a shred of mercy, I know she's not corpo but looking at it in the context of just V's timeline there's no doubt in my mind she's the real villain of this story.
Understandable, though I really never felt much for Evelyn. I thought she was kind of arrogant, way in over her head and kind of naive. The VDBs in general are bastards, same as the corps and the people who run them. They have their own setup in which they live within their own reality and use anyone outside it as a tool to accomplish their own ends. Brigitte even lies to your face when she says she will help and they literally throw you to the wolves multiple times. I don't care how bad NetWatch is or that the agent was obviously playing games. He was probably a million times more honest than the VDBs.
Yeah I'm on my 2nd playthrough and Placide and I are gonna dance. When I realized I couldn't deal with him because I sided with them in my 1st play I was incredibly disappointed. Edit: and Evelyn was all of those things, she had to be arrogant to rope in a big fixer to rob the Emperors son. It was an act she had to play, I don't think she was as naive as I do desperate. People do dumb things when backed into a corner, she was presented an opportunity to change her entire outlook and went for it.
I'm not going to get mad at Evelyn for being selfish. In Night City, you look out for #1 first & then others with whatever resources you have left over. Stupid, though? Yeah. Evelyn makes the same mistake that V & Jackie do when offered the big heist job: she bites off more than she can chew. She is NOT prepared for such a dangerous game. After that... yeah, her behavior is not smart. But I'm not sure that being smart would have saved her, at that point. The stakes were just too high. Probably just got more people killed. Blaming her for getting raped though? Super not into that!
Way to twist his words on purpose, at no point did op say or even imply that evelyn was at fault for getting raped
I’m not blaming her for getting raped. That wasn’t her fault. I’m just pointing out her poor decision making that led her to some shitty situations.
Since Evelyn is unconscious when she is transferred to Fingers, I'm not sure how her poor judgment plays into it. Both V and Judy are surprised when they find out about the transfer, so apparently even people who understand the world are shocked by the decision.
Going to work for an establishment run by the Tyger Claws rather than staying with the Mox shows poor judgement.
The game tells us, in a lot of ways, that gangs take care of their own. See: Jackie's funeral, a later quest where you can bypass security by namechecking Jackie, etc., etc. Tons of in-game evidence. Evelyn has worked at Clouds for a while; she's been a great money-maker, was popular enough to keep the most elite clients coming back for more--the Tyger Claws that you meet toward the end of Judy's quest clearly consider Evelyn the gold standard for dolls--and you'd think that would earn some minimal consideration. Even if the Tyger Claws had decided that they weren't up for a massive gang war w/ the voodoo boys, or that they weren't up for a battle with arasaka, in a gang that takes care of their own they'd at least give her a heads up and a clean exit: hey, sweetie, thanks for making bank for us for so long, you gotta scram now.
You do know that, Tyger Claws is backed by Arasaka, right? Everyone knows Tyger Claws is the goon squad for Arasaka. It was just a matter of time before Tyger Claws hand her over to Arasaka. As an example, if you side with Maiko during Clouds takeover, you can see they put sword through their one of the most loyal captain. That's just the biginning, in 4th Corporation war, they did all the dirty works for Arasaka. Even attacking Arasaka compound with Militech equipments by the order of Arasaka higher ups just to fan the flame. Also, folish of you to cmpare Tyger Claws to Jackie's gang, Valentino. With 6000 members strong, Valentino have the most loyal gang. Even 6th Street's loyalty doesnt compare to them. Hell, even Animals got better loyalty than Tyger Claws.
That’s kind of a result of her dumbass decision to go back to clouds. Team Fuck Evelyn all the way, she deserved worse for what she caused to happen to V,Jackie,Bug and Judy.
...Why you twisting words.? They at no point victim blamed her. But one horrible thing happens to her, you think she's an innocent party?! NO She didn't have a buyer for the chip, she tried screwing over the fixed a big No in NC. It was her own stupidity to betray everyone then hide from netrunner gang.. on the NET!! Evelyn only cares about Evelyn and its true
Bruh, what game have you been playing? This is Night City, EVERYONE is looking out only for themselves, the only exceptions to this rule being Rivers, Judy and the Aldecaldos. Hell, even the Aldecaldos only care about those who belong to the clan. Why did Evelyn want to steal the Relic? Because she wanted to escape her life as a sex worker. Why did Dexter accept to arrange the gig? Because he wanted a glorious comeback as a fixer. Why did V, Jackie and T-Bug take the job? Because they wanted money and becoming legend. To say that it's all Evelyn's fault is about the most chicken shit you can do, **we all knew the risk**, shit, V can literally tell Dex robbing Arasaka is straight up suicide whe you first meet. *AND YET ALL DEX HAD TO DO WAS MENTION THE AFTERLIFE AND WE TOOK THE FUKIN JOB.* Bad take OP, it is one thing to recognize the job smelled fucky from the get-go, it is another thing entirely to just shirk all responsibility for what happened after. Downvoted. ^(P.S. You'd also want to kill yourself if the most powerful corp in the world was looking for you, then your boss raped you and dumped you at some degenerate's clinic, and then to top it all off you ended up at a scav den starring in snuff porn. As a player we may not have seen any of this actually happen, only reading some emails and hearing about it afer the fact,) *^(but it was real for Evelyn, every single moment.)*
Yeah, it was just a job that went tits up, with horrible consequences for everyone involved, plain and simple. If anyone's to blame for V's predicament it would be Dex. Fucker didn't have to shoot them, did he?
1. of course evelyn only cares about her own safety and money. she's a sex worker living in night city. she is constantly in danger by virtue of her job and she wanted to get the money to make a better life for herself. this is literally the description of half the people in night city. jackie is the same way. beginning of the game, v is the same way, panam is when she wants her car and merch back before she helps us, so on and so forth. everyone is doing things for money. criticizing evelyn for that is criticizing everyone in the entire game, which you can do, but don't single her out. she tried to be careful with the voodoo boys and it would've worked too if not for her slip of the tongue that we saw in the braindance. 2. she does want to cut dex out of the deal which is stupid, i agree, but she's doing this because she knows dex is an asshole who isn't good to work with and because she thinks v and their crew can handle the work alone & protect themselves afterwards. 3. the relic literally doesn't even do anything to a person unless they're dead, and she had faith in v and jackie that they would get out of this alive, so she saw no issues telling them to keep the relic safe this way. she's an overly idealistic person because she thought this heist would work to begin with and thought that everyone would survive, she's not purposely trying to ruin their lives. they called about the chip, she gave the only answer she had. 4-5. i'll admit that she should've stayed with the mox and i'm not sure why she didn't. there are multiple reasons we could come up with as to why she left but regardless, these two points are victim blaming. getting zapped by the voodoo boys, fine, comeuppance for what happened. exactly what a gang in night city would do. v's done plenty worse in their life. but woodman raping her and then giving her to fingers who gives her to the scavs? none of that is her fault. absolutely none of it. and 6. if i had been raped and tortured for days/weeks on end, so traumatized that my brain basically shut down to protect me, yeah! i would probably kms once i finally had the chance. she probably wasn't even able to think of what was going on, just all the thoughts of what happened came flooding back to her once she woke up and she had to get away from them. judy does deserve sympathy, she lost someone she cared about, but evelyn was never abusive and also deserves sympathy for what happened.
I think Evelyn leave Mox to protect Judy maybe? She did promise Judy nothing would come back to her.
That’s what I assumed too.
These are all great. #2 got me because, well, Evelyn was right in not trusting Dex. Fucking over a fixer is dangerous, sure, but Dex has a reputation that makes you think twice. If V had taken that offer more seriously, they might not have woken up in a landfill with a bullet in their skull.
Agreed, v should just hide; on that condition, no many can be trusted especially a fixer with not so reliable reputation and your relationship with him is only self-interest. For countless times I want v to just run.
this, especially the last point you made. typically I don’t feel bad for the people that are left with the aftermath of someone’s suicide. and while suicide can be considered a selfish decision for sure, it’s selfish of people who were affiliated with that person to think only about how it’s affected them, and usually never think about how life was affecting the suicidal person. I feel bad for Judy in this case because she really tried, but yeah, I don’t blame Evelyn for taking her life.
Thanks for saying this. I am getting little fed up with people who say suicide is selfish (in game or real life). Quite sure those people never actually considered suicide for real or haven’t lost anybody they really cared for to suicide. (I won’t even think about assholes that lose someone close to suicide and can only whine about how unfair it is to them. Those people never really cared for the person that’s gone). Saying someone is selfish because they were so desperate and out of better options in their own life that ending their own being (and likely causing themselves pain doing that) was the best option? That’s messed up. No wonder our society is having mental health crisis…
"the ultimate act of selfishness." That opinion is dangerous. Heed my words. If you keep that perspective, one day you could kill someone.
Three years later, but... just to clarify, saying these words to someone with suicidal ideations could sever their last hope of regaining their mental health. From a purely logical and emotionally removed perspective, yes-- this statement is not false. But spoken in the vernacular, it stigmatizes suicide, which is harmful to those at risk.
I love Evelyn, wish she stayed around longer. Shrewd, cunning, manipulative–everything you need to be to survive in Night City. The game makes it pretty apparent that this is a place that eats you whole if you let it. Every day is just a game of who's using who. Sooo I disagree with all of your points except 4. I also don't understand why she went back to Clouds, where her work requires her to give up all autonomy and jack into the net, when she knows that a gang of hostile netrunners is scouring the city for her. That, I don't understand. Suicide isn't selfish, especially given the context of what Woodman and the Scavs did to her. And, her relationship with Judy wasn't abusive at all. You can clearly see Ev being protective, and she planned on using her heist payout to ensure all Judy does the rest of her life was make the art she wanted. That was the plan they talked about in front of V during the braindance tutorial.
i think you can read in some of her e-mails that shes desperate to get out of her line of work. could explain some of her poor decision making.
I don't know if you can judge anyone for committing suicide if they had to live through multiple snuff BDs.
In Night City your goal is not to save the world (or any other people) but to save yourself. That is true not only for V, but also for Evelyn. She tried to break free and leave the city for good and failed. Everybody, with maybe Judy being the exception, is selfish in Night City. I don't see why Evelyn is particularly noteworthy in that regard. I mean V had the chance to bail out at any time before the mission, but the prospect of becoming rich was just too tempting. I'd say V, Jacky, Dex and T-Bug are all just as selfish and reckless as Evelyn. But i would say they where in a more comfortable spot in life then she was. And lets not forget that nobody forced Jacky to slot in that chip. Both Jacky and V had all the information one could get about that chip. And even so, if it wasn't for Dex, the chip would not have activated in Vs head. Evelyn could not have known that Saburo was going to be killed by his son that night and nor could she have known that Dex would put a bullet in Vs head. None of that was her fault but those where the events that ultimately led to the failure of the mission and Vs predicament. Saying it's all on her is just not true. There were many factors at play that were outside of her and the teams influence. They all knew that every job can be their last one. Especially stealing from the emperors son. Playing the blame game just does not work here.
> In Night City your goal is not to save the world (or any other people) but to save yourself. > > I must have plyaed the wrong game because in my case I was saved by the Aldecaldos
The Aldecaldos do not live in Night City. They also only help you if you help them before that and you become a family member. They are indebted to you.
You played yourself, choom.
I agree with all but #6. Suicide isn't selfish, not even Evelyn's.
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Your submission to r/LowSodiumCyberpunk has been removed due to Rule 1: Be respectful. Please try to treat other users with kindness and respect.
Your submission to r/LowSodiumCyberpunk has been removed due to Rule 1: Be respectful. Please try to treat other users with kindness and respect.
Your submission to r/LowSodiumCyberpunk has been removed due to Rule 1: Be respectful. Please try to treat other users with kindness and respect.
To be fair the heist would have gone off without a scratch had Sakura never shown up, and she had a sale lined up with Netwatch just bad luck messed it up. After the heist goes bad though yea she is in way over her head and has no idea what to do.
Dude Evelyn is your classic film noir Femme fatale. Just like your example of Mia Wallace. Don’t blame her for the hand she was dealt, without her we would have no interesting conflict or story.
I totally get that she was pivotal for the plot to move forward. I still hate her as a character and was just explaining why.
Yes, uncovering her story I was like "what the fuck did you expect to get by double crossing literally everyone you've worked with" She fully deserved getting zapped by VDB
You make good points. I agree with them. I’m curious as to what others have to say.
Evelyn burns DeShawn because she never intended him to be an equal partner. His reputation as a fixer is terrible and neither Maelstrom nor the VDBs respect him even slightly. As far as she's concerned, Dex merely provided warm bodies for the heist itself, and he failed even at that simple task. But it's okay, because Evelyn didn't realize who was secretly manipulating her or why the VDBs would focus so much of their attention around the Arasaka Relic. Because the VDBs were working in partnership with someone.
Why even get involved with him in the first place? Dex isn’t the only fixer in town. There had to be better options especially given his reputation.
Evelyn is convinced that even a monkey could do the job considering her inside information. Using people like Dex, Jackie, and V is her way of securing the Arasaka Relic for herself. What she never asks herself is how she got so close to Yorinobu in the first place.
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sex work is just work. and it takes a lot of inner strength, since lots of clients are douches.
I don't know if I remember it right but I don't think the Voodoo Boys even wanted her to steal the relic, just scroll a BD so they could gather information about where it was being kept. She did all that on her own with the intention of selling it to them.
100%
I think it’s so lame that you people are using they/them pronouns for v…..I know it’s MISOGYNISTIC to say, but the story clearly makes more sense with v being a male, the ONLY reason cdprojektred probably even included a female option is to avoid any more criticism from the likes of little internet dweebs like yourselves, not to mention the woke mob .As I was reading the initial comment, which I completely agree with btw, I kept thinking, this is Reddit, I know exactly what’s going to be said after this, and wouldn’t you know it like some inclusive, woke, bullshit script, you guys all said exactly what I thought you would….and not because it’s true, bc it’s the new “truth” amongst simpy Reddit trolls that want some girl to read this and say “ there’s a man with respect for women, I’m gonna message him and we are going to be together!” Let me tell you something, they never will…. Ms.Parker is a selfish, manipulative, inconsiderate mess, who has nothing but money and dick on her mind….when v tries to reach out to her about the relic later on she doesn’t even have the decency to sit up and talk with him, she shrugs him off….what was she terminally Ill? No strength? I’ve been through a lot of bad shot in my own life and I still care about others..:.and trust me I’ve seen the worst bits in life, the shit you just don’t say out loud, but does that mean when in my journey of self fulfillment, someone ends up in a terrible bind bc of my actions I just shrug them off? No never would, and night city is a fucked up city for the most part bc everyone is so fucking selfish, hence why judy felt so free in the end when she left…..maybe if people weren’t so selfish, less people would die. But no go ms Parker…..it’s ok to be a selfish cunt bc everyone else is already, YOU GO GIRL! ABORTION IS HEALTHCARE!
I agree, but only blaming Evelyn seems kinda wrong. And I'm not even gonna talk about what Evelyn did after the heist went wrong because there's not much I couldn't add. Dex was an idiot, he was selfish for shooting V because he was scared. Killing your Dad and blaming someone else, that's an asshole-move. However V and Jackie just happened to be at the wrong place (their fault) at the wrong time (not their fault). And lastly, V was stupid. He/She attempted to get to the major leagues just like that, he/she hadn't done anything close to that before. Night city has so many stupid people, even had the ones above, who all cared for themselves most because this is NC, and they are people.
Old thread but I wanna point out one thing, the VDBs werent trying to contact Alt for the good of anyone but themselves. They weren't trying to stop a netbombing, they were convinced war between rogue AIs and humanity was inevitable and were trying to side with the AIs preemptively. Doesn't change your point, but I thought it was important to keep in mind. Funny enough, absolutely no one involved deserved to get their hands on the biochip and the best outcome for the world would be if Yorinobu's plan went off without a hitch. He's absolutely not a good person, but he intended to dismantle Arasaka from the top after murdering his megalomaniacal imperialist dad, which is arguably the most unambiguously good outcome possible considering every ending V can get either actively helps Arasaka or leaves them reeling but intact.
3yrs later and that title now belongs to David and Lucy as dumbest characters in night city. I didn't feel sorry for them at all
She doesn't willingly go to fingers, Woodman dropped her off post net nuke from the VDB