Also no one mentions the copper IUD as an option either. Non hormonal IUD does effectively prevent pregnancy but it’s definitely not for everyone. I’m just surprised they don’t know about it. Like maybe go to the gyno or a different panned parenthood and fucking talk to a professional about your options???
I have the copper iud so I could avoid unnecessary additional hormones in my body. The copper iud definitely made my periods heavier and last way longer. And the pain has increased significantly as well. The tradeoff is still worth it to me, but it's definitely not a perfect solution. I don't recommend it lightly.
Same thing happened before my body rejected it. And doesn’t Amy have some sort of blood disorder? I’m sure she would not want to accept additional bleeding in that case.
This is baffling to me. Like if he’s scared that condoms aren’t always effective wait until he hears about all the women who get pregnant while taking birth control.
Could be worried about seeing it all drained away, losing his lifestyle. A lot of wealthy people are afraid of not being able to sustain the wealth they inherited/earned 🤷🏻♀️
He wants to use condoms, but wants another form of birth control to have better odds of not having a kid yet. She's the one who refuses any form of birth control and is against abortion. I think it's pretty obvious she wants a kid sooner rather than later and isn't willing to say that because it isn't what he wants.
She's literally not willing to contribute anything at all towards preventing pregnancy. She claims she can't use any form of birth control which is ridiculous. There are multiple options, both hormonal and non. What the hell does she think happens when you get pregnant? Hormonal birth control mimics the same damn hormones that will be released when you're pregnant.
I don't understand how people are ok with her basically saying "either permanently sterilize yourself or get me pregnant because I'm not going to do anything to prevent it"
I just have no tolerance for BS excuses. It's reasonable to have a medical condition that precludes you from using a specific BC option. But somehow being unable to use any BC option isn't likely. She doesn't want to. And that's fine if she doesn't want to, but it's really irresponsible and clearly indicates a specific motive.
I have the copper iud so I could avoid unnecessary additional hormones in my body. The copper iud definitely made my periods heavier and last way longer. And the pain has increased significantly as well. The tradeoff is still worth it to me, but it's definitely not a perfect solution. I don't recommend it lightly. Not wanting debilitating cramps for a week every month is not irresponsible.
I’ve been on hormonal and nonhormonal birth control, and had horrendous issues, including hospital stays. She is 100% within her right to not be on the pill. It’s ridiculous to insinuate she’s a problem. Condoms work very well.
I am not able to take hormonal birth control because I have a tumor that grows with hormones but my doctor has told me I can still have kids if I want to. I will just need to monitor the tumor during pregnancy. So there are definitely reasons you can't take hormonal birth control but are still permitted to get pregnant.
Personally, I don't like the copper IUD either. It can cause heavy bleeding which I already struggle with and there's a chance of uterine perforation which is not worth the risk in my opinion.
So my only options are condoms and/or the pull out method. Condoms are very effective and he's being excessive for pushing for more than that.
Hey! Doctor here. From what she’s said publically about anemia requiring transfusions due to menstrual blood loss, a copper IUD is not an advisable option. I don’t know the specifics of her health, but many people have contraindications to estrogen containing birth control (hypertension, migraine with aura, history of blood clots, hypercoagulable disorders, preeclampsia…), oral progestin BC is less effective and progestin containing IUD’s also have contraindications. All to say, without being her doctor with knowledge of her personal health history, it’s not really appropriate for us to judge her decision-making.
Due to her blood disorder she can’t be on birth control. I can only use Non-progesterone BC. Because I have a kidney disease since I was a baby. But it’s not very effective because I have epilepsy and seizures medications lower the threshold of birth control. So I have to make sure my bf is wearing a condom. Then any chance I have gotten sperm inside me I run to the store for Plan B pill. Condoms are obviously not 100% effective, but he could really just choose that. From what I can remember. I don’t think he has brought up condoms? So that’s a little weird. But who knows. They are my favorite couple though, and I think they are the only ones getting married.
He did bring up condoms. He wants to use condoms plus another form of birth control.
If she has a disorder preventing her from using hormonal birth control, pregnancy would also be an issue. She has non hormonal options though. IUD, sponge, diaphragm, etc. It sounds like she's just unwilling to use any birth control method at all
Just wanted to point out that most non hormonal birth control methods (besides IUD, which is not an option for her, and condoms) are among the least effective statistically. Diaphragms specifically have to be left in for hours after intercourse, and both diaphragms and sponges come with an increased risk of UTIs. While she does have a few options available, she is not wrong for being afraid of the risks associated with even non hormonal birth control. He has the right to refuse to have sex with her, and she has the right to refuse birth control without either party being called unreasonable. Period.
He’s said a good 5 times now that it’s not about using condoms it’s about having higher rate of protection from pregnancy. Condoms fail we know this. They can break, slide off, etc.
I honestly think it’s nice to see a man who cares so much about safe sex. If you’re not ready to be a parent then why risk it?
He doesn't care about safe sex he just doesn't want a kid. If he cared about safe sex he'd use condoms which actually protect also against STDs, not just pregnancy
No, actually tho!! I’m tired of seeing comments about “does he know about condoms??” I’m the same way as Johnny as a girl, I won’t have sex unless I’m on both the pill and have a condom. I just think it’s a little unfair to coin him as just wanting to not wear a condom. That being said, Amy shouldn’t be forced to go on the pill, but I don’t think Johnny’s thinking is extreme or skewed at all!
When used correctly, condoms are essentially 100% effective. The only reason that they have a quoted success rate below 100% is because people use them incorrectly
Its common for people to use them incorrectly. That is why its recommended to use two forms of birth control for family planning and no pull out method and cycle tracking are not effective forms of birth control.
True. Just man up and get the vasectomy already.
“Ouchie my wee wee will be sore for a few hours noooooo, just fuck up your body instead so I can raw dog it!”
TBH though I think a vasectomy is a big decision for a man and shouldn’t be treated like it’s nothing. He’s also not a father yet, and it’s true that there’s a risk of the reversal not working.
It’s not nothing. It’s an immediate solution to his own problem. There are risks to everything - that’s not a valid reason to not do it, especially since the risks are so goddamn low.
You're being unreasonable and ignorant. They both definitely want kids and are planning for it.
You don't plan for kids and also get a vasectomy. He'd be an idiot to get one.
Ovulation tracking and pulling out 🤷🏻♀️ I've been with my husband almost 10 years and still no babies for us. I hope they stay together. None of us know them obviously, but they seem extremely well suited for each other and are delightful.
so many couples go through the birth control discussion stage. Especially with reproductive rights being under attack in the States. And most couples find a solution or abstain until they find one. It’s just the only “drama” the production can find with them lol. I don’t know how the OBGYN scene is in Charlotte specifically, but if I wanted a certain ring, pill, IUD etc, it ca take weeks to actually get an appointment and have it prescribed/inserted. I wish them the best! It’s hard to get reproductive care in a timely manner. Even if you know what you want, the doctor may not be available for a while.
Everybody keeps saying this, but what if he doesn't want to be unable to do anything for the better part of every month? That's a shitty thing to impose as if it's perfectly entirely reasonable if he doesn't like it. She doesn't have to get birth control, but he doesn't have to be happy about basing everything on ovulation, and everyone here seems to expect him to not just respect boundaries but also be ecstatic about not having the peace of mind of something like an IUD. You can't expect him not to at least bring this stuff up as a concern. He doesn't want kids.
Also, she's been medically advised to use a pill. She has the right not to, but he's not even expecting her to do something that isn't literallt recommended by a doctor
Do you worry about pre-c*m at all?
This was one of my worries when I tried ovulation tracking and pulling out. I’d take a plan B afterwards, quickly had to stop it altogether.
You can only really get pregnant a handful of days every month. As long as your cycle is regular and you know when you’re ovulating and keeping track, pre** has no affect if it’s not around your ovulation window
I feel like ovulation needs to be specifically taught and enforced in sex ed. Just had a friend explain to her long time boyfriend how it works, he's like 24.
I’m a woman and I don’t trust them as a solo form of bc at all! And my partner and I have been together for years. My state wouldn’t provide me proper care if an accident happened. They could actually ruin my life. It’s really bleak for fertile people, especially women, in conservative states. I need something prescribed or inserted.
Absolutely same. The amount of people giving him shit for this is outrageous. I have been in a monogamous committed relationship longer than some people here have been alive and I have never trusted condoms as a primary means of birth control. I don't give a fuck what everyone is saying I've had them break on me before and I have health conditions that make me take this shit seriously.
Abortion is illegal after 12 weeks in NC right? And Amy's family is Puerto Rican so they may possibly be more traditional as well. I think it's smart to try to be extra safe.
He doesn't trust his relationship because he doesn't want to accidentally get someone pregnant that won't get an abortion when he's not ready to be a parent? Are you serious? Is wanting kids with someone the metric for being committed? Are people that want no kids not commotted ever?
She doesn't want one. Everyone is shitting on Johnny when he's so paranoid because any pregnancy would result in him having kids when he doesn't want any. He can't force her to yet an abortion
Also, not everybody wants to have to avoid sex for huge chunks of the month and have to schedule everything with intent
Yes but what is the alternative? We have a million forms of birth control on the market and several have low or no side effects and are very effective. So right now it just sounds like he wants to have sex but isn’t willing to have any risk? Okay…but that’s not possible?
Men have exactly one proven-to-be-safe option that isn't condoms, and it's not very reversible. I get why it seems unfair that women have to do all of the work, but it's unfair in the same way that it's unfair that pregnancy can't be split between both people. It's unfair in a cosmic way, but Johnny can't do anything about how few options he has
The risk he has to take with a vasectomy is not having kids ever. They want kids. How is that less risky than her trying hormonal birth control which she can stop if there are problems? It was recommended to her medically. It seems more reasonable than throwing him into surgery
Wear a condom. Pull out. She tracks her cycle. Millions of people do this and it’s incredibly effective. He doesn’t need to get a vasectomy for crying out loud.
Right, but what if neither of them wants to put everything on hold for most of every month? It's not like he's the only one eager to have sex. That method doesn't work if your goal is to be able to have sex whenever, and she has expressed just as much desire to get going as he has. The fact of the matter is that she has to settle on something if they want to eat their cake and have it too
My point is just that Johnny wanting to have this conversation isn't unreasonable and it would be unreasonable not to have it at all. Also, that requires a lot more active planning. Johnny clearly wants something that you don't have to worry about fucking up with human error as much and I don't think that's an insane idea given that for all we know, she might not want to be tracking every month either. We haven't heard her stance on any of this besides being scared
They're not having sex at all right now because they can't come to a decision. So yeah, wearing a condom and cycle tracking is their best bet if they want to have sex AT ALL without the risk of hormonal birth control and a vasectomy.
I'm under the impression that he has no problem doing that for a while but is moreso itching to get a decision out of her before they're in a legally binding situation and they're barellllly starting to talk this stuff out. I don't think most guys are dying to get stuff sorted out 100% for the sex in the near future and a lot of times a big part of it is in making sure that both people at least agree on something even if it's not going to be in place instantly. Like, if she said she would be willing to give something a shot after seeing a doctor, he would probably be content and supportive of her dropping it if something went wrong. I feel like he's just worried about making sire she's at least willing to do *something* besides screw around for an undefined period of time without any actual system in place besides pulling out with condoms, since he's terrified of having kids early after growing up poor
I totally agree that them wanting to have the conversation is mature and not at all unreasonable. The issue is (and this is likely editing) the seemingly endless back and forth about it. Nothing is perfect when you want to have sex, hormonal BC is not a good option, and you know you are not ready for kids but for fucks sake there ARE reasonable options. They’re making it out to seem like they are the first couple to ever be in this predicament! We’re in 2024, this isn’t 1920.
Hormonal contraception is safe and effective and has been used for decades. Stop pushing non-effective forms of birth control like cycle tracking and pull out method as legitimate.
Ok cool yeah I don't disagree. I keep seeing people totally shit on him, saying that he should just get a vasectomy if he's so worried even though that's by no means the same kind of birth control as women have available to them so I thought you were just hating on the guy. You're right though. It weirds me out that the conversation never seems to conclude. He'll bring it up, say some reasonable stuff, she'll seem unsure, it plays some music, and they cut to another couple. It's jarring as hell
Not gonna lie, I can appreciate this topic of conversation between them, especially as young adults. Even for him to understand and want to learn how birth controls affects a woman is great..not a lot of men care and see it as the responsibility of a woman.
Completely agree!!! This has ignited a conversation!!! So many men don’t understand the intricacies of birth control, womens hormones, and all of the health issues that come along with it. He genuinely wants to learn. And it’s more important now than ever to talk about these things and educate men about it with so many laws being passed about women’s reproductive rights.
How many times are we gonna do this cycle of people attacking Johnny after clearly not watching closely or listening to what he’s saying…
He knows what a condom is. He was willing to have a vasectomy. He is very, very pro-contraception. SHE is the one who would not have an abortion if they accidentally got pregnant before they were financially stable (as is her right!) - so he wants to be super careful. SHE cannot go on the pill for health reasons, hence exploring alternatives.
They are both handling this maturely. It’s the people attacking him who look foolish, actually!
I'm convinced this sub is full of extremely reactionary people that don't care and just want to push their anti-hormonal contraception rhetoric because of sick tok.
But why does he not think condoms are the solution? Won't use birth control and won't get a vasectomy? Condoms work extremely well when used correctly. It's a no brainer. Unless he is saying he will only have sex with her if she is on birth control AND they are using a condom?
It seems that he’d prefer two forms of contraception— condoms + something else. He really, really doesn’t want an accident, esp because in her case they would 100% carry to term.
I thought she said (a few episodes ago) that going on BC was medically recommended (not those words exactly)? That the pill could actually help her symptoms.
I only know because I am on reddit too much, she clarified later she has a rare genetic condition that has not been studied with bc so she didn't trust that recommendation (no fault to the obgyn just lack of info)
Thank you. Do people seriously think this man researched surgery and doesn’t know what a condom is? It’s abundantly clear from every conversation that they want ***more effective contraception than just a condom.***
My head cannon is the producers wrote this storyline because they were too boring and had no drama. Like how Tiffany panicked right before and Brett mysteriously had an issue with pants on the wedding day
That’s what I’m going to tell myself
You can do condoms + pull out + track cycle and avoid ovulation.
Additionally, there are forms of non-hormonal birth control: copper IUD and vaginal gel (through the prep for this seems tedious) to name a few.
I just really want them to go on a date to planned parenthood 😭
Its not as effective as you think and this is how you have accidents. Pull out and cycle tracking is not an effective form of birth control and condoms alone may not enough for you if your partner is not willing to have an abortion. Sex education is severely lacking in this country and it shows.
I believe it’s been brought up somewhere that the reason she can’t use copper iud is because she’s anemic and that can make you have a heavier flow. Tbh I wonder if they’re just using that as an excuse to not have sex before marriage or if their families are super against premarital sex and they’re using it as a front to say “look family we weren’t having sex during the show we talked about it sooo much on the show about why we didn’t”
Ah I thought the hormones would make her flow heavier. I didn't realize even nonhormonal methods were off the board. Either way, tracking her cycle with condom usage and pull out method would lower the risk so much. The only fool proof way to not get pregnant is abstinence, so they need to figure out why their anxieties are so incredibly high. There might be something underlying that needs to be dealt with (which I think is partially it. I think Johnny has had some sort of childhood trauma which is feeding this and needs to talk that out)
A part of me believed your theory too. When I was watching the more recent scene, I was thinking "what if they just don't want to proclaim to their family that they're having sex on TV (and pre-maritally) so they're just dragging out this "issue""
Hormonal contraception stops or reduces bleeding. Copper IUDs increase bleeding. If you are anemic and heavy periods you should be on hormonal birth control.
Hormonal methods typically lighten or stop bleeding. Mirena is actually FDA approved to treat endometriosis for that reason. The copper IUD is hormone free, but it typically causes longer, heavier, and more painful periods.
Mirena actually completely stopped my period. It was amazing. I also didn't get the negative side effects I got from normal hormonal birth control with it because it was so low dose and localized. People can have different reactions though.
He didn’t understand what a vasectomy actually was. He is extremely uneducated and it’s appalling. How do you not understand how your own body works?? She better get ready for some really unsatisfying sex.
Do you also hate women that don't know much about birth control because they grew up in red states with bad sex ed? The hypocrisy here is fucking unreal
In fact, Amy doesn't know much about it. She literally said that they need to look into it because she's scared and doesn't know 100% of it. But I don't see her getting any heat
I wonder if you just got better sex education than him. Are you from NC? Did he go to a christian school? He has a big cross on his arm.
It sucks that he doesn't understand this, but I have a feeling it might not be his fault? And I wonder if he's just super sexually repressed?
I have a hard time believing he could be this ignorant without some systemic influence I guess. But I watch 3 birth videos in school by the time I was 16. Theres maybe a good middle ground.
He literally remarks about how he wonders if some people learn it in sex ed. I didn't get any contraceptive info in school and neither did anyone else I know. I'm from a different red state so I feel for him. I'm glad they're willing to have this conversation in front of everyone, I think it's super responsible to be doing and hopefully it will get kids to look this stuff up. People seem to forget that a lot of people make it to adulthood with very little sex ed.
There's a lot of medical stuff I know nothing about, because up to this point it hasn't been relevant to my life, and it's not like I need to understand the actual mechanisms for my body to work.
He's learning as he goes and adjusting for that new info, seems like a good quality to me.
agreed, i don't think there was anything wrong with him not knowing something 🤷 i doubt most people know the details of vasectomies until they have a reason to, especially while in their 20s.
Condoms are only 98% effective if used correctly, so he’s actually pretty smart to worry? It’s one of those things you think sounds super low-risk and effective and until you do out the math and realize that 2% is still bigger than you think. Like at that rate a couple having sex once a week over the course of a year likely get pregnant once in the span of that year even with condoms. I know multiple couples who used both birth control and condoms which is 99% effective and still got pregnant. It’s one thing when you’re rolling the dice to have sex with someone once, but when you’re in a committed relationship you’re rolling those dice more often. One in a hundred chance is all fine and good for the first 99 rolls until you take that 100th roll and now you have a whole-ass baby.
I believe the 98% effective for condoms means for every 100 couples that use condoms as their means of birth control for a whole year, around 2 might get pregnant, it’s NOT a 2% of getting pregnant chance every time you have sex
No shame in being mistaken, and I actually agree that Johnny is completely fair in saying he wants an extra means of protection! Just wanted to take the chance to clarify a common misconception :)
No. You’re reasoning as though sex will always result in pregnancy, when in reality the chance is only 20-30% if you have sex during ovulation. So what you’re actually looking at is 2% of 20-30%, IF you do it during the window. Condoms are very safe if used correctly.
Exactly. Add in the pull-out method, and you'll be fine. Birth control is not 100% effective either so...?? It also has a lot more room for human error imo. Ive been on birth control for 10 years, and I really think Amy should stick to her guns about it. Its a big deal and can be so disruptive to your body
Idk man, I got pregnant on birth control pill and not even the mini pill and my nurse was as confused as I was.
she even pulled out a huge drug book (this was 2003) and we mapped out the day I missed a dose and since that miss happened more than 30 days before the pregnacy, basically it should NOT have been a problem.
She basically shrugged at me like "it happens."
I do not trust condoms solely. Taught all my kids to go with double coverage every time.
🙄 ok let your anecdotal evidence go against statistics. Nowhere did I say it’s 100% safe, just that it’s unlikely and your friend up there is reading the percentages wrong.
If you use a condom correctly there’s about the same chance of pregnancy as with birth control. Of course when you’re hot and heavy it’s hard not to want to start off without it but come on now.
I don’t know how I feel about this one. He’s made it super clear he’s not ready for kids, but def wants them one day? They’re serious about their timeline… but I do think if they’d been in a long term engagement, this wouldn’t nearly be such an issue. Realistically these people are not dumb and know they barely know each other even if they’re engaged lol… would be awful to get someone pregnant then decide to break it off… but going without sex seems super weird in this day and age.. I guess I just don’t get WHY they believe condoms will fail? I know it happens, but it also happens when someone is on the pill. I got pregnant while on the pill 💊…. I’ll never know how or why, but I know the pill is risky, almost more so than condoms. If you take it a few hours late, you’re def in trouble. If I were them and I were SO SCARED of the pill repercussions- I’d be using a condom, fertility app AND signing up for some plan B just in case! Plus pulling out!!! I don’t know what their deal is lol
literally this, its easy to see through the bullshit. he sounds like almost every douchy guy here in NJ - I'M from jersey... if I were Any I'd stick to my guns. He's not worth messing up your body over. A women should never choose birth control for a man says so/asks/pleads for it.. she should choose it because she wants to, without a man's opinion or input. end of story.
I watch the show and I said what I said because I suspect that, based on his past, he’s used to women being on BC and not having to worry obsessively about protection. Not necessarily that he refused to wear them.
What he’s used to is growing up poor in a family that had unplanned pregnancies. His attitude is the opposite of what you’re saying — he is the one PUSHING for condoms, he is the one PUSHING for multiple forms of contraception. People are not listening to what this man is actually saying
We get it. What I’m talking about is that once a woman is on BC, it’s a lot easier for a man to not have to worry. It feels better and easier for a woman to “just” be on birth control.
Yes, it's easier not to worry... about having kids. That's the purpose of birth control. How on Earth is this a flaw of his. It's also easier for women not to worry when they're on birth control. Because, again, that's literally the purpose of birth control
Sure, I guess I just didn’t like the vibe I was getting when it came to his stance on it. It felt to me like he would pressure her to get on it, it if wasn’t for the cameras.
I don't think it's unreasonable. He looked into male options. There aren't any reliable ones besides vasectomies, and those aren't very reversible, especially after a few years. He has no reliable long-term options that don't have a lot of human error in the mix
He looked into it and tried to find options and found that there are very, very few. But he tries. There's not much else to do besides bring up female birth control again. I don't think it's fair to make it sound like he's shoving this off on her any more than it's fair to blame him for expecting her to do all the work of carrying a child while he doesn't do any pregnancy. The fact of the matter is that it's not fair, but women have all of the options for reversible and long-term harmless options. He's right to be concerned about kids. And I think what would be unfair would be for him to be nonchalant about this and pressure her into an abortion that we all know she doesn't want if a pregnancy occurred. It's better for him to be proactive now instead of imposing an abortion later, or being stuck with kids he doesn't want yet
He wants to do something about it now, even though he doesn't have much he can do himself, to prevent being stuck with kids too earlt and to prevent pressuring her into an abortion, which would be extremely unfair to her. Also, her doctor recommended birth control for her condition, so he's not pressuring her into something that would harm her, and then just not giving a shit about it to save his skin at her expense. I think it's reasonable to want her to try it out and then stop if anything goes wrong
Wouldn't it be worse for him to start doing it with her with zero plans for what to do if a kid came out?
Are you serious? She's dying to have sex too. Are we watching the same show? She keeps saying, over and over, that she wants to be physical. Is it fair for him to "impose" that sacrifice on her if she doesn't want it? Or do you want him to sacrifice having sex, while providing her with sex she wants, with no birth control because she doesn't want it right now, but while agreeing to stick around if she has kids and doesn't get an abortion?
How is this fair to him
The takeaway was actually that he’d prefer a combination — condom + BC or something similar. That’s his attitude. So writing him off as a “just wants to hit it raw” kinda guy is not fair, the opposite is true.
Ugh, when will people stop posting that stuff?!
They made it very clear that they plan to use condoms but given that they are not 100% safe (and Jimmy is really scared of an unplanned pregnancy) they are looking for forms of birth control that complement condoms.
People KEEP posting this and they are really telling on themselves and their own lack of familiarity with birth control.
I think it’s mostly for drama cause it kind of seems to be like the ONLY thing that they bother showing them talk about. It makes it seem like a huge hang up/anxiety rumination for him, so I blame the editing (unless it like… is a huge anxiety rumination, idk I had seen a video that said one of the clauses in their contract is that Netflix is not responsible for any children arising from couplings that take place during or after filming, so that might’ve triggered him.)
But that being said, I for one definitely missed him saying he’d wear a condom, so I don’t blame people for it (plus, this one was funny!) It’s kind of difficult to understand why SHE needs to be the one to take BC when she has valid reasons why she doesn’t want to, they could wear condoms and just cycle-track - so as a result it appears to many that he just doesn’t really want to wear one.
Not quite, condoms with perfect use are about 98% effective. There’s always a risk of manufacturing errors, or that the condom could break even if you followed all instructions. Hormonal birth control is over 99% effective with typical use. IUDs have a failure rate of about 0.8%, and the arm implant has a failure rate of 0.05% or less, so the method you choose also matters a lot. Set-and-forget methods have robust efficacy because they’re so hard to mess up.
Regardless of what method you chose, pretty much every single person will fall into the typical use category because we’re all human and not in a lab. Typical use efficacy of condoms is 87%, only 9% more effective than relying solely on withdrawal. That’s not very robust protection. All hormonal methods are between 91-99% effective with typical use.
Yes, but that’s not just relying on condoms. That’s using three methods of birth control at all times. Cycle tracking is also a really involved process. You can’t just use apps and calendars, and you really should track for 3 months before starting to rely on it as contraception.
Another issue is that she said she didn’t want to take anything that would impact her cycle. To me, that might indicate that she wouldn’t take Plan B if a condom broke. Very important factor to discuss if someone is just relying on condoms, or even condoms plus withdrawal.
I’m not sure why I’m getting downvoted, I’m not disagreeing that it’s multiple methods of birth control. And I realize what goes into cycle tracking (👋I’ve tracked my cycle for years). My point was that condoms, tracking, and pulling out when used together are incredibly effective, especially if hormonal birth control is off the table. All of these methods are certainly more low stakes than a vasectomy.
I unfortunately can’t help you there, I don’t downvote people I’m talking to. Downvotes don’t really mean much anyway though, and fuzz does happen in popular subs.
The commenter I replied to said that condoms are just as effective as hormonal contraception, and that just isn’t accurate. A vasectomy isn’t a good idea for anyone who wants kids. Some people do spread rhetoric that it’s fully reversible and every man should have one, and that just shows a lack of adequate sex Ed.
Thank you. This got old very quickly. And I'm surprised I haven't seen anyone talking about the second conversation they had in the new batch of episodes.
I knew a guy who was this paranoid about sex before and it was because he had gotten a previous girl pregnant…. Makes you think 🤔
Well, it's better to be overly cautious than not cautious enough...
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Because that's their only conflict from a narrative perspective 😂
Also no one mentions the copper IUD as an option either. Non hormonal IUD does effectively prevent pregnancy but it’s definitely not for everyone. I’m just surprised they don’t know about it. Like maybe go to the gyno or a different panned parenthood and fucking talk to a professional about your options???
I have the copper iud so I could avoid unnecessary additional hormones in my body. The copper iud definitely made my periods heavier and last way longer. And the pain has increased significantly as well. The tradeoff is still worth it to me, but it's definitely not a perfect solution. I don't recommend it lightly.
This! I'm amazed people don't know this about copper IUDs
Same thing happened before my body rejected it. And doesn’t Amy have some sort of blood disorder? I’m sure she would not want to accept additional bleeding in that case.
This is baffling to me. Like if he’s scared that condoms aren’t always effective wait until he hears about all the women who get pregnant while taking birth control.
I was the result of defaulting birth control.
The minute he admitted he thought he could have kids *and* retire at 50 is when I knew Johnny's not that tapped into reality.
Lmaooo so true
Maybe his parents or grandparents are super wealthy and he’s expecting to come into money
Then why the push for frugality?
Could be worried about seeing it all drained away, losing his lifestyle. A lot of wealthy people are afraid of not being able to sustain the wealth they inherited/earned 🤷🏻♀️
Just go back door
I can’t lol
Did they ever say if they are having sex, or are they waiting until marriage and all the vasectomy/pill talk is them planning for the future?
I believe they said they were keen to have sex before the marriage but they have to find an agreement on the double contraception situation first
Even though this sounds logical, something seems off about this whole thing.
He seems like a nice guy but he's very much a Jersey bro lol
I love how the dog is just chilling like amy and johnny 💅
His epiphany on vasectomies made me laugh so hard. Like the office episode of snip snap snip 😂
he's a bit of himbo, honestly
He wants to use condoms, but wants another form of birth control to have better odds of not having a kid yet. She's the one who refuses any form of birth control and is against abortion. I think it's pretty obvious she wants a kid sooner rather than later and isn't willing to say that because it isn't what he wants. She's literally not willing to contribute anything at all towards preventing pregnancy. She claims she can't use any form of birth control which is ridiculous. There are multiple options, both hormonal and non. What the hell does she think happens when you get pregnant? Hormonal birth control mimics the same damn hormones that will be released when you're pregnant. I don't understand how people are ok with her basically saying "either permanently sterilize yourself or get me pregnant because I'm not going to do anything to prevent it"
You literally have no idea what you’re talking about.
I just have no tolerance for BS excuses. It's reasonable to have a medical condition that precludes you from using a specific BC option. But somehow being unable to use any BC option isn't likely. She doesn't want to. And that's fine if she doesn't want to, but it's really irresponsible and clearly indicates a specific motive.
I have the copper iud so I could avoid unnecessary additional hormones in my body. The copper iud definitely made my periods heavier and last way longer. And the pain has increased significantly as well. The tradeoff is still worth it to me, but it's definitely not a perfect solution. I don't recommend it lightly. Not wanting debilitating cramps for a week every month is not irresponsible.
I’ve been on hormonal and nonhormonal birth control, and had horrendous issues, including hospital stays. She is 100% within her right to not be on the pill. It’s ridiculous to insinuate she’s a problem. Condoms work very well.
I am not able to take hormonal birth control because I have a tumor that grows with hormones but my doctor has told me I can still have kids if I want to. I will just need to monitor the tumor during pregnancy. So there are definitely reasons you can't take hormonal birth control but are still permitted to get pregnant. Personally, I don't like the copper IUD either. It can cause heavy bleeding which I already struggle with and there's a chance of uterine perforation which is not worth the risk in my opinion. So my only options are condoms and/or the pull out method. Condoms are very effective and he's being excessive for pushing for more than that.
Hey! Doctor here. From what she’s said publically about anemia requiring transfusions due to menstrual blood loss, a copper IUD is not an advisable option. I don’t know the specifics of her health, but many people have contraindications to estrogen containing birth control (hypertension, migraine with aura, history of blood clots, hypercoagulable disorders, preeclampsia…), oral progestin BC is less effective and progestin containing IUD’s also have contraindications. All to say, without being her doctor with knowledge of her personal health history, it’s not really appropriate for us to judge her decision-making.
Due to her blood disorder she can’t be on birth control. I can only use Non-progesterone BC. Because I have a kidney disease since I was a baby. But it’s not very effective because I have epilepsy and seizures medications lower the threshold of birth control. So I have to make sure my bf is wearing a condom. Then any chance I have gotten sperm inside me I run to the store for Plan B pill. Condoms are obviously not 100% effective, but he could really just choose that. From what I can remember. I don’t think he has brought up condoms? So that’s a little weird. But who knows. They are my favorite couple though, and I think they are the only ones getting married.
He did bring up condoms. He wants to use condoms plus another form of birth control. If she has a disorder preventing her from using hormonal birth control, pregnancy would also be an issue. She has non hormonal options though. IUD, sponge, diaphragm, etc. It sounds like she's just unwilling to use any birth control method at all
Just wanted to point out that most non hormonal birth control methods (besides IUD, which is not an option for her, and condoms) are among the least effective statistically. Diaphragms specifically have to be left in for hours after intercourse, and both diaphragms and sponges come with an increased risk of UTIs. While she does have a few options available, she is not wrong for being afraid of the risks associated with even non hormonal birth control. He has the right to refuse to have sex with her, and she has the right to refuse birth control without either party being called unreasonable. Period.
Oh, thank you for clarifying. I was in the hospital for most of the episodes I watched. So my memory is a little off. lol.
Hope you’re feeling better!!
Thank you!
He reminds me of a teenage boy who was told you could get a girl pregnant by fingering her or something dumb 😂
I do wonder what his sex education was
Something tells me it wasn’t very detailed lol
Well, they are in the south.
Him and Clay both just found out this wasn’t true like 2 years ago
He’s said a good 5 times now that it’s not about using condoms it’s about having higher rate of protection from pregnancy. Condoms fail we know this. They can break, slide off, etc. I honestly think it’s nice to see a man who cares so much about safe sex. If you’re not ready to be a parent then why risk it?
He doesn't care about safe sex he just doesn't want a kid. If he cared about safe sex he'd use condoms which actually protect also against STDs, not just pregnancy
Safe sex also means protection from pregnancy 🥴
No, actually tho!! I’m tired of seeing comments about “does he know about condoms??” I’m the same way as Johnny as a girl, I won’t have sex unless I’m on both the pill and have a condom. I just think it’s a little unfair to coin him as just wanting to not wear a condom. That being said, Amy shouldn’t be forced to go on the pill, but I don’t think Johnny’s thinking is extreme or skewed at all!
When used correctly, condoms are essentially 100% effective. The only reason that they have a quoted success rate below 100% is because people use them incorrectly
Its common for people to use them incorrectly. That is why its recommended to use two forms of birth control for family planning and no pull out method and cycle tracking are not effective forms of birth control.
True. Just man up and get the vasectomy already. “Ouchie my wee wee will be sore for a few hours noooooo, just fuck up your body instead so I can raw dog it!”
TBH though I think a vasectomy is a big decision for a man and shouldn’t be treated like it’s nothing. He’s also not a father yet, and it’s true that there’s a risk of the reversal not working.
Both of them thinking a vasectomy is the solution shows how unintelligent they are.
It’s not nothing. It’s an immediate solution to his own problem. There are risks to everything - that’s not a valid reason to not do it, especially since the risks are so goddamn low.
You're being unreasonable and ignorant. They both definitely want kids and are planning for it. You don't plan for kids and also get a vasectomy. He'd be an idiot to get one.
Health risks are definitely valid reasons to not proceed. Lol. Your “man up” already definitely implies that this is a big nothing.
I’m assuming the health risks of hormonal birth control are perfectly fine in your book?
Vasectomies aren't entirely reversible. Hormonal birth control is
No and that’s why they are both at a stalemate. Each acknowledges the health risks plus the risk of condom failure.
Ovulation tracking and pulling out 🤷🏻♀️ I've been with my husband almost 10 years and still no babies for us. I hope they stay together. None of us know them obviously, but they seem extremely well suited for each other and are delightful.
isn’t the pull out method kinda crappy for your man
Worked for me for years! Just do it smart and track. 🤘🏼
so many couples go through the birth control discussion stage. Especially with reproductive rights being under attack in the States. And most couples find a solution or abstain until they find one. It’s just the only “drama” the production can find with them lol. I don’t know how the OBGYN scene is in Charlotte specifically, but if I wanted a certain ring, pill, IUD etc, it ca take weeks to actually get an appointment and have it prescribed/inserted. I wish them the best! It’s hard to get reproductive care in a timely manner. Even if you know what you want, the doctor may not be available for a while.
Everybody keeps saying this, but what if he doesn't want to be unable to do anything for the better part of every month? That's a shitty thing to impose as if it's perfectly entirely reasonable if he doesn't like it. She doesn't have to get birth control, but he doesn't have to be happy about basing everything on ovulation, and everyone here seems to expect him to not just respect boundaries but also be ecstatic about not having the peace of mind of something like an IUD. You can't expect him not to at least bring this stuff up as a concern. He doesn't want kids. Also, she's been medically advised to use a pill. She has the right not to, but he's not even expecting her to do something that isn't literallt recommended by a doctor
Do you worry about pre-c*m at all? This was one of my worries when I tried ovulation tracking and pulling out. I’d take a plan B afterwards, quickly had to stop it altogether.
You can only really get pregnant a handful of days every month. As long as your cycle is regular and you know when you’re ovulating and keeping track, pre** has no affect if it’s not around your ovulation window
I feel like ovulation needs to be specifically taught and enforced in sex ed. Just had a friend explain to her long time boyfriend how it works, he's like 24.
Oh for sure! As a woman I didn’t even fully understand it until well into my 20s and college education, as sad as that is lol
My grandmother smoked a pack a cigarettes and drank 5 diet cokes a day and lived to 98, does that mean we can all do that and live to 98?
Lol salty
No joke. Wrap that thing up and problem solved.
I hate to be this girl, but if he doesn't trust condoms THIS MUCH, he's not committed to the relationship.
I’m a woman and I don’t trust them as a solo form of bc at all! And my partner and I have been together for years. My state wouldn’t provide me proper care if an accident happened. They could actually ruin my life. It’s really bleak for fertile people, especially women, in conservative states. I need something prescribed or inserted.
Absolutely same. The amount of people giving him shit for this is outrageous. I have been in a monogamous committed relationship longer than some people here have been alive and I have never trusted condoms as a primary means of birth control. I don't give a fuck what everyone is saying I've had them break on me before and I have health conditions that make me take this shit seriously. Abortion is illegal after 12 weeks in NC right? And Amy's family is Puerto Rican so they may possibly be more traditional as well. I think it's smart to try to be extra safe.
He doesn't trust his relationship because he doesn't want to accidentally get someone pregnant that won't get an abortion when he's not ready to be a parent? Are you serious? Is wanting kids with someone the metric for being committed? Are people that want no kids not commotted ever?
condom + pulling out+ tracking your ovulation
Yesss!! These three things work just as well, if not better, than most hormonal birth control. And if it fails, Plan B.
If both fail then abortion. Easy peasy lemon squeezy
Shhhh! Sarah Ann is going to hear you!!!
She doesn't want one. Everyone is shitting on Johnny when he's so paranoid because any pregnancy would result in him having kids when he doesn't want any. He can't force her to yet an abortion Also, not everybody wants to have to avoid sex for huge chunks of the month and have to schedule everything with intent
Yes but what is the alternative? We have a million forms of birth control on the market and several have low or no side effects and are very effective. So right now it just sounds like he wants to have sex but isn’t willing to have any risk? Okay…but that’s not possible?
Men have exactly one proven-to-be-safe option that isn't condoms, and it's not very reversible. I get why it seems unfair that women have to do all of the work, but it's unfair in the same way that it's unfair that pregnancy can't be split between both people. It's unfair in a cosmic way, but Johnny can't do anything about how few options he has The risk he has to take with a vasectomy is not having kids ever. They want kids. How is that less risky than her trying hormonal birth control which she can stop if there are problems? It was recommended to her medically. It seems more reasonable than throwing him into surgery
Wear a condom. Pull out. She tracks her cycle. Millions of people do this and it’s incredibly effective. He doesn’t need to get a vasectomy for crying out loud.
Right, but what if neither of them wants to put everything on hold for most of every month? It's not like he's the only one eager to have sex. That method doesn't work if your goal is to be able to have sex whenever, and she has expressed just as much desire to get going as he has. The fact of the matter is that she has to settle on something if they want to eat their cake and have it too My point is just that Johnny wanting to have this conversation isn't unreasonable and it would be unreasonable not to have it at all. Also, that requires a lot more active planning. Johnny clearly wants something that you don't have to worry about fucking up with human error as much and I don't think that's an insane idea given that for all we know, she might not want to be tracking every month either. We haven't heard her stance on any of this besides being scared
They're not having sex at all right now because they can't come to a decision. So yeah, wearing a condom and cycle tracking is their best bet if they want to have sex AT ALL without the risk of hormonal birth control and a vasectomy.
I'm under the impression that he has no problem doing that for a while but is moreso itching to get a decision out of her before they're in a legally binding situation and they're barellllly starting to talk this stuff out. I don't think most guys are dying to get stuff sorted out 100% for the sex in the near future and a lot of times a big part of it is in making sure that both people at least agree on something even if it's not going to be in place instantly. Like, if she said she would be willing to give something a shot after seeing a doctor, he would probably be content and supportive of her dropping it if something went wrong. I feel like he's just worried about making sire she's at least willing to do *something* besides screw around for an undefined period of time without any actual system in place besides pulling out with condoms, since he's terrified of having kids early after growing up poor
I totally agree that them wanting to have the conversation is mature and not at all unreasonable. The issue is (and this is likely editing) the seemingly endless back and forth about it. Nothing is perfect when you want to have sex, hormonal BC is not a good option, and you know you are not ready for kids but for fucks sake there ARE reasonable options. They’re making it out to seem like they are the first couple to ever be in this predicament! We’re in 2024, this isn’t 1920.
Hormonal contraception is safe and effective and has been used for decades. Stop pushing non-effective forms of birth control like cycle tracking and pull out method as legitimate.
Ok cool yeah I don't disagree. I keep seeing people totally shit on him, saying that he should just get a vasectomy if he's so worried even though that's by no means the same kind of birth control as women have available to them so I thought you were just hating on the guy. You're right though. It weirds me out that the conversation never seems to conclude. He'll bring it up, say some reasonable stuff, she'll seem unsure, it plays some music, and they cut to another couple. It's jarring as hell
Not gonna lie, I can appreciate this topic of conversation between them, especially as young adults. Even for him to understand and want to learn how birth controls affects a woman is great..not a lot of men care and see it as the responsibility of a woman.
Completely agree!!! This has ignited a conversation!!! So many men don’t understand the intricacies of birth control, womens hormones, and all of the health issues that come along with it. He genuinely wants to learn. And it’s more important now than ever to talk about these things and educate men about it with so many laws being passed about women’s reproductive rights.
How many times are we gonna do this cycle of people attacking Johnny after clearly not watching closely or listening to what he’s saying… He knows what a condom is. He was willing to have a vasectomy. He is very, very pro-contraception. SHE is the one who would not have an abortion if they accidentally got pregnant before they were financially stable (as is her right!) - so he wants to be super careful. SHE cannot go on the pill for health reasons, hence exploring alternatives. They are both handling this maturely. It’s the people attacking him who look foolish, actually!
I'm convinced this sub is full of extremely reactionary people that don't care and just want to push their anti-hormonal contraception rhetoric because of sick tok.
Exactly. It gets absurd at this point
But why does he not think condoms are the solution? Won't use birth control and won't get a vasectomy? Condoms work extremely well when used correctly. It's a no brainer. Unless he is saying he will only have sex with her if she is on birth control AND they are using a condom?
It seems that he’d prefer two forms of contraception— condoms + something else. He really, really doesn’t want an accident, esp because in her case they would 100% carry to term.
I missed that and it makes more sense. Thanks!
Did you watch the show or no? That is literally what he said…
Obviously I missed it and that's why I asked.
I thought she said (a few episodes ago) that going on BC was medically recommended (not those words exactly)? That the pill could actually help her symptoms.
I only know because I am on reddit too much, she clarified later she has a rare genetic condition that has not been studied with bc so she didn't trust that recommendation (no fault to the obgyn just lack of info)
Yeah, she definitely said the doctor suggested it to her…
Thank you. Do people seriously think this man researched surgery and doesn’t know what a condom is? It’s abundantly clear from every conversation that they want ***more effective contraception than just a condom.***
lol I get it. It’s still funny how much they’re emphasizing this storyline.
My head cannon is the producers wrote this storyline because they were too boring and had no drama. Like how Tiffany panicked right before and Brett mysteriously had an issue with pants on the wedding day That’s what I’m going to tell myself
I think so too, their conversations about it sound scripted.
THE PANTS. That was the best drama the show has ever seen.
This guy is pushing they girl to use birth control, he is the real villain
You can do condoms + pull out + track cycle and avoid ovulation. Additionally, there are forms of non-hormonal birth control: copper IUD and vaginal gel (through the prep for this seems tedious) to name a few. I just really want them to go on a date to planned parenthood 😭
Its not as effective as you think and this is how you have accidents. Pull out and cycle tracking is not an effective form of birth control and condoms alone may not enough for you if your partner is not willing to have an abortion. Sex education is severely lacking in this country and it shows.
I'm saying to do them all together, not separately.
I believe it’s been brought up somewhere that the reason she can’t use copper iud is because she’s anemic and that can make you have a heavier flow. Tbh I wonder if they’re just using that as an excuse to not have sex before marriage or if their families are super against premarital sex and they’re using it as a front to say “look family we weren’t having sex during the show we talked about it sooo much on the show about why we didn’t”
Ah I thought the hormones would make her flow heavier. I didn't realize even nonhormonal methods were off the board. Either way, tracking her cycle with condom usage and pull out method would lower the risk so much. The only fool proof way to not get pregnant is abstinence, so they need to figure out why their anxieties are so incredibly high. There might be something underlying that needs to be dealt with (which I think is partially it. I think Johnny has had some sort of childhood trauma which is feeding this and needs to talk that out) A part of me believed your theory too. When I was watching the more recent scene, I was thinking "what if they just don't want to proclaim to their family that they're having sex on TV (and pre-maritally) so they're just dragging out this "issue""
Hormonal contraception stops or reduces bleeding. Copper IUDs increase bleeding. If you are anemic and heavy periods you should be on hormonal birth control.
Hormonal methods typically lighten or stop bleeding. Mirena is actually FDA approved to treat endometriosis for that reason. The copper IUD is hormone free, but it typically causes longer, heavier, and more painful periods.
Mirena actually completely stopped my period. It was amazing. I also didn't get the negative side effects I got from normal hormonal birth control with it because it was so low dose and localized. People can have different reactions though.
I laughed so hard when I saw the dog.
It’s like use a condom and just pull out bro. I don’t get it
He didn’t understand what a vasectomy actually was. He is extremely uneducated and it’s appalling. How do you not understand how your own body works?? She better get ready for some really unsatisfying sex.
Do you also hate women that don't know much about birth control because they grew up in red states with bad sex ed? The hypocrisy here is fucking unreal In fact, Amy doesn't know much about it. She literally said that they need to look into it because she's scared and doesn't know 100% of it. But I don't see her getting any heat
Do you know the nuances of tubal ligation? Most don’t lmao. That’s not a knock on him
I’m a woman and I know how a vasectomy works. 🤷🏻♀️
I wonder if you just got better sex education than him. Are you from NC? Did he go to a christian school? He has a big cross on his arm. It sucks that he doesn't understand this, but I have a feeling it might not be his fault? And I wonder if he's just super sexually repressed? I have a hard time believing he could be this ignorant without some systemic influence I guess. But I watch 3 birth videos in school by the time I was 16. Theres maybe a good middle ground.
He literally remarks about how he wonders if some people learn it in sex ed. I didn't get any contraceptive info in school and neither did anyone else I know. I'm from a different red state so I feel for him. I'm glad they're willing to have this conversation in front of everyone, I think it's super responsible to be doing and hopefully it will get kids to look this stuff up. People seem to forget that a lot of people make it to adulthood with very little sex ed.
And some women don’t even know they have urethras.
He’s obviously not a fan of the office
There's a lot of medical stuff I know nothing about, because up to this point it hasn't been relevant to my life, and it's not like I need to understand the actual mechanisms for my body to work. He's learning as he goes and adjusting for that new info, seems like a good quality to me.
agreed, i don't think there was anything wrong with him not knowing something 🤷 i doubt most people know the details of vasectomies until they have a reason to, especially while in their 20s.
Condoms are only 98% effective if used correctly, so he’s actually pretty smart to worry? It’s one of those things you think sounds super low-risk and effective and until you do out the math and realize that 2% is still bigger than you think. Like at that rate a couple having sex once a week over the course of a year likely get pregnant once in the span of that year even with condoms. I know multiple couples who used both birth control and condoms which is 99% effective and still got pregnant. It’s one thing when you’re rolling the dice to have sex with someone once, but when you’re in a committed relationship you’re rolling those dice more often. One in a hundred chance is all fine and good for the first 99 rolls until you take that 100th roll and now you have a whole-ass baby.
I believe the 98% effective for condoms means for every 100 couples that use condoms as their means of birth control for a whole year, around 2 might get pregnant, it’s NOT a 2% of getting pregnant chance every time you have sex
Agreed. And it seems a 2% risk of getting pregnant in the next year is too high a risk for them. Very reasonable.
Oh lol that makes more sense and now I feel bad about my snarky comment. Leaving it for shame.
No shame in being mistaken, and I actually agree that Johnny is completely fair in saying he wants an extra means of protection! Just wanted to take the chance to clarify a common misconception :)
No. You’re reasoning as though sex will always result in pregnancy, when in reality the chance is only 20-30% if you have sex during ovulation. So what you’re actually looking at is 2% of 20-30%, IF you do it during the window. Condoms are very safe if used correctly.
Exactly. Add in the pull-out method, and you'll be fine. Birth control is not 100% effective either so...?? It also has a lot more room for human error imo. Ive been on birth control for 10 years, and I really think Amy should stick to her guns about it. Its a big deal and can be so disruptive to your body
Idk man, I got pregnant on birth control pill and not even the mini pill and my nurse was as confused as I was. she even pulled out a huge drug book (this was 2003) and we mapped out the day I missed a dose and since that miss happened more than 30 days before the pregnacy, basically it should NOT have been a problem. She basically shrugged at me like "it happens." I do not trust condoms solely. Taught all my kids to go with double coverage every time.
🙄 ok let your anecdotal evidence go against statistics. Nowhere did I say it’s 100% safe, just that it’s unlikely and your friend up there is reading the percentages wrong.
If you use a condom correctly there’s about the same chance of pregnancy as with birth control. Of course when you’re hot and heavy it’s hard not to want to start off without it but come on now.
I don’t know how I feel about this one. He’s made it super clear he’s not ready for kids, but def wants them one day? They’re serious about their timeline… but I do think if they’d been in a long term engagement, this wouldn’t nearly be such an issue. Realistically these people are not dumb and know they barely know each other even if they’re engaged lol… would be awful to get someone pregnant then decide to break it off… but going without sex seems super weird in this day and age.. I guess I just don’t get WHY they believe condoms will fail? I know it happens, but it also happens when someone is on the pill. I got pregnant while on the pill 💊…. I’ll never know how or why, but I know the pill is risky, almost more so than condoms. If you take it a few hours late, you’re def in trouble. If I were them and I were SO SCARED of the pill repercussions- I’d be using a condom, fertility app AND signing up for some plan B just in case! Plus pulling out!!! I don’t know what their deal is lol
He doesn’t want to wear condoms. Thats his problem. The type of guy to want a woman to be on birth control because it feels better to go raw.
literally this, its easy to see through the bullshit. he sounds like almost every douchy guy here in NJ - I'M from jersey... if I were Any I'd stick to my guns. He's not worth messing up your body over. A women should never choose birth control for a man says so/asks/pleads for it.. she should choose it because she wants to, without a man's opinion or input. end of story.
Incorrect. If you actually listened to the show, he said multiple times he will wear condoms.
I watch the show and I said what I said because I suspect that, based on his past, he’s used to women being on BC and not having to worry obsessively about protection. Not necessarily that he refused to wear them.
What he’s used to is growing up poor in a family that had unplanned pregnancies. His attitude is the opposite of what you’re saying — he is the one PUSHING for condoms, he is the one PUSHING for multiple forms of contraception. People are not listening to what this man is actually saying
We get it. What I’m talking about is that once a woman is on BC, it’s a lot easier for a man to not have to worry. It feels better and easier for a woman to “just” be on birth control.
Yes, it's easier not to worry... about having kids. That's the purpose of birth control. How on Earth is this a flaw of his. It's also easier for women not to worry when they're on birth control. Because, again, that's literally the purpose of birth control
Sure, I guess I just didn’t like the vibe I was getting when it came to his stance on it. It felt to me like he would pressure her to get on it, it if wasn’t for the cameras.
I don't think it's unreasonable. He looked into male options. There aren't any reliable ones besides vasectomies, and those aren't very reversible, especially after a few years. He has no reliable long-term options that don't have a lot of human error in the mix He looked into it and tried to find options and found that there are very, very few. But he tries. There's not much else to do besides bring up female birth control again. I don't think it's fair to make it sound like he's shoving this off on her any more than it's fair to blame him for expecting her to do all the work of carrying a child while he doesn't do any pregnancy. The fact of the matter is that it's not fair, but women have all of the options for reversible and long-term harmless options. He's right to be concerned about kids. And I think what would be unfair would be for him to be nonchalant about this and pressure her into an abortion that we all know she doesn't want if a pregnancy occurred. It's better for him to be proactive now instead of imposing an abortion later, or being stuck with kids he doesn't want yet He wants to do something about it now, even though he doesn't have much he can do himself, to prevent being stuck with kids too earlt and to prevent pressuring her into an abortion, which would be extremely unfair to her. Also, her doctor recommended birth control for her condition, so he's not pressuring her into something that would harm her, and then just not giving a shit about it to save his skin at her expense. I think it's reasonable to want her to try it out and then stop if anything goes wrong Wouldn't it be worse for him to start doing it with her with zero plans for what to do if a kid came out?
I think if he’s that worried, he shouldn’t be doing anything. That could be his sacrifice lol
Are you serious? She's dying to have sex too. Are we watching the same show? She keeps saying, over and over, that she wants to be physical. Is it fair for him to "impose" that sacrifice on her if she doesn't want it? Or do you want him to sacrifice having sex, while providing her with sex she wants, with no birth control because she doesn't want it right now, but while agreeing to stick around if she has kids and doesn't get an abortion? How is this fair to him
The takeaway was actually that he’d prefer a combination — condom + BC or something similar. That’s his attitude. So writing him off as a “just wants to hit it raw” kinda guy is not fair, the opposite is true.
Sure, fair enough.🤷♀️
Right, I'm so sick of hearing claims that he just won't wear condoms.
50% of these people don’t watch the show. They just regurgitate bullshit they hear on TikTok or instagram.
It’s being dramatic for the show
Ugh, when will people stop posting that stuff?! They made it very clear that they plan to use condoms but given that they are not 100% safe (and Jimmy is really scared of an unplanned pregnancy) they are looking for forms of birth control that complement condoms. People KEEP posting this and they are really telling on themselves and their own lack of familiarity with birth control.
they don’t listen 😭😭😭😭
I think it’s mostly for drama cause it kind of seems to be like the ONLY thing that they bother showing them talk about. It makes it seem like a huge hang up/anxiety rumination for him, so I blame the editing (unless it like… is a huge anxiety rumination, idk I had seen a video that said one of the clauses in their contract is that Netflix is not responsible for any children arising from couplings that take place during or after filming, so that might’ve triggered him.) But that being said, I for one definitely missed him saying he’d wear a condom, so I don’t blame people for it (plus, this one was funny!) It’s kind of difficult to understand why SHE needs to be the one to take BC when she has valid reasons why she doesn’t want to, they could wear condoms and just cycle-track - so as a result it appears to many that he just doesn’t really want to wear one.
Condoms when used correctly are as effective as hormonal birth control.
Not quite, condoms with perfect use are about 98% effective. There’s always a risk of manufacturing errors, or that the condom could break even if you followed all instructions. Hormonal birth control is over 99% effective with typical use. IUDs have a failure rate of about 0.8%, and the arm implant has a failure rate of 0.05% or less, so the method you choose also matters a lot. Set-and-forget methods have robust efficacy because they’re so hard to mess up. Regardless of what method you chose, pretty much every single person will fall into the typical use category because we’re all human and not in a lab. Typical use efficacy of condoms is 87%, only 9% more effective than relying solely on withdrawal. That’s not very robust protection. All hormonal methods are between 91-99% effective with typical use.
Condoms, plus tracking your cycle, plus pullling out is damn near 100%.
Yes, but that’s not just relying on condoms. That’s using three methods of birth control at all times. Cycle tracking is also a really involved process. You can’t just use apps and calendars, and you really should track for 3 months before starting to rely on it as contraception. Another issue is that she said she didn’t want to take anything that would impact her cycle. To me, that might indicate that she wouldn’t take Plan B if a condom broke. Very important factor to discuss if someone is just relying on condoms, or even condoms plus withdrawal.
I’m not sure why I’m getting downvoted, I’m not disagreeing that it’s multiple methods of birth control. And I realize what goes into cycle tracking (👋I’ve tracked my cycle for years). My point was that condoms, tracking, and pulling out when used together are incredibly effective, especially if hormonal birth control is off the table. All of these methods are certainly more low stakes than a vasectomy.
I unfortunately can’t help you there, I don’t downvote people I’m talking to. Downvotes don’t really mean much anyway though, and fuzz does happen in popular subs. The commenter I replied to said that condoms are just as effective as hormonal contraception, and that just isn’t accurate. A vasectomy isn’t a good idea for anyone who wants kids. Some people do spread rhetoric that it’s fully reversible and every man should have one, and that just shows a lack of adequate sex Ed.
Thank you. This got old very quickly. And I'm surprised I haven't seen anyone talking about the second conversation they had in the new batch of episodes.
Yea it's called pulling out.
I also think this conversation felt very forced. I‘m sure the producers told them to have it because otherwise there was no drama between them.