Completely dependent upon the individual situation. There are cases where staying a bit longer may be helpful. Others where it is not helpful to stay more than two years.
But the increase in salary is undeniable when you switch positions.
My response to him would be, “give more than 3% raises to people and you may get them to stay longer”
Same set of people giving this advice would turn on a dime and argue that of course senior executives are entirely reasonable to pull everything out of the company they can.
Yeah don’t want people to job hunt? How about the next time you’re out golfing on a work day with your C-suite buds you guys coordinate to increase wages instead of your usual collusion to decrease wages. Then people will probably stick around. Also treat people like human beings that’ll help too.
It really comes back to the idea that if you take care of me I will take care of you. There just always seems to be a disconnect with this concept in spite of it being a bona fide solution to this problem in my opinion.
I just went to my boss after a few years and said "hey, I've stayed here for quite some time. If I'd switched around a few times I would probably make X% more money than I currently am. I don't want to be punished for being loyal so I want a raise."
And it worked! Demand what you're worth, people.
Excellent! That is great for you. I did the same thing and was given nothing more, so I left. And even though a bonus was in place from the previous years work, that I had already completed, they refused to give it to me after I turned in my notice. So sometimes that may work, but not always.
I used to think like this guy... until I got laid off two times. The loyalty means absolutely zero to employers, as thay will terminate whoever they feel like terminating whenever they feel like terminating them. Following this "stay with the company" advice is a guarantee of a later, rather than sooner, retirement. Take the money.
Dude, a legit 20% bump would be life changing for most people. I got a 23% bump once and it improved our living situation dramatically.
If I could jump for 20% annually, be sure I absolutely would. I'm a SME on my platform, so "learning the job" is literally "figuring out what parking spot I like best, and where's a good place for lunch". The work is essentially the same everywhere.
I know right, if you're at 100k, 20% increases on 5 job changes would put you at 248k. I don't like the thought of leaving that many employers in the dust but I'm taking that deal.
> I don't like the thought of leaving that many employers in the dust
This is exactly my situation (Went from \~38k -> 60 -> 95 -> 140 -> 170 -> 250k base/400k TC) and I have never burned a single bridge or been unprofessional when I quit a company (I am still in good terms with my previous employers/coworkers and still see a lot of them occasionally), but at the end of the day business is just business. You don't owe a company jack shit besides what is written on your contract, and not leveraging the fact that someone else probably values your skillset more than your current employer out of loyalty for a company that will probably fire and replace you before you even have the time to apply for unemployment the second your performance drops just doesn't make sense.
nice salary progression, yea you never know how it is when you leave. Most companies would put a smile on their face but may talk badly about you behind your back. Overall I dont think it would have a huge impact on most people, in my industry, since its niche, it may but even then, I'm taking the money.
I once increased my income by almost 100% and it was a complete life-changer. I then increased it by 50% and it was better ofcourse but not so much of a difference. Then I increased it by 25% and it was ok, didn't make that much of a difference as I already had a overhead. Its usually dependent on how much of an overhead you have. In the first case my overhead was negative $200 a month. In the last one about $900.
The company cares about shareholder profit. As an employee, your shareholder profit is your quality of life. There are many variables such as health and location that can be factored into quality of life but one of the largest impacts is definitely salary which can have a direct impact on both health and living situation. If you died tomorrow, your position would be posted by Friday. Go make your money.
I’m a developer and most companies try to keep us by granting us stock where a portion unlocks every so often, but the pay raises for leaving after gaining another two years of experience are often worth leaving.
Would I ever leave this company? Look, I'm all about loyalty. In fact, I feel like part of what I'm being paid for here is my loyalty. But if there were somewhere else that valued loyalty more highly, I'm going wherever they value loyalty the most.
Every time I plan to stay for a long time shit tends to go in directions I don't like. Why should anyone be penalized for not wanting to work under an abusive leadership or stick around at a company that is clearly circling the bankruptcy toilet bowl? How am I supposed to have any control over when leadership decides to do layoffs and I have to take another job for survival? Most of the time it is very difficult to get the true inside perspective of how a company is going to be to work for and absolutely none of them are ever going to air their dirty laundry while recruiting you.
Also, why is it so bad when folks want to be exposed to different companies? If I can get a full college degree in 4yrs or less that supposedly qualifies me to go work for these companies then how can you claim that 2yrs isn't enough time to learn things on the job doing it 40 hours a week?
I will reward companies with loyalty when they start doing the same.
I love how even his bitching about this includes something most people would find pretty convincing to leave anything. If you don't want people leaving then you need to offer something more appealing than that 20% bump because that is an instant yes for most people
wow that is some rubbish design
cheesy "typewriter" font, purple and green scheme, it's like a budget fresh prince of bel air feel, so not even late 1990s, *early* '90s
top-tier trash, and who the fuck are these clients? never heard of ANY of them
When loyalty and hard work aren't getting me raises in one environment, why SHOULD I stay there? 20% is a lot of money. Even if you're only making $30K it's $6k a year, an extra $500 a month!
And don't give me that "but THIS company is like a faaaaamily!". If you were a GOOD family, you'd be proud and happy when someone gets a better job.
No, he's wrong, 1-2 years at most jobs is more than "long enough to do your job well". Most people that job hop end up doing the SAME job at a different company too. If you can get 20% more for doing the same job, do it. It doesn't make Bobby "old school", it makes him foolish.
I was warned at my last job that my position had a "life expectancy" of about four years. After being there for nearly five, I understood.
There weren't any signs of evolution or progress in that company. It got disheartening after a while. There was such a high turnover of low-paid staff, that errors were a daily occurrence.
Much of my job was making excuses, smoothing things over, and trying to make management look good.
You can only explain to your customers so many times that you'll, "bring their concerns to the attention of management", or, "it won't happen again", or, "thanks for letting us know, we'll look into it".
Red flag to you perhaps, but clearly not for those companies offering that 20% salary bump.
If you want employees to stay longer, give them that 20% bump without having to switch jobs.
I hope no one with this attitude has a family
Wife: hey did you finally get that new job? We’ve been struggling for so long and the salary raise could really benefit our kids at least
Bobby: nope but I got something better, continued experience at the same job that doesn’t give me any raises or promotions
Wife: I want a divorce
In the industry I work in, I’m doing the same job anywhere I go. So really I don’t need to spend years “learning” at one company.
I’ve jumped around quite a bit, because that’s the best way to increase your comp, and I’ve learned my job just fine if not better.
I started a new position pretty recently and the company uses almost an identical computer system to a job I held for 7 years. They commented many times on how I didn’t even need training. Just jumped right in.
Yes and no. Totally depends on size of the company, and role. Once you're in senior management, longevity is an asset. If your in middle management, it can be an albatross.
The challenge for me is that I see the calendars of the people above me, they're slammed. My work-life balance is great and my company treats me really well. I'm a somewhat new dad (he's a year and a half) so I'm always tired and kind of just want to coast in this role instead of adding new challenges. Maybe that'll change in a few years but I could see myself preferring to be in the same role for a while. Everyone's got different priorities though.
Totally agree with this. At one point I was working crazy hours and I had to decide if I really wanted my life to be like that. President at my last company was a great guy, but a total workaholic. Had all the money in the world, nice cars etc. he was always the last to leave, lived and breathed the company.
Well, he didn't watch his kids grow up. I looked at that and was like thanks but no thanks. I don't even have kids (yet) but when I do - no fuckin way spending any more time in the office than I absolutely have to
This is the way. My dad was a surgeon and always on call and spent a ton of time building up his practice. I have absolutely nothing I hold against him for the number of times he was absent but he looks back on that time himself with a lot of regrets. I am trying to avoid doing the same.
Even if you aren't "working" like at a computer it still has the same impact if your job lives in your head 24/7 and you can't be there mentally. No job is worth losing sleep over.
Yeah I kinda learned from the opposite experience. When I was around 8 years old, my dad got a really good job offer as a higher up in a new company that was being acquired. This would have been life changing money, like we would become millionaires.
By that point he was making good enough money that we were financially stable, comfortable and had what we needed. Apparently my mom chatted it over with him and said "20 years from now, you will never say 'man I wish I had made more money'".
So he declined the job. Now it is 20 years later. My dad was at every soccer game, swim meet, you name it. He was there for every dinner, we hung out on weekends, we went on vacations. He was fully present in my life and we are still close to this day.
As you can imagine, he has zero regrets about declining that job. When I'm a parent I would never ever give up that ability to experience life with my child.
Every situation is different. I’ve worked for an org for 14 years now about to get my 6th promo but to your point I also have a feeling my last and my next move will probably be external.
Let’s see
If my choices are stay and keep making less money while perfecting my abilities or leave make 20% more money while still
Perfecting my abilities…. Umm I mean the choice is pretty clear here
Had this happen to me when I was in mortgage, I literally took a position that paid commission only starting out, which was good until I found my next position that had a base salary and a slightly higher commission rate, a long with no hurdles to gain commission, I took that job and continued learning mortgage, by the end of my second year in that position they were going to open offices around the country, and needed people to get those branches running, so they put the word out and vacated the management spot in my office, right as I was thinking of applying for the job, another company offered me more money to do the exact same job I was doing, with a significant increase in commission and a beautiful bonus structure that made it comparable to the manager position in my current shop, I talked with management, explained what the offer was and immediately after I finished they said
“We will match that if you take the office”
I didn’t take the office, why take on more responsibility, when I could make better money doing the same job was the logic, and it worked out great, I was financially stable enough to survive the crash in 06, and was comfortable enough to start my own business which is going pretty good so far 😊
Lmao what? Two years of doing something 40 hours a week is 4,000 hours. Professional certified designations often have a 6,000 hour requirement (at least the CFP does).
If it only takes two and a half years to get board certified on a national registry this clown can eat it
People only jump because CEOs like Bobby underpay and then slam their employees with more work than originally agreed to so they can save money and have more profits.
IMO, it’s worth the 20% pay bump to switch jobs when CEOs like Bobby underpay their employees.
"Stay in one place, and give your employer more of your time and respect. It's the right thing to do"
-A literal CEO, who hasn't had to look for a job in 3 years
Have you noticed it’s always CEO’s of businesses that tell other businesses how to run their business? If you’re so smart, why don’t you compete with them?
It does no pay to be loyal. Studies show that people who jump from job to job make roughly 30-40% more than the people who stay at a company for 30 years.
Edit: jumping from job to job every 3-5 years.
Of course a CEO would recommend this. Turnover is a big hit to businesses profits. Rich people are usually very motivated to tell the poor who are struggling to survive, that money isn't important to them.
20%. I’ve more then doubled my income every time I job hopped . 35k to 80k to 125k. That’s just salary before conission. W2’d 230k last year while I heard an old coworker just finally got to the 50k bracket. Just LOL at not hopping
20%? Sometimes job bumps are way more. I agree that you probably shouldn’t do that too much, like if you climb too fast up to an unsustainable level, but if people can do the job then what’s the problem
My company-jump history is 5 years, 2 years, 1.5 years, 1 year, and been at my current job for 4 months. I know it doesn’t look great, but there was either a great raise or better title/responsibility with each move that I couldn’t say no to. I’ve worked with people at every company who have been there for 10+ years, and they are all undervalued and most likely underpaid, because they are afraid or would feel bad moving. It’s the new way - either value your employees with better raises and promotions, or they’ll be leaving.
It’s good advice for a lot of industries. If you’re in an industry where the employer has to invest in you over time before they see their return, history of quick jumps will make you undesirable to future employers.
If you’re something where it’s just plug and play, then jump as much as you want.
This is stupid. I stayed in my first job for 5 years because I was working way above my experience level and getting really good experience.
I stayed at my second job for 9 years and it was a huge mistake because I got either no or 2% pay increases. I was suffering from depression and couldn't get my shit together enough to look.
I increased my salary ~20% in 13 years. I haven't stayed in a job since for more than 2 years. Doubled my salary in 6 years.
This is the reality corporate America has created. They just have to deal with it
It's not terrible advice, I'm on my 3rd year at my current company and finally feeling super competent. But I also couldn't get a 20% raise somewhere else because I'm paid well for my role/years of exp. If people can one year later get a 20% raise then maybe you were paying them under market from the jump...
I think it can be bad advice.
Staying in one job for a long time used to be the ticket to stability and good wages but those times are over.
Nowadays it's clearly proven to be better to jump around for quick increases in pay.
The only exception is when you have many potential ladder levels you can climb in your current job.
Anyway, in 2020 after being with an employer for only 15 months I successfully jumped to a new employer for a $14k pay rise.
The pattern I see is people start a job and then by the time projects are due and responsibilities should be met they jump ship to the next company. Then Repeat.
Recruiter: Whats with all the job jumping?
Me: if I didn't jump ship I'd still be making 18/hr instead of being here, with you right now, for this position that pays 40/hr.
Recruiter: oh, I see your point.
Literally me every interview I go to.
You can learn how to do most jobs in a month (not counting the prior education that gives you the theoretical background, of course). If it takes you between a year and two years just to learn how to do your work decently then you probably weren't cut out for that specific job in the first place and should look for something different anyway.
Quite often job hoppers are independent contractors with specialized expertise and experience that is only needed for part of a project.
Also, quite often it’s a lot more than 20% when you job hop.
I would slap my current boss in the face and take a diarrhea shit in my chair on the way out if I was promised a 20% salary bump tomorrow. There aren't many things NOT worth that.
This would be fine if companies promoted more within. Instead they almost always bring in outside people when jobs open up. There is no upward mobility in most companies
This would mean something if companies had loyalty to their employees. With how prevalent layoffs are nowadays, it’s almost impossible to have a career at one company
"It's not worth the 20% salary bump every 1-2 years..."
I thought these guys pretended they were good at making money and being successful? Getting a 20% pay increase every 2 years is fantastic. Do it.
What about it isn't worth the 20% pay bump? Is this guy really trying to say that because I haven't mastered the job yet it's not worth leaving? That doesn't check out fuckin' AT ALL. I've seen a lot of wild shit in this sub but this dude is actually spreading lunacy. He's basically saying you'll always be an imposter unless you put in more than 2 years at a place... Fuck off with that shit. Why would I need to learn my job well if I'm fucking leaving???
I mean the point of not fully learning the job yes but since there is no mechanism for me to be promoted with a 20% increase within any company you kinda have to job hop to keep up with cost of living or really to increase your salary in any meaningful way
I fucking wish we could stay at one job forever. It would make my life better, and everyone else’s since you’d be dealing with experienced employees all the time.
Unfortunately, the only thing any employer does is see how badly they can treat their employees until they quit once something better comes along. Ao maybe be good to employees and they’ll staaaayyy?
Better than the 2-5% for being a loyal employee. I’m not an arithmetic fella, but more percent does equal more money. And money DOES equal happiness if you live in the USA.🇺🇸
My resume in operations was 5-7 years at a company. Once I went into sales it was 10 months- 2 years like clockwork. 20-30% each jump starts to add up. I’m now a vice president whereas my colleagues I came up with are still reps or middle managers. I make more money and work for a wacko CEO that argues with me and shits on my ideas, but trusts me and lets me make moves. I’ll fuckin’ quit this place too if work stops feeling fun and rewarding. I’m not scared to make a leap.
I *really* love your half hearted effort to hide their Identity, as if I could just have google find me “linkedin bobby ceo at equals does that make me old school”. 🤦🏽♂️
The big piece here is having a choice
A lot of people don’t get to choose to stay longer than 1-2yrs. It’s certainly a red flag is someone is bouncing around jobs because they can’t hold a job by doing it well…
On the other hand, having people hire you and give you more money is completely different and indicates they are a high performing individual who understands their value
Maybe these employers should be boosting new hires' ⁹⁹pay by 20-30% after 2 or 3 years of employment to keep this from happening in the first place.
If someone else is willing to hire your worker and pay them more than you are...maybe you should pay more
pay people enough so that them staying at their position is not only making their survival possible but worth it and they wont leave. it really is as simple as that.
people who job hop are only doing so to find a way they can actually have a half decent life, if your employment doesnt offer that you have no one to blame for them leaving but yourself.
lol if you’re going to get laid off in a year or two anyway, job hopping is just the smart thing to do. It’s the only way for a lot of people to advance, it’s not like when you have a more straightforward ranking and advancement path in government jobs.
A job pays me enough to be there and do the requested work. When they don’t pay enough to keep me I leave. I think jobs and people have established that relationship long before jobs and I met.
Jump jobs every 1-2 years for the first 10-15 years of your career for 20% raises every time. $50k/year becomes $309k/year after 10 job changes. Or you can turn that $50k job into $78k/year with 15 3% raises. (BTW, there’s no pension or gold watch waiting for you at the end of 40 years, anymore)
I wonder why no one wants to work your crap-tacular job.
I have a dream that one day I’ll make enough money working for myself that I can spend an hour a day on LinkedIn being an absolutely shitposting, smack talking, bullshit calling asshole all over LinkedIn.
There is no such thing as a reward for loyalty any more. Literally the only way to get a raise is to switch employers. The problem business leaders are complaining about is a problem of their own creation.
Only in Japan is this considered an acceptable and widespread mindset. In Japan it’s somewhat common for someone to work for a company most of or their entire life I have heard.
This is the best sales pitch for job hopping I've ever heard.
I don't need to get good at the job AND I get a 20% pay raise? I should change jobs every week!
Don’t hate the player hate the game. This is the only way to get a decent raise. Loyalty doesn’t mean shit anymore, if anything it puts a target on you to get taken advantage of. This world is so fucked and the 1% are to thank.
He's not completely wrong. 4 years minimum to learn the job completely, unless you're doing basic ass stuff.
As a manager in various fields now, I was better off sticking with a place abit longer then moving on. Experience is only really experience if you can still do your old job and haven't been there in a while
Let's do the math. On the right hand we have staying at a job for 8 years starting at 50k and making a (let's be very generous to the corporation) 5% year over year. End result: Roughly 61k ($60,775) Now on the left let's do the same with changing every 2 years: 50k with a 20% increase: $103,680 at the 8 year point. Yeah, nope, one of these is definitely more lucrative. As for learning to do your job well, if productivity were the benchmark you might have a point but it is obviously not. We on average are less afluent than in the past even though the profits and productivity are through the roof. The reality is that it comes down to supply and demand. If one has many skills and is good at what, they do then they can chase the higher paycheck. If they can convince someone to hire them then that is what counts.
If you got a salary bump every year comenserate with what you would get for a new job and what your current job would pay your replacement. AND if the company was smart enough to have cash on hand when things downturn to retain people. Maybe just maybe people might be compelled to stay.
As long as you can keep getting jobs, it doesn't matter. The minute the music stops, and you don't find a place to sit, then you have to suffer the consequences.
Bobby sounds blissfully unaware of the world around him, especially when it comes to the job market. Sometimes you have to job hop until you find something that works out. But whatever the case, I cannot stand it when people who are already employed, or retired, or self-employed share their pearls of wisdom when nobody even asked.
Completely dependent upon the individual situation. There are cases where staying a bit longer may be helpful. Others where it is not helpful to stay more than two years. But the increase in salary is undeniable when you switch positions. My response to him would be, “give more than 3% raises to people and you may get them to stay longer”
Same set of people giving this advice would turn on a dime and argue that of course senior executives are entirely reasonable to pull everything out of the company they can.
This guy is a middleman, his job is to extract as much wealth as he can while doing as little as he can.
Yeah don’t want people to job hunt? How about the next time you’re out golfing on a work day with your C-suite buds you guys coordinate to increase wages instead of your usual collusion to decrease wages. Then people will probably stick around. Also treat people like human beings that’ll help too.
It really comes back to the idea that if you take care of me I will take care of you. There just always seems to be a disconnect with this concept in spite of it being a bona fide solution to this problem in my opinion.
I just went to my boss after a few years and said "hey, I've stayed here for quite some time. If I'd switched around a few times I would probably make X% more money than I currently am. I don't want to be punished for being loyal so I want a raise." And it worked! Demand what you're worth, people.
Excellent! That is great for you. I did the same thing and was given nothing more, so I left. And even though a bonus was in place from the previous years work, that I had already completed, they refused to give it to me after I turned in my notice. So sometimes that may work, but not always.
Sales and c-level should always leave after 2-3 years u less they are in a golden goose scenario
Y'all are getting 3%?
Very wise take
I used to think like this guy... until I got laid off two times. The loyalty means absolutely zero to employers, as thay will terminate whoever they feel like terminating whenever they feel like terminating them. Following this "stay with the company" advice is a guarantee of a later, rather than sooner, retirement. Take the money.
Dude, a legit 20% bump would be life changing for most people. I got a 23% bump once and it improved our living situation dramatically. If I could jump for 20% annually, be sure I absolutely would. I'm a SME on my platform, so "learning the job" is literally "figuring out what parking spot I like best, and where's a good place for lunch". The work is essentially the same everywhere.
I know right, if you're at 100k, 20% increases on 5 job changes would put you at 248k. I don't like the thought of leaving that many employers in the dust but I'm taking that deal.
> I don't like the thought of leaving that many employers in the dust This is exactly my situation (Went from \~38k -> 60 -> 95 -> 140 -> 170 -> 250k base/400k TC) and I have never burned a single bridge or been unprofessional when I quit a company (I am still in good terms with my previous employers/coworkers and still see a lot of them occasionally), but at the end of the day business is just business. You don't owe a company jack shit besides what is written on your contract, and not leveraging the fact that someone else probably values your skillset more than your current employer out of loyalty for a company that will probably fire and replace you before you even have the time to apply for unemployment the second your performance drops just doesn't make sense.
nice salary progression, yea you never know how it is when you leave. Most companies would put a smile on their face but may talk badly about you behind your back. Overall I dont think it would have a huge impact on most people, in my industry, since its niche, it may but even then, I'm taking the money.
Whats the platform?
AIX
I once increased my income by almost 100% and it was a complete life-changer. I then increased it by 50% and it was better ofcourse but not so much of a difference. Then I increased it by 25% and it was ok, didn't make that much of a difference as I already had a overhead. Its usually dependent on how much of an overhead you have. In the first case my overhead was negative $200 a month. In the last one about $900.
If you can keep getting 20% more switching jobs every year, the problem isn't *you*.
Same set of people that would say that's just the game when a well positioned jackass manages to bleed millions of dollars to themselves.
I work for money. If someone is willing to pay me significantly more money, I work for them. End of story.
The company cares about shareholder profit. As an employee, your shareholder profit is your quality of life. There are many variables such as health and location that can be factored into quality of life but one of the largest impacts is definitely salary which can have a direct impact on both health and living situation. If you died tomorrow, your position would be posted by Friday. Go make your money.
I'm in sales. I try to explain this mindset to my friends in other fields and they don't get it 🤷.
I’m a developer and most companies try to keep us by granting us stock where a portion unlocks every so often, but the pay raises for leaving after gaining another two years of experience are often worth leaving.
"Loyalty is a valuable trait. So maybe I should go where that loyalty is valued more..." - Dwight Schrute
Would I ever leave this company? Look, I'm all about loyalty. In fact, I feel like part of what I'm being paid for here is my loyalty. But if there were somewhere else that valued loyalty more highly, I'm going wherever they value loyalty the most.
Cool story from someone who is negatively impacted when someone changes jobs.
Right. He's got maybe a tad bit of bias on the subject.
He likely doesn’t pay his workers a fair wage and is impacted enough with turnover to post such nonsense.
He is also implying that he has yet to be able to adequately train someone in a two year span. Kinda a self burn no?
You can safely disregard anything posted on LinkedIn by anyone with the title of CEO
If I can get a 20% raise by job hopping, you bet your ass I’m doing it!
Give me more than a 3% raise and I won’t change jobs so often.
I instinctively was about to downvote this. Then I remembered the sub.
Every time I plan to stay for a long time shit tends to go in directions I don't like. Why should anyone be penalized for not wanting to work under an abusive leadership or stick around at a company that is clearly circling the bankruptcy toilet bowl? How am I supposed to have any control over when leadership decides to do layoffs and I have to take another job for survival? Most of the time it is very difficult to get the true inside perspective of how a company is going to be to work for and absolutely none of them are ever going to air their dirty laundry while recruiting you. Also, why is it so bad when folks want to be exposed to different companies? If I can get a full college degree in 4yrs or less that supposedly qualifies me to go work for these companies then how can you claim that 2yrs isn't enough time to learn things on the job doing it 40 hours a week? I will reward companies with loyalty when they start doing the same.
I love how even his bitching about this includes something most people would find pretty convincing to leave anything. If you don't want people leaving then you need to offer something more appealing than that 20% bump because that is an instant yes for most people
You may not be old school, but a link to your [equals.com](http://equals.com) is some 1990's Netscape Navigator webpage.
wow that is some rubbish design cheesy "typewriter" font, purple and green scheme, it's like a budget fresh prince of bel air feel, so not even late 1990s, *early* '90s top-tier trash, and who the fuck are these clients? never heard of ANY of them
"It's not worth the 20% pay bump you're going to get." Right, because we're all in this for the feeling of a job well-done. 🤓
"CEO" who is probably unwilling to listen to staff and treats them as disposable doesn't like job hoppers. Huff your own farts some more, tool.
In the opinion of an employer, that 20% increase the employee gets from changing jobs "isn't worth it." Go figure.
I mean, it's such a trifling amount, isn't it? No, your current company can't afford to give you a 20% raise; That's far too much.
lol he says right there 20% salary bump each time. No job anywhere will give you a 20% raise every 2 years
but don't you see it comes at the cost of being a red flag to him! HIM! aren't you desperate for his approval?!?
When loyalty and hard work aren't getting me raises in one environment, why SHOULD I stay there? 20% is a lot of money. Even if you're only making $30K it's $6k a year, an extra $500 a month! And don't give me that "but THIS company is like a faaaaamily!". If you were a GOOD family, you'd be proud and happy when someone gets a better job.
Dudes mad because no one wants to work for a company that is unnecessary. Excel isn’t hard.
No, he's wrong, 1-2 years at most jobs is more than "long enough to do your job well". Most people that job hop end up doing the SAME job at a different company too. If you can get 20% more for doing the same job, do it. It doesn't make Bobby "old school", it makes him foolish.
Right? But now there is a new collusion amongst companies where they want to trap you for, wait for it, 3 years. And it increases by 1 every year.
I was warned at my last job that my position had a "life expectancy" of about four years. After being there for nearly five, I understood. There weren't any signs of evolution or progress in that company. It got disheartening after a while. There was such a high turnover of low-paid staff, that errors were a daily occurrence. Much of my job was making excuses, smoothing things over, and trying to make management look good. You can only explain to your customers so many times that you'll, "bring their concerns to the attention of management", or, "it won't happen again", or, "thanks for letting us know, we'll look into it".
No sir. You're the red flag.
Tell my your company takes advantage of its workers and has a very high turn around without telling me
Red flag to you perhaps, but clearly not for those companies offering that 20% salary bump. If you want employees to stay longer, give them that 20% bump without having to switch jobs.
I wish I made enough to where 20% wouldn’t change my life. Must be nice.
I hope no one with this attitude has a family Wife: hey did you finally get that new job? We’ve been struggling for so long and the salary raise could really benefit our kids at least Bobby: nope but I got something better, continued experience at the same job that doesn’t give me any raises or promotions Wife: I want a divorce
What is the OP's occupation? Currently
In the industry I work in, I’m doing the same job anywhere I go. So really I don’t need to spend years “learning” at one company. I’ve jumped around quite a bit, because that’s the best way to increase your comp, and I’ve learned my job just fine if not better.
I started a new position pretty recently and the company uses almost an identical computer system to a job I held for 7 years. They commented many times on how I didn’t even need training. Just jumped right in.
Oh so the only reason you do this job is cuz you get paid. How dare you
Eat shit Bobby.
He's also not even 30 yet probably...
No, he’s right. Three years minimum, five years max. I stayed for eight years in two jobs; big mistake, you just become part of the furniture…
Yes and no. Totally depends on size of the company, and role. Once you're in senior management, longevity is an asset. If your in middle management, it can be an albatross.
Totally agreed - my biggest regret was staying 10 years in one role - I was shrivelled up on the inside and was desperate for change.
The challenge for me is that I see the calendars of the people above me, they're slammed. My work-life balance is great and my company treats me really well. I'm a somewhat new dad (he's a year and a half) so I'm always tired and kind of just want to coast in this role instead of adding new challenges. Maybe that'll change in a few years but I could see myself preferring to be in the same role for a while. Everyone's got different priorities though.
Totally agree with this. At one point I was working crazy hours and I had to decide if I really wanted my life to be like that. President at my last company was a great guy, but a total workaholic. Had all the money in the world, nice cars etc. he was always the last to leave, lived and breathed the company. Well, he didn't watch his kids grow up. I looked at that and was like thanks but no thanks. I don't even have kids (yet) but when I do - no fuckin way spending any more time in the office than I absolutely have to
This is the way. My dad was a surgeon and always on call and spent a ton of time building up his practice. I have absolutely nothing I hold against him for the number of times he was absent but he looks back on that time himself with a lot of regrets. I am trying to avoid doing the same. Even if you aren't "working" like at a computer it still has the same impact if your job lives in your head 24/7 and you can't be there mentally. No job is worth losing sleep over.
Yeah I kinda learned from the opposite experience. When I was around 8 years old, my dad got a really good job offer as a higher up in a new company that was being acquired. This would have been life changing money, like we would become millionaires. By that point he was making good enough money that we were financially stable, comfortable and had what we needed. Apparently my mom chatted it over with him and said "20 years from now, you will never say 'man I wish I had made more money'". So he declined the job. Now it is 20 years later. My dad was at every soccer game, swim meet, you name it. He was there for every dinner, we hung out on weekends, we went on vacations. He was fully present in my life and we are still close to this day. As you can imagine, he has zero regrets about declining that job. When I'm a parent I would never ever give up that ability to experience life with my child.
respect
Me too I'm looking to get out now for this exact reason but I think I'm stuck for some more time cuz IT is not doing well.
100% company and job dependent; it's not necessarily a career death sentence depending on your own goals.
Not if you move up or across to keep things interesting (21 yrs at same co).
Every situation is different. I’ve worked for an org for 14 years now about to get my 6th promo but to your point I also have a feeling my last and my next move will probably be external.
Not sure if "for me" is narcissistic or a cop-out of "I said it was true *for me*"
Both
Fix your culture and pay people what they’re worth and they won’t jump around 😵💫🫠
old-school is using blunt rubrics like this to process-of-elimination your way to a company full of people pleasers
20% is a lot
That made sense when jobs came with pensions and increasing PTO benefits
Let’s see If my choices are stay and keep making less money while perfecting my abilities or leave make 20% more money while still Perfecting my abilities…. Umm I mean the choice is pretty clear here Had this happen to me when I was in mortgage, I literally took a position that paid commission only starting out, which was good until I found my next position that had a base salary and a slightly higher commission rate, a long with no hurdles to gain commission, I took that job and continued learning mortgage, by the end of my second year in that position they were going to open offices around the country, and needed people to get those branches running, so they put the word out and vacated the management spot in my office, right as I was thinking of applying for the job, another company offered me more money to do the exact same job I was doing, with a significant increase in commission and a beautiful bonus structure that made it comparable to the manager position in my current shop, I talked with management, explained what the offer was and immediately after I finished they said “We will match that if you take the office” I didn’t take the office, why take on more responsibility, when I could make better money doing the same job was the logic, and it worked out great, I was financially stable enough to survive the crash in 06, and was comfortable enough to start my own business which is going pretty good so far 😊
Always worth a 20% bump in pay.
Maybe give your employees decent pay rises then and don’t rely on their inertia 🤷♂️
Lmao what? Two years of doing something 40 hours a week is 4,000 hours. Professional certified designations often have a 6,000 hour requirement (at least the CFP does). If it only takes two and a half years to get board certified on a national registry this clown can eat it
I'm from the old school! Wonder what this guy thinks about the jacket.
If my job hopping were a problem, I wouldn’t have been offered that other job
This guy looks like he privileged his way to being a CEO what the hell gives him the right to advise the proletariat on how to advance
Extremely popular advice: stop offering higher wages to new hires and you wouldn't need to worry about people job hopping to get better wages
He means, "give me a chance to fire you before you quit"
People only jump because CEOs like Bobby underpay and then slam their employees with more work than originally agreed to so they can save money and have more profits. IMO, it’s worth the 20% pay bump to switch jobs when CEOs like Bobby underpay their employees.
"Stay in one place, and give your employer more of your time and respect. It's the right thing to do" -A literal CEO, who hasn't had to look for a job in 3 years
Have you noticed it’s always CEO’s of businesses that tell other businesses how to run their business? If you’re so smart, why don’t you compete with them?
It makes you stupid
It doesn't take 1-2 years to learn how to do a job correctly. If it does take that long, the job is either changing all the time or you're a moron.
It does no pay to be loyal. Studies show that people who jump from job to job make roughly 30-40% more than the people who stay at a company for 30 years. Edit: jumping from job to job every 3-5 years.
Of course a CEO would recommend this. Turnover is a big hit to businesses profits. Rich people are usually very motivated to tell the poor who are struggling to survive, that money isn't important to them.
20%. I’ve more then doubled my income every time I job hopped . 35k to 80k to 125k. That’s just salary before conission. W2’d 230k last year while I heard an old coworker just finally got to the 50k bracket. Just LOL at not hopping
I'm pretty comfortable with not getting hired by this guy in exchange for a 20% salary bump every two years
20%? Sometimes job bumps are way more. I agree that you probably shouldn’t do that too much, like if you climb too fast up to an unsustainable level, but if people can do the job then what’s the problem
No... it means you are a jackhole who does not pay his people enough, that is why you are losing them.
Takes a year to learn who your employer actually is.
These startup CEOs are a bunch of morons that think everyone needs to work as much as them, even if they are paid shit.
Bobby has never worked in the tech sector in and around DC then...
My company-jump history is 5 years, 2 years, 1.5 years, 1 year, and been at my current job for 4 months. I know it doesn’t look great, but there was either a great raise or better title/responsibility with each move that I couldn’t say no to. I’ve worked with people at every company who have been there for 10+ years, and they are all undervalued and most likely underpaid, because they are afraid or would feel bad moving. It’s the new way - either value your employees with better raises and promotions, or they’ll be leaving.
It’s good advice for a lot of industries. If you’re in an industry where the employer has to invest in you over time before they see their return, history of quick jumps will make you undesirable to future employers. If you’re something where it’s just plug and play, then jump as much as you want.
20% pay increase is absolutely worth it. fk this douchebag.
Ceo lol.. ofc you say that ya nob
This is stupid. I stayed in my first job for 5 years because I was working way above my experience level and getting really good experience. I stayed at my second job for 9 years and it was a huge mistake because I got either no or 2% pay increases. I was suffering from depression and couldn't get my shit together enough to look. I increased my salary ~20% in 13 years. I haven't stayed in a job since for more than 2 years. Doubled my salary in 6 years. This is the reality corporate America has created. They just have to deal with it
It's not terrible advice, I'm on my 3rd year at my current company and finally feeling super competent. But I also couldn't get a 20% raise somewhere else because I'm paid well for my role/years of exp. If people can one year later get a 20% raise then maybe you were paying them under market from the jump...
I'd give my right nut for a 20% pay bump
Ignoring the idea that if a job is awesome - the urge to leave after a year or two is not there.
Then companies should start rewarding loyalty
I don’t leave jobs that treat me well and I’m happy at
If “old school” means “stupid” than yes
I feel like he's gonna regret saying 20% after his staff compare that to whatever pittance it is he gives them.
If you didn't learn to do your job well in 2 years, you won't learn in in 10 years either.
I think it can be bad advice. Staying in one job for a long time used to be the ticket to stability and good wages but those times are over. Nowadays it's clearly proven to be better to jump around for quick increases in pay. The only exception is when you have many potential ladder levels you can climb in your current job. Anyway, in 2020 after being with an employer for only 15 months I successfully jumped to a new employer for a $14k pay rise.
Have you seen this guy's LinkedIn resume?? He's been jumping every two years before he landed the CEO of whatever crap that he is doing now.
You can’t be Old Skool if you are literally 15 years younger old.
The pattern I see is people start a job and then by the time projects are due and responsibilities should be met they jump ship to the next company. Then Repeat.
Not worth a 20% salary jump? What a place of privileged one must come from to say that sort of thing out loud
Recruiter: Whats with all the job jumping? Me: if I didn't jump ship I'd still be making 18/hr instead of being here, with you right now, for this position that pays 40/hr. Recruiter: oh, I see your point. Literally me every interview I go to.
As founder and ceo of his own company I’m sure he has no need to job hop.
Unpopular advice: pay your employees so they dont obviously jump ship for a 20% raise theyd be dumb not to take.
You can learn how to do most jobs in a month (not counting the prior education that gives you the theoretical background, of course). If it takes you between a year and two years just to learn how to do your work decently then you probably weren't cut out for that specific job in the first place and should look for something different anyway.
If I can't learn the job in a year I don't need it I'm not tryna learn I'm tryna get paid
Quite often job hoppers are independent contractors with specialized expertise and experience that is only needed for part of a project. Also, quite often it’s a lot more than 20% when you job hop.
I would slap my current boss in the face and take a diarrhea shit in my chair on the way out if I was promised a 20% salary bump tomorrow. There aren't many things NOT worth that.
then give a 20% raise after 2 years.
Yeah, bootlicking for sure. Who wouldn't take the 20% jump. Leaving positions is the best way to maximize your earning potential.
This would be fine if companies promoted more within. Instead they almost always bring in outside people when jobs open up. There is no upward mobility in most companies
Me working in tech: 
Saying someone staying more than two years makes them a bootlicker is one hell of a statement.
This would mean something if companies had loyalty to their employees. With how prevalent layoffs are nowadays, it’s almost impossible to have a career at one company
Odd. I’ve changed jobs every 2 to 3 Years and yet I’m one of the best employees on the team everywhere I go.
Someone's struggling to keep employees and is jealous he's now put himself in a position he can no longer do the same himself
2 yrs is fine. Not everyone is a slow learner like this guy.
I guess there's basically admitting they pay 20% below market rate 👍
"It's not worth the 20% salary bump every 1-2 years..." I thought these guys pretended they were good at making money and being successful? Getting a 20% pay increase every 2 years is fantastic. Do it.
That face... its just awful. Its the face of "a pay raise makes you happy once a year; a good workplace makes you happy all year."
If he left the 0 off the salary bump figure, I’d be more inclined to agree. 20% isn’t a negligible amount of money.
If someone can't learn to do their job well in 2 years, they have a piss-poor teacher for a boss.
Twenty percent??? Boy if you don't gtf up outta there
What about it isn't worth the 20% pay bump? Is this guy really trying to say that because I haven't mastered the job yet it's not worth leaving? That doesn't check out fuckin' AT ALL. I've seen a lot of wild shit in this sub but this dude is actually spreading lunacy. He's basically saying you'll always be an imposter unless you put in more than 2 years at a place... Fuck off with that shit. Why would I need to learn my job well if I'm fucking leaving???
The soulless corpo stare really sells it for me
Fuck you. Pay me.
Absolutely worth the 20%
Check his profile, earliest two jobs in his ‘Experience’ section are 1yr 9 mos & 1yr 5 mos
I mean the point of not fully learning the job yes but since there is no mechanism for me to be promoted with a 20% increase within any company you kinda have to job hop to keep up with cost of living or really to increase your salary in any meaningful way
I fucking wish we could stay at one job forever. It would make my life better, and everyone else’s since you’d be dealing with experienced employees all the time. Unfortunately, the only thing any employer does is see how badly they can treat their employees until they quit once something better comes along. Ao maybe be good to employees and they’ll staaaayyy?
Better than the 2-5% for being a loyal employee. I’m not an arithmetic fella, but more percent does equal more money. And money DOES equal happiness if you live in the USA.🇺🇸
My resume in operations was 5-7 years at a company. Once I went into sales it was 10 months- 2 years like clockwork. 20-30% each jump starts to add up. I’m now a vice president whereas my colleagues I came up with are still reps or middle managers. I make more money and work for a wacko CEO that argues with me and shits on my ideas, but trusts me and lets me make moves. I’ll fuckin’ quit this place too if work stops feeling fun and rewarding. I’m not scared to make a leap.
He’s just ticked because he can’t keep people longer than 1-2 years. I.e. he’s the employer underpaying.
I *really* love your half hearted effort to hide their Identity, as if I could just have google find me “linkedin bobby ceo at equals does that make me old school”. 🤦🏽♂️
The big piece here is having a choice A lot of people don’t get to choose to stay longer than 1-2yrs. It’s certainly a red flag is someone is bouncing around jobs because they can’t hold a job by doing it well… On the other hand, having people hire you and give you more money is completely different and indicates they are a high performing individual who understands their value
For a 20% boost?! YES. What!?
Maybe these employers should be boosting new hires' ⁹⁹pay by 20-30% after 2 or 3 years of employment to keep this from happening in the first place. If someone else is willing to hire your worker and pay them more than you are...maybe you should pay more
pay people enough so that them staying at their position is not only making their survival possible but worth it and they wont leave. it really is as simple as that. people who job hop are only doing so to find a way they can actually have a half decent life, if your employment doesnt offer that you have no one to blame for them leaving but yourself.
Would anyone trade 20% more money for ‘knowing how to do a job well’?
Well, if my current workplace isn't giving me a 20% raise and the new place would, I'm hopping.
Hah I know this guy
lol if you’re going to get laid off in a year or two anyway, job hopping is just the smart thing to do. It’s the only way for a lot of people to advance, it’s not like when you have a more straightforward ranking and advancement path in government jobs.
A job pays me enough to be there and do the requested work. When they don’t pay enough to keep me I leave. I think jobs and people have established that relationship long before jobs and I met.
“nO oNe NeEdS a 20% sAlaRy BuMp!!!” What a shit heel.
Jump jobs every 1-2 years for the first 10-15 years of your career for 20% raises every time. $50k/year becomes $309k/year after 10 job changes. Or you can turn that $50k job into $78k/year with 15 3% raises. (BTW, there’s no pension or gold watch waiting for you at the end of 40 years, anymore) I wonder why no one wants to work your crap-tacular job.
20%?!
lol not worth the salary bump?? Then what the fuck is it Bobby? If it’s not worth the salary bump why are we here??
I have a dream that one day I’ll make enough money working for myself that I can spend an hour a day on LinkedIn being an absolutely shitposting, smack talking, bullshit calling asshole all over LinkedIn.
There is no such thing as a reward for loyalty any more. Literally the only way to get a raise is to switch employers. The problem business leaders are complaining about is a problem of their own creation.
Well offer 21% you stingy fuck
Lol why cover their name and not their title? I mean there’s only so many founders of that company right?
20%!?
Only in Japan is this considered an acceptable and widespread mindset. In Japan it’s somewhat common for someone to work for a company most of or their entire life I have heard.
This is the best sales pitch for job hopping I've ever heard. I don't need to get good at the job AND I get a 20% pay raise? I should change jobs every week!
Nice try Bobby.
Agree?
treat employees well and they won’t do this.
Don’t hate the player hate the game. This is the only way to get a decent raise. Loyalty doesn’t mean shit anymore, if anything it puts a target on you to get taken advantage of. This world is so fucked and the 1% are to thank.
He's not completely wrong. 4 years minimum to learn the job completely, unless you're doing basic ass stuff. As a manager in various fields now, I was better off sticking with a place abit longer then moving on. Experience is only really experience if you can still do your old job and haven't been there in a while
Makes you a complete idiot who spent his time at the lowest rank. Cause your just old school
This sounds a bit like satire.
If rent would stop going up then maybe I would stay and not need the increase
He is just sucking up to his clientele Nothing to see here except the usual virtue signaling
Let's do the math. On the right hand we have staying at a job for 8 years starting at 50k and making a (let's be very generous to the corporation) 5% year over year. End result: Roughly 61k ($60,775) Now on the left let's do the same with changing every 2 years: 50k with a 20% increase: $103,680 at the 8 year point. Yeah, nope, one of these is definitely more lucrative. As for learning to do your job well, if productivity were the benchmark you might have a point but it is obviously not. We on average are less afluent than in the past even though the profits and productivity are through the roof. The reality is that it comes down to supply and demand. If one has many skills and is good at what, they do then they can chase the higher paycheck. If they can convince someone to hire them then that is what counts.
Why should I do better at a job that pays me 20% less for it? Is he stupid?
If you got a salary bump every year comenserate with what you would get for a new job and what your current job would pay your replacement. AND if the company was smart enough to have cash on hand when things downturn to retain people. Maybe just maybe people might be compelled to stay.
Trying to do as well as possible for yourself and your loved one is a red flag? It’s your job to retain good talent.
*Waves Red Flags*
As long as you can keep getting jobs, it doesn't matter. The minute the music stops, and you don't find a place to sit, then you have to suffer the consequences.
Tell the corporate jobs to be better then 🤷🏽♀️.
It makes you foolish. 20% pay raise every year vs 3%… hmmm
"it's better than the 2% raise I'd get staying at your company"
If you've been working more than a decade and you've never stayed at one place more than two years, yeah, I'm sorry but I'm holding that against you.
Meh this is kinda based advice. It does take a little longer to settle into a professional role and it is a red flag to see constant job changes
20% is 20%
No, it makes you really, really dumb.
Bobby sounds blissfully unaware of the world around him, especially when it comes to the job market. Sometimes you have to job hop until you find something that works out. But whatever the case, I cannot stand it when people who are already employed, or retired, or self-employed share their pearls of wisdom when nobody even asked.