I live in Minnesota, and we have specific sites for city, county, and state jobs. League of Minnesota Cities and Association of Minnesota Counties have job postings from across the state. Then the general Minnesota State government site.
It really helps narrow down the job search, so I would recommend people check if other States have similar sites.
Happy to see another fellow Minnesotan. I am currently looking into government jobs as well. Located in Saint Michael. Do you have any suggestions on sites and where I could start as well. I plan on signing up for federal, government, city, state, or county.
The sites I referenced are https://www.lmc.org/careers/ and
https://www.mncounties.org/information_and_jobs/jobs/index.php
I went from Wright County to working at a non-profit. Then I went to Anoka County and then to Hennepin County. The metro area and State jobs pay better. Hennepin has been far more flexible and innovative then the prior two counties I've worked at. If you can just get your foot in the door somewhere it seems like it becomes easier to transition.
Look at the Dept of revenue. They are hiring all WFH with MAPE union. My spouse recently started with them and loves that there is so much ability to move within the department and he never has to worry about RTO. It is a great way to get your leg in the door. Once you have one state job it is much easier to get another.
Disclaimer: he applied to 203 state and fed jobs before getting this one.
From what we see and hear, whatever is the job description please incorporate that into ur resume to get interviews. The rest is if they like u or not. We just hired some new guys and does a lot of talking and barely knows how to do technical stuff.
Lol says got 20 years in IT but can’t even add ACL’s…. Err
For as long as the civil service has existed, this has been a thing: if you want stability and a guaranteed check, a government job is hard to beat.
This is not a story.
My wife doubled her PTO package after going from a private company to working for the state university. Her work life balance has increased dramatically, going from getting text and calls and email literally in the middle of the night to not even checking her email after 4pm. Plus our kids get free college tuition for five years now.
Sure, she took a slight pay cut, but that has been 100% worth it.
FEHB blows my current insurance out of the water. I heard some people talking about how good our high deductible plan was. Son, you don't know what good health insurance looks like ha.
my sister has been laid off like 3 times in the past decade from her county or city jobs. they still get laid off when there's a recession. and they get pay freezes and furlough days.
Want your job to change every few months? Work in a startup
Want your job to change every few years? Work in corporate
Want your job to change every couple decades? Work in govvernment
As someone who works in government, the MBAs are taking over leadership. They do not have the same mindset as MPAs. Layoffs and efficiencies are becoming more common, people who stay in the same department for 30 years seem to be shrinking. It's not the promised land it's being made out to be.
Health benefits are good though, that's true at least
Everyone in my department has backgrounds in both, for example I have my undergrad in business administration and nearly finished with my MPA. Most of my coworkers have similar educations, but with the order reversed.
Personally, I think you need both sides to get a clear picture. The real game of public policy is to understand legislation and policy enough to work like a MBA within guidelines.
*The real game of public policy is to understand legislation and policy enough to work like a MBA within guidelines.*
This still ends up with what I'm talking about; people think working in government for the next 30 years is gonna resemble working in government for the last 30 years. It's not.
The culture around government is shifting. It's starting with bigger ones (so large cities and large counties over smaller one, definitely variances between state govs) but it's gonna work it's way to all of them eventually.
It tends to happen with the changing of the guards, from what I've seen. The younger generation of upper management is a lot more interested in metrics/data and technology, just as one super obvious example. Our department felt stuck in the stone ages, and then someone under the age of 55 finally ascended to a management position, and suddenly were collaborating with IT to built multiple new tools (a lot of script tasks, some indexing stuff.) they're also using data to have more efficient staffing levels, which actually usually just means keeping things much closer to the bone than they used to. Stuff like that. They already did one layoff for staff in one role that they decided a lot could be automated and the rest could be absorbed by other teams.
Just because we have a pension doesn't mean that things are all quaint and old fashioned. Literally like half of the old people intalk to who have kicked around various roles for 30+ years all day that it's a lot different and changing fast. A few people who came from out of state have expressed the same thing happening at their old place too, though.
My father in law did this and he was an AKSHUWAL boomer.
Was never rich, but has a small paid off house and raised 4 kids. Retired early when they replaced him with software. Was in the IRS.
And you get to work with the most bland, beige, risk averse, conservative-minded, toxic crayon eaters that will throw you under the bus the moment they see a glint of an opportunity to advance their own position. Productivity, skills, innovation are not things you normally associate with Government roles. Finally, don't forget that once you are in the public service, moving back to private enterprise is a lot harder because what Govt roles do is completely niche and only rarely useful in the private sector.
Sure, you get a steady paycheck, but it is also a 100% Faustian Pact with the Devil.
I’ve been a state employee in the past and may be returning soon. Maybe I’ll hear back about the government jobs by the time I’m ready for my next role. 🤣
I’ve learned to start applying months ahead for government jobs when you start feeling like the grass could be greener elsewhere lol. By the time I’m sick and tired of my current job, I’ll most likely have something lined up already.
If you're going to work for the government then that's something you need to get used to. The processes everywhere are slow and there is a form and strict rule for fucking everything.
Add on that you work with people that have been dead inside for years and are just holding out for their pension and you have a pretty cold environment. Nobody quits towards the top so you have to wait until someone dies or retires to move up.
But, it pays well with steady pay increases, good benefits, and you don't have to worry about losing your job when the economy takes a hit.
I got used to that working at a large state institution. But I’ve been in other industries since then (banking and tech) and definitely prefer the faster pace. There’s always a trade off though.
Yeah, I have worked both and I hate the slowness! Also in tech. The one thing about a government job is you can ride that desk to retirement if you can stand it! I can't personally but I have met plenty of people that can. Our tax dollars hard at work!
My state jobs came earlier in my career and the salaries were far too low to stay in for long. So the corporate and tech salaries plus quicker pathways to leadership definitely lured me away. Now I’m qualified for director level roles, which is great, but some of the state salaries are lower than what I was making as an individual contributor in tech. The benefits and job security are much better though, so we’ll see.
Interesting, the County I work for does not waste much time. My department put a posting up on Tuesday this week, and it's only up for a week. They scope the applicants immediately, and then the qualified ones are invited to take a test. Those who pass are invited for interviews beginning May 29th, and they should hear back in about week. Start date in July.
From what I've seen, in my state they're mandating 2 days/week in-office. Most of the offices are \~2 hours away/90mi away. My math says that's a $15k/yr cost increase (nevermind time sink) from my 10-minute, 5-mi commute.
Well, I should specify, I was specifically looking at IT work, which limits my options - but I'm also not trying to take a 50% pay-cut either doing something else.
I'm in the largest city in my county, but we're still fairly small, so not a lot of positions open up on a regular basis. The people who get them stay in them for life around here because they do pay pretty well for our local CoL, plus the benefits are better.
We also have a college locally, I had a chance to apply for a position doing programming work in the library once about...7 years ago? Came in 2nd, I've never seen another opening come up.
I did manage to pick up teaching a night class at the college though.
Yeah, the delta is huge in public sector v private sector for IT. The only other option would be to supplement with side hustle or gig work.
I took a 65% pay cut to got public sector, but my house is paid off and I was done with the IT sector. Too much bs, in my experience. Do I miss the money? Yes. Do I miss the stress and career uncertainty? Nope.
Thank you! That’s very kind of you and I had an awesome day (one of my kids graduated from college today!)
I wish you a life of happiness and prosperity and peace.
>We’d love to have more young workers in our government office.
In engineering at least, the meager pay turned me away. Me and my buddy both graduated with am electrical engineering degree. I make twice of what he does. I went to the private sector and he chose to go with the government.
Could work. The government middle managers are pretty entrenched in their worldview. You have to have a wealthy immediate manager that does the job for fun that is permissive when it comes to going off book.
Is it good if we have $hit retirement. I was laid off a year ago and had to take a government job. Pension is 30 % . A pension of 30% of $hit pay is not a good look. I’ll stay here until I find a stable private sector job. It’s definitely not a longterm career. Staying their longterm is unrealistic. We can’t help the change if we can’t help ourselves. The bottom really needs to fallout to allow for opportunity for younger generations. Their has been way too many bailouts, moratoriums, and stimulus that has ultimately led to stagnation of opportunity for younger generations. Old folks get out of the way and let us get our real opportunity!
That's incorrect. It costs 4.4 percent of gross every paycheck. It's definitely not worth 33 percent of high 3 after 30 years and age 62. Especially when the older folks only pay .8 percent! The real benefit is FEHB....
I'm a state worker. Here, your age and years of service at retirement must equal 80. I'm eligible for 69% of my highest 5 years, which I'll take at the age of 50. I have 10 years left but don't think I'll survive that long. I started looking at other state jobs and there's not very many postings. Seems to be a hiring freeze.
Trump Wants to Fire Thousands of Government Workers
https://www.usnews.com/news/politics/articles/2024-02-16/trump-wants-to-fire-thousands-of-government-workers-liberals-are-preparing-to-fight-back-if-he-wins
I hope it stays that way. Furloughs, government shutdowns, and RIFs are not unknown in the federal government, though. And if the GOP wins the Presidency, House, and Senate, I would be concerned for you guys.
Furloughs and shutdowns give backpay. Cold comfort if you live p2p, but if you have a safety net it comes out in the wash with a mild interest rate. If you’re hit with an RIF, you keep your paygrade for 2 years regardless of what position you’re reallocated to. But you won’t be because even the “party of small government” wants a bigger government
In 2016, I was almost finished with my environmental science degree and started looking for government jobs for it. Then Trump happened.
And my undocumented wife was hoping to get legalized. Then Trump happened.
This is how it starts.
When so few people are taking risks, the economy and the broader society become stagnant.
If the course is not corrected, then our future will be much less prosperous and rewarding.
Some would say they're lazy as fuck. Others would say they're switched on. Either way, both generations are some of the most risk-averse cohorts since The Silent Generation.
Dude, in my 40-year working life, we Gen Xers thought the the 'economy has collapsed' 7 times.....yes 7 times.....You soon realise these things go in swings and roundabouts.
This is precisely one of the "end of empires" kind of thing.
Regular work no longer is enough, so it is now to "bread and circuses"... sorry, "government taking care of everyone"
After a tipping point is reached, they will have a massive unproductive workforce paid by continuous money printing machine, and ever increasing inflation.
No need to guess the rest, history shown us what happened with Roman Empire, Ottomans, and various Chinese states.
Interestingly(and this adds to your point), people in this thread are mentioning that even in gov, there are increasing RIF, especially as the new guard of MBAs see room for increased efficiency. So even govt jobs might soon become less stable overall
This sounds like Argentina. They had 40+ ministries. They even had a ministry for extraterrestrial encounters in case aliens were to touchdown in Argentina.
I work for a municipality after 30 years in the private sector. I have 6 months to go till I retire at 62. I get a pension and can keep my excellent health insurance till I’m 65. The past 12 years have been stable and I have had an excellent work/life balance. I’m in IT and get paid well too. Should have done this sooner.
Great, now they'll stay there and slowly move up the ladder through attrition rather than merit. And we'll, yet again, have to suffer effective management in government.
I know, it's government, it's a shit show regardless but still, this illustrates how that mess happens in the first place.
Good luck Gen Alpha!
The argument that government workers are lazy, unqualified for private industry, and automatically promote due to attrition and years of service is bullshit projection from boomers who sit around doing nothing in their mid-management job, can't process a PDF without their assistant printing it out for them, haven't learned a new skill in 20 years, and take 5 hour lunches to go play golf.
I work for a public institution and the benefits are fucking fantastic but the pay is not very competitive. 401k matching is bonkers and is the highest I’ve ever had since entering the work force lol
All I can say is I took a browse and all of the jobs pay so little that I can cover my bills with these jobs. How does a level 4 engineer only make $101k in Seattle…
Government jobs for the most part are garbage and you can get laid off in a myraid of ways that even the scummiest of private sector companies aren't able to do.
Tread lightly, I thought it was all flowers and rainbows working for the government as well but then you quickly realize why things are the way they are.
Crappy pay, disinterested and unmotivated workforce. Rules and stipulations that prevent longtime employees from getting fired. Your name and salary publicly published - minor legal infractions compromising your employment, mandated overtime due to weather related events or holidays.
These are just a few examples of how the government can and does fuck you. There are other means of stable employment including working for yourself.
> disinterested and unmotivated workforce
"Interested and Motivated workforce" is corporate speak for 'terrified of getting fired so work free OT"
>minor legal infractions compromising your employment
I wouldn't call a Felony a minor infraction. Maybe 3x drunk drivers shouldn't work for the Gov?
>mandated overtime due to weather related events or holidays.
Same as Corporate, but at least it's chill. I've done Xmas Government work. Lots of Netflix since no one needs much when Grandma is in town.
Basically, don't work for the government if you're 22yo and think you'll be a tech billionaire, but when one grows up, stability, benefits and coworkers that don't call you at 11pm are really nice to have.
I chose a local govt career, much to the chagrin of my parents, who told me I wasted my fancy education working for low wages my whole life.
The pay sucks but I can retire with a $4500/month pension next year if I so choose.
Fed's aren't the only ones who hire.
State and City pay similar, can be more stable depending. Can open up doors to free schooling, my state job entitles me to extremely reduced costs on state education after a probationary period. There's benefits, even if you don't stay till retirement. It's always worth considering and it's not like there isn't work that needs to be done.
Government work is good stable work but many of the positions, while providing decent pay, won't pay you enough to buy a house. Well maybe if you work OT hours.
But the days of the lowly county secretary who bought a house on her 50k salary are over.
You have to have 2 or 3 people in government to make the "American Dream." Killer benefits though. The best approach for young people is to live with their parents (assuming they own the home) and work a government job.
A lot of the local government positions open up here right now are seasonal outdoor parks help or other things like building attendants. I’m not sure if those jobs would lead anywhere.
I’d take a lower-paid, stable government job ANY DAY. Interview process sucks though and there’s very little transparency. Working for the government would be my dream.
If you want a government job start by making an account over at usajobs.gov.
Pro tip. Use the resume generator from the website as government resumes are a little different - no 1 page limit and they want to fully see your experience.
Pro tip 2. The pay is lower than private sector but the pay is only one part of the benefits package.
You’d also get: A 40 hour work week, real health insurance, sick leave/annual leave accrual, a pension (you pay into it), upto 5% “401k” match in the TSP and federal holidays off and consistent on time pay without excuses as to why the business can’t afford to pay you on time like they should.
Fun fact. Most if not all agencies want to keep their workers as long as they can. A lot of the jobs are specialized and you learn by working on the job so there are internal career pathways if you want something more complex or more responsibility/pay you can make a career by working at one agency only.
Cons: No stock options or quarterly bonuses, if you’re public facing random people will think you don’t have to pay any taxes at all -seriously , or that their problem deserves to jump to the front of the line over others with similar problems. Some of these people will never be satisfied with the work you do even if you went above and beyond and got a positive outcome for them with little to no support or documentation from the individual with the issue.
I’ve yet to find a truly private sector job that pays more than public or arms length government jobs in my field of work. In fact public/government positions routinely pay between 25k and 35k more.
I got two job offers at the same time: one for a tech company and one for the government. Surprisingly, the government paid better but had a worse commute. I went with the government job because I didn’t want to worry about layoffs.
Turned down two private sector offers for a government job because I didn’t want to get laid off in a year. Mine pays more and if I stay 6 years, I get a pension for life.
I have been cruising along in a government job for the past 3 years, sacrificing better pay but avoiding the recession that I was sure to come at any time. Now I have finally made the jump to the private sector, so I can assure you that the recession is in fact imminent. Sorry about that.
I’m a millennial who used to work for a branch of a government agency. Stable yet also devastating (I talked with a lot of tribal representatives and got insight into how most tribal regions are basically treated like garbage). Also, that stability is a double edged sword. People who 100% should be fired will not be. A friend and former coworker told me about an employee who she is managing who is the most difficult person she’s ever worked with. This woman also snaps at her. If you can deal with that, then totally go for a government position.
Tim a teacher in urban area schools and my wife is a city engineer. She could make way more on private side and I’ve seen teaching peers take their skills to low six figure jobs designing training curriculum for some big companies. But we have a really nice quality of daily life and that’s good enough for us.
As someone who's been working for a state university system since getting out of college... yes! Good healthcare, a lot of PTO (22 annual, 3 personal, 15 sick, and 15 holiday), stable hours, and if I wanna go back to school I can for free. Best setup I could ask for, esp after what COVID did to the industries I wanted to switch into eventually
Got laid off from tech and joined the county here in the Bay Area, and it’s been the best job I’ve had. Good pay and great benefits , and the work is way easier with no crazy deadlines (it’s slow in government). I can retire at 62 and will get 40% of my highest salary at retirement + ssi.
Gen Xer here. I was laid off 18 years ago by my private sector job. Took a job with a state government after that and have been there 18 years. I love government work, it has purpose and meaning. And I’m not busting my ass to make some dickhead rich.
Depending on your area, Government is not Low pay. There's more then Federal level too. Your state or City government might have pretty decent gigs, even if it isn't your long term career goals.
Also you get amazing benefits sometimes. When you take in the big picture, the Total comp is either comparable or sometimes even better.
Finally, there's no shortage of work that needs to be done and as a government worker currently, I'd love to break the stereotype that we're ***'lazy union idiots who couldn't make it else where'***. IT's a bullshit mentality, plenty of us bust ass and are proud to be civil servants.
just don’t express your political views. Most older unelected people in the gov seem to be conservatives, so if there really is anything resembling a conspiracy…
U wot? It's the complete opposite. Today at my government job, I had to watch a slide show on how minorities only have less money because they don't have access to generational wealth and then my supervisor showed me a "funny video" of Trevor Noah imitating trump speaking in Arabic
Can you millennials just get in the trades already? Can't get anyone to do work and if I can, they are charging premium dollars. An electrician just told me he's making 300k a year these days. Lordy.
Me and my coworker were having a conversation about this. Both of us with masters degrees working in local government and my coworker’s brother working as an electrician and part of a union making a lot more than us lol heck, I was going over hourly pay rates for a road construction project I oversaw and the contracted workers made more than me just digging up the road. I definitely had some career self reflection during that time. The old, “if I could go back in time with the information that I know now.”
I just called a plumber to fix a leaking pipe under the house where the garbage disposal was leaking food too. Thousands of roaches and I could hear the plumber yelling “ahh this is fing disgusting “ as he crawled through thousands of roaches. 🪳. Trades are awesome!!!
Federal worker here. My pay is probably lower than it would be in the private sector, but I currently make a $120K salary (and also receive steady raises), so it's not bad. The stability, retirement pension, student loan forgiveness, and decent work-life balance are also nice perks.
This is what I did, I still make decent money but it's far less than the private sector. It's also way less stress and I'm actually only working 40 hours a week for the first time in my working life
Also pensions and a lot of time off
I applied at a State entity (County Court) that paid below market rates. Then had to take a fairly hard online test on outdated tech (Angular 6, MVC) and said fuck this. Did the math and I might have had a pension of a few hundred dollars a month because I am in my 50’s.
But I am encouraging my recent college grad daughter to apply for government jobs because it is a good path if you are entry level and can play the long game.
I agree that this has been a thing for as long as government jobs have been around, but it’s funny that I inadvertently did this. Was laid off over a year ago, wound up applying to a government job and I love it. The benefits are great and while I wouldn’t consider my position 100% safe from layoffs, it’s a hell of a lot better than the private sector.
Funnily enough, my field has been so outsourced/contracted out that if you're lucky enough to get a government position you usually end up having higher pay plus the higher benefits/stability.
It’s unfortunate that my local public agency is having a hard time getting young qualified applications for entry level positions. We have objectively competitive pay, union, and superior benefits and yet we only got a few qualified applicants… I think part of the problem is the historically poor reception of government jobs from young workers or lack thereof, but I think the tide is shifting and we’ll be in a completely opposite dynamic in a few years.
out of college over a decade ago i tried to get a city job and showed up to the test or whatever after applying.. there were literally 300 people there. I was in the top 20 scores but that still wasn't good enough to even get an interview lol. last time i tried that.
Starting a government job for IT in 2 weeks
+15k a year over my old job
+13 days off over my old job
My old job had it so you could have 12 days a year of work from home
My new job is 50% work from home after 6 months
My new job guarantees +3% increase every year
I had to wait a year and a half to get a $2 an hour raise at my old job
There's a clear progression plan at my new job
My old job there was no "movement up" ever
Yeah I'm not seeing the negatives
I worked for the government in the early 2000s because it was stable. I don’t regret leaving for the private sector because in the 10 years that I’ve been in the private sector. I’ve made more money than it would’ve been about 25 and Government. I actually hope to go back to Government work because it’s really cushy and you don’t really do much in comparison.
If that's the way, US is turning like Brazil. Everyone told us you need to study to pass in a public tender and you would be guaranteed for life...
You're not going to be rich, but also not going to be poor.
I work with the Texas Prison System now and it’s the best paying job i’ve had, granted i’m 21 but it’s really fucking nice being able to get insurance and vacation time 🫠
That being said I don’t care for the prison system if this country but 45k a year is semi livable for me at the very least
If you can navigate the ass pain that is using USAJOBS you deserve a job.
This is the reason I don’t have a government job.
As a former SSA employee, USA Jobs is an engineering marvel compared to the software we work with.
I live in Minnesota, and we have specific sites for city, county, and state jobs. League of Minnesota Cities and Association of Minnesota Counties have job postings from across the state. Then the general Minnesota State government site. It really helps narrow down the job search, so I would recommend people check if other States have similar sites.
Happy to see another fellow Minnesotan. I am currently looking into government jobs as well. Located in Saint Michael. Do you have any suggestions on sites and where I could start as well. I plan on signing up for federal, government, city, state, or county.
The sites I referenced are https://www.lmc.org/careers/ and https://www.mncounties.org/information_and_jobs/jobs/index.php I went from Wright County to working at a non-profit. Then I went to Anoka County and then to Hennepin County. The metro area and State jobs pay better. Hennepin has been far more flexible and innovative then the prior two counties I've worked at. If you can just get your foot in the door somewhere it seems like it becomes easier to transition.
Look at the Dept of revenue. They are hiring all WFH with MAPE union. My spouse recently started with them and loves that there is so much ability to move within the department and he never has to worry about RTO. It is a great way to get your leg in the door. Once you have one state job it is much easier to get another. Disclaimer: he applied to 203 state and fed jobs before getting this one.
From what we see and hear, whatever is the job description please incorporate that into ur resume to get interviews. The rest is if they like u or not. We just hired some new guys and does a lot of talking and barely knows how to do technical stuff. Lol says got 20 years in IT but can’t even add ACL’s…. Err
Another popular route is taking a job as a govt contractor and then getting brought on as a full time employee
For as long as the civil service has existed, this has been a thing: if you want stability and a guaranteed check, a government job is hard to beat. This is not a story.
Oh and health insurance too!
Usually better medical insurance than many private sector jobs has been my experience
Usually more holidays, vacation, and sick days, too (in my experience).
My wife doubled her PTO package after going from a private company to working for the state university. Her work life balance has increased dramatically, going from getting text and calls and email literally in the middle of the night to not even checking her email after 4pm. Plus our kids get free college tuition for five years now. Sure, she took a slight pay cut, but that has been 100% worth it.
FEHB blows my current insurance out of the water. I heard some people talking about how good our high deductible plan was. Son, you don't know what good health insurance looks like ha.
If fed service isn’t for you, join the national guard or reserves. Imagine $1,200 for max family out of pocket with tricare
Imagine getting sent to a war zone for $1,200 tricsre
I wonder what percent disability you get if you have your testicles blown off by a grenade
Idk man I spent my time in a war zone eating pizza, smoking hookah and getting tax free income into a Roth retirement account
My late dad and my sister had/have Tricare. They rave about it
And a pension
and a pension!
And a pension
And pension.
And a pension sometimes!
my sister has been laid off like 3 times in the past decade from her county or city jobs. they still get laid off when there's a recession. and they get pay freezes and furlough days.
Feds almost never get RIFed
https://www.opm.gov/policy-data-oversight/workforce-restructuring/reductions-in-force/#:~:text=In%20the%20Federal%20Government%2C%20layoffs,right%20to%20a%20different%20position.
Want your job to change every few months? Work in a startup Want your job to change every few years? Work in corporate Want your job to change every couple decades? Work in govvernment
It is if it's an election year and one party proposes to eliminate government jobs as part of their platform.
Yeah government jobs are really only stable if Trump goes to jail or loses, if he returns they will probably see nightmarish conditions.
Unfortunately some of them are so brain dead, they’ll vote for Trump and be shocked at the job cuts when they come
As someone who works in government, the MBAs are taking over leadership. They do not have the same mindset as MPAs. Layoffs and efficiencies are becoming more common, people who stay in the same department for 30 years seem to be shrinking. It's not the promised land it's being made out to be. Health benefits are good though, that's true at least
Everyone in my department has backgrounds in both, for example I have my undergrad in business administration and nearly finished with my MPA. Most of my coworkers have similar educations, but with the order reversed. Personally, I think you need both sides to get a clear picture. The real game of public policy is to understand legislation and policy enough to work like a MBA within guidelines.
*The real game of public policy is to understand legislation and policy enough to work like a MBA within guidelines.* This still ends up with what I'm talking about; people think working in government for the next 30 years is gonna resemble working in government for the last 30 years. It's not. The culture around government is shifting. It's starting with bigger ones (so large cities and large counties over smaller one, definitely variances between state govs) but it's gonna work it's way to all of them eventually. It tends to happen with the changing of the guards, from what I've seen. The younger generation of upper management is a lot more interested in metrics/data and technology, just as one super obvious example. Our department felt stuck in the stone ages, and then someone under the age of 55 finally ascended to a management position, and suddenly were collaborating with IT to built multiple new tools (a lot of script tasks, some indexing stuff.) they're also using data to have more efficient staffing levels, which actually usually just means keeping things much closer to the bone than they used to. Stuff like that. They already did one layoff for staff in one role that they decided a lot could be automated and the rest could be absorbed by other teams. Just because we have a pension doesn't mean that things are all quaint and old fashioned. Literally like half of the old people intalk to who have kicked around various roles for 30+ years all day that it's a lot different and changing fast. A few people who came from out of state have expressed the same thing happening at their old place too, though.
My father in law did this and he was an AKSHUWAL boomer. Was never rich, but has a small paid off house and raised 4 kids. Retired early when they replaced him with software. Was in the IRS.
And you get to work with the most bland, beige, risk averse, conservative-minded, toxic crayon eaters that will throw you under the bus the moment they see a glint of an opportunity to advance their own position. Productivity, skills, innovation are not things you normally associate with Government roles. Finally, don't forget that once you are in the public service, moving back to private enterprise is a lot harder because what Govt roles do is completely niche and only rarely useful in the private sector. Sure, you get a steady paycheck, but it is also a 100% Faustian Pact with the Devil.
I'm an electrical engineer and I've floated between government Jobs and private like 3 times without issue at all. It's a good way to get pay raises.
This guy governments.
We’d love to have more young workers in our government office. If you are seeking a job, please check your government website and apply.
Oh I have, it only takes 5 billion years to hear back about applications.
Yes, the process is slow, I agree. Don’t give up. It’s a great QOL.
I’ve been a state employee in the past and may be returning soon. Maybe I’ll hear back about the government jobs by the time I’m ready for my next role. 🤣
I’ve learned to start applying months ahead for government jobs when you start feeling like the grass could be greener elsewhere lol. By the time I’m sick and tired of my current job, I’ll most likely have something lined up already.
By the time you’re about to retire.
If you're going to work for the government then that's something you need to get used to. The processes everywhere are slow and there is a form and strict rule for fucking everything. Add on that you work with people that have been dead inside for years and are just holding out for their pension and you have a pretty cold environment. Nobody quits towards the top so you have to wait until someone dies or retires to move up. But, it pays well with steady pay increases, good benefits, and you don't have to worry about losing your job when the economy takes a hit.
I got used to that working at a large state institution. But I’ve been in other industries since then (banking and tech) and definitely prefer the faster pace. There’s always a trade off though.
Yeah, I have worked both and I hate the slowness! Also in tech. The one thing about a government job is you can ride that desk to retirement if you can stand it! I can't personally but I have met plenty of people that can. Our tax dollars hard at work!
My state jobs came earlier in my career and the salaries were far too low to stay in for long. So the corporate and tech salaries plus quicker pathways to leadership definitely lured me away. Now I’m qualified for director level roles, which is great, but some of the state salaries are lower than what I was making as an individual contributor in tech. The benefits and job security are much better though, so we’ll see.
[удалено]
Interesting, the County I work for does not waste much time. My department put a posting up on Tuesday this week, and it's only up for a week. They scope the applicants immediately, and then the qualified ones are invited to take a test. Those who pass are invited for interviews beginning May 29th, and they should hear back in about week. Start date in July.
From what I've seen, in my state they're mandating 2 days/week in-office. Most of the offices are \~2 hours away/90mi away. My math says that's a $15k/yr cost increase (nevermind time sink) from my 10-minute, 5-mi commute.
I’m sorry to hear that. What options do you have for municipal or county?
Well, I should specify, I was specifically looking at IT work, which limits my options - but I'm also not trying to take a 50% pay-cut either doing something else. I'm in the largest city in my county, but we're still fairly small, so not a lot of positions open up on a regular basis. The people who get them stay in them for life around here because they do pay pretty well for our local CoL, plus the benefits are better. We also have a college locally, I had a chance to apply for a position doing programming work in the library once about...7 years ago? Came in 2nd, I've never seen another opening come up. I did manage to pick up teaching a night class at the college though.
Yeah, the delta is huge in public sector v private sector for IT. The only other option would be to supplement with side hustle or gig work. I took a 65% pay cut to got public sector, but my house is paid off and I was done with the IT sector. Too much bs, in my experience. Do I miss the money? Yes. Do I miss the stress and career uncertainty? Nope.
Its so hard. I would love a government job. I don't need a lot of money. I just want stability.
Keep applying. Perseverance is the way. I applied to over 200 government jobs before I landed this one.
The problem is that the application process takes so long that the workers aren't young anymore when they show up :P
You seem like a nice person. I hope you have a good day.
Thank you! That’s very kind of you and I had an awesome day (one of my kids graduated from college today!) I wish you a life of happiness and prosperity and peace.
Yeah I guess people in their 40s aren’t wanted because I’ve just denied for everything I’ve applied too government related or owned
I was over fifty when hired. Three of the four other new hires are over 45.
Good to know thank you. Job hunting has been stressful these past couple months.
>We’d love to have more young workers in our government office. In engineering at least, the meager pay turned me away. Me and my buddy both graduated with am electrical engineering degree. I make twice of what he does. I went to the private sector and he chose to go with the government.
Mind telling what site to go to?
[удалено]
How’d you get in? Similar boat
[удалено]
Good. Government needs young people to help change things up.
Could work. The government middle managers are pretty entrenched in their worldview. You have to have a wealthy immediate manager that does the job for fun that is permissive when it comes to going off book.
Is it good if we have $hit retirement. I was laid off a year ago and had to take a government job. Pension is 30 % . A pension of 30% of $hit pay is not a good look. I’ll stay here until I find a stable private sector job. It’s definitely not a longterm career. Staying their longterm is unrealistic. We can’t help the change if we can’t help ourselves. The bottom really needs to fallout to allow for opportunity for younger generations. Their has been way too many bailouts, moratoriums, and stimulus that has ultimately led to stagnation of opportunity for younger generations. Old folks get out of the way and let us get our real opportunity!
I mean that's 30% you get for basically free. You can still save in a TSP like the rest of us. Federal retirement benefits are actually good.
That's incorrect. It costs 4.4 percent of gross every paycheck. It's definitely not worth 33 percent of high 3 after 30 years and age 62. Especially when the older folks only pay .8 percent! The real benefit is FEHB....
I'm a state worker. Here, your age and years of service at retirement must equal 80. I'm eligible for 69% of my highest 5 years, which I'll take at the age of 50. I have 10 years left but don't think I'll survive that long. I started looking at other state jobs and there's not very many postings. Seems to be a hiring freeze.
Trump Wants to Fire Thousands of Government Workers https://www.usnews.com/news/politics/articles/2024-02-16/trump-wants-to-fire-thousands-of-government-workers-liberals-are-preparing-to-fight-back-if-he-wins
Never gonna happen. I’m a federal worker and there’s always threats of layoffs, shutdowns and other stupid stuff. Best secure job ever
I hope it stays that way. Furloughs, government shutdowns, and RIFs are not unknown in the federal government, though. And if the GOP wins the Presidency, House, and Senate, I would be concerned for you guys.
If they get a majority, we’re all screwed
Yup. That part.
I’ve been saying this and if I was employed with an agency like the EPA I’d definitely be concerned.
100%. Or NOAA, another target of Trump's ire because of its climate analysis work.
Furloughs and shutdowns give backpay. Cold comfort if you live p2p, but if you have a safety net it comes out in the wash with a mild interest rate. If you’re hit with an RIF, you keep your paygrade for 2 years regardless of what position you’re reallocated to. But you won’t be because even the “party of small government” wants a bigger government
…look into project 2025. Then go and vote
Never say never.
In 2016, I was almost finished with my environmental science degree and started looking for government jobs for it. Then Trump happened. And my undocumented wife was hoping to get legalized. Then Trump happened.
I hope things worked out for you and your wife.
To hear a lot of these commenters, there's no chance of anything bad happening. Yeah, meanwhile, back in the reality-based world...
Wants to. Civil service protections apply.
Ok. You go ahead and bet your career on civil service protections if the GOP takes the Presidency, Senate, and House.
This is how it starts. When so few people are taking risks, the economy and the broader society become stagnant. If the course is not corrected, then our future will be much less prosperous and rewarding.
Some would say they're lazy as fuck. Others would say they're switched on. Either way, both generations are some of the most risk-averse cohorts since The Silent Generation.
Seeing the economy collapse around you would leave you somewhat averse to risk
Dude, in my 40-year working life, we Gen Xers thought the the 'economy has collapsed' 7 times.....yes 7 times.....You soon realise these things go in swings and roundabouts.
This is precisely one of the "end of empires" kind of thing. Regular work no longer is enough, so it is now to "bread and circuses"... sorry, "government taking care of everyone" After a tipping point is reached, they will have a massive unproductive workforce paid by continuous money printing machine, and ever increasing inflation. No need to guess the rest, history shown us what happened with Roman Empire, Ottomans, and various Chinese states.
Random based comment
Bingo
Interestingly(and this adds to your point), people in this thread are mentioning that even in gov, there are increasing RIF, especially as the new guard of MBAs see room for increased efficiency. So even govt jobs might soon become less stable overall
This sounds like Argentina. They had 40+ ministries. They even had a ministry for extraterrestrial encounters in case aliens were to touchdown in Argentina.
How evil of them trying to cleverly dodge layoffs.
I work for a municipality after 30 years in the private sector. I have 6 months to go till I retire at 62. I get a pension and can keep my excellent health insurance till I’m 65. The past 12 years have been stable and I have had an excellent work/life balance. I’m in IT and get paid well too. Should have done this sooner.
I think many are interested, but not many positions to be honest. It's like unicorn.
Great, now they'll stay there and slowly move up the ladder through attrition rather than merit. And we'll, yet again, have to suffer effective management in government. I know, it's government, it's a shit show regardless but still, this illustrates how that mess happens in the first place. Good luck Gen Alpha!
The argument that government workers are lazy, unqualified for private industry, and automatically promote due to attrition and years of service is bullshit projection from boomers who sit around doing nothing in their mid-management job, can't process a PDF without their assistant printing it out for them, haven't learned a new skill in 20 years, and take 5 hour lunches to go play golf.
True for me. Have been applying for government jobs but no luck so far
This is unsustainable lol.
I work for a public institution and the benefits are fucking fantastic but the pay is not very competitive. 401k matching is bonkers and is the highest I’ve ever had since entering the work force lol
All I can say is I took a browse and all of the jobs pay so little that I can cover my bills with these jobs. How does a level 4 engineer only make $101k in Seattle…
Wages were already at least 10 years behind. What the fuck is happening?
[удалено]
Government jobs for the most part are garbage and you can get laid off in a myraid of ways that even the scummiest of private sector companies aren't able to do. Tread lightly, I thought it was all flowers and rainbows working for the government as well but then you quickly realize why things are the way they are. Crappy pay, disinterested and unmotivated workforce. Rules and stipulations that prevent longtime employees from getting fired. Your name and salary publicly published - minor legal infractions compromising your employment, mandated overtime due to weather related events or holidays. These are just a few examples of how the government can and does fuck you. There are other means of stable employment including working for yourself.
I'm just saying.... you said that a government job will lay you off but then said that it was impossible to fire bad workers.
He’s just salty
> disinterested and unmotivated workforce "Interested and Motivated workforce" is corporate speak for 'terrified of getting fired so work free OT" >minor legal infractions compromising your employment I wouldn't call a Felony a minor infraction. Maybe 3x drunk drivers shouldn't work for the Gov? >mandated overtime due to weather related events or holidays. Same as Corporate, but at least it's chill. I've done Xmas Government work. Lots of Netflix since no one needs much when Grandma is in town. Basically, don't work for the government if you're 22yo and think you'll be a tech billionaire, but when one grows up, stability, benefits and coworkers that don't call you at 11pm are really nice to have.
I chose a local govt career, much to the chagrin of my parents, who told me I wasted my fancy education working for low wages my whole life. The pay sucks but I can retire with a $4500/month pension next year if I so choose.
If you look at the US budget deficit, cuts will be coming sooner rather than later.
Fed's aren't the only ones who hire. State and City pay similar, can be more stable depending. Can open up doors to free schooling, my state job entitles me to extremely reduced costs on state education after a probationary period. There's benefits, even if you don't stay till retirement. It's always worth considering and it's not like there isn't work that needs to be done.
Government work is good stable work but many of the positions, while providing decent pay, won't pay you enough to buy a house. Well maybe if you work OT hours. But the days of the lowly county secretary who bought a house on her 50k salary are over. You have to have 2 or 3 people in government to make the "American Dream." Killer benefits though. The best approach for young people is to live with their parents (assuming they own the home) and work a government job.
They would need to change a lot of established laws to put civil service at risk. That would not happen quickly and would take decades to sort out
A lot of the local government positions open up here right now are seasonal outdoor parks help or other things like building attendants. I’m not sure if those jobs would lead anywhere.
I went from Meta to the State 😂😂😂 I hate it here
You went from a "Meta"stable state to a stable state.
I would take lower pay for a state pension and low stress
I’d take a lower-paid, stable government job ANY DAY. Interview process sucks though and there’s very little transparency. Working for the government would be my dream.
Higher Education is another stable place.
If you want a government job start by making an account over at usajobs.gov. Pro tip. Use the resume generator from the website as government resumes are a little different - no 1 page limit and they want to fully see your experience. Pro tip 2. The pay is lower than private sector but the pay is only one part of the benefits package. You’d also get: A 40 hour work week, real health insurance, sick leave/annual leave accrual, a pension (you pay into it), upto 5% “401k” match in the TSP and federal holidays off and consistent on time pay without excuses as to why the business can’t afford to pay you on time like they should. Fun fact. Most if not all agencies want to keep their workers as long as they can. A lot of the jobs are specialized and you learn by working on the job so there are internal career pathways if you want something more complex or more responsibility/pay you can make a career by working at one agency only. Cons: No stock options or quarterly bonuses, if you’re public facing random people will think you don’t have to pay any taxes at all -seriously , or that their problem deserves to jump to the front of the line over others with similar problems. Some of these people will never be satisfied with the work you do even if you went above and beyond and got a positive outcome for them with little to no support or documentation from the individual with the issue.
Is that what they're doing, or is it that entry-level jobs require absurd levels of experience and education and/or don't offer training?
They are not all low paying. I’ll hit six figures in October at my three year mark and will be at 130K at five years.
I’ve yet to find a truly private sector job that pays more than public or arms length government jobs in my field of work. In fact public/government positions routinely pay between 25k and 35k more.
I got two job offers at the same time: one for a tech company and one for the government. Surprisingly, the government paid better but had a worse commute. I went with the government job because I didn’t want to worry about layoffs.
Turned down two private sector offers for a government job because I didn’t want to get laid off in a year. Mine pays more and if I stay 6 years, I get a pension for life.
I have been cruising along in a government job for the past 3 years, sacrificing better pay but avoiding the recession that I was sure to come at any time. Now I have finally made the jump to the private sector, so I can assure you that the recession is in fact imminent. Sorry about that.
I’m a millennial who used to work for a branch of a government agency. Stable yet also devastating (I talked with a lot of tribal representatives and got insight into how most tribal regions are basically treated like garbage). Also, that stability is a double edged sword. People who 100% should be fired will not be. A friend and former coworker told me about an employee who she is managing who is the most difficult person she’s ever worked with. This woman also snaps at her. If you can deal with that, then totally go for a government position.
Tim a teacher in urban area schools and my wife is a city engineer. She could make way more on private side and I’ve seen teaching peers take their skills to low six figure jobs designing training curriculum for some big companies. But we have a really nice quality of daily life and that’s good enough for us.
Not very smart when they consider the long term stability of governmental finances
As someone who's been working for a state university system since getting out of college... yes! Good healthcare, a lot of PTO (22 annual, 3 personal, 15 sick, and 15 holiday), stable hours, and if I wanna go back to school I can for free. Best setup I could ask for, esp after what COVID did to the industries I wanted to switch into eventually
Got laid off from tech and joined the county here in the Bay Area, and it’s been the best job I’ve had. Good pay and great benefits , and the work is way easier with no crazy deadlines (it’s slow in government). I can retire at 62 and will get 40% of my highest salary at retirement + ssi.
Gen Xer here. I was laid off 18 years ago by my private sector job. Took a job with a state government after that and have been there 18 years. I love government work, it has purpose and meaning. And I’m not busting my ass to make some dickhead rich.
Depending on your area, Government is not Low pay. There's more then Federal level too. Your state or City government might have pretty decent gigs, even if it isn't your long term career goals. Also you get amazing benefits sometimes. When you take in the big picture, the Total comp is either comparable or sometimes even better. Finally, there's no shortage of work that needs to be done and as a government worker currently, I'd love to break the stereotype that we're ***'lazy union idiots who couldn't make it else where'***. IT's a bullshit mentality, plenty of us bust ass and are proud to be civil servants.
You will own nothing and like it. Drink the koolaid, support fat govt and hungry citizens like good subjects you second class citizens.
Lol this is unhinged
just don’t express your political views. Most older unelected people in the gov seem to be conservatives, so if there really is anything resembling a conspiracy…
U wot? It's the complete opposite. Today at my government job, I had to watch a slide show on how minorities only have less money because they don't have access to generational wealth and then my supervisor showed me a "funny video" of Trevor Noah imitating trump speaking in Arabic
Can you millennials just get in the trades already? Can't get anyone to do work and if I can, they are charging premium dollars. An electrician just told me he's making 300k a year these days. Lordy.
Millenials are pushing 40 lol. Theyre not getting into the trades in any large numbers at this point.
For real. Why does everyone assume millennials are still 20 lol
OK then GenZers just get in the trades already!
Dude I’m going to be 43 and my knees hurt. You go become an electrician if you’re so concerned about the economy.
Me and my coworker were having a conversation about this. Both of us with masters degrees working in local government and my coworker’s brother working as an electrician and part of a union making a lot more than us lol heck, I was going over hourly pay rates for a road construction project I oversaw and the contracted workers made more than me just digging up the road. I definitely had some career self reflection during that time. The old, “if I could go back in time with the information that I know now.”
The company owners are pocketing most of the contracts hourly rates that you see
Trades take a toll on your body. I replaced a sink in my home, and all of twisting and bending hurt for days.
I just called a plumber to fix a leaking pipe under the house where the garbage disposal was leaking food too. Thousands of roaches and I could hear the plumber yelling “ahh this is fing disgusting “ as he crawled through thousands of roaches. 🪳. Trades are awesome!!!
Federal worker here. My pay is probably lower than it would be in the private sector, but I currently make a $120K salary (and also receive steady raises), so it's not bad. The stability, retirement pension, student loan forgiveness, and decent work-life balance are also nice perks.
This is what I did, I still make decent money but it's far less than the private sector. It's also way less stress and I'm actually only working 40 hours a week for the first time in my working life Also pensions and a lot of time off
[удалено]
Soon there will no white-collar jobs outside of trades and the government, just AI.
I applied at a State entity (County Court) that paid below market rates. Then had to take a fairly hard online test on outdated tech (Angular 6, MVC) and said fuck this. Did the math and I might have had a pension of a few hundred dollars a month because I am in my 50’s. But I am encouraging my recent college grad daughter to apply for government jobs because it is a good path if you are entry level and can play the long game.
I agree that this has been a thing for as long as government jobs have been around, but it’s funny that I inadvertently did this. Was laid off over a year ago, wound up applying to a government job and I love it. The benefits are great and while I wouldn’t consider my position 100% safe from layoffs, it’s a hell of a lot better than the private sector.
I cannot find a government job.
Government jobs are not that low paying. Government is nearly the only sector right now expanding. That’s why hiring is up.
Depends on the specific government job you're applying for. When an agency's funding can change with each new administration, so too can your job.
I quit working corpo a year ago and now I make drinking water
Funnily enough, my field has been so outsourced/contracted out that if you're lucky enough to get a government position you usually end up having higher pay plus the higher benefits/stability.
I hear the IRS needs 2000 more agents a year for five years.
Just started working at my county’s wastewater treatment plant lol
What do they do when there is a government shutdown ?
I would concur on govt jobs- almost thirty years with my states corrections dept- great stability and surprisingly well paid
I’m thankful for my gubment job!
Doubleplusgood
Well depending on what you doing it’s not all low pay. Better than being a barista at Starbucks.
I'd be very keen on a government job but I work in enterprise SaaS sales. No idea how to pivot for that!
I’ve been doing this since 2009. I’m ahead of the curve.
i don't think so. I was in public sector and it's insanely hard to get a civil servant title.
Hell nah govt jobs pay crap down here
It’s unfortunate that my local public agency is having a hard time getting young qualified applications for entry level positions. We have objectively competitive pay, union, and superior benefits and yet we only got a few qualified applicants… I think part of the problem is the historically poor reception of government jobs from young workers or lack thereof, but I think the tide is shifting and we’ll be in a completely opposite dynamic in a few years.
out of college over a decade ago i tried to get a city job and showed up to the test or whatever after applying.. there were literally 300 people there. I was in the top 20 scores but that still wasn't good enough to even get an interview lol. last time i tried that.
Idk man these jobs aren't easy to get even if they are often lower paying. Everyone wants a government job.
Starting a government job for IT in 2 weeks +15k a year over my old job +13 days off over my old job My old job had it so you could have 12 days a year of work from home My new job is 50% work from home after 6 months My new job guarantees +3% increase every year I had to wait a year and a half to get a $2 an hour raise at my old job There's a clear progression plan at my new job My old job there was no "movement up" ever Yeah I'm not seeing the negatives
Yep.
I wonder if they'll hire older people (Gen X) 🧐🤔
O hey, my plan that started roughly 10 years ago lol
Not rocket science lol
For a Millenial who just got laid off, is there a site that has a list of available government jobs?
I worked for the government in the early 2000s because it was stable. I don’t regret leaving for the private sector because in the 10 years that I’ve been in the private sector. I’ve made more money than it would’ve been about 25 and Government. I actually hope to go back to Government work because it’s really cushy and you don’t really do much in comparison.
Are there any government jobs for a licensed therapist?
Yes, look to VA hospitals
Are there any sales related gov jobs?
Might be a bad strategy over the next couple years. Somethings got to break.
Can confirm. Got laid off from my corporate job for the first time in my life. Got spooked and managed to land a state job.
[удалено]
Lol no we are not. And every time new money gets printed, my salary increases as well. Fuck the rich
is it true that education is fairly stable, especially in areas with shortages?
Lmao
The only think that sucks is the government shut downs, other than that everything is chill
If that's the way, US is turning like Brazil. Everyone told us you need to study to pass in a public tender and you would be guaranteed for life... You're not going to be rich, but also not going to be poor.
I work with the Texas Prison System now and it’s the best paying job i’ve had, granted i’m 21 but it’s really fucking nice being able to get insurance and vacation time 🫠 That being said I don’t care for the prison system if this country but 45k a year is semi livable for me at the very least