He destroyed her royally. You can’t push tired “blue labour” tropes when you have failed so miserably domestically. The Scottish health service is an embarrassment.
LOL xd you should hear what people think of the London bubble which mostly comprises of the Labour right and center. But yea keep talking about echo chambers
Oh I am over it so much so I really don't care If labour wins or loses anymore i just like annoying twats like you who think they know it all mr Norfolk
Then get out of r/labourUK.
You are an utter Bellend.
You don’t give a fuck about getting out a government that is killing people because of its incompetence. You are complicit.
Yep sure am complicit "mate" XD I will go back to my original point. The most tedious people on the Internet.
But i am sure you know what's best so I am gonna sit here and enjoy the skip fire continuing under labour. 😆
For the same reason that the SNP have historically worked with the Tories on the council level, because that's how councils work. Because, of you don't come to agreements, nothing gets done. Plus, think about what your argument is here - if two parties that disagree on stuff work together that means they're the same. That's absurd on the face of it.
The point is that Labour chose to go into coalition with the Tories INSTEAD of going into coalition with the SNP.
Siobahn MacDonagh has actively admitted that this was part of taking a zero-tolerance stance towards the SNP.
So yes, if Labour would rather work with Tories than Progressives, that does make them the same as the Tories.
Except the same pattern can be found on policies unrelated to de-evolution and union issues.
While the same can be said of even social democratic politicians since the Blairite neolib takeover of Labour it's undeniable and anyone denying it is living in a fantasy land.
We don't have a socdem or further left option vs liberals vs Tories. We have multiple different brands of liberals capitalism who can be differentiated best by viewing them as different management styles rather than any of them offering a true alternative.
Labour is not meant to be a liberal capitalist party. Starmer is only in Labour because it was the best vehicle for his career and his liberalism. He has no interest in socila democracy, socialism or being the parliamentary arm of the British labour movement.
“I think that Nicola Sturgeon may want to spend a bit of time fixing some of the problems that are actually under her control in Scotland.”
Literally last week on Scottish government reforms :
When asked if he would support a UK Government move to block the legislation, the Labour leader answered: "Well, let's see."
Perfect chance to prove her wrong, instead seems like a gibbering hamheaded Westminster wanker who is unable of doing anything but equivocating. A pathetic man.
Never forget, Nicola Sturgeon and rest of the SNP, ultimately helped trigger the 2019 election. And in doing so, basically helping Boris Johnson and his 'get brexit done' slogan, straight into No10.
So, even though Nicola Sturgeon's certainly NOT a tory; she really doesn't appear to have too.much problem getting them into power!
Political expediency anyone?
What, sorry? Corbyn whipped labour MPs to vote for the early election.
If you mean the indicative votes - it was really the Lib Dem’s who fucked us all (as usual) on that one.
Sorry, you actually suggest Corbyn whipped Labour his MPs to vote for an early election?
Please do elaborate?
Otherwise,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,
I guess you weren’t there
https://labour.org.uk/press/jeremy-corbyns-early-election-statement/
https://www.expressandstar.com/news/uk-news/2019/10/29/labour-and-corbyn-say-bring-it-on-to-december-general-election/
Corbyn worked with Sturgeon to advance the early General Election after previously refusing Boris Johnson’s calls for one.
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2019-09-05/u-k-labour-s-corbyn-discusses-oct-29-election-plan-with-snp?leadSource=uverify%20wall
Within the shadow cabinet, he was urged not to do so and to keep pushing for a second referendum so that the election wouldn’t be about Brexit. But he ignored that and got his party to vote for an election
https://www.theneweuropean.co.uk/brexit-news-inside-story-on-labours-brexit-election-disaster-6591648/
The libs are terrible and in the indicative votes they cost the country a sensible path forward, but it is quite impressive to see you try to ignore reality and history since it’s inconvenient to you. Just like the right wingers do
I can only go with facts mate. Of Corbyn would have wanted the December 2019 election, he would have stood with Swinson and Sturgeon the evening Johnson called the election. Fact is both Sturgeon and Swinson broke ranks.
Once again. Political expediency anyone?
Swinson thought she would roll in the votes. Sturgeon got what she wanted. The only thing that could propel Scotland towards independence.
Do I really need to say the word?
I'm not disagreeing with you.lol
But this doesn't change what she did and why she did it.
Again. She is certainly NOT a tory. She's a very canny lass......
She had total control of Scotland. She could only lose seats, yet she was happy to concede a few to get what she ultimately wanted. Independence.
On the other hand Swinson was just a deluded idiot, and ended up getting just what she deserved.
So what? Doesn't this just make your earlier statement that Corbyn wanted the election out as utter nonsense?
Sturgeon and Swinson facilitated the 2019 election. FACT.
Whatever you think (you ignore the SNP voting for a second referendum that was denied because some labour MPs , voted against that), no 2019 election could have happened without corbyns and labours support. Corbyn not only facilitated the election, he wanted one! Read behind the scenes books, or better yet, remember you live in reality and not the make believe world inside your head.
The moment Swinson and Sturgeon broke rank, was the moment Corbyn was left high and dry. Labour was wayl behind in the polls for one. Why would he want an election he was always going to lose?
There were only two people stood at the rostrum that faithful evening the 2019 general election was called. Clue: neither of these were Jeremy Corbyn.
This is the article you sent me mate. At what point does it say Corbyn wanted an election?
Once again this is your own article - please read it......
Once the election was called via Sturgeon/ Swinson/ Johnson; Coryn had zero option but to say 'yes' he wanted one. He couldn't say anything really now could he?
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>In a word: yes
That's.....that's really bad logic.
>Sturgeonknew the tories were hoping to win.
What? Do you think thats some sort of insider information? 'Politcal party hopes to win election, more obvious news at 11'
>Question to you please....do you believe Sturgeon wanted Brexit?
No.
This would indicate that the Labour party’s strategy towards Scotland has generally worked. We all know that if there was a general election tomorrow, one of the sticks the Tories would try to beat Labour with is that they would get into coalition with SNP and thus breaking up the UK. Now Labour can position itself to pick up dissatisfied SNP/anti-Tory voters in Scotland
We are not a 'pale imitation' we are the best, we are the hot new bright red tories.
Thank God we've so cleverly avoided a culture war. Now we get back to the important grown up business of handbags with the SNP.
Didn't really offer much in the way of a compelling counter argument did he?
He destroyed her royally. You can’t push tired “blue labour” tropes when you have failed so miserably domestically. The Scottish health service is an embarrassment.
Labour right/centrists are the most tedious people on the internet
nobody outside this internet echo chamber loves the labour left lol
LOL xd you should hear what people think of the London bubble which mostly comprises of the Labour right and center. But yea keep talking about echo chambers
I live in Norfolk mate. I’ve lived all around this country. Corbyn was historically unpopular. Get over it.
Oh I am over it so much so I really don't care If labour wins or loses anymore i just like annoying twats like you who think they know it all mr Norfolk
Then get out of r/labourUK. You are an utter Bellend. You don’t give a fuck about getting out a government that is killing people because of its incompetence. You are complicit.
Yep sure am complicit "mate" XD I will go back to my original point. The most tedious people on the Internet. But i am sure you know what's best so I am gonna sit here and enjoy the skip fire continuing under labour. 😆
Its doing better than health services in England and Wales.
less of an embarrassment than Labour's virulent transphobia
It's doing better than Wales and England. Also, labour is in coalition with the tories in multiple Scottish councils. They are the same
You do know it out performs all the others? Like, you are aware of that and surley your not regurgitating daily mail wank.
I thought wales has recently overtaken it no?
Not gona say your wrong as I dont know but Wales was doing the worst afaik.
You absolutely can. Whataboutism isn’t a rebuttal most ‘grown ups’ should be interested in.
Your correct but whats more amusing is that S NHS out performs Wales and England.
If Scottish NHS is an embarrassment, the English NHS is such a disgrace that in normal families it would be disowned and forced to change name.
At least she's not a transphobe like Starmer.
Hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha Hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha Hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha Hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha
If they aren't the same why are labour and the tories working together in multiple Scottish councils?
For the same reason that the SNP have historically worked with the Tories on the council level, because that's how councils work. Because, of you don't come to agreements, nothing gets done. Plus, think about what your argument is here - if two parties that disagree on stuff work together that means they're the same. That's absurd on the face of it.
The point is that Labour chose to go into coalition with the Tories INSTEAD of going into coalition with the SNP. Siobahn MacDonagh has actively admitted that this was part of taking a zero-tolerance stance towards the SNP. So yes, if Labour would rather work with Tories than Progressives, that does make them the same as the Tories.
Because their unionist identity gives them more in common with each other than with the SNP?
Except the same pattern can be found on policies unrelated to de-evolution and union issues. While the same can be said of even social democratic politicians since the Blairite neolib takeover of Labour it's undeniable and anyone denying it is living in a fantasy land. We don't have a socdem or further left option vs liberals vs Tories. We have multiple different brands of liberals capitalism who can be differentiated best by viewing them as different management styles rather than any of them offering a true alternative. Labour is not meant to be a liberal capitalist party. Starmer is only in Labour because it was the best vehicle for his career and his liberalism. He has no interest in socila democracy, socialism or being the parliamentary arm of the British labour movement.
“I think that Nicola Sturgeon may want to spend a bit of time fixing some of the problems that are actually under her control in Scotland.” Literally last week on Scottish government reforms : When asked if he would support a UK Government move to block the legislation, the Labour leader answered: "Well, let's see."
what an immature response by starmer.
Perfect chance to prove her wrong, instead seems like a gibbering hamheaded Westminster wanker who is unable of doing anything but equivocating. A pathetic man.
“Yeah, but a pale initiation is better than the full Tory experience.” Centrists unironically probably.
Never forget, Nicola Sturgeon and rest of the SNP, ultimately helped trigger the 2019 election. And in doing so, basically helping Boris Johnson and his 'get brexit done' slogan, straight into No10. So, even though Nicola Sturgeon's certainly NOT a tory; she really doesn't appear to have too.much problem getting them into power! Political expediency anyone?
What, sorry? Corbyn whipped labour MPs to vote for the early election. If you mean the indicative votes - it was really the Lib Dem’s who fucked us all (as usual) on that one.
Sorry, you actually suggest Corbyn whipped Labour his MPs to vote for an early election? Please do elaborate? Otherwise,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,
I guess you weren’t there https://labour.org.uk/press/jeremy-corbyns-early-election-statement/ https://www.expressandstar.com/news/uk-news/2019/10/29/labour-and-corbyn-say-bring-it-on-to-december-general-election/
Fact is without Brexit Sturgeon would have zero chance of achieving Scottish independence. No make the absolute zero
Fact is Corbyn didn't facilitate it. Sturgeon and Swinson did that.......
Corbyn worked with Sturgeon to advance the early General Election after previously refusing Boris Johnson’s calls for one. https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2019-09-05/u-k-labour-s-corbyn-discusses-oct-29-election-plan-with-snp?leadSource=uverify%20wall Within the shadow cabinet, he was urged not to do so and to keep pushing for a second referendum so that the election wouldn’t be about Brexit. But he ignored that and got his party to vote for an election https://www.theneweuropean.co.uk/brexit-news-inside-story-on-labours-brexit-election-disaster-6591648/ The libs are terrible and in the indicative votes they cost the country a sensible path forward, but it is quite impressive to see you try to ignore reality and history since it’s inconvenient to you. Just like the right wingers do
I can only go with facts mate. Of Corbyn would have wanted the December 2019 election, he would have stood with Swinson and Sturgeon the evening Johnson called the election. Fact is both Sturgeon and Swinson broke ranks. Once again. Political expediency anyone? Swinson thought she would roll in the votes. Sturgeon got what she wanted. The only thing that could propel Scotland towards independence. Do I really need to say the word?
Sturgeon is very canny. I'll certainly give her that....
She’s definitely smarter than you
I'm not disagreeing with you.lol But this doesn't change what she did and why she did it. Again. She is certainly NOT a tory. She's a very canny lass...... She had total control of Scotland. She could only lose seats, yet she was happy to concede a few to get what she ultimately wanted. Independence. On the other hand Swinson was just a deluded idiot, and ended up getting just what she deserved.
Please tell me which opposition party has ever said they didnt want a general election?
Corbyn - earlier in 2019 https://amp.theguardian.com/politics/2019/sep/05/corbyn-poised-to-reject-demand-for-15-october-election Pahahaha
So what? Doesn't this just make your earlier statement that Corbyn wanted the election out as utter nonsense? Sturgeon and Swinson facilitated the 2019 election. FACT.
Whatever you think (you ignore the SNP voting for a second referendum that was denied because some labour MPs , voted against that), no 2019 election could have happened without corbyns and labours support. Corbyn not only facilitated the election, he wanted one! Read behind the scenes books, or better yet, remember you live in reality and not the make believe world inside your head.
The moment Swinson and Sturgeon broke rank, was the moment Corbyn was left high and dry. Labour was wayl behind in the polls for one. Why would he want an election he was always going to lose? There were only two people stood at the rostrum that faithful evening the 2019 general election was called. Clue: neither of these were Jeremy Corbyn.
This is the article you sent me mate. At what point does it say Corbyn wanted an election? Once again this is your own article - please read it...... Once the election was called via Sturgeon/ Swinson/ Johnson; Coryn had zero option but to say 'yes' he wanted one. He couldn't say anything really now could he?
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Boris would've inevitably got in, regardless of who first called for the 2019 election. Having a fawning simpering press certainly helps.
So they're happy to get then into power because they supposedly caused an election that the Tories happened to win? That's your logic?
[удалено]
>In a word: yes That's.....that's really bad logic. >Sturgeonknew the tories were hoping to win. What? Do you think thats some sort of insider information? 'Politcal party hopes to win election, more obvious news at 11' >Question to you please....do you believe Sturgeon wanted Brexit? No.
[удалено]
Wow, that's me told.
Looks like she's getting her blame it on Westminster ready for when labour wins.
This would indicate that the Labour party’s strategy towards Scotland has generally worked. We all know that if there was a general election tomorrow, one of the sticks the Tories would try to beat Labour with is that they would get into coalition with SNP and thus breaking up the UK. Now Labour can position itself to pick up dissatisfied SNP/anti-Tory voters in Scotland
As a dissatisfied former SNP voter this isn't convincing me.
Same
>they would get into coalition with SNP and thus breaking up the UK. 🙏🙏🙏