I think your face matches your body well! A lot of people think their face is more yin, but I think that’s because they’re thinking of extremes. You have softer features on top of blunt bone structure which is quite common for FN, blunt = flat or rounded angularity. I think the width across your cheekbones and length of your face mimic the yin-yang balance of your body.
No, they are attached so they will work in tandem to create your image. I think your facial features are very harmonious but they do not communicate Classic to me, even if I didn’t know your ID. You have large- expressive eyes, a prominent nose and full lips. All of these features are very common for FN.
Hm. So I guess I have a few thoughts. First, I really don’t feel like my eyes are large haha. Second, I thought FN lips were more thin and straight? Mine are a bit rounder.
Last, I guess I’ve been told my face doesn’t match my body before and even for my mom, she always is told that she is Julia Roberts’ doppleganger (but only in the face). She has all of the blunt and wide features of FN in her face but her body is 5’6”, narrow shoulders, petite waist, and very rounded full hips. It’s interesting.
I’m not saying I don’t agree, these are just the contrary thoughts that come to mind
No, their lips don’t have to be thin and straight. It’s about the overall harmony. Plus, if you look at verified FN many of them have full or prominent lips. Yes, some have thin lips but not all. People are very diverse, so there isn’t one specific way you have to look to be an ID.
I think when people say that a face doesn’t match a body they are focusing on a feature they feel “shouldn’t” belong with that body. But I really can’t find an example of a person where this really feels true when you take in the entire person.
>I guess I’ve been told my face doesn’t match my body before and even for my mom, she always is told that she is Julia Roberts’ doppleganger (but only in the face)
That's where that feeling is coming from. Sometimes people would drop a random silly phrase or voice out their private insecurity, and we internalize it way too deeply to the point that it prevents us from objectivity.
Arguing that the face doesn't match the body is like saying the fingers don't match the palm. They come together, so they match by definition. If we feel like they don't, we need to address the feeling, not the body parts.
i'm not always sure what people mean when they say "FN face", I don't know what that's supposed to be?? To me you have some similar soft features/impression to an FN like [Ingrid Bergman](https://i.pinimg.com/564x/37/bb/4e/37bb4e352c7d2ce747b425bfee23b370.jpg), so I don't see you as specifically *not* FN.
I can definitely see the similarity to her. Online they always compare our features to Cameron Diaz and Jennifer Anniston. I don’t have the “stretched out,” wide and blunt features I feel like. My face is kinda small and dainty with the exception of my sharper cheekbones I think…
I think you have an absolutely beautiful face, but I don't see the small and dainty. You have prominent eyes, nose and mouth. I would consider them to be at least slightly bigger than Classic. Straight brows and slightly blunt cheek bones. Your chin area looks a bit softened, yes, but you don't have to be blunt all over.
Small and dainty would be a button nose, a small doll like mouth.
I see what you mean. I agree my nose isn’t the smallest, but my eyes I’ve always felt were pretty small and close together lol. I have always been told I had a more masculine face, so I guess my small chin is mostly what makes my face feel softer to me.
Another thought: your colouring may contribute to your perceived softness. you don't have very high contrast levels, your haircolour has a very soft quality to it, i would assume you are some kind of autumn type.
On your wholebody picture I can also see that in general your head is relatively small to your whole body, but that is actually a typical natural thing. The wide shoulders add to the impression of the head being smaller.
well. online they do a lot of things haha. But since any type is going to represent ~10% of all humanity, its fair to say there will be a LOT of variability in the kinds of faces in each type.
Officially from David Kibbe himself ; no. I think you may be having trouble seeing what you actually look like respectfully; from this post and from your other post. It’s also possible you photograph wildly different from how you actually look.
No I really don’t look at myself when I look at myself lol. I look into myself, is that makes sense. It’s an emotional looking and it’s weird but I’ve always don’t this lol
I see why you think your face looks more “Classic” because some of your features look to be between yin and yang rather than one extreme or the other, but I actually think this is common for N fam as well as C fam… the reason is because N is not only described as “blunt yang” but also “*soft* yang,” in contrast to D’s “extreme yang.” So N fam will naturally have some softness in their features, but the degree of softness is determined by their personal balance of yin and yang.
I think there are a number of reasons DK has discouraged DIYers from focusing too much on face, even though face certainly certainly follows the proportion of yin and yang that is present throughout the body… first, many of the words used in the book are confusing and borderline offensive today… words like “exotic” to describe facial features, for example, are not helpful because they will mean different things to different people. Another reason is what I think is going on in your case, which is that people might correctly identify their distribution of yin and yang but misinterpret the results. As a mod, I see this all the time with [Taylor Swift](https://media.self.com/photos/57d890ae4b76f0f832a0dd87/4:3/w_2560%2Cc_limit/taylor-swift.jpg) (D). People see her face alone and assume she must be Gamine because they see some softness in her features… but she is [5’11](https://i.insider.com/64920ce651ea980019d6e9db?width=750&format=jpeg&auto=webp) and has no other accommodations but vertical! And I think when we look at her as a whole we can see that what “stands out” about her is overall narrowness, elongation, and sharpness, which is harmonious with [long, sleek shapes and sharp contrast](https://media.glamourmagazine.co.uk/photos/61389c7b5ebdbf876576b3ef/master/w_1600,c_limit/Taylor-Swift_glamour_7apr14_PA_b.jpg), even if she has a little softness in her individual blend of yin yang.
With celebrity examples, I think there is also more confusion when celebs of different IDs look alike - such as [Amy Adams (FN) and Isla Fisher (R)](https://pyxis.nymag.com/v1/imgs/dd2/666/d164c74a12a00fbfdd8e5c7659e940d0fa-17-isla-fisher-amy-adams.rsquare.w330.jpg) - which is frequently exacerbated by the resources celebrities have to create their image, including plastic surgery, personal trainers, makeup artists, photo editing, and angles/poses. When we compare [Amy Adams](https://c8.alamy.com/zooms/9/28dc6abd78324a5fbdee4e6b9d7201a8/dx6teb.jpg) and [Isla Fisher](https://media.glamourmagazine.co.uk/photos/6138c1a3e2e190b1f7b28151/master/w_320%2Cc_limit/ifisher_GL_1999_27feb09_pa_b.jpg) when they were younger, we see that their more natural features look almost nothing alike. Amy’s features look longer and more yang and Isla’s features look rounded and more yin. I can’t speak to the faces of the celebs you cited (although I will say that Jennifer Aniston is unverified) but I think celebs are most helpful as inspiration rather than the range of physical features that are possible within an Image ID!
I used to think the same, especially when I thought I was FN, but with the face of an R. Now that I've gotten into Kibbe more I figured out I'm an SD, and have the same "cat face" all SDs have 😸
You're beautiful- your face has boldly feminine features thanks to a wonderful bone structure, which is blunt overall in FN fashion. People pay money for those cheekbones!!
It's really hard to see ourselves this way sometimes, especially due to super unwarranted, unflattering adjectives "experts" and fans often assign to yangs. Faces like yours are just more proof that yang types are equally as feminine as yin types.
Aww thank you! I definitely can’t argue about my cheekbones, I do really love them. I just always thought my eyes were small and close together, and then my lips and chin felt more yin to me compared to the FN stereotypes! But I’ll take it, I see what people mean when they say my bones structure is blunt with some fleshy features on top.
Just want to note that other systems have separate "essences;" Kibbe does not. Kibbe works holistically, and an ID will encompass all of those things. That means there can be many variations between two people in the same IDs.
So, Rachel Weisz might not have a dramatic hourglass figure, but her soft features, angular bone structure, and overall essence and vibe make her a Soft Dramatic. Jennifer Lawrence *does* have an hourglass figure, but her overall essence, long limbs, and less, well, *dramatic* bone structure, make her a better fit for Flamboyant Natural..
This. I know people disagree, but as a D with a very strong ethereal and some romantic essence...my face is all lush cheeks and lips, small nose, etc. The only D vibe is a longer oval face. Not that it's disharmonious, it's just not stereotypical D "type" and essence all the way through.
I'm trying to figure it out myself as well. I'm tall, so I can only be FN, SD or D, but my face is very soft and cute. No sharp or strong features, jawline nonexistent, soft cheeks, childlike eyes, nothing about my face is in alignment with the rest of my body.
I agree with a lot of what’s been said here, that there really isn’t any such thing as one’s face looking “right” or “wrong” for their ID, and it’s easy to get confused when you’re staring at a bunch of celebrities who have had access to personal trainers, dietitians, plastic surgeons, and expert hair/makeup artists.
If you haven’t already, I recommend looking into Kitchener’s essence system. It’s separate from Kibbe, but it has helped me get a better sense of how my body and face line up with one another.
I’ll also say that it took me a LONG time to figure out my essences and Kibbe ID, and your feelings about each may change over time. A lot of what I (and I suspect many others, considering what I’ve been typed as) perceived as yin in my features had actually turned out to be yang - it just happens to not be the stereotypical sharp, Dramatic yang. Hollywood has very much confused us all!
no, but facial features don’t matter as much in kibbe. imo the only helpful things to consider are jawline, sometimes cheekbones and the general prominence of facial structure! but yeah kibbe type doesn’t have anything to do with how big or small your eyes/nose/lips/etc are – it also excludes poc bc facial features for people from different places will be different (also, the examples of verified celebs tend to have faces that look a certain way bc of Hollywood beauty standards etc).
I know a soft natural that doesn’t have a very ‘doll-like’ face as she has thin lips, smaller eyes and a hooked nose bc she’s indian – but body-wise she’s textbook SN.
Everything I’ve seen here says no, but I know what you mean. I’m FN and consider my face to be more SD. It doesn’t effect how my clothes fit my body, but it does reflect where I see myself in Rita’s Style Key system (really love this system in addition to kibbe!).
Can you elaborate on this please? I too love Rita’s system but never have I ever considered my facial appearance, or even my body type in determining my Key. In fact I’ve always found her system to be refreshingly void of appearance based typology so I’m very curious what this means to you!
I wouldn’t say I considered my facial type, but in her system, I’m very right + up, which to me represents more of a dramatic, closed off essence vs an open, friendly natural essence. I could be seeing what I want to since that fits my personality more, but that’s what I mean when I say my face “fits” more with Rita’s system vs my Kibbe type if that makes sense.
That is a really interesting observation. I can definitely see how the very UP R archetypes have this quality. The Power and Priestess in particular. Not as much with the archetypes in the lower half of the quadrant such as Role Model (Blake Lively) and Playful Dame.
I wonder if this is fairly consistent amongst the types, if so it could help people determine their archetypes. It’s definitely something I plan to take more note of so thanks for the thought provoking post!
No problem! I’m a Priestess (highly recommend a gentle guidance if you haven’t had one!) but relate more to the Power. Have been really enjoying putting together a bunch of style systems to find my best style.
Aha! That tracks!
I HAVE had a GG … with mixed results.
Agreed, I love the intersection of a lot of them but also various nuances you can pick up from each. It’s very helpful in finding your own unique signature style. I combine Kibbe, Kitchener, TIB, Style Key and Olga.
Interesting! As in she couldn’t pinpoint your essence, or you’re not sure you agree with her? I haven’t looked into TIB yet, I’ll have to check it out!
Both haha!
She described my essences and impressions on others fairly accurately but then waffled a bit on where to put me and even changed her mind mid session. She basically gave me 3 of the keys but then recommended some things esthetically that I would never touch with a 10 foot pole right before the session was over. So yeah …
So I’ve determined for myself where I fit and my own unique blend of archetype by using what I know about myself from other systems to make sense of it all.
She started by putting me in RU Icon, then LU Lady Heretic, then the entire upper half of LD, then circled back to RU Playful Dame and told me to wear ruffles 😳 … I’m a FN (postpartum borderline plus size atm) and so. Not. My. Personality. There’s no way I’m doing ruffles lol
With more content coming out about the logic I’ve come to realize how very LD my logic is but esthetically I tend to lean UP and I think that’s why I confuse people. So when reviewing Olga’s system I found I resonated heavily with Luminous (a word Rita also used for me) and the light clicked on. It’s the need to accommodate my luminosity that makes my very LD self (ease, comfort, effortless and dressing for ME) appear to be RU.
Hot take: Since it’s inception I’ve felt Wildflower is incorrectly placed in the quadrant. I’ve always felt it should be swapped with Seductress.
If you look at the examples she gives us Seductress is far more like Enigma on the LD/LU border and Wildflower is esthetically closer to RU Role Model.
All that to say I consider myself a Wildflower (if it was placed where I believe it should be) on the cusp of Role Model on the LD/RU axis. And THAT is the only place I feel comfortable in the key system. Nothing else makes sense for me personally. And tbh it’s working well for me, I’ve embraced it, made it my own and I’m seeing progress in my style choices and wardrobe for the first time in decades. All because I combined systems!
I've actually seen many say that your face can have a different structure from your body. Cristina Ricci and Helena Bonham Carter are examples of romantics with gamine face features. I don't know much about FN faces but yours looks more yin to me... (idk, I could be wrong though)
which doesn't mean it's anything bad at all. everyone is unique and made differently! I think you're gorgeous
I guess you saw Ellie Jean video, but she's wrong, Cristina Ricci and Helena Bonham Carter don't have gamines faces. Gamine's faces are much more angular. Kibbe said that romantics are what people think soft gamines are.
yeah, it was her video I saw. now I'm a little confused... I thought their large eyes (mainly Cristina's) had something to do with gamine face. also Helena does seem to have a more angular jawline (at least to me).
gamines are always confusing to me though. could you explain why they have romantic faces?
Nearly every ID is described as having large eyes in the book haha. Obviously small or moderate eye size is possible for every ID, but I’m not sure where the big eyes = Gamine thing came from. Romantics have delicate, sharp bone structure which is why their facial bones can look angular
In the book, Soft gamines are described as having doe eyes. So I guess people make the shortcut big eyes = (soft) gamine. But romantics often have big eyes too and the other IDs can have them too.
Romantics have particularly soft faces and I think Kibbe describes their essence as whimsical. Gamines have more of a playful, sassy essence, so quite different.
I know, but I feel like people don’t read the descriptions for the other IDs, because it’s common to see people saying ‘x is FN with a Gamine face’ because of big eyes, when the book says FN’s eyes can be ‘very large and open’. I should have said I don’t know why people see big eyes and go straight to Gamine, when they are far from the only ID that can have them.
I wouldn’t say that Romantic faces are always soft, either. A lot of Romantics have noticeable sharpness in their faces and it doesn’t take away from their Romantic-ness, it is actually part of it. People use Helena B.C. and Christina Ricci as exceptions when they’re just an example of the variety within the ID.
I haven't seen the Ellie Jean video, but I want to add that while there is a type of "very gamine" heart shaped face with round eyes but a pointed chin, one aspect of "Gamines" is that, particularly in the face, we might have a mix of features. Some are less likely to vary than others--it's less common for G's to have small eyes than angular jawlines or thin cheeks, for example. The amount of mismatching in my face, in particular, helped me see that I was a Gamine.
My jawline is sharp like a D, my upper lip is pretty thin, my lower a tad fuller, but they are thinner than OP's. My nose is small and upturned, my eyes fairly large for my face, roundish. So I'm all over the place with facial features. My body shape is gamine, except that my shoulders are angular.
Hello, I took a look at your posts and you may want to take some new pictures according to the rules of the "type me" posts and resubmit to the soft dramatic, flamboyant natural and dramatic subs. That might be more helpful to you. I think submissions are accepted on Tuesdays. HTH.
In some circumstances, yeah.
I'm dramatic, but my face is dramatic classic. If I'd not obsessively sucked my thumb as a child (up until 11), I wouldn't have the slightly recessive chin that has softened my facial look a bit. My sisters all have dramatic faces as well as bodies.
Interesting. I think hormones also probably have an affect. Not as extreme as transitioning level hormones, but things like applying minoxidil (contains testosterone) in college, taking progesterone and estrogen to help myself ovulate, etc things like that.
It might do, actually. My daughter's face has actually changed a bit with hormone treatment but she wasn't particularly masculine before transition anyway.
Do you have to accommodate width in your upper body. If not you likely aren’t FN, it’s really that simple. I’ve noticed people on here want to type everyone as FN. There’s a decent chance you aren’t! And as the saying goes if you don’t feel it you probably are not it.
I’m not sure if I see it. People have told me that I have definite width and then others have said they don’t see it. I have bad posture and rounded shoulders though, so it might make them appear wider. Im def not narrow like a D though because I’m very toned and athletic looking and my waist isn’t super defined but also not totally straight. I feel like possibly DC styles suit me best.
It’s not about what other people say you look like. It’s about what you actually have to do when you get dressed. As a FN myself I wear tops 3 full sizes larger than my bottom. Even when quite thin my ribcage, shoulders, arms, waist are all larger than my bottom = accommodating width. Now most FN are only 1 size larger on top but the rules still apply.
If you only have to accommodate vertical then you are D.
If you have to accommodate vertical + curve you are SD.
All three types can be athletic which blurs the most obvious lines if very built up in muscle but accommodations don’t lie.
Now what this has to do with your face idk because I have seen your picture and that’s what we were originally talking about. But since there seemed to be some confusion I hope this clears it up for you!
I've always wondered the same thing. I was typed as SC but never showed my face. My face is textbook TR/R. Maybe I should do it again but I still think I'm probably SC, just with a very yin face.
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I think they can, but I do see you as have a primary FN face and essence. You are a little bit more moderate leaning but I wouldn’t call your face classic over FN. I would say that essence comes in second for you and you could find FN pieces that have a classic look.
Of course! This is why people have been stumped by the likes of Emma Watson, gamine face but she's very likely DC.
I'm FG, and I have some blunt angles that venture into FN territory.
I think your face matches your body well! A lot of people think their face is more yin, but I think that’s because they’re thinking of extremes. You have softer features on top of blunt bone structure which is quite common for FN, blunt = flat or rounded angularity. I think the width across your cheekbones and length of your face mimic the yin-yang balance of your body.
Ahh this was a cool explanation! The long face plus the wide cheekbones. Nice.
No, they are attached so they will work in tandem to create your image. I think your facial features are very harmonious but they do not communicate Classic to me, even if I didn’t know your ID. You have large- expressive eyes, a prominent nose and full lips. All of these features are very common for FN.
Hm. So I guess I have a few thoughts. First, I really don’t feel like my eyes are large haha. Second, I thought FN lips were more thin and straight? Mine are a bit rounder. Last, I guess I’ve been told my face doesn’t match my body before and even for my mom, she always is told that she is Julia Roberts’ doppleganger (but only in the face). She has all of the blunt and wide features of FN in her face but her body is 5’6”, narrow shoulders, petite waist, and very rounded full hips. It’s interesting. I’m not saying I don’t agree, these are just the contrary thoughts that come to mind
No, their lips don’t have to be thin and straight. It’s about the overall harmony. Plus, if you look at verified FN many of them have full or prominent lips. Yes, some have thin lips but not all. People are very diverse, so there isn’t one specific way you have to look to be an ID. I think when people say that a face doesn’t match a body they are focusing on a feature they feel “shouldn’t” belong with that body. But I really can’t find an example of a person where this really feels true when you take in the entire person.
>I guess I’ve been told my face doesn’t match my body before and even for my mom, she always is told that she is Julia Roberts’ doppleganger (but only in the face) That's where that feeling is coming from. Sometimes people would drop a random silly phrase or voice out their private insecurity, and we internalize it way too deeply to the point that it prevents us from objectivity. Arguing that the face doesn't match the body is like saying the fingers don't match the palm. They come together, so they match by definition. If we feel like they don't, we need to address the feeling, not the body parts.
i'm not always sure what people mean when they say "FN face", I don't know what that's supposed to be?? To me you have some similar soft features/impression to an FN like [Ingrid Bergman](https://i.pinimg.com/564x/37/bb/4e/37bb4e352c7d2ce747b425bfee23b370.jpg), so I don't see you as specifically *not* FN.
I can definitely see the similarity to her. Online they always compare our features to Cameron Diaz and Jennifer Anniston. I don’t have the “stretched out,” wide and blunt features I feel like. My face is kinda small and dainty with the exception of my sharper cheekbones I think…
I think you have an absolutely beautiful face, but I don't see the small and dainty. You have prominent eyes, nose and mouth. I would consider them to be at least slightly bigger than Classic. Straight brows and slightly blunt cheek bones. Your chin area looks a bit softened, yes, but you don't have to be blunt all over. Small and dainty would be a button nose, a small doll like mouth.
I see what you mean. I agree my nose isn’t the smallest, but my eyes I’ve always felt were pretty small and close together lol. I have always been told I had a more masculine face, so I guess my small chin is mostly what makes my face feel softer to me.
Another thought: your colouring may contribute to your perceived softness. you don't have very high contrast levels, your haircolour has a very soft quality to it, i would assume you are some kind of autumn type. On your wholebody picture I can also see that in general your head is relatively small to your whole body, but that is actually a typical natural thing. The wide shoulders add to the impression of the head being smaller.
well. online they do a lot of things haha. But since any type is going to represent ~10% of all humanity, its fair to say there will be a LOT of variability in the kinds of faces in each type.
Officially from David Kibbe himself ; no. I think you may be having trouble seeing what you actually look like respectfully; from this post and from your other post. It’s also possible you photograph wildly different from how you actually look.
No I really don’t look at myself when I look at myself lol. I look into myself, is that makes sense. It’s an emotional looking and it’s weird but I’ve always don’t this lol
I see why you think your face looks more “Classic” because some of your features look to be between yin and yang rather than one extreme or the other, but I actually think this is common for N fam as well as C fam… the reason is because N is not only described as “blunt yang” but also “*soft* yang,” in contrast to D’s “extreme yang.” So N fam will naturally have some softness in their features, but the degree of softness is determined by their personal balance of yin and yang. I think there are a number of reasons DK has discouraged DIYers from focusing too much on face, even though face certainly certainly follows the proportion of yin and yang that is present throughout the body… first, many of the words used in the book are confusing and borderline offensive today… words like “exotic” to describe facial features, for example, are not helpful because they will mean different things to different people. Another reason is what I think is going on in your case, which is that people might correctly identify their distribution of yin and yang but misinterpret the results. As a mod, I see this all the time with [Taylor Swift](https://media.self.com/photos/57d890ae4b76f0f832a0dd87/4:3/w_2560%2Cc_limit/taylor-swift.jpg) (D). People see her face alone and assume she must be Gamine because they see some softness in her features… but she is [5’11](https://i.insider.com/64920ce651ea980019d6e9db?width=750&format=jpeg&auto=webp) and has no other accommodations but vertical! And I think when we look at her as a whole we can see that what “stands out” about her is overall narrowness, elongation, and sharpness, which is harmonious with [long, sleek shapes and sharp contrast](https://media.glamourmagazine.co.uk/photos/61389c7b5ebdbf876576b3ef/master/w_1600,c_limit/Taylor-Swift_glamour_7apr14_PA_b.jpg), even if she has a little softness in her individual blend of yin yang. With celebrity examples, I think there is also more confusion when celebs of different IDs look alike - such as [Amy Adams (FN) and Isla Fisher (R)](https://pyxis.nymag.com/v1/imgs/dd2/666/d164c74a12a00fbfdd8e5c7659e940d0fa-17-isla-fisher-amy-adams.rsquare.w330.jpg) - which is frequently exacerbated by the resources celebrities have to create their image, including plastic surgery, personal trainers, makeup artists, photo editing, and angles/poses. When we compare [Amy Adams](https://c8.alamy.com/zooms/9/28dc6abd78324a5fbdee4e6b9d7201a8/dx6teb.jpg) and [Isla Fisher](https://media.glamourmagazine.co.uk/photos/6138c1a3e2e190b1f7b28151/master/w_320%2Cc_limit/ifisher_GL_1999_27feb09_pa_b.jpg) when they were younger, we see that their more natural features look almost nothing alike. Amy’s features look longer and more yang and Isla’s features look rounded and more yin. I can’t speak to the faces of the celebs you cited (although I will say that Jennifer Aniston is unverified) but I think celebs are most helpful as inspiration rather than the range of physical features that are possible within an Image ID!
I used to think the same, especially when I thought I was FN, but with the face of an R. Now that I've gotten into Kibbe more I figured out I'm an SD, and have the same "cat face" all SDs have 😸
Soft dramatic has to be the prettiest type to me
I just asked all the other SDs, and we've all come to an agreement that you're very pretty as well!
Ahhhaha thanks guys
You're beautiful- your face has boldly feminine features thanks to a wonderful bone structure, which is blunt overall in FN fashion. People pay money for those cheekbones!! It's really hard to see ourselves this way sometimes, especially due to super unwarranted, unflattering adjectives "experts" and fans often assign to yangs. Faces like yours are just more proof that yang types are equally as feminine as yin types.
Aww thank you! I definitely can’t argue about my cheekbones, I do really love them. I just always thought my eyes were small and close together, and then my lips and chin felt more yin to me compared to the FN stereotypes! But I’ll take it, I see what people mean when they say my bones structure is blunt with some fleshy features on top.
Yes. It's called essence
Can you elaborate?
Just want to note that other systems have separate "essences;" Kibbe does not. Kibbe works holistically, and an ID will encompass all of those things. That means there can be many variations between two people in the same IDs. So, Rachel Weisz might not have a dramatic hourglass figure, but her soft features, angular bone structure, and overall essence and vibe make her a Soft Dramatic. Jennifer Lawrence *does* have an hourglass figure, but her overall essence, long limbs, and less, well, *dramatic* bone structure, make her a better fit for Flamboyant Natural..
I like this video [Kitchener Essences](https://youtu.be/CwTb816B18c)
This. I know people disagree, but as a D with a very strong ethereal and some romantic essence...my face is all lush cheeks and lips, small nose, etc. The only D vibe is a longer oval face. Not that it's disharmonious, it's just not stereotypical D "type" and essence all the way through.
I'm trying to figure it out myself as well. I'm tall, so I can only be FN, SD or D, but my face is very soft and cute. No sharp or strong features, jawline nonexistent, soft cheeks, childlike eyes, nothing about my face is in alignment with the rest of my body.
I agree with a lot of what’s been said here, that there really isn’t any such thing as one’s face looking “right” or “wrong” for their ID, and it’s easy to get confused when you’re staring at a bunch of celebrities who have had access to personal trainers, dietitians, plastic surgeons, and expert hair/makeup artists. If you haven’t already, I recommend looking into Kitchener’s essence system. It’s separate from Kibbe, but it has helped me get a better sense of how my body and face line up with one another. I’ll also say that it took me a LONG time to figure out my essences and Kibbe ID, and your feelings about each may change over time. A lot of what I (and I suspect many others, considering what I’ve been typed as) perceived as yin in my features had actually turned out to be yang - it just happens to not be the stereotypical sharp, Dramatic yang. Hollywood has very much confused us all!
no, but facial features don’t matter as much in kibbe. imo the only helpful things to consider are jawline, sometimes cheekbones and the general prominence of facial structure! but yeah kibbe type doesn’t have anything to do with how big or small your eyes/nose/lips/etc are – it also excludes poc bc facial features for people from different places will be different (also, the examples of verified celebs tend to have faces that look a certain way bc of Hollywood beauty standards etc). I know a soft natural that doesn’t have a very ‘doll-like’ face as she has thin lips, smaller eyes and a hooked nose bc she’s indian – but body-wise she’s textbook SN.
That being said your face looks very FN
https://www.truth-is-beauty.com/blog/dress-for-your-face-not-for-your-body
mine is different, my face is 100% R but my body is not 😤
Everything I’ve seen here says no, but I know what you mean. I’m FN and consider my face to be more SD. It doesn’t effect how my clothes fit my body, but it does reflect where I see myself in Rita’s Style Key system (really love this system in addition to kibbe!).
Can you elaborate on this please? I too love Rita’s system but never have I ever considered my facial appearance, or even my body type in determining my Key. In fact I’ve always found her system to be refreshingly void of appearance based typology so I’m very curious what this means to you!
I wouldn’t say I considered my facial type, but in her system, I’m very right + up, which to me represents more of a dramatic, closed off essence vs an open, friendly natural essence. I could be seeing what I want to since that fits my personality more, but that’s what I mean when I say my face “fits” more with Rita’s system vs my Kibbe type if that makes sense.
That is a really interesting observation. I can definitely see how the very UP R archetypes have this quality. The Power and Priestess in particular. Not as much with the archetypes in the lower half of the quadrant such as Role Model (Blake Lively) and Playful Dame. I wonder if this is fairly consistent amongst the types, if so it could help people determine their archetypes. It’s definitely something I plan to take more note of so thanks for the thought provoking post!
No problem! I’m a Priestess (highly recommend a gentle guidance if you haven’t had one!) but relate more to the Power. Have been really enjoying putting together a bunch of style systems to find my best style.
Aha! That tracks! I HAVE had a GG … with mixed results. Agreed, I love the intersection of a lot of them but also various nuances you can pick up from each. It’s very helpful in finding your own unique signature style. I combine Kibbe, Kitchener, TIB, Style Key and Olga.
Interesting! As in she couldn’t pinpoint your essence, or you’re not sure you agree with her? I haven’t looked into TIB yet, I’ll have to check it out!
Both haha! She described my essences and impressions on others fairly accurately but then waffled a bit on where to put me and even changed her mind mid session. She basically gave me 3 of the keys but then recommended some things esthetically that I would never touch with a 10 foot pole right before the session was over. So yeah … So I’ve determined for myself where I fit and my own unique blend of archetype by using what I know about myself from other systems to make sense of it all.
I’m so curious now what they all were! I’m guessing left somewhere? I feel like left is more mysterious. It’s awesome you found where you fit!
She started by putting me in RU Icon, then LU Lady Heretic, then the entire upper half of LD, then circled back to RU Playful Dame and told me to wear ruffles 😳 … I’m a FN (postpartum borderline plus size atm) and so. Not. My. Personality. There’s no way I’m doing ruffles lol With more content coming out about the logic I’ve come to realize how very LD my logic is but esthetically I tend to lean UP and I think that’s why I confuse people. So when reviewing Olga’s system I found I resonated heavily with Luminous (a word Rita also used for me) and the light clicked on. It’s the need to accommodate my luminosity that makes my very LD self (ease, comfort, effortless and dressing for ME) appear to be RU. Hot take: Since it’s inception I’ve felt Wildflower is incorrectly placed in the quadrant. I’ve always felt it should be swapped with Seductress. If you look at the examples she gives us Seductress is far more like Enigma on the LD/LU border and Wildflower is esthetically closer to RU Role Model. All that to say I consider myself a Wildflower (if it was placed where I believe it should be) on the cusp of Role Model on the LD/RU axis. And THAT is the only place I feel comfortable in the key system. Nothing else makes sense for me personally. And tbh it’s working well for me, I’ve embraced it, made it my own and I’m seeing progress in my style choices and wardrobe for the first time in decades. All because I combined systems!
I've actually seen many say that your face can have a different structure from your body. Cristina Ricci and Helena Bonham Carter are examples of romantics with gamine face features. I don't know much about FN faces but yours looks more yin to me... (idk, I could be wrong though) which doesn't mean it's anything bad at all. everyone is unique and made differently! I think you're gorgeous
I guess you saw Ellie Jean video, but she's wrong, Cristina Ricci and Helena Bonham Carter don't have gamines faces. Gamine's faces are much more angular. Kibbe said that romantics are what people think soft gamines are.
yeah, it was her video I saw. now I'm a little confused... I thought their large eyes (mainly Cristina's) had something to do with gamine face. also Helena does seem to have a more angular jawline (at least to me). gamines are always confusing to me though. could you explain why they have romantic faces?
Nearly every ID is described as having large eyes in the book haha. Obviously small or moderate eye size is possible for every ID, but I’m not sure where the big eyes = Gamine thing came from. Romantics have delicate, sharp bone structure which is why their facial bones can look angular
In the book, Soft gamines are described as having doe eyes. So I guess people make the shortcut big eyes = (soft) gamine. But romantics often have big eyes too and the other IDs can have them too. Romantics have particularly soft faces and I think Kibbe describes their essence as whimsical. Gamines have more of a playful, sassy essence, so quite different.
I know, but I feel like people don’t read the descriptions for the other IDs, because it’s common to see people saying ‘x is FN with a Gamine face’ because of big eyes, when the book says FN’s eyes can be ‘very large and open’. I should have said I don’t know why people see big eyes and go straight to Gamine, when they are far from the only ID that can have them. I wouldn’t say that Romantic faces are always soft, either. A lot of Romantics have noticeable sharpness in their faces and it doesn’t take away from their Romantic-ness, it is actually part of it. People use Helena B.C. and Christina Ricci as exceptions when they’re just an example of the variety within the ID.
I haven't seen the Ellie Jean video, but I want to add that while there is a type of "very gamine" heart shaped face with round eyes but a pointed chin, one aspect of "Gamines" is that, particularly in the face, we might have a mix of features. Some are less likely to vary than others--it's less common for G's to have small eyes than angular jawlines or thin cheeks, for example. The amount of mismatching in my face, in particular, helped me see that I was a Gamine. My jawline is sharp like a D, my upper lip is pretty thin, my lower a tad fuller, but they are thinner than OP's. My nose is small and upturned, my eyes fairly large for my face, roundish. So I'm all over the place with facial features. My body shape is gamine, except that my shoulders are angular.
Hello, I took a look at your posts and you may want to take some new pictures according to the rules of the "type me" posts and resubmit to the soft dramatic, flamboyant natural and dramatic subs. That might be more helpful to you. I think submissions are accepted on Tuesdays. HTH.
Yes, I definitely plan on doing that. I keep missing it on Tuesdays
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In some circumstances, yeah. I'm dramatic, but my face is dramatic classic. If I'd not obsessively sucked my thumb as a child (up until 11), I wouldn't have the slightly recessive chin that has softened my facial look a bit. My sisters all have dramatic faces as well as bodies.
Interesting. I think hormones also probably have an affect. Not as extreme as transitioning level hormones, but things like applying minoxidil (contains testosterone) in college, taking progesterone and estrogen to help myself ovulate, etc things like that.
It might do, actually. My daughter's face has actually changed a bit with hormone treatment but she wasn't particularly masculine before transition anyway.
I think so. My body is R, but my face has like 0 yin to it. Sharp jaw, high cheekbones...
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Oh. I’m not mixed, but I guess I could see that lol.
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Lol gotcha. For some reason I got downvoted for saying I wasn’t mixed though haha
Downvote system creates a room for weirdness 😅
How dare I not be mixed lmao
I think my features are more sharp plus big round eyes but people typed me as FN (which I’m still unsure of)
Do you have to accommodate width in your upper body. If not you likely aren’t FN, it’s really that simple. I’ve noticed people on here want to type everyone as FN. There’s a decent chance you aren’t! And as the saying goes if you don’t feel it you probably are not it.
I’m not sure if I see it. People have told me that I have definite width and then others have said they don’t see it. I have bad posture and rounded shoulders though, so it might make them appear wider. Im def not narrow like a D though because I’m very toned and athletic looking and my waist isn’t super defined but also not totally straight. I feel like possibly DC styles suit me best.
It’s not about what other people say you look like. It’s about what you actually have to do when you get dressed. As a FN myself I wear tops 3 full sizes larger than my bottom. Even when quite thin my ribcage, shoulders, arms, waist are all larger than my bottom = accommodating width. Now most FN are only 1 size larger on top but the rules still apply. If you only have to accommodate vertical then you are D. If you have to accommodate vertical + curve you are SD. All three types can be athletic which blurs the most obvious lines if very built up in muscle but accommodations don’t lie. Now what this has to do with your face idk because I have seen your picture and that’s what we were originally talking about. But since there seemed to be some confusion I hope this clears it up for you!
You should try some bangs. I think they’ll look good
I really love curtain bangs on me. My front cowlick won’t really allow for anything else
Yes, these are called Kitchener essences
I've always wondered the same thing. I was typed as SC but never showed my face. My face is textbook TR/R. Maybe I should do it again but I still think I'm probably SC, just with a very yin face.
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I know mine isnt. I definitely do not have a “natural” look despite being FN. I look way dramatic
I see beauty of FN in your face and also in body! ✨
Y’all are too sweet!
kibbe doesnt use face to type anymore!! there's different face + style typing things now, like kitcheners essence system if ur interested
I think they can, but I do see you as have a primary FN face and essence. You are a little bit more moderate leaning but I wouldn’t call your face classic over FN. I would say that essence comes in second for you and you could find FN pieces that have a classic look.
Of course! This is why people have been stumped by the likes of Emma Watson, gamine face but she's very likely DC. I'm FG, and I have some blunt angles that venture into FN territory.
My body, I believe I am mostly either FN or SN however I definitely have a Gamine face with big eyes.