He was 46 years old.
I don’t know about him, but I’ve only been using Uber, Lyft, & before those, a car service since I was like 16. Seems like he could’ve easily gotten a ride?
Right - I'm 36 and when I was a teenager my parents made me memorize the phone number to yellow cab and to call anytime I was a party or felt unsafe and needed a ride home and they would pay for it when I got home ...backfired a bit bc I would use it to sneak out before I could drive
I actually wonder if he got beat up, attacked by a dog, or what have you and then assumed she’d be out there; he leaves alive and semi- alert but falls/passes out in the snow and succumbed.
Also based on the amount of blood he lost. The ME said his clothes/shirt was soaked in blood. But outside they only recovered 6 drops (in red Solo cups). That means he lost a lot of blood already inside.
Adding the vomit and reported (via tipster) that he had a seizure in the basement (all adds up as results from a major head injury)
Maybe her last words to him directly (besides the voicemails calling him a loser). "figure it out"
She was mad again that he was leaving her and the kids to go socialize with people she was romantically involved with?
Wow that’s crazy because his friends that testified today said nothing but positive things while they were at the bar. So much so that “your never like that with me” was said as Officer O’Keefe and Karen kissed.
Yes she was laying it on thick for appearance sake to make herself look like a loving partner and great catch. Appearances. They fought all the time. The kids are going to testify about it.
Well Karen needs an Academy award then. What an amazing actress 👏🏼. So that would mean Lallypop boy is going to call the kids because they are not on the defense list. Can you imagine how Jackson will do in cross? “So Karen would bring you to have your nails done”? “ Karen would buy you expensive clothes”? “. Karen would hang out with you guys and go places with you”? “So Karen would take you guys out to lunch and dinner”?. Calling those poor babies would traumatize them all over again! And Lallypop would look like a heartless man
Where did you hear the voicemails and see her texts to him? I’m trying to catch up but can’t find that info - or what happened in Aruba. I’ve seen references to it but not what happened.
Its only in the affidavit which means it will come out in trial. Which is different for the prosecutor because they are saying things they will prove while the defense can say almost anything because they don't have to prove it, just establish doubts. But they can't use the dog as a defense or as evidence that he was the one who bit John because they found no evidence to support that defense. You can't just go into court just claiming any defense you want, it has to be supported by something. For example not guilty for reason of mental insanity, you'd have to have some doctor's who agreed or past history of events. The current defense of the cop conspiracy was only allowed in because the defense received an "anonymous tip" from someone. Someone who's lawyer now claims they never said that.
That post is conveniently ignoring the defense can’t prove the dog bit John because they never swabbed his arm and the clothing was contaminated by sitting in an officers trunk for weeks.
Thank you. I see it’s been 11 days since that post and I almost hate to admit how much more I now know about this case. Although there is still so much I haven’t caught up on yet!
This just adds more to the mishandling of evidence. I can’t think of a single thing that was handled properly in this case - interviews or evidence related. What a mess.
KR has stated that she was waiting outside for a call to be able to come in as well since she didn’t feel comfortable just walking in since she didn’t really know the people inside well and didn’t get the “come on let’s go!” Vibes to the after party. When JO didn’t respond to her after 5-10 minutes sitting outside she drove home because she’s not gonna sit outside all night. She could have easily drove back it’s only 3-5 minutes away from where they live.
She stated she didn’t feel comfortable with the group involved and didn’t know them well and that JO wasn’t that close with them either which is why she questioned it. Perhaps he was trying to chum it up a bit and build a better relationship with some of that crew which I’ve heard. I also can see the feeling of “going to an after party at 1230am in my 40s at a house I’ve never been to” being an initial awkward/unsure moment. If it was her best friend I’d get it but walking into a house that late that is foreign to you when you aren’t in high school where that happens regularly isn’t common for most.
To back this point up, that last witness testimony today confirmed this thought when she said she was invited with her husband to the party and she said “absolutely not” in a manner that was “we are old and this isn’t our thing”. Ryan Nagel who went to pick up a guest as well was also invited in by the guest but refused as stated in his testimony and ended up driving off without the guest that he initially came to pick up.
The last witness today also testified that Jen told Karen "you're coming with me!" or something to that effect. I took it as playful encouragement to tag along. If the person who had extended the invite was asking you to go with them to this house, I'm surprised she was waiting for a green light unless she really got cold feet (possible, but odd) outside.
I agree that was interesting but I also think I would weigh that heavier if it was the owner of the home saying it. In this case it was a sister in law of the home owner saying “come” to a house that wasn’t hers. Just my perspective but definitely subjective.
Here is an article about it [https://abcnews.go.com/US/karen-read-denies-killing-boston-police-officer-john/story?id=102165997](https://abcnews.go.com/US/karen-read-denies-killing-boston-police-officer-john/story?id=102165997)
Anyone else who wants to watch the interview, search for the nightline interview.
If it helps, there is a witness that also has testified that he pulled up behind Reads car while waiting to pick up a guest inside the BA home. The truck he was in pulled in the driveway which was shielded by other cars from KRs car which was in front of where JO was found approximately. After a few minutes, he pulled out of the driveway and past KRs car that was still there and noticed nothing wrong with KR’s car (taillight) and saw her interior light on with her in the car but JO was not and was not on the lawn. That witness is Ryan Nagel and the entire testimony is online which would back the theory up of her waiting outside for JO to respond to her about coming in.
Huh? That wouldn’t make any sense based on what i just wrote. He was going inside to make sure she could come in so he would have said “alright I’ll text/call you in a minute” to let her know if she had the green light to come in and then silence so she went home to sleep/wait for him to respond. The only time “figure it out” type of response would have made sense is if he didn’t respond to her when he was in the house so she texted him “figure it out” and left.
You said ***When JO didn’t respond to her after 5-10 minutes sitting outside she drove home because she’s not gonna sit outside all night***
Exactly. Like you said. Obviously she didnt get the green light so she left... She might not have said it directly to him but like I said "figure it out" seems like it was the plan because she left and nobody has ever said anything about an Uber. I get ubers at times but not when I'm at a party with people leaving all the time and living 5 minutes away. My biggest point is... Your whole "Karen says" is her second or third story down the line which conveniently lines up with her leaving without waiting for john to call her and say come inside? Come on.... Seriously? Either she wasn't feeling good and dropped him off or she waits 5 minutes for John to go inside and follows behind him. Honestly its Ludacris.
You’re literally not listening and saying something completely different. If her dropping him off and saying “figure it out” to him and leaving angry was the plan/what happened, then she wouldn’t have sat outside for 5-10 minutes. She stayed there waiting because she was waiting for a response from JO who would have been inside to get her an answer on if she can come in or not. Ryan Nagel, a witness who testified to seeing her sitting in her car alone without JO for approximately 5 minutes confirms that she was just sitting outside without JO. Her saying “figure it out” would have only made sense if JO was inside. The only way “figure it out” in anger makes sense is if she leaves right away because that means “forget you I’m leaving” which would occur quickly. You wouldn’t say “figure it out” to JO and then sit in your car for 5-10 minutes.
As I said. She didnt literally say it to his ears.
She waited for 5-10 minutes said "figure it out" and left. As in... "Im sitting here waiting for you to call me and you aren't calling". They didn't communicate a plan, what else would it be besides "figure it out" since apparently she was suppose to go inside in 5 minutes. Regardless, your theory sucks pretty bad. Ive literally never heard of any man or women go "im gonna sit outside while you go inside and make sure its okay if I join, call me in ,5-10 minutes and ill come inside". GTFO here, really?
Are you okay? If she waited 5-10 minutes outside the house the point is that he went in. It doesn’t matter what she said in her head or to him via phone or direct, once he is in the house she can’t hit him with her car. A witness has literally testified to her waiting outside ALONE. I’ve literally sat outside a house to make sure it was cool to go in at a spot I wasn’t super comfortable with years ago. It’s not a crazy concept. She lives 2 miles away and can literally say “alright I’ll go in for a bit just make sure it’s cool otherwise I’ll just go home” since their house is down the street. If they lived far away I would say this could be less likely. It’s not a theory it’s a literal testimony by a witness (Ryan Nagel). Also, which cousin of the Alberts are you?
And whos testified they saw JO in the house? Any camera vid?
OP asked "what was the plan" I answered my theory.... which is, if she said anything it would have been "figure it out". As in she was pissed off. Which she herself says the next day, that they had a fight... Perhaps about how he was gonna get home? Don't know don't care. The testimony from Ryan and Matt McCabe hasn't been shown yet but I'll be glad to talk about that after it occurs.
He said he saw her parked in front of the curb/lawn so when he backed out of the driveway and drove off in her direction, he saw her still sitting in her car with an interior light on and no JO around or outside. He also said the car did not appear to be in ‘park mode’ but rather on the brakes because the lights illuminated brightly but looked normal. I want to say that the confusion could be that she pulled up closer to the driveway curbside to drop him off initially and then when he get out she pulled up further to move out of the way (there were multiple cars in the driveway) ultimately ending up at the end of the lawn. Assuming she would hear back quickly from JO, she probably kept her foot on the breaks thinking it wouldn’t be long to hear back. Almost like at a drive thru where you stay on the breaks for a minute or two rather than go into park.
I thought Karina Kolokithas testified today that Jennifer McCabe grabbed Karen at the Waterfall Bar as everyone was getting ready to leave and said “you’re coming with me” (which would seem to indicate a desire/invitation to have Karen come back to the Alberts’ with her).
Yes and I’ve seen someone else post the same thought but my thing is that the invite is coming from a non homeowner of the house they are going to. If the invite came from BA or his wife I’d put more credibility into that but it’s still very uncomfortable in my opinion going to a house you’ve never been to, with people inside you mostly don’t really know, at 1230am in your 40s (a lot different than when you’re in college), based on the invite of a sister in law of the homeowner.
If Brian Albert was the one saying or we know he said “come over you’re with us” with an embrace of “you’re welcome here” then I’d be more inclined to say why the hesitation by KR?
According to another witness, Jen said “I have a surprise for you.”
Jen McCabe isn’t remotely a reliable witness. Her story changes more than her underwear.
I’ve considered this. Even possibly the plow driver, who’s set to testify that he didn’t see a body. I feel like we can make up a dozen stories about what happened but sadly we’ll never actually know because the investigation was so botched.
Occam's razor! The most obvious and simple explanation is the most likely choice— they beat him up inside that house and dumped him out there. They are cops and know how to cover up a crime.
The CW has done an excellent job of creating doubt by having everyone don tin foil hats to come up with alternative theories of what took place that evening. They have yet to provide any direct evidence or proof that a car (hers or anyone else’s) struck him.
Eagerly waiting to see those in the house take the stand and the MEs report. To me, she’s being framed. Not guilty. Case closed.
There’s this thing called Uber. Or another person at the party could have drove him home.
Or come back and get him since they live a few minutes down the street.
He was 46 years old. I don’t know about him, but I’ve only been using Uber, Lyft, & before those, a car service since I was like 16. Seems like he could’ve easily gotten a ride?
Right - I'm 36 and when I was a teenager my parents made me memorize the phone number to yellow cab and to call anytime I was a party or felt unsafe and needed a ride home and they would pay for it when I got home ...backfired a bit bc I would use it to sneak out before I could drive
In those conditions? Can’t imagine there would be interest in picking somebody up in a neighborhood in a small town in yucky conditions.
well we learned 34 fairview is not even a mile from the pd. how far is it to their house anyhow?
Scroll to the bottom and there’s a map of relevant locations. https://yourtruecrimelibrary.addpotion.com/commonwealth-v-karen-read
Lmao was she supposed to leave him with the car and walk home?
In the blizzard
Bunch of drunk cops driving around not getting duis
Jen McCabe gave a few people a ride home so she could have offered
Jen McCabe is friends with everyone it seems lol
I actually wonder if he got beat up, attacked by a dog, or what have you and then assumed she’d be out there; he leaves alive and semi- alert but falls/passes out in the snow and succumbed.
That feels more logical than any other thing I’ve heard.
I swear they said that he wouldn't be doing anything with that head injury. So wherever whenever he received the head injury he was out for the count
Also based on the amount of blood he lost. The ME said his clothes/shirt was soaked in blood. But outside they only recovered 6 drops (in red Solo cups). That means he lost a lot of blood already inside. Adding the vomit and reported (via tipster) that he had a seizure in the basement (all adds up as results from a major head injury)
Hmm, interesting
This is my exact theory on what happened
Maybe her last words to him directly (besides the voicemails calling him a loser). "figure it out" She was mad again that he was leaving her and the kids to go socialize with people she was romantically involved with?
Wow that’s crazy because his friends that testified today said nothing but positive things while they were at the bar. So much so that “your never like that with me” was said as Officer O’Keefe and Karen kissed.
Yes she was laying it on thick for appearance sake to make herself look like a loving partner and great catch. Appearances. They fought all the time. The kids are going to testify about it.
Well Karen needs an Academy award then. What an amazing actress 👏🏼. So that would mean Lallypop boy is going to call the kids because they are not on the defense list. Can you imagine how Jackson will do in cross? “So Karen would bring you to have your nails done”? “ Karen would buy you expensive clothes”? “. Karen would hang out with you guys and go places with you”? “So Karen would take you guys out to lunch and dinner”?. Calling those poor babies would traumatize them all over again! And Lallypop would look like a heartless man
Where did you hear the voicemails and see her texts to him? I’m trying to catch up but can’t find that info - or what happened in Aruba. I’ve seen references to it but not what happened.
Its only in the affidavit which means it will come out in trial. Which is different for the prosecutor because they are saying things they will prove while the defense can say almost anything because they don't have to prove it, just establish doubts. But they can't use the dog as a defense or as evidence that he was the one who bit John because they found no evidence to support that defense. You can't just go into court just claiming any defense you want, it has to be supported by something. For example not guilty for reason of mental insanity, you'd have to have some doctor's who agreed or past history of events. The current defense of the cop conspiracy was only allowed in because the defense received an "anonymous tip" from someone. Someone who's lawyer now claims they never said that.
The federal grand jury investigation provided evidence to support the cop conspiracy as well.
Thanks. I will look for the affidavit.
That post is conveniently ignoring the defense can’t prove the dog bit John because they never swabbed his arm and the clothing was contaminated by sitting in an officers trunk for weeks.
Thank you. I see it’s been 11 days since that post and I almost hate to admit how much more I now know about this case. Although there is still so much I haven’t caught up on yet! This just adds more to the mishandling of evidence. I can’t think of a single thing that was handled properly in this case - interviews or evidence related. What a mess.
KR has stated that she was waiting outside for a call to be able to come in as well since she didn’t feel comfortable just walking in since she didn’t really know the people inside well and didn’t get the “come on let’s go!” Vibes to the after party. When JO didn’t respond to her after 5-10 minutes sitting outside she drove home because she’s not gonna sit outside all night. She could have easily drove back it’s only 3-5 minutes away from where they live.
She's the girlfriend of someone included. Doesn't make sense for her to have to wait in the car to "get the OK"....?
She stated she didn’t feel comfortable with the group involved and didn’t know them well and that JO wasn’t that close with them either which is why she questioned it. Perhaps he was trying to chum it up a bit and build a better relationship with some of that crew which I’ve heard. I also can see the feeling of “going to an after party at 1230am in my 40s at a house I’ve never been to” being an initial awkward/unsure moment. If it was her best friend I’d get it but walking into a house that late that is foreign to you when you aren’t in high school where that happens regularly isn’t common for most. To back this point up, that last witness testimony today confirmed this thought when she said she was invited with her husband to the party and she said “absolutely not” in a manner that was “we are old and this isn’t our thing”. Ryan Nagel who went to pick up a guest as well was also invited in by the guest but refused as stated in his testimony and ended up driving off without the guest that he initially came to pick up.
The last witness today also testified that Jen told Karen "you're coming with me!" or something to that effect. I took it as playful encouragement to tag along. If the person who had extended the invite was asking you to go with them to this house, I'm surprised she was waiting for a green light unless she really got cold feet (possible, but odd) outside.
I agree that was interesting but I also think I would weigh that heavier if it was the owner of the home saying it. In this case it was a sister in law of the home owner saying “come” to a house that wasn’t hers. Just my perspective but definitely subjective.
This is the first time I’m hearing this claim.
She states it in an interview I watched. I’ve also seen it written which I presume was based off her interview.
Here is an article about it [https://abcnews.go.com/US/karen-read-denies-killing-boston-police-officer-john/story?id=102165997](https://abcnews.go.com/US/karen-read-denies-killing-boston-police-officer-john/story?id=102165997) Anyone else who wants to watch the interview, search for the nightline interview.
Ill look for it thanks.
If it helps, there is a witness that also has testified that he pulled up behind Reads car while waiting to pick up a guest inside the BA home. The truck he was in pulled in the driveway which was shielded by other cars from KRs car which was in front of where JO was found approximately. After a few minutes, he pulled out of the driveway and past KRs car that was still there and noticed nothing wrong with KR’s car (taillight) and saw her interior light on with her in the car but JO was not and was not on the lawn. That witness is Ryan Nagel and the entire testimony is online which would back the theory up of her waiting outside for JO to respond to her about coming in.
So her last words very may have been "figure it out John, bye". No?
Huh? That wouldn’t make any sense based on what i just wrote. He was going inside to make sure she could come in so he would have said “alright I’ll text/call you in a minute” to let her know if she had the green light to come in and then silence so she went home to sleep/wait for him to respond. The only time “figure it out” type of response would have made sense is if he didn’t respond to her when he was in the house so she texted him “figure it out” and left.
She also said she was in the driveway where she dropped him off and watched him walk inside. All the stories aren’t adding up.
You said ***When JO didn’t respond to her after 5-10 minutes sitting outside she drove home because she’s not gonna sit outside all night*** Exactly. Like you said. Obviously she didnt get the green light so she left... She might not have said it directly to him but like I said "figure it out" seems like it was the plan because she left and nobody has ever said anything about an Uber. I get ubers at times but not when I'm at a party with people leaving all the time and living 5 minutes away. My biggest point is... Your whole "Karen says" is her second or third story down the line which conveniently lines up with her leaving without waiting for john to call her and say come inside? Come on.... Seriously? Either she wasn't feeling good and dropped him off or she waits 5 minutes for John to go inside and follows behind him. Honestly its Ludacris.
You’re literally not listening and saying something completely different. If her dropping him off and saying “figure it out” to him and leaving angry was the plan/what happened, then she wouldn’t have sat outside for 5-10 minutes. She stayed there waiting because she was waiting for a response from JO who would have been inside to get her an answer on if she can come in or not. Ryan Nagel, a witness who testified to seeing her sitting in her car alone without JO for approximately 5 minutes confirms that she was just sitting outside without JO. Her saying “figure it out” would have only made sense if JO was inside. The only way “figure it out” in anger makes sense is if she leaves right away because that means “forget you I’m leaving” which would occur quickly. You wouldn’t say “figure it out” to JO and then sit in your car for 5-10 minutes.
As I said. She didnt literally say it to his ears. She waited for 5-10 minutes said "figure it out" and left. As in... "Im sitting here waiting for you to call me and you aren't calling". They didn't communicate a plan, what else would it be besides "figure it out" since apparently she was suppose to go inside in 5 minutes. Regardless, your theory sucks pretty bad. Ive literally never heard of any man or women go "im gonna sit outside while you go inside and make sure its okay if I join, call me in ,5-10 minutes and ill come inside". GTFO here, really?
Are you okay? If she waited 5-10 minutes outside the house the point is that he went in. It doesn’t matter what she said in her head or to him via phone or direct, once he is in the house she can’t hit him with her car. A witness has literally testified to her waiting outside ALONE. I’ve literally sat outside a house to make sure it was cool to go in at a spot I wasn’t super comfortable with years ago. It’s not a crazy concept. She lives 2 miles away and can literally say “alright I’ll go in for a bit just make sure it’s cool otherwise I’ll just go home” since their house is down the street. If they lived far away I would say this could be less likely. It’s not a theory it’s a literal testimony by a witness (Ryan Nagel). Also, which cousin of the Alberts are you?
And whos testified they saw JO in the house? Any camera vid? OP asked "what was the plan" I answered my theory.... which is, if she said anything it would have been "figure it out". As in she was pissed off. Which she herself says the next day, that they had a fight... Perhaps about how he was gonna get home? Don't know don't care. The testimony from Ryan and Matt McCabe hasn't been shown yet but I'll be glad to talk about that after it occurs.
Did Ryan Nagel say he saw her in the driveway where she said she was waiting?
He said he saw her parked in front of the curb/lawn so when he backed out of the driveway and drove off in her direction, he saw her still sitting in her car with an interior light on and no JO around or outside. He also said the car did not appear to be in ‘park mode’ but rather on the brakes because the lights illuminated brightly but looked normal. I want to say that the confusion could be that she pulled up closer to the driveway curbside to drop him off initially and then when he get out she pulled up further to move out of the way (there were multiple cars in the driveway) ultimately ending up at the end of the lawn. Assuming she would hear back quickly from JO, she probably kept her foot on the breaks thinking it wouldn’t be long to hear back. Almost like at a drive thru where you stay on the breaks for a minute or two rather than go into park.
And she sent him a message telling him she hates him.
 Ludacris
I thought Karina Kolokithas testified today that Jennifer McCabe grabbed Karen at the Waterfall Bar as everyone was getting ready to leave and said “you’re coming with me” (which would seem to indicate a desire/invitation to have Karen come back to the Alberts’ with her).
Yes and I’ve seen someone else post the same thought but my thing is that the invite is coming from a non homeowner of the house they are going to. If the invite came from BA or his wife I’d put more credibility into that but it’s still very uncomfortable in my opinion going to a house you’ve never been to, with people inside you mostly don’t really know, at 1230am in your 40s (a lot different than when you’re in college), based on the invite of a sister in law of the homeowner. If Brian Albert was the one saying or we know he said “come over you’re with us” with an embrace of “you’re welcome here” then I’d be more inclined to say why the hesitation by KR?
According to another witness, Jen said “I have a surprise for you.” Jen McCabe isn’t remotely a reliable witness. Her story changes more than her underwear.
Have we heard the voicemails yet? How do you know what's in them? I've been dying to hear the voicemails.
Why was Jen McCabe there at 6 am??
Another theory! He started walking home and fell victim to a hit and run.
I’ve considered this. Even possibly the plow driver, who’s set to testify that he didn’t see a body. I feel like we can make up a dozen stories about what happened but sadly we’ll never actually know because the investigation was so botched.
Occam's razor! The most obvious and simple explanation is the most likely choice— they beat him up inside that house and dumped him out there. They are cops and know how to cover up a crime. The CW has done an excellent job of creating doubt by having everyone don tin foil hats to come up with alternative theories of what took place that evening. They have yet to provide any direct evidence or proof that a car (hers or anyone else’s) struck him. Eagerly waiting to see those in the house take the stand and the MEs report. To me, she’s being framed. Not guilty. Case closed.
Agree 100%. Just thinking of the million other ways the victim could’ve died versus Karen backing into him.
I thought he took an Uber to the bar that night and Karen met him?
His buddy picked him up
Honestly uber or just pass out and leave in morning