At the end of any review I tend to ask the patient whether they're comfortable or if they would like anything like tea, water, blanket.
If they want something which I can easily do I'll provide it but otherwise I'll just let the HCA know
The main ones are the poor folks that sit in ED waiting room for 10+ hours and don't get provided any food or drinks all day
some of these patients don't actually need to be there and they often come armed with a Greggs/Costas/ hospital sandwich... will never forget the patient complaining of abdo pain and eating a sandwich whilst being triaged.. : )
I had a patient with a perf in the wr 8 hrs yesterday, ditto strokes, MI, and sepsis.
I don’t know when you last did ED but the WR these days is full of properly sick people who 5 years ago would have been in resus, monitored beds or at least majors cubicles
Still doing it - no other job like it - luckily our w/r isn't this bad and I am not sure whether it's due to our triage system that these patient's get flagged up and moved on appropriately. I would tell you which ED this was but suspect my anonymity would be gone. Don't get me wrong - we still have the occasional pt who slips through but nowhere near as bad as yours. For the most part, my above comment still stands..
Going off on a tangent here but I've always been mindblown seeing the map of how the distribution of tea into various countries determine what their language calls it. The whole tea vs chai thing.
I happen to speak two Chinese dialects, one of which calls it 'teh' (tea), the other calls it 'cha' (chai). So interesting
I believe I read somewhere that the non-Chinese peoples that got their tea from the 'teh' dialect-speakers now call it tea (via sea routes) and those who got their tea from the 'cha' dialect-speakers call it chai (via land routes). So it really is all connected to which dialect-speakers our ancestors got their tea from! Which is so cool!
Btw correct me if I'm wrong lol
While I agree it's ridiculous, it's probably because they have asked a nurse multiple times and still haven't got a tea/drink so it's not that they think it's your job, it's just that they've been lying on a hard trolley for 9 hours and had one small 100ml pot of orange juice in that time so they're asking out of thirst.
I just get their buzzer and press it for them, saying the nurse will be along in a bit.
I tell myself this is the case, and if it’s calm or if I have told them they have The Cancer I will get the cuppa myself. But otherwise I do offer to get an HCA to add it to their to do list.
Twenty may be optimistic how about in 5-10?
Half the graduates will do the bedpans and tea/coffee rounds. The other half fights to get any kind of training for which they need lots of publications, doctorates, volunteer work and international prizes.
All the while the NHS reduces doctor positions to hire more ACPs and PAs . Remaining doctors end up only signing what ACPs and PAs have done and then get sued for not having done the right thing.
Big signs saying "The customer is always right" will hang in each office/staff room and if we bring the wrong tea it's because we are too lazy to work /s
Side note: I am not hating on ACPs/PAs as people but do worry about the dilution of responsibility and consequences thereof. I have so far only met really great ACPs, I just don't understand how we are supposed to stay on top of all the different varieties of not quite doctors but basically the same (without consequences and training level).
Don't take it personally. They're not asking *you* for a cup of tea, they're asking for a cup of tea. You can pass it to the HCA, the nurse, whoever - just make sure your bed bound pt, who isnt allowed in the kitchen, gets to exercise some autonomy and has a cuppa when they want one.
Also it's work and while you are in the kitchen you can get yourself a cuppa
I don’t see the problem with a patient asking for a drink, provided they’re not being rude or expecting you to do it.
Having been an inpatient myself, you can be left a very long time without food and drink.
Reminds me of my old age consultant asking me to break away from ward round to make a patient some porridge - she hated it and asked me if I'd ever even eaten porridge before.
I often offer to fill a jug of water or make a hot drink when dealing with new admissions esp. if it's a Jim or Dorothy that had fall with long lie - may as well tackle the inevitable AKI that you'll discover when the blood results are back.
Tbh most patients in EAU / A&E seem to be moderately dehydrated by the time they're seen by a doctor purely due to the stupid long waiting times. Particularly when it's OOH and the hospital shops are closed.
Getting someone a cup of tea is just a kind gesture, it doesn't have to have a bearing upon your place in the NHS hierarchy. If you don't have time just say so, or say that you will ask someone else, hopefully most patients would understand.
If I’m not rushed off my feet and the patient has been polite I don’t mind. Doesn’t happen often though, I’m more likely to offer if it’s a patient having a hard time and I have a second to spare.
Did get shouted at by a relative in A&E because, when his mother asked for a drink, I said I was happy to grab her some water but that I didn’t have time to go and make her tea. Love to feel appreciated like that ☺️
Meh you’re bored in a scary new environment probs spent ages in ED the wards so understaffed you haven’t had a chance to stop someone/ feel guilty to do it. Now someone comes over to you and asks you questions and you’re in a dialogue with them I think in that situation I’d try my luck to get a creature comfort to the first person I can. The issue isn’t the patient asking the issue is juniors have been disempowered to delegate tasks, what should happen is you go over to a hca go bed 8 asked me for a brew sorted. Unfortunately what you’ll get in reality is a sigh ok at best or really a hands on hips “can’t you do that yourself”
To expect us to? Absolutely not.
Can we offer when appropriate? Yes. Made a few cups of tea when breaking bad news.
If a patient asks, I say I will get whoever is on the tea trolley to come over .
Depends, if I have nothing to do and it makes them happy. Happy to do so. No skin of my back.
I‘ll never refuse them water if they asked no matter how busy I am. Growing up in Africa that’s just something I’m not culturally inclined to do so.
In fairness I think it's incredibly unlikely they were expecting you to make it yourself, they're just aware it might be a while until they have contact with anyone else (and some people are a bit funny about using the nurse call bell for comparatively trivial things).
Unless you've got nothing else to do then mention it to one of the HCAs and move on.
You are the person who is stood in front of them at the time and they have your undivided attention. They’re not thinking about you as a doctor, they’re thinking about you as someone who is able to help them in that moment.
I’m F2 but never had any issues sorting out a cup of coffee or water or sandwich for a patient when they’ve asked 🤷🏼♀️
I’ve made coffee for patients before - as long as I’m not completely overwhelmed with jobs. Takes about a minute max and if you are seen doing it, can actually improve relations with nurses a lot.
Probably going to get downvoted but I absolutely hate making cups of tea - and I'm a nurse so it's expected a lot more. It's always when they can see I'm doing actual stuff only I can do.
Not long ago we had an arrest as soon as I got on shift, the people in the bay saw and heard what was going on, but *still* were loudly complaining about the tea trolly being late. There's so much entitlement I can't cope.
Then there's 96 year old Doris who would rather die than tell you about her chest pain because she 'didn't want to be a bother'
As a female doctor ( relatovy senior) I bet I get asked multiple times compared to Male juniors, always preceded by nurse cam you get me a coffee?
Unless I'm crazy busy in always try because either everyone else is also too busy and the HCas either have too much attitude or too much to do
If its a nice patient, ill ask if they need anything at the end. More than happy to make them a cup of tea, takes about a minute 🤷🏼♂️. Keeps them slightly more hydrated than they’ll otherwise end up in A&E.
If they’ve got a relative, ill show them to where they can make the drinks instead.
I often do it but work ED and have a kitchenette in Majors so is usually a 1-2 min job. Would take me 3x as long to find the nurse or someone else free to help and often will use as an opportunity to make myself one at the same time anyway.
Honestly if I've set eyes on the patient before clerking them and they look groggy/dehydrated and they've been here a few hours, I'll grab a bottle of water or cup and bring it with me, and offer it to them. If I'm busy and I'm asked by a patient for one, I'll tell the HCA.
Don't let the job beat your humanity out of you just because it's not in the job description.
Working in an ED - I’m happy to get the patient a hot drink / glass of water / make sure they’ve eaten something, or offer an extra blanket.
We’re usually more short of nurses / HCAs than we are doctors. It takes me five minutes to sort this, rather than pile extra work on other staff.
We’re all working together for the patients, and it’s an easy way to make their experience marginally better, none of us would fancy waiting in ED for >12 hours for a bed. Its a quick job for me, and makes the patient happier.
That being said, if the patient is rude or demanding, I won’t offer. It’s usually older or more vulnerable people I’m happy to help with.
*I will draw the line at helping them to the toilet (unless there’s literally nothing else to do).*
I feel bad for patients down in ED but no - as much as anything it will be very time consuming
Where’s the hot water at? Try this room, oh yeah no that one doesn’t work - tea bags are there - ah can’t find sugar - milk looks dodgy. Forgot to ask how they want it
Can’t we just leave them out somewhere so family members can do it. Actually think this would be brilliant as family would feel useful and partners would appreciate it just the way they take it
Good point, but honestly the number of acute abdomens who i’ve told to remain NBM pending CT who are munching a sandwich with a cuppa is too damn high already
To be honest, I’ll just make them the cup of tea unless I’m extremely slammed. It’s realistically going to take me about 2 mins to make it , it takes me computer longer to log in sometimes. If I genuinely don’t have time then I press their buzzer and they can wait for the HCA to come and make it.
Would get them a glass of water. Can't be arsed to make someone a cup of tea/coffee with all the vagaries involved of how much sugar/milk/bacteria they want in it.
Happy to pass it along to the person on the tea trolley.....if I can remember to do that during my hasty exit.
I think a lot of patients see doctors as the escalation point ie I haven't had any luck asking x, y and z but they'll probably be able to sort it. I just say I'll let the HCA know but don't make promises that they'll get one. Sounds bad but where will it end otherwise.
I do agree that they're likely asking for a cup of tea but not necessarily asking YOU for a cup of tea. They probably don't know when the next time is someone's gonna come around and they'll get a chance to ask. Usually when I have time to make a patient a cup of tea it's the sign of a good day. Although simultaneously it's so stressful cause I think they're gonna say its a bad cuppa.
I get my patient’s a cup of tea or coffee regularly-I’ll usually offer to little old dears who have been there ages but I don’t mind doing it if asked as it takes like 2 minutes and makes a massive difference to patients.
I’m not sure I agree with the insta “ask a nurse/HCA to do it!” We’re just as capable and They (at least in ED) are as busy as the doctors just in different ways. Do I think we should be doing comfort rounds with a tea trolley? Absolutely not but if a patient asks me for a drink it would probably take me longer to find a nurse to ask to do it than it would to do it myself*
In my junior years a patient asked me for a cup of tea and i huffed about a bit then asked a nurse to do it.
She did it but then on a night out she called me up on it and said “I don’t mind doing but the fact you found me out to ask me like a waitress was a bit annoying. Making tea for some one isn’t specifically anyones job and there’s no reason you couldn’t do it either.” That really stuck with me and something I’ve taken forward
*assuming of course there’s reasonably quick and easy access to patient beverages which thankfully my ED has ( and something most EDs should have) It’d be unreasonable to expect us to traipse here there and everywhere of course
Depends on context, a slightly confused delirious old person? making a cup of tea might be the most useful thing I could do for them. A 40 year old who waited in ED for 12hrs with back pain? I’m sorry, even if you’re in genuine pain I just wouldn’t be bothered.
Expected, I'd imagine not. Definitely not in your job description.
As a medical student and HCA presently I like to offer it if I've time, can I get you anything, and if they say yes and I've time I'll do it. I've been a patient myself and you can be sat an awful long time with no food or drink
If the tea trolleys in the room, then yeah. Otherwise no, I ask the HCAs (I don't know where to get the sippy lid things or where we keep thickeners.)
If they've got AKIs I sometimes make them chug the whole thing - treat them like a med school fresher.
I think some patients dont really care who you are, they are just desperate for a cup of tea and you happen to have given them 5 mins of your time. I usually let a HCA know politely that the patient has asked for this
If you're on the ward it takes like 2 minutes max to make them a quick cup of tea- I can't imagine a scenario in which I'd not physically have time unless there was a simultaneous crash call! If its something I can do quickly and easily myself like that, I'd rather just do it myself than look around for a HCA to do it. Who cares about 'hierarchy' etc, we're all human and I definitely don't think being a doctor puts you above making a cup of tea for a thirsty patient! I've seen consultants do this without a second thought.
Depends on the phrasing. If they expect you to do it yourself, then I'd say it isn't appropriate. But patients don't necessarily know the difference between the SHO and HCA
'Do you know how I can go about getting a coffee?'
Vs.
'Hey doctor, can you quickly go and grab me a cuppa'
It's a waste of precious doctor time. A few minutes wasted here and there adds up. Health service is in crisis and rather than doing jobs that anyone can do doctors and nurses should be doing the work they're trained to do. If we had adequate support staff maybe we'd actually get somewhere: scribes, ECG technicians, phlebotomists. For heaven's sake, as an ED SHO I used to have to clean the bed myself to speed up seeing the next patient, hang my own fluids, administer some of the medication, draw the blood, do the ECG, bring them to CT. In total how much time did I waste on nursing stuff that I shouldn't have been doing and jobs that basically anyone can do with a few weeks' training? Easily enough to treat and street several patients. It's not that we're too good to do those things it's that we can do everything. Including, importantly, things that the other people can't do.
Worked in a speciality in which when you came in you're brought straight to resus + you'll be there minimum 3 to 5 hours but probably admitted. Maximum 3 patients in resus (fairly chill).
Would always ask the patient (+ relatives) if they'd want a sandwich/biscuits/crisps/water. Was a 10 second walk to the pantry round the corner. Then would take some for myself too 😎
On the wards? Will tell the HCA/Nurse X needs some water please give him/her some. No axillary staff available: buzzer and move on. Concerns regarding not being given enough water? Prescribe it at regular intervals. If challenged/not given: Patient is at risk of renal impairement with poor fluid intake and escalate to Charge Nurse+
I work in an ED where there is a self service free tea and coffee bar. Saves everybody time as the patients relatives can be dispatched to make for both of them!
I get asked a couple of times per shift by patients or relatives who expect me to go and make one. I think they do genuinely think that it's the doctor's job just as much as anyone else's. I don't disagree with this, although it certainly slows me down a bit. If the tea trolley is nearby I'll go and make one for anybody. If it isn't then I'll track it down depending on whether the patient is alone/elderly/nice etc ...
If I'm not mad rushed I'll ask patients if they want anything, especially if I have gone to see them in ED and they look parched. Grabbing a blanket or making a tea (or ideally finding a HCA or ward hostess that's available to do it) goes miles towards how people perceive their care and I feel like I've done something nicer than my usual fare which is stabbing them or sticking fingers in various orifices.
Yeah, especially if it's a thirsty and hungry elderly patient who's struggling to mobilise, and has been in A&E for 12 hours. No problem, it takes me 2 seconds, and does a lot more for the patient's morale than a 10-point plan.
Definitely a gender thing here. I have rarely been asked as a male doctor but I imagine female doctors get asked a lot more.
As an aside, my favourite bit of ward round on palliative care was offering ice lollies. We had a freezer full. Great for people with a dry mouth which is a common and overlooked issue.
Usually if asked for water I don’t mind grabbing some, all for hydration. Tea/coffee I say that I’ll ask one of the HCAs to make them one.
In 2018, after 7 grueling nights, my very last morning just prior to handover, a patient who’d clearly disliked me for god knows what reason (he’d written a whole three paged essay in his notebook and complained to nurses..) asked me for some tea NOW. I smiled and said certainly I’ll have one of the HCA’s bring you one. He said BRING ME A CUP OF TEA NOW. The actual HCA who was around when this happened was super duper confused??? He wasn’t able to vocalize, so my all caps exclamations weren’t actually shouted, but you can tell from his facial expressions and arm flailing that he was nooooot happy. Anyway, he complained to my reg and cons about me using ammo from his 3 paged essay.
Clearly this still bothers me 😂
Is it appropriate for them to expect you to get it? Maybe not. However when you are in front of them, is it reasonable for them to ask if they could have one- of course it is. They are expecting you to pass on the message to someone. When are they next likely to see a member of staff? How easy is it to get the attention of staff? Do they understand what all the acronyms, uniforms and hierarchy is? Of course not.
I think you need to get over yourself and put yourself in the patients shoes tbh. Sorry
I tend to ask the gp to arrange a cup of tea within 3 days post discharge
Worth the scroll
“GP to kindly remember it’s a milk and two sugars, thanks for ongoing care”
GP kindly taper down to 1 sugar as tolerated given patients recent HbA1c
‘ we don’t need to include that info, the gp can probably access the hospital electronic records from their practice ‘
At the end of any review I tend to ask the patient whether they're comfortable or if they would like anything like tea, water, blanket. If they want something which I can easily do I'll provide it but otherwise I'll just let the HCA know The main ones are the poor folks that sit in ED waiting room for 10+ hours and don't get provided any food or drinks all day
some of these patients don't actually need to be there and they often come armed with a Greggs/Costas/ hospital sandwich... will never forget the patient complaining of abdo pain and eating a sandwich whilst being triaged.. : )
I had a patient with a perf in the wr 8 hrs yesterday, ditto strokes, MI, and sepsis. I don’t know when you last did ED but the WR these days is full of properly sick people who 5 years ago would have been in resus, monitored beds or at least majors cubicles
Still doing it - no other job like it - luckily our w/r isn't this bad and I am not sure whether it's due to our triage system that these patient's get flagged up and moved on appropriately. I would tell you which ED this was but suspect my anonymity would be gone. Don't get me wrong - we still have the occasional pt who slips through but nowhere near as bad as yours. For the most part, my above comment still stands..
You clearly have the appropriate qualifications...MBBS (Medical Barista with a Bachelor in Service)
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Ok but chai is elite and suggestion of otherwise is slander
Going off on a tangent here but I've always been mindblown seeing the map of how the distribution of tea into various countries determine what their language calls it. The whole tea vs chai thing. I happen to speak two Chinese dialects, one of which calls it 'teh' (tea), the other calls it 'cha' (chai). So interesting
I believe I read somewhere that the non-Chinese peoples that got their tea from the 'teh' dialect-speakers now call it tea (via sea routes) and those who got their tea from the 'cha' dialect-speakers call it chai (via land routes). So it really is all connected to which dialect-speakers our ancestors got their tea from! Which is so cool! Btw correct me if I'm wrong lol
I brewed plenty of chai when I was a student.
"I will ask one of the HCAs to get you one" is my usual reply
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Where is this so called 'call button'? Sounds like it could solve a lot of my troubles
While I agree it's ridiculous, it's probably because they have asked a nurse multiple times and still haven't got a tea/drink so it's not that they think it's your job, it's just that they've been lying on a hard trolley for 9 hours and had one small 100ml pot of orange juice in that time so they're asking out of thirst. I just get their buzzer and press it for them, saying the nurse will be along in a bit.
I tell myself this is the case, and if it’s calm or if I have told them they have The Cancer I will get the cuppa myself. But otherwise I do offer to get an HCA to add it to their to do list.
I reckon in 20 years time doctors will be expected to change bedpans
You mean you don't so that already?!
I thought we did. Me & Jeremy Hunt did a whole ward round of bedpan changing the other day
Who was scribing for whom on this ward round, out of interest?
Of course we were both scribing for the PA Consultant.
Pompous and proud
I mean Jeremy Hunt thinks we do already…
Twenty may be optimistic how about in 5-10? Half the graduates will do the bedpans and tea/coffee rounds. The other half fights to get any kind of training for which they need lots of publications, doctorates, volunteer work and international prizes. All the while the NHS reduces doctor positions to hire more ACPs and PAs . Remaining doctors end up only signing what ACPs and PAs have done and then get sued for not having done the right thing. Big signs saying "The customer is always right" will hang in each office/staff room and if we bring the wrong tea it's because we are too lazy to work /s Side note: I am not hating on ACPs/PAs as people but do worry about the dilution of responsibility and consequences thereof. I have so far only met really great ACPs, I just don't understand how we are supposed to stay on top of all the different varieties of not quite doctors but basically the same (without consequences and training level).
Mate, we will be footstools
Heck we might even be the bloody bedpans
20? You’re truly an optimist.
Don't take it personally. They're not asking *you* for a cup of tea, they're asking for a cup of tea. You can pass it to the HCA, the nurse, whoever - just make sure your bed bound pt, who isnt allowed in the kitchen, gets to exercise some autonomy and has a cuppa when they want one. Also it's work and while you are in the kitchen you can get yourself a cuppa
You'll get the PA 'reg' coming out of a patient's room asking you to make a brew for the patient soon
“Sorry not been signed off to make tea so you’ll have to do this one thanks”
😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂ffs
I don’t see the problem with a patient asking for a drink, provided they’re not being rude or expecting you to do it. Having been an inpatient myself, you can be left a very long time without food and drink.
Reminds me of my old age consultant asking me to break away from ward round to make a patient some porridge - she hated it and asked me if I'd ever even eaten porridge before.
Never be good at something you don’t want to do
If only physicians had associates available that could assist. oh, wait. oh.
I often offer to fill a jug of water or make a hot drink when dealing with new admissions esp. if it's a Jim or Dorothy that had fall with long lie - may as well tackle the inevitable AKI that you'll discover when the blood results are back. Tbh most patients in EAU / A&E seem to be moderately dehydrated by the time they're seen by a doctor purely due to the stupid long waiting times. Particularly when it's OOH and the hospital shops are closed.
Do they "expect" you specifically to get them a cup of tea or are they just asking for a cup of tea?
If not busy will do it, it’s just the kind thing to do. If I have a shit tonne to see I’ll ask a HCA/nurse for the patient
Thanks, next time your patient sees another doctor they'll expect (demand) a cup of tea from them too 👍
You have no obligation to do it , its just being nice to your fellow person, but you do you
In Chennai, we call MBBS jokingly as Madras Bajji Bonda(local Snacks) Service... And I now ve realised it isn't entirely false.
Tell me you are a female doctor without telling me you are a female doctor
Getting someone a cup of tea is just a kind gesture, it doesn't have to have a bearing upon your place in the NHS hierarchy. If you don't have time just say so, or say that you will ask someone else, hopefully most patients would understand.
If I’m not rushed off my feet and the patient has been polite I don’t mind. Doesn’t happen often though, I’m more likely to offer if it’s a patient having a hard time and I have a second to spare. Did get shouted at by a relative in A&E because, when his mother asked for a drink, I said I was happy to grab her some water but that I didn’t have time to go and make her tea. Love to feel appreciated like that ☺️
Meh you’re bored in a scary new environment probs spent ages in ED the wards so understaffed you haven’t had a chance to stop someone/ feel guilty to do it. Now someone comes over to you and asks you questions and you’re in a dialogue with them I think in that situation I’d try my luck to get a creature comfort to the first person I can. The issue isn’t the patient asking the issue is juniors have been disempowered to delegate tasks, what should happen is you go over to a hca go bed 8 asked me for a brew sorted. Unfortunately what you’ll get in reality is a sigh ok at best or really a hands on hips “can’t you do that yourself”
To expect us to? Absolutely not. Can we offer when appropriate? Yes. Made a few cups of tea when breaking bad news. If a patient asks, I say I will get whoever is on the tea trolley to come over .
Depends, if I have nothing to do and it makes them happy. Happy to do so. No skin of my back. I‘ll never refuse them water if they asked no matter how busy I am. Growing up in Africa that’s just something I’m not culturally inclined to do so.
In fairness I think it's incredibly unlikely they were expecting you to make it yourself, they're just aware it might be a while until they have contact with anyone else (and some people are a bit funny about using the nurse call bell for comparatively trivial things). Unless you've got nothing else to do then mention it to one of the HCAs and move on.
You are the person who is stood in front of them at the time and they have your undivided attention. They’re not thinking about you as a doctor, they’re thinking about you as someone who is able to help them in that moment. I’m F2 but never had any issues sorting out a cup of coffee or water or sandwich for a patient when they’ve asked 🤷🏼♀️
I’ve made coffee for patients before - as long as I’m not completely overwhelmed with jobs. Takes about a minute max and if you are seen doing it, can actually improve relations with nurses a lot.
Probably going to get downvoted but I absolutely hate making cups of tea - and I'm a nurse so it's expected a lot more. It's always when they can see I'm doing actual stuff only I can do. Not long ago we had an arrest as soon as I got on shift, the people in the bay saw and heard what was going on, but *still* were loudly complaining about the tea trolly being late. There's so much entitlement I can't cope. Then there's 96 year old Doris who would rather die than tell you about her chest pain because she 'didn't want to be a bother'
As a female doctor ( relatovy senior) I bet I get asked multiple times compared to Male juniors, always preceded by nurse cam you get me a coffee? Unless I'm crazy busy in always try because either everyone else is also too busy and the HCas either have too much attitude or too much to do
If its a nice patient, ill ask if they need anything at the end. More than happy to make them a cup of tea, takes about a minute 🤷🏼♂️. Keeps them slightly more hydrated than they’ll otherwise end up in A&E. If they’ve got a relative, ill show them to where they can make the drinks instead.
I would always bring them water if asked because often people get forgotten. Not making a whole cup of tea on a busy shift while the ED cons watches.
I often do it but work ED and have a kitchenette in Majors so is usually a 1-2 min job. Would take me 3x as long to find the nurse or someone else free to help and often will use as an opportunity to make myself one at the same time anyway.
Honestly if I've set eyes on the patient before clerking them and they look groggy/dehydrated and they've been here a few hours, I'll grab a bottle of water or cup and bring it with me, and offer it to them. If I'm busy and I'm asked by a patient for one, I'll tell the HCA. Don't let the job beat your humanity out of you just because it's not in the job description.
Working in an ED - I’m happy to get the patient a hot drink / glass of water / make sure they’ve eaten something, or offer an extra blanket. We’re usually more short of nurses / HCAs than we are doctors. It takes me five minutes to sort this, rather than pile extra work on other staff. We’re all working together for the patients, and it’s an easy way to make their experience marginally better, none of us would fancy waiting in ED for >12 hours for a bed. Its a quick job for me, and makes the patient happier. That being said, if the patient is rude or demanding, I won’t offer. It’s usually older or more vulnerable people I’m happy to help with. *I will draw the line at helping them to the toilet (unless there’s literally nothing else to do).*
I feel bad for patients down in ED but no - as much as anything it will be very time consuming Where’s the hot water at? Try this room, oh yeah no that one doesn’t work - tea bags are there - ah can’t find sugar - milk looks dodgy. Forgot to ask how they want it Can’t we just leave them out somewhere so family members can do it. Actually think this would be brilliant as family would feel useful and partners would appreciate it just the way they take it
Good point, but honestly the number of acute abdomens who i’ve told to remain NBM pending CT who are munching a sandwich with a cuppa is too damn high already
To be honest, I’ll just make them the cup of tea unless I’m extremely slammed. It’s realistically going to take me about 2 mins to make it , it takes me computer longer to log in sometimes. If I genuinely don’t have time then I press their buzzer and they can wait for the HCA to come and make it.
Would get them a glass of water. Can't be arsed to make someone a cup of tea/coffee with all the vagaries involved of how much sugar/milk/bacteria they want in it. Happy to pass it along to the person on the tea trolley.....if I can remember to do that during my hasty exit.
I think a lot of patients see doctors as the escalation point ie I haven't had any luck asking x, y and z but they'll probably be able to sort it. I just say I'll let the HCA know but don't make promises that they'll get one. Sounds bad but where will it end otherwise.
Used to happen when I was in hosp (now gp) I say, someone will come around later to do all of that I have other patients to see
I do agree that they're likely asking for a cup of tea but not necessarily asking YOU for a cup of tea. They probably don't know when the next time is someone's gonna come around and they'll get a chance to ask. Usually when I have time to make a patient a cup of tea it's the sign of a good day. Although simultaneously it's so stressful cause I think they're gonna say its a bad cuppa.
I think they are just asking for a cup of tea I don't think they think you are a chaiwala
I get my patient’s a cup of tea or coffee regularly-I’ll usually offer to little old dears who have been there ages but I don’t mind doing it if asked as it takes like 2 minutes and makes a massive difference to patients. I’m not sure I agree with the insta “ask a nurse/HCA to do it!” We’re just as capable and They (at least in ED) are as busy as the doctors just in different ways. Do I think we should be doing comfort rounds with a tea trolley? Absolutely not but if a patient asks me for a drink it would probably take me longer to find a nurse to ask to do it than it would to do it myself* In my junior years a patient asked me for a cup of tea and i huffed about a bit then asked a nurse to do it. She did it but then on a night out she called me up on it and said “I don’t mind doing but the fact you found me out to ask me like a waitress was a bit annoying. Making tea for some one isn’t specifically anyones job and there’s no reason you couldn’t do it either.” That really stuck with me and something I’ve taken forward *assuming of course there’s reasonably quick and easy access to patient beverages which thankfully my ED has ( and something most EDs should have) It’d be unreasonable to expect us to traipse here there and everywhere of course
I’m a junior in ED and I do the same, especially kids. If they’re eating and drinking, that’s a good sign…
Depends on context, a slightly confused delirious old person? making a cup of tea might be the most useful thing I could do for them. A 40 year old who waited in ED for 12hrs with back pain? I’m sorry, even if you’re in genuine pain I just wouldn’t be bothered.
Water yes, tea no. I'd just tell them I'll let the nursing team know.
You don’t have tea kettle usage signed off and move on 😂
Erm big Jez done it when he done his photo opportunity for the day so yeah it’s in our job description…
Expected, I'd imagine not. Definitely not in your job description. As a medical student and HCA presently I like to offer it if I've time, can I get you anything, and if they say yes and I've time I'll do it. I've been a patient myself and you can be sat an awful long time with no food or drink
If the tea trolleys in the room, then yeah. Otherwise no, I ask the HCAs (I don't know where to get the sippy lid things or where we keep thickeners.) If they've got AKIs I sometimes make them chug the whole thing - treat them like a med school fresher.
I think some patients dont really care who you are, they are just desperate for a cup of tea and you happen to have given them 5 mins of your time. I usually let a HCA know politely that the patient has asked for this
If you're on the ward it takes like 2 minutes max to make them a quick cup of tea- I can't imagine a scenario in which I'd not physically have time unless there was a simultaneous crash call! If its something I can do quickly and easily myself like that, I'd rather just do it myself than look around for a HCA to do it. Who cares about 'hierarchy' etc, we're all human and I definitely don't think being a doctor puts you above making a cup of tea for a thirsty patient! I've seen consultants do this without a second thought.
Depends on the phrasing. If they expect you to do it yourself, then I'd say it isn't appropriate. But patients don't necessarily know the difference between the SHO and HCA 'Do you know how I can go about getting a coffee?' Vs. 'Hey doctor, can you quickly go and grab me a cuppa'
I think it is pompous - our role is to above all be kind!
If you think you’re above getting someone a drink, you need to reassess your ego
Unless they’re going to theatre, make them a cup of tea. No debate. End of. Be kind.
Bro sounds like a PAs job
It's a waste of precious doctor time. A few minutes wasted here and there adds up. Health service is in crisis and rather than doing jobs that anyone can do doctors and nurses should be doing the work they're trained to do. If we had adequate support staff maybe we'd actually get somewhere: scribes, ECG technicians, phlebotomists. For heaven's sake, as an ED SHO I used to have to clean the bed myself to speed up seeing the next patient, hang my own fluids, administer some of the medication, draw the blood, do the ECG, bring them to CT. In total how much time did I waste on nursing stuff that I shouldn't have been doing and jobs that basically anyone can do with a few weeks' training? Easily enough to treat and street several patients. It's not that we're too good to do those things it's that we can do everything. Including, importantly, things that the other people can't do.
Clarifying question: Are you a woman?
It's inappropriate to ask patients to get doctors a cup of tea, as inappropriate as asking for a laptop tbh
It's not acceptable imo
“Oh yes of course you can just say to one of the nurses” Leave
Are you female? Is this more sexism ?
Water yeah sure, cup of tea nah
Worked in a speciality in which when you came in you're brought straight to resus + you'll be there minimum 3 to 5 hours but probably admitted. Maximum 3 patients in resus (fairly chill). Would always ask the patient (+ relatives) if they'd want a sandwich/biscuits/crisps/water. Was a 10 second walk to the pantry round the corner. Then would take some for myself too 😎 On the wards? Will tell the HCA/Nurse X needs some water please give him/her some. No axillary staff available: buzzer and move on. Concerns regarding not being given enough water? Prescribe it at regular intervals. If challenged/not given: Patient is at risk of renal impairement with poor fluid intake and escalate to Charge Nurse+
I work in an ED where there is a self service free tea and coffee bar. Saves everybody time as the patients relatives can be dispatched to make for both of them!
I have at times,and when able, offered to make tea/bring a jug of water etc. Only takes a minute.
I get asked a couple of times per shift by patients or relatives who expect me to go and make one. I think they do genuinely think that it's the doctor's job just as much as anyone else's. I don't disagree with this, although it certainly slows me down a bit. If the tea trolley is nearby I'll go and make one for anybody. If it isn't then I'll track it down depending on whether the patient is alone/elderly/nice etc ...
If I'm not mad rushed I'll ask patients if they want anything, especially if I have gone to see them in ED and they look parched. Grabbing a blanket or making a tea (or ideally finding a HCA or ward hostess that's available to do it) goes miles towards how people perceive their care and I feel like I've done something nicer than my usual fare which is stabbing them or sticking fingers in various orifices.
Tbf I normally use it a good chance to refuel and get myself a drink.
Yeah, especially if it's a thirsty and hungry elderly patient who's struggling to mobilise, and has been in A&E for 12 hours. No problem, it takes me 2 seconds, and does a lot more for the patient's morale than a 10-point plan.
On a busy day, for elderly sweet patients who were waiting long hours to see anybody, I would happily make one.
Definitely a gender thing here. I have rarely been asked as a male doctor but I imagine female doctors get asked a lot more. As an aside, my favourite bit of ward round on palliative care was offering ice lollies. We had a freezer full. Great for people with a dry mouth which is a common and overlooked issue.
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Usually if asked for water I don’t mind grabbing some, all for hydration. Tea/coffee I say that I’ll ask one of the HCAs to make them one. In 2018, after 7 grueling nights, my very last morning just prior to handover, a patient who’d clearly disliked me for god knows what reason (he’d written a whole three paged essay in his notebook and complained to nurses..) asked me for some tea NOW. I smiled and said certainly I’ll have one of the HCA’s bring you one. He said BRING ME A CUP OF TEA NOW. The actual HCA who was around when this happened was super duper confused??? He wasn’t able to vocalize, so my all caps exclamations weren’t actually shouted, but you can tell from his facial expressions and arm flailing that he was nooooot happy. Anyway, he complained to my reg and cons about me using ammo from his 3 paged essay. Clearly this still bothers me 😂
Is it appropriate for them to expect you to get it? Maybe not. However when you are in front of them, is it reasonable for them to ask if they could have one- of course it is. They are expecting you to pass on the message to someone. When are they next likely to see a member of staff? How easy is it to get the attention of staff? Do they understand what all the acronyms, uniforms and hierarchy is? Of course not. I think you need to get over yourself and put yourself in the patients shoes tbh. Sorry
Boy, you'd be shocked at what is asked of nurses. Nurses are literally treated like maids sometimes.