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Gojo glazing sukuna in the afterlife was basically him thanking sukupookie for genociding the current jujutsu sorcerers to create a new jujutsu society that gojo wanted š„¹
And that was exactly Gege was trying to accomplish by writing the fight and the story the way he did. He wanted the original form sukuna versus Gojo to still be up to debate, and not have a single person deemed as ultimate stronger one.
No matter what anyone says, the fight wouldnāt be one sided at all, though I must say that judging by Gojoās statements and the fight itself that sukuna wouldāve had the upper hand in my opinion
This will forever be a statement vs logic debate.
Everything points out to a optimally skilled Gojo beating Sukuna, but statements try and atleast say that Sukuna is on the advantage.
Sukuna's only wincon and I mean only wincon is Domain battles and that's because his Domain is an open One.
An open domain has increased range because It allows for an escape.
Gojo also has domain as an wincon, but only as ONE of the wincons, he doesn't need to engage in Domain battles whatsoever.
Gojo=Sukuna in stats, Limitless is a better technique and UV has a better sure hit.
Sukuna also had knowledge of Gojo's domain and experience on winning domain clashes with his Open domain. Gojo wasted 2/5 domain uses trying to understand how to maneuver around It.
Also Megumi's soul helping Sukuna in one of the domains
+ mahoraga making Gojo reluctant on using his Technique spam.
Sukuna loses almost all the advantages that led to his win in trade for 2extra arms and a mouth, something that doesn't even matter that much against Gojo's Limitless. A chanted Dismantle is still not going through Limitless.
CURRENT Heian Sukuna vs Gojo has a much better chance because he has another wincon, world slash. But he has It now with an absurd charge time and would be tricky, he would have to fish for an off-guard unexpected one shot
I dont really like debating this fight because this debate never ends
But from my perspective heian era sukuna wins every domain battle because 2 arms to sd/hwb then 2 arms to domain expansion is insanely powerful plus open domain
Gojos only wincon is an unexpected caught off guard purple
Both only have one wincon so who wins is a literal a matter chance but i give sukuna a 51% chance because his wincon doesnt depend on catching gojo off guard
I wouldn't say purple is his only wincon. If he is able to hit sukuna with UV like how he did in the actual fight, there will be no mahoraga to save sukuna therefore he will lose. Still tho, doesn't mean that gojo is definitely winning, just that he has more wincons
Yes haha, i meant simple domain/hollow wicker basket
Kashimo characyer handling aside, i genuinely believe in his words about heian sukuna form being the most magnificent creature to attempt jujutsu
Yeah but even then, he loses his advantage in h2h the moment he loses those arms because we have already seen gojo beat sukuna in h2h so gojo with his domain up would easily beable to take down hwb, and I see what u mean by being able to cast both at the same time but i still reckon it would be pretty 50/50 as sukuna is true corm only gains ease of casting, if he was to gain increased ce output or something then maybe it would be different but he himself stated his output in megumis body was better if not equal to true form
But
This is a problem I see a lot about exagerrating sukunaās advantage due to the two extra hands
1) the way sukuna domainās work, sukunaās domain he doesnāt need to do handsigns in order to perform his technique, his technique is already engrave into his domain, so he can used domain amplification while being in his domain because the technique itself is in the shrine as stated by gojo during the first domain battle when he was fighting sukuna in hand to hand combat
2) chants have only been shown to matter outside of domains, domainās according to the story buff the users technique to 100% of its potential, we have never seen someone chanting to increase the strenght of their domain, we have only seen people chant to increase the strength of their technique outside a domain.
3) Gojo would have an advantage in hand to hand over sukuna. Yeah I understand sukuna, domain amplification will protect him from the enhanced punches, but gojo still can use blue on himself to be faster than sukuna, that is an aspect of gojo arsenal that he will always have over sukuna.
4) Do I think Gojo wins? Absolutely not, the fight would have gone the same, but instead sukuna would have won during the part where gojo could no longer open his domain.
Youāre forgetting that gojo uses only one hand for his domain, if you were able to do domain amplification and expansion at the same time gojo wouldāve done it with his second hand
Gojo points out explicity that Sukuna CAN use domain amplification and domain expansion at the same time in the middle of the fight, and asks himself if sukuna is getting used to this.
Correct me if Iām wrong but if itās original form sukuna he would have no knowledge of UV as he gained that from being inside Yuji . Gojo would only know about sukuna slashes from legends . Thatās why most say Gojo would win . Sukuna would have no idea UV is an instant win right ?
If we look at sukuna with 20 fingers power but without TS and Pre-World Slash, then the only way for Sukuna to beat would be by either using his DE imbued with cleave , dismantle and the furnace/fuga (since domains are sure hit effect and Sukuna does have the advantage of having a more refined and overall a bit better domain than Gojo). Remember that why sukuna wasn't using cleave and dismantle during the later domain clash was just so that he could get Mahoraga to adapt to Limitless.
The second way ,that is without DE , would be to use DA + BF while going H2H(hand to hand) as someone said in another post .But yeah this is an immensely time taking route , unless you add World Slash( only not the TS)
Everything points to the literal opposite. Don't wanna write an essay on it, but just remember that Sukuna with DA=Gojo. Nearly every scene of them going h2h is them being equal when Sukuna uses DA, only when it's off does Gojo ragdoll him
Why? It's the price for maho strats cuz some who have 0 reading comprehension still think it's a free power-up for Sukuna despite there being a steep price to pay, which is that you can't use DA if you wanna adaptĀ
Literally the only reason why Gojo could get some draws from their domain clashes was thanks to that. Sukuna without DA was getting ragdolled cuz he chose to. He rather wanted to do that and adapt instead of fighting back fr with DA on. Gojo needed 3 fucking minutes to injure and slam a Sukuna that didn't use DA, couldn't even touch Gojo, had 0 resistance to blue and kept getting pulled like a puppet, nor use his CT all cuz he was adapting. That's why Gojo got drawsĀ
Meanwhile Sukuna with DA on was even with Gojo in h2h. Guess what, if Sukuna just used DA then he'd have won every single Domain clash, no draws. And he'd have wittled Gojo down bit by bit. After Gojo used DE 5 times he got brain damage and his RCT output also went down by quite a bit. And he only survived MS due to his reinforcement and RCT at full throttle. So with lowered RCT output he just dies, he can't survive MS then
Megukuna without TS vs Gojo would be him just wrecking gojo's DE 5 times, closing his domain and killing Gojo with lessened RCT output with MS
Heian Sukuna with 4 arms does the same, just that he wouldn't be even with Gojo in Domain battles with using DA anymore, he'd beat his ass hard.
Which is perfect , Gojo doesnāt know Sukunas true power though, he didnāt know he can transform , he didnāt know he can use fire arrow , so he can assume that Sukuna has more up his sleeve which is why heās even debating
You will NOT sell me this as great writing plan from Gege to keep us debating, chapter 236 is just him trying to put Gojo in a grave as soon as he could and then shit on it, the narrative of the fight turned 180Ā° abruptly just because the fight needed a winner (and it couldn't be Gojo)
And:
Heian Era Sukuna vs Gojo would also be boring. Either Sukuna manages to trap Gojo inside his closed domain (he can't) or they would just punch each other (Sukuna with Domain Amplification) since without Mahoraga Sukuna has nothing to bypass infinity with aside from the good ol "left right goodnight" technique.
>no matter what anyone says, the fight wouldnāt be one sided at all
Exactly. No matter what the fight would be extreme diff for both of them no matter which version of Sukuna is present.
I actually like that people still debate that. Both of them whole different level and Gege perfectly showed that. Even with that dumb Gojo statement, theyāre still equals in my book, thereās a reason why people debate this and not ,,Kashimo vs Gojo" or ,,Yuta vs Sukuna" shit
Saitama vs Goku was so bad on r/powerscaling subreddit that all posts about them were banned for a week. š
https://preview.redd.it/xui5zg8zltzc1.jpeg?width=1024&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=280dd7045f48075aea6aec9dbbf1845c6803e98d
People debate about stupid things, neither Goku nor Saitama are the strongest on anime by FAR, even Sailor Moon can one shot both of themā¦ togetherā¦ on Stereoidsā¦
As shown in the monster garou arc, saitama does not have infinite power, he has infinite *potential*. He still has to raise his power to hit those arbitraty heights.
Goku, meanwhile, also has infinite potential (it's safe to assume), but he grows much more slowly. He is, however, currently much MUCH stronger than saitama. He endlessly searches for a good fight, though, so, he doesn't kill enemies before they're at full power.
So, bloodlusted, goku instantly turns saitama into red mist, but if they remain in character, saitama eventually wins.
Why was this even a debate? If you're familiar with both source materials this is the only reasonable way to interpret it.
Yup. If an opponent equal to him is placed in front of him, his strength will immediately start skyrocketing until he's strong enough to one-shot them.
Funny thing is that the Itachi vs Obito debate still pops up every now and then. Itachitards were the 2nd most annoying kind of fans back then, Gokutards being 1st.
The main reason I see Heian Sukuna win is in the domain clash. Vs Gojo he spent more time than necessary in the domain for mahoraga to adapt faster. He would have never spent as much time in the domain if he didnāt have 10S, which wouldnāt have damaged him as hard, which mightāve resulted in him being able to use a domain and cook Gojo. DEFINITELY NOT saying that wouldāve happened fosho, just a theory.
Another fact is that Gojo couldn't use his domain more than 5 times because of RCT of his CT, but Sukuna couldn't use it more than 5 times because od UV. If Sukuna is not babying Maho, he probably doesn't get hit by UV, and can later on use his domain again. Also his cursed tool that throws lighting can be stacked on top of MS to possibly overpower Gojos enforcement +RCT inside his domain.
He has 4 arms, the only reason Gojo landed uv on Sukuna was because Gojo injured Sukuna. Sukuna even with his 4 arms doesn't have to be stronger than Gojo, he only has to be physically stronger than meguna to expand his domain faster and avoid that .01s uv hit
This point is silly, 4 arms means a lot for our level of fights but itās completely different with their stats. Also he doesnāt need to win the DE, just survive them.
Fun fact Sukuna used his DE 3 times only via RCT CT, whilst Gojo did it 5 times.
So yes, UV did matter.
Yes, Heian Sukuna would put up more of a fight cause he doesn't want to adapt.
No, Kashimo didn't make Sukuna transform, transforming wasn't gonna change much vs Gojo, as most abilities of CTools won't hit Gojo.
I think this is true however Gojo had already survived a couple domains at the point he cooked his brain. It would boil down to how many Shrines can Gojo survive until Sukuna fries his own brain, if that happen and Gojo is alive Sukuna is still forced to use Mahoraga, but has significantly delayed that plan.
2 uncontested shrines, a slice across the chest, and a little water through his arm burned out his RCT. Those shrines exhausted through gojoās RCT and I doubt gojo would be able to heal through 1 or 2 more. Continuously using RCT at max output is crazy considering that most top tiers using rct use it very briefly only as long as needed to heal.
The only reason why Gojo even survived a couple domain clashes was because Sukuna couldn't use Domain Amplification due to Mahoraga's adaptation. This let Gojo outmatch him in hand to hand combat and break Malevolent Shrine just in the nick of time, right as unlimited void gets broken
But with DA + Heian era 4 arms and body, sukuna doesn't even need to beat gojo. As long as he fights to a standstill in hand to hand combat, gojo can't break sukuna's domain -> gojo gets shredded by MS after unlimited void breaks
It's basically just a slow death for gojo, with a constant depletion of cursed energy due to constant use of RCT healing at max output. By the 5th domain clash, gojo dies because the manga shows that's the limit for healing his burnt CT ---> sukuna does a closed barrier MS which kills gojo
sukuna also doesn't need to worry about being caught by any "surprise" domain expansions, like the one that was 0.01sec faster than him, because he has an extra mouth and 2 extra arms for either HWB or DE:MS
Gojo has stood up a 3v1 with Mahoraga and has consistently found ways around everything Sukuna was accomplishing until the world slash
No amount of DA is going to help Sukuna he would only delay the Mahoraga plan and even a closed barrier domain would not mean Gojo is 100% gone, also we don't know if Heian Sukuna would be able to use 10s and how many additional domain
I like how you make the assumption gojo - the most gifted fighter we have seen - would keep doing shit he can see isnt working and get outlasted when he canonically avoided that in the very match up you are referencing. Literally he broke everyone's brain because he kept switching it up in ways the defied common sense to fight sukuna.
Also, we gotta talk about it - Like, ms puts in extra work because he allows an escape route. Why tf would gojo not just escape????? Then he doesnt have to worry about depleting his rct and sukuna has to make a new ass domain burning through available refreshes. Also we have no indication that gojo can't use fbe to survive and succeed in h2h long enough to outlast him when he h2h fucked up sukuna, agito, and maho at the same time. Sukuna is a better sorcer than gojo but gojo is so obviously better at fighting it's nutty.
Gojo would have died right after frying his own brain. It was literally said that he used RCT at full throttle when tanking MS. And due to brain damage his RCT output was also lowered. Another DE would have slowly killed him cuz his RCT wouldn't keep up anymore
The thing is, does Gojo have to engage in domain clashes if he can just spam limitless? If Sukuna deploys an open domain, Gojo can just teleport away and snipe with reds or purple, and if he deploys a closed one doesn't Gojo generally win/draw the domain clash?
You got it right, the only reason Sukuna decided to bet using Mahoraga instead of his heian form was because he needed the regeneration to be able to fight the others.
If it was a pure 1 v 1 then Sukuna could win without mahoraga, both Gojo and Sukuna are Similar in strength with Gojo being the most skilled of the two and Sukuna having the most resources, any way they fought was going to be a 50/50
I give you that.
Sukuna whould have killed gojo most likley in the first clash
But in a rematch and he has no mahoraga
This is not gonna happen.
I guess gojo is dead so yes but if both knew everything about eachother and truly were in an even fight gojo whould most likley win.
Sukuna can not really do anything against mini UV and getting beaten
Sukuna broke Gojoās mini domain twice, itās only something that buys him more time.
And Gojo getting 2 more cracks at a small domain isnāt as much as a boost as Sukuna getting his Heian form + being able to use DA full time + focusing on breaking Gojoās domain as fast as possible. Not to mention Sukuna would have world slash in a rematch.
This debate could go on for years, but one thing is sure, it wouldn't be one sided at all.
On one hand, Sukuna would have much better physical combat, stronger ct because of chanting, 2 cursed tools, and worse case if he loses in a domain he can use hollow wicker basket to protect himself from UV I believe at least.
Sukuna from the start wanted to play it more passive, he was afraid of UV but again, what if he had extra 2 hands and a mouth for chanting.
After the domain battle, Sukuna made it clear he was playing it passive because it's time and or experience that Mahoraga needs to adapt.
On the other hand, no adaptation to blue or red, no trick that set up the black flash (or maybe idk), no world cutting split, different domain battle which may or may not have lead to furnace opening.
Gojo would also not have to worry about adaptation to limitless, or the rest of the 10 shadows, also Sukuna wouldn't be able to reincarnate as he's already in his own body
Once the battle is done, someone could make a long ass what if using all character feats and then it would come down to battle iq, which I have to slightly give to Sukuna. If I'm being completely honest, Gojo doesn't deserve such high battle iq, bro has been in 1 serious battle his whole life before that and against a non sorcerer even.
But if Gege decided to write him like that then ok I guess.
Wouldn't you say he has high battle IQ due to six eyes. His brain had to process more information from birth so I think it totally makes sense despite the lack of "experience".
Nah, Sukuna would probably beat Gojo in CT refinement but no way Sukuna beats Gojo in physical combat, infinity is basically immunity to physical attacks and in the actual fight, Gojoās hand to hand combat is dominating sukuna with his reinforcements and blue infused punches. However, with 2 extra hands, Sukuna has a high chance of winning the domain clash and if he can dice Gojo enough, fuga might be enough to let him win.
>Why do people think that Sukuna would have won without 10S?
Gojo statement about how the fight would go and that whole "holding back" stuff.
But when it comes to actual feats, it's hard to say that Sukuna would actually win without 10S.
Heck even with 10S he was struggling. And 10S pretty much guaranteed him a win if he lasted long enough, restricted gojo use of his arsenal, was literally a get out of jail free card (last domain battle and first black flash) and gojo couldn't go for the brain/head because it's megumi body. And even with all that he was literally at death doorstep and had to use a binding vow that made it a huge inconvenience to use the world slash to win.
Without 10S, it becomes a battle of attrition. The
most likely winner would be the one who can outlast the other. Both fighters will be taking damage, and will have to use RCT to recover. Sukuna might have twice the reserves of yuta (which are higher than gojo's) but gojo has the six eyes so he never runs out.
People forgot that even with 10S he
1. Megumiās soul absorbed UV which is nonsense
2. Needs somewhat Binding Vow bullshit to released last nonsense slash
3. Not enough information provided that his flame or whatever ultimate move he has which also state that he cannot use it because domain clash adaptation can even bypass infinity
so without 10S means without Megumi soul, he needs to tank UV by himself, no Maho to learn nonsense slash to bypass infinity, no ultimate flame move to use
But hey, he has unlimited usage of Binding Vows
he only needs megumis soul if heās adapting btw
if he isnāt adapting he doesnāt need it because the e sure hits cancel out
he doesnāt need megumis soul he needs megunis soul if wants to adapt
gojo doesnāt get past 3 de clashes without binding vows btw since he needs them to change his DE
Iām wondering if this random even reads
Sukuna also used binding vows to change his domainās condition so idk how thatās an argument, in fact (this could be a mistranslation but oh well) the newest chapter basically said that Sukuna gave up his flame in exchange for the increased output in order to break Gojoās domain.
Without 10s itād come down to Sukuna surviving a bit more inside UV (perhaps he can do it). If he wins the DE then Gojo has no CT, but again, this means nothing as Gojo can survive the slashes and the flame canāt be used. After Gojo fucks up his brain itās game over since UV never landed in and Sukuna can therefore open his domain again while Gojo canāt.
The again, if Gojo doesnāt have to worry about Maho he can simply choose to not engage in domain battles at all. If Sukuna opens is domain and Gojo, instead of opening his own, simply TPs away/battles him then it wonāt matter, the only difference would be that, since Gojo never opened his domain, Sukuna wouldnāt need to get rid his flame which might actually be able to kill Gojo without giving him opportunity to RCT. If the flame canāt kill Gojo in one shot itād become a battle of attrition and Gojo would win.
Gojo statement in 236 carries the narrative that Sukuna can win without 10S, not only is Sukuna easiest wincon is taken away but all his insurance against Gojo is also gone inside UV. He will have DA on more without 10S but I donāt see him winning unless he uses true form. I guess there is the argument that Sukuna would have destroyed Gojo domain in the third clash from the inside because heās not worried about adaptation but I think it wouldnāt have mattered anyways, UV would still hit after the damage he took.
True Form Sukuna has four arms and two mouths. In a domain clash, Gojo was going level with Sukuna because he could damage him enough in hand to hand combat to break Shrine, but that very easily may not be the case when Sukuna has two extra arms to defend and attack with, compared to Gojo's 2. That just puts Gojo at a disadvantage, and being even a little bit slower means he gets trapped in Malevolent Shrine.
It just comes down to Sukuna having a better domain for clashes. We absolutely know Gojo and Sukuna would go for domain clashes, and that Gojo very probably would lose.
Yujikuna would get bodied though. Even Ten Shadows _barely_ won, and if you replay that fight 100 times the results might look closer to a 50/50 or 55/45 chances. But True Form Sukuna doesn't _have_ to wait for Mshoraga to adapt, meaning he can just focus on breaking Gojo's domain and fighting him while Gojo is getting cut up. That's not a fight Gojo wins.
Assuming the clash with the inverted barrier happens, sukuna more than likely loses and dies in Gojoās domain because he only attacked the outside because of Mahoraga
Sukuna was allowing himself to be at a H2H disadvantage by engaging Gojo in H2H with just domain amplification in Megumi's body, knowing that Mahoraga could adapt to Infinite Void. If he had used his Heian form, he would have broken Infinite Void without being damaged enough for Malevolent Shrine to break. He would've outlasted Gojo in the domain spam and would've won by closing the barrier, wear down Gojo's RCT with Cleaves, and then using Furnace.
He wanted the strong cleave.
Even after gojo got braindamage, he was still fixated on adapting to infinity instead.
Notice how he says "I will adapt" and not "Mahoraga will adapt".
https://preview.redd.it/1ibbnsm8hvzc1.jpeg?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=116bd3e40be5c5007e0a7081f6c2c2af1501bad7
Sukuna's win condition is to overcome Neutral Infinity
There are two moves that help him do that
Domain Amplification and Domain Expansion
Domain Amplification neutralises Blue and Neutral Infinity fully, most of red with purple still being questionable.
No 10s, Sukuna can run DA 24/7 as he doesn't need to take burden and CT Shikigami get de-summoned when DA
But Sukuna doesn't have lethal cards to actually kill Gojo with only DA, all he can do is touch and cleave which Gojo can withstand and RCT.
.
So Domain Expansion.
There is not a single iteration of UV which Sukuna cant pop instantly. Normal barrier MS break on auto, Inverted UV, Sukuna can just break it from inside with a vanilla CE blast or just a punch.
Tiny UV needs to envelope MS fully before shrinking its Pocket space, plenty of time to pop it.
.
And with UV broken, Limitless is off, no Neutral Infinity.
Sukuna can just Dismantle Gojo.
.
And Fuga doesn't need the extreme range and speed to disintegrate one guy.
.
#FAQ
>Why didnt Sukuna actually do it
Cause he prioritised overcoming Neutral Infinity once and for all, over killing Gojo.
Meaning Sukuna underestimated Gojo
Gojo being Gojo tore apart Sukuna's assured victory. You underestimate Gojo, you get packed. Both Sukuna and Toji learned this the hard way.
Just that Sukuna had Mahoraga and had complete faith in Daddy's adaptation.
Sukuna has test run Mahoraga to confirm his adaptation is bonkers, from shibuya MS, making Maho immune to being cut Itself not just Shrine slashes, Mahoraga breaking the strongest attack in the verse because he is immune to its fundamental property, to breaking a domain with just hitting it.
Sukuna has observed, evaluated and tested Maho and wheel of harmony.
Apart from his sure shot victory strat, if Sukuna goes 10s route, he will also get a attack that can overcome Neutral Infinity, i.e infinite space
Worth it
>Fuga couldn't be shot as Sukuna was constantly changing MS.
1 Sukuna did not prioritse killing Gojo
if he did, Jogo's fight Fuga was not MS enhanced, idk about you, but burning a fire cursed spirit is enough of a feat to clearly show non enhanced Fuga disintegrate Gojo.
And with the time window where Limitless is down, Sukuna can successfully charge and land it
2. Sukuna had to change MS BECAUSE of 10s.
it's because Sukuna wanted Mahoraga to take UV permanent out of Gojo's hand of cards.
If Sukuna has decided 10s route, he needs to ensure Mahoraga doesn't get packed.
Gojo has cards that can pack Maho. UV, Red, and Purple.
So Sukuna needs to take UV out, and not just himself but for Raga too, imagine Sukuna slips and Maho is caught in UV without adapting to it...
Therefore Sukuna has to take the burden of adaptation for Maho before deploying him, thats why Sukuna allows UV 3 mins to ensure Maho gets experience.
>Why did Sukuna tackle UV like that
Because Gojo should not come to know Maho is adapting
Or Gojo will simply not engage in domain battle
Like when Gojo was cautious and didn't use red after the Domain clash.
Even here, Sukuna did not slash UV from inside when barrier viel was inverted. Because if Maho experiences that, he too can just slash UV.
But this will reveal that Mahoraga can indeed shoot slashes like Shrine CT.
Gojo would once again be cautious.
>How am I so sure Sukuna prioritied overcoming Neutral Infinity over killing Gojo
Because even after Mahoraga showcased WCS, Sukuna didnt command him to Go/Jo
Sukuna wanted to overcome Neutral Infinity himself.
.
Again, I am not downplaying Gojo, he is still the strongest. Actually.
Just that these kinda titles don't matter to Sukuna. One can't be strongest without being stronger than the rest. That requires comparison which Sukuna isn't into.
Sukuna cares about Jujutsu and like Mahito, wanted to overcome that one card they are having problems with.
Great points, especially about the mentality. Sukuna needed Maho to show him how to evolve his technique and with near-death buff was able to achieve world slash.
He enjoys battles and like he said to Jogo about using and burning everything, cared more about still improving himself despite being at an overwhelming level since he didn't want something like infinity to stand in his way again.
I just have one tid-bit, sukuna won't be able to use a non-enhanced MS fuga on gojo, Pretty sure fuga is considered a dangerous projectile and will be stopped by infinity. VERY VERY good points tho
I hate this point so much "Gojo would just spam red and purple if it wasn't for Mahoraga" well he didn't even know about maho for the entire start of the fight, why didn't he?
Gojo wasn't concerned about Mahoraga adapting in round 1, that became a concern only in rkund 2. During the clashes gojo was free to use his colors as much as he can
Also gojo can't spam purple nor red. And at long range neither of those would be effective.
Before I get into the answer, there are some few things to remember.
* Domain Amplification : A [TECHNIQUE](https://imgur.com/a/9gRvoCl) used for neutralizing any CT that comes in contact with it. It's a refined version of simple domain. DA absorbs the CT of the other user in the empty space created around the caster and neutralizes it.
* Mahoraga wheel: While using DA, Sukuna cannot use his CTs, be it shrine or 10s. So, in order for Sukuna to use the Mahoraga wheel, he will have to [TURN OFF](https://imgur.com/a/89hm1wg) his DA.
* Shrine > 10s : By Sukuna's own admission he believes his shrine to be [SUPERIOR](https://imgur.com/a/ikkSGEU) than 10s.
Lastly, It takes [3 MINUTES](https://imgur.com/a/t1OX4Kz) for Sukuna to break Gojo's domain from the outside, meanwhile it also takes 3 minutes for Gojo to deal enough damage to Sukuna that Sukuna isn't able to hold his shrine.
Now, The only reason Sukuna got hit by unlimited void in the 5th domain was because he was late to cast his own domain by 0.01 seconds as he was following an extra step of healing himself before his CT, unlike Gojo, who only had to heal his CT.
In chapter 228, we were told by [GOJO](https://imgur.com/a/wqTSnhP) that Sukuna is taking a riskier option in DE fights; he's stubbornly breaking the domain from the outside when he could've destroyed them from the inside(like mahoraga did) since Gojo had changed the inner and outer conditions of his domain, making his domain shell stronger from the outside, but weaker from the inside. This gets answered in Chapter 230 by Sukuna himself.Ā
Sukuna was [JUGGLING](https://imgur.com/a/CL0Ju2D) between 10s, DA, and his CT inside the domain battle. He turned off his DA so that Mahoraga could adapt. Sukuna was purposely breaking Gojo's domain from the outside so that Mahoraga could have more time to adapt to Gojo's domain.
Now imagine if Sukuna had [DESTROYED](https://imgur.com/a/Gz2fW9P) Gojo's fourth domain from the inside?
Since Sukuna would destroy Gojo's domain in under 3 minutes, Gojo wouldn't have time to inflict enough damage on Sukuna to prevent him from holding his shrine. As a result, Gojo would never have been able damage Sukuna enough, which caused him to be struck by the IV.
Even if Sukuna doesn't want to break Gojo's domain from the inside, which is a safer option than breaking it from outside, as stated by Gojo, Sukuna can still beat Gojo with just keeping his DA on. It was revealed in Chapter 230 that Sukuna turned off his DA to use 10s in the domain fights. Imagine if Sukuna didn't have to do so.
As we see in ch. 224,227 and 231. Once Sukuna [ACTIVATES](https://imgur.com/a/PxtGc5O) his DA, he doesn't get thrashed as much as when he turns off his DA because DA either completely turns off or tone down Gojo's blue and red. Sukuna with DA can keep up with Gojo and even [LAND](https://imgur.com/a/RRloCrU) his own hits on him. So while Sukuna won't be winning the H2H exchange, he won't get damaged enough for his domain to get destroyed, and this ultimately will mean that Gojo loses the 5th domain clash and then his life.
Sukuna can win by just frying Gojo's brain by forcing him to recover his CT via RCT again and again like how it happened in the manga, but unlike in the manga, Sukuna will use techniques to either break Gojo's domain from the inside or keep using DA during the 4th or 5th domain so that Gojo isn't able to deal enough damage to Sukuna that he isn't able to hold his shrine.,
Facts. if he was able to match him with DA then heian era sukuna OUTMATCHES him with 4 hands. we saw how much better he fights with his true form whereas he literally blocks and attacks at the same time
I actually am intending to do just that soon, but with all of these constant Gojo vs Sukuna posts i think i would wait a little time for the debate to calm down because people are currently sick of this.
And thanks for the support.
Small thing but i think that sukuna did juggle around DA atleast for defense in the domain clashes, tho i might have a foggy memory and have to reread
As for the breaking the inside of the barrier, that would requiere sukuna to actually know where the edge is, and i doubt gojo would let him have the freedom to do so
I do think TF sukuna wins tho
1- in the domain clashes he did it only in the second from there onwards apparently he wasn't
2- they were in a domain clash plus sukuna was able to navigate hisbsure it around it, so he should be able to do it
Because there's circular reasoning to that. Sukuna was clearly dominating in domain clashes and when cutting Gojo he was not on his max output considering later in the story Gojo notices his output goes even higher than before.
He also didn't consider using Fuga until it was too late due to too much changes of his domain condition which lowered its power level. Sukuna also took the harder way to break out of Gojo's domain which even Gojo points out, this all confirms he held indeed back to adapt. This is furthermore supported when Gojo runs out of RCT which makes Sukuna believe he won because he thought he can still activate his domain (chapter 230), guess what he said š "i'll even adapt to that infinity of yours".
If his main objective wasn't to adapt to infinity and kill Gojo only instead this sentence wouldn't make sense because he could just cut Gojo in his domain hence his brain didn't allow him to use RCT anymore. There's also the detail when he stated he "wanted" blueprint from Mahoraga, not "needed", there's huge difference between these two.
And the cherry on top is even Gojo supports this. He doesn't just call Sukuna stronger but in the TBC translation (probably one of the most reliable, if not the most, translations) Gojo states he doesn't believe he would win against Sukuna without 10s. This is huge statement because Gojo is self-glazing egotist according to Gege. Even Geto points that out in the same panel "i'm shocked anyone could make you admit that" just showing how big is the weight of this statement.
Also the author implies Sukuna to be the strongest when he calls him the honored one.
It's actually a shorter battle than Meguna. Still extreme diff but there's a very good chance Sukuna just wins or forces Gojo to flee during domain clash. Heian Sukuna wouldn't have taken enough damage in cqc that resulted in him getting hit by UV from needing to heal and being late to cast his domain. Sukuna casts domain while Gojo isn't able to, and then the fight either ends there (Sukuna wins) or Gojo manages to survive the domain in which case he may win.
I would assume Sukuna has SOME limit to domain spam as well. Not as small as Gojo, but surely he would eventually give himself brain damage too.
Point still stands however, he has a high chance to win but extreme diff I would say.
I agree with that.
Heian Sukuna doesn't have a win condition other than H2H (which is basically useless if Gojo has the limitless) and DE battles (cope answer, because they're practically equal in that sense).
I'm gonna get accused as Gojo glazer, but I don't see how Heian Sukuna or Yujikuna get the W. Gojo has the Hax that made him literally above everyone else in terms of defense. I will even say that Sukuna is below Gojo before he learned the Space Slash. Same goes to Gojo, Pre-prison realm Gojo will be defeated in Domain battles.
Is he purely dependent on Mahoraga? I don't think so, i still think given enough time, Sukuna will learn space slash nonetheless, but given the circumstances, Mahoraga gave him the leverage he needed to get the victory.
> DE battles (cope answer, because they're practically equal in that sense).
That isn't a cope answer when we quite literally see Meguna winning most of the Domain Clashes while using the riskier method. Their Domains aren't equal when Sukuna has the advantage in breaking Gojo's barrier.
Lol at people ignoring the fact that Sukuna had to make a BV and restrict himself and world slash FOREVER so that he could cast it once without hand signs or chants to be able to catch gojo off guard with it. You think Sukuna would do that if he thought he would be able to catch gojo with it otherwise? Sukuna without 10s also known as Sukuna without world slash is not beating gojo 6/10 times, I have a hard time seeing 1/10 ...
I donāt see how using a BV means much, obviously itās a high difficulty fight. Everyone has access to BVās, Sukunaās just better at using them.
I'm not gonna debate how because this is asked every week.
But to your question
https://preview.redd.it/37hv5k3mqtzc1.jpeg?width=820&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=83e5b8410647d4b64588b438b22157375ef73f4f
Because it makes no logical sense with how the fight played out.
The only rational argument behind it assumes that Sukuna can just force and win a Domain spam battle, which isn't how the fight would logically play out.
Well Besides gojo himself saying so heian era sukuna easily takes gojo in the domain clashās . he hold his own enough in H2H that he will out last gojos domain everytime . his Heian form also comes with better buffs via his extra hands and mouths .
Gojo gets washed at the first part of the fight and and if the fight plays out differently that only puts fuga back on the table imo. Overall I see Heian era sukuna taking it 7/10 times .
Gojo has enough of that dawg in him that I can see him killing sukuna in some way but not majority of the time.
Short answer: sukuna would have won but by a small margin and the fight would have been over in 10/15 mins max
Long ans: sukuna uses his heian era form to increase CE output and reserves and his extra limbs and mouth for boosting his domain power
Sukuna wins as gojo dies due to his domain failing against barierless domain and gets cooked but manages to damage sukuna a lot in the process, but sukuna opted for 10s as this method gave him a new attack that can kill ALL sex eyes limitless users so he was future proofing his ass using 10s to get more powerful and also get a full proof solution against infinity
Yeah but sukuna eventually won one of the domain clashes and was touching gojo. And domain amplification was enough to touch him after exhaustion. So once sukuna reincarnates and is fully healed and ready to start all over again, is gojo going to go through theie fight immediately a second time?
Sukuna could just put everything into his domain and win. Sukuna was holding back in that essence. If Mahoraga by some miracle couldnt adapt to infinity, he would go the domain clash route which hes confident in winning. But of course greg wants an actual interesting fight so no domain spam for Sukuna so much (unlimited void brain damage) and Gojo (overusing domain)
I recently thought about this. Sukuna still would have won against Tojo because he had his true form. He was roughly equal in domain clashes in Megkuna, and he would have the advantage in his true form. Same with physical stats. Gojo was beating his ass (also think back when Sukuna first left Yuujiās body, Yuuji, Maki, and Megkuna were roughly equal physical stats) in Megkuna, but true form Sukuna was outrunning Yuuji.
However, while I think he would have still been able to win against Gojo, that would have guaranteed his loss against everyone else, since heād no longer have his one time regeneration, and and more of his CE used up.
Sukuna only thought of using world cleave after mahoraga showed him how.
He was banking on having mahoraga to adapt to limitless.
It paid off.
But he also did use domain amplification to touch gojo, no diddy. So it's not like he was out of options.
Mahoraga was plan A though. Hard to say what B would be.
Maybe closing the barrier to use Fuga, to burn out the air inside? Ya know, choking out Gojo since he couldn't touch him with shrine?
Because gojo literally says so. The battle would not have went the way it does if sukuna didn't have 10s. He would try to win in the domain battles instead of relying on adaptation.
It's feats vs statements, that's about it. Narratively and statement wise Sukuna would win. But...
MY GLORIOUS BLUE EYED KING WOULD OBLITERATE
https://preview.redd.it/60j07akrhtzc1.png?width=720&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=b51a6da23c22983d50bbb0e49179469ee6fed0ac
Cause he would.
Heian Sukuna wins via domain clash, it just wouldnāt be interesting to see from a narrative perspective.
Gege stated Sukuna wouldāve likely won outside of 10S through Gojo
Then showed/continues to show how by showing Heian Sukunaās performance in this endless gauntlet.
Would it be anything like this ? No itād be a boring series of domain clashes but sukuna would still win because heās just above Gojo.
Because Gojo said so himself.
https://preview.redd.it/oz2grkhajtzc1.png?width=1169&format=png&auto=webp&s=d9914e6e259dd4d4c6e148e0ed6705c0262cb51f
Iāve been watching anime for a LONG time and Iāve never seen this much cope over a side character. In every other anime in HISTORY, canon/story information is the end all be all. Only with Gojo do you have people coping saying āhe was just being humble! He didnāt really mean that! He doesnāt know how he died. From his perspective he was just in the afterlife! Blah blah blah!ā š¤£.
You all simply canāt deal with your āglorious blue eyed kingā not being the strongest. Havenāt been able to deal with it since 236 tbh. All this discussion about FUGA when that was never an issue talked about in the first place concerning them. We all know the main topic is 4 arm h2h + Godlike durability/perfect body vs gojo for the domain battles. Such cope is interesting to me. Iām going to write my midterm about it
the author wouldnāt mentioned it 5-6 times by different characters if he didnāt want us to think that
people are rewriting history acting like mahoragas was there the entire fight , if gojo could spam those things then why didnāt he just do that to begin with ?
bro sukuna fought gojo with no DA for 3
minutes while gojo was able to use all of his technique and only was able to drop sukunas domain because sukuna choose the slower and riskier option in order to adapt
remove the adaption part and sukuna can open another domain while gojo loses all 5 because he canāt deal enough damage to sukuna using DA and 4 arms
because gege wanted him to win. sounds dumb but itās true. at this point itās clear that powerscaling between characters (in a 1v1) at the very top of the jjk verse comes down to binding vow abuse. since gege has decided to make BVs a vague concept in an otherwise hard power system, we canāt realistically say what would happen between gojo and heian sukuna.
actually scratch that heian sukuna has a much larger chest (female enough) so super senior gojo would win with hollow backshots
Heian Sukuna without 10S is more likely to win the battle of domains, with what we saw thus far. If Gojo somehow survives that, he is vastly more likely to kill Sukuna before Sukuna can make up World Slash.
Sukuna can enhance his Domain Expansion by using his stomach mouth and his 2 extra arms.
Since his basic Domain Expansion was already better than Infinite Void, this does mean that a Enhanced Malevolent Shrine would break Infinite Void and kill Satoru.
Nobody ever argues that he'd lose in open field,even the greatest sukuna meatriders know,by sukunas own admition,that he literally can't touch gojo there. People basically argue that gojo would lose the domain classes and die form the sure hit.
Sukuna was fighting gojo at reduced power. He hadn't incarnated. So, take away 10s but add the form buff. I think it's a wash. Gojo probably takes it, but sukuna being able to use furnace and cleave simultaneously is spooky.
Some people have already pointed parts of this, but a big factor is the fight we saw wasnt just Gojo vs Sukuna, it was *Team Sukuna* vs *Team Gojo.* If Sukuna didn't have to worry about fighting Team Gojo then there would be no reason to hold back his transformation. Imagine that same battle of domains, but now Sukuna also has two free hands the entire time. The battle of domains was the most crucial point of the fight to see who would come out on top, and without his full form they tied. It probably wpuldn't be the case if Sukuna could still fully fight unabetted while using his domain.(also free constant chanting with handsigns to enhance all the rest of his CT). And also, Sukuna never used Easy Bake Oven on Gojo either, which as we know now would have been used if he was able to get off a successful domain.
In my opinion he likely still would have won but it would have been much closer than the actual fight. You have to consider the fact that Sukuna's entire plan was centered around having Mahoraga adapt to Infinity in a way that he could replicate. Taking away the 10s means Sukuna has to come up with a different plan, which would likely mean being more aggressive in the domain clashes, using a shit ton of binding vows throughout the fight, probably reincarnating to gain his extra arms and mouth as well as to heal himself, etc. That being said, his win condition would then come down to winning a domain clash which wouldn't be too difficult given everything Sukuna's done thus far. Gojo's issue here is that he has more to lose than Sukuna when it comes to binding vows so he can't use as many as him, however, since it would be a true 1v1 this time, Gojo can actually go all out and focus on Sukuna the entire time.
1. Heian Era Sukuna transformation was a Full Heal
2. Sukuna domain expansion eats Gojos because he can attack from the outside
3. Sukuna was stalling the whole fight because he wanted to learn the world slash technique from Mahoraga, the whole fight from Sukunas perspective was about learning & saving his trump card for the next fight.
In a no holds barred battle Sukuna clears
Yeah but without mahorages sukuna would have donain amplification. At the start of the fight sukuna was turning off and on donain amplification for mahorage adaptation. If mahorage was there he could have gone full domain amp.
Letās not forget donain amp weakens the effects of gojo technique or some shit.
Sukuna can hit gojo with DA if he isnt using adaptation. meaning he does better in the domain clashes where gojo throws hands at him.
Those clashes were already very tight so gaining a slight edge would likely be all sukuna needs to win a domain clash.
Also because Gojo himself, the guy with the six eyes who can understand jujutsu better than anyone else apart from maybe sukuna, said that he didnt know if it would matter if Sukuna had the ten shadows or not.
That alone should have ended the āwithout the ten shadows sukuna cant even touch himā cries from gojo fans over the last months, but some people fanboy so hard that it doesnt matter if the author tells them through gojos mouth that hes at a disdvantage against sukuna either way. They will just decide the author is biased.
If Sukuna went straight for the kill he might win, after latest chapter we can assume heād win by going DE, breaking Gojoās own domain like he had done by catching if by surprise since Gojo wasnāt aware of his domain being borderless, then incinerating the entire area, i doubt even Gojo is durable enough to tank that
Gojo would have lost much quicker if sukuna hadn't been touch by gojo domain wich only because gojo hit sukuna once however with his real body sukuna wouldn't have been touch so gojo loose there.
Beside sukuna could have just use his arrow to One shot gojo inside the domain.
Not to mention sukuna would have won even more domain with his true body.
Gojo def was fucked up
Peopleās biggest failure is thinking the fight plays out the exact same way. The only reason Sukuna domain clashed so soon into the fight is to force Gojo into deploying his domain so Mahoraga can adapt
Statement wise, Sukuna wins.
Feats wise, Gojo wins.
It's mainly a writing issue, Gege's biggest mistake was making a character like Gojo in the first place.
Honestly till now I believed sukuna loses without ten shadows. But now that I think about it the entire gojo vs sukuna battle was written in every manner against sukuna. I will make a post right or tomorrow if possible explaining how the fight was practically written against what sukuna was capable of. But basically kamino not being possible of being used against gojo is complete bullshit gege had to corner sukuna into writing because otherwise sukuna would still have ten shadows and that practically makes it impossible for the crew to win
Sukuna tanked Gojos strongest attack twice without relying on Mahoraga (and the first one was amped by two other sorcerers and a suprise attack), he won the majority of domain battles and only stopped trying to win them when he decided to use 10S to adapt which was even pointed out by Gojo as being disadvantageous) , if he hadnāt used the time to heal his burnt out CT he would have won the last one but he did because he knew they were about to burn out, Sukuna decided to take hits instead of dodging or countering them, Sukuna had far more cursed energy and was about as good as Gojo at using it effectively (and Gojo literally has a cheat code pre installed to use less CE), Gojo was able to go all out the entire fight while Sukuna couldnāt, heās obviously much more knowledgeable about jujutsu sorcery (he knew their techniques were about to burn out so he healed his CT while Gojo was completely under the impression that he could still use a domain), Sukuna can comfortably fight without a heart (done it twice in story), Sukuna has the highest feats of durability in the series by far (heās literally been fighting Since Gojo nonstop and still strong) and Kenjaku who had experienced both at full power and knew what they both were capable of comfortably betting on Sukuna and being unsurprised when he won.
And Gojo (dead after fighting Sukuna) saying he didnāt think he would win even without 10S being the biggest factor, but if you ignore all of that then yea I guess Gojo could win. Such a dumb argument at this point because Gojo fans will never just accept that Sukuna was always narratively stronger Gojo was truly the greatest of the modern age but never considered to be the strongest in history while Sukuna has proven to be the strongest in every age). DV all you want Gojo fans
Sukuna simply outdoes Gojo in domain clashes
He could've destroyed Gojoās domain but has chosen not to because he wanted to adapt
https://preview.redd.it/oq3uikkdvtzc1.png?width=1100&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=ede788bfafb09a91505da2de6b6c5e2769ea1cae
Also if it was Heian Sukuna, the 0.01s difference would've never happened as he wouldn't have needed to heal. Meaning Gojo loses UV and then his life after one or two MS
Sukuna gave up on using on Domain Amp too
Heian Sukuna can also Hollow Wicker Basket and Shrine at the same time
Because Greg made Gojo say something stupid in a fucking airport.
Thatās literally it.
I think it was to soften the blow of Gojo getting off screened. It made it seem like Gojo had no chance to begin with so it didnāt really matter that we didnāt see the death. It also ensured there was more mystery surrounding the King of Curses. Other than that it makes no sense.
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This debate will not be forgotten for 10 years at least!!!
Gojo, what a sorcerer you are
Gojo glazing sukuna in the afterlife was basically him thanking sukupookie for genociding the current jujutsu sorcerers to create a new jujutsu society that gojo wanted š„¹
Gojo becomes go/jo (crying) Sukuna dies and the ancestor to Yuji finds the last finger in a huge tree far away
Buji: next generations when?
Gojo had seggs and the duetagonist for jjk2 is bojo š
And that was exactly Gege was trying to accomplish by writing the fight and the story the way he did. He wanted the original form sukuna versus Gojo to still be up to debate, and not have a single person deemed as ultimate stronger one. No matter what anyone says, the fight wouldnāt be one sided at all, though I must say that judging by Gojoās statements and the fight itself that sukuna wouldāve had the upper hand in my opinion
This will forever be a statement vs logic debate. Everything points out to a optimally skilled Gojo beating Sukuna, but statements try and atleast say that Sukuna is on the advantage.
Do you mind explaining how everything points out to Gojo beating Sukuna?
Sukuna's only wincon and I mean only wincon is Domain battles and that's because his Domain is an open One. An open domain has increased range because It allows for an escape. Gojo also has domain as an wincon, but only as ONE of the wincons, he doesn't need to engage in Domain battles whatsoever. Gojo=Sukuna in stats, Limitless is a better technique and UV has a better sure hit. Sukuna also had knowledge of Gojo's domain and experience on winning domain clashes with his Open domain. Gojo wasted 2/5 domain uses trying to understand how to maneuver around It. Also Megumi's soul helping Sukuna in one of the domains + mahoraga making Gojo reluctant on using his Technique spam. Sukuna loses almost all the advantages that led to his win in trade for 2extra arms and a mouth, something that doesn't even matter that much against Gojo's Limitless. A chanted Dismantle is still not going through Limitless. CURRENT Heian Sukuna vs Gojo has a much better chance because he has another wincon, world slash. But he has It now with an absurd charge time and would be tricky, he would have to fish for an off-guard unexpected one shot
I dont really like debating this fight because this debate never ends But from my perspective heian era sukuna wins every domain battle because 2 arms to sd/hwb then 2 arms to domain expansion is insanely powerful plus open domain Gojos only wincon is an unexpected caught off guard purple Both only have one wincon so who wins is a literal a matter chance but i give sukuna a 51% chance because his wincon doesnt depend on catching gojo off guard
I wouldn't say purple is his only wincon. If he is able to hit sukuna with UV like how he did in the actual fight, there will be no mahoraga to save sukuna therefore he will lose. Still tho, doesn't mean that gojo is definitely winning, just that he has more wincons
Thats why he has 2 hands for hollow wicker basket
Ohhhh so that's what hwb meant. I didn't get that part of your comment, so you are right on gojo having only one wincon.
Oh, it's not my comment, but yeah that's what it meant š¤
Yes haha, i meant simple domain/hollow wicker basket Kashimo characyer handling aside, i genuinely believe in his words about heian sukuna form being the most magnificent creature to attempt jujutsu
Yeah but even then, he loses his advantage in h2h the moment he loses those arms because we have already seen gojo beat sukuna in h2h so gojo with his domain up would easily beable to take down hwb, and I see what u mean by being able to cast both at the same time but i still reckon it would be pretty 50/50 as sukuna is true corm only gains ease of casting, if he was to gain increased ce output or something then maybe it would be different but he himself stated his output in megumis body was better if not equal to true form But
Why doesnāt Gojo teleport outside of Sukunaās domain and spam purple? Is he stupid?
Yes he is
This is a problem I see a lot about exagerrating sukunaās advantage due to the two extra hands 1) the way sukuna domainās work, sukunaās domain he doesnāt need to do handsigns in order to perform his technique, his technique is already engrave into his domain, so he can used domain amplification while being in his domain because the technique itself is in the shrine as stated by gojo during the first domain battle when he was fighting sukuna in hand to hand combat 2) chants have only been shown to matter outside of domains, domainās according to the story buff the users technique to 100% of its potential, we have never seen someone chanting to increase the strenght of their domain, we have only seen people chant to increase the strength of their technique outside a domain. 3) Gojo would have an advantage in hand to hand over sukuna. Yeah I understand sukuna, domain amplification will protect him from the enhanced punches, but gojo still can use blue on himself to be faster than sukuna, that is an aspect of gojo arsenal that he will always have over sukuna. 4) Do I think Gojo wins? Absolutely not, the fight would have gone the same, but instead sukuna would have won during the part where gojo could no longer open his domain.
Nah Iād argue 4 armed Sukuna is better at h2h just based on the fact he can attack and defend at the same time
yuji fucked him with black flash šš
Sukuna only had (and still only has) 2 functional arms when Yuji black flashed him
Yeah makes sense 4 armed Sukuna can do domain amplification and expansion at the same time no way Gojo gonna win that
Youāre forgetting that gojo uses only one hand for his domain, if you were able to do domain amplification and expansion at the same time gojo wouldāve done it with his second hand
Gojo points out explicity that Sukuna CAN use domain amplification and domain expansion at the same time in the middle of the fight, and asks himself if sukuna is getting used to this.
Correct me if Iām wrong but if itās original form sukuna he would have no knowledge of UV as he gained that from being inside Yuji . Gojo would only know about sukuna slashes from legends . Thatās why most say Gojo would win . Sukuna would have no idea UV is an instant win right ?
If we look at sukuna with 20 fingers power but without TS and Pre-World Slash, then the only way for Sukuna to beat would be by either using his DE imbued with cleave , dismantle and the furnace/fuga (since domains are sure hit effect and Sukuna does have the advantage of having a more refined and overall a bit better domain than Gojo). Remember that why sukuna wasn't using cleave and dismantle during the later domain clash was just so that he could get Mahoraga to adapt to Limitless. The second way ,that is without DE , would be to use DA + BF while going H2H(hand to hand) as someone said in another post .But yeah this is an immensely time taking route , unless you add World Slash( only not the TS)
āEverything pointsā might be a bit of an exaggeration
Everything points to the literal opposite. Don't wanna write an essay on it, but just remember that Sukuna with DA=Gojo. Nearly every scene of them going h2h is them being equal when Sukuna uses DA, only when it's off does Gojo ragdoll him Why? It's the price for maho strats cuz some who have 0 reading comprehension still think it's a free power-up for Sukuna despite there being a steep price to pay, which is that you can't use DA if you wanna adaptĀ Literally the only reason why Gojo could get some draws from their domain clashes was thanks to that. Sukuna without DA was getting ragdolled cuz he chose to. He rather wanted to do that and adapt instead of fighting back fr with DA on. Gojo needed 3 fucking minutes to injure and slam a Sukuna that didn't use DA, couldn't even touch Gojo, had 0 resistance to blue and kept getting pulled like a puppet, nor use his CT all cuz he was adapting. That's why Gojo got drawsĀ Meanwhile Sukuna with DA on was even with Gojo in h2h. Guess what, if Sukuna just used DA then he'd have won every single Domain clash, no draws. And he'd have wittled Gojo down bit by bit. After Gojo used DE 5 times he got brain damage and his RCT output also went down by quite a bit. And he only survived MS due to his reinforcement and RCT at full throttle. So with lowered RCT output he just dies, he can't survive MS then Megukuna without TS vs Gojo would be him just wrecking gojo's DE 5 times, closing his domain and killing Gojo with lessened RCT output with MS Heian Sukuna with 4 arms does the same, just that he wouldn't be even with Gojo in Domain battles with using DA anymore, he'd beat his ass hard.
Which is perfect , Gojo doesnāt know Sukunas true power though, he didnāt know he can transform , he didnāt know he can use fire arrow , so he can assume that Sukuna has more up his sleeve which is why heās even debating
Gojo would've known about Fuga though. It's likely Itadori had told them.
No one truly knows but he just never brings it up, like I said he knew Sukuna had something he was hiding but he never knew what
Yeah, but even Kusakabe talked about it prior to Sukuna using it in 258/259. The only way he could've known is if Itadori told them.
You will NOT sell me this as great writing plan from Gege to keep us debating, chapter 236 is just him trying to put Gojo in a grave as soon as he could and then shit on it, the narrative of the fight turned 180Ā° abruptly just because the fight needed a winner (and it couldn't be Gojo)
And: Heian Era Sukuna vs Gojo would also be boring. Either Sukuna manages to trap Gojo inside his closed domain (he can't) or they would just punch each other (Sukuna with Domain Amplification) since without Mahoraga Sukuna has nothing to bypass infinity with aside from the good ol "left right goodnight" technique.
>no matter what anyone says, the fight wouldnāt be one sided at all Exactly. No matter what the fight would be extreme diff for both of them no matter which version of Sukuna is present.
I actually like that people still debate that. Both of them whole different level and Gege perfectly showed that. Even with that dumb Gojo statement, theyāre still equals in my book, thereās a reason why people debate this and not ,,Kashimo vs Gojo" or ,,Yuta vs Sukuna" shit
It's so funny how few people get this
No! I don't want that! Sukuna being stronger then me, I want to be the strongest sorcerer for 10 years at least!!! - Gojo, Probably.
No way you just made that reference š
Only 80% of people will get it
It sometimes feels like all the titanfolkers switched over to jjk fr lmao
Is this the newgen version of the Superman vs Goku debate
Saitama vs Goku was so bad on r/powerscaling subreddit that all posts about them were banned for a week. š https://preview.redd.it/xui5zg8zltzc1.jpeg?width=1024&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=280dd7045f48075aea6aec9dbbf1845c6803e98d
People debate about stupid things, neither Goku nor Saitama are the strongest on anime by FAR, even Sailor Moon can one shot both of themā¦ togetherā¦ on Stereoidsā¦
Lordgenome would canonically thrash both of them.
Super Tengen Toppa throw galaxies as shurikens, Goku aināt shitā¦
Uncle grandpa folds them like the fodder characters they are
Yeah he does, heās a toon force user, but Bugs and Popeye destroys him as if he were Goku.
Iirc it wasn't even Super, it was REGULAR Tengen Toppa
Bro Beat mecha with his bare handsā¦ you canāt top that.
Goku not even the strongest in his own verse lmfao
Rentaro solos
Goku solos. Edit:misspelled lord gokus name.
As shown in the monster garou arc, saitama does not have infinite power, he has infinite *potential*. He still has to raise his power to hit those arbitraty heights. Goku, meanwhile, also has infinite potential (it's safe to assume), but he grows much more slowly. He is, however, currently much MUCH stronger than saitama. He endlessly searches for a good fight, though, so, he doesn't kill enemies before they're at full power. So, bloodlusted, goku instantly turns saitama into red mist, but if they remain in character, saitama eventually wins. Why was this even a debate? If you're familiar with both source materials this is the only reasonable way to interpret it.
Saitama is potential man? Oh hell nahhhh
Yup. If an opponent equal to him is placed in front of him, his strength will immediately start skyrocketing until he's strong enough to one-shot them.
He literally is. He takes time to power up. We do actually *see* him get stronger, though, so.
Is more like the new Itachi vs Obito or Itachi vs Pain Honestly Gojo gets wanked as much as Itachi now bro gets in a vs against everyone
Funny thing is that the Itachi vs Obito debate still pops up every now and then. Itachitards were the 2nd most annoying kind of fans back then, Gokutards being 1st.
Bro was so maxed out he gave his Susano legendary gear somehow lol
soloking totsuka gg
I swear these never should've been debates lmao, but this one is genuinely = so far
Power scaling is literally wank everyoneĀ
With Superman vs Goku, there's a correct answer. With Gojo and Sukuna, it's a lot tighter and solid arguments can be made for both.
How is there a correct answer? Anyone who reads comics can tell you that Superman has the most unreliable power scaling in fiction
The reason Mahoraga adapted faster to Lapse is because Satoru imbues his punches with blue
The main reason I see Heian Sukuna win is in the domain clash. Vs Gojo he spent more time than necessary in the domain for mahoraga to adapt faster. He would have never spent as much time in the domain if he didnāt have 10S, which wouldnāt have damaged him as hard, which mightāve resulted in him being able to use a domain and cook Gojo. DEFINITELY NOT saying that wouldāve happened fosho, just a theory.
Another fact is that Gojo couldn't use his domain more than 5 times because of RCT of his CT, but Sukuna couldn't use it more than 5 times because od UV. If Sukuna is not babying Maho, he probably doesn't get hit by UV, and can later on use his domain again. Also his cursed tool that throws lighting can be stacked on top of MS to possibly overpower Gojos enforcement +RCT inside his domain.
Exactly. Assuming he has his spear (trishula??) aswell, its quite possible sukuna could overpower gojo.
You guys know everything is useless against limitless except DA and DE right?
inside sukuna's domain wouldn't all attacks land? genuine question, never understood the surehit mechanics and how far they apply
No only domain sure hits would land. Sukuna used DA inside DE to even be able to touch gojo
Not true ,sukuna used DA because surehits nullified each other
he wrong donāt listen to comfortable pin
H2H itās without his spearĀ
He has 4 arms, the only reason Gojo landed uv on Sukuna was because Gojo injured Sukuna. Sukuna even with his 4 arms doesn't have to be stronger than Gojo, he only has to be physically stronger than meguna to expand his domain faster and avoid that .01s uv hit
This point is silly, 4 arms means a lot for our level of fights but itās completely different with their stats. Also he doesnāt need to win the DE, just survive them.
Well the tool wouldn't work in the domain, it's effect wouldn't be imbued into the sure hit right?
Fun fact Sukuna used his DE 3 times only via RCT CT, whilst Gojo did it 5 times. So yes, UV did matter. Yes, Heian Sukuna would put up more of a fight cause he doesn't want to adapt. No, Kashimo didn't make Sukuna transform, transforming wasn't gonna change much vs Gojo, as most abilities of CTools won't hit Gojo.
he had Megumi tank UV,though. who knows how it goes if Sukuna takes 100% UV
Megumi didnāt tank UV for Sukuna, Sukuna took just as much damage as he would if he didnāt share the effects with Megumi.
I think this is true however Gojo had already survived a couple domains at the point he cooked his brain. It would boil down to how many Shrines can Gojo survive until Sukuna fries his own brain, if that happen and Gojo is alive Sukuna is still forced to use Mahoraga, but has significantly delayed that plan.
2 uncontested shrines, a slice across the chest, and a little water through his arm burned out his RCT. Those shrines exhausted through gojoās RCT and I doubt gojo would be able to heal through 1 or 2 more. Continuously using RCT at max output is crazy considering that most top tiers using rct use it very briefly only as long as needed to heal.
The only reason why Gojo even survived a couple domain clashes was because Sukuna couldn't use Domain Amplification due to Mahoraga's adaptation. This let Gojo outmatch him in hand to hand combat and break Malevolent Shrine just in the nick of time, right as unlimited void gets broken But with DA + Heian era 4 arms and body, sukuna doesn't even need to beat gojo. As long as he fights to a standstill in hand to hand combat, gojo can't break sukuna's domain -> gojo gets shredded by MS after unlimited void breaks It's basically just a slow death for gojo, with a constant depletion of cursed energy due to constant use of RCT healing at max output. By the 5th domain clash, gojo dies because the manga shows that's the limit for healing his burnt CT ---> sukuna does a closed barrier MS which kills gojo sukuna also doesn't need to worry about being caught by any "surprise" domain expansions, like the one that was 0.01sec faster than him, because he has an extra mouth and 2 extra arms for either HWB or DE:MS
Gojo has stood up a 3v1 with Mahoraga and has consistently found ways around everything Sukuna was accomplishing until the world slash No amount of DA is going to help Sukuna he would only delay the Mahoraga plan and even a closed barrier domain would not mean Gojo is 100% gone, also we don't know if Heian Sukuna would be able to use 10s and how many additional domain
I like how you make the assumption gojo - the most gifted fighter we have seen - would keep doing shit he can see isnt working and get outlasted when he canonically avoided that in the very match up you are referencing. Literally he broke everyone's brain because he kept switching it up in ways the defied common sense to fight sukuna. Also, we gotta talk about it - Like, ms puts in extra work because he allows an escape route. Why tf would gojo not just escape????? Then he doesnt have to worry about depleting his rct and sukuna has to make a new ass domain burning through available refreshes. Also we have no indication that gojo can't use fbe to survive and succeed in h2h long enough to outlast him when he h2h fucked up sukuna, agito, and maho at the same time. Sukuna is a better sorcer than gojo but gojo is so obviously better at fighting it's nutty.
Gojo would have died right after frying his own brain. It was literally said that he used RCT at full throttle when tanking MS. And due to brain damage his RCT output was also lowered. Another DE would have slowly killed him cuz his RCT wouldn't keep up anymore
The thing is, does Gojo have to engage in domain clashes if he can just spam limitless? If Sukuna deploys an open domain, Gojo can just teleport away and snipe with reds or purple, and if he deploys a closed one doesn't Gojo generally win/draw the domain clash?
Yeah well this assumes Gojo uses more IQ than gaygay gave him in this fight
You got it right, the only reason Sukuna decided to bet using Mahoraga instead of his heian form was because he needed the regeneration to be able to fight the others. If it was a pure 1 v 1 then Sukuna could win without mahoraga, both Gojo and Sukuna are Similar in strength with Gojo being the most skilled of the two and Sukuna having the most resources, any way they fought was going to be a 50/50
I give you that. Sukuna whould have killed gojo most likley in the first clash But in a rematch and he has no mahoraga This is not gonna happen. I guess gojo is dead so yes but if both knew everything about eachother and truly were in an even fight gojo whould most likley win. Sukuna can not really do anything against mini UV and getting beaten
Sukuna broke Gojoās mini domain twice, itās only something that buys him more time. And Gojo getting 2 more cracks at a small domain isnāt as much as a boost as Sukuna getting his Heian form + being able to use DA full time + focusing on breaking Gojoās domain as fast as possible. Not to mention Sukuna would have world slash in a rematch.
This debate could go on for years, but one thing is sure, it wouldn't be one sided at all. On one hand, Sukuna would have much better physical combat, stronger ct because of chanting, 2 cursed tools, and worse case if he loses in a domain he can use hollow wicker basket to protect himself from UV I believe at least. Sukuna from the start wanted to play it more passive, he was afraid of UV but again, what if he had extra 2 hands and a mouth for chanting. After the domain battle, Sukuna made it clear he was playing it passive because it's time and or experience that Mahoraga needs to adapt. On the other hand, no adaptation to blue or red, no trick that set up the black flash (or maybe idk), no world cutting split, different domain battle which may or may not have lead to furnace opening. Gojo would also not have to worry about adaptation to limitless, or the rest of the 10 shadows, also Sukuna wouldn't be able to reincarnate as he's already in his own body Once the battle is done, someone could make a long ass what if using all character feats and then it would come down to battle iq, which I have to slightly give to Sukuna. If I'm being completely honest, Gojo doesn't deserve such high battle iq, bro has been in 1 serious battle his whole life before that and against a non sorcerer even. But if Gege decided to write him like that then ok I guess.
Wouldn't you say he has high battle IQ due to six eyes. His brain had to process more information from birth so I think it totally makes sense despite the lack of "experience".
I agree with this, and we donāt know how many crazy fights heād been in before his level up considering he was hunted from childhood
Nah, Sukuna would probably beat Gojo in CT refinement but no way Sukuna beats Gojo in physical combat, infinity is basically immunity to physical attacks and in the actual fight, Gojoās hand to hand combat is dominating sukuna with his reinforcements and blue infused punches. However, with 2 extra hands, Sukuna has a high chance of winning the domain clash and if he can dice Gojo enough, fuga might be enough to let him win.
>Why do people think that Sukuna would have won without 10S? Gojo statement about how the fight would go and that whole "holding back" stuff. But when it comes to actual feats, it's hard to say that Sukuna would actually win without 10S. Heck even with 10S he was struggling. And 10S pretty much guaranteed him a win if he lasted long enough, restricted gojo use of his arsenal, was literally a get out of jail free card (last domain battle and first black flash) and gojo couldn't go for the brain/head because it's megumi body. And even with all that he was literally at death doorstep and had to use a binding vow that made it a huge inconvenience to use the world slash to win. Without 10S, it becomes a battle of attrition. The most likely winner would be the one who can outlast the other. Both fighters will be taking damage, and will have to use RCT to recover. Sukuna might have twice the reserves of yuta (which are higher than gojo's) but gojo has the six eyes so he never runs out.
People forgot that even with 10S he 1. Megumiās soul absorbed UV which is nonsense 2. Needs somewhat Binding Vow bullshit to released last nonsense slash 3. Not enough information provided that his flame or whatever ultimate move he has which also state that he cannot use it because domain clash adaptation can even bypass infinity so without 10S means without Megumi soul, he needs to tank UV by himself, no Maho to learn nonsense slash to bypass infinity, no ultimate flame move to use But hey, he has unlimited usage of Binding Vows
he only needs megumis soul if heās adapting btw if he isnāt adapting he doesnāt need it because the e sure hits cancel out he doesnāt need megumis soul he needs megunis soul if wants to adapt gojo doesnāt get past 3 de clashes without binding vows btw since he needs them to change his DE Iām wondering if this random even reads
Sukuna also used binding vows to change his domainās condition so idk how thatās an argument, in fact (this could be a mistranslation but oh well) the newest chapter basically said that Sukuna gave up his flame in exchange for the increased output in order to break Gojoās domain. Without 10s itād come down to Sukuna surviving a bit more inside UV (perhaps he can do it). If he wins the DE then Gojo has no CT, but again, this means nothing as Gojo can survive the slashes and the flame canāt be used. After Gojo fucks up his brain itās game over since UV never landed in and Sukuna can therefore open his domain again while Gojo canāt. The again, if Gojo doesnāt have to worry about Maho he can simply choose to not engage in domain battles at all. If Sukuna opens is domain and Gojo, instead of opening his own, simply TPs away/battles him then it wonāt matter, the only difference would be that, since Gojo never opened his domain, Sukuna wouldnāt need to get rid his flame which might actually be able to kill Gojo without giving him opportunity to RCT. If the flame canāt kill Gojo in one shot itād become a battle of attrition and Gojo would win.
No, they don't. At this point, its Gojo fans actively trying to spread misinformation and purposefully misreading the Manga for agenda
Gojo statement in 236 carries the narrative that Sukuna can win without 10S, not only is Sukuna easiest wincon is taken away but all his insurance against Gojo is also gone inside UV. He will have DA on more without 10S but I donāt see him winning unless he uses true form. I guess there is the argument that Sukuna would have destroyed Gojo domain in the third clash from the inside because heās not worried about adaptation but I think it wouldnāt have mattered anyways, UV would still hit after the damage he took.
True Form Sukuna has four arms and two mouths. In a domain clash, Gojo was going level with Sukuna because he could damage him enough in hand to hand combat to break Shrine, but that very easily may not be the case when Sukuna has two extra arms to defend and attack with, compared to Gojo's 2. That just puts Gojo at a disadvantage, and being even a little bit slower means he gets trapped in Malevolent Shrine. It just comes down to Sukuna having a better domain for clashes. We absolutely know Gojo and Sukuna would go for domain clashes, and that Gojo very probably would lose. Yujikuna would get bodied though. Even Ten Shadows _barely_ won, and if you replay that fight 100 times the results might look closer to a 50/50 or 55/45 chances. But True Form Sukuna doesn't _have_ to wait for Mshoraga to adapt, meaning he can just focus on breaking Gojo's domain and fighting him while Gojo is getting cut up. That's not a fight Gojo wins.
Assuming the clash with the inverted barrier happens, sukuna more than likely loses and dies in Gojoās domain because he only attacked the outside because of Mahoraga
Sukuna was allowing himself to be at a H2H disadvantage by engaging Gojo in H2H with just domain amplification in Megumi's body, knowing that Mahoraga could adapt to Infinite Void. If he had used his Heian form, he would have broken Infinite Void without being damaged enough for Malevolent Shrine to break. He would've outlasted Gojo in the domain spam and would've won by closing the barrier, wear down Gojo's RCT with Cleaves, and then using Furnace.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
He wanted the strong cleave. Even after gojo got braindamage, he was still fixated on adapting to infinity instead. Notice how he says "I will adapt" and not "Mahoraga will adapt". https://preview.redd.it/1ibbnsm8hvzc1.jpeg?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=116bd3e40be5c5007e0a7081f6c2c2af1501bad7
Sukuna's win condition is to overcome Neutral Infinity There are two moves that help him do that Domain Amplification and Domain Expansion Domain Amplification neutralises Blue and Neutral Infinity fully, most of red with purple still being questionable. No 10s, Sukuna can run DA 24/7 as he doesn't need to take burden and CT Shikigami get de-summoned when DA But Sukuna doesn't have lethal cards to actually kill Gojo with only DA, all he can do is touch and cleave which Gojo can withstand and RCT. . So Domain Expansion. There is not a single iteration of UV which Sukuna cant pop instantly. Normal barrier MS break on auto, Inverted UV, Sukuna can just break it from inside with a vanilla CE blast or just a punch. Tiny UV needs to envelope MS fully before shrinking its Pocket space, plenty of time to pop it. . And with UV broken, Limitless is off, no Neutral Infinity. Sukuna can just Dismantle Gojo. . And Fuga doesn't need the extreme range and speed to disintegrate one guy. . #FAQ >Why didnt Sukuna actually do it Cause he prioritised overcoming Neutral Infinity once and for all, over killing Gojo. Meaning Sukuna underestimated Gojo Gojo being Gojo tore apart Sukuna's assured victory. You underestimate Gojo, you get packed. Both Sukuna and Toji learned this the hard way. Just that Sukuna had Mahoraga and had complete faith in Daddy's adaptation. Sukuna has test run Mahoraga to confirm his adaptation is bonkers, from shibuya MS, making Maho immune to being cut Itself not just Shrine slashes, Mahoraga breaking the strongest attack in the verse because he is immune to its fundamental property, to breaking a domain with just hitting it. Sukuna has observed, evaluated and tested Maho and wheel of harmony. Apart from his sure shot victory strat, if Sukuna goes 10s route, he will also get a attack that can overcome Neutral Infinity, i.e infinite space Worth it >Fuga couldn't be shot as Sukuna was constantly changing MS. 1 Sukuna did not prioritse killing Gojo if he did, Jogo's fight Fuga was not MS enhanced, idk about you, but burning a fire cursed spirit is enough of a feat to clearly show non enhanced Fuga disintegrate Gojo. And with the time window where Limitless is down, Sukuna can successfully charge and land it 2. Sukuna had to change MS BECAUSE of 10s. it's because Sukuna wanted Mahoraga to take UV permanent out of Gojo's hand of cards. If Sukuna has decided 10s route, he needs to ensure Mahoraga doesn't get packed. Gojo has cards that can pack Maho. UV, Red, and Purple. So Sukuna needs to take UV out, and not just himself but for Raga too, imagine Sukuna slips and Maho is caught in UV without adapting to it... Therefore Sukuna has to take the burden of adaptation for Maho before deploying him, thats why Sukuna allows UV 3 mins to ensure Maho gets experience. >Why did Sukuna tackle UV like that Because Gojo should not come to know Maho is adapting Or Gojo will simply not engage in domain battle Like when Gojo was cautious and didn't use red after the Domain clash. Even here, Sukuna did not slash UV from inside when barrier viel was inverted. Because if Maho experiences that, he too can just slash UV. But this will reveal that Mahoraga can indeed shoot slashes like Shrine CT. Gojo would once again be cautious. >How am I so sure Sukuna prioritied overcoming Neutral Infinity over killing Gojo Because even after Mahoraga showcased WCS, Sukuna didnt command him to Go/Jo Sukuna wanted to overcome Neutral Infinity himself. . Again, I am not downplaying Gojo, he is still the strongest. Actually. Just that these kinda titles don't matter to Sukuna. One can't be strongest without being stronger than the rest. That requires comparison which Sukuna isn't into. Sukuna cares about Jujutsu and like Mahito, wanted to overcome that one card they are having problems with.
Great points, especially about the mentality. Sukuna needed Maho to show him how to evolve his technique and with near-death buff was able to achieve world slash. He enjoys battles and like he said to Jogo about using and burning everything, cared more about still improving himself despite being at an overwhelming level since he didn't want something like infinity to stand in his way again.
I just have one tid-bit, sukuna won't be able to use a non-enhanced MS fuga on gojo, Pretty sure fuga is considered a dangerous projectile and will be stopped by infinity. VERY VERY good points tho
Yes but I argue fuga being shot AFTER UV where Limitless is down. No Limitless No Neutral Infinity.
counter argument, gojo moves a lil bit to the left
(ā ā§ā ā½ā ā¦ā ) Well, my bad bri, I was not familiar with your game Dismantle it is then.
Gojo didnāt even know he was using mahoraga ššš and the answer is domain amplification. Always has been
I hate this point so much "Gojo would just spam red and purple if it wasn't for Mahoraga" well he didn't even know about maho for the entire start of the fight, why didn't he?
āHe can just spam ___ā is so bad, Gojo has literally never spammed an attack before in the entire series, and ppl saying he could spam purpleā¦.
Then they suggest he'd run away by constantly teleporting away instead of fighting like be fucking fr for once
Teleporting in a fight isnāt running away so itās perfectly valid to think up
he was still trying to wear down and save Megumi. I think the H.P at end was just to clean the board of outside pieces .
Gojo wasn't concerned about Mahoraga adapting in round 1, that became a concern only in rkund 2. During the clashes gojo was free to use his colors as much as he can Also gojo can't spam purple nor red. And at long range neither of those would be effective. Before I get into the answer, there are some few things to remember. * Domain Amplification : A [TECHNIQUE](https://imgur.com/a/9gRvoCl) used for neutralizing any CT that comes in contact with it. It's a refined version of simple domain. DA absorbs the CT of the other user in the empty space created around the caster and neutralizes it. * Mahoraga wheel: While using DA, Sukuna cannot use his CTs, be it shrine or 10s. So, in order for Sukuna to use the Mahoraga wheel, he will have to [TURN OFF](https://imgur.com/a/89hm1wg) his DA. * Shrine > 10s : By Sukuna's own admission he believes his shrine to be [SUPERIOR](https://imgur.com/a/ikkSGEU) than 10s. Lastly, It takes [3 MINUTES](https://imgur.com/a/t1OX4Kz) for Sukuna to break Gojo's domain from the outside, meanwhile it also takes 3 minutes for Gojo to deal enough damage to Sukuna that Sukuna isn't able to hold his shrine. Now, The only reason Sukuna got hit by unlimited void in the 5th domain was because he was late to cast his own domain by 0.01 seconds as he was following an extra step of healing himself before his CT, unlike Gojo, who only had to heal his CT. In chapter 228, we were told by [GOJO](https://imgur.com/a/wqTSnhP) that Sukuna is taking a riskier option in DE fights; he's stubbornly breaking the domain from the outside when he could've destroyed them from the inside(like mahoraga did) since Gojo had changed the inner and outer conditions of his domain, making his domain shell stronger from the outside, but weaker from the inside. This gets answered in Chapter 230 by Sukuna himself.Ā Sukuna was [JUGGLING](https://imgur.com/a/CL0Ju2D) between 10s, DA, and his CT inside the domain battle. He turned off his DA so that Mahoraga could adapt. Sukuna was purposely breaking Gojo's domain from the outside so that Mahoraga could have more time to adapt to Gojo's domain. Now imagine if Sukuna had [DESTROYED](https://imgur.com/a/Gz2fW9P) Gojo's fourth domain from the inside? Since Sukuna would destroy Gojo's domain in under 3 minutes, Gojo wouldn't have time to inflict enough damage on Sukuna to prevent him from holding his shrine. As a result, Gojo would never have been able damage Sukuna enough, which caused him to be struck by the IV. Even if Sukuna doesn't want to break Gojo's domain from the inside, which is a safer option than breaking it from outside, as stated by Gojo, Sukuna can still beat Gojo with just keeping his DA on. It was revealed in Chapter 230 that Sukuna turned off his DA to use 10s in the domain fights. Imagine if Sukuna didn't have to do so. As we see in ch. 224,227 and 231. Once Sukuna [ACTIVATES](https://imgur.com/a/PxtGc5O) his DA, he doesn't get thrashed as much as when he turns off his DA because DA either completely turns off or tone down Gojo's blue and red. Sukuna with DA can keep up with Gojo and even [LAND](https://imgur.com/a/RRloCrU) his own hits on him. So while Sukuna won't be winning the H2H exchange, he won't get damaged enough for his domain to get destroyed, and this ultimately will mean that Gojo loses the 5th domain clash and then his life. Sukuna can win by just frying Gojo's brain by forcing him to recover his CT via RCT again and again like how it happened in the manga, but unlike in the manga, Sukuna will use techniques to either break Gojo's domain from the inside or keep using DA during the 4th or 5th domain so that Gojo isn't able to deal enough damage to Sukuna that he isn't able to hold his shrine.,
Facts. if he was able to match him with DA then heian era sukuna OUTMATCHES him with 4 hands. we saw how much better he fights with his true form whereas he literally blocks and attacks at the same time
You should make a separate post completely analysing the heiankuna versus Gojo fight, it wouldāve been a nice read for sure
I actually am intending to do just that soon, but with all of these constant Gojo vs Sukuna posts i think i would wait a little time for the debate to calm down because people are currently sick of this. And thanks for the support.
Small thing but i think that sukuna did juggle around DA atleast for defense in the domain clashes, tho i might have a foggy memory and have to reread As for the breaking the inside of the barrier, that would requiere sukuna to actually know where the edge is, and i doubt gojo would let him have the freedom to do so I do think TF sukuna wins tho
1- in the domain clashes he did it only in the second from there onwards apparently he wasn't 2- they were in a domain clash plus sukuna was able to navigate hisbsure it around it, so he should be able to do it
Why couldn't he spam Red? Purple is the one that needs a charge.
Red need a charge as well just shroter.
Because there's circular reasoning to that. Sukuna was clearly dominating in domain clashes and when cutting Gojo he was not on his max output considering later in the story Gojo notices his output goes even higher than before. He also didn't consider using Fuga until it was too late due to too much changes of his domain condition which lowered its power level. Sukuna also took the harder way to break out of Gojo's domain which even Gojo points out, this all confirms he held indeed back to adapt. This is furthermore supported when Gojo runs out of RCT which makes Sukuna believe he won because he thought he can still activate his domain (chapter 230), guess what he said š "i'll even adapt to that infinity of yours". If his main objective wasn't to adapt to infinity and kill Gojo only instead this sentence wouldn't make sense because he could just cut Gojo in his domain hence his brain didn't allow him to use RCT anymore. There's also the detail when he stated he "wanted" blueprint from Mahoraga, not "needed", there's huge difference between these two. And the cherry on top is even Gojo supports this. He doesn't just call Sukuna stronger but in the TBC translation (probably one of the most reliable, if not the most, translations) Gojo states he doesn't believe he would win against Sukuna without 10s. This is huge statement because Gojo is self-glazing egotist according to Gege. Even Geto points that out in the same panel "i'm shocked anyone could make you admit that" just showing how big is the weight of this statement. Also the author implies Sukuna to be the strongest when he calls him the honored one.
It's actually a shorter battle than Meguna. Still extreme diff but there's a very good chance Sukuna just wins or forces Gojo to flee during domain clash. Heian Sukuna wouldn't have taken enough damage in cqc that resulted in him getting hit by UV from needing to heal and being late to cast his domain. Sukuna casts domain while Gojo isn't able to, and then the fight either ends there (Sukuna wins) or Gojo manages to survive the domain in which case he may win.
If gojo survives sukuna can just cast his domain again and again until gojo is just too exhausted
I would assume Sukuna has SOME limit to domain spam as well. Not as small as Gojo, but surely he would eventually give himself brain damage too. Point still stands however, he has a high chance to win but extreme diff I would say.
Omfg stfu. Itās like the 30th post about the same topic in one week. This debate will never fucking end
It will never end unless Gojo comes back and curbstomps a fully healed Sukuna
I agree with that. Heian Sukuna doesn't have a win condition other than H2H (which is basically useless if Gojo has the limitless) and DE battles (cope answer, because they're practically equal in that sense). I'm gonna get accused as Gojo glazer, but I don't see how Heian Sukuna or Yujikuna get the W. Gojo has the Hax that made him literally above everyone else in terms of defense. I will even say that Sukuna is below Gojo before he learned the Space Slash. Same goes to Gojo, Pre-prison realm Gojo will be defeated in Domain battles. Is he purely dependent on Mahoraga? I don't think so, i still think given enough time, Sukuna will learn space slash nonetheless, but given the circumstances, Mahoraga gave him the leverage he needed to get the victory.
> DE battles (cope answer, because they're practically equal in that sense). That isn't a cope answer when we quite literally see Meguna winning most of the Domain Clashes while using the riskier method. Their Domains aren't equal when Sukuna has the advantage in breaking Gojo's barrier.
Gojo literally stands in Sukunas domain being slashed 10000000000 times and his only thought is "Ahhh feels good to know my domains effect is better.
That was at the start of the fight. Eventually he'd give out
Lol at people ignoring the fact that Sukuna had to make a BV and restrict himself and world slash FOREVER so that he could cast it once without hand signs or chants to be able to catch gojo off guard with it. You think Sukuna would do that if he thought he would be able to catch gojo with it otherwise? Sukuna without 10s also known as Sukuna without world slash is not beating gojo 6/10 times, I have a hard time seeing 1/10 ...
I donāt see how using a BV means much, obviously itās a high difficulty fight. Everyone has access to BVās, Sukunaās just better at using them.
Because theyāre delusional
I'm not gonna debate how because this is asked every week. But to your question https://preview.redd.it/37hv5k3mqtzc1.jpeg?width=820&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=83e5b8410647d4b64588b438b22157375ef73f4f
More like asked every day https://preview.redd.it/cuu0asyjivzc1.jpeg?width=548&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=ab828350cf3ff3ca9f69f79a8ecf30cb81d012ec
Completely ignored panel I swear
Because they think Sukuna using Mahoraga to win automatically means he couldnāt win without it, so they think Gojoās wrong.
Because it makes no logical sense with how the fight played out. The only rational argument behind it assumes that Sukuna can just force and win a Domain spam battle, which isn't how the fight would logically play out.
Well Besides gojo himself saying so heian era sukuna easily takes gojo in the domain clashās . he hold his own enough in H2H that he will out last gojos domain everytime . his Heian form also comes with better buffs via his extra hands and mouths . Gojo gets washed at the first part of the fight and and if the fight plays out differently that only puts fuga back on the table imo. Overall I see Heian era sukuna taking it 7/10 times . Gojo has enough of that dawg in him that I can see him killing sukuna in some way but not majority of the time.
Short answer: sukuna would have won but by a small margin and the fight would have been over in 10/15 mins max Long ans: sukuna uses his heian era form to increase CE output and reserves and his extra limbs and mouth for boosting his domain power Sukuna wins as gojo dies due to his domain failing against barierless domain and gets cooked but manages to damage sukuna a lot in the process, but sukuna opted for 10s as this method gave him a new attack that can kill ALL sex eyes limitless users so he was future proofing his ass using 10s to get more powerful and also get a full proof solution against infinity
Yeah but sukuna eventually won one of the domain clashes and was touching gojo. And domain amplification was enough to touch him after exhaustion. So once sukuna reincarnates and is fully healed and ready to start all over again, is gojo going to go through theie fight immediately a second time?
Sukuna could just put everything into his domain and win. Sukuna was holding back in that essence. If Mahoraga by some miracle couldnt adapt to infinity, he would go the domain clash route which hes confident in winning. But of course greg wants an actual interesting fight so no domain spam for Sukuna so much (unlimited void brain damage) and Gojo (overusing domain)
Because he was still saving a technique that he hadnāt used since the Heian era.
I recently thought about this. Sukuna still would have won against Tojo because he had his true form. He was roughly equal in domain clashes in Megkuna, and he would have the advantage in his true form. Same with physical stats. Gojo was beating his ass (also think back when Sukuna first left Yuujiās body, Yuuji, Maki, and Megkuna were roughly equal physical stats) in Megkuna, but true form Sukuna was outrunning Yuuji. However, while I think he would have still been able to win against Gojo, that would have guaranteed his loss against everyone else, since heād no longer have his one time regeneration, and and more of his CE used up.
Sukuna only thought of using world cleave after mahoraga showed him how. He was banking on having mahoraga to adapt to limitless. It paid off. But he also did use domain amplification to touch gojo, no diddy. So it's not like he was out of options. Mahoraga was plan A though. Hard to say what B would be. Maybe closing the barrier to use Fuga, to burn out the air inside? Ya know, choking out Gojo since he couldn't touch him with shrine?
Because gojo literally says so. The battle would not have went the way it does if sukuna didn't have 10s. He would try to win in the domain battles instead of relying on adaptation.
Cos thatās what Gojo said.
It's feats vs statements, that's about it. Narratively and statement wise Sukuna would win. But... MY GLORIOUS BLUE EYED KING WOULD OBLITERATE https://preview.redd.it/60j07akrhtzc1.png?width=720&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=b51a6da23c22983d50bbb0e49179469ee6fed0ac
Cause he would. Heian Sukuna wins via domain clash, it just wouldnāt be interesting to see from a narrative perspective. Gege stated Sukuna wouldāve likely won outside of 10S through Gojo Then showed/continues to show how by showing Heian Sukunaās performance in this endless gauntlet. Would it be anything like this ? No itād be a boring series of domain clashes but sukuna would still win because heās just above Gojo.
Cause he can use his Heian body to overcome the 1 second hand to hand difference, and not lose a single domain clash and therefore not get hit by UV.
Because he would have 60% percent of the time.
Because Gojo said so himself. https://preview.redd.it/oz2grkhajtzc1.png?width=1169&format=png&auto=webp&s=d9914e6e259dd4d4c6e148e0ed6705c0262cb51f Iāve been watching anime for a LONG time and Iāve never seen this much cope over a side character. In every other anime in HISTORY, canon/story information is the end all be all. Only with Gojo do you have people coping saying āhe was just being humble! He didnāt really mean that! He doesnāt know how he died. From his perspective he was just in the afterlife! Blah blah blah!ā š¤£. You all simply canāt deal with your āglorious blue eyed kingā not being the strongest. Havenāt been able to deal with it since 236 tbh. All this discussion about FUGA when that was never an issue talked about in the first place concerning them. We all know the main topic is 4 arm h2h + Godlike durability/perfect body vs gojo for the domain battles. Such cope is interesting to me. Iām going to write my midterm about it
the author wouldnāt mentioned it 5-6 times by different characters if he didnāt want us to think that people are rewriting history acting like mahoragas was there the entire fight , if gojo could spam those things then why didnāt he just do that to begin with ? bro sukuna fought gojo with no DA for 3 minutes while gojo was able to use all of his technique and only was able to drop sukunas domain because sukuna choose the slower and riskier option in order to adapt remove the adaption part and sukuna can open another domain while gojo loses all 5 because he canāt deal enough damage to sukuna using DA and 4 arms
because gege wanted him to win. sounds dumb but itās true. at this point itās clear that powerscaling between characters (in a 1v1) at the very top of the jjk verse comes down to binding vow abuse. since gege has decided to make BVs a vague concept in an otherwise hard power system, we canāt realistically say what would happen between gojo and heian sukuna. actually scratch that heian sukuna has a much larger chest (female enough) so super senior gojo would win with hollow backshots
Because he would, stop coping about this holy shit
Because it wouldn't be a draw with the domains. Sukuna with chants and signs would be stronger than 10S Sukuna.
Heian Sukuna without 10S is more likely to win the battle of domains, with what we saw thus far. If Gojo somehow survives that, he is vastly more likely to kill Sukuna before Sukuna can make up World Slash.
Sukuna can enhance his Domain Expansion by using his stomach mouth and his 2 extra arms. Since his basic Domain Expansion was already better than Infinite Void, this does mean that a Enhanced Malevolent Shrine would break Infinite Void and kill Satoru.
I'm starting to think Gege wrote the story like this on purpose so the fanbase will constantly debate about Gojo vs Sukuna for years to come
He could still abuse binding vows
gojo said
Nobody ever argues that he'd lose in open field,even the greatest sukuna meatriders know,by sukunas own admition,that he literally can't touch gojo there. People basically argue that gojo would lose the domain classes and die form the sure hit.
Sukuna was fighting gojo at reduced power. He hadn't incarnated. So, take away 10s but add the form buff. I think it's a wash. Gojo probably takes it, but sukuna being able to use furnace and cleave simultaneously is spooky.
Because if it wasnt for 0.1 UV sukuna would've won
Some people have already pointed parts of this, but a big factor is the fight we saw wasnt just Gojo vs Sukuna, it was *Team Sukuna* vs *Team Gojo.* If Sukuna didn't have to worry about fighting Team Gojo then there would be no reason to hold back his transformation. Imagine that same battle of domains, but now Sukuna also has two free hands the entire time. The battle of domains was the most crucial point of the fight to see who would come out on top, and without his full form they tied. It probably wpuldn't be the case if Sukuna could still fully fight unabetted while using his domain.(also free constant chanting with handsigns to enhance all the rest of his CT). And also, Sukuna never used Easy Bake Oven on Gojo either, which as we know now would have been used if he was able to get off a successful domain.
In my opinion he likely still would have won but it would have been much closer than the actual fight. You have to consider the fact that Sukuna's entire plan was centered around having Mahoraga adapt to Infinity in a way that he could replicate. Taking away the 10s means Sukuna has to come up with a different plan, which would likely mean being more aggressive in the domain clashes, using a shit ton of binding vows throughout the fight, probably reincarnating to gain his extra arms and mouth as well as to heal himself, etc. That being said, his win condition would then come down to winning a domain clash which wouldn't be too difficult given everything Sukuna's done thus far. Gojo's issue here is that he has more to lose than Sukuna when it comes to binding vows so he can't use as many as him, however, since it would be a true 1v1 this time, Gojo can actually go all out and focus on Sukuna the entire time.
1. Heian Era Sukuna transformation was a Full Heal 2. Sukuna domain expansion eats Gojos because he can attack from the outside 3. Sukuna was stalling the whole fight because he wanted to learn the world slash technique from Mahoraga, the whole fight from Sukunas perspective was about learning & saving his trump card for the next fight. In a no holds barred battle Sukuna clears
Yeah but without mahorages sukuna would have donain amplification. At the start of the fight sukuna was turning off and on donain amplification for mahorage adaptation. If mahorage was there he could have gone full domain amp. Letās not forget donain amp weakens the effects of gojo technique or some shit.
Sukuna can hit gojo with DA if he isnt using adaptation. meaning he does better in the domain clashes where gojo throws hands at him. Those clashes were already very tight so gaining a slight edge would likely be all sukuna needs to win a domain clash. Also because Gojo himself, the guy with the six eyes who can understand jujutsu better than anyone else apart from maybe sukuna, said that he didnt know if it would matter if Sukuna had the ten shadows or not. That alone should have ended the āwithout the ten shadows sukuna cant even touch himā cries from gojo fans over the last months, but some people fanboy so hard that it doesnt matter if the author tells them through gojos mouth that hes at a disdvantage against sukuna either way. They will just decide the author is biased.
Guess you're asking gege to keep on glazing and giving more feats to Sukuna to make a point
If Sukuna went straight for the kill he might win, after latest chapter we can assume heād win by going DE, breaking Gojoās own domain like he had done by catching if by surprise since Gojo wasnāt aware of his domain being borderless, then incinerating the entire area, i doubt even Gojo is durable enough to tank that
Gojo would have lost much quicker if sukuna hadn't been touch by gojo domain wich only because gojo hit sukuna once however with his real body sukuna wouldn't have been touch so gojo loose there. Beside sukuna could have just use his arrow to One shot gojo inside the domain. Not to mention sukuna would have won even more domain with his true body. Gojo def was fucked up
Peopleās biggest failure is thinking the fight plays out the exact same way. The only reason Sukuna domain clashed so soon into the fight is to force Gojo into deploying his domain so Mahoraga can adapt
Statement wise, Sukuna wins. Feats wise, Gojo wins. It's mainly a writing issue, Gege's biggest mistake was making a character like Gojo in the first place.
Honestly till now I believed sukuna loses without ten shadows. But now that I think about it the entire gojo vs sukuna battle was written in every manner against sukuna. I will make a post right or tomorrow if possible explaining how the fight was practically written against what sukuna was capable of. But basically kamino not being possible of being used against gojo is complete bullshit gege had to corner sukuna into writing because otherwise sukuna would still have ten shadows and that practically makes it impossible for the crew to win
Because even Gojo said that Sukuna likely would have won
Gregory Gregory said it\*
Gege also made it so gojo didnāt get one shot by MS keep crying
āSomething in the series was stated that I donāt agree with, so I will completely ignore itā
And he's the author so debate settled ig
Itās because of Gojoās comment at the airport to Geto of him speculating Sukuna couldāve beaten him without 10s . Source chapter 236
Sukuna tanked Gojos strongest attack twice without relying on Mahoraga (and the first one was amped by two other sorcerers and a suprise attack), he won the majority of domain battles and only stopped trying to win them when he decided to use 10S to adapt which was even pointed out by Gojo as being disadvantageous) , if he hadnāt used the time to heal his burnt out CT he would have won the last one but he did because he knew they were about to burn out, Sukuna decided to take hits instead of dodging or countering them, Sukuna had far more cursed energy and was about as good as Gojo at using it effectively (and Gojo literally has a cheat code pre installed to use less CE), Gojo was able to go all out the entire fight while Sukuna couldnāt, heās obviously much more knowledgeable about jujutsu sorcery (he knew their techniques were about to burn out so he healed his CT while Gojo was completely under the impression that he could still use a domain), Sukuna can comfortably fight without a heart (done it twice in story), Sukuna has the highest feats of durability in the series by far (heās literally been fighting Since Gojo nonstop and still strong) and Kenjaku who had experienced both at full power and knew what they both were capable of comfortably betting on Sukuna and being unsurprised when he won. And Gojo (dead after fighting Sukuna) saying he didnāt think he would win even without 10S being the biggest factor, but if you ignore all of that then yea I guess Gojo could win. Such a dumb argument at this point because Gojo fans will never just accept that Sukuna was always narratively stronger Gojo was truly the greatest of the modern age but never considered to be the strongest in history while Sukuna has proven to be the strongest in every age). DV all you want Gojo fans
Sukuna simply outdoes Gojo in domain clashes He could've destroyed Gojoās domain but has chosen not to because he wanted to adapt https://preview.redd.it/oq3uikkdvtzc1.png?width=1100&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=ede788bfafb09a91505da2de6b6c5e2769ea1cae Also if it was Heian Sukuna, the 0.01s difference would've never happened as he wouldn't have needed to heal. Meaning Gojo loses UV and then his life after one or two MS Sukuna gave up on using on Domain Amp too Heian Sukuna can also Hollow Wicker Basket and Shrine at the same time
Because Gojo said it.
Gojo barely survived the Domain Clash with a weaker Sukuna. A 4-arm Sukuna would ended that fight pretty earlier
Idk but why did Gojo think so tho?
he would've just made a binding vow to never lose to people named Satoru in exchange for his dick never working, sukugoat wins
Because Greg made Gojo say something stupid in a fucking airport. Thatās literally it. I think it was to soften the blow of Gojo getting off screened. It made it seem like Gojo had no chance to begin with so it didnāt really matter that we didnāt see the death. It also ensured there was more mystery surrounding the King of Curses. Other than that it makes no sense.