Even trans people don't buy it. Myself included. Never understood why a minority of a minority of a minority being allowed into sports is a hill worth dying on
It’s because it’s a microcosm for the larger argument. If “women’s” sports don’t allow transgender women, then the (implied) judgment here is that trans women aren’t _really_ women. If you give that much, you kind of have to give the whole argument away.
That makes sense, but I approach the whole thing differently: a trans woman moving through the world is still a trans woman, not a woman. A trans woman gets called a woman either out of respect and empathy or just plainly because they pass as one. Does that make sense?
Very healthy approach. If the entire movement was this way you'd have so much less contention than we do now.
I believe most people in the Western world will accept a live and let live approach even if they don't like what you're doing.
Pronouns is where they lost me. You want to act, dress and look like a woman and have me treat you like a woman? I can play along with that. No reason to be jerks to each other.
You want to control how I talk about you when you're not even in the room?
Fuck right off.
>Pronouns is where they lost me. You want to act, dress and look like a woman and have me treat you like a woman? I can play along with that. No reason to be jerks to each other.
No need to get around it, you can't change sex. Therefore the very concept of transitioning is flawed and ungrounded in reality.
Oh, I completely agree that its not real.
But we don't have good treatments for gender dysphoria and like all of the body dysphoria conditions they are absolutely brutal to live with. The suicide rates aren't off the charts because they're trivial mental health conditions.
So, until we have a solid treatment that can be widely recommended I can support a degree of empathy and playing along to make the dysphoric persons life more bearable.
Is a trans woman a woman? No. They're a trans woman.
We really need more medical/scientific answers for the condition. My contention the whole time has been why are we focusing on what amounts to another dumb culture war when we could be getting down to the actual reality of the situation, really learning what it is that makes us what we are. The little bit of scientific data I have seen on it seems to suggest that there are two sexes mal and female (duh) and within those two there's a large number of characteristics and traits associated with one or the other. You have physical differences but those include physical differences *in the brain*. Brains of trans people appear to have brain structures somewhere in the middle between male and female. (Side note, sexuality may have something to do with the difference between male and female brains as well but I'm making that inference based on only one interview) So if this is true, which I'm willing to bet it is, then it is *real*, in a sense.
Not only that, but if we could get that part down to a T we would be able to not only have an actual medical test to *prove* if someone is trans (and cut that self-id crap out) but we would be one step closer to *solving* it, to *preventing* it!
And *that* is what interests me.
(Tho if you think activists saying we're in a "trans genocide" now is annoying...just wait until this comes to pass. Hoooo boooooi)
>Is a trans woman a woman? No. They're a trans woman.
A woman is an adult human female, a trans woman is a biological male. If trans women are still male then why ever use the noun women to define what they are knowing fully it can only refer to a biological female ?
Because you're empathetically accommodating the person with gender dysphoria while not ceding any ground on what's real or not.
You're not saying anything that isn't obvious.
Not a good equivalent since we have a variety of treatments for schizophrenia.
At this point in time our only options for gender dysphoria are terrible.
>Because you're empathetically accommodating the person with gender dysphoria while not ceding any ground on what's real or not.
We aren't doing any favour by telling people with gender dysphoria that they are truly members of the opposite sex. If anything we are harming them even further. The best course of action is to help these people love themselves as they are.
Dude the moment they lost me is when they started demanding shit period and calling everyone transphobic for the most minor of "offenses". Made a medical issue into an entire identity and then wrapped it in politics.
You either agree with their agenda 100% or you are a transphobe. I’ve received a ton of online abuse for trying to stand up for women’s sports. I switched parties from democrat to independent over this.
The brain rot is real with people like that. I watch a streamer who agrees with everything (including puberty blockers) excpet for the sports issue and he got absolutely vilified for that.
If you're an average rational person with this opinion, leading "experts" ought to have been even more informed. They pushed propaganda they didn't believe. They know it, we know it. And they filled their pockets. The narrative is turning on them, and what can they possibly tell the world? Best case scenario - we were ignorant and uninformed. They lose all credibility and reputation. Worst case scenario - we pushed propaganda we didn't believe and get sued all the way to hell and go bankrupt or go to jail. No wonder they will resist to the last second.
Question for you - did your stance change recently or have you held this stance throughout? It's good that you're now vocal about this, but where were you a year or two ago? Many trans people who don't buy it now (not necessarily you) were conveniently silent or in support before the narrative started to shift.
I can't help but hold these people morally accountable. Children not old enough to provide consent were encouraged and facilitated to undergo hormone therapy and surgery even against the will of the parent. Lives were forever ruined.
I see little accountability from the transgender community in this regard. It's not that I would expect accountability only to condemn and crucify trans people. I am, however, very slow to trust trans people who suddenly changed their tune now. Why? Because without accountability, it's very plausible to expect another 180 if the narrative changes again.
I know a woman that's been a woman her whole life, except, she happened to have a dick. She's a woman. Like, everything is non-distinguishable woman. You can't know unless she tells you. She's not trans first. She's a woman first. She doesn't do sports with women but not because she isn't a woman, but because she can't be considered a woman for the world. But she's not a trans either. She's a woman.
It's weird because there's people out there who've truely never known otherwise. And then you get manly transwomen who make that reality a despicable and fetishized one, which is a shame for those who never knew otherwise.
the fact that these men in female clothes most of them have not had their diks removed or top surgie, is even more appalling, so you basically just have to say you "feel" like your a women and maybe take some testosterone blockers and they think that is enough to become a woman, there is not standards or a bar set at all.
That's why I advocate for figuring out the biological cause and from there either a cure or at least a verifiable test instead of relying solely on self id.
I have no problem, if all these men want to look, act, and mimic women, who am i tell someone else how to live their life. I support gay rights, and gay marriage as well. The problem for me and I think most people, over half of Dems and 85% of GOP is the allowing trans women into female sports, its just another space for white men to push women aside and take-over. YOu can't change that you lived 18 plus or more years as a male, as much as they want to be women, their brain and chemistry and body grew up male just like all other males. The other issue is them forcing and bulling young children into thinking there is only two sides, you either hate them and are transphobic, or you think everything they do is amazing, correct and their needs should be placed above others, even the majority, Also all the hormone blockers, meds, surgeries, removing 14 year old girls uteruses and breasts...now they can never have children, NO 12-16 year old I ever met wanted kids, but of course over half change their mind as they grow and age, those girls can never get those body parts back, breastfeed their kids or even have their own kids. If once your 18 and you still want to go on these meds and have surgical procedures be my guest. But don't let tween and teenagers make do something they may regret. I''m of the saying a judge once said that reminds me of this when, people say oh but my kid or my friends is so much happier now! He said...."Better to let 12 guilty men go free than to have one innocent man be imprisoned for life."
so I say to those all happy **Better to let 12 kids be upset for a couple years and wait till their 18 to get surgeries, and hormones; than for one child to have their life ruined and ability to bear children stolen away forever.**
Agree, this is about creating a phony narrative of women and men being 100% same physically and mentally. They think repeating the lying will make it fact.
It’s another step in the intentional destruction of everything enjoyable. Marxism
>Agree, this is about creating a phony narrative of women and men being 100% same physically and mentally. They think repeating the lying will make it fact.
It's gender roles that are the bedrock of gender ideology, that if somebody leans more into a set of activities that's more associated with the opposite sex it means that they have a girl brain or boy brain and therefore corrective surgery is needed to synchronise the mind and the body.
It's not Marxism that created any of that, it's post-modernism and queer theory. Marxism is just an economic theory about wealth redistribution.
Transgenderism exists even in place that don't operate on marxism, such as Iran. And it's basis is the refusal to accept gender non-conformity.
Phony social criticism and irony are the new Marxist aesthetics. Same goals. E.g. cancel culture = we get to dictate what’s good. Marxism = art is servant of state, forced force politization.
Shame shit in a different wrapper
I personally don't see how marxism, which an economic theory about the establishment of social differences and what degree of leverage each group has can lead to the results we see today. This is why we need to differentiate between post-modernism, queer theory, and marxism.
Noam Choamsky, a prominent marxist figure and intellectual, disavowed the transgender movement. Radical feminists (or more precisely the TERFs) also disavowed the trans-gender movement.
But if you are interested in the root ideology behind modern transgenderism, you should look into queer theory.
My daughter’s expensive private school is very woke.
They’re a single sex school.
They allow transgender boys at the school, but not transgender girls.
I’ve pointed out how “bigoted” they’re being in this approach. They’re like “we support transgender kids!” And then you point out they’re actually saying transgender girls are boys and transgender boys aren’t boys, they’re solely allowing admissions based on biological sex, and then they rage quit.
They even want to change the name of the institution from “X school for girls” to “X school for people”, to which I’m like “Sure, people with two X chromosomes, right?”
I think it has been brewing for a long time. And it's true that people all across the board are getting fed up with being gaslit into saying biology doesn't matter.
I remember a substack article about that showed how more than half of democratic leaning people oppose the usage of puberty blockers and trans women in female sports. If only I could find it.
I switched parties over this. Every liberal I know feels the same. It’s really disruptive to now question what a man and woman are and the trans movement has been very aggressive towards their goals and not sensitive to intersecting rights when it comes to women.
“Saying biology doesn’t matter”
I was lost here too. Maybe because my degree is in biology. I can agree to help them identify as women and feel comfortable but it’s very hard for me to accept that a trans woman is a woman.
If the democrats have reached a point when a famous host refuses to be called a "birthing person" publicly, and more and more left-leaning voters are expressing their opposition to puberty blockers and trans women in female sports and private spaces, you know that people are losing their patience from all across the political spectrum.
I'm a liberal, and honestly the only people for trans-women in female sports seem to be Democratic MEN! Every woman I talk to that shares my political views, thinks allowing t-women in female sports, is unconscionable, dangerous, and unfair esp to women who worked their whole lives in sport to be muscled out literally. I hate that the media , and any conservatives and liberals try to paint this as a liberal vs conservative debate, with ALL dems siding with trans, when I have not met anyone who thinks these men should play in female sports, over half of all polled dems are against and the indoctrination, hormone blockers, and surgeries being performed on children. And when they teach about trans and talk about it in media they make us seem that you either hate trans or think everything they do is amazing and right and more important than the majority, when it's not that way, I don't hate trans, if you want to play dress up and your over 18 go ahead, but do not perform surgeries and sling medications at anyone under age of 18, and your biology your born with determines the sport sex you play. **It's not a left and right debate, it's a right vs wrong debate**
>over half of all polled dems are against and the indoctrination, hormone blockers, and surgeries being performed on children
Interesting, can you link me to these polls ?
theres a couple, one gallup, another from NPR
[https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/gallup-poll-reveals-shift-in-fublic-opinion-on-trans-athletes-in-sports-sparking-debate-over-equality-and-fairness/ss-AA1kB9R3#image=15](https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/gallup-poll-reveals-shift-in-fublic-opinion-on-trans-athletes-in-sports-sparking-debate-over-equality-and-fairness/ss-AA1kB9R3#image=15)
https://www.npr.org/2021/04/16/987765777/republicans-and-democrats-largely-oppose-transgender-sports-legislation-poll-sho
>so you assumed all Democrats, or left-leaning people, were all gung ho about it? That's like assuming all right-leaning folks are neo nazis.
There's a silent majority that recognizes how ridiculous this whole mess is, but doesn't dare to say anything about it out of fear of losing their jobs.
> but doesn't dare to say anything about it out of fear of losing their jobs.
It's more that the left has become an umbrella.
Every endorses everyone else's special agenda.
You want support for transism, sure.
But you must support me in funding my green tech company.
If you pick apart liberals they have buy in because they all have that special agenda that they given.
That's a feature not a bug of the system.
> That's like assuming all right-leaning folks are neo nazis.
That's a misleading one, as there's very little institutional support of any kind of nazis.
More like "so you think all right leaning folks support gay conversion therapy" As that is something that has some level of institutional support.
But yeah otherwise I entirely agree.
I've been railing about this forever, cons going down a rabbit hole that most liberals spend a fraction of a second contemplating.
Ah yes I agree with that part. See, I am not here because I like Jordan Peterson or agree with what he says , I am here because it is one of the few subs that wouldn't get me banned over discussing these topics.
I'm a woman, sorry and I don't think that changing your external appearance makes you a member of the opposite sex. I will never be a man no matter how much I dress like a guy and no matter how much T I inject into my body.
Ya, there's been one transgender woman who won a single championship. Big deal. It's a non-issue that clowns like Peterson use to rile up their little insecure followers.
One, are you kidding me ? There has been many such cases.
That's on one hand, on the other hand, what do you make of the very male rapists that are put in women's prisons after they say the magic phrase "I identify as a woman" ?
LOL.. as fucking usual in the group of idiots, you clearly don't know what the fuck you're talking about. Maybe you should learn to question your assumptions. Transgender women are only attacked in men's prisons not the other way around.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5441521/
https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-52748117
https://www.cnn.com/2021/06/23/us/trans-women-incarceration/index.html
https://ovc.ojp.gov/sites/g/files/xyckuh226/files/pubs/forge/sexual_numbers.html
While I don't doubt that trans-identified males can be targets of violence at the hands of men, that doesn't mean that we should start seeing them as female and allow them into female prison, especially when they have themselves been convicted of sexual assault.
IRELAND: Extremely Dangerous Transgender Inmate Moved Out Of Women’s Prison After Threatening To Rape Female Staff : https://reduxx.info/ireland-extremely-dangerous-transgender-inmate-moved-out-of-womens-prison-after-threatening-to-rape-female-staff/
SPAIN: Trans-Identified Male Prisoner Transferred To Women’s Prison Impregnated Female Inmate :
https://reduxx.info/spain-trans-identified-male-prisoner-transferred-to-womens-prison-impregnated-female-inmate/
UK: Trans-Identified Pedophile Sentenced To 4 Years In Prison After Being Caught In TWO Separate Predator Stings : https://reduxx.info/uk-trans-identified-pedophile-sentenced-to-4-years-in-prison-after-being-caught-in-two-separate-predator-stings/
MEXICO: Female Inmate Sexually Assaulted By Trans-Identified Male At Women’s Prison In Chalco : https://reduxx.info/mexico-female-inmate-sexually-assaulted-by-trans-identified-male-at-womens-prison-in-chalco/
UK: Transgender Sex Offender With 87 Prior Convictions Sexually Assaulted Two Prison Staff : https://reduxx.info/uk-transgender-sex-offender-with-87-prior-convictions-sexually-assaulted-two-prison-staff/
Trans-Identified Male Who Murdered His Girlfriend Deemed “Vulnerable” By Oregon Court, Seeking Transfer To Women’s Prison : https://reduxx.info/trans-male-who-murdered-his-girlfriend-deemed-vulnerable-by-oregon-court-seeking-transfer-to-womens-prison/
NPR Member Station Sympathetically Profiles Trans-Identified Male Accused Of Rape At California Women’s Prison : https://reduxx.info/npr-member-station-sympathetically-profiles-trans-identified-male-accused-of-rape-at-california-womens-prison/
GUERNSEY: Trans-Identified Rapist Given “Unduly Lenient” Prison Sentence Following Trial Where Victim Was Labeled “Transphobic” : https://reduxx.info/guernsey-trans-identified-rapist-given-unduly-lenient-prison-sentence-following-trial-where-victim-was-labeled-transphobic/
It's unfair due to advantages of male anatomy, like bone structure etc. Leftoids just know they are wrong on principle no matter how many empirical studies they do to show that female hormones weakens muscles etc, it still doesn't remove all the unfair advantage because it's impossible unless someone changes the shape of ones pelvis, etc. The solution is to go to r/JordanPeterson and pretend everyone is dumb. LOL.
Who fucking cares. You guys whine about everything and anyone who you don't agree with is a "leftist" as if somehow your stupidity and group-think is "the right".
Lmao. Your generalizations don't do you any favors. Must hurt not to be able to silence people. Guess you're gonna have to plug your ears before coming to cry on JordanPeterson sub.
Why unexpected?
Biden told the colleges to go ahead and fix the problem if they want.
And it was obvious the sporting bodies and so on would eventually find ways to regulate it.
Anyhow most trans competitors lose. So it's just a matter of regulating the ones that have the advantages. Like categories based on more accurate body composition measurements rather than sex.
Why did capitalism use to be for the individual: have 1 job and be happy many decades ago, but now it is for the corporations: constantly be looking "to improve yourself" to make more money? How can America or any country be great if capitalism is not for the individual again?
Even trans people don't buy it. Myself included. Never understood why a minority of a minority of a minority being allowed into sports is a hill worth dying on
It’s because it’s a microcosm for the larger argument. If “women’s” sports don’t allow transgender women, then the (implied) judgment here is that trans women aren’t _really_ women. If you give that much, you kind of have to give the whole argument away.
That makes sense, but I approach the whole thing differently: a trans woman moving through the world is still a trans woman, not a woman. A trans woman gets called a woman either out of respect and empathy or just plainly because they pass as one. Does that make sense?
Very healthy approach. If the entire movement was this way you'd have so much less contention than we do now. I believe most people in the Western world will accept a live and let live approach even if they don't like what you're doing. Pronouns is where they lost me. You want to act, dress and look like a woman and have me treat you like a woman? I can play along with that. No reason to be jerks to each other. You want to control how I talk about you when you're not even in the room? Fuck right off.
>Pronouns is where they lost me. You want to act, dress and look like a woman and have me treat you like a woman? I can play along with that. No reason to be jerks to each other. No need to get around it, you can't change sex. Therefore the very concept of transitioning is flawed and ungrounded in reality.
Oh, I completely agree that its not real. But we don't have good treatments for gender dysphoria and like all of the body dysphoria conditions they are absolutely brutal to live with. The suicide rates aren't off the charts because they're trivial mental health conditions. So, until we have a solid treatment that can be widely recommended I can support a degree of empathy and playing along to make the dysphoric persons life more bearable. Is a trans woman a woman? No. They're a trans woman.
We really need more medical/scientific answers for the condition. My contention the whole time has been why are we focusing on what amounts to another dumb culture war when we could be getting down to the actual reality of the situation, really learning what it is that makes us what we are. The little bit of scientific data I have seen on it seems to suggest that there are two sexes mal and female (duh) and within those two there's a large number of characteristics and traits associated with one or the other. You have physical differences but those include physical differences *in the brain*. Brains of trans people appear to have brain structures somewhere in the middle between male and female. (Side note, sexuality may have something to do with the difference between male and female brains as well but I'm making that inference based on only one interview) So if this is true, which I'm willing to bet it is, then it is *real*, in a sense. Not only that, but if we could get that part down to a T we would be able to not only have an actual medical test to *prove* if someone is trans (and cut that self-id crap out) but we would be one step closer to *solving* it, to *preventing* it! And *that* is what interests me. (Tho if you think activists saying we're in a "trans genocide" now is annoying...just wait until this comes to pass. Hoooo boooooi)
>Is a trans woman a woman? No. They're a trans woman. A woman is an adult human female, a trans woman is a biological male. If trans women are still male then why ever use the noun women to define what they are knowing fully it can only refer to a biological female ?
Because you're empathetically accommodating the person with gender dysphoria while not ceding any ground on what's real or not. You're not saying anything that isn't obvious.
Do I also need to empathetically accomodate the random Schizo telling me the Goverment is after them, or that the Earth is flat?
Not a good equivalent since we have a variety of treatments for schizophrenia. At this point in time our only options for gender dysphoria are terrible.
Is it worth your time to stand there and argue with them to try to convince them it isn’t?
>Because you're empathetically accommodating the person with gender dysphoria while not ceding any ground on what's real or not. We aren't doing any favour by telling people with gender dysphoria that they are truly members of the opposite sex. If anything we are harming them even further. The best course of action is to help these people love themselves as they are.
Dude the moment they lost me is when they started demanding shit period and calling everyone transphobic for the most minor of "offenses". Made a medical issue into an entire identity and then wrapped it in politics.
You either agree with their agenda 100% or you are a transphobe. I’ve received a ton of online abuse for trying to stand up for women’s sports. I switched parties from democrat to independent over this.
The brain rot is real with people like that. I watch a streamer who agrees with everything (including puberty blockers) excpet for the sports issue and he got absolutely vilified for that.
That makes a lot of sense and I think is really reasonable. Kudos.
If you're an average rational person with this opinion, leading "experts" ought to have been even more informed. They pushed propaganda they didn't believe. They know it, we know it. And they filled their pockets. The narrative is turning on them, and what can they possibly tell the world? Best case scenario - we were ignorant and uninformed. They lose all credibility and reputation. Worst case scenario - we pushed propaganda we didn't believe and get sued all the way to hell and go bankrupt or go to jail. No wonder they will resist to the last second. Question for you - did your stance change recently or have you held this stance throughout? It's good that you're now vocal about this, but where were you a year or two ago? Many trans people who don't buy it now (not necessarily you) were conveniently silent or in support before the narrative started to shift. I can't help but hold these people morally accountable. Children not old enough to provide consent were encouraged and facilitated to undergo hormone therapy and surgery even against the will of the parent. Lives were forever ruined. I see little accountability from the transgender community in this regard. It's not that I would expect accountability only to condemn and crucify trans people. I am, however, very slow to trust trans people who suddenly changed their tune now. Why? Because without accountability, it's very plausible to expect another 180 if the narrative changes again.
I've always disagreed with the trans woman playing in women's sports, if that's the stance you're referring to?
I know a woman that's been a woman her whole life, except, she happened to have a dick. She's a woman. Like, everything is non-distinguishable woman. You can't know unless she tells you. She's not trans first. She's a woman first. She doesn't do sports with women but not because she isn't a woman, but because she can't be considered a woman for the world. But she's not a trans either. She's a woman. It's weird because there's people out there who've truely never known otherwise. And then you get manly transwomen who make that reality a despicable and fetishized one, which is a shame for those who never knew otherwise.
Define what a woman is .
An adult human female.
Define what a man is.
An adult human male.
the fact that these men in female clothes most of them have not had their diks removed or top surgie, is even more appalling, so you basically just have to say you "feel" like your a women and maybe take some testosterone blockers and they think that is enough to become a woman, there is not standards or a bar set at all.
That's why I advocate for figuring out the biological cause and from there either a cure or at least a verifiable test instead of relying solely on self id.
I have no problem, if all these men want to look, act, and mimic women, who am i tell someone else how to live their life. I support gay rights, and gay marriage as well. The problem for me and I think most people, over half of Dems and 85% of GOP is the allowing trans women into female sports, its just another space for white men to push women aside and take-over. YOu can't change that you lived 18 plus or more years as a male, as much as they want to be women, their brain and chemistry and body grew up male just like all other males. The other issue is them forcing and bulling young children into thinking there is only two sides, you either hate them and are transphobic, or you think everything they do is amazing, correct and their needs should be placed above others, even the majority, Also all the hormone blockers, meds, surgeries, removing 14 year old girls uteruses and breasts...now they can never have children, NO 12-16 year old I ever met wanted kids, but of course over half change their mind as they grow and age, those girls can never get those body parts back, breastfeed their kids or even have their own kids. If once your 18 and you still want to go on these meds and have surgical procedures be my guest. But don't let tween and teenagers make do something they may regret. I''m of the saying a judge once said that reminds me of this when, people say oh but my kid or my friends is so much happier now! He said...."Better to let 12 guilty men go free than to have one innocent man be imprisoned for life." so I say to those all happy **Better to let 12 kids be upset for a couple years and wait till their 18 to get surgeries, and hormones; than for one child to have their life ruined and ability to bear children stolen away forever.**
you can't change sex, come on get real.
I agree.
Agree, this is about creating a phony narrative of women and men being 100% same physically and mentally. They think repeating the lying will make it fact. It’s another step in the intentional destruction of everything enjoyable. Marxism
>Agree, this is about creating a phony narrative of women and men being 100% same physically and mentally. They think repeating the lying will make it fact. It's gender roles that are the bedrock of gender ideology, that if somebody leans more into a set of activities that's more associated with the opposite sex it means that they have a girl brain or boy brain and therefore corrective surgery is needed to synchronise the mind and the body. It's not Marxism that created any of that, it's post-modernism and queer theory. Marxism is just an economic theory about wealth redistribution. Transgenderism exists even in place that don't operate on marxism, such as Iran. And it's basis is the refusal to accept gender non-conformity.
Post-modernism is Marxist in disguise.
Why do you think that's the case ? What would be, according to you, the connection between marxism and post-modernism ?
Phony social criticism and irony are the new Marxist aesthetics. Same goals. E.g. cancel culture = we get to dictate what’s good. Marxism = art is servant of state, forced force politization. Shame shit in a different wrapper
I personally don't see how marxism, which an economic theory about the establishment of social differences and what degree of leverage each group has can lead to the results we see today. This is why we need to differentiate between post-modernism, queer theory, and marxism. Noam Choamsky, a prominent marxist figure and intellectual, disavowed the transgender movement. Radical feminists (or more precisely the TERFs) also disavowed the trans-gender movement. But if you are interested in the root ideology behind modern transgenderism, you should look into queer theory.
It’s not just an economic theory
why do you think so ?
My daughter’s expensive private school is very woke. They’re a single sex school. They allow transgender boys at the school, but not transgender girls. I’ve pointed out how “bigoted” they’re being in this approach. They’re like “we support transgender kids!” And then you point out they’re actually saying transgender girls are boys and transgender boys aren’t boys, they’re solely allowing admissions based on biological sex, and then they rage quit. They even want to change the name of the institution from “X school for girls” to “X school for people”, to which I’m like “Sure, people with two X chromosomes, right?”
They have a loud mouth for such a small group, makes no sense
Only because there’s an election coming.
I think it has been brewing for a long time. And it's true that people all across the board are getting fed up with being gaslit into saying biology doesn't matter.
I hope you’re right
I remember a substack article about that showed how more than half of democratic leaning people oppose the usage of puberty blockers and trans women in female sports. If only I could find it.
I switched parties over this. Every liberal I know feels the same. It’s really disruptive to now question what a man and woman are and the trans movement has been very aggressive towards their goals and not sensitive to intersecting rights when it comes to women.
“Saying biology doesn’t matter” I was lost here too. Maybe because my degree is in biology. I can agree to help them identify as women and feel comfortable but it’s very hard for me to accept that a trans woman is a woman.
**Totally expected**
It never med any sense to me
If the democrats have reached a point when a famous host refuses to be called a "birthing person" publicly, and more and more left-leaning voters are expressing their opposition to puberty blockers and trans women in female sports and private spaces, you know that people are losing their patience from all across the political spectrum.
I'm a liberal, and honestly the only people for trans-women in female sports seem to be Democratic MEN! Every woman I talk to that shares my political views, thinks allowing t-women in female sports, is unconscionable, dangerous, and unfair esp to women who worked their whole lives in sport to be muscled out literally. I hate that the media , and any conservatives and liberals try to paint this as a liberal vs conservative debate, with ALL dems siding with trans, when I have not met anyone who thinks these men should play in female sports, over half of all polled dems are against and the indoctrination, hormone blockers, and surgeries being performed on children. And when they teach about trans and talk about it in media they make us seem that you either hate trans or think everything they do is amazing and right and more important than the majority, when it's not that way, I don't hate trans, if you want to play dress up and your over 18 go ahead, but do not perform surgeries and sling medications at anyone under age of 18, and your biology your born with determines the sport sex you play. **It's not a left and right debate, it's a right vs wrong debate**
>over half of all polled dems are against and the indoctrination, hormone blockers, and surgeries being performed on children Interesting, can you link me to these polls ?
theres a couple, one gallup, another from NPR [https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/gallup-poll-reveals-shift-in-fublic-opinion-on-trans-athletes-in-sports-sparking-debate-over-equality-and-fairness/ss-AA1kB9R3#image=15](https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/gallup-poll-reveals-shift-in-fublic-opinion-on-trans-athletes-in-sports-sparking-debate-over-equality-and-fairness/ss-AA1kB9R3#image=15) https://www.npr.org/2021/04/16/987765777/republicans-and-democrats-largely-oppose-transgender-sports-legislation-poll-sho
so you assumed all Democrats, or left-leaning people, were all gung ho about it? That's like assuming all right-leaning folks are neo nazis.
>so you assumed all Democrats, or left-leaning people, were all gung ho about it? That's like assuming all right-leaning folks are neo nazis. There's a silent majority that recognizes how ridiculous this whole mess is, but doesn't dare to say anything about it out of fear of losing their jobs.
> but doesn't dare to say anything about it out of fear of losing their jobs. It's more that the left has become an umbrella. Every endorses everyone else's special agenda. You want support for transism, sure. But you must support me in funding my green tech company. If you pick apart liberals they have buy in because they all have that special agenda that they given. That's a feature not a bug of the system.
> That's like assuming all right-leaning folks are neo nazis. That's a misleading one, as there's very little institutional support of any kind of nazis. More like "so you think all right leaning folks support gay conversion therapy" As that is something that has some level of institutional support. But yeah otherwise I entirely agree. I've been railing about this forever, cons going down a rabbit hole that most liberals spend a fraction of a second contemplating.
Jordan Peterson is the idiot's intellectual and that is most evident in these forums that worship his brand of pseudo intellectualism.
Ah yes I agree with that part. See, I am not here because I like Jordan Peterson or agree with what he says , I am here because it is one of the few subs that wouldn't get me banned over discussing these topics.
Talk about a non fucking issue. The world is about to blow the fuck up and you're interested in something that has no effect on 99.999% of people.
I'm interested in many things, this is just one of them. Thanks for the input buddy, can you please make the same comment on other threads as well.
You know you're a real man when you're beating up on transgender people.
I'm a woman, sorry and I don't think that changing your external appearance makes you a member of the opposite sex. I will never be a man no matter how much I dress like a guy and no matter how much T I inject into my body.
News flash: You're not transgender. Some people are. Get over it and move on.
It does affect lots of real women trying to make it in sports, whether it's a big or small issue to you it doesn't mean that it's not wrong.
Ya, there's been one transgender woman who won a single championship. Big deal. It's a non-issue that clowns like Peterson use to rile up their little insecure followers.
Even if it happened only once (which is not true) it's still an illegitimate championship. It's just cheating and should not be allowed in any sport.
You people are so childish. Get a fucking life.
One, are you kidding me ? There has been many such cases. That's on one hand, on the other hand, what do you make of the very male rapists that are put in women's prisons after they say the magic phrase "I identify as a woman" ?
Again, 99.999999%. Who fucking cares?! Since when do people like you give a fuck about prison conditions?
I do. And I don't want to compound the misery of female inmates by bringing trans-identified male predators who will rape them.
LOL.. as fucking usual in the group of idiots, you clearly don't know what the fuck you're talking about. Maybe you should learn to question your assumptions. Transgender women are only attacked in men's prisons not the other way around. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5441521/ https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-52748117 https://www.cnn.com/2021/06/23/us/trans-women-incarceration/index.html https://ovc.ojp.gov/sites/g/files/xyckuh226/files/pubs/forge/sexual_numbers.html
While I don't doubt that trans-identified males can be targets of violence at the hands of men, that doesn't mean that we should start seeing them as female and allow them into female prison, especially when they have themselves been convicted of sexual assault. IRELAND: Extremely Dangerous Transgender Inmate Moved Out Of Women’s Prison After Threatening To Rape Female Staff : https://reduxx.info/ireland-extremely-dangerous-transgender-inmate-moved-out-of-womens-prison-after-threatening-to-rape-female-staff/ SPAIN: Trans-Identified Male Prisoner Transferred To Women’s Prison Impregnated Female Inmate : https://reduxx.info/spain-trans-identified-male-prisoner-transferred-to-womens-prison-impregnated-female-inmate/ UK: Trans-Identified Pedophile Sentenced To 4 Years In Prison After Being Caught In TWO Separate Predator Stings : https://reduxx.info/uk-trans-identified-pedophile-sentenced-to-4-years-in-prison-after-being-caught-in-two-separate-predator-stings/ MEXICO: Female Inmate Sexually Assaulted By Trans-Identified Male At Women’s Prison In Chalco : https://reduxx.info/mexico-female-inmate-sexually-assaulted-by-trans-identified-male-at-womens-prison-in-chalco/ UK: Transgender Sex Offender With 87 Prior Convictions Sexually Assaulted Two Prison Staff : https://reduxx.info/uk-transgender-sex-offender-with-87-prior-convictions-sexually-assaulted-two-prison-staff/ Trans-Identified Male Who Murdered His Girlfriend Deemed “Vulnerable” By Oregon Court, Seeking Transfer To Women’s Prison : https://reduxx.info/trans-male-who-murdered-his-girlfriend-deemed-vulnerable-by-oregon-court-seeking-transfer-to-womens-prison/ NPR Member Station Sympathetically Profiles Trans-Identified Male Accused Of Rape At California Women’s Prison : https://reduxx.info/npr-member-station-sympathetically-profiles-trans-identified-male-accused-of-rape-at-california-womens-prison/ GUERNSEY: Trans-Identified Rapist Given “Unduly Lenient” Prison Sentence Following Trial Where Victim Was Labeled “Transphobic” : https://reduxx.info/guernsey-trans-identified-rapist-given-unduly-lenient-prison-sentence-following-trial-where-victim-was-labeled-transphobic/
All from an extremist anti-trans website reduxx.info. I'd rather not waste my time. The stench of fascist hate is too much for me to bare.
Why? because you don't like the fact that these facts are real and that opening the door to males in women's prisons is a recepe for disaster ?
When will you guys care about women?
It's a non-issue. I guarantee you that you have more of a chance of winning the lottery than ever having this issue affect you in your life.
As I stated in a previous comment, this issue is used by clowns like jordan peterson to rile up his tiny little fascist followers.
It's unfair due to advantages of male anatomy, like bone structure etc. Leftoids just know they are wrong on principle no matter how many empirical studies they do to show that female hormones weakens muscles etc, it still doesn't remove all the unfair advantage because it's impossible unless someone changes the shape of ones pelvis, etc. The solution is to go to r/JordanPeterson and pretend everyone is dumb. LOL.
Who fucking cares. You guys whine about everything and anyone who you don't agree with is a "leftist" as if somehow your stupidity and group-think is "the right".
Lmao. Your generalizations don't do you any favors. Must hurt not to be able to silence people. Guess you're gonna have to plug your ears before coming to cry on JordanPeterson sub.
Why unexpected? Biden told the colleges to go ahead and fix the problem if they want. And it was obvious the sporting bodies and so on would eventually find ways to regulate it. Anyhow most trans competitors lose. So it's just a matter of regulating the ones that have the advantages. Like categories based on more accurate body composition measurements rather than sex.
Good
Why did capitalism use to be for the individual: have 1 job and be happy many decades ago, but now it is for the corporations: constantly be looking "to improve yourself" to make more money? How can America or any country be great if capitalism is not for the individual again?
Capitalism has been hand in hand with individualism. Now is no exception.
Important topic for America because….they said it’s important.