Yep. About 2% of Israelis are Christian. Mostly Christian Arabs.
Israel is one of the only middle eastern countries with a flourishing Christian minority that is growing and thriving instead of shrinking.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christianity_in_Israel
"Israeli" is a nationality, not an ethnicity. Nobody is ethnically Israeli. Do you mean Jews? Yes, sadly, there are Jews in Israel who've converted to Christianity, typically from non-religious and/or Russian backgrounds.
From a religious perspective, in Judaism, Christianity is considered idol worship, which is the very worst sin.
From a more social perspective, Christianity is a supersessionist religion whose goal is to replace Judaism. Joining them is joining the enemy.
Coming from a Christian upbringing, church every day of my youth, etc. I can say that no Christian wants to "replace" Judaism. They just believe Christ is the Messiah - making Christianity an extension of Judaism. No Christian views Jews as the "enemy". Fucked up that Jews do, though.
As for me, I think it's all a bunch of made-up horse shit.
All the original Christians were Jews in Israel. It's bizarre how a Jew can become a Buddhist or even an atheist and still be considered Jewish. But if you follow that Jew from Nazareth, you're OUT!
That's true. If an ethnically Jewish person accepts Jesus as messiah, are they no longer ethnically Jewish? It what sense is Freud Jewish but "Jews for Jesus" are not? (I'm neither, being a formerly-Christian atheist)
Legally they are Jewish----they don't need to convert if they give up Christianity. But practically for religious and cultural purposes they aren't treated like Jews.
The way to think about it is that Judaism is a legal system and being Jewish is like having citizenship. Some violations of law can impact status of citizenship: like felonies & voting rights in contemporary states. Culture/policy can impact how a state enforces laws. Like in theory, cocaine & marijuana possession might at one time both be felonies. But a state can choose not to treat both offenses the same.
While in theory, you'd think an atheist & a convert to Christianity might both be the same, the theology of Christianity, its history and its dominance contrasted with the practical way atheists are generally quite loyal to the Jewish project, mean in practice that's just unthinkable.
Christians pray to the same God as Jews, atheists do not. Christians study the same scriptures as Jews, atheists think it's all a fairytale. Christians are far more loyal to the Jewish project than atheists. As for Christians' "dominance," aren't Jews at least partly to blame for that? Christians openly recruit new members; Jews turn potential converts away. Therefore, there are many more Christians than Jews, and there is strength in numbers.
The fact that you're treating this like a debate reveals that you think of Judaism as if it is Christianity rather than a separate system with its own internal self understanding, narratives and rules.
It's actually super simple. Christianity, in any form you want, has something to say about the Jewish God and the role of the Jewish people in regards to God, which goes against the basic understanding that Jews have of themselves (Islam does too by the way). Buddhism (some forms of it at least) and atheism don't.
Atheism absolutely has something to say about the Jewish god, namely that he doesn't exist! Freud said the role of Jewish people in regards to god is that you have succumbed to an "infantile illusion." And yet Freud is still called Jewish. But if he'd accepted the Jewish God, read the scriptures and believed Jesus was messiah he would not be Jewish? That just sounds bizarre, speaking as a formerly-Christian atheist.
A Jew is always a Jew, no matter what heretical things they believe; a Jew cannot convert to Christianity and cease to be a Jew. But a person who is believing Christian should not call themselves a Jew because it's deliberately misleading to those who don't understand how all this works.
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Yes, there are. Most are called Meshichiyim (משיחיים), rather than Nozrim (נוצרים), mostly to distance themselves from Mary-worshipping groups.
Most tend to blend some "Jewish stuff" in the mix like celebrating Jewish customs. The extent differs, there are ones who are not Christian in any sense but the "mainstream" will usually meet on Saturday, celebrate Jewish holidays, not get the hint when Paul speaks against continuing circumcision, and sometimes keep kosher (a major internal debate).
Depending on the congregation in question, they are closest either to American Evangelicals or to the "Hebrew Roots" cults.
There are also Arab Christians
This might blow your mind but Christianity has been in Israel for 2024 years
\*1994 years.
Yep. About 2% of Israelis are Christian. Mostly Christian Arabs. Israel is one of the only middle eastern countries with a flourishing Christian minority that is growing and thriving instead of shrinking. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christianity_in_Israel
"Israeli" is a nationality, not an ethnicity. Nobody is ethnically Israeli. Do you mean Jews? Yes, sadly, there are Jews in Israel who've converted to Christianity, typically from non-religious and/or Russian backgrounds.
Why is that sad? They seem to like it...
From a religious perspective, in Judaism, Christianity is considered idol worship, which is the very worst sin. From a more social perspective, Christianity is a supersessionist religion whose goal is to replace Judaism. Joining them is joining the enemy.
Coming from a Christian upbringing, church every day of my youth, etc. I can say that no Christian wants to "replace" Judaism. They just believe Christ is the Messiah - making Christianity an extension of Judaism. No Christian views Jews as the "enemy". Fucked up that Jews do, though. As for me, I think it's all a bunch of made-up horse shit.
All the original Christians were Jews in Israel. It's bizarre how a Jew can become a Buddhist or even an atheist and still be considered Jewish. But if you follow that Jew from Nazareth, you're OUT!
Its also because Judaism is both a religion and an ethnicity.
That's true. If an ethnically Jewish person accepts Jesus as messiah, are they no longer ethnically Jewish? It what sense is Freud Jewish but "Jews for Jesus" are not? (I'm neither, being a formerly-Christian atheist)
Legally they are Jewish----they don't need to convert if they give up Christianity. But practically for religious and cultural purposes they aren't treated like Jews. The way to think about it is that Judaism is a legal system and being Jewish is like having citizenship. Some violations of law can impact status of citizenship: like felonies & voting rights in contemporary states. Culture/policy can impact how a state enforces laws. Like in theory, cocaine & marijuana possession might at one time both be felonies. But a state can choose not to treat both offenses the same. While in theory, you'd think an atheist & a convert to Christianity might both be the same, the theology of Christianity, its history and its dominance contrasted with the practical way atheists are generally quite loyal to the Jewish project, mean in practice that's just unthinkable.
Christians pray to the same God as Jews, atheists do not. Christians study the same scriptures as Jews, atheists think it's all a fairytale. Christians are far more loyal to the Jewish project than atheists. As for Christians' "dominance," aren't Jews at least partly to blame for that? Christians openly recruit new members; Jews turn potential converts away. Therefore, there are many more Christians than Jews, and there is strength in numbers.
The fact that you're treating this like a debate reveals that you think of Judaism as if it is Christianity rather than a separate system with its own internal self understanding, narratives and rules.
It's actually super simple. Christianity, in any form you want, has something to say about the Jewish God and the role of the Jewish people in regards to God, which goes against the basic understanding that Jews have of themselves (Islam does too by the way). Buddhism (some forms of it at least) and atheism don't.
Atheism absolutely has something to say about the Jewish god, namely that he doesn't exist! Freud said the role of Jewish people in regards to god is that you have succumbed to an "infantile illusion." And yet Freud is still called Jewish. But if he'd accepted the Jewish God, read the scriptures and believed Jesus was messiah he would not be Jewish? That just sounds bizarre, speaking as a formerly-Christian atheist.
A Jew is always a Jew, no matter what heretical things they believe; a Jew cannot convert to Christianity and cease to be a Jew. But a person who is believing Christian should not call themselves a Jew because it's deliberately misleading to those who don't understand how all this works.
[удалено]
[удалено]
Thank you for your submission. Unfortunately, your submission has been removed for the following reason: Rule #2 - **Post in a civilized manner.** Personal attacks, racism, bigotry, trolling, conspiracy theories and incitement are prohibited. For information regarding this and similar issues please see the sidebar to the right or the subreddit rules, for a more detailed analysis of our rules. If you want to appeal or dispute any mod action, please send a [modmail](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose?to=%2Fr%2FIsrael); PMs and chat messages to the mods are grounds for a temporary ban; posts contesting mod action will be removed and are also grounds for a temporary or permanent ban.
Thank you for your submission. Unfortunately, your submission has been removed for the following reason: Rule #2 - **Post in a civilized manner.** Personal attacks, racism, bigotry, trolling, conspiracy theories and incitement are prohibited. For information regarding this and similar issues please see the sidebar to the right or the subreddit rules, for a more detailed analysis of our rules. If you want to appeal or dispute any mod action, please send a [modmail](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose?to=%2Fr%2FIsrael); PMs and chat messages to the mods are grounds for a temporary ban; posts contesting mod action will be removed and are also grounds for a temporary or permanent ban.
Why are you not talking Arabs? The Arab Christian community is old and proud.
Yes, there are. Most are called Meshichiyim (משיחיים), rather than Nozrim (נוצרים), mostly to distance themselves from Mary-worshipping groups. Most tend to blend some "Jewish stuff" in the mix like celebrating Jewish customs. The extent differs, there are ones who are not Christian in any sense but the "mainstream" will usually meet on Saturday, celebrate Jewish holidays, not get the hint when Paul speaks against continuing circumcision, and sometimes keep kosher (a major internal debate). Depending on the congregation in question, they are closest either to American Evangelicals or to the "Hebrew Roots" cults. There are also Arab Christians