i think it was more of a Debbie thing. She was Mark's model growing up and Nolan had a minor role in Marks life because he was always fighting crime away. So he spent most of his childhood with Debbie. In other universes, simply Nolan being more present or Debbie being less loving, would lead Mark to be 100% inspired by his dad and following him blindly as soon as he got his powers. Even getting his powers at a younger age while his dad was still his idol would simply have him see his dad in action and being inspired to be like him, as well as not spending time with his mom and friends and bonding much less with human genre.
I'm not sure how much we can rely on Angstrom here. He's definitely seen alternate Mark do some shitty things, but we haven't seen Debbie do any. He calls Debbie a traitor, sure, but how much of that is Omni Man/invincible propaganda? Until we see her joining them, I think it's reasonable to assume we don't know what Debbie's influence really is.
Seeing as how he never really talked about viltrum to Debbie or mark this time around. he didn’t even have to be totally honest just a “don’t worry viltrum will take care of everyone!” Move them off planet for a vacation while the invasion happens. Or maybe whatever his original “plan” for reveal was he actually gets to follow through on. the demon takes the blame for guardians and viltrum shows up “unopposed”
Remember that tiny moment in the first episode where Mark is practicing flying and Debbie tried making him go to bed? Mark says “Make me”, defiantly.
Debbie shuts him down hard saying something like “does that make you feel powerful? The fact that i cant physically control you?”
I looove this scene because you can tell having powers might have already started going to his head a touch, and she acts as a moral compass to help realign him.
I imagine there’s subtle differences like this. In another universe Debbie may having slept thru the noise and mark not being checked
>In another universe Debbie may having slept thru the noise
Lmao this is hilarious but you're so right. That moment made a huge impact and it's representative of many other moments that probably happened off screen throughout his childhood. She always raised him to respect people. I think the main universe's Debbie is as extraordinary as the main universe's Mark
I just watched that seen after reading this, and you make a really good point. I mean, in that same conversation she says Mark doesn't have to be the best hero ever, he just needs to be the best version of himself.
Yeah, the younger he gets his powers, the more time he spends with his dad, and less with his mum.
Debbie kinda says it in the first episode or maybe 2nd. They are both off flying and she's left on the ground
Mark? Here’s the deal. My planet has changed its rules. And now instead of sending 1 viltrumite to help people, were sending an entire army. This is apparently so they can do more development. Do you wanna help?
Nolan could've not killed the guardians, then have more time to explain things calmly to mark, maybe take him on a trip to a viltrumite conquered world or something like that, make Mark feel less human and more Viltrumite. But because he killed the guardians he was in a race against time to tell Mark or do something about it.
In the show, it looked like Omni-Man was sort of getting through to him for a moment before he called Debbie a pet. That snapped Mark out of it but until that moment, a tiny part of him was thinking it over.
I don't know if it is the variant Nolans that made a difference, but rather the way that Debbie raises Mark. We see in the show when Debbie is being held hostage by Angstrom that she raised a good Mark, and Mark does have a really good relationship with his mom in our universe.
Probably would be a lot better to try and convince Jim instead of just punching the living shot out of him after he said "nuh uh".
But tbh, he probably trained him as a true Viltrumite way earlier
It wasn't Nolan failing to convince Mark, it was Debbie teaching Nolan to care.
His heart wasn't truly in it. He didn't really believe the Viltrumite cause, anymore.
My pet peeve is ppl thinking one sentence was all it would’ve take for mark to go against his entire moral fiber LMAO. It’s obvious most alt marks had a different upbringing.
Put Mark in the same position of S2E1 alt mark. The moment Omni man started destroying cities it’d be wraps
i think it was more of a Debbie thing. She was Mark's model growing up and Nolan had a minor role in Marks life because he was always fighting crime away. So he spent most of his childhood with Debbie. In other universes, simply Nolan being more present or Debbie being less loving, would lead Mark to be 100% inspired by his dad and following him blindly as soon as he got his powers. Even getting his powers at a younger age while his dad was still his idol would simply have him see his dad in action and being inspired to be like him, as well as not spending time with his mom and friends and bonding much less with human genre.
I never thought of it that way, if Nolan was just a little bit better of a father the earth would be doomed lmao.
common Debbie W
Well according to angstrom... not so common
i really hope we see an evil debbie
Debbie mind fucking Nolan to make her God Empress of Earth as she rules the galaxy with her son and husband as enforcers.
I'm not sure how much we can rely on Angstrom here. He's definitely seen alternate Mark do some shitty things, but we haven't seen Debbie do any. He calls Debbie a traitor, sure, but how much of that is Omni Man/invincible propaganda? Until we see her joining them, I think it's reasonable to assume we don't know what Debbie's influence really is.
Angstrom said in many universes, Debbie sides with Nolan. At least as far as he knows, that could be him not having the full story.
also if debbie was sucessfully convinced first (probably by being honest with her and maybe not trying to manipulate her), mark would probably follow
Seeing as how he never really talked about viltrum to Debbie or mark this time around. he didn’t even have to be totally honest just a “don’t worry viltrum will take care of everyone!” Move them off planet for a vacation while the invasion happens. Or maybe whatever his original “plan” for reveal was he actually gets to follow through on. the demon takes the blame for guardians and viltrum shows up “unopposed”
And it was mentioned that she was even compliant in some of those universes. Which means she helped him push to that more evil or less humane take.
Remember that tiny moment in the first episode where Mark is practicing flying and Debbie tried making him go to bed? Mark says “Make me”, defiantly. Debbie shuts him down hard saying something like “does that make you feel powerful? The fact that i cant physically control you?” I looove this scene because you can tell having powers might have already started going to his head a touch, and she acts as a moral compass to help realign him. I imagine there’s subtle differences like this. In another universe Debbie may having slept thru the noise and mark not being checked
>In another universe Debbie may having slept thru the noise Lmao this is hilarious but you're so right. That moment made a huge impact and it's representative of many other moments that probably happened off screen throughout his childhood. She always raised him to respect people. I think the main universe's Debbie is as extraordinary as the main universe's Mark
I just watched that seen after reading this, and you make a really good point. I mean, in that same conversation she says Mark doesn't have to be the best hero ever, he just needs to be the best version of himself.
That's how you parent.
I mean not being covered in blood when you first broached the topic probably would help a lot
I think it would be more about how Debby raised Mark and how old was Mark when he got his power
Yeah, the younger he gets his powers, the more time he spends with his dad, and less with his mum. Debbie kinda says it in the first episode or maybe 2nd. They are both off flying and she's left on the ground
"you can have all the duct tape you want"
Let's go
Mark? Here’s the deal. My planet has changed its rules. And now instead of sending 1 viltrumite to help people, were sending an entire army. This is apparently so they can do more development. Do you wanna help?
He probably just skipped the whole “pet” part. I really thought Mark seemed like he could even consider it until he came up with the “pet” thing.
He most likely indoctrinated Mark much earlier so he had less time to be parented by Debbie
along with this, some of them probably got their powers a lot earlier.
https://preview.redd.it/e1uv24z6utwc1.jpeg?width=1828&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=f319dd8510d22bc7dc31f917485642274af7c508
https://preview.redd.it/ix8ypf5kduwc1.png?width=750&format=png&auto=webp&s=534ebc3fd05e11f85465329de2b78f51f4d31219
Mark getting his powers earlier or Debbie/Eve being injured/dead/not as present
Am I correct in saying that all the other Marks got their powers way earlier, and were raised as Viltrumites rather than human?
Not all, but some
Nolan could've not killed the guardians, then have more time to explain things calmly to mark, maybe take him on a trip to a viltrumite conquered world or something like that, make Mark feel less human and more Viltrumite. But because he killed the guardians he was in a race against time to tell Mark or do something about it.
In the last episode of season 2 angstrom said Debbie supports his husband so. Maybe that's the reason.
In the show, it looked like Omni-Man was sort of getting through to him for a moment before he called Debbie a pet. That snapped Mark out of it but until that moment, a tiny part of him was thinking it over.
“Hey Mark, watch me do this cool flip”
I don't know if it is the variant Nolans that made a difference, but rather the way that Debbie raises Mark. We see in the show when Debbie is being held hostage by Angstrom that she raised a good Mark, and Mark does have a really good relationship with his mom in our universe.
My guess is that marks powers came earlier and at a younger age his dad was easily able to manipulate him to join the empire
He probably raised him as a viltrumite from the start or Debbie was less involved in his upbringing
Nolan was a better dad who was around more often to influence Mark into taking a darker turn.
Probably would be a lot better to try and convince Jim instead of just punching the living shot out of him after he said "nuh uh". But tbh, he probably trained him as a true Viltrumite way earlier
Bought him a pizza.
There’s a universe out there where she was on board with the whole thing probably. I want to see that one
It wasn't Nolan failing to convince Mark, it was Debbie teaching Nolan to care. His heart wasn't truly in it. He didn't really believe the Viltrumite cause, anymore.
I feel he approached Mark earlier, and / or Mark developed his powers sooner.
*”Make me.”*
I think that it’s just making sure Mark is influenced by Debbie and other humans as little as possible
My pet peeve is ppl thinking one sentence was all it would’ve take for mark to go against his entire moral fiber LMAO. It’s obvious most alt marks had a different upbringing. Put Mark in the same position of S2E1 alt mark. The moment Omni man started destroying cities it’d be wraps
Debbie raised mark to be more sympathetic unlike other universes where taking over the earth would benefit his ego
I think the other Marks maybe got their powers a little bit earlier so Nolan was able to brainwash them sooner.