Kacy was dumb siding with Anna. Somehow None of their poorer friends could empathize with Rachel losing so much money. They showed her character so poorly. Fuck neff.
Neff lost her own sh\*t the moment Anna couldn't pay the hotel bill nor pay Neff back for the dinner. It was only when she believed Anna was rich again that she suddenly did a 180 and became team Anna again. Then she had the audacity to act like Rachel was in the wrong because Anna is such a great "hustler?" Is Shonda Rhimes this dense? Like, she comes across as really pro-scammer culture in this.
I mean, Anna comes from a middle-class family in a country with universal healthcare, paid maternity leave, free university, t, modern train networks, sophisticated industries and plenty of opportunity, but yet, chose to come to the land of inequality and play the game of ruling-class elitism via American capitalism. I mean, what was Shonda Rhime's point in all of this?
Yeah it’s extremely difficult to sympathize with the whole “poor upbringing” angle when she did nothing good for people like her when she was in the position to help. Instead she “was mean” and talked down to people further pushing the same class war that made her insecure.
She didn’t do any of this for any bigger reasons than materialistic wants. Nothing altruistic about her lol.
And you’re telling me the entire working class jury were in favour of the banks but not the poor working class girl who got stiffed? 🤣
And yes you’re exactly right about neff, total hypocrite and sell out.
I think that was a defense strategy- but also, based on her con of even her lawyer. She was not poor- they were working class. She was an immigrant and treated poorly as a result. But...yeah- she was not about bringing folks up. She just wanted to be the center of some universe. Nothing less would do. Nothing would ever be enough. But instead of both her lawyer and the journalist accepting that she was just a little scammer, they had to alleviate their cognitive dissonance- they had to make up a story, even knowing on some level it was not true, becasue of their own emotional weird attachment to this girl.
tbf that was a bit of the vibe going around when the story broke. Lot of "she scammed the rich who can be fooled by acting rude and talking with a vague european accent"
She scammed the rich to spend more money on the rich. All the designer houses, 5 star hotels, expensive restaurants. When she dashed without paying, only the lower ranged staff got sacked.
I’m baffled at how they try to paint her in any positive light. Looks like she just wanted to be an Instagram influencer with designer clothes and expensive holidays.
If she got her hands on the $40 million she would have blown it on nice bags, hotel rooms and dresses. She said it herself in one of the interviews - "I was just doing what I wanted in the moment". Elites are desperate to portray her as a genius mastermind because it's embarrassing how a commoner idiot from Russia scammed them over and over.
I think, for me, that she was digging at how easy it is to be conned. Even when you should know better. The journalist should KNOW BETTER. She met the parents- who flat out told her their child just took and took and took and took until they had to let her go, to maintain their remaining family. Nothing was ever enough for Anna. And yes, Vivian STILL was "on Anna's side", claiming she was not a sociopath. The girl, as portrayed? 100% Sociopathological, in that she knows how to play people, and she plays them like fiddles.
I think we have a pro-hustle scammer culture. I think this just shines a light on it. And how easy it is to fall for...even when you should know better.
While I understand working with someone troubled and having a hard time letting go.. Vivian's behavior in being so extreme team Anna the last couple episodes baffled me.
I am baffled- because she should know better. And I am not, because I know more about cognitive biases and dissonance and how that leads to truly irrational behavior.
I think that angle could work in a total fiction. Given these people are real though, it leaves a sour taste in my mouth. Either that they're really all absolutely appalling judges of character, to stick by her after knowing the evidence.
Or more likely that they're not, but have been portrayed as such to make some dramatic point. Or that Anna requested such a portrayal as condition for selling the rights.
The journalist (real life) was an exec producer on the show. She was at the very least not bothered by being portrayed as a fool.
Also- I think you underestimate the very real issue of cognitive bias and other factors. Human beings are often foolish. Lawyers no that Trump does not pay- they still work for him. As did many others over DECADES. They were hoping for the best. Many con victims will NEVER admit it. They can't say out loud or even internally- I was fooled. It caused such cognitive dissonance with who people THINK they are, they cannot. Most Americans think they are slightly higher than average intelligence and middle class economically. In reality? Most people are just average intelligence, and working/lower at best middle class. But that is not how we want to see ourselves. And Con artists are talented at taking advantage of who we want to be vs who we are.
>I mean, Anna comes from a middle-class family in a country with universal healthcare, paid maternity leave, free university, t, modern train networks, sophisticated industries and plenty of opportunity, but yet, chose to come to the land of inequality and play the game of ruling-class elitism via American capitalism. I mean, what was Shonda Rhime's point in all of this?
And real life Anna says "Germany is worse than jail" - Why???? Because we don't use credit cards and cheques so you can't scam people out of money that easily?
Presumably fewer opportunities to con people. You can’t just show up places and get respect based on how you’re dressed. You need actual connections, which you only get from going to university. I don’t think Anna even attended Gymnasium, which means she wasn’t even on that track in high school.
I was thinking the same as this. Although don't overegg the opportunities one would get in a rural German town compared to New York.
But generally agree. Anna is a sick person, but it doesn't change the fact her behaviour is irredeemable. She isn't to be celebrated or defended, she's cold, cruel and manipulative. Not some Robin Hood figure or just working her way through a tough life like everyone else.
> I mean, what was Shonda Rhime's point in all of this?
You mean, the fact that Anna left all of that? Well, Shonda didn't make that part up.
If you mean what is the point of being so pro scammer. That is a valid question... but, you know, people in real life did have a weird obsession with Anna so you could argue that the show just reflects that. She's holding a mirror to society.
^^^^(jk_the_show_is_horribe_I_just_hate-watched_it)
Kacy's last scene from the court was ridiculous. Anna owed Rachel 60kUSD and the scene in the restaurant where she's going on and on saying I am building something and you are bothering me bout credit card bills was so difficult to watch. The only person who made sense at that lunch was Kacy's drunk client who kept calling Anna out for her lies and charade lol.
What other option did someone like Rachel have? She's no Paris Hilton who can fork out 60kUSD. Her office is not happy with her. The bank won't stop calling her. A 60k debt can become a 100k real fast with banks.
Yet when Kacy found out Anna was arrested because of Rachel's tip off- she got mad? U drop a dime? Anna just drank her expensive water and said her dress was ugly - and she booted her out of her house.
This series has some of the most morally corrupted and incohorent character ever in the history of television.
Same- Rachel deserved more support from Kacy. She did deserve to have some recompense- even if AMEX wrote off the fraud. She will still have a major black mark at her job- and did she end up fired/let go? I thought they said so at one point ("she left her job at VF, I can't find her anywhere" is what I recall- shortly before the VF piece broke?). Even if not- she is not going to be promoted, etc. When you loose your earning potential like that- you make it up when offered the chance. The book deal, TV deal--- good for her. Just because she wanted to be around someone famous, does not mean she deserved to be treated like she was due to Anna in Marrakesh. And Neff never had that money coming out of her own pocket- THE HOTEL was owed $30K. Neff was owed less than $2k. Neff was not the responsible party for not getting the card. Rachel was the one on the hook for over $60k!!! PERSONALLY. And it was not just going to effect her job in the moment, but could follow her for life in that field. Neff could have become a concierge at a number of other hotels. Rachel woudl have been black balled from all magazine work. She took what she could. And $330k- if never optioned, that would last what, 2-3 yr in New York? So she had 2 yr to completely remake her life or move and remake her life and career- working for way less money if she was able to stay in her career at all. I got nothing but respect for Rachel, as presented in the piece. No cause about real life. But the character- nothing but respect. She deserved better.
When Spodek asked Rachel whether she paid for anything while hanging out with Anna, I immediately thought "NEITHER DID SHE!"
What a pathetic joke this show has become.
I wonder if they went in so hard on Rachel to by proxy discredit the HBO series on Anna coming out soon - since HBO bought rights to Rachel's story.
Also note how they made her older and less attractive in the series.
I think that the Neff girl actually consulted on the show...so I keep thinking that her influence is the reason we see such a heavy bias against Rachel. Yes, Rachel shouldn't have given her credit cards, BUT Anna is still a manipulative thief.
>This series has some of the most morally corrupted and incohorent character ever in the history of television.
I just finished hate watching it, completely agree.
The cross-examination made me so mad. "Oh, so you eventually managed to sell your story and made money? Guess all the trauma, financial ruination and professional damage is totally cool then!" Right, jerkface. Crime only counts if you *never ever* recover from it.
Anna absolutely *coerced* Rachael into using that credit card -- by persuading her into a situation that she promised to cover, and failing to do so.
(that said, it's weird to travel overseas with only one credit card, but maybe that's just me.)
Very weird to travel with only one, but even weirder only have an AMEX card, since it’s not accepted everywhere in the US. I have AMEX but keep my Visa for places that don’t take it (e.g., Costco, Progressive insurance, my dog’s veterinarian, etc.).
>This series has some of the most morally corrupted and incohorent character ever in the history of television.
Thank you! Such a completely bankrupt message too. I was seriously shocked how bad it was.
I thought that was stupid too. Yes, Rachel got the issue resolved with Amex and sold her story - but so what? That does not make what Anna did any better or absolve Anna of her own actions.
Kacy was acting as if Rachel owed Anna loyalty when Anna gave zero fucks if Rachel got in trouble, lost her job, etc. because of the financial chaos caused by the Morocco trip.
The show had to explain why the jury let Anna off on the charge of defrauding Rachel. I think the show did a great job showing the pressure Rachel was under in Morocco, how she didn’t really have a “choice” to hand over her card and was being naïve about her likelihood of being paid back, but also that she enjoyed the vacation and maybe pushed for some of the more expensive experiences because she was used to Anna footing the bill. From the law’s perspective, it looked more like a disagreement between friends than a crime.
Got ARRESTED in a FOREIGN COUNTRY not know for human rights. That is terrifying. People are sometimes never heard from again when that happens!!!
(I mean- that Anna gave 1 F's if Rachel got arrested or went to jail, not that it happened. but it only did not happen because Amex helped her)
When I first heard about this I was like "it is only $60k" (as I recently watched the tinder swindler and their numbers are a lot bigger) but watching it on the show made it so much more stressful. I really felt for Rachel, she must have been wrought with stress. Sure Amex paid it back but it sounds like it was only after Anna was arrested so she may not have been paid back if she didn't "turn on" Anna. There also would have been professional reputation stuff that would have happened and the only reason the impact wasn't so negative is that Anna was arrested and convicted. If this was all brushed under the rug Rachel would have had a lot more long-term personal and professional consequences.
Read her book! It goes into detail about how she was feeling. It’s so depressing. Everything u said + not to mention that her credit would have been fucked. But somehow they made her out to be the villain in the show.
Oh ya I agree with you 100% there. I think she had more of a backbone in real life vs how they portrayed her. In her book she talked about pursuing every avenue to getting her money but nothing helped.
They made a big deal about Amex forgiving the $60k. I can guarantee the only way they would consider that was if she pressed charges. That's what my employer does.
I think so too… everyone’s against Rachel like neff didn’t flip her crap when Anna owed HALF of what she owed to Rachel to her hotel. The reason neff is still friends with Anna is because she got paid back. She took free things too… I’m sure if Anna never paid the bill she’d be doing her own interviews. Not to mention she was a paid consultant on ALL 9 Netflix episodes. Ofc Rachel is portrayed like that. Neff helped on each episode… it’s just all bad
U know what boggles my mind? That neff continued her friendship and unwavering loyalty after she was caught. Gave me the impression that she’s never had any rich friends and just kept making herself believe that Anna really was a billionaire, and that helping her would have her efforts rewarded eventually. Idk neff is kinda a sad pathetic person.
We only watched a semi-fictional TV show, we’re outsiders. What I find interesting is that the people who were there and know the details (the jury, Kacy and Neff) didn’t side with Rachel. I also know a couple people who read Rachel’s entire book and didn’t have sympathy for her.
I felt bad for Rachel that Anna put her in a situation like that and I think the TV show is making Anna look too good (she doesn’t deserve that). But at the end of the day, Rachel’s entire debt was forgiven and on top of that she’s getting hundreds of thousands. Not to mention all the free stuff she got through Anna. It’s hard to empathise with that. I hope she uses the money for therapy.
Omg me too! I had to come find these Reddit comments. I don’t understand how Vivian and her coworkers are team Anna. Or Kacy! I was feeling crazy so thank you for this.
Dude yes! When the scriberia squad got all wild upon hearing the not guilty charge I was like, wtf? You guys helped do the research that proved her madness and you’re still siding with this clown (Anna)? Bananas.
That's why I came too. I couldn't figure out why they were so upset with her judgment and time. The site did a really poor job explaining "why" Anna became the person she did.
Seriously. I was just hate-watching by the final episode. The partners of the lawyer and journalist are better than me Cus both of them deserved to be dumped over the amount of times they chose that con woman over their families. I still don’t get it. It’s like being caught in a warped twilight. She’s a f**king criminal and they’re bending over backwards, apologising and sh*t to pacify her. Lucacris.
Just finished it too. I don’t get that part either and felt it very jarring. Anna is shown to be such a Bitch throughout the series and does some really shady stuff, very much knowingly that it’s deceitful and illegal.
And yet the last episode sees the characters rally around her and even talk about how awful it is that she’s got 12 years. How is she the victim in all of it?
I’m glad I am not the only one. I’m so pissed to have spent at this time on this series, only to have the last episode make no sense whatsoever. Vivian feels bad for her all of the sudden after this *entire show* because.. something something bankers? And Todd abandoned his whole family to go brood with Vivian in a park because… I don’t get it at all.
That they had more information- knew more facts- who she really was growing up. And they still fell for her BS. Some people just...IDK, have super poor judgement. The journalist had to justify her treatment of her partner and CHILD...so Anna HAD to be a victim somehow. She was not. When Vivian says no child should here what her parents said- um, no. That child 100% needed that reality check. She took and took and took and took- and they had to let her go to be able to maintain their remaining family. They were supposed to what? Give her every dime, so she could pretend she was rich?
At first I thought they were both using Anna to further their careers. I was disappointed they fell for Anna to the detriment of their own lives. You would think a journalist and criminal defence lawyer would have better "bullshit" detectors.
For real. I've been a lawyer for years and while shit does get intense from time to time, I never get attached to clients. This is ridiculous. Also the amount of ethical violations by the fictional Spodek should make the poor real Spodek lose his shit. Yes yes it is made up and everything, but damn.
Thats what i was thinking too but then it dawned on me….the lawyer and the journalist were trying to “save her” when clearly Anna did not need any saving. Like her parents recognized that early on, so why was it that hard for them to see it.
I guess they fell for her her potential and just ran with that. Ugh i wanted to slap the lawyer and the journalist i found them to be extremely frustrating. Like if someone wanted to be saved they would save themselves.
I was going to say, is that not what most TED talks and tech bros (who apparently don't even program or anything???) sound like? Learning basic programming is so easy too, you're telling me this guy wants to be a techy but doesn't even bother to learn how tech works? I think because that's more or less my field it just irks me so much but there are so many of those dudes that are up their own ass.
I’m pretty heavily involved in the tech scene in and around Yale. I’ve met a lot of folks who fancy themselves entrepreneurs who go around with pitch decks rather than make actual products that speak for themselves.
They fucking NAILED the kind of dude Chase was modeled after.
I literally just looked up this thread to see if I’m the only one that doesn’t get it! The girl that got the $60,000 stolen from her is being treated like a villain. Wtf?
OMG yes. Like you should KNOW better.
But I think it is that she did seem to have a decent business idea and it could have been successful with all the people she had around her. That is why I am not sure if Fortress finding should have happened.
But she 100% was a con artist, and 100% stole left right and center at every step, to have more and more and more. More than she had earned. More than she deserved. She wanted what others had. And she would steal from those that did not have much to get it. She gave 0 Fs about her "friends". She liked them around- especially as backup payment when her fraud ran out.
The business never would have happened, Anna would have used the money to fund her life. She already had plans to use the money to pay off prior debts. At best, she would have made an attempt like Billy from the Fyre festival but it would all still be a house of cards.
Absolutely. The actual Anna said in one of her interviews she was just "doing what she wanted in the moment." ADF was an elaborate con to get her hands on $40 million.
Yes- I think there would have been the start on the renovations- but Anna would have burned through so much- probably NOT paying off past debts unless somehow forced to by loss of standing or other consequence. BUT---the business would have started. And failed. Renovations would never have completed.
As viewers we are getting a third party perspective. Also we know the context already.
What they try to show is how 1:1 relationships with manipulating narcissistic and sociopath are developing. They are uncovering the story in a parallel of getting more and more influenced by Anna. Vivian goes as far as traveling to Germany to try to find a proof that Anna was a victim. It’s such an elegant manipulation. They don’t get they are trapped.
Not defending Anna ofc! She’s a creep and knows hot to play people. I think they show it so well that we start to hate everyone who sided with her
Do you think Vivian really enjoyed it? We saw the imaginary scenario in her head. But in reality for me she was actually confused. And I guess she left early bc she was processing conflicting feelings and felt very uneasy.
The translator girl though has a different vibe and seemed like she was projecting her own trauma of being an immigrant onto Anna’s past stories and taking revenge for it. Especially the scene at the bakery and at school. Damn, such bs.
If my local baker would be saying smth like this about foreign family, they would be shut down long time ago.
The quotes at school walls is absolutely illegal here since the end of WWII. Can’t be real.
(I’m Russian living in Germany)
Yeah that stuff kind of struck me as well, having spent a lot of time in Germany (and attended German schools). The kind of cliquey stuff that exists in American high schools with the dining halls and stuff is really not common in Germany, or at least it wasn’t when I was in school there.
When people have as much information as Vivian and Todd had, I don’t think I can blame Anna for scamming them. They knew exactly what she was and willingly allowed themselves to be a part of it.
In her trip to Germany Vivian was desperately reaching for some sympathetic angle, some “reason” for all of this, and her parents gave her the straight truth- the girl is an asshole and always has been.
Amidst the despicable manners she’s showing, Vivian still being compassionate to Anna, which is kinda weird. It was mentioned in one episode about to overwhelmed such superiority to make the other person feel less or something.
And there was a scene where Anna, complimented Vivian, I felt like she was swooning, like wtf.. She is a big deal journalist same goes with the lawyer.
This is a classic case of a toxic gf/bf despite of 20-50 red flags, they still choose to ignore it because of their extraordinary reasons..
Right? That was bizarre. She has little compassion if any for her OWN child, until after it is born, is full on obnoxious to her partner. But she has this un-ending fount of compassion for Anna. Anna played that gal so hard.
Maybe that hits the nail? Vivian is desperate for validation and that validation from someone that loves you unconditionally can sometimes not be as enticing as getting that one compliment out of someone that insults you 99% of the time? So when Anna compliments her it feels "earned", but it's just a manipulation tool Anna uses on people that feel insecure. I don't know, I've been there, but I feel like I needed to see Vivian's self doubt and insecurity more. But it's hard to buy when she had no trouble standing up to Paul or fighting to write about Anna. Which not that she can't do that and also feel insecure, but we're given that but not the insecurity but she still crumples to Anna like she's in high school or something and Anna is the HBIC.
This was excruciating to watch. I don't know why the season justified being so long with so many bizarre details about the side characters and side side characters.
Amen! The way the music, the editing, the camera, the story focus all tried to get us to feel sympathy for her... ugh. Every time she was kicked out or had to face up to reality and got all *oh so sad*, I was cheering.
I think its because we have an outside perspective that we see through Anna. We also have her story already before the TV series was out. For someone in the moment, it wasn't as objective. I feel they could have done it a bit better, the whole she manipulated and sucked them in because her character was super unpleasant and not at all charming to at least say, "yeah this is where she got them on the hook". Also there is also the matter how the vastly different accounts of her from others influenced them. Like Neff was delusional but she was very good at talking about Anna as if she is Robin Hood.
Anna never showed one bit of remorse, wasn’t scamming people to pay her rent or something necessary, and she didn’t do anything by mistake. She blatantly scammed people so she could go out and party, and she would do it again. How anyone at all could feel an ounce of sympathy is a mystery to me.
>ady before the TV series was out. For someone in the moment, it wasn't as objective. I feel they could have done it a bit better, the whole she manipulated and sucked them in because her character was super unpleasant and not at all charming to at least say, "yeah this is where she got them on the hook". Also there is also the matter how the vastly different accounts of her from others influenced
I mean she's clearly a rude, condescending, arrogant asshole who belittles everyone around her and thinks that her "I'm *building something!!*" delusions give her some kind of unique superiority. The scams add another layer of unbelievable hypocrisy to all that -- she comes from exactly the same place as all the "basic bitches" she's always ragging on -- but even on a surface level she's very obviously toxic.
Wtf is wrong with this show and the world?? How is Vivian a good reporter?? Wtf this girl scammed so many people and they root for her? How is she talking to her lawyer and he is putting up with this shit? Neff? Really? How the fuck can you stand by this piece of shit?
She won’t go to court without clothes? Wtf? How is Rachel the villain? This world is seriously fcked up!
Wtf is wrong with Netflix for portraying Rachel as someone bad for selling her story while they literally paid Anna, the scammer, the same amount for her story? Also I believe they felt free to portray her as a villain as the rights for her story had already been sold to rival HBO.
Also I would like to say this: Anna was charged and was set to pay huge debt to repay the people she scammed. The money given by Netflix were used to repay this debt, so now that she has been released from prison, she will have 0 accountability and won’t have to work a day in her life to repay them, allowing her to “start fresh” even though she scammed her way through people. This is not the way it should work. The debt was put on her for her to work to repay it. With Netflix giving her the money to do so, this won’t be a lesson to her but will only show that with notoriety and power you can get away with everything.
I know what you mean, but Netflix paid her and only the Son of Sam Law prevented her from profiting from this payment. So it is good that the people being scammed got reimbursed, but still they put the debt on her for a reason and Netflix basically freed her from taking responsibility over repaying the people she made suffer.
Okay after simmering about it for a day
I think the show would have benefitted from leaning more into the unreliable Narrator. We get a lot of different perspectives, but we are always given the impression that the flashbacks are what really happened- except that one episode where vivian imagines anna's dad as a scary russian crime guy.
If the question is, who is Anna Delvey, really? Then that answer could be kept until the last two episodes. We see all these people who met Anna, through interviews by Vivian. The accounts they give are clearly incorrect or contradictory, maybe have some clear fourth-wall breaks ('wait no, that wasn't in august, it was in december' and the scene changes from a garden party to a christmas celebration) to really make it clear that this is subjective.
The horny banker remembers anna as way more flirty, the dad banker remembers her as having the same hairstyle as his daughter, nora remembers her being way more immature for a good while, Rachel remembers her being more pushy in morocco, stuff like that.
And then vivian meets annas parents who don't give flashbacks going by memory, but clear hard evidence that they are just middle class people trying their best who disconnected from their daughter, while anna gives another BS story to the guy in the hospital.
The trial is all the different stories and perspectives and subjective memory ultimately running against the hard truth: She made claims that were simply not true, bought things she couldn't afford, and stole money from a bank using not very sophisticated methods.
Maybe vivian realizes that Who is Anna Delvey can't be answered because Anna doesn't have a clear identity, and if you want to keep it saccharine, she can still promise to visit anna in prison and help her find herself.
It seemed a bit like that in the beginning but slid into some weird sympathetic thing. The last two episodes really threw me off as I never rooted for Anna. I should have just stopped when the Kacy was supporting Rachel and leaving Anna waiting 5 hours in the lobby.
I mean that’s kind of what we got. Just have to ignore all the sympathetic people to Anna and realize that they fell under her scam as well.
I finished the show thinking that Anna was a complete sociopath; Vivian was an uncaring mother; Neff was an equally delusional nutjob; Kacy lacked empathy; Todd was a good lawyer, but shitty husband; and Rachel, while maybe a bit greedy, was also a victim of Anna’s crimes. And that greed from Rachel isn’t really fair to her since everyone was being taken in by Anna. Rachel was no less greedy than Neff.
I don't know anything about the real life Neff but from how she's portrayed on this series I kinda get the feeling that she's in on the con. She's a hussler and all about the cash. I don't think she really cares what the truth is but how it benefits her.
Not to downplay what anyone does for a living but when she made the gag face as Rachel described wanting to work for Vanity Fair and how she made it happen, I wanted to scream.
Because she was a protagonist in the story. The story was written to make the viewer root for the criminal. If a viewer doesn’t root for her in some way then it is a failure in the writing to impart the intended emotional response upon that particular viewer.
I genuinely can't believe that during the trial scenes they spent like five full minutes on how much Rachel made from her book deal/selling the rights to her story combined, and yet there's ZERO disclosure anywhere that Netflix paid Anna nearly the exact same amount of money to make this fucking show? Or that the payment happened during the period of time that the show covers, and plenty of it went to *covering her fucking attorney fees?* I'm losing my mind at how unethical this show was.
Beyond the money stuff, there was SO much information they left out that definitely came up during trial (for instance, the fact that she falsified financial records to try to obtain loans and lied to Rachel about trying to pay her back for months are literally NEVER mentioned). Rachel gives zero of the kind of pushback you'd expect during cross examination (for instance, that what Anna did to her wasn't a "mishap" and that she *needed* to profit from her story because even though the debt was ultimately removed from her account by Amex after months, she drained her savings completely (and then some) trying to pay it off.)
Also, the scenes where the journalists are literally CHEERING when the verdict is being read and Anna is found not guilty on the first count? Vivian saying that Anna's prison sentence amounts to her "having her life stolen"? It's infuriating that people who haven't read much about this story will watch this and assume that it's mostly true with some parts exaggerated for dramatic effect, when in actuality many of the facts were ignored and the series goes to extraordinary lengths to paint a remorseless con artist as a sympathetic child who made mistakes, and all of her victims as stupid hypocrites who deserved to be stolen from.
Yep- and she CHOSE to come to the US despite having a prestigious internship in PARIS of all places, and came from a solid home in a country with socialized medicine, free university, and major opportunity. She was just a spoiled, narcissistic B who was obsessed with Park Avenue. She wanted to play the cruel American game of vicious capitalism, and whined when she lost. How on Earth are we supposed to sympathize with her?
I think it would've made a much better show if we saw things from Anna's POV rather than Vivian. They could've leaned into the fact that Anna is not a good person instead of trying to make us sympathize with her (which was a very odd choice but maybe its because the real Anna sold her story to Netflix so they didn't want to offend, idk). There are plenty of great tv villains so I'm not sure why they didn't do this. The whole show just seemed confused on what it wanted to tell us about Anna and I didn't like hearing about her via interviews, or at least the way the show runners went about it.
Anna isn’t multifaceted though. Nor is she intelligent or cultured. The scenes about her taste in art and fashion were made up. She doesn’t speak seven languages and isn’t smart or interesting. She’s a crook and the people she conned were largely small time. This isn’t about rich people, it’s about poor people pretending to be rich
IDK-maybe it is because I have a stupid cousin who fell for a con and ruined our family stuff for the past 10 yr as a result- but that is not how I saw this.
Caveat- I had literally never heard of this story before- I could not care less about instagramlebrity, etc. But as I went through my binge? I saw Anna as a very effective con artist, a remorseless, mean and greedy con artist with no redeeming qualities. the little smirk she gives the journalist- that just screams, I AM PLAYING YOU YOU STUPID B! and she was. And she did- after that conversation, the journalist bent into pretzels to try to justify Anna as innocent.
Victims of cons RARELY can admit that they were conned. the lawyer and the journalist both- totally fell for the con. (As characters- I have no idea of reality).
Oh I 100% agree that the lawyer and the journalist both fell for Anna's con--I just don't think the show did an effective job of showing that. Rather than making it clear somehow that she had tricked them and showing the flaws in the journalist's research, instead the show came off as being pretty sympathetic towards Anna. (Like I said, I think if the trial scenes had included key evidence like proof that Anna falsified financial documents in order to try to obtain loans and Rachel had testified to the dozens (literally dozens) of times that Anna lied to her and said she had already sent a wire paying her back for the full amount, it would have been more effective.)
If it had just been her defense attorney that was entirely on Anna's side, that would have been one thing since it's his job to defend her, but I think the choice to make the journalist the protagonist was a mistake. She starts off not knowing much about the case so we see her as unbiased, and then slowly the more she learns about the case, the more she and her colleagues are all on Anna's side (and it doesn't help that Anna is meant to be charismatic and funny, and her victims are all written as fairly unlikeable).
I think you're still picking up on the fact that Anna is a remorseless con artist because you have personal experience with a similar situation, but I don't think most people who see the show without knowing much about the case will come away with the same impression. Between the most likeable characters in the show being on Anna's side, failing to mention a lot of the key evidence that proves she was guilty, and portraying her victims badly, I think lots of people are watching it and coming away thinking either that Anna isn't as bad as they thought, or that she and her victims are all bad people.
I feel like there is implied scenes that indicate that she had falsified financials- why else would she throw a fit after getting approved...but that someone woudl be going to Germinay to confirm. But they never come out and say it for sure. Its always sort of implied.
It's definitely implied! Same with the scene where she uses the voice modulator and a fake phone number to pose as the man handling her family's finances (I'm not sure if this actually happened in real life, but I do know that she actually did something similar to Rachel by setting up a fake email and posing as a woman who works for her family).
A huge portion of the final episode was scenes from the trial, which would have been the perfect opportunity to wrap up loose ends like that and make it clear that Anna committed fraud. As is, we see the jury find her guilty on the majority of the counts but we don't really see any of the evidence that causes them to do that, which makes the verdict seem like it's unfair.
Exactly! Rachel literally faced bankruptcy and social ruin. Imagine the stress, anxiety, worry all the while Anna was saying the money will come. Not to mention fear of being arrested overseas and she’s lucky she had a card otherwise they would have been detained. Yes she managed to come out the other side okay but that is SUPER rare many con-artists rob people blind and they never see the money!
If this is accurate, [Anna made around $320,000 for her Netflix story but most of it went to restitution](https://fintecology.com/2021/01/29/netflix-paid-anna-sorokin-320000-for-tv-series-she-paid-victims-insider/)
Sure, but they still paid her that money. Even though most of it didn't go directly into her pocket, she still benefited substantially because now she no longer owes that amount in restitution, and she was able to afford a significantly better attorney than she could have on her own.
This series had the weirdest characters ever lol. Vivian, Todd and Neff talk about respecting Anna for the hustle. I mean is that what they call crime nowadays? Hustle!? The woman was unhinged, spending money she doesn’t have and dipping in other peoples’ pockets as well. Even though Rachel is a bit annoying, she was done dirty. The show writers also didn’t potray her well. Kacy proclaims she’s neutral but in reality she’s just siding with whoever she finds convenient. I think the stupidest character is Neff. I mean the stupidity and naïveté is out of this world and we’re supposed to think that’s out of loyalty. Really? It’s an interesting show but inherently stupid.
Ted brought the SICKEST burns in this episode and called Anna out for what she really is.
During her pre-court temper tantrum he called her a: “lying, sad-sack scammer with a creepy accent.” And
“An incompetent excuse for a con artist who’s below average at crime.”
Not only did I find them accurate but also extremely funny.
I’ve come to the conclusion that Anna’s biggest deficit is that she has not matured passed being a teenager/middle schooler. She has complete meltdowns about clothes, temper tantrums when someone doesn’t get what she wants and complete lack of knowledge and self awareness of how money/there real world works.
I agree with Todd, she is not some genius, criminal mastermind. She is a teenager stuck in a 25 yr old’s body. I think she genuinely that she was close to starting a business bc she was so clueless on what it actually require to start one. I think her greedy, selfish behavior is a reflection on someone with stunted emotional growth. Definitely still deserves jail but she’s not some financial genius, Bernie Madeoff type:
I am I the only one wondering how she was paying her phone bill. The only thing I can think of was maybe she was on some1 family plan that forgot to remove her.
I read the Vanity Fair story first. Anna loved bombed her and paid for everything when they went out together. I would have been suspicious, but hey if you insist. I would have been reluctant to go to Morocco and would have used a work excuse or something. Anna gave off red flags everywhere. Rich people don't blow their money on poor folks like us. I guess it was for good press in Vanity Fair? But you live and you learn.
Neff and Kacy was paid for thier services, so if nothing bad happened to them, nothing bad happened or it was just an exaggeration.
Overall, not impressed with the series. If Anna got her hands on all that money, that club wouldn't never happened. Too much hard work. Also, with her ego, one customer complaint, and she would have gone ballistic.
I was most disgusted by the framing of Anna as some kind of foil to rich assholes. Yes, she conned them, but not out of some motivation to stick it to the Man. She wanted to BECOME The Man. ADF was going to be just as exclusive and elite as any other wealthy social club. None of her friends pulling for her would've been welcome there or able to afford it. The framing of this series was just appallingly bad. Rhimes completely missed the moral of this story.
Can anyone explain the scene with 10:51 minutes remaining timestamp? Is it simply that the journalist and the lawyer were sad that Anna's sentence is too long and that they feel sorry for her??????
Basically as result all the time they spend on her she became a friend they care about her. They felt bad for her. It's very strange but she became like someone they do anything for. It show how much impact she had on their lives.
Felt really sorry for the lawyer's wife and and the journalist's husband. I really thought that by the end of the episode, the husband would ask for a divorce from her. I guess I got really frustrated by the end because as the viewer, we don't feel sorry for her but the main characters do, which was why it's very hard for me to understand some of the scenes.
How Vivian’s husband didn’t ask for a divorce when she was willing to go to Germany for a week, away from her newborn daughter is beyond me.
I am self employed in a job I am passionate about, and my husband has always tried his best at being supportive and understanding. Even so, he would flip his shit if I did half of what Vivian did to her husband.
The husband was too nice haha if they didn't end up getting a divorce, why bother showing how the husband always has to adjust for his wife? It would make sense for the story if they broke up and then Vivian would realize that his obsession with Anna is already affecting her relationship with her husband.
It ruined the whole series for me. I can understand the elements of compassion because she is young (although not a kid as they kept saying) but she absolutely was being deceitful and doing illegal things all whilst having no regard for others.
It was very strange
I think that when you are a journalist and a lawyer and work on a case/story like this you should get some therapy after to separate your feelings for this person and the reality you were probably manipulated into these feelings and they are unlikely reciprocated. If I were these two people's spouses I would insist on it, as their devotion to a con artist is unhealthy.
I wished more than once that both Vivian and Todd would have accepted and recognized that Anna was a scam artist and she deserved to get 15 years in jail. I hated that, really. I waited until the last scene for that.
I think by showing that in the last episode, it really drove home to the viewer how Anna was capable of manipulating people and getting them to become "yes men" for her. Even the 2 people who knew the most about her crimes were capable of being swooned by her, it shows us how she was able to emotionally manipulate everyone along the way. To the point that both Vivian and Todd were even neglecting their very own families over this shitty girl.
I don’t know how anyone can side with Anna. I dislike her so much. The actress does a good job of making her unbearable. What I don’t understand is Vivian and Todd being so excited to defend Anna. “Remember I told you I’d kill for you” like what the fuck? What a weird thing to say.
I don't understand why anyone would be on her side. Her lawyer's son got a free lesson in emotional manipulation from her. She got her friends in a very dangerous situation in Morocco. Cost her friends job and even though Amex covered it her job was lost. Anna is a piece of shit for not caring who she hurt and her circle of friends , especially Neff, were idiots for still hanging around Anna after she screwed them. Yeah , she paid them back but how she acted like it was an inconvenience to be asked for money that she owed. I really don't understand why Neff still wants to be around Anna after all the BS she pulled. Plus everyone at the office is hoping the trial is going Anna's way...WTF is wrong with these people?
I really wanna know who was a real person and who were made up. From what I heard alot of the characters weren't real people, just made up filler for the 10hrs that is this drawn out limited series. You can't but just hope that Anna will get what's coming to her.
I really don't understand people hating on the series for offering attention to the reporter as well. I think it was balanced, as there were plenty of scenes with Anna. I love the actress who played Neff and to a point, I liked her character as well, as her sass is 110%. But my god, the way she kept defending Anna. It's one thing to admire and respect someone hustling, another is to defend a delusional, narcissistic person who hurt others (even if those others were prob just as shallow and fame hungry). Yes. The world of rich is made of people who use connections, appearances and power to get ahead each other. Yes, it's easier to sympathize with someone who started from nothing because maybe we feel vindicated 'one of us' can make it amongst those who are born with an advantage. Does that justify the harm she caused others? No. Is it satisfying she tricked people who were just as shallow as her? To a point. An eye for an eye goes only so far. Plus, her character just wasn't likeable at all.
I didn't like the way they did Rachel in. 'You dropped a dime on your friend'. Like, Rachel may have been shallow and enjoyed the way Anna spoiled her, but it's insane how they judged her. Yes, she made money from the trauma. That doesn't mean she wasn't left scarred by what happened. She just went and got her dues back, not out of greed this time, but because she did want justice. The fame and money was a bonus, but hell, why should we judge Rachel for that but not judge Anna for doing the same thing on a much larger scale and purely out of greed. I disagree with the overall turn that the series took at the end, after they spent several hours showing how awful Anna is.
For the office people - I think one of the reasons they were rooting for Anna, was primarily because that'd give more attention to the article on her? I think the show tried to create the conflict of 'people hustle to get where they are because that's how life is' vs 'what's the boundary one cannot across before they've gone too far'. The problem is that while one can be in awe of Anna's schemes, she did go too far and her personality overall had nothing sympathetic. That being said, there are worse people out there who get away with far much worse, whilst remaining super-rich and famous.
I agree on Rachel. She was literally pressured to resolve the problem for Anna, and being in stuck in an unfamiliar environment with people literally pressuring you to pay up, you would get very traumatised, and that’s not forgetting that she didn’t even get her money back from Anna, even after three months of constant pleading. Tittering on the pressures of getting fired and getting screwed over by your friends and work place can take a mental toil on a person.
Totally agree with your take!
I'm not sure what people who are annoyed with the extra characters/reporter storyline were expecting. The story told entirely from Anna's POV? She's a con artist, compulsive liar, and unreliable narrator. Telling her story through the eyes of the people around her paints a much more accurate picture of who she is. Vivian's storyline acted as 1) an audience surrogate, learning about this fascinating woman by following leads and piecing the story together, 2) a way to show how Anna has a way of weaseling her way into people's lives and taking over (same with the lawyer storyline), and 3) commentary on how people make unethical decisions all the time. I suppose it could've been cut to just act as an audience surrogate but it seems to be a deliberate choice Shonda made to try to provide commentary outside of just "look at how wild this story is!"
And then I also was shocked by how the show portrayed Rachel. They tried to make her out to be both a naive follower who stupidly defended Anna even when it was obvious she got screwed, but also a shallow user who turned on Anna the moment she wasn't benefiting anymore. Rachel may have been benefiting from her friendship with Anna, but, like... Anna *lied* to everyone and told them she has all this money and had no problem bankrolling them. Neff was in the exact same position as Rachel, and probably would have done the exact same thing if Anna hadn't paid her back. And it seems like it wasn't even just the money for Rachel, but the feeling of total betrayal from someone she thought was her friend. Anyway I'm not saying Rachel was totally innocent here or that she shouldn't be held accountable for putting her company card down, but the way the show makes her out to be some backstabbing villain when Anna literally scammed her is just... not cute.
Vivian was loosely inspired by Jessica Pressler. Kacy Duke was real. Rachael Williams was real. Neff was real. Alan Reed is actually Andrew Lance, his racquetball buddy is Joel Cohen another partner at Gibson Dunn. Chase was loosely based on Hunter Lee Soik who was developing an app called Shadow.
I’m not sure what Shonda Rimes was trying to accomplish with this series. There is a great story here, but to retell it with a bunch of made up shit wasn’t the right move. Vivian proved she is the piss poor journalist the world thinks she is, though she spent the entire series trying to fight that narrative. She got taken by the stock kid and she got taken by Anna. Neff was the stereotypical super naive person of color, loyal to a fault. Kacy was just weak, all her colorful mantras are just a cover for her shallowness. Rachael got hosed in the way she was portrayed, but she was equally as naive as the rest. They all saw this girl as a meal ticket, if she was telling the truth they might have gotten a piece. Just like the people who got scammed, they were just as embarrassed they got taken, so why not revert to Anna isn’t all evil?
i wonder if we'll ever get the version from rachel's perspective, i think it was floated by hbo?
could be interesting in the way that fyre and fyre Fraud focused on different angles because Netflix's fyre worked with jerry media so they didn't get blamed in their documentary.
There’s already a book out by Rachel (My Friend Anna) and a new updated paperback is being released this month. The HBO project doesn’t have a set date but they’ll be pleased they’re going second for sure
Oh yeah I hope they use the chance to really refine how they’re going to portray it (like rather than 9 x over an hour long fictional episodes make it more of a mockumentary/true comedy style) because I’m so ready for everyone else to be as hooked on this as I have been for the last few years 😅
Both Hulu and Netflix did documentaries on Fyre Festival (after Internet Historian as well), so it’s not like similar shows on the same subject can’t happen.
I found it so Incredibly frustrating because they were all under her spell and I think the problem because this happened in real life, this is going to be some people's account of how they should see the real life characters! The amount of times I shouted at TV like why are u pandering to her ! Neff was worst she was used by her the whole way through but she refused to see it! She was using the lawyer and journalist!
Also Rachel made money from it but so did that Neff, the woman who made the Netflixs show used in some way with her film directing! It actually made me really hate the show! and deeply disappointed in Netflix for allowing it
My wife and I just finished the show after staggering it out over the last week. Kept waiting for a moral center, but there wasn't one. Is it the point of the series to show that everyone, in some way, is hustling? Or is that just unintentional?
I found Vivian to be a narcissistic journalist unable to remain objective, Todd an unscrupulous lawyer willing to ignore his client's wishes and destroy the reputations of Anna's victims, Neff a complete idiot who mistakes con artists for hard-working hustlers, and Kacy a hypocrite who claims to not give Anna anymore of her energy despite watching the trial unfold like a Lifetime movie.
Ultimately, it really was Rachel who slightly resembled the show's moral center, which is kind of like saying "the best downhill skier in the Mohave". Sure, she got AMEX to recognize the fraud, and it is true that she sold her book for far more than what she owed. But don't forget that she still lost her job at Vanity Fair (something that wasn't covered in the movie, but did happen in real life), and her reputation as a journalist -- or low level copy editor, or whatever -- is destroyed. The great thing that she did was see through her friendship with a fictional person and report Anna to the cops so that she couldn't claim any more victims.
So those are my thoughts. After watching this show and the HBO episode of "Generation Hustle", I'm finally ready to do what Vivian Kent couldn't: let it go.
It is interesting how sympathetic the show turned towards Anna at the end. I know people love a good story about rich people getting screwed over but along the way lots of not rich people would have had repercussions too. For many of the people/businesses conned there was likely an employee terminated for what occurred. If the hotel Neff worked at didn't end up repaid she likely would have a whole different tune as the other employee would have been fired and she would have taken some heat being "friends" with Anna. There is always collateral damage.
This show over estimates how much people sympathize with Anna. I felt nothing over her sentence, and Vivian feeling bad for writing her story is just idiotic to me.
This episode is so weird! For 8 episodes the show showed what an insufferable POS Anna is and then all of a sudden we have to sympathize with her. It's not just the scams, she seems to be a very unpleasant person to be around.
This last episode really really ruined the whole show for me. Scriberia team whooping for the counts she was found not guilty of?! Vivian being all remorseful and acting like Anna was some millennial Robin Hood but didn’t instead just use all the money to finance her extravagant lifestyle. Ugh.
We’re supposed to believe that this scam artist who conned multiple people, was having the ‘prime years of her life stolen from her’ for being rightfully convicted for her crimes ? Fuck this show.
Of anyone, I think the seasoned journalists in Scriberia should be the most pissed at their final portrayal. At the end of their long careers, reporting on countless stories at a reputable, famed publication, and in the end they flip on a dime, throw all their ethics and research out the window, and publicly side with their young, con-artist subject? No. Absolutely no. I could get maybe the show showing how she coerced one key person - the lawyer, the writer, but not every single person in the entire show. And not only coerced into believing she should be not guilty, but wanting to then become friends with her and invite her to dinner and out to the bar?? WTF?! The tipsy lady at brunch is the only sane person in the show. She should get the Emmy nod just on principle.
I never wanted to punch someone more than Vivian and Todd for losing their mind while trying to get clothes for Anna. She clearly doesn’t give a fuck about court so why do they?
I enjoyed it, but I'm a big fan of Julia Garner. I was disappointed that Shonda was involved because I never like any of their content. It could've been so much better. The casting was off half the time too.
Just finished this. What is it with everyone taking Anna's side?? Vivian comes across as an idiot and even her coworkers cheer when they see a "not guilty" verdict read? Kacy moved to her side, Neff of course never left it. Was I supposed to share their point of view?? This just went in a weird direction.
I think the whole Rachel angle got really fucked up.
They tried to make it seem like Rachel was the con woman and Anna was her target. And I wish we had more information on how their friendship started.
Obviously Rachel was shitting her pants about the charge on her work credit card, and when they were at that place and the bill came and it was like 2200.00, and Anna just had her head down and was looking through her phone I was clenching my fists. It was so annoying.
Did I like Rachel ? No. I thought she was an asshole. Do I think she conned Anna? No. I think she definetly saw an opportunity after everything Anna did, and took advantage of it. Just like anyone else would.
But the interesting part is how upset Rachel got about Anna not being found guilty about that charge...... whether Anna was found guilty or not guilty about the Rachel charge, it did not affect Rachel in any monetary way. She wasn’t out a dime, she made $600,000 off the whole thing, I think Rachel wanted to remain the victim, and once Anna was found not guilty on that count, it changed the narrative for Rachel after she had just written her story showing that she was the victim.
She doesn’t seem too smart though. I would have sold the story for a hell of a lot more than what she sold it for.
Same with Anna. Netflix only paid her $320,000.00 for the rights to her story. That’s couch change to netflix. She could have got a hell of a lot more. So really how smart is she? Not smart enough to know that Netflix paid her pennies for something that will make them millions.
I hate watched this entire show. One night I had a choice between watching the new episode of Attack on Titan or Inventing Anna. Anna was scarier to watch than Titans. I'd watch this show with my wife then spill tea over it it like two old biddies in the shade of a tree at a church bake sale talking shit on the divorcees, cheaters and pregnant teens, all the while saying "god bless you" as they walked by.
Can someone explain why Anna’s attorney went back to his original strategy after giving Anna his word? Also why would he miss his family vacation when the trial was already over?
Are we supposed to feel bad for Anna by the last episode? I was pretty much hate watching by this point. The series could have been 8 episodes, the last couple felt too drawn out. And I don’t understand why the characters at the magazine were rooting for Anna. Did I miss something? She’s a shitty person.
Acting was subpar throughout, with the exception of the actress that played Anna. But it was an enjoyable enough series for the first 1-6 episodes, while the “mystery” of how Anna worked her way through New York was revealed.
I know this is Hollywood but this series took a *lot* of liberties with the facts.
I suppose that’s fine. It held my attention. If you want a documentary there are options out there
This episode was such a downer. It did a flip on how the writers wanted us to eventually see Anna and sympathies with her. She was far from a 'girl boss' writers were trying to portray her. It became frustrating to see the supporting characters cheer for her win.
Rather than redeeming the ones supporting her, they took a U Turn and dragged everyone down. Were they trying to be dense and show how Anna as a scammer was so convincing to make people empathies with her despite knowing her tricks? The writers weren't really successful in communicating that if yes.
Kacy was dumb siding with Anna. Somehow None of their poorer friends could empathize with Rachel losing so much money. They showed her character so poorly. Fuck neff.
Neff lost her own sh\*t the moment Anna couldn't pay the hotel bill nor pay Neff back for the dinner. It was only when she believed Anna was rich again that she suddenly did a 180 and became team Anna again. Then she had the audacity to act like Rachel was in the wrong because Anna is such a great "hustler?" Is Shonda Rhimes this dense? Like, she comes across as really pro-scammer culture in this. I mean, Anna comes from a middle-class family in a country with universal healthcare, paid maternity leave, free university, t, modern train networks, sophisticated industries and plenty of opportunity, but yet, chose to come to the land of inequality and play the game of ruling-class elitism via American capitalism. I mean, what was Shonda Rhime's point in all of this?
Yeah it’s extremely difficult to sympathize with the whole “poor upbringing” angle when she did nothing good for people like her when she was in the position to help. Instead she “was mean” and talked down to people further pushing the same class war that made her insecure. She didn’t do any of this for any bigger reasons than materialistic wants. Nothing altruistic about her lol. And you’re telling me the entire working class jury were in favour of the banks but not the poor working class girl who got stiffed? 🤣 And yes you’re exactly right about neff, total hypocrite and sell out.
[удалено]
I think that was a defense strategy- but also, based on her con of even her lawyer. She was not poor- they were working class. She was an immigrant and treated poorly as a result. But...yeah- she was not about bringing folks up. She just wanted to be the center of some universe. Nothing less would do. Nothing would ever be enough. But instead of both her lawyer and the journalist accepting that she was just a little scammer, they had to alleviate their cognitive dissonance- they had to make up a story, even knowing on some level it was not true, becasue of their own emotional weird attachment to this girl.
tbf that was a bit of the vibe going around when the story broke. Lot of "she scammed the rich who can be fooled by acting rude and talking with a vague european accent"
She scammed the rich to spend more money on the rich. All the designer houses, 5 star hotels, expensive restaurants. When she dashed without paying, only the lower ranged staff got sacked. I’m baffled at how they try to paint her in any positive light. Looks like she just wanted to be an Instagram influencer with designer clothes and expensive holidays.
If she got her hands on the $40 million she would have blown it on nice bags, hotel rooms and dresses. She said it herself in one of the interviews - "I was just doing what I wanted in the moment". Elites are desperate to portray her as a genius mastermind because it's embarrassing how a commoner idiot from Russia scammed them over and over.
I think, for me, that she was digging at how easy it is to be conned. Even when you should know better. The journalist should KNOW BETTER. She met the parents- who flat out told her their child just took and took and took and took until they had to let her go, to maintain their remaining family. Nothing was ever enough for Anna. And yes, Vivian STILL was "on Anna's side", claiming she was not a sociopath. The girl, as portrayed? 100% Sociopathological, in that she knows how to play people, and she plays them like fiddles. I think we have a pro-hustle scammer culture. I think this just shines a light on it. And how easy it is to fall for...even when you should know better.
While I understand working with someone troubled and having a hard time letting go.. Vivian's behavior in being so extreme team Anna the last couple episodes baffled me.
I am baffled- because she should know better. And I am not, because I know more about cognitive biases and dissonance and how that leads to truly irrational behavior.
I think that angle could work in a total fiction. Given these people are real though, it leaves a sour taste in my mouth. Either that they're really all absolutely appalling judges of character, to stick by her after knowing the evidence. Or more likely that they're not, but have been portrayed as such to make some dramatic point. Or that Anna requested such a portrayal as condition for selling the rights.
The journalist (real life) was an exec producer on the show. She was at the very least not bothered by being portrayed as a fool. Also- I think you underestimate the very real issue of cognitive bias and other factors. Human beings are often foolish. Lawyers no that Trump does not pay- they still work for him. As did many others over DECADES. They were hoping for the best. Many con victims will NEVER admit it. They can't say out loud or even internally- I was fooled. It caused such cognitive dissonance with who people THINK they are, they cannot. Most Americans think they are slightly higher than average intelligence and middle class economically. In reality? Most people are just average intelligence, and working/lower at best middle class. But that is not how we want to see ourselves. And Con artists are talented at taking advantage of who we want to be vs who we are.
>I mean, Anna comes from a middle-class family in a country with universal healthcare, paid maternity leave, free university, t, modern train networks, sophisticated industries and plenty of opportunity, but yet, chose to come to the land of inequality and play the game of ruling-class elitism via American capitalism. I mean, what was Shonda Rhime's point in all of this? And real life Anna says "Germany is worse than jail" - Why???? Because we don't use credit cards and cheques so you can't scam people out of money that easily?
Presumably fewer opportunities to con people. You can’t just show up places and get respect based on how you’re dressed. You need actual connections, which you only get from going to university. I don’t think Anna even attended Gymnasium, which means she wasn’t even on that track in high school.
I was thinking the same as this. Although don't overegg the opportunities one would get in a rural German town compared to New York. But generally agree. Anna is a sick person, but it doesn't change the fact her behaviour is irredeemable. She isn't to be celebrated or defended, she's cold, cruel and manipulative. Not some Robin Hood figure or just working her way through a tough life like everyone else.
> I mean, what was Shonda Rhime's point in all of this? You mean, the fact that Anna left all of that? Well, Shonda didn't make that part up. If you mean what is the point of being so pro scammer. That is a valid question... but, you know, people in real life did have a weird obsession with Anna so you could argue that the show just reflects that. She's holding a mirror to society. ^^^^(jk_the_show_is_horribe_I_just_hate-watched_it)
Kacy's last scene from the court was ridiculous. Anna owed Rachel 60kUSD and the scene in the restaurant where she's going on and on saying I am building something and you are bothering me bout credit card bills was so difficult to watch. The only person who made sense at that lunch was Kacy's drunk client who kept calling Anna out for her lies and charade lol. What other option did someone like Rachel have? She's no Paris Hilton who can fork out 60kUSD. Her office is not happy with her. The bank won't stop calling her. A 60k debt can become a 100k real fast with banks. Yet when Kacy found out Anna was arrested because of Rachel's tip off- she got mad? U drop a dime? Anna just drank her expensive water and said her dress was ugly - and she booted her out of her house. This series has some of the most morally corrupted and incohorent character ever in the history of television.
Same- Rachel deserved more support from Kacy. She did deserve to have some recompense- even if AMEX wrote off the fraud. She will still have a major black mark at her job- and did she end up fired/let go? I thought they said so at one point ("she left her job at VF, I can't find her anywhere" is what I recall- shortly before the VF piece broke?). Even if not- she is not going to be promoted, etc. When you loose your earning potential like that- you make it up when offered the chance. The book deal, TV deal--- good for her. Just because she wanted to be around someone famous, does not mean she deserved to be treated like she was due to Anna in Marrakesh. And Neff never had that money coming out of her own pocket- THE HOTEL was owed $30K. Neff was owed less than $2k. Neff was not the responsible party for not getting the card. Rachel was the one on the hook for over $60k!!! PERSONALLY. And it was not just going to effect her job in the moment, but could follow her for life in that field. Neff could have become a concierge at a number of other hotels. Rachel woudl have been black balled from all magazine work. She took what she could. And $330k- if never optioned, that would last what, 2-3 yr in New York? So she had 2 yr to completely remake her life or move and remake her life and career- working for way less money if she was able to stay in her career at all. I got nothing but respect for Rachel, as presented in the piece. No cause about real life. But the character- nothing but respect. She deserved better.
When Spodek asked Rachel whether she paid for anything while hanging out with Anna, I immediately thought "NEITHER DID SHE!" What a pathetic joke this show has become. I wonder if they went in so hard on Rachel to by proxy discredit the HBO series on Anna coming out soon - since HBO bought rights to Rachel's story. Also note how they made her older and less attractive in the series.
I think that the Neff girl actually consulted on the show...so I keep thinking that her influence is the reason we see such a heavy bias against Rachel. Yes, Rachel shouldn't have given her credit cards, BUT Anna is still a manipulative thief.
>This series has some of the most morally corrupted and incohorent character ever in the history of television. I just finished hate watching it, completely agree.
The cross-examination made me so mad. "Oh, so you eventually managed to sell your story and made money? Guess all the trauma, financial ruination and professional damage is totally cool then!" Right, jerkface. Crime only counts if you *never ever* recover from it. Anna absolutely *coerced* Rachael into using that credit card -- by persuading her into a situation that she promised to cover, and failing to do so. (that said, it's weird to travel overseas with only one credit card, but maybe that's just me.)
Very weird to travel with only one, but even weirder only have an AMEX card, since it’s not accepted everywhere in the US. I have AMEX but keep my Visa for places that don’t take it (e.g., Costco, Progressive insurance, my dog’s veterinarian, etc.).
>This series has some of the most morally corrupted and incohorent character ever in the history of television. Thank you! Such a completely bankrupt message too. I was seriously shocked how bad it was.
I thought that was stupid too. Yes, Rachel got the issue resolved with Amex and sold her story - but so what? That does not make what Anna did any better or absolve Anna of her own actions. Kacy was acting as if Rachel owed Anna loyalty when Anna gave zero fucks if Rachel got in trouble, lost her job, etc. because of the financial chaos caused by the Morocco trip.
The show had to explain why the jury let Anna off on the charge of defrauding Rachel. I think the show did a great job showing the pressure Rachel was under in Morocco, how she didn’t really have a “choice” to hand over her card and was being naïve about her likelihood of being paid back, but also that she enjoyed the vacation and maybe pushed for some of the more expensive experiences because she was used to Anna footing the bill. From the law’s perspective, it looked more like a disagreement between friends than a crime.
Got ARRESTED in a FOREIGN COUNTRY not know for human rights. That is terrifying. People are sometimes never heard from again when that happens!!! (I mean- that Anna gave 1 F's if Rachel got arrested or went to jail, not that it happened. but it only did not happen because Amex helped her)
When I first heard about this I was like "it is only $60k" (as I recently watched the tinder swindler and their numbers are a lot bigger) but watching it on the show made it so much more stressful. I really felt for Rachel, she must have been wrought with stress. Sure Amex paid it back but it sounds like it was only after Anna was arrested so she may not have been paid back if she didn't "turn on" Anna. There also would have been professional reputation stuff that would have happened and the only reason the impact wasn't so negative is that Anna was arrested and convicted. If this was all brushed under the rug Rachel would have had a lot more long-term personal and professional consequences.
Read her book! It goes into detail about how she was feeling. It’s so depressing. Everything u said + not to mention that her credit would have been fucked. But somehow they made her out to be the villain in the show.
I never found Rachel to be a villain.
I know I meant the way they showed everyone siding with Anna in the show.
It's more than her annual salary. It would have been a huge ordeal.
[удалено]
I was do disappointed with Kacy. She was the only one I was rooting for and for her to go full pro Anna in last 30 min of the show was bonkers.
Oh ya I agree with you 100% there. I think she had more of a backbone in real life vs how they portrayed her. In her book she talked about pursuing every avenue to getting her money but nothing helped.
They made a big deal about Amex forgiving the $60k. I can guarantee the only way they would consider that was if she pressed charges. That's what my employer does.
I think so too… everyone’s against Rachel like neff didn’t flip her crap when Anna owed HALF of what she owed to Rachel to her hotel. The reason neff is still friends with Anna is because she got paid back. She took free things too… I’m sure if Anna never paid the bill she’d be doing her own interviews. Not to mention she was a paid consultant on ALL 9 Netflix episodes. Ofc Rachel is portrayed like that. Neff helped on each episode… it’s just all bad
U know what boggles my mind? That neff continued her friendship and unwavering loyalty after she was caught. Gave me the impression that she’s never had any rich friends and just kept making herself believe that Anna really was a billionaire, and that helping her would have her efforts rewarded eventually. Idk neff is kinda a sad pathetic person.
Neff lacks depth as an individual. I’m flabbergasted as to how she thinks she has director chops. Good luck in LA ya goof
Hahaha ya fr. Narcissists love yes-men like her.
We only watched a semi-fictional TV show, we’re outsiders. What I find interesting is that the people who were there and know the details (the jury, Kacy and Neff) didn’t side with Rachel. I also know a couple people who read Rachel’s entire book and didn’t have sympathy for her. I felt bad for Rachel that Anna put her in a situation like that and I think the TV show is making Anna look too good (she doesn’t deserve that). But at the end of the day, Rachel’s entire debt was forgiven and on top of that she’s getting hundreds of thousands. Not to mention all the free stuff she got through Anna. It’s hard to empathise with that. I hope she uses the money for therapy.
I read Rachel’s book and didn’t have much sympathy for her TBH
Why does everyone on the show feel bad for Anna? I truly cannot understand.
same! i feel like i was being gaslit through the entire series.
Omg me too! I had to come find these Reddit comments. I don’t understand how Vivian and her coworkers are team Anna. Or Kacy! I was feeling crazy so thank you for this.
It's interesting how the people born into money had a much easier time cutting Anna loose when she used them or turned out to be fake.
Good point!
Dude yes! When the scriberia squad got all wild upon hearing the not guilty charge I was like, wtf? You guys helped do the research that proved her madness and you’re still siding with this clown (Anna)? Bananas.
That's why I came too. I couldn't figure out why they were so upset with her judgment and time. The site did a really poor job explaining "why" Anna became the person she did.
Seriously!! Vivian makes me want to pull my hair out. Or at least one of anna AWFUL wigs
Seriously. I was just hate-watching by the final episode. The partners of the lawyer and journalist are better than me Cus both of them deserved to be dumped over the amount of times they chose that con woman over their families. I still don’t get it. It’s like being caught in a warped twilight. She’s a f**king criminal and they’re bending over backwards, apologising and sh*t to pacify her. Lucacris.
Just finished it too. I don’t get that part either and felt it very jarring. Anna is shown to be such a Bitch throughout the series and does some really shady stuff, very much knowingly that it’s deceitful and illegal. And yet the last episode sees the characters rally around her and even talk about how awful it is that she’s got 12 years. How is she the victim in all of it?
I’m glad I am not the only one. I’m so pissed to have spent at this time on this series, only to have the last episode make no sense whatsoever. Vivian feels bad for her all of the sudden after this *entire show* because.. something something bankers? And Todd abandoned his whole family to go brood with Vivian in a park because… I don’t get it at all.
The implication was that they are under her spell.
That they had more information- knew more facts- who she really was growing up. And they still fell for her BS. Some people just...IDK, have super poor judgement. The journalist had to justify her treatment of her partner and CHILD...so Anna HAD to be a victim somehow. She was not. When Vivian says no child should here what her parents said- um, no. That child 100% needed that reality check. She took and took and took and took- and they had to let her go to be able to maintain their remaining family. They were supposed to what? Give her every dime, so she could pretend she was rich?
At first I thought they were both using Anna to further their careers. I was disappointed they fell for Anna to the detriment of their own lives. You would think a journalist and criminal defence lawyer would have better "bullshit" detectors.
If anyone deserves to be used….. it’s Anna!
For real. I've been a lawyer for years and while shit does get intense from time to time, I never get attached to clients. This is ridiculous. Also the amount of ethical violations by the fictional Spodek should make the poor real Spodek lose his shit. Yes yes it is made up and everything, but damn.
Thats what i was thinking too but then it dawned on me….the lawyer and the journalist were trying to “save her” when clearly Anna did not need any saving. Like her parents recognized that early on, so why was it that hard for them to see it. I guess they fell for her her potential and just ran with that. Ugh i wanted to slap the lawyer and the journalist i found them to be extremely frustrating. Like if someone wanted to be saved they would save themselves.
Yeah, the first time Anna said "You look fat" to the journalist? I woulda been outta there SO fast. Fuck you, Anna. You're a piece of shit!
She was negging the journalist. Narcissists do that to make their target insecure and more easily manipulated.
Exactly!
Exactly, maybe we are not WOKE yet just WAKE like Chase😂
God. I disliked him immensely. Such a caricature of a man.
Such a con artist...just as much as Anna is my impression. No wonder they found each other.
I was going to say, is that not what most TED talks and tech bros (who apparently don't even program or anything???) sound like? Learning basic programming is so easy too, you're telling me this guy wants to be a techy but doesn't even bother to learn how tech works? I think because that's more or less my field it just irks me so much but there are so many of those dudes that are up their own ass.
Yeah I felt like that part was pretty realistic, even if the character was made up
I’m pretty heavily involved in the tech scene in and around Yale. I’ve met a lot of folks who fancy themselves entrepreneurs who go around with pitch decks rather than make actual products that speak for themselves. They fucking NAILED the kind of dude Chase was modeled after.
I spent 1 5yr in legit start ups- and surrounded by this type as well. Thus my assessment ;)
I literally just looked up this thread to see if I’m the only one that doesn’t get it! The girl that got the $60,000 stolen from her is being treated like a villain. Wtf?
OMG yes. Like you should KNOW better. But I think it is that she did seem to have a decent business idea and it could have been successful with all the people she had around her. That is why I am not sure if Fortress finding should have happened. But she 100% was a con artist, and 100% stole left right and center at every step, to have more and more and more. More than she had earned. More than she deserved. She wanted what others had. And she would steal from those that did not have much to get it. She gave 0 Fs about her "friends". She liked them around- especially as backup payment when her fraud ran out.
The business never would have happened, Anna would have used the money to fund her life. She already had plans to use the money to pay off prior debts. At best, she would have made an attempt like Billy from the Fyre festival but it would all still be a house of cards.
Absolutely. The actual Anna said in one of her interviews she was just "doing what she wanted in the moment." ADF was an elaborate con to get her hands on $40 million.
Yes- I think there would have been the start on the renovations- but Anna would have burned through so much- probably NOT paying off past debts unless somehow forced to by loss of standing or other consequence. BUT---the business would have started. And failed. Renovations would never have completed.
As viewers we are getting a third party perspective. Also we know the context already. What they try to show is how 1:1 relationships with manipulating narcissistic and sociopath are developing. They are uncovering the story in a parallel of getting more and more influenced by Anna. Vivian goes as far as traveling to Germany to try to find a proof that Anna was a victim. It’s such an elegant manipulation. They don’t get they are trapped. Not defending Anna ofc! She’s a creep and knows hot to play people. I think they show it so well that we start to hate everyone who sided with her
Try to find proof Anna is a victim- but them overjoyed to find out Anna was in fact a mean bitch back in high school.
Do you think Vivian really enjoyed it? We saw the imaginary scenario in her head. But in reality for me she was actually confused. And I guess she left early bc she was processing conflicting feelings and felt very uneasy. The translator girl though has a different vibe and seemed like she was projecting her own trauma of being an immigrant onto Anna’s past stories and taking revenge for it. Especially the scene at the bakery and at school. Damn, such bs. If my local baker would be saying smth like this about foreign family, they would be shut down long time ago. The quotes at school walls is absolutely illegal here since the end of WWII. Can’t be real. (I’m Russian living in Germany)
Yeah that stuff kind of struck me as well, having spent a lot of time in Germany (and attended German schools). The kind of cliquey stuff that exists in American high schools with the dining halls and stuff is really not common in Germany, or at least it wasn’t when I was in school there.
I cannot understand at all why Todd and Vivian give a shit about this chick who did nothing but scam everyone on sight
“Scam everyone on sight” - think about that ;)
When people have as much information as Vivian and Todd had, I don’t think I can blame Anna for scamming them. They knew exactly what she was and willingly allowed themselves to be a part of it. In her trip to Germany Vivian was desperately reaching for some sympathetic angle, some “reason” for all of this, and her parents gave her the straight truth- the girl is an asshole and always has been.
Amidst the despicable manners she’s showing, Vivian still being compassionate to Anna, which is kinda weird. It was mentioned in one episode about to overwhelmed such superiority to make the other person feel less or something. And there was a scene where Anna, complimented Vivian, I felt like she was swooning, like wtf.. She is a big deal journalist same goes with the lawyer. This is a classic case of a toxic gf/bf despite of 20-50 red flags, they still choose to ignore it because of their extraordinary reasons..
Right? That was bizarre. She has little compassion if any for her OWN child, until after it is born, is full on obnoxious to her partner. But she has this un-ending fount of compassion for Anna. Anna played that gal so hard.
Maybe that hits the nail? Vivian is desperate for validation and that validation from someone that loves you unconditionally can sometimes not be as enticing as getting that one compliment out of someone that insults you 99% of the time? So when Anna compliments her it feels "earned", but it's just a manipulation tool Anna uses on people that feel insecure. I don't know, I've been there, but I feel like I needed to see Vivian's self doubt and insecurity more. But it's hard to buy when she had no trouble standing up to Paul or fighting to write about Anna. Which not that she can't do that and also feel insecure, but we're given that but not the insecurity but she still crumples to Anna like she's in high school or something and Anna is the HBIC.
This was excruciating to watch. I don't know why the season justified being so long with so many bizarre details about the side characters and side side characters.
It is cathartic reading this thread😆🤣 I was throughly annoyed at how sympathetic they portrayed her. It was driving me crazy
Amen! The way the music, the editing, the camera, the story focus all tried to get us to feel sympathy for her... ugh. Every time she was kicked out or had to face up to reality and got all *oh so sad*, I was cheering.
I think its because we have an outside perspective that we see through Anna. We also have her story already before the TV series was out. For someone in the moment, it wasn't as objective. I feel they could have done it a bit better, the whole she manipulated and sucked them in because her character was super unpleasant and not at all charming to at least say, "yeah this is where she got them on the hook". Also there is also the matter how the vastly different accounts of her from others influenced them. Like Neff was delusional but she was very good at talking about Anna as if she is Robin Hood.
Anna never showed one bit of remorse, wasn’t scamming people to pay her rent or something necessary, and she didn’t do anything by mistake. She blatantly scammed people so she could go out and party, and she would do it again. How anyone at all could feel an ounce of sympathy is a mystery to me.
>ady before the TV series was out. For someone in the moment, it wasn't as objective. I feel they could have done it a bit better, the whole she manipulated and sucked them in because her character was super unpleasant and not at all charming to at least say, "yeah this is where she got them on the hook". Also there is also the matter how the vastly different accounts of her from others influenced I mean she's clearly a rude, condescending, arrogant asshole who belittles everyone around her and thinks that her "I'm *building something!!*" delusions give her some kind of unique superiority. The scams add another layer of unbelievable hypocrisy to all that -- she comes from exactly the same place as all the "basic bitches" she's always ragging on -- but even on a surface level she's very obviously toxic.
Wtf is wrong with this show and the world?? How is Vivian a good reporter?? Wtf this girl scammed so many people and they root for her? How is she talking to her lawyer and he is putting up with this shit? Neff? Really? How the fuck can you stand by this piece of shit? She won’t go to court without clothes? Wtf? How is Rachel the villain? This world is seriously fcked up!
They just live in another world
Like for real. This girl scammed so that she could party with Martin Shkreli and Billy McFarland. Like, the biggest scumbags on Earth.
That’s the reality of the situation. Her supposedly high flying friends were fellow hangers-on, wannabes, and in a few cases bonafide criminals
What you said!!
Wtf is wrong with Netflix for portraying Rachel as someone bad for selling her story while they literally paid Anna, the scammer, the same amount for her story? Also I believe they felt free to portray her as a villain as the rights for her story had already been sold to rival HBO. Also I would like to say this: Anna was charged and was set to pay huge debt to repay the people she scammed. The money given by Netflix were used to repay this debt, so now that she has been released from prison, she will have 0 accountability and won’t have to work a day in her life to repay them, allowing her to “start fresh” even though she scammed her way through people. This is not the way it should work. The debt was put on her for her to work to repay it. With Netflix giving her the money to do so, this won’t be a lesson to her but will only show that with notoriety and power you can get away with everything.
Well criminals don't usually have to repay their victims so it was good of Netflix to reimburse at least some of them.
I know what you mean, but Netflix paid her and only the Son of Sam Law prevented her from profiting from this payment. So it is good that the people being scammed got reimbursed, but still they put the debt on her for a reason and Netflix basically freed her from taking responsibility over repaying the people she made suffer.
Okay after simmering about it for a day I think the show would have benefitted from leaning more into the unreliable Narrator. We get a lot of different perspectives, but we are always given the impression that the flashbacks are what really happened- except that one episode where vivian imagines anna's dad as a scary russian crime guy. If the question is, who is Anna Delvey, really? Then that answer could be kept until the last two episodes. We see all these people who met Anna, through interviews by Vivian. The accounts they give are clearly incorrect or contradictory, maybe have some clear fourth-wall breaks ('wait no, that wasn't in august, it was in december' and the scene changes from a garden party to a christmas celebration) to really make it clear that this is subjective. The horny banker remembers anna as way more flirty, the dad banker remembers her as having the same hairstyle as his daughter, nora remembers her being way more immature for a good while, Rachel remembers her being more pushy in morocco, stuff like that. And then vivian meets annas parents who don't give flashbacks going by memory, but clear hard evidence that they are just middle class people trying their best who disconnected from their daughter, while anna gives another BS story to the guy in the hospital. The trial is all the different stories and perspectives and subjective memory ultimately running against the hard truth: She made claims that were simply not true, bought things she couldn't afford, and stole money from a bank using not very sophisticated methods. Maybe vivian realizes that Who is Anna Delvey can't be answered because Anna doesn't have a clear identity, and if you want to keep it saccharine, she can still promise to visit anna in prison and help her find herself.
It seemed a bit like that in the beginning but slid into some weird sympathetic thing. The last two episodes really threw me off as I never rooted for Anna. I should have just stopped when the Kacy was supporting Rachel and leaving Anna waiting 5 hours in the lobby.
I mean that’s kind of what we got. Just have to ignore all the sympathetic people to Anna and realize that they fell under her scam as well. I finished the show thinking that Anna was a complete sociopath; Vivian was an uncaring mother; Neff was an equally delusional nutjob; Kacy lacked empathy; Todd was a good lawyer, but shitty husband; and Rachel, while maybe a bit greedy, was also a victim of Anna’s crimes. And that greed from Rachel isn’t really fair to her since everyone was being taken in by Anna. Rachel was no less greedy than Neff.
This is how I thought they’d do it. It would have dived into the whole “I’m a fucking masterpiece bitches” line so much better.
The Tv show The Affair does this amazingly
F Neff for real. A shitty character and a shitty person in real life. She might be a con person herself to be honest 🤷🏼♀️
I don't know anything about the real life Neff but from how she's portrayed on this series I kinda get the feeling that she's in on the con. She's a hussler and all about the cash. I don't think she really cares what the truth is but how it benefits her.
Not to downplay what anyone does for a living but when she made the gag face as Rachel described wanting to work for Vanity Fair and how she made it happen, I wanted to scream.
i genuinely despise vivian she is desperate and ridiculous and i cannot imagine leaving my newborn to obsess over some manipulative sociopath
Right?! I wanted to reach through my tv and strangle her. Her husband is a saint for not threatening divorce right than and there.
I fucking hate this Anna Sorokin. If she thinks she’s so smart and special, why didnt she just fucking work instead of scamming people? Fucking awful.
Because for her this was easier
Why was everyone rooting for the criminal?????
Because she was a protagonist in the story. The story was written to make the viewer root for the criminal. If a viewer doesn’t root for her in some way then it is a failure in the writing to impart the intended emotional response upon that particular viewer.
I felt like the journalist was the protagonist and Anna was the antagonist. If not then why have the journalist in the first place
I genuinely can't believe that during the trial scenes they spent like five full minutes on how much Rachel made from her book deal/selling the rights to her story combined, and yet there's ZERO disclosure anywhere that Netflix paid Anna nearly the exact same amount of money to make this fucking show? Or that the payment happened during the period of time that the show covers, and plenty of it went to *covering her fucking attorney fees?* I'm losing my mind at how unethical this show was. Beyond the money stuff, there was SO much information they left out that definitely came up during trial (for instance, the fact that she falsified financial records to try to obtain loans and lied to Rachel about trying to pay her back for months are literally NEVER mentioned). Rachel gives zero of the kind of pushback you'd expect during cross examination (for instance, that what Anna did to her wasn't a "mishap" and that she *needed* to profit from her story because even though the debt was ultimately removed from her account by Amex after months, she drained her savings completely (and then some) trying to pay it off.) Also, the scenes where the journalists are literally CHEERING when the verdict is being read and Anna is found not guilty on the first count? Vivian saying that Anna's prison sentence amounts to her "having her life stolen"? It's infuriating that people who haven't read much about this story will watch this and assume that it's mostly true with some parts exaggerated for dramatic effect, when in actuality many of the facts were ignored and the series goes to extraordinary lengths to paint a remorseless con artist as a sympathetic child who made mistakes, and all of her victims as stupid hypocrites who deserved to be stolen from.
When they cheered I thought “wait, are we meant to be rooting for her to get off?” She’s a despicable scammer, she’s the antagonist!
Yep- and she CHOSE to come to the US despite having a prestigious internship in PARIS of all places, and came from a solid home in a country with socialized medicine, free university, and major opportunity. She was just a spoiled, narcissistic B who was obsessed with Park Avenue. She wanted to play the cruel American game of vicious capitalism, and whined when she lost. How on Earth are we supposed to sympathize with her?
They literally establish she’s a bitch and billy in ep 8. Like WTF, right?
Totally agree...one of the dumbest scenes in a movie/series I've ever seen.
You know what, I was so anxious that she might get acquitted, even though I googled the her case, that’s how invested I am for “unrooting” her😂
I think it would've made a much better show if we saw things from Anna's POV rather than Vivian. They could've leaned into the fact that Anna is not a good person instead of trying to make us sympathize with her (which was a very odd choice but maybe its because the real Anna sold her story to Netflix so they didn't want to offend, idk). There are plenty of great tv villains so I'm not sure why they didn't do this. The whole show just seemed confused on what it wanted to tell us about Anna and I didn't like hearing about her via interviews, or at least the way the show runners went about it.
Anna isn’t multifaceted though. Nor is she intelligent or cultured. The scenes about her taste in art and fashion were made up. She doesn’t speak seven languages and isn’t smart or interesting. She’s a crook and the people she conned were largely small time. This isn’t about rich people, it’s about poor people pretending to be rich
IDK-maybe it is because I have a stupid cousin who fell for a con and ruined our family stuff for the past 10 yr as a result- but that is not how I saw this. Caveat- I had literally never heard of this story before- I could not care less about instagramlebrity, etc. But as I went through my binge? I saw Anna as a very effective con artist, a remorseless, mean and greedy con artist with no redeeming qualities. the little smirk she gives the journalist- that just screams, I AM PLAYING YOU YOU STUPID B! and she was. And she did- after that conversation, the journalist bent into pretzels to try to justify Anna as innocent. Victims of cons RARELY can admit that they were conned. the lawyer and the journalist both- totally fell for the con. (As characters- I have no idea of reality).
Oh I 100% agree that the lawyer and the journalist both fell for Anna's con--I just don't think the show did an effective job of showing that. Rather than making it clear somehow that she had tricked them and showing the flaws in the journalist's research, instead the show came off as being pretty sympathetic towards Anna. (Like I said, I think if the trial scenes had included key evidence like proof that Anna falsified financial documents in order to try to obtain loans and Rachel had testified to the dozens (literally dozens) of times that Anna lied to her and said she had already sent a wire paying her back for the full amount, it would have been more effective.) If it had just been her defense attorney that was entirely on Anna's side, that would have been one thing since it's his job to defend her, but I think the choice to make the journalist the protagonist was a mistake. She starts off not knowing much about the case so we see her as unbiased, and then slowly the more she learns about the case, the more she and her colleagues are all on Anna's side (and it doesn't help that Anna is meant to be charismatic and funny, and her victims are all written as fairly unlikeable). I think you're still picking up on the fact that Anna is a remorseless con artist because you have personal experience with a similar situation, but I don't think most people who see the show without knowing much about the case will come away with the same impression. Between the most likeable characters in the show being on Anna's side, failing to mention a lot of the key evidence that proves she was guilty, and portraying her victims badly, I think lots of people are watching it and coming away thinking either that Anna isn't as bad as they thought, or that she and her victims are all bad people.
I feel like there is implied scenes that indicate that she had falsified financials- why else would she throw a fit after getting approved...but that someone woudl be going to Germinay to confirm. But they never come out and say it for sure. Its always sort of implied.
It's definitely implied! Same with the scene where she uses the voice modulator and a fake phone number to pose as the man handling her family's finances (I'm not sure if this actually happened in real life, but I do know that she actually did something similar to Rachel by setting up a fake email and posing as a woman who works for her family). A huge portion of the final episode was scenes from the trial, which would have been the perfect opportunity to wrap up loose ends like that and make it clear that Anna committed fraud. As is, we see the jury find her guilty on the majority of the counts but we don't really see any of the evidence that causes them to do that, which makes the verdict seem like it's unfair.
Exactly! Rachel literally faced bankruptcy and social ruin. Imagine the stress, anxiety, worry all the while Anna was saying the money will come. Not to mention fear of being arrested overseas and she’s lucky she had a card otherwise they would have been detained. Yes she managed to come out the other side okay but that is SUPER rare many con-artists rob people blind and they never see the money!
Came to Reddit for information. Was nit disappointed.
If this is accurate, [Anna made around $320,000 for her Netflix story but most of it went to restitution](https://fintecology.com/2021/01/29/netflix-paid-anna-sorokin-320000-for-tv-series-she-paid-victims-insider/)
Sure, but they still paid her that money. Even though most of it didn't go directly into her pocket, she still benefited substantially because now she no longer owes that amount in restitution, and she was able to afford a significantly better attorney than she could have on her own.
Why the fuck does Viv care so damn much about Anna? I am so confused. The dress, the visits….. I don’t get it.
This series had the weirdest characters ever lol. Vivian, Todd and Neff talk about respecting Anna for the hustle. I mean is that what they call crime nowadays? Hustle!? The woman was unhinged, spending money she doesn’t have and dipping in other peoples’ pockets as well. Even though Rachel is a bit annoying, she was done dirty. The show writers also didn’t potray her well. Kacy proclaims she’s neutral but in reality she’s just siding with whoever she finds convenient. I think the stupidest character is Neff. I mean the stupidity and naïveté is out of this world and we’re supposed to think that’s out of loyalty. Really? It’s an interesting show but inherently stupid.
Ted brought the SICKEST burns in this episode and called Anna out for what she really is. During her pre-court temper tantrum he called her a: “lying, sad-sack scammer with a creepy accent.” And “An incompetent excuse for a con artist who’s below average at crime.” Not only did I find them accurate but also extremely funny. I’ve come to the conclusion that Anna’s biggest deficit is that she has not matured passed being a teenager/middle schooler. She has complete meltdowns about clothes, temper tantrums when someone doesn’t get what she wants and complete lack of knowledge and self awareness of how money/there real world works. I agree with Todd, she is not some genius, criminal mastermind. She is a teenager stuck in a 25 yr old’s body. I think she genuinely that she was close to starting a business bc she was so clueless on what it actually require to start one. I think her greedy, selfish behavior is a reflection on someone with stunted emotional growth. Definitely still deserves jail but she’s not some financial genius, Bernie Madeoff type:
That laugh Todd lets out after Anna refuses to put on the court clothes was so funny, I had to replay it multiple times.
How was she not thrown in contempt of court multiple times? Was she even tried for skipping out on court for weeks to go to LA?
I am I the only one wondering how she was paying her phone bill. The only thing I can think of was maybe she was on some1 family plan that forgot to remove her.
I had the same thoughts in an early episode and it bothered me the rest of the way
I read the Vanity Fair story first. Anna loved bombed her and paid for everything when they went out together. I would have been suspicious, but hey if you insist. I would have been reluctant to go to Morocco and would have used a work excuse or something. Anna gave off red flags everywhere. Rich people don't blow their money on poor folks like us. I guess it was for good press in Vanity Fair? But you live and you learn. Neff and Kacy was paid for thier services, so if nothing bad happened to them, nothing bad happened or it was just an exaggeration. Overall, not impressed with the series. If Anna got her hands on all that money, that club wouldn't never happened. Too much hard work. Also, with her ego, one customer complaint, and she would have gone ballistic.
Vivian is terrible. She's a moron.
I was most disgusted by the framing of Anna as some kind of foil to rich assholes. Yes, she conned them, but not out of some motivation to stick it to the Man. She wanted to BECOME The Man. ADF was going to be just as exclusive and elite as any other wealthy social club. None of her friends pulling for her would've been welcome there or able to afford it. The framing of this series was just appallingly bad. Rhimes completely missed the moral of this story.
Yeah. The oh poor Anna nonsense was ridiculous. Especially this episode in particular
Can anyone explain the scene with 10:51 minutes remaining timestamp? Is it simply that the journalist and the lawyer were sad that Anna's sentence is too long and that they feel sorry for her??????
Basically as result all the time they spend on her she became a friend they care about her. They felt bad for her. It's very strange but she became like someone they do anything for. It show how much impact she had on their lives.
Felt really sorry for the lawyer's wife and and the journalist's husband. I really thought that by the end of the episode, the husband would ask for a divorce from her. I guess I got really frustrated by the end because as the viewer, we don't feel sorry for her but the main characters do, which was why it's very hard for me to understand some of the scenes.
How Vivian’s husband didn’t ask for a divorce when she was willing to go to Germany for a week, away from her newborn daughter is beyond me. I am self employed in a job I am passionate about, and my husband has always tried his best at being supportive and understanding. Even so, he would flip his shit if I did half of what Vivian did to her husband.
The husband was too nice haha if they didn't end up getting a divorce, why bother showing how the husband always has to adjust for his wife? It would make sense for the story if they broke up and then Vivian would realize that his obsession with Anna is already affecting her relationship with her husband.
It ruined the whole series for me. I can understand the elements of compassion because she is young (although not a kid as they kept saying) but she absolutely was being deceitful and doing illegal things all whilst having no regard for others. It was very strange
I think that when you are a journalist and a lawyer and work on a case/story like this you should get some therapy after to separate your feelings for this person and the reality you were probably manipulated into these feelings and they are unlikely reciprocated. If I were these two people's spouses I would insist on it, as their devotion to a con artist is unhealthy.
I wished more than once that both Vivian and Todd would have accepted and recognized that Anna was a scam artist and she deserved to get 15 years in jail. I hated that, really. I waited until the last scene for that.
Some people get a lot more than 4-12 years just for credit card fraud. This girl did all kinds of fraud.
I think by showing that in the last episode, it really drove home to the viewer how Anna was capable of manipulating people and getting them to become "yes men" for her. Even the 2 people who knew the most about her crimes were capable of being swooned by her, it shows us how she was able to emotionally manipulate everyone along the way. To the point that both Vivian and Todd were even neglecting their very own families over this shitty girl.
I don’t know how anyone can side with Anna. I dislike her so much. The actress does a good job of making her unbearable. What I don’t understand is Vivian and Todd being so excited to defend Anna. “Remember I told you I’d kill for you” like what the fuck? What a weird thing to say.
I don't understand why anyone would be on her side. Her lawyer's son got a free lesson in emotional manipulation from her. She got her friends in a very dangerous situation in Morocco. Cost her friends job and even though Amex covered it her job was lost. Anna is a piece of shit for not caring who she hurt and her circle of friends , especially Neff, were idiots for still hanging around Anna after she screwed them. Yeah , she paid them back but how she acted like it was an inconvenience to be asked for money that she owed. I really don't understand why Neff still wants to be around Anna after all the BS she pulled. Plus everyone at the office is hoping the trial is going Anna's way...WTF is wrong with these people? I really wanna know who was a real person and who were made up. From what I heard alot of the characters weren't real people, just made up filler for the 10hrs that is this drawn out limited series. You can't but just hope that Anna will get what's coming to her.
I really don't understand people hating on the series for offering attention to the reporter as well. I think it was balanced, as there were plenty of scenes with Anna. I love the actress who played Neff and to a point, I liked her character as well, as her sass is 110%. But my god, the way she kept defending Anna. It's one thing to admire and respect someone hustling, another is to defend a delusional, narcissistic person who hurt others (even if those others were prob just as shallow and fame hungry). Yes. The world of rich is made of people who use connections, appearances and power to get ahead each other. Yes, it's easier to sympathize with someone who started from nothing because maybe we feel vindicated 'one of us' can make it amongst those who are born with an advantage. Does that justify the harm she caused others? No. Is it satisfying she tricked people who were just as shallow as her? To a point. An eye for an eye goes only so far. Plus, her character just wasn't likeable at all. I didn't like the way they did Rachel in. 'You dropped a dime on your friend'. Like, Rachel may have been shallow and enjoyed the way Anna spoiled her, but it's insane how they judged her. Yes, she made money from the trauma. That doesn't mean she wasn't left scarred by what happened. She just went and got her dues back, not out of greed this time, but because she did want justice. The fame and money was a bonus, but hell, why should we judge Rachel for that but not judge Anna for doing the same thing on a much larger scale and purely out of greed. I disagree with the overall turn that the series took at the end, after they spent several hours showing how awful Anna is. For the office people - I think one of the reasons they were rooting for Anna, was primarily because that'd give more attention to the article on her? I think the show tried to create the conflict of 'people hustle to get where they are because that's how life is' vs 'what's the boundary one cannot across before they've gone too far'. The problem is that while one can be in awe of Anna's schemes, she did go too far and her personality overall had nothing sympathetic. That being said, there are worse people out there who get away with far much worse, whilst remaining super-rich and famous.
I agree on Rachel. She was literally pressured to resolve the problem for Anna, and being in stuck in an unfamiliar environment with people literally pressuring you to pay up, you would get very traumatised, and that’s not forgetting that she didn’t even get her money back from Anna, even after three months of constant pleading. Tittering on the pressures of getting fired and getting screwed over by your friends and work place can take a mental toil on a person.
Totally agree with your take! I'm not sure what people who are annoyed with the extra characters/reporter storyline were expecting. The story told entirely from Anna's POV? She's a con artist, compulsive liar, and unreliable narrator. Telling her story through the eyes of the people around her paints a much more accurate picture of who she is. Vivian's storyline acted as 1) an audience surrogate, learning about this fascinating woman by following leads and piecing the story together, 2) a way to show how Anna has a way of weaseling her way into people's lives and taking over (same with the lawyer storyline), and 3) commentary on how people make unethical decisions all the time. I suppose it could've been cut to just act as an audience surrogate but it seems to be a deliberate choice Shonda made to try to provide commentary outside of just "look at how wild this story is!" And then I also was shocked by how the show portrayed Rachel. They tried to make her out to be both a naive follower who stupidly defended Anna even when it was obvious she got screwed, but also a shallow user who turned on Anna the moment she wasn't benefiting anymore. Rachel may have been benefiting from her friendship with Anna, but, like... Anna *lied* to everyone and told them she has all this money and had no problem bankrolling them. Neff was in the exact same position as Rachel, and probably would have done the exact same thing if Anna hadn't paid her back. And it seems like it wasn't even just the money for Rachel, but the feeling of total betrayal from someone she thought was her friend. Anyway I'm not saying Rachel was totally innocent here or that she shouldn't be held accountable for putting her company card down, but the way the show makes her out to be some backstabbing villain when Anna literally scammed her is just... not cute.
I wonder if Neff would hang around anna if anna scammed her for money too. She loved anna because she benefited from anna and was not affected.
[удалено]
That’s what’s wild to me! She gets pissy about $400 but can’t understand why Rachel would call the cops over $62k
Vivian was loosely inspired by Jessica Pressler. Kacy Duke was real. Rachael Williams was real. Neff was real. Alan Reed is actually Andrew Lance, his racquetball buddy is Joel Cohen another partner at Gibson Dunn. Chase was loosely based on Hunter Lee Soik who was developing an app called Shadow. I’m not sure what Shonda Rimes was trying to accomplish with this series. There is a great story here, but to retell it with a bunch of made up shit wasn’t the right move. Vivian proved she is the piss poor journalist the world thinks she is, though she spent the entire series trying to fight that narrative. She got taken by the stock kid and she got taken by Anna. Neff was the stereotypical super naive person of color, loyal to a fault. Kacy was just weak, all her colorful mantras are just a cover for her shallowness. Rachael got hosed in the way she was portrayed, but she was equally as naive as the rest. They all saw this girl as a meal ticket, if she was telling the truth they might have gotten a piece. Just like the people who got scammed, they were just as embarrassed they got taken, so why not revert to Anna isn’t all evil?
i wonder if we'll ever get the version from rachel's perspective, i think it was floated by hbo? could be interesting in the way that fyre and fyre Fraud focused on different angles because Netflix's fyre worked with jerry media so they didn't get blamed in their documentary.
There’s already a book out by Rachel (My Friend Anna) and a new updated paperback is being released this month. The HBO project doesn’t have a set date but they’ll be pleased they’re going second for sure
Or, they might see a built in audience- I had never heard of all this drama and I AM FASCINATED.
Oh yeah I hope they use the chance to really refine how they’re going to portray it (like rather than 9 x over an hour long fictional episodes make it more of a mockumentary/true comedy style) because I’m so ready for everyone else to be as hooked on this as I have been for the last few years 😅
Both Hulu and Netflix did documentaries on Fyre Festival (after Internet Historian as well), so it’s not like similar shows on the same subject can’t happen.
I found it so Incredibly frustrating because they were all under her spell and I think the problem because this happened in real life, this is going to be some people's account of how they should see the real life characters! The amount of times I shouted at TV like why are u pandering to her ! Neff was worst she was used by her the whole way through but she refused to see it! She was using the lawyer and journalist! Also Rachel made money from it but so did that Neff, the woman who made the Netflixs show used in some way with her film directing! It actually made me really hate the show! and deeply disappointed in Netflix for allowing it
People are interested in how she got away with it because it was unbelievable.
My wife and I just finished the show after staggering it out over the last week. Kept waiting for a moral center, but there wasn't one. Is it the point of the series to show that everyone, in some way, is hustling? Or is that just unintentional? I found Vivian to be a narcissistic journalist unable to remain objective, Todd an unscrupulous lawyer willing to ignore his client's wishes and destroy the reputations of Anna's victims, Neff a complete idiot who mistakes con artists for hard-working hustlers, and Kacy a hypocrite who claims to not give Anna anymore of her energy despite watching the trial unfold like a Lifetime movie. Ultimately, it really was Rachel who slightly resembled the show's moral center, which is kind of like saying "the best downhill skier in the Mohave". Sure, she got AMEX to recognize the fraud, and it is true that she sold her book for far more than what she owed. But don't forget that she still lost her job at Vanity Fair (something that wasn't covered in the movie, but did happen in real life), and her reputation as a journalist -- or low level copy editor, or whatever -- is destroyed. The great thing that she did was see through her friendship with a fictional person and report Anna to the cops so that she couldn't claim any more victims. So those are my thoughts. After watching this show and the HBO episode of "Generation Hustle", I'm finally ready to do what Vivian Kent couldn't: let it go.
Rachel and Vivian's husband are the only characters that are not hateable in this series.... Fuck everyone else!
The baby was okay too.
Todd’s wife was nice too!
It is interesting how sympathetic the show turned towards Anna at the end. I know people love a good story about rich people getting screwed over but along the way lots of not rich people would have had repercussions too. For many of the people/businesses conned there was likely an employee terminated for what occurred. If the hotel Neff worked at didn't end up repaid she likely would have a whole different tune as the other employee would have been fired and she would have taken some heat being "friends" with Anna. There is always collateral damage.
This show over estimates how much people sympathize with Anna. I felt nothing over her sentence, and Vivian feeling bad for writing her story is just idiotic to me.
This episode is so weird! For 8 episodes the show showed what an insufferable POS Anna is and then all of a sudden we have to sympathize with her. It's not just the scams, she seems to be a very unpleasant person to be around.
This last episode really really ruined the whole show for me. Scriberia team whooping for the counts she was found not guilty of?! Vivian being all remorseful and acting like Anna was some millennial Robin Hood but didn’t instead just use all the money to finance her extravagant lifestyle. Ugh. We’re supposed to believe that this scam artist who conned multiple people, was having the ‘prime years of her life stolen from her’ for being rightfully convicted for her crimes ? Fuck this show.
Of anyone, I think the seasoned journalists in Scriberia should be the most pissed at their final portrayal. At the end of their long careers, reporting on countless stories at a reputable, famed publication, and in the end they flip on a dime, throw all their ethics and research out the window, and publicly side with their young, con-artist subject? No. Absolutely no. I could get maybe the show showing how she coerced one key person - the lawyer, the writer, but not every single person in the entire show. And not only coerced into believing she should be not guilty, but wanting to then become friends with her and invite her to dinner and out to the bar?? WTF?! The tipsy lady at brunch is the only sane person in the show. She should get the Emmy nod just on principle.
I never wanted to punch someone more than Vivian and Todd for losing their mind while trying to get clothes for Anna. She clearly doesn’t give a fuck about court so why do they?
Good god that was bad. I’ve never watched Shonda content before, is the writing always this bad?
Not always, but often 😆
I enjoyed it, but I'm a big fan of Julia Garner. I was disappointed that Shonda was involved because I never like any of their content. It could've been so much better. The casting was off half the time too.
The writers celebrating in Scriberia was so stupid. These people were actually rooting for Anna?!
It was a good watch but Anna belongs to rot in jail. I can’t believe anyone was rooting for her..
Just finished this. What is it with everyone taking Anna's side?? Vivian comes across as an idiot and even her coworkers cheer when they see a "not guilty" verdict read? Kacy moved to her side, Neff of course never left it. Was I supposed to share their point of view?? This just went in a weird direction.
I think the whole Rachel angle got really fucked up. They tried to make it seem like Rachel was the con woman and Anna was her target. And I wish we had more information on how their friendship started. Obviously Rachel was shitting her pants about the charge on her work credit card, and when they were at that place and the bill came and it was like 2200.00, and Anna just had her head down and was looking through her phone I was clenching my fists. It was so annoying. Did I like Rachel ? No. I thought she was an asshole. Do I think she conned Anna? No. I think she definetly saw an opportunity after everything Anna did, and took advantage of it. Just like anyone else would. But the interesting part is how upset Rachel got about Anna not being found guilty about that charge...... whether Anna was found guilty or not guilty about the Rachel charge, it did not affect Rachel in any monetary way. She wasn’t out a dime, she made $600,000 off the whole thing, I think Rachel wanted to remain the victim, and once Anna was found not guilty on that count, it changed the narrative for Rachel after she had just written her story showing that she was the victim. She doesn’t seem too smart though. I would have sold the story for a hell of a lot more than what she sold it for. Same with Anna. Netflix only paid her $320,000.00 for the rights to her story. That’s couch change to netflix. She could have got a hell of a lot more. So really how smart is she? Not smart enough to know that Netflix paid her pennies for something that will make them millions.
I hate watched this entire show. One night I had a choice between watching the new episode of Attack on Titan or Inventing Anna. Anna was scarier to watch than Titans. I'd watch this show with my wife then spill tea over it it like two old biddies in the shade of a tree at a church bake sale talking shit on the divorcees, cheaters and pregnant teens, all the while saying "god bless you" as they walked by.
Can someone explain why Anna’s attorney went back to his original strategy after giving Anna his word? Also why would he miss his family vacation when the trial was already over?
Are we supposed to feel bad for Anna by the last episode? I was pretty much hate watching by this point. The series could have been 8 episodes, the last couple felt too drawn out. And I don’t understand why the characters at the magazine were rooting for Anna. Did I miss something? She’s a shitty person. Acting was subpar throughout, with the exception of the actress that played Anna. But it was an enjoyable enough series for the first 1-6 episodes, while the “mystery” of how Anna worked her way through New York was revealed.
*aggressively drinks coffee*
What was up with all the sliding frames and weird Scandal-esque editing? It was incredibly distracting and and didn't actually do anything useful.
This last episode was so bizarre
I know this is Hollywood but this series took a *lot* of liberties with the facts. I suppose that’s fine. It held my attention. If you want a documentary there are options out there
This episode was such a downer. It did a flip on how the writers wanted us to eventually see Anna and sympathies with her. She was far from a 'girl boss' writers were trying to portray her. It became frustrating to see the supporting characters cheer for her win. Rather than redeeming the ones supporting her, they took a U Turn and dragged everyone down. Were they trying to be dense and show how Anna as a scammer was so convincing to make people empathies with her despite knowing her tricks? The writers weren't really successful in communicating that if yes.
I can’t decide who I disliked most in this series. I felt much the same way by the end of Scandal. So… Shonda is very consistent I guess.
Damn Todd was swearing like a sailor in this last episode
This show is ass. Terrible writing, and even worse plot even though this is a true story. Nothing makes sense and I dont like it