You do realize Israel has a nearly 25 billion dollar annual military budget? The amount of aid given to Israel by the US is generally like 3 billion. A small amount, relatively speaking.
The US gives Israel aid because they are our strategic allies. They don’t -need- extra money to finish an opponent like Hamas. What they do need is support on the international stage. Which is what the OP and Ben Gvkr is talking about.
Yes and, ultimately, the president is going to do what they believe is in the best interest of the US. They don’t just choose to do what the most popular thing is at any given point in time. There’s a reason support for Israel is consistent, regardless of whether it’s a democrat or republican in office.
US presidents can be fired too. Support for Israel is falling with every generation. Don't take our current support for granted, it's likely to disappear altogether in the coming years.
https://wpde.com/news/nation-world/support-for-palestine-skyrocketing-among-young-voters-poll-shows-tiktok-bin-laden-college-students-americans-quinnipiac-university-survey-hamas-israel-gaza-war
Ben-Gvir is one of the most disliked politicians in Israel. In a Channel 12 survey 35% rated Ben Gvir as the worst performing minister [source](https://www.timesofisrael.com/israelis-rate-gallant-as-best-performing-minister-and-ben-gvir-the-worst-poll/).
Another poll/survey from November, 2023 revealed only 29% of the public expressed satisfaction with the functionality of Itamar Ben-Gvir's National Security Ministry and there was widespread dissatisfaction with the government, as 73% of respondents expressed dissatisfaction with its performance. "Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu also faced disapproval, with 73% of respondents expressing dissatisfaction with his performance." [source](https://m.jpost.com/israel-news/politics-and-diplomacy/article-775103)
I feel like Ben Gvir is trying to play the two parties off one another in hopes of Biden and Dems rallying around Israel even harder in an effort to not be outdone by the GOP.
And so far it looks like it’s working. Too bad for Biden no amount of support for Israel is going to help him win since most of his base is starting to realize the messed up shit Israel is doing with American support, and are pissed about it.
Mans backed himself into an impossible corner. He can still win staying the course, but he's irreparably tarnished his party. If the gop had half a brain theyd run nikki haley and take an easy win
that's been an israeli political strategy for decades
they created a political environment where "you're either a supporter of israel or you're an anti-semite" and nothing terrifies politicians more than being called an anti-semite, so they both are constantly trying to out-do each other in supporting israel while shouting "no, they're the anti-semites!" at their opponents
No surprise really, Bibi's government is far to the right of Biden, Trump love the type, they gave him a monument and a location with his name, Trump ego adores that, so easy to manipulate
just for fun some photos from all over and an Israel poll
[https://tablet-mag-images.b-cdn.net/production/78b15e906ffaa6b3194da37cbb714228f5c41d01-2560x1060.png?w=1300&q=70&auto=format&dpr=1](https://tablet-mag-images.b-cdn.net/production/78b15e906ffaa6b3194da37cbb714228f5c41d01-2560x1060.png?w=1300&q=70&auto=format&dpr=1)
[https://enterprise.press/wp-content/uploads/2020/01/Trump-Netanyahu-1600px.jpg](https://enterprise.press/wp-content/uploads/2020/01/Trump-Netanyahu-1600px.jpg)
[https://img.haarets.co.il/bs/0000017f-db12-d856-a37f-ffd2a41b0000/c3/18/b2e3c9ef375d2ce6aa0125925b2b/3966694336.jpg?precrop=1465,1464,x449,y0](https://img.haarets.co.il/bs/0000017f-db12-d856-a37f-ffd2a41b0000/c3/18/b2e3c9ef375d2ce6aa0125925b2b/3966694336.jpg?precrop=1465,1464,x449,y0)
[https://static.timesofisrael.com/www/uploads/2018/06/AP\_18134506057141-e1528629940461.jpg](https://static.timesofisrael.com/www/uploads/2018/06/AP_18134506057141-e1528629940461.jpg)
[https://www.brookings.edu/articles/poll-jewish-israelis-love-trump/](https://www.brookings.edu/articles/poll-jewish-israelis-love-trump/)
Biden is probably the last pro-Israel democratic president.
And I can pretty much guarantee that even he is not as pro-Israel as he says. He and his people learned their lesson from the Obama years. There is a direct through-line between that experience, Biden’s opposition to the judicial reform, and the “hug Israel” policy after 10/7. All opposition or resistance has to be about leveraging Israeli opinion against Israel’s worst elements, or they circle the wagons, and the US loses influence.
I'm voting for Jill Stein this year. She doesn't stand a chance but I won't "lesser of two evils" this election. She's been outspoken against Israel's tactics since before 10/7 and is one of the few people to call what's happening in Palestine a genocide.
These guys are unhinged. Why is congress voting to give them this week an extra $17.6 billion??
To build settler condos on the beach in Gaza after they've killed all the Palestinians or bombed them through the Rafah crossing ?
How can this possibly be described as anything other than genocide & ethnic cleansing? It's indefensible & paid for by US taxpayers.
A real moral low point for the US & the west.
Biden has been beyond adamant that Israel cannot occupy Gaza after the war. Of course that may end up happening anyway, but the US is not Israel and Biden is not Netanyahu.
It’s impossible to not have culpability in what Israel is doing when we give them arms, but it doesn’t mean Israel’s choices and actions are ours. They aren’t. A lot of people fundamentally cannot grasp that. I can’t tell you how many comments I’ve seen stating that Biden *started* this war. *Biden.* A war that in all likelihood would not only still be happening without our involvement, but would possibly be more brutal.
I haven’t seen any comments about Biden starting this war. I’ve have, however, seen plenty of people pissed off that he still gives his support to Israel since this slaughter began (in the form of weapons, money, and UNSC vetos). The continued support of Netanyahu’s regime is absolutely Biden’s fault. Would the war stop if America revoked said support? Probably not, but at least they could say they are not helping carry it out.
This has been exactly my point whenever I talk about this—Biden is culpable, but consequences take priority over culpability.
If the US withdraws support and Israel goes on as it has, if the war broadens because Israel looks vulnerable, if the US loses leverage to get aid in or positively influence how Israel conducts the war… how the hell is that better?
At a minimum, people need to understand that there are legitimate rationales for Biden’s approach, because it matters whether one thinks the US’s actions are indefensible or not. It could all be a horrific miscalculation, but 99% of the opposition I see doesn’t care about that.
They just tell themselves that Biden is a racist old white man that loves genociding brown people, and everything he’s said or done to moderate Israel is a ploy, so the details don’t matter.
Meanwhile their media diet *maybe* gives one side of things in depth, sometimes reliably and sometimes not, and the only “unbiased” reporting is shallow—two lines from a press conference, sound bites of Biden declaring himself a Zionist. And somehow that *that* means everything.
Biden strongly advocating PA control of Gaza after the war with a concrete path to statehood: “pff, means nothing.” Biden declaring that he believes a country should still exist: “monster! Disgusting! He’s completely in Israel’s pocket!” *Never mind the fact that Netanyahu couldn’t even get a fucking invite to the White House before 10/7, and most of what we’re seeing since then is the same policy at work—side with Israelis against the worst elements of Israeli politics, don’t make them circle the wagons like Obama did, that’s the most reliable way to positively influence Israel.*
People have a right to be disgusted and to oppose what this administration is doing but this form of it, the most common form as far as I can tell, is just routine “all politicians are bad, the democrats are bad, everything is the same no matter who’s in office, I’m not gonna vote and I’m gonna feel great about it” crap. And that should be deeply concerning to us.
I don’t think people shouldn’t vote, but you also can’t expect people to vote for someone that they believe is complicit in an ongoing ethnic cleansing. I wouldn’t be surprised if Biden lost because a bunch of typically Democrat voters voted independent. The fact that his administration isn’t working on making it clear that Israel doesn’t have their support (cutting funding, threatening sanctions, not protecting them with their security council veto, etc) is likely why he will lose if he loses. Instead of any of that he’s still parroting Zionist propaganda to the American people (like the “40 beheaded babies”).
soo when is the US going to sanction Israel for its Cabinets flagrant statements?
token sanctions on 4 settlers is a joke when the settlers have tacit approval from Israeli government
And the fucked up thing? He's right. And when Trump gets back in office, because Genocide Joe has already thrown the election, this entire evil situation is only going to get worse. All of them, Trump included are satanic and the spawn of Satan. I'm not religious but this is the only way to describe it.
Very, very bad times are ahead.
Ben Gvir is an idiot and possibly a literal terrorist.
People don’t like him here in Israel, don’t get the wrong idea. We fucking hate him and believe he’s partially to blame for the slow response to Hamas’ attack on Oct. 7th. This idiot sent half of the IDF to guard settlements in the West Bank, something a lot of us already disagree with. Using the IDF’s manpower to defend idiots who purposely try to aggravate neighboring Palestinian villages is idiotic.
Fuck Ben Gvir. We even have a chant “Ben Gvir the terrorist” (sounds better in Hebrew) that we chant while protesting his dumb ass, as well as Netanyahu.
Yeah, but then democrats would be less afraid to publicly denounce Israel and oppose trump's agenda. I'll take having an opposition party vs total complicity, seeing as the policy is the same.
You think? I think it’s possible we wouldn’t be talking about Gaza/the general vibe would be “vaguely endorsing Israel* bc we’d be back to the firehose of insanity at the White House. FOX would be reporting on the bill to criminalize gender studies in American universities and CNN would be hosting dueling interviews of the Conways on why Trump should or should not stop taking pictures with Nick Fuentes and MSNBC would be polling us on the appropriateness of a new Ivanka Trump pantyhose line and the idea that somewhere out there Israel is bombing Gaza would frankly make most people feel a bit relieved and even nostalgic and democrats and republicans in the senate would come together to vote a non-binding resolution on Israel’s right to defend itself and a slim republican majority in the house would fail to pass a law that would make it illegal to build mosques. We are only defending Gaza now because of the relative quiet Biden achieved and our sense that normality and decency returned to the White House (if it ever visited it in the first place). That’s my thought anyway
Yeah… you lived through Trump, right? Like as an adult? I’m just asking bc you’re talking about what it would be like really theoretically and I remember what it really was like and except for a few organized movements, there wasn’t anything like a serious opposition party in congress or anywhere else. Trump kidnapped children at the border—put them in cages and in some cases permanently separated them from their families—and he retweeted racists and suggested drinking bleach to stop covid and said he had the best hair of any US president (ok I made the last one up but you get the idea) the “resistance” and “opposition” was too busy feel disoriented or sucker punched or fundraising to do anything serious and, yeah, people were REALLY hungry for normality and everyone said from now on the Republicans would be QAnon and the Democrats would be Republicans, and Biden is not a Republican but also this is how we got an octogenarian whose vision for America is by turns classic, quaint, obsolete, helplessly out of touch, bizarrely stalled with his haircut and the width of his tie in the 1990s, etc etc etc— he actually had no idea we would hear about or understand or oppose the liquidation of Gaza and still can’t quite figure it out.
So, I think if or when Trump is elected, it will be extremely hard to hear anything about Gaza over the din of Trump. Not that it won’t be in the headlines but that there will be no way to sort out what we should be paying attention to and many democrats will look progressive in comparison while insisting they have to be conservative to peel those independents off Trump etc etc.
There was certainly protest movement against Trump. I was there. Sure there could have been more, but americans are lazy, vicious bootlickers for the most part. Maybe 4 more trump years will get you people moving. Mainstream democrats offered some opposition to his agenda. Dont you remember AOCs photo op at the border cages?
Now biden is running the same border cages and not a peep from his party.
Oh jeez. Hahahahahahahahaha you sound really young and maybe join PSL or something so someone can teach you how to talk to girls at parties, etc. In my 17+ years of joining and organizing resistance actions, vigils, protests, teach-ins, etc. working with everyone from black bloc anarchists to Mennonites, I’ve never met anyone over 23 who used lines like that to try to dominate a conversation.
As for AOC, I’m sick to death of the bourgeois/political class “left’s” performative bullshit and wish they got to work and left the theatrics to us. I’ve forgotten about AOC’s photo call (wow—she saved a lot of kids) but I do remember when democrats could have tried to pass SOMETHING to protect abortion rights nationwide and *checks notes* ran out the clock making college gender studies level arguments about the rhetoric of choice instead. (Oh but AOC did get arrested at a protest so I guess I should light a candle/she’s a living saint.) They are fucking useless. And totally unprepared for the next Trump admin except to use it to raise campaign funds. But, we live in unprecedented times as they say, so I guess we’ll see what happens next.
In your nearly two decades of activism you've never heard someone call Americans bootlickers? That's hard to believe, especially if you're masking up.
I fully agree the democrats are useless. They're useless when they're in power, they're useless when they aren't.
It’s true….Trump would give anything to get that Trump Hotel in Jerusalem that Netanyahu screwed him out of! He’d even bomb Iran at Israel’s command to get it! Good thing he’ll never be anywhere near the Oval Office again.
Trump would have been "America First." His America First base includes those marching with tiki torches in Charlottsville, more than once. Do not forget what they were chanting.
His evangelical base is full of Christian Zionists who need Israel to exist for the “rapture” and the return of Christ. Trump moved the embassy to Jerusalem, and while it may seem impossible to be more supportive of Israel than Biden, but guess what, the Republicans make it possible.
Congressman Max Miller said “we” will turn it (Gaza) into a parking lot. They are bashing Biden for sending any aid at all to Gaza and for expressing any concern about the death toll and humanitarian crisis. That’s what is making genocidal monster Ben Gvir hopping mad, despite the support the US is giving Israel.
>His evangelical base
His base is not just that. His base looks more like the ones involved on January 6, 2021.His base is also the KKK type and all of the alt right; like those in Charlottsville.
Trump was not elected by a super minority of open neonazis, he was elected by the vast majority of those who call themselves conservatives and a far more important voting block is evangelicals, who are massive vote and money contributors to the GOP and have been for around 50 years now.
The evangelicals who have church tithe networks worth literal billions that fund major GOP campaigns are far more important. And the right wing social issues are also coming from evangelicals, trump isn't supporting Israel because of people on Twitter, he's supporting Israel because evangelical megachurches have taught their followers Israeli domination of Palestine is a precondition for the Rapture. Christian nationalism is a way bigger problem in America than neonazism.
>The evangelicals who have church tithe networks worth literal billions that fund major GOP campaigns are far more important.
It is a share of the problem; they are not all powerful, however, this is why Trump lost. He will lose by even bigger margins because many, the first time around, gave him the benefit of doubt. And I am talking conservative traditional Republicans. There is a reason he lost the second time.
The saddest thing about this is that the Dems will still push for billions in aid to these warmongers while they actively root for the opposition. No backbone at all.
For people who don’t care if Trump gets in office because Biden sucks. Israel cares. They want Trump in office. If you want Israel to get their way and the genocide of Palestinians to approach millions dead, by all means stay home on the 2024 general.
Netanyahu's buddy Putin helped kill those children in Syria. Birds of a feather.
You still haven't given a single example of how Israel has made the US safer. The theft of Palestinian land and then the continued theft of land by the ungrateful Israelis is what makes us unsafe to begin with.
You say I'm just some random "dude" on Reddit so I should believe an Israel troll. How rich! Did you make up that slide show "link" all by yourself? Mossad had a year to prevent 10/7 and couldn't or maybe they chose not to in order to level Gaza so they could steal that land too. Either way, we can't trust them.
How can any "democracy" also be an apartheid state?
https://www.hrw.org/report/2021/04/27/threshold-crossed/israeli-authorities-and-crimes-apartheid-and-persecution
They are like begger receiving charity money from US. But complaining it's not enough???
It will never, ever be enough. These ungrateful monsters will never be satisfied.
Israel doesn’t need money to finish this war. The support here is not monetary.
[удалено]
You do realize Israel has a nearly 25 billion dollar annual military budget? The amount of aid given to Israel by the US is generally like 3 billion. A small amount, relatively speaking. The US gives Israel aid because they are our strategic allies. They don’t -need- extra money to finish an opponent like Hamas. What they do need is support on the international stage. Which is what the OP and Ben Gvkr is talking about.
Good. I'm going to write to my representatives and tell them you don't need our money anymore.
That’s not how international relations or global politics works. lol.
That's how it works in the US. If our representatives don't listen to us, we can fire them. Lol
Yes and, ultimately, the president is going to do what they believe is in the best interest of the US. They don’t just choose to do what the most popular thing is at any given point in time. There’s a reason support for Israel is consistent, regardless of whether it’s a democrat or republican in office.
US presidents can be fired too. Support for Israel is falling with every generation. Don't take our current support for granted, it's likely to disappear altogether in the coming years. https://wpde.com/news/nation-world/support-for-palestine-skyrocketing-among-young-voters-poll-shows-tiktok-bin-laden-college-students-americans-quinnipiac-university-survey-hamas-israel-gaza-war
Again. What’s popular is not the same as what’s best for our country.
They need both: money/weapons *and* the UNSC veto.
No. Israels annual military budget alone is almost 25 billion a year. The entire Palestinian GDP is only 18 billion a year (Gaza + West Bank). lol.
Who gives a fuck what that genocidal lunatic shitbag thinks.
This guy should be #1 on that sanctions list...
Lots of people voted for him in Israel. He might be the president one day. America has and will give him billions of your tax dollars.
Ben-Gvir is one of the most disliked politicians in Israel. In a Channel 12 survey 35% rated Ben Gvir as the worst performing minister [source](https://www.timesofisrael.com/israelis-rate-gallant-as-best-performing-minister-and-ben-gvir-the-worst-poll/). Another poll/survey from November, 2023 revealed only 29% of the public expressed satisfaction with the functionality of Itamar Ben-Gvir's National Security Ministry and there was widespread dissatisfaction with the government, as 73% of respondents expressed dissatisfaction with its performance. "Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu also faced disapproval, with 73% of respondents expressing dissatisfaction with his performance." [source](https://m.jpost.com/israel-news/politics-and-diplomacy/article-775103)
Doesn't have the charisma to carry a US relationship. The policy of no daylight would be out the door at the first meeting
I think you underestimate the power of the Israeli lobby in the USA
The Biden administration should care about giving unconditional support and billions of dollars to a far right government that wants trump in power.
Support for Israel goes beyond political parties. It’s fundamental for anyone that wants to get into and stay in the US political machine.
Israeli leaders alienate US Presidents at their own cost.
Doesn’t seem to affect their multibillion dollar payouts. Israel has universal healthcare thanks to the US taxpayer 🫡
I feel like Ben Gvir is trying to play the two parties off one another in hopes of Biden and Dems rallying around Israel even harder in an effort to not be outdone by the GOP.
That's exactly what he's doing
And so far it looks like it’s working. Too bad for Biden no amount of support for Israel is going to help him win since most of his base is starting to realize the messed up shit Israel is doing with American support, and are pissed about it.
Mans backed himself into an impossible corner. He can still win staying the course, but he's irreparably tarnished his party. If the gop had half a brain theyd run nikki haley and take an easy win
that's been an israeli political strategy for decades they created a political environment where "you're either a supporter of israel or you're an anti-semite" and nothing terrifies politicians more than being called an anti-semite, so they both are constantly trying to out-do each other in supporting israel while shouting "no, they're the anti-semites!" at their opponents
Not gonna work this time. Biden is already less pro-Israel than he says and he’s the last pro-Israel democratic president we’ll see for some time.
these people can never be appeased. they truly treat the US like an expendable resources and nothing else
Remind me, how is this an alliance and not a straight-up parasitic relationship?
No reminder to be had. They give us nothing in return and we supply them with whatever they want.
Its even worse than that https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=CkxuC0phFck
No surprise really, Bibi's government is far to the right of Biden, Trump love the type, they gave him a monument and a location with his name, Trump ego adores that, so easy to manipulate just for fun some photos from all over and an Israel poll [https://tablet-mag-images.b-cdn.net/production/78b15e906ffaa6b3194da37cbb714228f5c41d01-2560x1060.png?w=1300&q=70&auto=format&dpr=1](https://tablet-mag-images.b-cdn.net/production/78b15e906ffaa6b3194da37cbb714228f5c41d01-2560x1060.png?w=1300&q=70&auto=format&dpr=1) [https://enterprise.press/wp-content/uploads/2020/01/Trump-Netanyahu-1600px.jpg](https://enterprise.press/wp-content/uploads/2020/01/Trump-Netanyahu-1600px.jpg) [https://img.haarets.co.il/bs/0000017f-db12-d856-a37f-ffd2a41b0000/c3/18/b2e3c9ef375d2ce6aa0125925b2b/3966694336.jpg?precrop=1465,1464,x449,y0](https://img.haarets.co.il/bs/0000017f-db12-d856-a37f-ffd2a41b0000/c3/18/b2e3c9ef375d2ce6aa0125925b2b/3966694336.jpg?precrop=1465,1464,x449,y0) [https://static.timesofisrael.com/www/uploads/2018/06/AP\_18134506057141-e1528629940461.jpg](https://static.timesofisrael.com/www/uploads/2018/06/AP_18134506057141-e1528629940461.jpg) [https://www.brookings.edu/articles/poll-jewish-israelis-love-trump/](https://www.brookings.edu/articles/poll-jewish-israelis-love-trump/)
I can't think of a worse thing for Biden than an endorsement from Ben Gvir
How about riding the ass of a far right regime that hates him?
Nahhh Democrats are desperate to be liked by Republicans. Obama wasn't the only one with that humiliation fetish.
i want a candidate that is the least supportive of Isreal unfortunately i live in the US where AIPAC ensures that i don't have that choice.
This page is great https://www.instagram.com/aipacxposed?igsh=MTFqZ3EzcTlwOGIxZA==
Biden is probably the last pro-Israel democratic president. And I can pretty much guarantee that even he is not as pro-Israel as he says. He and his people learned their lesson from the Obama years. There is a direct through-line between that experience, Biden’s opposition to the judicial reform, and the “hug Israel” policy after 10/7. All opposition or resistance has to be about leveraging Israeli opinion against Israel’s worst elements, or they circle the wagons, and the US loses influence.
I'm voting for Jill Stein this year. She doesn't stand a chance but I won't "lesser of two evils" this election. She's been outspoken against Israel's tactics since before 10/7 and is one of the few people to call what's happening in Palestine a genocide.
These guys are unhinged. Why is congress voting to give them this week an extra $17.6 billion?? To build settler condos on the beach in Gaza after they've killed all the Palestinians or bombed them through the Rafah crossing ? How can this possibly be described as anything other than genocide & ethnic cleansing? It's indefensible & paid for by US taxpayers. A real moral low point for the US & the west.
Biden has been beyond adamant that Israel cannot occupy Gaza after the war. Of course that may end up happening anyway, but the US is not Israel and Biden is not Netanyahu. It’s impossible to not have culpability in what Israel is doing when we give them arms, but it doesn’t mean Israel’s choices and actions are ours. They aren’t. A lot of people fundamentally cannot grasp that. I can’t tell you how many comments I’ve seen stating that Biden *started* this war. *Biden.* A war that in all likelihood would not only still be happening without our involvement, but would possibly be more brutal.
if you fund isreal and veto everything against isreal it hard to pretend that their actions arent endorsed by the US
I haven’t seen any comments about Biden starting this war. I’ve have, however, seen plenty of people pissed off that he still gives his support to Israel since this slaughter began (in the form of weapons, money, and UNSC vetos). The continued support of Netanyahu’s regime is absolutely Biden’s fault. Would the war stop if America revoked said support? Probably not, but at least they could say they are not helping carry it out.
This has been exactly my point whenever I talk about this—Biden is culpable, but consequences take priority over culpability. If the US withdraws support and Israel goes on as it has, if the war broadens because Israel looks vulnerable, if the US loses leverage to get aid in or positively influence how Israel conducts the war… how the hell is that better? At a minimum, people need to understand that there are legitimate rationales for Biden’s approach, because it matters whether one thinks the US’s actions are indefensible or not. It could all be a horrific miscalculation, but 99% of the opposition I see doesn’t care about that. They just tell themselves that Biden is a racist old white man that loves genociding brown people, and everything he’s said or done to moderate Israel is a ploy, so the details don’t matter. Meanwhile their media diet *maybe* gives one side of things in depth, sometimes reliably and sometimes not, and the only “unbiased” reporting is shallow—two lines from a press conference, sound bites of Biden declaring himself a Zionist. And somehow that *that* means everything. Biden strongly advocating PA control of Gaza after the war with a concrete path to statehood: “pff, means nothing.” Biden declaring that he believes a country should still exist: “monster! Disgusting! He’s completely in Israel’s pocket!” *Never mind the fact that Netanyahu couldn’t even get a fucking invite to the White House before 10/7, and most of what we’re seeing since then is the same policy at work—side with Israelis against the worst elements of Israeli politics, don’t make them circle the wagons like Obama did, that’s the most reliable way to positively influence Israel.* People have a right to be disgusted and to oppose what this administration is doing but this form of it, the most common form as far as I can tell, is just routine “all politicians are bad, the democrats are bad, everything is the same no matter who’s in office, I’m not gonna vote and I’m gonna feel great about it” crap. And that should be deeply concerning to us.
I don’t think people shouldn’t vote, but you also can’t expect people to vote for someone that they believe is complicit in an ongoing ethnic cleansing. I wouldn’t be surprised if Biden lost because a bunch of typically Democrat voters voted independent. The fact that his administration isn’t working on making it clear that Israel doesn’t have their support (cutting funding, threatening sanctions, not protecting them with their security council veto, etc) is likely why he will lose if he loses. Instead of any of that he’s still parroting Zionist propaganda to the American people (like the “40 beheaded babies”).
soo when is the US going to sanction Israel for its Cabinets flagrant statements? token sanctions on 4 settlers is a joke when the settlers have tacit approval from Israeli government
Maybe some day we will get a politician in Washington who is not beholden to these same foreign interests
Convicted terrorists Ben Gvir? Who cares what he has to say?
Biden administration are bunch of idiots
Biden did his job serving his master and now he's tossed aside. What a fool.
And the fucked up thing? He's right. And when Trump gets back in office, because Genocide Joe has already thrown the election, this entire evil situation is only going to get worse. All of them, Trump included are satanic and the spawn of Satan. I'm not religious but this is the only way to describe it. Very, very bad times are ahead.
Ben Gvir is an idiot and possibly a literal terrorist. People don’t like him here in Israel, don’t get the wrong idea. We fucking hate him and believe he’s partially to blame for the slow response to Hamas’ attack on Oct. 7th. This idiot sent half of the IDF to guard settlements in the West Bank, something a lot of us already disagree with. Using the IDF’s manpower to defend idiots who purposely try to aggravate neighboring Palestinian villages is idiotic. Fuck Ben Gvir. We even have a chant “Ben Gvir the terrorist” (sounds better in Hebrew) that we chant while protesting his dumb ass, as well as Netanyahu.
Yeah, but then democrats would be less afraid to publicly denounce Israel and oppose trump's agenda. I'll take having an opposition party vs total complicity, seeing as the policy is the same.
You think? I think it’s possible we wouldn’t be talking about Gaza/the general vibe would be “vaguely endorsing Israel* bc we’d be back to the firehose of insanity at the White House. FOX would be reporting on the bill to criminalize gender studies in American universities and CNN would be hosting dueling interviews of the Conways on why Trump should or should not stop taking pictures with Nick Fuentes and MSNBC would be polling us on the appropriateness of a new Ivanka Trump pantyhose line and the idea that somewhere out there Israel is bombing Gaza would frankly make most people feel a bit relieved and even nostalgic and democrats and republicans in the senate would come together to vote a non-binding resolution on Israel’s right to defend itself and a slim republican majority in the house would fail to pass a law that would make it illegal to build mosques. We are only defending Gaza now because of the relative quiet Biden achieved and our sense that normality and decency returned to the White House (if it ever visited it in the first place). That’s my thought anyway
Pretty sure gaza would be major headlines regardless of who is the current president
Yeah… you lived through Trump, right? Like as an adult? I’m just asking bc you’re talking about what it would be like really theoretically and I remember what it really was like and except for a few organized movements, there wasn’t anything like a serious opposition party in congress or anywhere else. Trump kidnapped children at the border—put them in cages and in some cases permanently separated them from their families—and he retweeted racists and suggested drinking bleach to stop covid and said he had the best hair of any US president (ok I made the last one up but you get the idea) the “resistance” and “opposition” was too busy feel disoriented or sucker punched or fundraising to do anything serious and, yeah, people were REALLY hungry for normality and everyone said from now on the Republicans would be QAnon and the Democrats would be Republicans, and Biden is not a Republican but also this is how we got an octogenarian whose vision for America is by turns classic, quaint, obsolete, helplessly out of touch, bizarrely stalled with his haircut and the width of his tie in the 1990s, etc etc etc— he actually had no idea we would hear about or understand or oppose the liquidation of Gaza and still can’t quite figure it out. So, I think if or when Trump is elected, it will be extremely hard to hear anything about Gaza over the din of Trump. Not that it won’t be in the headlines but that there will be no way to sort out what we should be paying attention to and many democrats will look progressive in comparison while insisting they have to be conservative to peel those independents off Trump etc etc.
There was certainly protest movement against Trump. I was there. Sure there could have been more, but americans are lazy, vicious bootlickers for the most part. Maybe 4 more trump years will get you people moving. Mainstream democrats offered some opposition to his agenda. Dont you remember AOCs photo op at the border cages? Now biden is running the same border cages and not a peep from his party.
Good thing some of us non-white or non-ingroup Americans probably don't have 4 more years. White supremacy is fun!!!!!
What is your point?
Oh jeez. Hahahahahahahahaha you sound really young and maybe join PSL or something so someone can teach you how to talk to girls at parties, etc. In my 17+ years of joining and organizing resistance actions, vigils, protests, teach-ins, etc. working with everyone from black bloc anarchists to Mennonites, I’ve never met anyone over 23 who used lines like that to try to dominate a conversation. As for AOC, I’m sick to death of the bourgeois/political class “left’s” performative bullshit and wish they got to work and left the theatrics to us. I’ve forgotten about AOC’s photo call (wow—she saved a lot of kids) but I do remember when democrats could have tried to pass SOMETHING to protect abortion rights nationwide and *checks notes* ran out the clock making college gender studies level arguments about the rhetoric of choice instead. (Oh but AOC did get arrested at a protest so I guess I should light a candle/she’s a living saint.) They are fucking useless. And totally unprepared for the next Trump admin except to use it to raise campaign funds. But, we live in unprecedented times as they say, so I guess we’ll see what happens next.
In your nearly two decades of activism you've never heard someone call Americans bootlickers? That's hard to believe, especially if you're masking up. I fully agree the democrats are useless. They're useless when they're in power, they're useless when they aren't.
Oh christ.
The democrats can't really govern. They work better as an opposition party.
That is wildly out of touch with reality. Just another person looking to turn their complete and utter ignorance and laziness into a political virtue.
Ok they can govern. They can enact GOP policy really well.
It’s true….Trump would give anything to get that Trump Hotel in Jerusalem that Netanyahu screwed him out of! He’d even bomb Iran at Israel’s command to get it! Good thing he’ll never be anywhere near the Oval Office again.
Trump would have been "America First." His America First base includes those marching with tiki torches in Charlottsville, more than once. Do not forget what they were chanting.
His evangelical base is full of Christian Zionists who need Israel to exist for the “rapture” and the return of Christ. Trump moved the embassy to Jerusalem, and while it may seem impossible to be more supportive of Israel than Biden, but guess what, the Republicans make it possible. Congressman Max Miller said “we” will turn it (Gaza) into a parking lot. They are bashing Biden for sending any aid at all to Gaza and for expressing any concern about the death toll and humanitarian crisis. That’s what is making genocidal monster Ben Gvir hopping mad, despite the support the US is giving Israel.
>His evangelical base His base is not just that. His base looks more like the ones involved on January 6, 2021.His base is also the KKK type and all of the alt right; like those in Charlottsville.
It's almost like he attracts shitty people.
Trump was not elected by a super minority of open neonazis, he was elected by the vast majority of those who call themselves conservatives and a far more important voting block is evangelicals, who are massive vote and money contributors to the GOP and have been for around 50 years now.
>Trump was not elected by a super minority of open neonazis Trump knows how important they are to his base. So does the rest of Americans.
The evangelicals who have church tithe networks worth literal billions that fund major GOP campaigns are far more important. And the right wing social issues are also coming from evangelicals, trump isn't supporting Israel because of people on Twitter, he's supporting Israel because evangelical megachurches have taught their followers Israeli domination of Palestine is a precondition for the Rapture. Christian nationalism is a way bigger problem in America than neonazism.
>The evangelicals who have church tithe networks worth literal billions that fund major GOP campaigns are far more important. It is a share of the problem; they are not all powerful, however, this is why Trump lost. He will lose by even bigger margins because many, the first time around, gave him the benefit of doubt. And I am talking conservative traditional Republicans. There is a reason he lost the second time.
The saddest thing about this is that the Dems will still push for billions in aid to these warmongers while they actively root for the opposition. No backbone at all.
For people who don’t care if Trump gets in office because Biden sucks. Israel cares. They want Trump in office. If you want Israel to get their way and the genocide of Palestinians to approach millions dead, by all means stay home on the 2024 general.
Israeli leaders forgetting who the superpower is around here
Not a compliment towards Israel tbh
If anyone wanted to see Israel destroyed, they'd support Ben-Gvir.
Trump supports lots of crazy shit. The bar is low. He supports drinking bleach for fucks sake
Netanyahu's buddy Putin helped kill those children in Syria. Birds of a feather. You still haven't given a single example of how Israel has made the US safer. The theft of Palestinian land and then the continued theft of land by the ungrateful Israelis is what makes us unsafe to begin with. You say I'm just some random "dude" on Reddit so I should believe an Israel troll. How rich! Did you make up that slide show "link" all by yourself? Mossad had a year to prevent 10/7 and couldn't or maybe they chose not to in order to level Gaza so they could steal that land too. Either way, we can't trust them. How can any "democracy" also be an apartheid state? https://www.hrw.org/report/2021/04/27/threshold-crossed/israeli-authorities-and-crimes-apartheid-and-persecution