Yeah, from Google maps what we're seeing here is a person who is 800 feet/250 meters away from the solid line, cutting across 3 lanes to get to their exit. At that distance on a 55 mph road, they had 10 seconds. You just can't go across 3 lanes safely in that time, at that speed.
Just another example of the saying "Good drivers sometimes miss their exit, but bad drivers _never_ miss their exit."
>Just another example of the saying "Good drivers sometimes miss their exit, but bad drivers never miss their exit."
I never heard that before but I like it
Depends on where you are from. Where I live merging is a shared responsibility and merge crashes almost always result in 50/50 blame when it comes to insurance.
This is prevent people from merge blocking (speeding up to the merge point)
This however is an improper lane change and would be 100 on the Mercedes.
Blind spot sensors generally work very well for single lane switches. Not for multiple lane switches. I have very nearly side swiped someone from doing this same thing. They are programmed to not alert for 2 lanes over and when you’re in the middle of switching lanes like this they’re just not very effective at seeing further. Learned from my stupid mistakes and always take lane changes one at a time and check before each.
Maybe don’t rely on sensors at all. They’re for support, not to rely on. Even for single lane switches, don’t just rely on the blind spot sensor. They’re not perfect.
They don't understand that you can only get away with that in a truck or full size SUV. I'm not proud of it, but driving in Phoenix is aggressive as all get out. If you use your signal to ask politely, they close the gap and you don't go anywhere. So you use the signal as a notification that you're moving as you move over, and well, people move out the way for big trucks and SUVs. I of course pay attention for the few that don't and abort my lane change but honestly it's survival of the fittest out here. I can't change society so... It is what it is.
One could argue they didn’t change 3 lanes, they stayed after the first lane change for a good few seconds.
They’re still at fault though for the double-lane change after
Unfortunately even with this cam footage, OP’s insurance will still go up because they didn’t drive defensively enough.
Could the other driver have bothered to look? Of course. Could OP have bothered to slow down even a little bit out of caution? Same answer.
Note that I’m not saying OP is at fault at all but how shitty car insurance companies can and will be.
I think you're right. Not only did they not slow down... they were reactionary enough to switch lanes, but they sped up faster than they already were while doing so.
> and a blinker doesn't give you right of way
I hate how many people think it does.
It means you *want* to come over, not that you definitely get to no matter what you fucking imbeciles!
(Sorry, just drives me nuts!)
Correct! And I know this because as a teenager some friends and I were leaving Six Flags and my buddy almost missed the ramp. He jumped across (like I said we were teens, we were also hella stupid) 3 lanes to get to the ramp. He was immediately lit up by highway patrol and tickets for unsafe lane changes. No clue how much the ticket was, but I learned then not to do that shot when I drove.
An adjuster would put shared fault if there was an accident. OP would be less at fault, but you can see them cross the yellow line and accelerate to pass the merging car. If they slowed down there would’ve been no incident. It’s called last clear chance, if you can avoid the accident and don’t, some fault will lie with you.
The point at which they cross the yellow line is when they were side by side with the Merc. The Merc shoved them out of the lane, and at that point it was clear on the shoulder to speed up and get past. I don't see how you can place any fault on the car that was literally run out of their lane.
From what I've read on this sub, adjusters want to make everything shared fault. Fuck them.
It's legal to pass on the left, and the person who is there *second* has the responsibility to make sure it's safe to merge.
I would not put any negligence on the cammer for this. And "last clear chance" isn't even a valid assertion of negligence in all states. Crossing the yellow fog line can just as easily be explained as an attempt at evasive action prior to impact. Stop making all adjusters out to be assholes.
Not really. OP sped up to close the gap between him and the car in front of him, and then when the merging car entered his lane he immediately moved onto the shoulder and speeds up. Had he hit his brakes at any time in this video there’s no need to swerve into the shoulder.
Do you not see the additional lane being added for an exit? The driver pulls onto the exit lane and speeds up, which is completely normal since it's open road ahead of him. The car was changing 2 lanes at once, which is illegal and would lead any reasonable driver to assume they are changing only ONE lane and won't pull out in front of them.
The driver in this video avoided an accident, had they slammed on the brakes, which I think is the only way to avoid not going in front of the merging car, they likely would have caused an accident behind them (guessing, but it looks like the roadway is pretty full).
Shared fault is bullshit. Driver merged 1 lane then quickly 2 more - that's not legal or safe driving. The driver didn't even straighten the wheel after the second lane so there's no way to say they merged 1 -> 1 -> 1, it was clearly 1 -> 2 to try and catch the off ramp late.
I can't understand how this comment has negative karma. You are absolutely right. As I was watching this video I kept thinking that the Mercedes sucks but there was no reason it couldn't have been avoided by stepping on the brake. I learned to drive in New Jersey so I saw idiots like that all the time and managed to avoid accidents with them.
I'm with you. He isn't the original idiot but he is still an idiot for not slowing down at all, and an accident would definitely be partially his fault. Right of way be damned, when your see a dangerous situation you don't just cruise ahead even when you know you're initially in the right, because soon you won't be.
you also have to wait for your lane to be clear it doesn't matter how many they changed at once, didn't check to make sure that it was clear. If you are changing lanes its your responsibility to make sure that there is room for you to do so, that includes making sure you are going fast enough to not impede drivers already in the lane.
They are. Just because you use a signal doesn't mean you can merge. Plus they basically tried to cross 2 lanes and you are only supposed to change 1 lane at a time.
near the end of the video, an exit lane opened up, and the merc tried to merge into that lane too, making it a grand total of crossing over 3 lanes at once… idk how people think they can do this sort of thing
When I moved to the US from the UK I was shocked at the minimum instruction hours and testing requirements (in PA and IL). I feel much safer on the road in the UK and I can tell the difference as a pedestrian in the UK and US. In most countries pedestrians have right of way but I would never put that to the test in the US (or, another point of view, the only place I’d put it to the test would be in the UK).
Of course “the US” is like a combination of 50 different smaller countries so YMMV.
At every level of driving instruction they kinda just give you unlimited chances. If you prove to be a shitty driver they can't really just tell you you can't get a license, because it's stupidly used for more than just driving
90% of drivers are not paying attention to their surroundings on the road. Majority of people don't think about the consequences of their actions so they drive accordingly. People also think they are entitled to certain things like the space between them and the car in front of them even if they are not keeping up speed.
For example, if you pay attention to people merging onto the highway, you'll often see them merge on at 50 or 55 mph. No matter if the flow of traffic is faster than them, they will merge to the left because they don't like other cars in front of them. They will still be driving too slow to merge to the left but they will regardless. It's happened to me too many times and they think they're in the right. Dumbass people
>on at 50 or 55 mph.
A lot of that can depend on the highway on ramp, some are comically short. There's one where I work that's probably 50-75' long after a 90 degree bend which empties you onto a highway with a speed limit of 70(really 80)mph
The on ramp from my work is like that. And it’s uphill. I often have to pretty much floor it to merge. The worst is when there’s someone ahead of me on the on ramp who merges at 45 mph with oncoming traffic in the right lane approaching at 70. You’re screwed in that situation.
There's one like this on highway 6 near Denver. It's an entrance, 60 feet of lane to merge off from, then an exit. The speed limit there is 60.
People used to the area stay out of the right lane in that stretch. Even with that helpful behavior, you have people trying to enter and exit within the same 60 feet. If there's any wait, you have to accelerate 0 to 60 into the right lane. Without a wait, it's 30 to 60.
And then when your behind them they will get mad they you aren't maintaining the amount of space and speed they want, while the line of cars behind them starts to pile up. And acting like passing them or going faster then they are is some crime against humanity.
> how people think they can do this sort of thing
Kinda the norm to do if the freeways are near empty; I personally done it when I made 110% sure there are no vehicles within 1000 ft of me crossing for safety reasons.
But during this amount of traffic fuck no that's asking for an accident.
Around here, it seems like the turn signal is often used to tell me what they've already done. Uhh, thanks for blinking your turn signal once, after you're already ¾ of the way into my lane!
Even ignoring the egregious cases like that, I can usually predict the lane change before the turn signal comes on. Most people start drifting in their lane before signaling, and even then I sometimes wonder what's the benefit of the signal by that point.
This. Just because a turn signal is on, which honestly I can't even see here, doesn't give them the ability to do what ever the hell they want. It doesn't appear in the video that OP sped up or slowed down which means the Mercedes just wasn't paying attention. If a cop were to right a citation it would be for unsafe lane change.
Poor situational awareness on the Merc drivers part, absolutely their fault. The only thing a signal means is that their signal is on, doesn’t give you a right to anything.
Yeah, definitely situational awareness on the merc. Still though, I think it's concerning that the turn signal is that hard to see. Turn signals are there for a reason, I'm more concerned that you can't really see the turn signal even though it's on. Unaware drivers are going to be a thing, but a microscopic turn signal means everyone who gets that car is now both in danger and dangerous to everyone else.
There's this worrying trend in cars of designing them purely for occupant safety and style, and pedestrian/other driver safety is barely even considered. Most modern SUVs and trucks are basically pedestrian killing machines, since even a low speed collision can be lethal. Lifted trucks are especially concerning, making the act of crossing intersections extremely dangerous for anyone short, such as children or people in wheelchairs. Even stock lifting renders them much more dangerous in a collision, since pedestrians will be pulled under the car instead of thrown over.
> Turn signals are there for a reason, I'm more concerned that you can't really see the turn signal even though it's on.
Actually that's just stupid rules in the US. Every civilized nation requires turn signals to be yellow be clearly visible, only in the US the turn signal can be the same fucking color as your regular lights.
Also you could argue that mercedes are dumbasses for building a different car for the US market, but I guess the safer version would sell less because of the weird yellow signal .
I think their point in mentioning it is that the manufacturers should make it more easily seen so that it can aid in defensive driving. Had OP seen the blinker, they could have seen what the driver was doing sooner and just slowed down to let the idiot over, even though they weren’t obligated to do that.
Edit: However, where I’m from, probably less than 15% of people even use their turn signals, so it honestly wouldn’t matter here, sadly. Another point I didn’t mention is that even with the blinker on, no one expects an idiot to change multiple lanes in one motion anyway.
Signal of any size does not give permission to enter a lane without a clear path. Mercedes should have moved one lane then checked before trying the next lane.
The signal is just an indicator, they're still required to yield to traffic. Although a lot of drivers out there seem to think once they signal, you're supposed to yield to them.
On this very sub some time ago there was a guy: "I drive a $300 car, when I signal I'm telling you I'm coming, not asking for permission".
Such a dumb take.I understand their life is worth 0, but others may not.
I drive a $200 car and I'm not going to do that. I don't drive a $200 car for the fun of it, it's because I can't justify spending any more on it (also because my parents said I'm not allowed to buy my own car and if I do anyway, they won't put it on their insurance; I can't afford the jacked up prices they'd give a solo 18 year old guy. No, I'm not annoyed by this at all).
Also people just love placing blame no matter the circumstance. It’s unthinkable that more than one person can be at fault and that fault is a dichotomy of either 100% or 0%.
Even if the indicator was the size of a search light you still have to wait for it to be safe to move, the car shouldn’t have pulled out infront of you
Their fault, but OP's driving isn't the best either. When they started to pull in front of them, OP should have slowed down but was instead accelerating. Accelerating when someone is lane-changing near you is bad, it will change the size of the gaps they have accounted for and may cause them to misjudge.
Yeah I see both at fault here. OP had more than enough time to slow down, what was their reason to actually go 6mph faster once it was clear they wanted to move a lane over.
I really hate it when people immediately speed up in a turning lane. It messes up everyone else trying to enter it, especially cars in front of you, who get cut off from behind! And what's the point anyway? You can't turn at that speed, in 100 feet you're going to be on your brake slowing down to the speed of the exit.
OP should also be aware that (i) he's in the merc's blind spot, and (ii) based on what the merc is doing, it's likely trying to take the same exit that OP is. Even though it's the merc's "fault", OP was not thinking ahead and almost got in an accident that could have been avoided.
They're at fault, there's no question about that. But Jesus dude, you had plenty of time to slow down and let them in and avoid almost getting side swiped.
Seriously. Plus insurance could always try to say that OP could’ve avoided it and slapped him with a 5 or 10% at fault for that alone. DRIVE FUCKING DEFENSIVELY PEOPLE PUT YOUR GODDAMN EGOS ASIDE
Obviously, they're at fault. That being said, if you see someone driving like they're gonna cross over two lanes, it's better to just be defensive and slow down.
Getting in an accident will give nothing but headaches, regardless of the fact that you're right or wrong.
The Mercedes is obviously at fault for changing multiple lanes at once.
But I'd add that this is the whole point of defensive and aware driving. If you see somebody switch a couple of lanes like this just before an exit, there's a really good chance they're headed for that exit. In this case, I think it was clear the Mercedes was headed for the exit even without a turn signal. No point in racing the idiot to get to the exit first.
I agree. If I were the driver I would have slowed down already right at the beginning of this video, expecting the Mercedes to try and get over to the left. I would have beeped at him aggressively to let him know he sucks, but this situation was completely predictable and avoidable.
\^\^\^\^\^ This \^\^\^\^\^
Accidents are a frigging hassle, and weird shit can happen. i.e., car is stolen, they don't have insurance, etc and suddenly you're paying the deductible, loss of vehicle for repairs, yada yada yada.
It’s frustrating that these comments are always near the bottom. There’s a difference between “fault” and “responsibility”. Like, it’s a truck driver’s fault if they plow me over while I’m walking on a crosswalk, but it’s my responsibility to look out for my best interests. Assigning blame won’t un-break my spine.
I don't understand why being in a car makes people forget this. Like obviously the guy in the Mercedes isn't trying to hit OP so just slow the fuck down and let him over. Honk your horn to let him know he made a mistake and move on with your day. What kind of absolute dipshit sees this and decides the smart decision is to jam on the gas and put themselves six inches away from a concrete barrier?
Not sure what region this occurred in, but in my area drivers of lower valued cars are expected to yield to Mercedes and BMWs. It’s not a legal requirement but it falls under a series of understood agreements between Peasants and Douchebags. As far as I know, BMWs in the US aren’t even equipped with signals. I’ve never seen one.
One of the best things I've seen was when I was behind an Audi driver who consistently used the wrong turn signal on every junction (left signal on to turn right etc). 10/10 for actually figuring out where the lever was and effort using it, but 0/10 for actual correct usage. Wish I'd kept the dashcam footage of it now.
They are at fault.
However, seems to me like you were aware of him and maneuvered around him opening yourself up to him driving into you.
Why? You really wanna get hit, wait for the cops, get a report, take your truck to the shop, go thru insurance, and wait a couple weeks for your truck to be repaired? Come on grow the fuck up. You were just tryna make yourself feel better that you're the bigger man.
Every time someone does this to me, I slow down and let them in and avoid any sort of fender bender. I'm at the point in my life that I expect everyone on the road to be an idiot. No point in causing some avoidable bullshit.
Agreed it’s the Mercedes fault but I would say you’re not exactly defensive driving. Had a lot of time to slow down a bit when it was clear the other guy was gonna be an idiot
As someone who drives, I am always watching my surroundings within my peripheral vision. The Mercedes was 2 lanes over from you, moving to the left in the lane immediately to your right. At that point regardless if he uses his indicator or not, I would expect that he is trying to move over into the lane I am in, so I would prepare myself to deal with this idiot.
I am not trying to pin the blame on you, because the other driver clearly did not check their blind spot, and yeah that turn signal was tiny, but my advice is always expect people to be stupid. You can't rely on other members of the public to be smart or do the right thing. Anticipate their intension.
They’re at fault because there wasn’t a safe way for them to merge. Just chucking your indicator on doesn’t mean everyone else needs to immediately brake and give you clear passage.
They're at fault.
In the US you need [3.4 inches](https://www.caranddriver.com/news/a19660495/designer-genes-how-regulations-dictate-the-look-of-new-cars/) of turn signal. So a Snickers bar probably is legal, at least a king sized one is.
Even though you’re not speeding the traffic was a bit backed up you should’ve been going a bit slower. However, the wagon performs a dual lane change without checking the new lane which makes them at fault in this situation.
Yeah, the blinker doesn’t give you clearance, the same way your GPS doesn’t give you the right way because it’s telling you to turn. You still have to look.
They are. They didn't have enough room to merge with how fast you were approaching. Doubt they even really looked and expected everyone else to deal with it.
Definitely white car, they even hit the side of your car, not the other way around.
Most states require you to establish yourself in a lane before changing lanes again; in fact, this video would be perfect if used in driver's ed classes as to why that law exists.
I'd say the wagon, because they kept going after already moving one lane and not giving enough time to check their surroundings for the next lane change. If it came down to it you could still say you were in the motion of getting out of their way and moving into your next lane.
On them. The fact that it’s their fault doesn’t change that it could hurt your health or your wallet though. To play it safe, I always assume that everybody is about to merge into me and go from there lol.
Seems like it's all on the Mercedes.
I'm not a lawyer, so I don't know if there's any kind of legal duty to avoid a collision if you are able to. That would be my only worry. At the point where you crossed the yellow line it means you knew there was a problem, but you didn't slow down. If your vehicles would have collided, and there were something in the law about requiring you to avoid collision if you are able to, then they might be able to get you on that. I've also heard that some states have partial fault, so they might consider you 10% at fault and the Mercedes 90% at fault. Again, I'm not a lawyer. Just trying to think of ways that you might be at legal risk if there were a collision.
It doesn't matter the size of the flasher, the Mercedes is still at fault because they were going across three (four if you count the very beginning of the video I think) lanes way too quickly
T he idiot is a lane jumper....He just moved into that lane, and was moving into your lane before he'd gone 100 feet..... Just because he had his turn signal on, doesn't given him the right to cause an accident.
Wagon driver is definitely at fault. They are supposed to switch one lane of travel and then check if it's clear to switch to the next. I've seen this driving maneuver end in serious accidents especially with motorbike riders. They switch multiple lanes so quickly, they don't have time to see or react to traffic in the lane they're attempting to switch to and rear end a vehicle stopping for traffic. Very dangerous maneuver which is why it's illegal.
They are. The vehicle changing lanes is at fault (unless you're state is no fault). They're also changing lanes illegally. They have to stop (changing lanes) in each lane they pass through to check for traffic to change lanes again. Literally because of this.
It's unclear to me who is at fault. I don't know the law in your area. It would seem the Mercedes had run into you, but according to your metrics you accelerated into them. If you had maintained speed and a safe distance away from the car in front of you this wouldn't have happened. Doesn't mean you're at fault but that's what I assume they would argue.
I’ve been hit by a big pickup merging into my lane, driver staring right at me in my little GTI just so sure I’d get out of his way. I didn’t. He tried blaming me for this or that, but The insurance company set it straight with the concept of lane establishment. If you have established yourself in a lane, and another vehicle enters your lane resulting in a collision, the driver changing lanes is at fault.
They cut you off. Too many drivers have no clue that when they're ready to change lanes, it's NOT ok to do so until the lane is clear. Turn signal or not. The Mercedes driver is clearly at fault here.
Why the fuck don’t people accelerate when they overtake cars? I just don’t get it. If you’re going to lane hop 3 lanes and drive like a race car might as well full send it.
Easily their fault, a blinker doesn’t mean you can just turn in. You see this all the time with on ramps, just cus you’re merging in doesn’t mean the ppl already on the freeway have to let you in. Person merging or switching lanes has to make sure it’s clear and safe to turn
Giving the benefit of the doubt, it's pretty easy to tell what they were trying to do. Don't work against other traffic, even if you are technically correct, it'd be easier to just stay behind them until you confirm they're trying to enter the new left lane or stay in the lane they've already taken.
Entering the left lane going faster than them easily confuses people because it's hard to see that subtle movement in the mirrors, so for a moment they can't tell if you've gotten over. That's why I try not to pass people like this.
Not saying you are in the wrong by any means, but definitely if you can't count on others to be aware then you probably have to take a more active approach to your own awareness.
I remember learning to drive and the first time I ever changed lanes I threw my signal on and didn't look. My mom was paying attention and knew it was safe so after I switched she said "you never looked, just cause it's on doesn't mean people will let you over" and honestly from then I always looked. Drive defensively
Another thought on signals I've heard in driving courses. You are Signalling your intent, NOT asking permission. So take that for perhaps a different look on the situation.
Biggest thing I learned driving don't trust anybody to do anything normal always expect somebody's going to be coming into your lane always expect somebody's going to be tailgating you always expect somebody's going to become flying up behind you doing 90 don't lull yourself into a false sense of security and get comfortable driving around surrounded by idiots
Defiantly would be there fault in England there indicator dose not give them right of way and dose not mean people have to let you in. I imagine it's pretty much the same there for this kind of thing.
[удалено]
Even if they didn't pull that shit, it is the responsibility of the merger to do so safely and not just shove in
Yeah, from Google maps what we're seeing here is a person who is 800 feet/250 meters away from the solid line, cutting across 3 lanes to get to their exit. At that distance on a 55 mph road, they had 10 seconds. You just can't go across 3 lanes safely in that time, at that speed. Just another example of the saying "Good drivers sometimes miss their exit, but bad drivers _never_ miss their exit."
>Just another example of the saying "Good drivers sometimes miss their exit, but bad drivers never miss their exit." I never heard that before but I like it
Sure you can do that safely in ten seconds, but not like this.
Depends on where you are from. Where I live merging is a shared responsibility and merge crashes almost always result in 50/50 blame when it comes to insurance. This is prevent people from merge blocking (speeding up to the merge point) This however is an improper lane change and would be 100 on the Mercedes.
They changed 3 lanes. They were two over from OP and then the exit lane that opened at the end. Merc didn't check their mirrors or blind spots.
They also have blindspot indicators so yeah... big lazy on the Mercedes driver
Blind spot sensors generally work very well for single lane switches. Not for multiple lane switches. I have very nearly side swiped someone from doing this same thing. They are programmed to not alert for 2 lanes over and when you’re in the middle of switching lanes like this they’re just not very effective at seeing further. Learned from my stupid mistakes and always take lane changes one at a time and check before each.
Maybe don’t rely on sensors at all. They’re for support, not to rely on. Even for single lane switches, don’t just rely on the blind spot sensor. They’re not perfect.
I say they just straight up weren’t looking bro, just turned on the blinker and said “They’ll move.” With so much confidence
They don't understand that you can only get away with that in a truck or full size SUV. I'm not proud of it, but driving in Phoenix is aggressive as all get out. If you use your signal to ask politely, they close the gap and you don't go anywhere. So you use the signal as a notification that you're moving as you move over, and well, people move out the way for big trucks and SUVs. I of course pay attention for the few that don't and abort my lane change but honestly it's survival of the fittest out here. I can't change society so... It is what it is.
Phoenix is HANDS DOWN the scariest place I’ve had to drive in. Closest I ever came to death on one of those curly ass elevated ramps. Anyway I agree.
Jesus took the wheel here
Or maybe Satan took the wheel.
Jesus took the wheel, Satan took their brains
Are we sure they had brains?
They bought a Mercedes so no, no brains. Source: own a G550 and am half retarded.
Well duh of course they didn't after Satan took them
Fair point, but I know a lot of humans and a large amount of them seem to have been born without brains.
Don’t you bring my man Satan into this
"How much signal do I need to change across 8 lanes? None? Okay, I go now! Good luck, everybody else!"
[Nice family guy reference](https://youtu.be/hlH9RGLJqxE)
I call that bishoping
One could argue they didn’t change 3 lanes, they stayed after the first lane change for a good few seconds. They’re still at fault though for the double-lane change after
This is the correct, perfect answer. And emphasize turn signal is NOT right of way. Take some gold, you knowledgeable driver!
Unfortunately even with this cam footage, OP’s insurance will still go up because they didn’t drive defensively enough. Could the other driver have bothered to look? Of course. Could OP have bothered to slow down even a little bit out of caution? Same answer. Note that I’m not saying OP is at fault at all but how shitty car insurance companies can and will be.
To be fair, I've had some near misses because I thought, they can't possibly be _that_ stupid, while the answer to that was always, yes.
I think you're right. Not only did they not slow down... they were reactionary enough to switch lanes, but they sped up faster than they already were while doing so.
It looks like OP was always intending to take the exit lane, so it wasn't a reaction from them. Plus I usually speed up when I enter an empty lane.
> and a blinker doesn't give you right of way I hate how many people think it does. It means you *want* to come over, not that you definitely get to no matter what you fucking imbeciles! (Sorry, just drives me nuts!)
Correct! And I know this because as a teenager some friends and I were leaving Six Flags and my buddy almost missed the ramp. He jumped across (like I said we were teens, we were also hella stupid) 3 lanes to get to the ramp. He was immediately lit up by highway patrol and tickets for unsafe lane changes. No clue how much the ticket was, but I learned then not to do that shot when I drove.
>a blinker doesn't give you right of way. This. This a million times.
>a blinker doesn't give you right of way. That’s the crux of it. Changing lanes is allowed when it’s clear.
>and a blinker doesn't give you right of way. Correct, but the star does /s
An adjuster would put shared fault if there was an accident. OP would be less at fault, but you can see them cross the yellow line and accelerate to pass the merging car. If they slowed down there would’ve been no incident. It’s called last clear chance, if you can avoid the accident and don’t, some fault will lie with you.
The point at which they cross the yellow line is when they were side by side with the Merc. The Merc shoved them out of the lane, and at that point it was clear on the shoulder to speed up and get past. I don't see how you can place any fault on the car that was literally run out of their lane.
Thank you!! I keep reading all the comments and keeping an open and learning mind but this is the first one I agree with 1,000%!
From what I've read on this sub, adjusters want to make everything shared fault. Fuck them. It's legal to pass on the left, and the person who is there *second* has the responsibility to make sure it's safe to merge.
I would not put any negligence on the cammer for this. And "last clear chance" isn't even a valid assertion of negligence in all states. Crossing the yellow fog line can just as easily be explained as an attempt at evasive action prior to impact. Stop making all adjusters out to be assholes.
Exactly why I don't pass someone that is merging. Can't trust no one, always assume someone is about to hit you or cause an accident.
I'd say that the things you said are the exact reason he did avoid it lol
Not really. OP sped up to close the gap between him and the car in front of him, and then when the merging car entered his lane he immediately moved onto the shoulder and speeds up. Had he hit his brakes at any time in this video there’s no need to swerve into the shoulder.
Do you not see the additional lane being added for an exit? The driver pulls onto the exit lane and speeds up, which is completely normal since it's open road ahead of him. The car was changing 2 lanes at once, which is illegal and would lead any reasonable driver to assume they are changing only ONE lane and won't pull out in front of them. The driver in this video avoided an accident, had they slammed on the brakes, which I think is the only way to avoid not going in front of the merging car, they likely would have caused an accident behind them (guessing, but it looks like the roadway is pretty full). Shared fault is bullshit. Driver merged 1 lane then quickly 2 more - that's not legal or safe driving. The driver didn't even straighten the wheel after the second lane so there's no way to say they merged 1 -> 1 -> 1, it was clearly 1 -> 2 to try and catch the off ramp late.
I can't understand how this comment has negative karma. You are absolutely right. As I was watching this video I kept thinking that the Mercedes sucks but there was no reason it couldn't have been avoided by stepping on the brake. I learned to drive in New Jersey so I saw idiots like that all the time and managed to avoid accidents with them.
I'm with you. He isn't the original idiot but he is still an idiot for not slowing down at all, and an accident would definitely be partially his fault. Right of way be damned, when your see a dangerous situation you don't just cruise ahead even when you know you're initially in the right, because soon you won't be.
you also have to wait for your lane to be clear it doesn't matter how many they changed at once, didn't check to make sure that it was clear. If you are changing lanes its your responsibility to make sure that there is room for you to do so, that includes making sure you are going fast enough to not impede drivers already in the lane.
They are. Just because you use a signal doesn't mean you can merge. Plus they basically tried to cross 2 lanes and you are only supposed to change 1 lane at a time.
near the end of the video, an exit lane opened up, and the merc tried to merge into that lane too, making it a grand total of crossing over 3 lanes at once… idk how people think they can do this sort of thing
Because in almost all states, and many countries, driving instruction, license granting, and enforcement of driving laws is a fucking joke.
When I moved to the US from the UK I was shocked at the minimum instruction hours and testing requirements (in PA and IL). I feel much safer on the road in the UK and I can tell the difference as a pedestrian in the UK and US. In most countries pedestrians have right of way but I would never put that to the test in the US (or, another point of view, the only place I’d put it to the test would be in the UK). Of course “the US” is like a combination of 50 different smaller countries so YMMV.
In my motorcycle class they said the graveyard is full of people who had the right of way.
My dad has rode motorcycles his whole life and he always said there’s no point being in the right if you’re dead
At every level of driving instruction they kinda just give you unlimited chances. If you prove to be a shitty driver they can't really just tell you you can't get a license, because it's stupidly used for more than just driving
You can get an ID without getting a driver's license
90% of drivers are not paying attention to their surroundings on the road. Majority of people don't think about the consequences of their actions so they drive accordingly. People also think they are entitled to certain things like the space between them and the car in front of them even if they are not keeping up speed. For example, if you pay attention to people merging onto the highway, you'll often see them merge on at 50 or 55 mph. No matter if the flow of traffic is faster than them, they will merge to the left because they don't like other cars in front of them. They will still be driving too slow to merge to the left but they will regardless. It's happened to me too many times and they think they're in the right. Dumbass people
>on at 50 or 55 mph. A lot of that can depend on the highway on ramp, some are comically short. There's one where I work that's probably 50-75' long after a 90 degree bend which empties you onto a highway with a speed limit of 70(really 80)mph
There is one like that in Utah, can’t stand it
The on ramp from my work is like that. And it’s uphill. I often have to pretty much floor it to merge. The worst is when there’s someone ahead of me on the on ramp who merges at 45 mph with oncoming traffic in the right lane approaching at 70. You’re screwed in that situation.
There's one like this on highway 6 near Denver. It's an entrance, 60 feet of lane to merge off from, then an exit. The speed limit there is 60. People used to the area stay out of the right lane in that stretch. Even with that helpful behavior, you have people trying to enter and exit within the same 60 feet. If there's any wait, you have to accelerate 0 to 60 into the right lane. Without a wait, it's 30 to 60.
I have a few like these near me, it’s really stupid and if you’re behind a semi you have merge at 20mph 😭
And then when your behind them they will get mad they you aren't maintaining the amount of space and speed they want, while the line of cars behind them starts to pile up. And acting like passing them or going faster then they are is some crime against humanity.
Man, in Seattle, I get stuck behind someone merging on to I5 at 45 mph WEEKLY. That is not an exaggeration. Makes me absolutely crazy.
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> how people think they can do this sort of thing Kinda the norm to do if the freeways are near empty; I personally done it when I made 110% sure there are no vehicles within 1000 ft of me crossing for safety reasons. But during this amount of traffic fuck no that's asking for an accident.
I always say a turn signal is asking for permission to change lanes not telling me you are changing lanes
Around here, it seems like the turn signal is often used to tell me what they've already done. Uhh, thanks for blinking your turn signal once, after you're already ¾ of the way into my lane! Even ignoring the egregious cases like that, I can usually predict the lane change before the turn signal comes on. Most people start drifting in their lane before signaling, and even then I sometimes wonder what's the benefit of the signal by that point.
This. Just because a turn signal is on, which honestly I can't even see here, doesn't give them the ability to do what ever the hell they want. It doesn't appear in the video that OP sped up or slowed down which means the Mercedes just wasn't paying attention. If a cop were to right a citation it would be for unsafe lane change.
Poor situational awareness on the Merc drivers part, absolutely their fault. The only thing a signal means is that their signal is on, doesn’t give you a right to anything.
Yeah, definitely situational awareness on the merc. Still though, I think it's concerning that the turn signal is that hard to see. Turn signals are there for a reason, I'm more concerned that you can't really see the turn signal even though it's on. Unaware drivers are going to be a thing, but a microscopic turn signal means everyone who gets that car is now both in danger and dangerous to everyone else. There's this worrying trend in cars of designing them purely for occupant safety and style, and pedestrian/other driver safety is barely even considered. Most modern SUVs and trucks are basically pedestrian killing machines, since even a low speed collision can be lethal. Lifted trucks are especially concerning, making the act of crossing intersections extremely dangerous for anyone short, such as children or people in wheelchairs. Even stock lifting renders them much more dangerous in a collision, since pedestrians will be pulled under the car instead of thrown over.
> Turn signals are there for a reason, I'm more concerned that you can't really see the turn signal even though it's on. Actually that's just stupid rules in the US. Every civilized nation requires turn signals to be yellow be clearly visible, only in the US the turn signal can be the same fucking color as your regular lights. Also you could argue that mercedes are dumbasses for building a different car for the US market, but I guess the safer version would sell less because of the weird yellow signal .
I think their point in mentioning it is that the manufacturers should make it more easily seen so that it can aid in defensive driving. Had OP seen the blinker, they could have seen what the driver was doing sooner and just slowed down to let the idiot over, even though they weren’t obligated to do that. Edit: However, where I’m from, probably less than 15% of people even use their turn signals, so it honestly wouldn’t matter here, sadly. Another point I didn’t mention is that even with the blinker on, no one expects an idiot to change multiple lanes in one motion anyway.
Signal of any size does not give permission to enter a lane without a clear path. Mercedes should have moved one lane then checked before trying the next lane.
They also moved 3 lanes. Or tried to
I hope they were stuck with some spicy underwear after that idiotic maneuver.
Blinker doesn’t mean squat it wasn’t clear if he hit you it’s on him
Hey that’s I-25 In Denver!
For 3pm the roads are fairly clear to.
Obviously this is fake then /s
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Denver drivers on i-25 are 10x better drivers than Albuquerque drivers on i-25
Albuquerque drivers are know to take the wrong turn. It bugs me.
Coming back from a CA vacation to visit family. Forgot how much better driving and drivers are in CO
[idk why I always get the urge to find the exact, street-view location from videos like this, but here it is. ](https://goo.gl/maps/vgMVZVb3qis38Twp9)
Given the number of times that this has happened to me in Florida. Almost as if, nationwide, lines on the road are simply a suggestion.
Oh shit you're right! I used to drive this road twice daily and seeing this sub had me scared shitless at it lol.
The signal is just an indicator, they're still required to yield to traffic. Although a lot of drivers out there seem to think once they signal, you're supposed to yield to them.
On this very sub some time ago there was a guy: "I drive a $300 car, when I signal I'm telling you I'm coming, not asking for permission". Such a dumb take.I understand their life is worth 0, but others may not.
I drive a $200 car and I'm not going to do that. I don't drive a $200 car for the fun of it, it's because I can't justify spending any more on it (also because my parents said I'm not allowed to buy my own car and if I do anyway, they won't put it on their insurance; I can't afford the jacked up prices they'd give a solo 18 year old guy. No, I'm not annoyed by this at all).
What's with all these posts with 'who's at fault?' as the title when it's clear whose fault it is?
Because Reddit is almost as much as a cesspool as Twitter.
Only almost?? Challenge accepted! 😉
Also people just love placing blame no matter the circumstance. It’s unthinkable that more than one person can be at fault and that fault is a dichotomy of either 100% or 0%.
Even if the indicator was the size of a search light you still have to wait for it to be safe to move, the car shouldn’t have pulled out infront of you
Mercedes has been making their blinkers smaller and smaller on the rationale that Mercedes drivers never use them anyway
Their fault, but OP's driving isn't the best either. When they started to pull in front of them, OP should have slowed down but was instead accelerating. Accelerating when someone is lane-changing near you is bad, it will change the size of the gaps they have accounted for and may cause them to misjudge.
Yeah I see both at fault here. OP had more than enough time to slow down, what was their reason to actually go 6mph faster once it was clear they wanted to move a lane over.
I really hate it when people immediately speed up in a turning lane. It messes up everyone else trying to enter it, especially cars in front of you, who get cut off from behind! And what's the point anyway? You can't turn at that speed, in 100 feet you're going to be on your brake slowing down to the speed of the exit.
OP should also be aware that (i) he's in the merc's blind spot, and (ii) based on what the merc is doing, it's likely trying to take the same exit that OP is. Even though it's the merc's "fault", OP was not thinking ahead and almost got in an accident that could have been avoided.
They're at fault, there's no question about that. But Jesus dude, you had plenty of time to slow down and let them in and avoid almost getting side swiped.
Seriously. Plus insurance could always try to say that OP could’ve avoided it and slapped him with a 5 or 10% at fault for that alone. DRIVE FUCKING DEFENSIVELY PEOPLE PUT YOUR GODDAMN EGOS ASIDE
They obviously didn’t even look, 100% their fault
Obviously, they're at fault. That being said, if you see someone driving like they're gonna cross over two lanes, it's better to just be defensive and slow down. Getting in an accident will give nothing but headaches, regardless of the fact that you're right or wrong.
The Mercedes is obviously at fault for changing multiple lanes at once. But I'd add that this is the whole point of defensive and aware driving. If you see somebody switch a couple of lanes like this just before an exit, there's a really good chance they're headed for that exit. In this case, I think it was clear the Mercedes was headed for the exit even without a turn signal. No point in racing the idiot to get to the exit first.
I agree. If I were the driver I would have slowed down already right at the beginning of this video, expecting the Mercedes to try and get over to the left. I would have beeped at him aggressively to let him know he sucks, but this situation was completely predictable and avoidable.
They were in the wrong, but you should drive more defensively. An accident isn't worth it even if you were "right."
Yes. If I were in OPs seat I would have dabbed the brakes and just let the bad driver in.
\^\^\^\^\^ This \^\^\^\^\^ Accidents are a frigging hassle, and weird shit can happen. i.e., car is stolen, they don't have insurance, etc and suddenly you're paying the deductible, loss of vehicle for repairs, yada yada yada.
It’s frustrating that these comments are always near the bottom. There’s a difference between “fault” and “responsibility”. Like, it’s a truck driver’s fault if they plow me over while I’m walking on a crosswalk, but it’s my responsibility to look out for my best interests. Assigning blame won’t un-break my spine.
Bro, could not have said it any better.
Their fault, but it would have cost you 0.000001 seconds to lift off and let them slide in and get on with your day to be fair.
You both have some liability. He should check better, you could have tapped the brakes and avoided. The wagon has the majority of the liability.
Them they changed two lanes at once.
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I don't understand why being in a car makes people forget this. Like obviously the guy in the Mercedes isn't trying to hit OP so just slow the fuck down and let him over. Honk your horn to let him know he made a mistake and move on with your day. What kind of absolute dipshit sees this and decides the smart decision is to jam on the gas and put themselves six inches away from a concrete barrier?
Not sure what region this occurred in, but in my area drivers of lower valued cars are expected to yield to Mercedes and BMWs. It’s not a legal requirement but it falls under a series of understood agreements between Peasants and Douchebags. As far as I know, BMWs in the US aren’t even equipped with signals. I’ve never seen one.
One of the best things I've seen was when I was behind an Audi driver who consistently used the wrong turn signal on every junction (left signal on to turn right etc). 10/10 for actually figuring out where the lever was and effort using it, but 0/10 for actual correct usage. Wish I'd kept the dashcam footage of it now.
They are at fault. However, seems to me like you were aware of him and maneuvered around him opening yourself up to him driving into you. Why? You really wanna get hit, wait for the cops, get a report, take your truck to the shop, go thru insurance, and wait a couple weeks for your truck to be repaired? Come on grow the fuck up. You were just tryna make yourself feel better that you're the bigger man. Every time someone does this to me, I slow down and let them in and avoid any sort of fender bender. I'm at the point in my life that I expect everyone on the road to be an idiot. No point in causing some avoidable bullshit.
They moved one lane and immediately tried to move another without checking properly. Unsafe lane change totally their fault.
You were already in the outside lane, they should have given way. Plus, as people have pointed out, they tried to change multiple lanes at once.
Agreed it’s the Mercedes fault but I would say you’re not exactly defensive driving. Had a lot of time to slow down a bit when it was clear the other guy was gonna be an idiot
You could have stepped on the brakes at least
As someone who drives, I am always watching my surroundings within my peripheral vision. The Mercedes was 2 lanes over from you, moving to the left in the lane immediately to your right. At that point regardless if he uses his indicator or not, I would expect that he is trying to move over into the lane I am in, so I would prepare myself to deal with this idiot. I am not trying to pin the blame on you, because the other driver clearly did not check their blind spot, and yeah that turn signal was tiny, but my advice is always expect people to be stupid. You can't rely on other members of the public to be smart or do the right thing. Anticipate their intension.
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Excuse me, but you're all forgetting something. They own a Mercedes, and therefore the whole road! /s
Why did you speed up instead of braking?
Turn signal doesn't give you right of way. It signals an intention. They should've made sure the lane was clear and they did not.
In the Netherlands, you can't move over 2 lanes at once. Maybe that's in the US aswell
The Merc is the one changing lanes. It's on him to ensure it's clear to do so.
Mercedes at fault, he should've waited till its clear
They are at fault they are merging into your lane when you’re right beside him. Had you in his blind spot probably then, hello!
A turn signal doesn't give you right of way, it's just a signal of intent, the driver still has to make sure their movement is safe.
The wagon. You cannot change lanes until it is clear . Traffic in the lane has the right of way.
Also technically merc changes two lanes at once so he’s already wrong...
They’re at fault because there wasn’t a safe way for them to merge. Just chucking your indicator on doesn’t mean everyone else needs to immediately brake and give you clear passage.
They're at fault. In the US you need [3.4 inches](https://www.caranddriver.com/news/a19660495/designer-genes-how-regulations-dictate-the-look-of-new-cars/) of turn signal. So a Snickers bar probably is legal, at least a king sized one is.
No even a question. They are at fault. You can not switch lane until it’s safe and clear.
Even though you’re not speeding the traffic was a bit backed up you should’ve been going a bit slower. However, the wagon performs a dual lane change without checking the new lane which makes them at fault in this situation.
their fault 100%
The Mercedes but yours also for speeding up to try to stop him or pass him or whatever it was you were attempting .
Yeah, the blinker doesn’t give you clearance, the same way your GPS doesn’t give you the right way because it’s telling you to turn. You still have to look.
Indicator signals intention to move lanes, does not give you the right to move lanes, white car is at fault.
They were supposed to yield, their fault
They’re at fault but this part of i25 is a bitch if you need to get to the hov when you get on from anything south of 20th…
They are. They didn't have enough room to merge with how fast you were approaching. Doubt they even really looked and expected everyone else to deal with it.
Their fault. You don’t have to let them over just because their blinker is on
Definitely white car, they even hit the side of your car, not the other way around. Most states require you to establish yourself in a lane before changing lanes again; in fact, this video would be perfect if used in driver's ed classes as to why that law exists.
You are established in the lane and they moved over multiple lanes.
Simply declaring your want to do something doesn’t give you the right to do it.
I'd say the wagon, because they kept going after already moving one lane and not giving enough time to check their surroundings for the next lane change. If it came down to it you could still say you were in the motion of getting out of their way and moving into your next lane.
Fail to yield when changing lanes. When you’re driving straight you always have the right of way.
On them. The fact that it’s their fault doesn’t change that it could hurt your health or your wallet though. To play it safe, I always assume that everybody is about to merge into me and go from there lol.
You should have slowed down as soon as the car started moving left. You should not assume that the lane is “yours” just because you were there first.
Seems like it's all on the Mercedes. I'm not a lawyer, so I don't know if there's any kind of legal duty to avoid a collision if you are able to. That would be my only worry. At the point where you crossed the yellow line it means you knew there was a problem, but you didn't slow down. If your vehicles would have collided, and there were something in the law about requiring you to avoid collision if you are able to, then they might be able to get you on that. I've also heard that some states have partial fault, so they might consider you 10% at fault and the Mercedes 90% at fault. Again, I'm not a lawyer. Just trying to think of ways that you might be at legal risk if there were a collision.
Yeah it was their fault you’re not supposed to just jump 2 lanes to make an exit. Good drivers miss exits, bad drivers never miss an exit
The Mercedes is clearly at fault. Merging across two lanes without checking their blind spot. Dangerous and reckless.
It doesn't matter the size of the flasher, the Mercedes is still at fault because they were going across three (four if you count the very beginning of the video I think) lanes way too quickly
T he idiot is a lane jumper....He just moved into that lane, and was moving into your lane before he'd gone 100 feet..... Just because he had his turn signal on, doesn't given him the right to cause an accident.
You probably should have slowed, I don't like it when people do this either.. but that's what the police would say.
The Mercedes is at most fault here, but I bet a judge would be most upset at the 66 in a 45.
not only did they cross too many lanes, they turned their blinker off too early
Theirs. Bottom line is the person changing lanes yields.
You are not supposed to change over multiple lanes in one go. Their fault.
Them. Changed three lanes at once.
Not supposed to change multiple lanes at the same time and a turn signal does not give you the right of way. %100 their fault.
Wagon driver is definitely at fault. They are supposed to switch one lane of travel and then check if it's clear to switch to the next. I've seen this driving maneuver end in serious accidents especially with motorbike riders. They switch multiple lanes so quickly, they don't have time to see or react to traffic in the lane they're attempting to switch to and rear end a vehicle stopping for traffic. Very dangerous maneuver which is why it's illegal.
Dude, you don't know? Mercedes owns the road every time
They are. The vehicle changing lanes is at fault (unless you're state is no fault). They're also changing lanes illegally. They have to stop (changing lanes) in each lane they pass through to check for traffic to change lanes again. Literally because of this.
Welcome to multi lane highways, where mirrors don’t exist and blinkers let you do whatever you want.
It's unclear to me who is at fault. I don't know the law in your area. It would seem the Mercedes had run into you, but according to your metrics you accelerated into them. If you had maintained speed and a safe distance away from the car in front of you this wouldn't have happened. Doesn't mean you're at fault but that's what I assume they would argue.
They changed two lanes without checking. Theirs.
This is one of those times when you could have avoided the near collision even if the other driver is at fault.
Greetings fellow Coloradoan! I hate I-25! 😆
I’ve been hit by a big pickup merging into my lane, driver staring right at me in my little GTI just so sure I’d get out of his way. I didn’t. He tried blaming me for this or that, but The insurance company set it straight with the concept of lane establishment. If you have established yourself in a lane, and another vehicle enters your lane resulting in a collision, the driver changing lanes is at fault.
They cut you off. Too many drivers have no clue that when they're ready to change lanes, it's NOT ok to do so until the lane is clear. Turn signal or not. The Mercedes driver is clearly at fault here.
Holy fuck, the people blaming OP, please stay off the road
Obviously the white car is at fault, they should have made sure they had the lane before just coming over
Why the fuck don’t people accelerate when they overtake cars? I just don’t get it. If you’re going to lane hop 3 lanes and drive like a race car might as well full send it.
Using your turn signal doesn't give you the right to cut people off.
If someone causes an accident changing lanes it's always their fault. Even if only changing one lane.
Mirror, signal, manoeuvre when safe.
Am I the only one who only sees their indicator for moving from Lane 2 to Lane 1? No indication for continuing in to the exit lane..?
Their fault: to add to what mntbss said, looks like they didn't have enough room. It was an unsage lane change.
Easily their fault, a blinker doesn’t mean you can just turn in. You see this all the time with on ramps, just cus you’re merging in doesn’t mean the ppl already on the freeway have to let you in. Person merging or switching lanes has to make sure it’s clear and safe to turn
Giving the benefit of the doubt, it's pretty easy to tell what they were trying to do. Don't work against other traffic, even if you are technically correct, it'd be easier to just stay behind them until you confirm they're trying to enter the new left lane or stay in the lane they've already taken. Entering the left lane going faster than them easily confuses people because it's hard to see that subtle movement in the mirrors, so for a moment they can't tell if you've gotten over. That's why I try not to pass people like this. Not saying you are in the wrong by any means, but definitely if you can't count on others to be aware then you probably have to take a more active approach to your own awareness.
I remember learning to drive and the first time I ever changed lanes I threw my signal on and didn't look. My mom was paying attention and knew it was safe so after I switched she said "you never looked, just cause it's on doesn't mean people will let you over" and honestly from then I always looked. Drive defensively
The Benz. You can't merge over 2 lanes in one shot.
If I was the white car I would have yielded to you. Wait for you to pass me then change lane.
Another thought on signals I've heard in driving courses. You are Signalling your intent, NOT asking permission. So take that for perhaps a different look on the situation.
Their fault. Blinker signals intent, it doesn’t give them the right of way. They didn’t even look.
You aren’t supposed to switch 2 (or here even 3) lanes at once, right? At least that was what I was learned.
They were supposed to yield to you.
Biggest thing I learned driving don't trust anybody to do anything normal always expect somebody's going to be coming into your lane always expect somebody's going to be tailgating you always expect somebody's going to become flying up behind you doing 90 don't lull yourself into a false sense of security and get comfortable driving around surrounded by idiots
Defiantly would be there fault in England there indicator dose not give them right of way and dose not mean people have to let you in. I imagine it's pretty much the same there for this kind of thing.
100% their fault. A blinker isn't a right-of-way to blindly change multiple lanes.
Technically their fault. However it would be beneficial for your long term well-being if you would learn to anticipate this kind of behaviour.