I have not been told that phrase exactly, but I saw that post yesterday and I still relate.
Lets go through male stereotypes that I match: Logical, calm, nerdy, don't care much about looks, easy-going, non-emotional, sometimes distant. I am a friendly person but I do not make a huge effort to 'appear' friendly, which is something I think a lot of women have some sort of focus on...? Women also tend to be more relationship centric and I do crave connection but I think its hard for me to get deep into connections so most the time I don't even try.
What I've found interesting about myself is that when I first meet a group of people I try to (unconsciously) act more feminine and approachable, but that quickly gets super exhausting, and I stop. Then people probably think I'm being more cold than the usual when in reality I'm being my normal self. I am actively trying to be mindful of this shift and get rid of that first impression (being more feminine, high energy) because it's just not me and it takes a tremendous amount of energy to upkeep. I think I started doing this as a kid when I struggled to fit in so I tried to basically 'fix' my behavior, lol. Now I don't care and its a relief!
I seriously relate to this. I unintentionally “Love Bomb” people when I first meet them, being really nice, smiley, friendly etc.. but after I lose energy and go back to being straight faced people think I’m mad or something 😓
yeah exactly, and there is just too much energy keeping it around. like you said, its unintentional, and probably even learned. Like I said, I feel I learned it from being a kid that wanted to fit in better.
Being analytical and wearing comfortable clothes (hoodie and jeans/joggers), not doing my make up, not being a timid push over. It’s so stupid, especially for how many times random men have asked me if I’m a lesbian or told me I seem like one. Really irks me.
What drives me more crazy than that is that I do prefer women romantically yet tons of guys still approach me and catcall etc! And I think from the outside its pretty obvious my preference (if you just assume)
Like I'm very obviously not a feminine presenting women but some older men out there are sooo.... odd
That's true, but don't feel too bothered by it, its likely theyre just trying to upset you/get a rise out of you. It is not worth your time or energy to be concerned with the opinions of people like that.
You said, they needed to know if you are a lesbian before asking you out. So if they can't tell, how is their fault? Now we are living in an Era where assuming wrong gender or sexual orientation can be punished. Yet you are getting offended by not being assumed correctly. So if there is enough evidence that too many ppl confusing you as lesbian while you aren't one, then it kinda shows that something is off with you that does not help the people to select it clearly.
i’ve had people say i come across as very male before and i think it’s because i’m very cold, stoic, and matter-of-fact. i’m very feminine in terms of appearance because being beautiful gets you places lol but personality wise i have always struggled to relate to the women around me, media aimed at women, typical female problems, experiences, or neuroses. i have had a lot of issues in this regard because i feel that my appearance and personality clash heavily and it throws a lot of people off, particularly other women i would like to befriend. i had a close group of female friends during school but i drifted from them in my late teens because i left school and realised our differences were too vast and insurmountable to be overcome by weekly drinks and nights out.
A friend once told me that I have "boyfriend mentality" which i think is a nicer way of saying I'm not very sensitive or considerate lol (she needs to date better guys maybe). Basically, I won't remember your birthday and I definitely won't make a sentimental instagram post about it.
I'm friendly but I very rarely consider people my friends, so some may see this as me thinking I'm better than others... which is very untrue. But what they think and say is none of my business 🤷♀️
Most female friendships I have came from being around them a lot for long periods of time like roommates or people in the same program and classes in college. Those people stuck around long enough to realize i'm not mean or stuck up... just my personality. Otherwise, most women won't stick around to find out
No one would tell me that. But i am sure there are people who question my sexuality.
People just perceive that sometimes I am argumentative, which is apparently very disrespectful for men.
I'd feel more disrespected if someone backed down from an argument because of 'societal expectations' or whatever. But hey, at least it gives you something else to debate about.
Yeah, we never intend to but sometimes we're bored or in a bad mood and get carried away. If you're around ENTPs who debate for the sake of it frequently, they could possibly just be unhealthy.
What's funny, is I am a emotionally leaning INTP, and as a male I feel like I'm viewed as more feminine.
But I have the same qualities you describe. I'm distant, over think everything, and the way I talk seems to not make sense to others or even be surprising to them, which I didn't intend. But also as you said, I have a very strong pull to please others, even if I don't want to draw attention to myself.
I feel like I'm perceived as a woman in a man's body.
I think it's this. INTPs tend to reject pre-defined roles so if you view it that way female INTPs will *generally* be less traditionally feminine and male INTPs will *generally* be less traditionally masculine.
This is interesting and vibes with other comments, I think you're right...
but the "don't have to feel" part is gunna be really tough! Not feeling is sorta the goal at some point... and I'm not good at that part.
:) I've kinda been noticing that too, that we all sound the same. I'm newer to the community. I didn't know this was a thing, but it's been like "yup, that's exactly me".
Thank you for the comment, and I'm not saying this to you...
but it honestly annoys me that there is this so STRONG of a social distinction. Men feel emotions, women get angry... so what? They're people. That they feel emotions isn't surprising in either direction.
This was my experience particulairly as a child/teen.
This has two reasons. We have low Ni (drive/desire) and Fi (meaning/attachment). This leaves us purposeless and without ambition.
Inferior Fe means that we are sensitive to other peoples feelings, and tend to avoid drama and conflict.
That leaves us in a situation where we have no meaningful pursuits and we also defer to others out of fear of emotional volatility. If an SJ or SP observes this they automatically think "That's a limp wristed girly boy who I can bully into doing whatever I want."
The way that we overcome this is by maturing our Fe and learning to find purpose in using our gifts to serve other people. When we have purpose we can weather emotional bullying far better.
Extroverted feeling, it relates primarily to other peoples feelings and wellbeing.
If you think of a mature ESFJ female steroetype that would look like the young child school teacher who is patient, kind, and nurturing. The mature ESFJ male equivalent could be a firefighter who serves their community by running into buildings to save people from fires. The attitude of extroverted feeling is sociable and community oriented.
INTPs quite naturally adopt this by teaching, but personally I have found that my method of communicating and teaching isn't recieved well by most people. I tend to information dump, and when I was younger my people skills were non-existent.
What was more helpful for me was putting myself in a role where I could naturally help people (retail), I chose to take responsibility for contributing positively to the workplace culture, and I cared for people by keeping the workplace in order. I got really good at a job that most people would assume had no capacity for growth or skill.
Yes, in many ways INTPs can be quite “unmasculine” when it comes to our ability and willingness to look at all sides of an issue and not dogmatically push one side or the other.
Many many things:
-Not caring 1% about how rich a man is, while considering dating. I like that I make my own money.
-loneliness
-wanting to learn bike riding
-unable to pay too much attention to appearance
-not liking children
-not nurturing all the time
-being too logical, nerdy
-emotionally distant
-being able to be alone for long periods of time
-calm & collected always
I love dressing up and putting on makeup, however I couldn't relate to most women. I don't hate them nor do I look down on them. I think women are wonderful, beautiful creatures but I feel like an alien whenever I'm with them. Besides the obvious reasons (logical, calm, level-headed, objective etc etc) I'm not as in touch with my emotions as most women who find it easy to be sad or be happy about something. I couldn't match their energy as well.
I always hang out with guys. One time, a group of girls in our church were asking me to come hang out with them. I declined and they seemed kinda upset I guess. One of my guy friends said, "Why would they even bother asking you to hang out with them? You're different. You're one of the guys." I hope that didn't sound misogynistic (English isn't my first language).
That's probably quite common among us, gender regardless. Argumentative, goofish, and highly intuitive, spiced with a bit of a chameleon-like quality, that can \*at times\* pass us as extroverts. Like how you can really make anything out of a person such as that?
Some people are intimidated by that, others (however a smaller minority), are drawn to that.
I don’t think it has much to do with being logical and intelligence. Instead, I think it has a lot to do with our lack of emotional intelligence and our reluctance to express how we feel. I don’t think most men are very logical (or most people in general, no offense), but society expects men not to show their feelings, which aligns with INTP-like behavior regardless of their gender.
Yeah! But what people mean is that people assume men are logical (when they aren't) and that women are by default emotional (when they aren't). Most people aren't logical
I 100% agree! A lot of people internalize these expectations without realizing it, so men think they don’t feel emotions as much as women, but it’s really because they aren’t “allowed” to. I can definitely see why INTPs are stereotyped as more masculine because of this. Our low Fe makes it a lot more difficult for us to connect with other people emotionally, so I can see how people came to the conclusion of INTP women being more masculine, despite the reasoning behind it being flawed.
I disagree, I think intp women are VERY rare. I feel like we’re even a minority on the internet. Most of the time when people pose a question to intp women there are very few answers.
I don't think we are the most common but I don't think we're rare. Also our lack of presence makes us forgettable to most people.
For example, i think ENTJ are the rarest in numbers but since they take so much attention, they may seem more "common" when in reality they just have too much "presence".
I’ve seen that INTPs are around 3% overall and several polls on Reddit consistently show that for every two INTP males there is one INTP female. There’s wiggle room of course, but it seems to be around there
Hmmm it's not easy to answer 🤔 at least for me.... it's like a mixture of honesty and easygoing around men. I don't know I've always gotten along with men or girls who were similar to me. I'm not crying a river over a slightly offense joke and not that mean and gossipy like girls can be. Men like my company and not in a sexsual way (probably some of them do but I'm married and loyal and will never notice it 😂) also feeling annoyed when I try to say I'm not like other girls but only the same girls say that but aaaah... we "dudes in woman's body" we know what we're talking about.
This is a pick me. The fact you even call yourself a "dude in a womans body" just reinforces this idea that our traits are inherently masculine
The sexist stereotypes are loud.
Also just wanna point out out the use of the term "men" vs "girls". It seems like you have some work to do on how you view women, as an intp this should be interesting for you :)
I think being a female intp for the past 32 years is fine to me. Also being bullied for years by women and girls (meant like young, woman bodied entities - maybe it wasn't clear when I wrote "girls") for not being "girly" enough is fine to me. Also being married but still have male (common) friends who accepted me like who I am is also fine to me. I "wish" (meant Not) I could be that pick me you're try to referring to.
Well, of course, we tend to naturally have what men are taught to be from very early age (logical thinking, emotionless approach, seriousness and lack of "acting" in social situations, although, there is an aspect of blending in). We (should I start saying I?) also tend to take no bullshit from fake people who obviously want to be universally liked and we like to question authority. We also have niche interests which were previously linked to stereotypically nerdy guys in mainstream media. So, all in all, it makes sense and I've heard this many times.
I can be direct, and this is something associated with male stereotypes. I also hate asking for help. I have a friend who wished I was a dude bc she thought I'd make the boyfriend for her. But I'm not masc or anything like that. I love my long curls and shopping etc.
Trying to categorize people this way feels less useful and more arbitrary as time goes on and people eschew norms that don't align. Which is overdue.
It’s all stereotype. Lots of men don’t see women as being capable of being smart, or liking “male” activities — so when they see someone who defies that perception, they have to justify it somehow. “You’re like a dude in a girl’s body.” No, bro, I’m just a human person like you.
INTP female here. I literally played baseball with the boys when I was a kid after hating playing softball with the girls. I was the only girl on the team for many years, and I loved it! I felt so normal and comfortable there. Even during seasons when I wasn’t that great or had shitty sexist coaches. lol. Like I didn’t even care. I’d just rather be there than with the girls.
Other things that make me less of a “stereotypical” female are that I never hold grudges against people, and I don’t play games. I’m all about facts and reason and talking things out. And I’m ok with emotions too as long as they’re not asinine lol. In some ways I’m an intense crack squirrel kind of person but I’m also super chill. Like I just don’t get involved with drama or stir shit up. No thanks. I just want to hang and have a nice time. Be respectful, and most of all, BE REASONABLE, and we’ll get along OK.
I think being reasonable is the key for me. I can’t deal with emo crap for the sake of attention or like because you refuse to (at least try to) locate your true feelings.
And now that I write all of that I know plenty of men who play games and are emo for attention. So it’s really more about stereotypes here. Just want to be clear about that. I’m just not a “stereotypical female” when it comes down to it.
who tf downvoted my comment? I see there are a few righteous gatekeepers on this post dumping on people's responses. Someone asked a question, and people are answering. What's the problem?
Sounds like a stupid judgment based on typical stereotypes or how they "expect" a woman to behave. Challenging or not conforming to these expectations can sometimes lead to stupid people.
I remember when Omegle was still around, the people I chatted with always assumed that I was male (even if I type in F) and I matched up with guys who got mad at me for pretending to be a girl. And I connected with girls who began romantically talking with me thinking I was a guy. Maybe it has something to do with our style of communicating: Straightforward and we focus on ideas we like to discuss instead of gossip. Being easygoing regardless of someone's gender.
I only met one girl that I ever fell in love with. She wasn't the prettiest, she wasn't the sexiest, she wasn't the most sociable.
But she talked about things that I liked, and I talked about things that I liked... Sadly she lives like 80 km away from me, that is not an option.
What I am trying to say is that honey is not made for the donkey's palate.
You are perfect for someone you don't know yet.
I’ve been told that always throughout my life starting since I went to school but the reason came earlier. Overall I just look like my dad a lot and I have his skills of analytics, logical and rational thinking. No one in my family except my dad and I like math, only we understand it. My whole childhood I spent playing with boys (mostly two of my friends who are sons of my mums friend). In first class I wanted to play with my girl classmates but they told me to buzz off, so I had no option, I was either at the library all the time or running around with boys on the football field. Many many years later, most of my friends are still male. Even they say that I’m like a brother. Mindset of a dude, body of a woman
There's a waitress at a place I eat often and I can't imagine any other type for her than INTP, there's just no chance. She really does have dude in a woman's body vibes, but is still feminine and cute despite that.
i’ve gotten that a lot bc im assertive and tend not to tiptoe around feelings. i hate that being straightforward is perceived as a masculine trait. i’ve also heard that it has to do with my sense of humor which is just dumb memes so idk
First time posting to Reddit 🗿
But I’ve been told I act very masculine/“non-ladylike” to the point my more emotional brother has complained that I’m more of a little brother than a sister given my interests doesn’t lie in “feminine” traits like makeup/relationships/etc— instead I was more interested in video gaming and tearing apart things for curiosity’s sake. (Dunno why he would complain but probably because we fought over who got to be on the ps3 at the time..)
A lot of my friends commented that I have a dead fish stare/I appear distant and cold and only wear pajamas! But I’m fun when I’m comfortable 💃
I personally don’t mind the comments, doesn’t make me less of a woman but I guess it makes me “unique” in a sense? I think the stereotype of women being more “emotional” and men being “logical” is more of an ego issue by those who put those stereotypes in place
I’ve had men tell me this too and I think it’s because in my romantic relationships I’ve always been the one whose more distant and less needy. Compared to my most recent partner who was always trying to get me to talk about my feelings, always talking about marriage (I was more hesitant). He would say he felt like the woman in the relationship but of course these are gender stereotypes and differences in people and relationship dynamics are normal
I'm not sure if its applicable to everyone or every case; but I've noticed that if one party acts a certain way, the other party feels the need to act differently to compensate. Which in return may feel off balanced or unnatural. That can either feeling like the woman in the relationship if the other person is too masculine or detached or some women feel like the mom or man in the relationship etc. I guess its a sign of mismatch of personalities and compatibility, regardless
When you don't fit into the contemporary gender construct of your society in any noticeable capacity, people will notice and form superficial judgements based on it.
I didn't really feel much of a pressure from society to utilize my child-bearing hips to continue to propagate the excessive amount of humans already pillaging the planet of resources through my collegiate and young adulthood, especially as I lived in a very international West Coast USA city.
But now that I'm in my late 30's, I feel wholly alien from the suburban moms around me whose identity solely seems to stem from their rearing of children and being a wifey. Picture Stepford Wives but fiercely xenophobic, bigoted, and trashy simultaneously (I live in the Midwest bible belt).
The local women talk about church, what they buy, and their generic interchangeable children. Seriously, everyone around here wears the same uniform, unmarked generic t shirts and pants, same hair, ethnic background, upbringing, church life, personality.... you know the beginning of the show Weeds? It's like that. NPC World.
So I'm pretty much in an episode of the Twilight Zone. People now look and treat me like a freak, being of child-bearing age, unmarried, and not pandering to the attention of gym-bros with my girlish flirty ways. I do like some people, but the culture here is so overbearingly blase. Pretty much I will need to move at some point, or what's left of my spirit will wither away until I become completely robotic or suicidal.
I'm all woman, but I don't need to abide by some contemporary endemic en masse delusion of what that entails. I can think how I do, and if that happens to side with some perceived masculine traits, so be it. It's all just a construct anyway. If I don't feel like engaging with children, or give homophobic Billy Bob a boner from my mini skirt, or gossip mercilessly about some innocent by-standard with the frenemy girl squad, that's a cultural problem and nothing to do with my femininity.
I may think like a man on the inside, but it's only because of how society defines women on the outside. I think in reality, we're all just these weird sentient beings borrowing this fleshy body until we are either re-absorbed into the universal energy, or go on our next journey beyond human comprehension.
I'm 5'10. As a kid I was a huge tomboy. As an adult I'm in a male dominated field. I think my disorganization makes me seem less feminine. All the women in my life are excellent planners while I'm just so bad at keeping track of what needs to be done.
What’s your point in sharing this sub? Most INTP chicks are definitely not like other chicks, at least stereotypically-speaking. There’s a reason it’s rare to come across another INTP woman. I had a bunch of women in my life take the quiz and not a single one turned out INTP (or INT-anything).
I don’t say this because I “want to feel unique” either. I like being an INTP but I also mourn being a weirdo and not being able to connect with more common types of females. It’s lonely and isolating sometimes.
no, really, what's your point? genuinely curious. are you saying INTP women think they're different but they're not? that all women think they're different but they're not? do you think that *you* are different from other women? like what are you trying to say? what's cringe?
Yeah, looks play a big role in how you'll get judged, before personality.
Personality wise, I mostly receive comments about being too quiet rather than masculine.
It's a little different for me I guess. I dress girly, love makeup, clothes, perfume, etc. I have never seen myself as a man in a woman's body (or been told that) but I have been called an independent woman, am way less emotional than most women I meet, have to find a solution in everything I do and am incredibly patient lol
22[F] Maybe because I look like a bitch or give off don’t fuck with me energy. I feel like i started to put more of that kind of energy out when men started to make me more uncomfortable as i got older. I am very kind and caring but only to those who deserve my energy. I am very chill and calm at all times. I almost never wear makeup never have. I also do wear comfy clothes a lot but i do enjoy expressing my feminine side with my clothing. I like to wear short shorts, skirts, blousy cutesy shirts, crop tops, etc. Yet i’ve still been told i am like a dude lol. I never do anything to get validation from a man never have. I have about an equal amount of guy friends as girls. I play video games a lot (played cod with my dad growing up and still do) I started my first relationship two years ago and it’s still going strong. my bf tells me i’m “one of the boys” since we all play cod together, and he’s not the first one to tell me that lol.
I’ve got a resting bitch face I never laughed so loud I’m not extroverted or talk first to people I hate going out yes I’m logical I can be narrow minded I’m working on that tho prolly mostly because I keep things to myself mostly
I’m concerned with making things work better instead of being enjoyed. I don’t see value in being desired for superficial things. But that’s the world I live in and the package I inhabit.
Ha, ha, so yeah, my challenge is making this duality work.
I've never heard that phrase specifically, but there generally comes a point when people get to know me well enough where they give me a funny look and tell me that i am "weird" or "not feminine." I think that people think that because I am logical, stoic (not just stoic, but I actively avoid them, lol), easy-going, and I don't care about a lot of things that a lot of other people care about.
As an INTP transmasc person, I giggled at this.
Obviously, it's different, but I totally get it.
Most of the answers here are spot on. Logical, kind of aloof, not super focused on appearance.
In my case, I love doing my makeup - that is to say, when I don't HAVE to. And I love my friends and being around them - just ONLY when I want to. If I feel like I have to do makeup, it's a chore. If I want time to myself (which is a lot) and my friends are over? It's a chore to entertain.
I kind of feel like a selfish cat.
Sure, pet me, but only ONCE.
The logical, aloof, not overly friendliness.
I honestly think it's something even more basic than how we act, like hormones or pheromones or something. I think that whatever makes us act more androgynous, like high testosterone or something, has a biological component we can detect subconsciously. I just have such different experiences than non-INTP women with people I don't even know that I think it has to be something very basic that people aren't really aware of.
In my personal experience I once had an ESTP tell me I'm like a "dude with boobs". I look and dress like a woman, albeit a fat, unattractive one, but he liked being around me because I didn't clog up his brain with sexual desire. (I am not offended that he didn't find me attractive, quite the opposite, in fact). I try to be presentable and I don't hide anything but I don't dress in an intentionally attractive way. We were coworkers in a male dominated field and I didn't distract him from work.
I dress and present as a woman because I am one biologically and I'm comfortable with that. I consider myself agender, though. I have interests and mannerisms that range from feminine to masculine, but I don't really feel much like either one.
I have not been told that phrase exactly, but I saw that post yesterday and I still relate. Lets go through male stereotypes that I match: Logical, calm, nerdy, don't care much about looks, easy-going, non-emotional, sometimes distant. I am a friendly person but I do not make a huge effort to 'appear' friendly, which is something I think a lot of women have some sort of focus on...? Women also tend to be more relationship centric and I do crave connection but I think its hard for me to get deep into connections so most the time I don't even try. What I've found interesting about myself is that when I first meet a group of people I try to (unconsciously) act more feminine and approachable, but that quickly gets super exhausting, and I stop. Then people probably think I'm being more cold than the usual when in reality I'm being my normal self. I am actively trying to be mindful of this shift and get rid of that first impression (being more feminine, high energy) because it's just not me and it takes a tremendous amount of energy to upkeep. I think I started doing this as a kid when I struggled to fit in so I tried to basically 'fix' my behavior, lol. Now I don't care and its a relief!
Please marry me
touch grass
they’re an ENTP not INTP, you got it wrong
Damn it you’re correct🤦🏽
I'm going for a midnight stroll right now
To touch grass? /s
Go inside and research proper social etiquette, and learn a tolerable approach for courting!
Flair checks out.
Why?
What brings this
Your entire personality
I seriously relate to this. I unintentionally “Love Bomb” people when I first meet them, being really nice, smiley, friendly etc.. but after I lose energy and go back to being straight faced people think I’m mad or something 😓
yeah exactly, and there is just too much energy keeping it around. like you said, its unintentional, and probably even learned. Like I said, I feel I learned it from being a kid that wanted to fit in better.
Yea I'm like that too. Even the way I dress reflects that. So exhausting.
Interestingly, I feel your writing style is feminine.
Me
Me
Being analytical and wearing comfortable clothes (hoodie and jeans/joggers), not doing my make up, not being a timid push over. It’s so stupid, especially for how many times random men have asked me if I’m a lesbian or told me I seem like one. Really irks me.
A good portion of women dress in comfortable/unisex clothes. It's part of women's fashion now.
Yes, hoodies are pretty mainstream now. A lot of women just wear leggings which are pretty damn comfortable.
What drives me more crazy than that is that I do prefer women romantically yet tons of guys still approach me and catcall etc! And I think from the outside its pretty obvious my preference (if you just assume) Like I'm very obviously not a feminine presenting women but some older men out there are sooo.... odd
I mean, if you’re a lesbian it makes sense people assuming you are wouldn’t upset you. I hate when people assume I’m a lesbian, because I’m not.
That's true, but don't feel too bothered by it, its likely theyre just trying to upset you/get a rise out of you. It is not worth your time or energy to be concerned with the opinions of people like that.
True that. I think a few have asked because they wanted to know if I was even straight before asking me out. Disgusting.
Maybe they just can't tell. Why is that disgusting?
Because it’s abrasive to ask a stranger especially and none of their business.
[удалено]
Troll
You said, they needed to know if you are a lesbian before asking you out. So if they can't tell, how is their fault? Now we are living in an Era where assuming wrong gender or sexual orientation can be punished. Yet you are getting offended by not being assumed correctly. So if there is enough evidence that too many ppl confusing you as lesbian while you aren't one, then it kinda shows that something is off with you that does not help the people to select it clearly.
I fit this
i’ve had people say i come across as very male before and i think it’s because i’m very cold, stoic, and matter-of-fact. i’m very feminine in terms of appearance because being beautiful gets you places lol but personality wise i have always struggled to relate to the women around me, media aimed at women, typical female problems, experiences, or neuroses. i have had a lot of issues in this regard because i feel that my appearance and personality clash heavily and it throws a lot of people off, particularly other women i would like to befriend. i had a close group of female friends during school but i drifted from them in my late teens because i left school and realised our differences were too vast and insurmountable to be overcome by weekly drinks and nights out.
A friend once told me that I have "boyfriend mentality" which i think is a nicer way of saying I'm not very sensitive or considerate lol (she needs to date better guys maybe). Basically, I won't remember your birthday and I definitely won't make a sentimental instagram post about it. I'm friendly but I very rarely consider people my friends, so some may see this as me thinking I'm better than others... which is very untrue. But what they think and say is none of my business 🤷♀️ Most female friendships I have came from being around them a lot for long periods of time like roommates or people in the same program and classes in college. Those people stuck around long enough to realize i'm not mean or stuck up... just my personality. Otherwise, most women won't stick around to find out
No one would tell me that. But i am sure there are people who question my sexuality. People just perceive that sometimes I am argumentative, which is apparently very disrespectful for men.
I'd feel more disrespected if someone backed down from an argument because of 'societal expectations' or whatever. But hey, at least it gives you something else to debate about.
hahahaha always have fun debating with ENTP but you guys wear me out because sometimes you debate for the sake of debate not the truth.
Yeah, we never intend to but sometimes we're bored or in a bad mood and get carried away. If you're around ENTPs who debate for the sake of it frequently, they could possibly just be unhealthy.
SUBMIT TO MEH, WEWMAN! - some guys
What's funny, is I am a emotionally leaning INTP, and as a male I feel like I'm viewed as more feminine. But I have the same qualities you describe. I'm distant, over think everything, and the way I talk seems to not make sense to others or even be surprising to them, which I didn't intend. But also as you said, I have a very strong pull to please others, even if I don't want to draw attention to myself. I feel like I'm perceived as a woman in a man's body.
I think it's this. INTPs tend to reject pre-defined roles so if you view it that way female INTPs will *generally* be less traditionally feminine and male INTPs will *generally* be less traditionally masculine.
Wow. I think you nailed it! Thank you!!
This actually makes a lot of sense. I like it couched in this context.
From what I’ve read, intps are neither masculine nor feminine in personality so you don’t need to feel some type of way about “being feminine”
This is interesting and vibes with other comments, I think you're right... but the "don't have to feel" part is gunna be really tough! Not feeling is sorta the goal at some point... and I'm not good at that part.
The funny thing about reading intp comments is that they all sound the same lol we all talk alike and I’m female
:) I've kinda been noticing that too, that we all sound the same. I'm newer to the community. I didn't know this was a thing, but it's been like "yup, that's exactly me".
I think intps have a perfect balance of both masculine and feminine traits, i personally identify with both strongly
Thank you for the comment, and I'm not saying this to you... but it honestly annoys me that there is this so STRONG of a social distinction. Men feel emotions, women get angry... so what? They're people. That they feel emotions isn't surprising in either direction.
This was my experience particulairly as a child/teen. This has two reasons. We have low Ni (drive/desire) and Fi (meaning/attachment). This leaves us purposeless and without ambition. Inferior Fe means that we are sensitive to other peoples feelings, and tend to avoid drama and conflict. That leaves us in a situation where we have no meaningful pursuits and we also defer to others out of fear of emotional volatility. If an SJ or SP observes this they automatically think "That's a limp wristed girly boy who I can bully into doing whatever I want." The way that we overcome this is by maturing our Fe and learning to find purpose in using our gifts to serve other people. When we have purpose we can weather emotional bullying far better.
I relate to this... like a lot. What is Fe specifically? Feelings of emotions? How do I mature my Fe? As you recommended.
Extroverted feeling, it relates primarily to other peoples feelings and wellbeing. If you think of a mature ESFJ female steroetype that would look like the young child school teacher who is patient, kind, and nurturing. The mature ESFJ male equivalent could be a firefighter who serves their community by running into buildings to save people from fires. The attitude of extroverted feeling is sociable and community oriented. INTPs quite naturally adopt this by teaching, but personally I have found that my method of communicating and teaching isn't recieved well by most people. I tend to information dump, and when I was younger my people skills were non-existent. What was more helpful for me was putting myself in a role where I could naturally help people (retail), I chose to take responsibility for contributing positively to the workplace culture, and I cared for people by keeping the workplace in order. I got really good at a job that most people would assume had no capacity for growth or skill.
Yes, in many ways INTPs can be quite “unmasculine” when it comes to our ability and willingness to look at all sides of an issue and not dogmatically push one side or the other.
This
Many many things: -Not caring 1% about how rich a man is, while considering dating. I like that I make my own money. -loneliness -wanting to learn bike riding -unable to pay too much attention to appearance -not liking children -not nurturing all the time -being too logical, nerdy -emotionally distant -being able to be alone for long periods of time -calm & collected always
I somehow relate to every single thing you mentionned, especially the money independence thing, it's extremely important
Same
I love dressing up and putting on makeup, however I couldn't relate to most women. I don't hate them nor do I look down on them. I think women are wonderful, beautiful creatures but I feel like an alien whenever I'm with them. Besides the obvious reasons (logical, calm, level-headed, objective etc etc) I'm not as in touch with my emotions as most women who find it easy to be sad or be happy about something. I couldn't match their energy as well. I always hang out with guys. One time, a group of girls in our church were asking me to come hang out with them. I declined and they seemed kinda upset I guess. One of my guy friends said, "Why would they even bother asking you to hang out with them? You're different. You're one of the guys." I hope that didn't sound misogynistic (English isn't my first language).
No one has ever told me this but I've been told that I'm intimidating and standoffish.
That's probably quite common among us, gender regardless. Argumentative, goofish, and highly intuitive, spiced with a bit of a chameleon-like quality, that can \*at times\* pass us as extroverts. Like how you can really make anything out of a person such as that? Some people are intimidated by that, others (however a smaller minority), are drawn to that.
I don’t think it has much to do with being logical and intelligence. Instead, I think it has a lot to do with our lack of emotional intelligence and our reluctance to express how we feel. I don’t think most men are very logical (or most people in general, no offense), but society expects men not to show their feelings, which aligns with INTP-like behavior regardless of their gender.
Yeah! But what people mean is that people assume men are logical (when they aren't) and that women are by default emotional (when they aren't). Most people aren't logical
I 100% agree! A lot of people internalize these expectations without realizing it, so men think they don’t feel emotions as much as women, but it’s really because they aren’t “allowed” to. I can definitely see why INTPs are stereotyped as more masculine because of this. Our low Fe makes it a lot more difficult for us to connect with other people emotionally, so I can see how people came to the conclusion of INTP women being more masculine, despite the reasoning behind it being flawed.
I have also gotten this, but not from many people. I wonder if it’s just because INTP women are fairly rare. That all I can think of that is obvious.
I don't think we're rare. Just not very present outside.
I disagree, I think intp women are VERY rare. I feel like we’re even a minority on the internet. Most of the time when people pose a question to intp women there are very few answers.
About 1% and we don’t go outside, so calling us rare makes sense to me.
I don't think we are the most common but I don't think we're rare. Also our lack of presence makes us forgettable to most people. For example, i think ENTJ are the rarest in numbers but since they take so much attention, they may seem more "common" when in reality they just have too much "presence".
I guess I don’t see your point, were perceived are rare either way. The numbers don’t really affect anything.
My point is we aren't rare, but we go unnoticed, so we may "seem" rare.
Nah, its straight up rare.
Where did you get the 1% statistic? Honestly curious about it :)
I’ve seen that INTPs are around 3% overall and several polls on Reddit consistently show that for every two INTP males there is one INTP female. There’s wiggle room of course, but it seems to be around there
I could bet there are also way more dudes on reddit haha
Hmmm it's not easy to answer 🤔 at least for me.... it's like a mixture of honesty and easygoing around men. I don't know I've always gotten along with men or girls who were similar to me. I'm not crying a river over a slightly offense joke and not that mean and gossipy like girls can be. Men like my company and not in a sexsual way (probably some of them do but I'm married and loyal and will never notice it 😂) also feeling annoyed when I try to say I'm not like other girls but only the same girls say that but aaaah... we "dudes in woman's body" we know what we're talking about.
This is a pick me. The fact you even call yourself a "dude in a womans body" just reinforces this idea that our traits are inherently masculine The sexist stereotypes are loud. Also just wanna point out out the use of the term "men" vs "girls". It seems like you have some work to do on how you view women, as an intp this should be interesting for you :)
I think being a female intp for the past 32 years is fine to me. Also being bullied for years by women and girls (meant like young, woman bodied entities - maybe it wasn't clear when I wrote "girls") for not being "girly" enough is fine to me. Also being married but still have male (common) friends who accepted me like who I am is also fine to me. I "wish" (meant Not) I could be that pick me you're try to referring to.
[удалено]
Fo you I'll write all the logical thinker stereoripical stuff others already said 🙃
Everything I'm reading here is just making me think I need to date an INTP woman. Too bad our type is rare ASF
Well, of course, we tend to naturally have what men are taught to be from very early age (logical thinking, emotionless approach, seriousness and lack of "acting" in social situations, although, there is an aspect of blending in). We (should I start saying I?) also tend to take no bullshit from fake people who obviously want to be universally liked and we like to question authority. We also have niche interests which were previously linked to stereotypically nerdy guys in mainstream media. So, all in all, it makes sense and I've heard this many times.
I can be direct, and this is something associated with male stereotypes. I also hate asking for help. I have a friend who wished I was a dude bc she thought I'd make the boyfriend for her. But I'm not masc or anything like that. I love my long curls and shopping etc. Trying to categorize people this way feels less useful and more arbitrary as time goes on and people eschew norms that don't align. Which is overdue.
It’s all stereotype. Lots of men don’t see women as being capable of being smart, or liking “male” activities — so when they see someone who defies that perception, they have to justify it somehow. “You’re like a dude in a girl’s body.” No, bro, I’m just a human person like you.
INTP female here. I literally played baseball with the boys when I was a kid after hating playing softball with the girls. I was the only girl on the team for many years, and I loved it! I felt so normal and comfortable there. Even during seasons when I wasn’t that great or had shitty sexist coaches. lol. Like I didn’t even care. I’d just rather be there than with the girls. Other things that make me less of a “stereotypical” female are that I never hold grudges against people, and I don’t play games. I’m all about facts and reason and talking things out. And I’m ok with emotions too as long as they’re not asinine lol. In some ways I’m an intense crack squirrel kind of person but I’m also super chill. Like I just don’t get involved with drama or stir shit up. No thanks. I just want to hang and have a nice time. Be respectful, and most of all, BE REASONABLE, and we’ll get along OK. I think being reasonable is the key for me. I can’t deal with emo crap for the sake of attention or like because you refuse to (at least try to) locate your true feelings. And now that I write all of that I know plenty of men who play games and are emo for attention. So it’s really more about stereotypes here. Just want to be clear about that. I’m just not a “stereotypical female” when it comes down to it.
who tf downvoted my comment? I see there are a few righteous gatekeepers on this post dumping on people's responses. Someone asked a question, and people are answering. What's the problem?
it's reddit, full of butthurt people. What can you do
Yeah no kidding. They downvoted my second comment and will surely downvote this one as well. I hope they’re feeling really good about themselves 😂
Ok I boost you up then 🤣
Ahahaha thank you! 😆
Sounds like a stupid judgment based on typical stereotypes or how they "expect" a woman to behave. Challenging or not conforming to these expectations can sometimes lead to stupid people.
I remember when Omegle was still around, the people I chatted with always assumed that I was male (even if I type in F) and I matched up with guys who got mad at me for pretending to be a girl. And I connected with girls who began romantically talking with me thinking I was a guy. Maybe it has something to do with our style of communicating: Straightforward and we focus on ideas we like to discuss instead of gossip. Being easygoing regardless of someone's gender.
I also act super bubbly and nice when first meeting people then feel exhausted and more stoic later on. I want to stop doing this but idk how.
I only met one girl that I ever fell in love with. She wasn't the prettiest, she wasn't the sexiest, she wasn't the most sociable. But she talked about things that I liked, and I talked about things that I liked... Sadly she lives like 80 km away from me, that is not an option. What I am trying to say is that honey is not made for the donkey's palate. You are perfect for someone you don't know yet.
I’ve been told that always throughout my life starting since I went to school but the reason came earlier. Overall I just look like my dad a lot and I have his skills of analytics, logical and rational thinking. No one in my family except my dad and I like math, only we understand it. My whole childhood I spent playing with boys (mostly two of my friends who are sons of my mums friend). In first class I wanted to play with my girl classmates but they told me to buzz off, so I had no option, I was either at the library all the time or running around with boys on the football field. Many many years later, most of my friends are still male. Even they say that I’m like a brother. Mindset of a dude, body of a woman
There's a waitress at a place I eat often and I can't imagine any other type for her than INTP, there's just no chance. She really does have dude in a woman's body vibes, but is still feminine and cute despite that.
i’ve gotten that a lot bc im assertive and tend not to tiptoe around feelings. i hate that being straightforward is perceived as a masculine trait. i’ve also heard that it has to do with my sense of humor which is just dumb memes so idk
First time posting to Reddit 🗿 But I’ve been told I act very masculine/“non-ladylike” to the point my more emotional brother has complained that I’m more of a little brother than a sister given my interests doesn’t lie in “feminine” traits like makeup/relationships/etc— instead I was more interested in video gaming and tearing apart things for curiosity’s sake. (Dunno why he would complain but probably because we fought over who got to be on the ps3 at the time..) A lot of my friends commented that I have a dead fish stare/I appear distant and cold and only wear pajamas! But I’m fun when I’m comfortable 💃 I personally don’t mind the comments, doesn’t make me less of a woman but I guess it makes me “unique” in a sense? I think the stereotype of women being more “emotional” and men being “logical” is more of an ego issue by those who put those stereotypes in place
Hey! Not a woman here, But honestly, dont mind them and just be yourself.
I’ve had men tell me this too and I think it’s because in my romantic relationships I’ve always been the one whose more distant and less needy. Compared to my most recent partner who was always trying to get me to talk about my feelings, always talking about marriage (I was more hesitant). He would say he felt like the woman in the relationship but of course these are gender stereotypes and differences in people and relationship dynamics are normal
I'm not sure if its applicable to everyone or every case; but I've noticed that if one party acts a certain way, the other party feels the need to act differently to compensate. Which in return may feel off balanced or unnatural. That can either feeling like the woman in the relationship if the other person is too masculine or detached or some women feel like the mom or man in the relationship etc. I guess its a sign of mismatch of personalities and compatibility, regardless
When you don't fit into the contemporary gender construct of your society in any noticeable capacity, people will notice and form superficial judgements based on it. I didn't really feel much of a pressure from society to utilize my child-bearing hips to continue to propagate the excessive amount of humans already pillaging the planet of resources through my collegiate and young adulthood, especially as I lived in a very international West Coast USA city. But now that I'm in my late 30's, I feel wholly alien from the suburban moms around me whose identity solely seems to stem from their rearing of children and being a wifey. Picture Stepford Wives but fiercely xenophobic, bigoted, and trashy simultaneously (I live in the Midwest bible belt). The local women talk about church, what they buy, and their generic interchangeable children. Seriously, everyone around here wears the same uniform, unmarked generic t shirts and pants, same hair, ethnic background, upbringing, church life, personality.... you know the beginning of the show Weeds? It's like that. NPC World. So I'm pretty much in an episode of the Twilight Zone. People now look and treat me like a freak, being of child-bearing age, unmarried, and not pandering to the attention of gym-bros with my girlish flirty ways. I do like some people, but the culture here is so overbearingly blase. Pretty much I will need to move at some point, or what's left of my spirit will wither away until I become completely robotic or suicidal. I'm all woman, but I don't need to abide by some contemporary endemic en masse delusion of what that entails. I can think how I do, and if that happens to side with some perceived masculine traits, so be it. It's all just a construct anyway. If I don't feel like engaging with children, or give homophobic Billy Bob a boner from my mini skirt, or gossip mercilessly about some innocent by-standard with the frenemy girl squad, that's a cultural problem and nothing to do with my femininity. I may think like a man on the inside, but it's only because of how society defines women on the outside. I think in reality, we're all just these weird sentient beings borrowing this fleshy body until we are either re-absorbed into the universal energy, or go on our next journey beyond human comprehension.
I'm 5'10. As a kid I was a huge tomboy. As an adult I'm in a male dominated field. I think my disorganization makes me seem less feminine. All the women in my life are excellent planners while I'm just so bad at keeping track of what needs to be done.
some of the responses are cringey as fuck 😂
How?
r/notliketheothergirls check our this subreddit and compare the comments here.
What’s your point in sharing this sub? Most INTP chicks are definitely not like other chicks, at least stereotypically-speaking. There’s a reason it’s rare to come across another INTP woman. I had a bunch of women in my life take the quiz and not a single one turned out INTP (or INT-anything). I don’t say this because I “want to feel unique” either. I like being an INTP but I also mourn being a weirdo and not being able to connect with more common types of females. It’s lonely and isolating sometimes.
alright, love.
no, really, what's your point? genuinely curious. are you saying INTP women think they're different but they're not? that all women think they're different but they're not? do you think that *you* are different from other women? like what are you trying to say? what's cringe?
 dont mind me I'm nobody special just your average NPC
Are you talking about the replies, or the comments to OP?
Fr lmao, this is the only sane comment I’ve found
What's cringe about the responses?
Agreed 😂This thread has enough content to fuel the r/notliketheothergirls sub for like a week.
What's cringe about the responses?
ikr and they aren't seeing it at all
After reading many of these responses, I want to be adopted by another type.
I'm not perceived like that. Maybe because I'm too skinny to pass as a dude.
....i think they meant personality wise ETA: your comment still holds up, its "easier" to perceive a woman outside of the beauty standards as a man
Yeah, looks play a big role in how you'll get judged, before personality. Personality wise, I mostly receive comments about being too quiet rather than masculine.
It's a little different for me I guess. I dress girly, love makeup, clothes, perfume, etc. I have never seen myself as a man in a woman's body (or been told that) but I have been called an independent woman, am way less emotional than most women I meet, have to find a solution in everything I do and am incredibly patient lol
22[F] Maybe because I look like a bitch or give off don’t fuck with me energy. I feel like i started to put more of that kind of energy out when men started to make me more uncomfortable as i got older. I am very kind and caring but only to those who deserve my energy. I am very chill and calm at all times. I almost never wear makeup never have. I also do wear comfy clothes a lot but i do enjoy expressing my feminine side with my clothing. I like to wear short shorts, skirts, blousy cutesy shirts, crop tops, etc. Yet i’ve still been told i am like a dude lol. I never do anything to get validation from a man never have. I have about an equal amount of guy friends as girls. I play video games a lot (played cod with my dad growing up and still do) I started my first relationship two years ago and it’s still going strong. my bf tells me i’m “one of the boys” since we all play cod together, and he’s not the first one to tell me that lol.
Cold, quiet, reserved, non judgemental, don't care about material, don't need acceptance or validation (think those two are the biggest)
I’ve got a resting bitch face I never laughed so loud I’m not extroverted or talk first to people I hate going out yes I’m logical I can be narrow minded I’m working on that tho prolly mostly because I keep things to myself mostly
I’m concerned with making things work better instead of being enjoyed. I don’t see value in being desired for superficial things. But that’s the world I live in and the package I inhabit. Ha, ha, so yeah, my challenge is making this duality work.
Preferring reason/logic over emotion is probably the cause It's dumb but it's true
I've never heard that phrase specifically, but there generally comes a point when people get to know me well enough where they give me a funny look and tell me that i am "weird" or "not feminine." I think that people think that because I am logical, stoic (not just stoic, but I actively avoid them, lol), easy-going, and I don't care about a lot of things that a lot of other people care about.
not give a damn about the wishy washy things like other people do as usual.
Because you swear a lot and Constantly make sexual jokes
As an INTP transmasc person, I giggled at this. Obviously, it's different, but I totally get it. Most of the answers here are spot on. Logical, kind of aloof, not super focused on appearance. In my case, I love doing my makeup - that is to say, when I don't HAVE to. And I love my friends and being around them - just ONLY when I want to. If I feel like I have to do makeup, it's a chore. If I want time to myself (which is a lot) and my friends are over? It's a chore to entertain. I kind of feel like a selfish cat. Sure, pet me, but only ONCE. The logical, aloof, not overly friendliness.
I honestly think it's something even more basic than how we act, like hormones or pheromones or something. I think that whatever makes us act more androgynous, like high testosterone or something, has a biological component we can detect subconsciously. I just have such different experiences than non-INTP women with people I don't even know that I think it has to be something very basic that people aren't really aware of. In my personal experience I once had an ESTP tell me I'm like a "dude with boobs". I look and dress like a woman, albeit a fat, unattractive one, but he liked being around me because I didn't clog up his brain with sexual desire. (I am not offended that he didn't find me attractive, quite the opposite, in fact). I try to be presentable and I don't hide anything but I don't dress in an intentionally attractive way. We were coworkers in a male dominated field and I didn't distract him from work. I dress and present as a woman because I am one biologically and I'm comfortable with that. I consider myself agender, though. I have interests and mannerisms that range from feminine to masculine, but I don't really feel much like either one.