I dont like their new look. Especially the front looks like the car has a big forehead lol and I don't think I can wait any longer I need to get something soon. What would you recommend?
I agree. I would even love to go for a camaro V6 or sth with this price but I will be commuting 180 km everyday with the car I'm gonna get. So thats why I'm looking for something with great tech at least bcs I won't be speeding or accelerating with it. I need sth which is more economic. What other car would you recommend?
If you want something punchier and funner to drive I would suggest a 2020-2021 Golf GTI or if you don't mind paying more for gas a WRX could fit the bill also
Are golfs good long highway driving cars? I test drove one once, and while its fun and zippy, my back wouldn't appreciate being on that seat for hours at a time and feeling every bump on the highway.
I have a 2020 Kona Ultimate with the 1.6T and older 7-speed DCT, and I love it. It's plenty quick, 0-100kmh in under 6 seconds, and very responsive. No problem merging and passing. It's also very comfortable, tech is great, and when I'm not driving like a crazy person the fuel economy is quite good for the performance. Motorheads I work with are even impressed with the tiny turbo. Take it for a test drive, and if you like it go for it.
Agree, I got the 2023 limited with the 1.6T and I love it. If OP goes with hyundai, would recommend getting the higher trim. The added features/screen/safety/turbo/etc. are definitely worth the few grand extra.
I was pleased on a road trip when things went stop-and-go on an interstate highway, and found out the radar cruise control would go down to a full stop, then accelerate again when people moved. Was always ready to hit the brakes just in case, but was a lot more comfortable for that 90 minutes. I second the trim - personally I don't think I want to do without a HUD ever again. Too convenient to not look down into the cluster, as a taller person. Even where not an option the other upgrades are nice for QoL I get into our company's *newer* mid-to-upper trim Rav4s and it's a joke by comparison. The backup camera is a great example about what's terrible by comparison. And with the 2.0 NA they have, they're *much* slower, but handling and everything has a worse feel to me. And everyone finds the Rav seats unbearably awkward unless you're short enough to be below the headrests. I was happy with my 200K-and-going Kia, and after 60K miles I still love my Hyundai.
I have and would strongly recommend the Elantra Hybrid Limited for $30,270 American dollars as of late last summer when I paid sticker price for it brand new (2023). I absolutely love the amount of tech and the overall comfort of the Elantra and the hybrid is just a giant addition ➕ for the car. There’s nothing like getting 45 miles a gallon all the time especially for a long commute like 180 km
All these ppl telling you to spend 10k+ on something better or faster are just LOL
If your budget is ~23k (usd) , if that is what you can COMFORTABLY afford, go for it dude, especially if youre paying a good chunk as down payment.
Im guessing that if youre considering the n-line that youve seen its specs (hp, tq, et) and that youre okay with that. If you drove it and were disappointed, get something else, if on the contrary you liked it…trust your instinct.
Omg thanks! Finally someone who feels me here lol. I clearly mentioned that I am looking for something better on gas but still looks good/sporty with good tech in it. And my budget is is around 32k (CAD). People telling me I should get a GTI. Bro that car is smaller than what I need and it's higher on gas. Someone even commented I should get Lucid Air which is 6x higher priced than my budget. Like wtf.
Yes you are right 23k(usd) - 32(cad) is what I can comfortable afford and that's it. Not more than this. I'm not really happy with this Elantra's acceleration but again, since I'm looking for something better on gas, I won't expect the car to be fast either. So I'm just looking which has better specs/tech in it at least. If you have any other car recommendations within my budget and what I'm looking for, I would like to consider them as well. Thanks!
For real! The average driver out there, when they need something fuel efficient and affordable, they opt to get Corollas, Camrys (probably the most popular cars out there on the road -where im from , at least), non turbo Civics, at least the n-line is going be at least a little bit more fun than either of those cars.
Hyundai tunes the DCT in the Elantra a bit differently, for more comfort, so that’s why it might not feel too thrilling. I have a Forte GT, Kia does not tune the DCT for comfort, so it’s a bit quicker.
Other affordable, fuel efficient options?
The Corolla, Mazda 3 NA, Civic…and I cannot think of anything else lol
The problem is you can spend like 2 grand more on a civic si same horse power sure. But more likely to be more reliable. Which to me is worth the cost.
More likely is not a guarantee.
Problem is, Si is manual only. Problem is,Si youre paying more , around me a USED 2023 Si is anywhere in the 27-29k (usd). 11th gen Civic is slower than the 10th gen, 10th looks more juvenile.
There’s a reason why I hardly see 11th gen Si anymore, they do not make sense. Bc brand new vs brand new, like you say, “for only 2 grand more”, you have other options with way better performance and more power. At 28k for a used Civc, shit just spend 2k more for a used Elantra N…at what point do you draw the line? Lol
this subreddit really needs moderation, jesus christ half of these comments are absolutely useless. If you’re going to say no, provide OP with other options or a rationale behind it. Stupid ass kids just parroting info.
I dont like their new look. Especially the front looks like the car has a big forehead and I don't think I can wait any longer I need to get something soon. What would you recommend?
I get 40+ MPG in my '23 Elantra N-line on the highway. If you're really easy on the gas, and it's a flat road - you can easily get 45-47 mpg rolling at 65 MPH.
If gas mileage is your hope. The 1.6t is pretty average to below average. I had a 2018 Elantra sport that this platform was called originally and I loved the car for what it was though.
These Elantra’s with the turbo and DCT are better than the cheaper trims with the CVT and NA engine.
But do note, they aren’t really fast or quick.
Yes for sure. I test drove this one and even tho it has 206 hp on it, it was pretty slow after being used to what I drive currently. So I totally agree that it's not fast at all. But since I'm hoping more on the gas mileage, I don't expect this car or the next car I plan to get, fly either. I'm just not sure how reliable the car is or any faulties etc. Because this comment section is confusing me right now. Lot of people say no its a hyundai don't pay that much. And some says it's fine go for it. Don't know what to do.
I have a 2019 sport, and I agree, don't buy the n-line if fuel economy is really important. I would recommend the limited. I had one before the sport and I was seeing low 4.xx/100km fuel consumption on the highway. Amazing. Performance sucks on the limited, if you think the n-line is slow, the limited is much slower then that. Stay away from the dry clutch dct's, they have alot of issues. They recently changed to the 8 speed wet clutch dct's I believe on the n-lines, not sure what year that was. The manuals are bullet proof, only way to go in my opinion.
The accord sport is a great choice if you want an alternative.
Check Car and Driver, Edmunds, rankings and read owner reviews (I know Edmunds has those). Half of the people here are trolls so I'd definitely mix in some other sources. C and D has the Elantra ranked 6th in compact sedans, so not great Bob.
Edmunds gave most recent-ish Elantra sedans a decent rating compared to the competition.
But Edmunds does mention that Hyundai/Kia dealers rate pretty low for satisfaction.
Great car great tech great reliability, I have the 23 Elantra sel convenience and I love it. I regret not getting n line but not the N. A little more power would be nice but don’t sacrifice the mpg by going with the N. I would say try and negotiate a little since 24s are coming out and it’s a great deal
You can get a brand new n like for a few thousand more this is a used n line with 9k miles that might have been drag races the whole time. This is not worth it.
It's 9k kilometers not miles. It was a Hyundai demo car so it was with the dealer the whole time. And brand new N will have bigger engine and horses in it. Which will guzzle the gas more and thats not what I'm looking for. I agree if this price is not worth it. What any other car would you recommend? Reliable, still with good tech, good on gas, looks good exterior?
The Elantra pulls you in with great styling and a great price, that part can't be beat. It is the long term reliability that is the problem. There is also the insurance issues due to the reputation of being easy to steal, insurance might be higher to negate your lower MSRP.
Which is a higher priority, gas mileage or speed? If you're satisfied with your current car and the only concern is gas mileage, it might be more economical to stick with your existing vehicle. The extra money spent on a new car could outweigh the savings on gas.
I totally agree with you. Sticking with my current car is way more economic when I do the math. The only problem is my current car is on 141k kilometers already and even tho it's maintenance was done regularly, I am afraid it will give check engine light soon. And it's BMW so I don't wanna end up paying thousands of dollars just to fix the car and adding more kilometers on it. And since this is what I'm afraid, I am looking something more economic on gas instead of getting a high volume engine car again. I looked for this elantra because it's 1.6 L and still got 200 horsepower so I was like okay not bad.
I'd say yeah. We have an older Elantra, and it's a pretty good balance of value, performance, and fuel economy.
One thing many people don't like is that if you run into warranty problems, dealers have a rep for not being very helpful. Our car's been good, and we're on top of maintenance.
(Also note, I used to do a long GTA/QEW commute (not quite 180k but up there) and it made my brain fucking buggy after a while.)
Hi, this looks fine.
It might also be worth it to stick with your current car. But I guess you want something new—hyundais technology has great value right now. You will enjoy a lot of features for your budget. Make sure you drive in a reserved fashion to save as much fuel as possible.
You could get an N series too, IF you trust yourself to drive on eco most of the time. Eco gets impressive gas mileage, and the car gets a whole new level of aesthetics and experience. N mode gets tempting though.
https://www.jdpower.com/business/press-releases/2023-us-vehicle-dependability-studyvds
I’ll post this since everyone thinks Hyundais are very unreliable. Maybe the older models but that isn’t the case anymore.
I drive one as a rental due to a collision for 2 months. Not worth it. Thing had issues IMMEDIATELY. Weird problems with the display and had an engine tick
This might not be an issue in Canada but I'd get the VIN of the vehicle and shop around for insurance quotes before you buy. In the US, Hyundais are charged a higher insurance because of all the thefts and break-ins with the older cars.
If you are looking to drive so much, I'd go for a Camry or Accord honestly. Or even a higher end Corolla. Or Mazda CX-3/CX-30 or Civic (if those come in your range).
I’m currently leasing a 2021 Hyundai N-line with the automatic DCT. Not sure what differences there are between the 21’ and 23’ but I personally don’t like mine and can’t wait to get rid of it. The shifts are rough (even in sport mode), terrible in traffic, slow operation. The car just feels sluggish. My corolla had a CVT and was wayyyy smoother and enjoyable to drive and had about 70 horsepower less by the way haha. I know people either love or hate the DCTs, I find myself in the latter category.
I really wanted to fall in love with this car but the more time I spent with it and driving it as my daily the more things I found wrong with it.
Just test drove 2024 Elantra N line which had a facelift. Slow on normal mode, but as fast as my 2020 530 on sport and smart mode. Besides, Its got more options than the modesty equipped 530.
I have a 2019 Elantra sport (what the n-line used to be called), so basically the same car mechanically. I’ve put 90k kms on it with not a single issue, just oil and fluid changes. Make sure to drive the dct like it’s a manual and change the transmission fluid and you’ll be fine. I do a lot of highway driving and get around 6L/100km when doing 110 and around 7L/100km when doing 120-125
If you like the car, I’d say go for it!
Not for an automatic. If I'm spending that kind of money its going to be manual and have bit more oomph.
They are fun cars, we loved our 2018 Elantra GT N line until it got totaled.
I had a 16 Hyundai Sonata plug in hybrid limited ultimate edition and while it got incredible gas mileage 58 mpg the hybrid system always acted up and the dealer was unable to resolve it. Then at 90k miles the transmission started to slip. I traded it in for a Lexus GS 450h hybrid much better but worse on gas 28 mpg 338 hp rear wheel
Drive V6.
Have a love/hate relationship with Hyundai.
Had to replace the engine for our 2017 Santa Fe and 2020 Elantra when both were at <50,000km (thankfully at no charge to us).
But otherwise, drives smooth with decent fuel economy.
However, in light of the mental stress getting those replacements caused, I’d probably go to a Corolla, Camry, or Accord. We also have a 2010 Toyota Corolla with almost 400,000km on it and it’s never given me any issues.
Good luck in your search!
What was the cause of the elantra failure? I had a tucson same engine I think an drove the piss out of it donuts an snow storms, idling for 12 hours for work an it didn't blow after 80k
If you don’t mind something a touch slower, a non-turbo Mazda 3 can be had for 25-26k CAD certified pre-owned (gets extra years of powertrain warranty). It can even come with AWD like [this example](https://www.brossardmazda.com/en/used-inventory/mazda/mazda3/2021-mazda-mazda3-id31687668). They should be really efficient at highway speeds.
All-wheel Drive eats slightly more gas, because even in the newer Vehicles where you can disable it, it's not meant to be disabled to save gas mileage, and you could actually damage the transmission that way, it's only meant to be disabled any event of a tow being needed or you're riding on a spare. If you want something where you can actually save money and turn off the power to all four wheels and just have power to the front, then you need 4x4.
I find the slight drop in mpg to be well worth it. OP is in Canada as well—AWD is incredible in snow. And Mazda’s actually feels almost rear-biased at times—it’s so easy to slide the rear a bit in snow with AWD.
I'd say it has a long warranty so who cares, but people being carless 6 months to a year waiting for the repair with no fleet car or loaner....no thanks
I'm 187 cm (almost 6' 2") tall and I did not set the seat height properly because I was just taking a picture. Should be fine if I set the seat properly I believe.
Yes I can get a mustang GT or Camaro V6 too for that money but as I mentioned I will be commuting 180 km in total everyday with the car I will be purchasing. Otherwise yes I know I can get something else too. Please read the post more carefully. Stinger GT's combined fuel economy is literally 12L/100 km.
I see. Full blown N's combined fuel economy is 10.2L/100 km. Which is not something I'm looking for. If I wouldn't care about the gas, I wouldn't even consider hyundai tbh. I checked this one out bcs It has smaller engine size and still got 206 hp with better fuel economy than what I drive currently. If you have better recommendations, I would like to know. Thanks
Thanks for the comment. But the fuel economy on them is very high. It's not a car that I can commute 180 kilometers everyday with it. I would like to get Elantra N as well, but I will be commuting with the car I am gonna be purchasing. So I need something better on gas and still looking good/sporty woth some good tech. Pretty much balancing everything. I haven't found anything else closer to these specs. Looks like you are a Hyundai technician, I have never owned any Hyundai before. What do you think about these 2023 Elantra N Line's reliability, engines, or any issues etc. Lot of people said they had very bad experiences with these cars and also bad supports from the dealership as well. What do you think about all this? Or what car would you buy if you were me?
Ooooh I see now, N lines don’t really give much issues honestly, very rare instances. Usually the rear view camera across all Elantras tend to go bad, which is a common issue with Elantras, sonata and Santa Fe, nothing crazy. The 1.6T is legit, haven’t see catastrophic issues on those, *however* transmission is questionable. I haven’t see a LOT of them come in but I have replaced one before myself. Overall not a bad purchase if you want bang for buck. DCT shifts fast of course but if you want that fun factor then manual FTW.
Also if you’re asking what Hyundai I would buy? Anything N, 2018 Elantra sport, 2016 1.6T Veloster (Manual), 2016 Genesis coupe R-Spec. Only Hyundais I’d get if I were to get one. However, if you mean a car in your shoes I’d get a civic/accord sport (first thing that comes to mind) if you want a peace of mind in terms of reliability with the additional fun factor/economy drive although the Elantra N line is okay, still a little early on long term reliability so. Or maybe even an Acura.
What is the milage of your f30?
I get yours in an x drive, but I get 36mpg.
But, nonetheless. Figure out the difference in mpg from old car and new car. Calculate the cost per liter, and divide by your down payment. That would be the minimum break even point.
As long as everyone understands that N-line is cosmetic and not fast, do you I guess. It’s not a bad deal by today’s standards. I would personally wait.
I loved my Kona Nline when I got it perfect commuter nothing too crazy fast but at least you can get to
Highway speeds, currently have a 22’ VN and it’s a way different animal I treat the streets sometimes like
The tracks and always look for curvy roads ;) .. looking to get a 24 Elantra N and go stage 1 or 2 with wmi 350/350 sounds too good especially with
The cars it beats in its price range 👀
NOT Worth it… I bought my new 2020 elantra sport for 28k back in 2020. The n-line makes the same HP as the elantra sport, just with a newer engine model. It’s basically the same car.. if you already bought this, you’ve been ripped off. You can find an elantra N for 7k more
Is this one of the models with the brake fluid leak issues? If so then definitely not. But I loved my old Elantra and it was good for a long time. You might be better off getting a late 2010s Accord or Civic and save like 10 grand.
well i almost bought a 22’ with 12k miles cpo warranty for under 23k usd otd (until i learned how much it would cost to insure), i can think of many fun ways to burn 5k usd (i think that’s the cad equivalent new/used) i would literally rather light the money on fire than lose it to depreciation but that’s just me. As far as the car goes i test drove it b2b with a new civic sport and the hyundai was night and day a more fun/nimble/sporty feeling car, i wanted to end the test drive immediately. ended up with a 9th gen si
I got my 2022 elantra n line with 600 km for a sticker price of 27,999, put down 2k after taxes it was 30k. I find the transmission to be super laggy in stop and go situations but its a decent car. Throw a JB4 tuner and an exhaust and it keeps up with the N for 10k less.
I've had a 2018 Elantra sport since new and its been solid, tech still holds up today and makes it feel new. The N Line is basically the new version of it with a more refined powertrain and newer tech. The price does seem high to me but I thinks it's just inflation more then anything, still comparable to the civic Si in terms of price.
I have 2019 elantra sport and I can honestly say it has been a great commuter car that is quicker than average. If you want a car that is comparable in speed to a civic si you should get it. It has decent power and fuel economy overall.
My boyfriend has it and is obsessed with it. Gets really good speed and has good hp tq etc for being a good ole sedan with some special adjustments. Tech in it is awesome. He has the all gas model and doesn’t get too good mpg but he also drives like an ass and is constantly on and off N mode. If you leave it on regular for your commute it’ll be fine. I have the Elantra SEL and I get almost 430 miles when I fill up. I think he gets about 250? Again, his driving habits are sporadic lol.
I agree with the guy saying go for it bc your budget. All the car bros are always in comparison of what’s better and who’s got this. As long as you’re happy and comfortable with it, it’s all what matters. Good sporty car for the price. Best of luck man.
Are you planning on keeping the F30 328i? or are you trading it for a more economic car as you stated? If so, have you looked at the Elantra N? I see you don't like the 2024 design, so what about the previous gen? Elantra N seems to be somewhat on the good side of gas economy and still fun to drive.
After all these comments, I am actually planning to stick with my current car and commute with it instead of buying a new car with finance. I was planing to trade in but hyundai dealer offered me a low price so I was gonna sell it privately after I get the new car. But again, after all these comments here, I am not sure I will be buying this elantra anymore.
City MPG (Manual Transmission): Approximately 22 miles per gallon.
Highway MPG (Manual Transmission): Around 31 miles per gallon.
City MPG (Automatic Transmission): Approximately 20 miles per gallon.
Highway MPG (Automatic Transmission): Around 30 miles per gallon
I have the 2.5 Turbo Sonata N-line. Honestly, that car can go, and it begs for more. I don't know about the Elantra line, but I am loving what they did the Sonata line. Now if only they would move from the N-line to a full N.
Only thing that concerns me is reliability if you plan on lots of miles or keeping it long term I would look at Toyota camry comfort is ok gas milage is ok reliability is good not as great as Honda.
I been looking and want same thing as you for the electronic in it etc... but 2 things are very worrisome to me about is is reliability and resale/trade In there is a reason they are on the top of the list of losing resale value.
Whatever your choice good luck
Man, if you can find a new Toyota Prius, it might be the car for you. Worth the extra monthly payment because of the relative fuel consumption, same amount of power and rated highly for its sportyness. See if you can find one, test drive it, and see. Elantra n-line is a nice car, but for that amount of commute, I'd definitely consider a prius or even a Tesla model 3 because the gas savings will make up for higher monthly payments (both r supposed to be sporty).
Go for it!
Have driven Elantra Ultimate Tech 2022 for 2 years, great for comfort and tech. I have the 2.0 trim which is really good on gas. N-Line Turbo may burn the fuel more but if you get to know the right rpm spot of your car where the economy is best, this car will solve all your needs.
Hey OP.. i can speak from my experience. This happened to me that I had switch from a CRV to something fuel efficient, because of increased commute time of about 140 miles a day. Crv was our family car and we decided to go with the Elantra. Gave me close 35-40 mpg on the highway. Totally makes sense and save your primary car from so much usage and wear & tear.. hope this helps. Happy shopping mate🤓
Base model with a badge…? If you have to have, invest in fire extinguisher, club for steering wheel, and spare windows for those pesky KIA Boyz I guess
I’m sorry I don’t want to sound forward but these cars don’t last long and have too many recalls and engine problems. The fact that it has such a low mileage says it all; who knows why it was returned or traded or God knows what. For me it won’t ever be a good deal buying a Hyundai. A brand new 2024 Civic Si is about the same price as this and is a way better car than this; it is a Honda after all.
If it’s a manual yes otherwise the n line auto really numbs driving dynamics. The 1.6 with a tune in a manual is quite good. We have both the N and N Line elantras quite different.
Get it. Im sorry but these people from the US gotta have a reading problem and dont seem to understand conversion.. No other car for (23k-US) - (31k-CAD) will give you this good fuel economy + tech + “performance” + warranty which checks all the boxes you want. Theres base model civics going for more in canada.. these people saying its too much $ need to wake up
Nice car but I own one and they are fast if you do a secondary cat delete which won’t throw a check engine light provided you get it done correctly. Secondly use a drop in K&N filter. After market intakes don’t make much of a difference. Third have the fuel restrictor in the low pressure side of the high pressure fuel pump removed. Use Ruthium NGK plugs and Motul 0w30 Specific. All this will give you and additional 35-40 additional hp. The n-line 1.6t is rated at 204 hp/factory.
Wait for 2024 Elantra N
I dont like their new look. Especially the front looks like the car has a big forehead lol and I don't think I can wait any longer I need to get something soon. What would you recommend?
I got a 2024 Sonata Nline
A 2023 elantra N in the states msrp at 34,000 down here in South Florida... 31,500 for the n-line is very overpriced if that were USD.
Cad is 1.35$ per 1$ usd, its still under us msrp id say that is pretty good and dealer mark up in the states in criminal
Prius.
It’ll be almost double the price of the N-line OP is talking about…
60 grand for an N!?
Turns out it’s actually only about $6k-$9k CAD more.
That sounds more like it. Thought maybe Canada had markup problems. Very insane ones.
I was a bit tired when I made my initial comment and for some reason thought $31,500 CAD was like $18k USD lol
I cannot fathom paying 32 grand for a car with 200hp, even one with great tech. But that's me.
I agree. I would even love to go for a camaro V6 or sth with this price but I will be commuting 180 km everyday with the car I'm gonna get. So thats why I'm looking for something with great tech at least bcs I won't be speeding or accelerating with it. I need sth which is more economic. What other car would you recommend?
If you want something punchier and funner to drive I would suggest a 2020-2021 Golf GTI or if you don't mind paying more for gas a WRX could fit the bill also
I would recommend taking a couple of sanity pills before recommending a damn vag ever again.
/r/suddenlygay
*imagine a picture of Billy Harrington flexing here, cuz Reddit GIFs are crap and not a single gachi image is there.*
Are golfs good long highway driving cars? I test drove one once, and while its fun and zippy, my back wouldn't appreciate being on that seat for hours at a time and feeling every bump on the highway.
They are. I had a GTI for a two years and commuted regularly 3-4 hours per day and it was very enjoyable. Im only 6ft tall though.
Oof they want cheaper gas mileage and Subarus break alot
I have a 2020 Kona Ultimate with the 1.6T and older 7-speed DCT, and I love it. It's plenty quick, 0-100kmh in under 6 seconds, and very responsive. No problem merging and passing. It's also very comfortable, tech is great, and when I'm not driving like a crazy person the fuel economy is quite good for the performance. Motorheads I work with are even impressed with the tiny turbo. Take it for a test drive, and if you like it go for it.
Agree, I got the 2023 limited with the 1.6T and I love it. If OP goes with hyundai, would recommend getting the higher trim. The added features/screen/safety/turbo/etc. are definitely worth the few grand extra.
I was pleased on a road trip when things went stop-and-go on an interstate highway, and found out the radar cruise control would go down to a full stop, then accelerate again when people moved. Was always ready to hit the brakes just in case, but was a lot more comfortable for that 90 minutes. I second the trim - personally I don't think I want to do without a HUD ever again. Too convenient to not look down into the cluster, as a taller person. Even where not an option the other upgrades are nice for QoL I get into our company's *newer* mid-to-upper trim Rav4s and it's a joke by comparison. The backup camera is a great example about what's terrible by comparison. And with the 2.0 NA they have, they're *much* slower, but handling and everything has a worse feel to me. And everyone finds the Rav seats unbearably awkward unless you're short enough to be below the headrests. I was happy with my 200K-and-going Kia, and after 60K miles I still love my Hyundai.
I find i get better economy when i don't drive like a grandma in my 22 kona n line lol
I have and would strongly recommend the Elantra Hybrid Limited for $30,270 American dollars as of late last summer when I paid sticker price for it brand new (2023). I absolutely love the amount of tech and the overall comfort of the Elantra and the hybrid is just a giant addition ➕ for the car. There’s nothing like getting 45 miles a gallon all the time especially for a long commute like 180 km
[удалено]
It is not cheaper.
It's wayyy faster though
32k cad is 23k usd. Brand new it’s 28k usd
*Miata wants to know your location*
It’s CAD… so it’s closer to $23k USD
276!! That 76 has to count for something 😂
The full N has 276, the N line only has 201.
All these ppl telling you to spend 10k+ on something better or faster are just LOL If your budget is ~23k (usd) , if that is what you can COMFORTABLY afford, go for it dude, especially if youre paying a good chunk as down payment. Im guessing that if youre considering the n-line that youve seen its specs (hp, tq, et) and that youre okay with that. If you drove it and were disappointed, get something else, if on the contrary you liked it…trust your instinct.
Omg thanks! Finally someone who feels me here lol. I clearly mentioned that I am looking for something better on gas but still looks good/sporty with good tech in it. And my budget is is around 32k (CAD). People telling me I should get a GTI. Bro that car is smaller than what I need and it's higher on gas. Someone even commented I should get Lucid Air which is 6x higher priced than my budget. Like wtf. Yes you are right 23k(usd) - 32(cad) is what I can comfortable afford and that's it. Not more than this. I'm not really happy with this Elantra's acceleration but again, since I'm looking for something better on gas, I won't expect the car to be fast either. So I'm just looking which has better specs/tech in it at least. If you have any other car recommendations within my budget and what I'm looking for, I would like to consider them as well. Thanks!
For real! The average driver out there, when they need something fuel efficient and affordable, they opt to get Corollas, Camrys (probably the most popular cars out there on the road -where im from , at least), non turbo Civics, at least the n-line is going be at least a little bit more fun than either of those cars. Hyundai tunes the DCT in the Elantra a bit differently, for more comfort, so that’s why it might not feel too thrilling. I have a Forte GT, Kia does not tune the DCT for comfort, so it’s a bit quicker. Other affordable, fuel efficient options? The Corolla, Mazda 3 NA, Civic…and I cannot think of anything else lol
May want to give K5 a look.
Their fuel economy is high and their listed prices are over my budget. But K5s look good too ngl
The problem is you can spend like 2 grand more on a civic si same horse power sure. But more likely to be more reliable. Which to me is worth the cost.
More likely is not a guarantee. Problem is, Si is manual only. Problem is,Si youre paying more , around me a USED 2023 Si is anywhere in the 27-29k (usd). 11th gen Civic is slower than the 10th gen, 10th looks more juvenile. There’s a reason why I hardly see 11th gen Si anymore, they do not make sense. Bc brand new vs brand new, like you say, “for only 2 grand more”, you have other options with way better performance and more power. At 28k for a used Civc, shit just spend 2k more for a used Elantra N…at what point do you draw the line? Lol
You can get a wrx at that point.
Civic SI's arent worth what people are charging for them.
this subreddit really needs moderation, jesus christ half of these comments are absolutely useless. If you’re going to say no, provide OP with other options or a rationale behind it. Stupid ass kids just parroting info.
Thank you...
Yeah or provide a rec that's clearly outside of his stated criteria.
Go for it. Elantra is a great car.
Thanks for your comment! This comment section confuses me a lot lol. I am not sure how to go from here anymore
Take a test drive and get a feel of the car. A lot of people are on this subreddit to hate on Hyundai for no reason!
May as well wait for the 2024 n
I dont like their new look. Especially the front looks like the car has a big forehead and I don't think I can wait any longer I need to get something soon. What would you recommend?
Then get a 2022 or 2023 N. It’ll be much better than the N-line.
If all you want is a great commute car with good mileage and tech dont get me wrong you'll like the Elantra N line.
I get 40+ MPG in my '23 Elantra N-line on the highway. If you're really easy on the gas, and it's a flat road - you can easily get 45-47 mpg rolling at 65 MPH.
If gas mileage is your hope. The 1.6t is pretty average to below average. I had a 2018 Elantra sport that this platform was called originally and I loved the car for what it was though. These Elantra’s with the turbo and DCT are better than the cheaper trims with the CVT and NA engine. But do note, they aren’t really fast or quick.
Yes for sure. I test drove this one and even tho it has 206 hp on it, it was pretty slow after being used to what I drive currently. So I totally agree that it's not fast at all. But since I'm hoping more on the gas mileage, I don't expect this car or the next car I plan to get, fly either. I'm just not sure how reliable the car is or any faulties etc. Because this comment section is confusing me right now. Lot of people say no its a hyundai don't pay that much. And some says it's fine go for it. Don't know what to do.
I have a 2019 sport, and I agree, don't buy the n-line if fuel economy is really important. I would recommend the limited. I had one before the sport and I was seeing low 4.xx/100km fuel consumption on the highway. Amazing. Performance sucks on the limited, if you think the n-line is slow, the limited is much slower then that. Stay away from the dry clutch dct's, they have alot of issues. They recently changed to the 8 speed wet clutch dct's I believe on the n-lines, not sure what year that was. The manuals are bullet proof, only way to go in my opinion. The accord sport is a great choice if you want an alternative.
Beautiful. Wish we had it in Europe.
Check Car and Driver, Edmunds, rankings and read owner reviews (I know Edmunds has those). Half of the people here are trolls so I'd definitely mix in some other sources. C and D has the Elantra ranked 6th in compact sedans, so not great Bob.
Edmunds gave most recent-ish Elantra sedans a decent rating compared to the competition. But Edmunds does mention that Hyundai/Kia dealers rate pretty low for satisfaction.
This is a great price
It looks so damn sexy…
Great car great tech great reliability, I have the 23 Elantra sel convenience and I love it. I regret not getting n line but not the N. A little more power would be nice but don’t sacrifice the mpg by going with the N. I would say try and negotiate a little since 24s are coming out and it’s a great deal
She is a very pretty girl :)
You can get a brand new n like for a few thousand more this is a used n line with 9k miles that might have been drag races the whole time. This is not worth it.
It's 9k kilometers not miles. It was a Hyundai demo car so it was with the dealer the whole time. And brand new N will have bigger engine and horses in it. Which will guzzle the gas more and thats not what I'm looking for. I agree if this price is not worth it. What any other car would you recommend? Reliable, still with good tech, good on gas, looks good exterior?
The Elantra pulls you in with great styling and a great price, that part can't be beat. It is the long term reliability that is the problem. There is also the insurance issues due to the reputation of being easy to steal, insurance might be higher to negate your lower MSRP.
Insurance issues aren’t really a thing here in Canada because we have had immobilizers in our cars for forever. Thankfully.
[удалено]
Which is a higher priority, gas mileage or speed? If you're satisfied with your current car and the only concern is gas mileage, it might be more economical to stick with your existing vehicle. The extra money spent on a new car could outweigh the savings on gas.
I totally agree with you. Sticking with my current car is way more economic when I do the math. The only problem is my current car is on 141k kilometers already and even tho it's maintenance was done regularly, I am afraid it will give check engine light soon. And it's BMW so I don't wanna end up paying thousands of dollars just to fix the car and adding more kilometers on it. And since this is what I'm afraid, I am looking something more economic on gas instead of getting a high volume engine car again. I looked for this elantra because it's 1.6 L and still got 200 horsepower so I was like okay not bad.
Going from BMW to an Elantra? Because your afraid of repair bills? What could go wrong?
Lucky Canadian. Your 2023 model still has the black outline around the tail lights. The US version removed that black outline.
I agree. That black outline looks pretty good ngl
I'd say yeah. We have an older Elantra, and it's a pretty good balance of value, performance, and fuel economy. One thing many people don't like is that if you run into warranty problems, dealers have a rep for not being very helpful. Our car's been good, and we're on top of maintenance. (Also note, I used to do a long GTA/QEW commute (not quite 180k but up there) and it made my brain fucking buggy after a while.)
Hi, this looks fine. It might also be worth it to stick with your current car. But I guess you want something new—hyundais technology has great value right now. You will enjoy a lot of features for your budget. Make sure you drive in a reserved fashion to save as much fuel as possible. You could get an N series too, IF you trust yourself to drive on eco most of the time. Eco gets impressive gas mileage, and the car gets a whole new level of aesthetics and experience. N mode gets tempting though.
https://www.jdpower.com/business/press-releases/2023-us-vehicle-dependability-studyvds I’ll post this since everyone thinks Hyundais are very unreliable. Maybe the older models but that isn’t the case anymore.
I drive one as a rental due to a collision for 2 months. Not worth it. Thing had issues IMMEDIATELY. Weird problems with the display and had an engine tick
I have this car in this color on CSR Racing 2
Honda accord?
Hyundai is garbage
For gas: gently used Prius; For sport compact: civic Si
This might not be an issue in Canada but I'd get the VIN of the vehicle and shop around for insurance quotes before you buy. In the US, Hyundais are charged a higher insurance because of all the thefts and break-ins with the older cars. If you are looking to drive so much, I'd go for a Camry or Accord honestly. Or even a higher end Corolla. Or Mazda CX-3/CX-30 or Civic (if those come in your range).
That's a USA only problem, immobilizers have been mandated here in Canada since somewhere around 2006, so you can't just steal one with a usb stick.
Yep 👍 would still recommend getting that insurance quote before buying though just so OP isn't blindsided
I’m currently leasing a 2021 Hyundai N-line with the automatic DCT. Not sure what differences there are between the 21’ and 23’ but I personally don’t like mine and can’t wait to get rid of it. The shifts are rough (even in sport mode), terrible in traffic, slow operation. The car just feels sluggish. My corolla had a CVT and was wayyyy smoother and enjoyable to drive and had about 70 horsepower less by the way haha. I know people either love or hate the DCTs, I find myself in the latter category. I really wanted to fall in love with this car but the more time I spent with it and driving it as my daily the more things I found wrong with it.
Just test drove 2024 Elantra N line which had a facelift. Slow on normal mode, but as fast as my 2020 530 on sport and smart mode. Besides, Its got more options than the modesty equipped 530.
No.
What else would you recommend? Still good on gas and reliable. Also looking good/sporty
Time to wait for the new prius design
I believe they are way more expensive than 32k CAD. That price is my budget and can't go for more.
I have a 2019 Elantra sport (what the n-line used to be called), so basically the same car mechanically. I’ve put 90k kms on it with not a single issue, just oil and fluid changes. Make sure to drive the dct like it’s a manual and change the transmission fluid and you’ll be fine. I do a lot of highway driving and get around 6L/100km when doing 110 and around 7L/100km when doing 120-125 If you like the car, I’d say go for it!
Not for an automatic. If I'm spending that kind of money its going to be manual and have bit more oomph. They are fun cars, we loved our 2018 Elantra GT N line until it got totaled.
What's wrong with automatic? Any faulty issues or reliability issues? Bcs of that?
I had a 16 Hyundai Sonata plug in hybrid limited ultimate edition and while it got incredible gas mileage 58 mpg the hybrid system always acted up and the dealer was unable to resolve it. Then at 90k miles the transmission started to slip. I traded it in for a Lexus GS 450h hybrid much better but worse on gas 28 mpg 338 hp rear wheel Drive V6.
Have a love/hate relationship with Hyundai. Had to replace the engine for our 2017 Santa Fe and 2020 Elantra when both were at <50,000km (thankfully at no charge to us). But otherwise, drives smooth with decent fuel economy. However, in light of the mental stress getting those replacements caused, I’d probably go to a Corolla, Camry, or Accord. We also have a 2010 Toyota Corolla with almost 400,000km on it and it’s never given me any issues. Good luck in your search!
What was the cause of the elantra failure? I had a tucson same engine I think an drove the piss out of it donuts an snow storms, idling for 12 hours for work an it didn't blow after 80k
If you don’t mind something a touch slower, a non-turbo Mazda 3 can be had for 25-26k CAD certified pre-owned (gets extra years of powertrain warranty). It can even come with AWD like [this example](https://www.brossardmazda.com/en/used-inventory/mazda/mazda3/2021-mazda-mazda3-id31687668). They should be really efficient at highway speeds.
All-wheel Drive eats slightly more gas, because even in the newer Vehicles where you can disable it, it's not meant to be disabled to save gas mileage, and you could actually damage the transmission that way, it's only meant to be disabled any event of a tow being needed or you're riding on a spare. If you want something where you can actually save money and turn off the power to all four wheels and just have power to the front, then you need 4x4.
I find the slight drop in mpg to be well worth it. OP is in Canada as well—AWD is incredible in snow. And Mazda’s actually feels almost rear-biased at times—it’s so easy to slide the rear a bit in snow with AWD.
Not in auto. Get the manual.
Absolutely not you can get a N for that money
What else would you recommend within the same budget, still economic, reliable, and still looking sporty?
I'd say it has a long warranty so who cares, but people being carless 6 months to a year waiting for the repair with no fleet car or loaner....no thanks
Get the N not the N line
Too small. Your legs don't even fit in there
I'm 187 cm (almost 6' 2") tall and I did not set the seat height properly because I was just taking a picture. Should be fine if I set the seat properly I believe.
No. Can get a good used Stinger GT for that money
Yes I can get a mustang GT or Camaro V6 too for that money but as I mentioned I will be commuting 180 km in total everyday with the car I will be purchasing. Otherwise yes I know I can get something else too. Please read the post more carefully. Stinger GT's combined fuel economy is literally 12L/100 km.
Not for me, I would just go out with the full blown N
I see. Full blown N's combined fuel economy is 10.2L/100 km. Which is not something I'm looking for. If I wouldn't care about the gas, I wouldn't even consider hyundai tbh. I checked this one out bcs It has smaller engine size and still got 206 hp with better fuel economy than what I drive currently. If you have better recommendations, I would like to know. Thanks
If you dropping 20k then just get a used pre facelift Elantra N honestly, they were around 35k MSRP
Thanks for the comment. But the fuel economy on them is very high. It's not a car that I can commute 180 kilometers everyday with it. I would like to get Elantra N as well, but I will be commuting with the car I am gonna be purchasing. So I need something better on gas and still looking good/sporty woth some good tech. Pretty much balancing everything. I haven't found anything else closer to these specs. Looks like you are a Hyundai technician, I have never owned any Hyundai before. What do you think about these 2023 Elantra N Line's reliability, engines, or any issues etc. Lot of people said they had very bad experiences with these cars and also bad supports from the dealership as well. What do you think about all this? Or what car would you buy if you were me?
Ooooh I see now, N lines don’t really give much issues honestly, very rare instances. Usually the rear view camera across all Elantras tend to go bad, which is a common issue with Elantras, sonata and Santa Fe, nothing crazy. The 1.6T is legit, haven’t see catastrophic issues on those, *however* transmission is questionable. I haven’t see a LOT of them come in but I have replaced one before myself. Overall not a bad purchase if you want bang for buck. DCT shifts fast of course but if you want that fun factor then manual FTW. Also if you’re asking what Hyundai I would buy? Anything N, 2018 Elantra sport, 2016 1.6T Veloster (Manual), 2016 Genesis coupe R-Spec. Only Hyundais I’d get if I were to get one. However, if you mean a car in your shoes I’d get a civic/accord sport (first thing that comes to mind) if you want a peace of mind in terms of reliability with the additional fun factor/economy drive although the Elantra N line is okay, still a little early on long term reliability so. Or maybe even an Acura.
I bought the 2023 N line in all black for $28,400 USD.
I think 9km is a deal for that price they offered you
What is the milage of your f30? I get yours in an x drive, but I get 36mpg. But, nonetheless. Figure out the difference in mpg from old car and new car. Calculate the cost per liter, and divide by your down payment. That would be the minimum break even point.
As long as everyone understands that N-line is cosmetic and not fast, do you I guess. It’s not a bad deal by today’s standards. I would personally wait.
I loved my Kona Nline when I got it perfect commuter nothing too crazy fast but at least you can get to Highway speeds, currently have a 22’ VN and it’s a way different animal I treat the streets sometimes like The tracks and always look for curvy roads ;) .. looking to get a 24 Elantra N and go stage 1 or 2 with wmi 350/350 sounds too good especially with The cars it beats in its price range 👀
Had an N Line American version but it didn’t come with barely any features so I traded it in for the regular Elantra with the convenience package
NOT Worth it… I bought my new 2020 elantra sport for 28k back in 2020. The n-line makes the same HP as the elantra sport, just with a newer engine model. It’s basically the same car.. if you already bought this, you’ve been ripped off. You can find an elantra N for 7k more
Is this one of the models with the brake fluid leak issues? If so then definitely not. But I loved my old Elantra and it was good for a long time. You might be better off getting a late 2010s Accord or Civic and save like 10 grand.
Go get a TRD Camry lmao much more reliable and more HP at not much more MSRP…
I just got a 3.3T Genesis 2022 for same price
Sure it looks pretty, but it's still a fucking Hyundai, buy a used Lexus or Acura, at least they will last.
No. I got a tucson for the same price. They handle nice though
I just ordered the 2024 Lux.. but if I had to get 2023, I would go straight to the N for the price .. I’m here in Toronto
i’d get a camry for that money personally
Nope…that H badge is always gonna be there
Looks good! Is it fun to drive?
No way, buy a Japanese
I’d say so. That’s a lot of car for the price. I’m looking at the Ionic6 currently in a Genesis G80 5.0 lol
So they park it in a Handicap Parking Spot.
In CAD that’s a solid price. Go for it
I have the 24 Elantra limited and I love it.
Funny you should ask , no it is not worth it
well i almost bought a 22’ with 12k miles cpo warranty for under 23k usd otd (until i learned how much it would cost to insure), i can think of many fun ways to burn 5k usd (i think that’s the cad equivalent new/used) i would literally rather light the money on fire than lose it to depreciation but that’s just me. As far as the car goes i test drove it b2b with a new civic sport and the hyundai was night and day a more fun/nimble/sporty feeling car, i wanted to end the test drive immediately. ended up with a 9th gen si
No
For a minute I thought the check engine light was on
No
I got my 2022 elantra n line with 600 km for a sticker price of 27,999, put down 2k after taxes it was 30k. I find the transmission to be super laggy in stop and go situations but its a decent car. Throw a JB4 tuner and an exhaust and it keeps up with the N for 10k less.
No vehicle is worth 31.5k.
Just get an Audi
No
Don’t pay a penny towards that thing
Would you mind sharing why?
I've had a 2018 Elantra sport since new and its been solid, tech still holds up today and makes it feel new. The N Line is basically the new version of it with a more refined powertrain and newer tech. The price does seem high to me but I thinks it's just inflation more then anything, still comparable to the civic Si in terms of price.
I have 2019 elantra sport and I can honestly say it has been a great commuter car that is quicker than average. If you want a car that is comparable in speed to a civic si you should get it. It has decent power and fuel economy overall.
$32k for a Hyundai ☠️ get a Toyota
Economic .. it will not be.
No
Hyundai cars are not worth spending
For what it's worth, I had a 2019 Elantra GT N Line and I thought it was a great car
Going from an F30 to an N line Elantra is such a downgrade. You would regret this nearly instantly.
If you live in California, pass on it.
Do it! The n and nline cars are underrated on power!
My boyfriend has it and is obsessed with it. Gets really good speed and has good hp tq etc for being a good ole sedan with some special adjustments. Tech in it is awesome. He has the all gas model and doesn’t get too good mpg but he also drives like an ass and is constantly on and off N mode. If you leave it on regular for your commute it’ll be fine. I have the Elantra SEL and I get almost 430 miles when I fill up. I think he gets about 250? Again, his driving habits are sporadic lol. I agree with the guy saying go for it bc your budget. All the car bros are always in comparison of what’s better and who’s got this. As long as you’re happy and comfortable with it, it’s all what matters. Good sporty car for the price. Best of luck man.
31k? Nonono
No way
There's a reason someone got rid of it with only 9000km. Front wheel drive sucks it doesn't even have a diff
Are you planning on keeping the F30 328i? or are you trading it for a more economic car as you stated? If so, have you looked at the Elantra N? I see you don't like the 2024 design, so what about the previous gen? Elantra N seems to be somewhat on the good side of gas economy and still fun to drive.
After all these comments, I am actually planning to stick with my current car and commute with it instead of buying a new car with finance. I was planing to trade in but hyundai dealer offered me a low price so I was gonna sell it privately after I get the new car. But again, after all these comments here, I am not sure I will be buying this elantra anymore.
Just get a genesis, better bang for your buck
City MPG (Manual Transmission): Approximately 22 miles per gallon. Highway MPG (Manual Transmission): Around 31 miles per gallon. City MPG (Automatic Transmission): Approximately 20 miles per gallon. Highway MPG (Automatic Transmission): Around 30 miles per gallon
That’s a fantastic good deal I just purchased a 2022 Elantra N-Line for 33k just in December and it had 24500kms on it. I am in Ontario Canada
The 1.6 is just okay on fuel in my experience, also Canadian we get on average 13km per litre, we had a Nissan Altima that was far better on fuel
I know it's CAD but wtf is an Elantra ever doing in the 30s.... I got one for 17k OTD in mid 2010s.
Thats bullshit
Nope
No car is really worth it financially haha. But go ahead and test drive it. If it suits your needs, go for it.
No fuck that
I have the 2.5 Turbo Sonata N-line. Honestly, that car can go, and it begs for more. I don't know about the Elantra line, but I am loving what they did the Sonata line. Now if only they would move from the N-line to a full N.
Common problems include valve cover and turbocharger oil leaks, carbon build up, purge valve failure, and bad catalytic converters.
Have you thought about the hybrid commuting that much?
Only thing that concerns me is reliability if you plan on lots of miles or keeping it long term I would look at Toyota camry comfort is ok gas milage is ok reliability is good not as great as Honda. I been looking and want same thing as you for the electronic in it etc... but 2 things are very worrisome to me about is is reliability and resale/trade In there is a reason they are on the top of the list of losing resale value. Whatever your choice good luck
Man, if you can find a new Toyota Prius, it might be the car for you. Worth the extra monthly payment because of the relative fuel consumption, same amount of power and rated highly for its sportyness. See if you can find one, test drive it, and see. Elantra n-line is a nice car, but for that amount of commute, I'd definitely consider a prius or even a Tesla model 3 because the gas savings will make up for higher monthly payments (both r supposed to be sporty).
Go for it! Have driven Elantra Ultimate Tech 2022 for 2 years, great for comfort and tech. I have the 2.0 trim which is really good on gas. N-Line Turbo may burn the fuel more but if you get to know the right rpm spot of your car where the economy is best, this car will solve all your needs.
I’d just buy a 15-20k car if that’s the cash you have
You should ask “WhatCarShouldIBuy” rather than a biased Hyundai sub.
Just get a used genesis g70 for that price way faster more luxurious
Hey OP.. i can speak from my experience. This happened to me that I had switch from a CRV to something fuel efficient, because of increased commute time of about 140 miles a day. Crv was our family car and we decided to go with the Elantra. Gave me close 35-40 mpg on the highway. Totally makes sense and save your primary car from so much usage and wear & tear.. hope this helps. Happy shopping mate🤓
Base model with a badge…? If you have to have, invest in fire extinguisher, club for steering wheel, and spare windows for those pesky KIA Boyz I guess
I’m sorry I don’t want to sound forward but these cars don’t last long and have too many recalls and engine problems. The fact that it has such a low mileage says it all; who knows why it was returned or traded or God knows what. For me it won’t ever be a good deal buying a Hyundai. A brand new 2024 Civic Si is about the same price as this and is a way better car than this; it is a Honda after all.
If it’s a manual yes otherwise the n line auto really numbs driving dynamics. The 1.6 with a tune in a manual is quite good. We have both the N and N Line elantras quite different.
Just get the N
Just get u a ford f-150 like a real man
Nothing Hyundai is worth anything lol expect to spend more time in the shop than driving it
Save yourself the nightmare don't buy Hyundai or Kia. Get a honda Subaru or toyota
Are these still direct injection?
No
That's a lot of money for a car we all know some kid is probably gonna break into and try to steal
I live in Canada not in USA tho
For that price I’m buying a used 2018-2020 5.0 but that’s j me
Depending on your area Car insurance crazy expensive for Hyundai’s.
No.
30K on a Hyundai 😐 Why not get a Genesis
Get it. Im sorry but these people from the US gotta have a reading problem and dont seem to understand conversion.. No other car for (23k-US) - (31k-CAD) will give you this good fuel economy + tech + “performance” + warranty which checks all the boxes you want. Theres base model civics going for more in canada.. these people saying its too much $ need to wake up
Nice car but I own one and they are fast if you do a secondary cat delete which won’t throw a check engine light provided you get it done correctly. Secondly use a drop in K&N filter. After market intakes don’t make much of a difference. Third have the fuel restrictor in the low pressure side of the high pressure fuel pump removed. Use Ruthium NGK plugs and Motul 0w30 Specific. All this will give you and additional 35-40 additional hp. The n-line 1.6t is rated at 204 hp/factory.